The title of the documentary implies that they aren't bullies anymore. The fact that they told the bullied kid "fuck you we're gonna make it anyway" proves they're still bullies.
Plus, as wooly said: some of them had the gall to laugh when retelling their stories for the documentary. No. Recompense is made by remorse and humility. It's not merely "water under the bridge" because they were kids - adults are just grown up children, after all. It's not reincarnation - there is no absolving of fault.
@@wormwoodbecomedelphinus4131 Yea there is a dumb belief that you just change in adulthood. That you just hotswap your mind and behaviour when you "grow up". Bull shit. People dont just change. That takes work. alot of work. it doesnt just happen.
And after they sent him the movie for approval 15 years earlier and he never got back with them so in a final act these Boomers who are still clueless said sure wether it's famous or infamous I'll be remembered for that time I kicked that kid's ass 50 years ago, that'll teach him for not being dismissed from class 5 minutes ago and they called him a dick, SMH. 50 years later and they still can't step outside of themselves and realize the true damage they caused, it just felt like their grandchildren told them they might be wrong 25 years ago and then they said 15 years ago.... maybe 🤔 nope I remember nobody liked him so he deserved it 🤯
@@wormwoodbecomedelphinus4131 unfortunately a lot of people really DO believe it's just what kids do and it's water under the bridge. Which is patently bollocks. It is telling if they'll laugh about their memories of bullying, that's for damn sure. If you really grow up into a good person you'd be fucking mortified to reflect on it.
Even just hearing the background story it's obvious why this is repeating history--because why would anyone ever think that someone who had been mass-bullied by an entire class would want anyone to make a film about what happened and distribute it? Just attempting to do more public humiliation
Its a profound statement dont get me wrong but its a little too "Only a sith deals in absolutes". Like at what age do we start applying informed decision making? is it Primary School age? Middle School Age? High School Age? Like bullies can come from any age group, literally and I personally believe any one beneath a 6th grade is acting purely on primitive impulse rather and rarely any higher rational thought process.
@@CazadorSixFour always a bit of whiplash when I'm reminded of that. I'm sure Pat's knowledge is a bit out of date, but it explains his constant good takes.
when i was a kid i realized that the bullshit “your bully has a lot of shit going on at home” thing is also just an excuse used by teachers/counselors/parents who don’t actually feel like doing anything about the problem.
@@theotherjared9824 Yup I remember getting in a fight with a bully just defending myself. Of course we sit in the office an the principle rants about how it takes 'two to fight' like wtf? Just stand there an take it I guess? even then we still would get shit for even being involved in a fight.
I mean, mine DID (his dad got sent to jail) but also like no adult outside of my parents ever lifted a single finger about it, and the school actively supported the bully whenever he'd turn around and cry when he almost got in trouble and then blamed it on me.
I remember having to go to the principal office multiple times to deal with my highschool bully. Took about two and a half months before they did something.
I watched it in health class years after the super size option was taken off the menu, so a large amount of information was outdated. The message boiled down to "don't do what this guy is doing" which we as middle schoolers either had no intention to do so or that decision was out of our hands.
“A second surprising finding from recent research: bullies do not, in fact, suffer from low self-esteem. Psychologists had long assumed that mean kids were taking out their insecurities on others. No. It turns out that most bullies act like self-satisfied little pricks not because they are tortured by self-doubt, but because they actually are self-satisfied little pricks.” - David Graeber, “The Bully’s Pulpit”
This study has conflicted with multiple large case studies. (That is, that a lot of bullies have low self esteem, although not all of them. Some seem to have a very high sense of status, but it is very hard to say if that is just a mask they are wearing while in public) This reference also gives a very narrow look at bullies behavior and where it stems from. Even if bullies have a high esteem, their actions can be easily traced back to bad parenting, or the absence of a good father figure/teacher.
Every evil person in history thought they were better than everyone else, and used that unwarranted self-esteem to justify their behavior. For some reason when it's school kids people think we suddenly live in opposite world.
Turns about people who abuse others feel extremely justified in doing so, to protect the own ego. "Well I'm not like those other bullies/abusers, I'm different!"
@@alastor8091 it was, it was expressly about the victim. They talked about how they bullied him, what they did, laugh about it and then give an excuse for way they did.
@@Broomer52 no, its about their mindset. The title of the documentary is "When WE were bullies". The movie is explicitly about the bullies. Did you not pay attention to the synopsis the guys gave? The focus isn't on the bullied kid.
@@alastor8091 I listened, did you? How did you pull a “this is a documentary about how the bullies think” out of a documentary built on the basis of “we all bullied this one kid in class, let’s bring them all together and talk about it and laugh about what we did” I suppose in that sense it technically is but the single unifying factor is “we bullied a kid mercilessly and want to share our work with the world and give an unjustified excuse for why and we’re going to do it without the permission of the victim and then tell him essentially ‘it’s for your own good’”
In a word: narcissism. Guy wanted to commodify his "redemption" and the story of making someone's life miserable, without the self-awareness to realise that he hasn't changed at all and that this project is just the latest act of harassment.
Oscars, Academy Awards, Grammies, and nearly all other such masturbatory fart-fests are garbage and incestuous to a ridiculous degree. Nothing of value can be gained from watching them.
Honestly the fact that the entire group participated in the bullying indicates an external factor to the personality traits of the individuals. Something else was going on there. But the creator refusing to listen to the victim is blatant sociopathy.
Yeah, there are exceptions, but when THAT MANY people are all shitting on the same guy there's usually a reason. Recall Columbine. The reason the two guys who did it got a news reputation as having been bullied was because they were shitty white supremacists and everyone could tell they were awful people. Exactly the kind of profile you expect from the harbingers of the modern mass shooting. It's a throughline with a LOT of school violence, but it's too complicated for the breaking-news media cycle to effectively parse. OF COURSE bullying is wrong, but sometimes it really is justified.
"What? You don't forgive us for all bullying you and not feeling much remorse at all? Pfft, little pussy ass bitch, bet your wife is the breadwinner huh, gonna cry about it?"
It's like a diffusal of responsibility thing I bet. "This can't be bad because everyone is doing it" or "I can't get in trouble because they're doing it too." That, plus add the fact that everyone wanted to fit in and/or were afraid they'd be bullied if they didn't join in and I think that explains it. The real questions are where was the authority figure to challenge this in the school and what shitstain kid started it.
Years ago I saw a documentary about "What if the Nazis won WWII and conquered America?" And with no buildup the Nazis suddenly had Wolfenstein level tech. And at the end of the documentary the conclusion the experts had was "Yeah but the Nazis wouldn't be able to hold America because the American people are too cool and would drive them out after a week because of the American spirit" while it showed a "reenactment" of a guy beating a group of Gestapo single handedly in an alleyway with an American flag while a dramatic slow version of the Star Spangled Banner played.
@@rossman8919 this documentary was on TV and it was pre The New Order. I have no clue how it got made apart from some guy in charge just busting at the thought because "I'm American so that means I'm cool too like these experts are saying"
Honestly that entire genre of nazi fetishism is really awful. Like there's at least a dozen documentaries where the director gets almost "serial killer crush" on Hitler in trying to rationalize and pathologize the horrific shit Hitler did while trying to spin him as a dark genius or the head of some conspiracy theory garbage while having an almost fanboyish obsession with nazi tech and industry with zero time to reflect on like. How any of this could be tone deaf as hell when shit like Charlottesville happend
@@mep15067 You don't need to explain Nazi fetishism to me, I play Battlefield so I got to meet them during Battlefield V when they would write full essays complaining about DICE not selling the "fall 1943 Eastern Front blüntsmöken" camo pattern or whatever. Meanwhile when people asked for specific gear for the American or British factions those same guys would suspiciously ask "Why do you care so much about that? The defaults look fine." (For reference, the British uniform people wanted was the main uniform of the war that DICE forgot to include and not just a camo pattern that was used for 3 weeks like the Nazi players wanted.) There was also the time when CoD Vanguard was announced and people were crying asking "Why can you play as the Soviets and not the Germans in campaign? The Soviets were way worse!"
"The decision to soothe yourself with cruelty is an informed one" might be the most poignant thing Pat has ever said. Like yeah, I've always understood that people can lash out as a way of coping with their own emotional problems. But lashing out at innocent people who are *unrelated* to those problems in any way? All sympathy is immediately lost.
also, blaming mental illness or social ills like divorce for it is pretty icky, considering people in vulnerable positions, like the mentally ill, are up to 10 times more likely to be the victim of violence and are almost never the perpetrator (number varies depending on location, and my memory for the exact data may be faulty).
So this dude really made a film that basically said "Yeah the whole class F'ed with this kid and it was rad af!" That is literally sociopathic behavior.
Not as sociopathic as that Imelda Marcos documentary where she attempts to make herself look charitable by throwing money into the impoverished streets of Manila. Which, is juxtaposed with most of her current shoe and clothing collection (a collection that she increased by embezzling the finances of the Philippines during her husband's reign of martial law). Considering the number of documentaries I've seen about some of the most eccentric lunatics in world history, "Yeah, the whole class fucked with this one kid and it was fucking rad yo!" isn't scratching the surface in regards to human sociopathy.
@@themachoechidnaugandarandy7583 But Pat WAS a bullied kid so now you've gotta make a documentary about him starting from that one soccer game he was left at, and the various rage moments of Omikron
Most people. The vast majority of people act civil purely on the basis that they would get fucking bodied if they didn't walk it back a couple notches.
@@somenerd3515 lol just listened to Arin rant about why Twitter is only a horrible place for conversation because there's no threat of getting punched in the face for being an asshole, so everybody feels free to be an asshole on Twitter. Great Elden Ring commentary lol but he's not wrong
@@justanobadi6655 You worded that like there aren't animals that naturally act altruistically. Humans are >social< animals. We are inclined to act in a way that benefits others because it indirectly benefits us. It's a simple and common train of thought for us to realize that being nice to others is a good way for them to be nice to us.
Jesus Christ I wouldn't say I was "bullied" but I definitely dealt with some assholes growing up and I can't even fathom how I'd feel if I found out they were all just making a movie about me without my consent and trying to justify their behavior. I hope this guy finds himself a good lawyer and tries to at least get some money out of this.
That bullies documentary would be better if during one of the sappy moments involving a guilty bully or whatever you could press a button on your remote and activate a Heat Action.
"We are still Bullies" would have been a more apt title. Also, and not to be a McDonald's stan but the guy who did SuperSizeMe was a vegan of several years beforehand, and the experiment was swiftly repeated by other people who weren't, to much less harsh effects. Also not to be a SuperSizeMe stan, it at least lead to more diversified menus at fast food joints and calorie counters and nutrition facts become more accessible so it became simultaneously easier and harder for people to pretend they are eating healthy. Honestly, The Founder is the best McDonald's documentary and it isn't even one.
Guy was also binge-drinking for years When his doctor says, "yeah your liver is like paté, I have no idea how McDonald's is doing this to you," it kind of puts a certain hue on how he says, "_Yeah man that's crazy_"
And that harder to pretend to be healthy bit was the main purpose of superizeme 2, in where he opens his own fast food chicken joint sprinkled with all the marketing buzzwords that make people buy garbage
SuperSizeMe was like a less impactful The Jungle. Also it exists PURELY to be shown in your middleschool health class. The best thing about SuperSizeMe was that it inspired SuperHighMe
Correct me if I'm wrong, It's been a while since I've seen it, but wasn't there also a point in SuperSizeMe where he talks about how eating nothing but McDonalds was making him unable to have sex with his girlfriend properly? Something about either having no energy, or unable to maintain an erection or something like that? Then shortly after the movie came out it was found out he was a piece of shit and his relationship was on the rocks anyway?
To be fair to Supersize Me, one topic it did touch on (but also failed to make any deep points about, at least as far as I recall) was the issue of portion sizes and how they're advertised. Everyone knows McD's is unhealthy, but there is perhaps a conversation to be had about the way they push their products.
Yeah people always associate bullies with “school kids” but there are PLENTY of grown-ass adult who bully others Good example is narcissistic bosses who will “punch up and kick down” and basically do everything they can to set up their employees to fail You would think someone like this would get weeded out, but if they are an academic professor with *_tenure_* for example, they are practically allowed to get away with what they want
middle-managers hardly ever hire anyone who could replace them, because they want to maintain their own job security. Who would've ever thought, right? :^)
"The overall message of the documentary seems to be Jay saying he accepts his own apology even though Richard does not" lmao this a real keyhole glimpse into the workings of a diseased mind
@@DR3ADER1 no, it's not. it's literally a right under privacy law for most countries. if you take a picture of someone or make a video about someone and they or their guardian do not give explicit consent, you can be sued or arrested (depending on the exact wording of the law in your area). meaning that richard has every right to call the police and force the platforms to drop the documentary, as it is about him and he explicitly said not to make it.
@@Yal_Rathol Incorrect. Once that film is made public, it's the copyright of the filmmakers. Under this logic, no one can post anything about other people online without consenting with the persons of interest. And under this logic, Sites such as Encyclopedia Dramatica can't legally publish pages about anyone online or offline who is a person of interest without their consent. If I write a Kiwi Farms thread about someone who is a lolcow and is publicly or privately making an arse of themselves, the site isn't allowed to make the thread public under such a law, which is incorrect in the United States, where films and other such actions are protected under the First Amendment.
@@DR3ADER1 it's always fun to encounter someone who's knowledge of the law starts and ends with the first and second amendment. no, speech of private citizens, through most mediums, is allowed. there are exceptions, they vary from region to region, but if you post a comment about someone, like for example if i say "DR3D1 is an idiot who doesn't understand the law", that is protected speech. but, if i took a picture of you and then posted it online without your or your parents' permission (depending on your age), you could sue me for breach of privacy. if you explicitly told me not to post it and i did, you could call the police on me. so, for example, if someone made a documentary about you and you said you wanted it taken down, for any reason, they legally have no standing to post it and if they do, you could sue them. copyright will not protect them because you are the subject of the documentary.
@@Yal_Rathol Tell that to Encyclopedia Dramatica or tell that to Null, Kiwi Farms' webmaster. He's received requests from people you can consider to fit the "private citizens" moniker to take hundreds of forum threads down but he correctly tells them to fuck off. Because, it doesn't matter if you took an image of me with or without my permission because the moment you upload it to the internet, I can't do anything about it and it would be an act of me not understanding the law if I tried to sue you for breach of privacy. Because I didn't agree to anything in writing, since there's no evidence of me writing any motions to consent or not consent to the action in the first place. Because private statements recorded privately CAN and will be released publicly and you can't sue people for that. Under your idiotic paralegal logic, Journalists can't record people secretly without the consent of the individuals being recorded. After all, they're private conversations. So if I record you asserting that "right to privacy" supersedes the right to record and document, or find an image of you in your house, I can legally scan/upload it, store it on my computer, post it on any blog that uses US servers (which aren't required to comply with bullshit data protection laws in Europe) and you can't do jack shit about it. Oh, and by the way, Doxxing's legal in the US. And Harassment has a very specific definition in the United States to prevent troglodytes from using their vexatiousness to censor people (Like David A. Stebbins/Acerthorn and Alex Mauer do). Just so you know. And cutting back to the film being available on HBO, Richard's plea was VERBAL, (read: "Not Written"). Verbal pleas and agreements are about as legally binding as your understanding of basic contract law. Or about as fragile as a statue made entirely of sugar glass. From the Privacy Act of 1974 verbatim: "Under the Privacy Act's disclosure provision, agencies generally are prohibited from disclosing records by any means of communication - written, oral, electronic, or mechanical - without the written consent of the individual, subject to twelve exceptions." Pay attention to that "written consent" section. Richard didn't write anything, as such, the filmmakers had every right to make the film public. Does it make them arseholes? Yes, however being an arsehole is sometimes a requirement to exercise any form of freedom, be it speech, expression, information or access. And before you try anything stupid, no, "implied consent" is not sufficient. It MUST be written consent. Top tip, when trying to assert that I "know nothing about the law" be sure to do your research properly first. Stones in glass houses are a risk for self-destruction. Also, fun fact: in England and Wales (not Scotland and NI) they tried to impose superinjunctions to prevent people online from talking about and posting details of people's personal lives, it went as well as you think it did, hilariously badly, people just posted such info anyway in another textbook example of the Streisand Effect. TL;DR Richard is an idiot, Null has every right to host personal information online on his forum, and so does ED. Journalists can record private "off-record" discussions and publish them, regardless of sensitivity, especially in nations and regions with one-party recording laws. Also, the Privacy Act of 1974 is very specific when it comes to "consent", in that it MUST be WRITTEN. Stones: Thrown Glass House: Shattered (edited for cleanup)
Also Woolie, big props to your cousin for working about researching Food Deserts in low income & middle class neighborhoods. That's a topic that isn't takled about enough when you talk about obesity and low income.
One minute in and already it's a shitshow. I get name-calling bc people always say stupid stuff about people they don't like but ganging up on the one kid? And then laughing about it even as adults? Man, Lost Judgement really was right on the mark about bullies never changing even after adulthood without lots of intervention.
They even go as far as assault with fucking sewing needle stabbings. Those people are legitimately horrible and the fact that any of them would look back at that with laughter is sociopathy. Lost Judgment was right.
It's not even sociopathy, they recognize that it was wrong of them to do; they just don't give a fuck, or justify it away to themselves. That's what the "Umm it's not about you" statement is, a justification for them to tell "their side" of the story, even though to a non-abusive person, that reason is fucking insane.
@@ubermenschen01 Sociopathy and psychopathy are different. Psychopaths are the ones without empathy, sociopaths typically do have empathy but seek to create conflict and suffering. That said, sociopaths usually have a broad-aiming aggression, to the point that in this situation they might even help the victim to antagonize the rest of the class. So what is actually being exhibited is pure sadism.
I'm really glad Supersize Me was mentioned. They actually had us watch it in high school gym class. Like, "See how bad this is for you?" to a room full of teenagers - whose only reaction was, "I really want some McDonald's now."
Reminds me of when Jamie Oliver showed a bunch of young children how chicken nuggets were made. At the end he asks who wants chicken nuggets and almost every child immediately raises their hands.
@@monkaWGiga I hate when people make the argument of "Have you seen how (insert X food item here) is made? It's gross and will make you not want to eat it." News flash, nearly any food item that ends up on a grocery store shelf/in a restaurant goes through some kind of process that probably would be considered gross to your average person, especially if it involves any kind of animal meat. Hell, even disregarding processed foods, I can't imagine that the process of a cow/chicken/etc being killed and cut up into various parts would be very appetizing to anyone who actually sees it happen themselves. By that logic you might as well give up eating anything from your average grocery store or fast food restaurant. And just because it looks/sounds gross to see/hear how a chicken is killed, defeathered, and mutilated into parts doesn't make me suddenly not want to ever eat chicken again.
@@omegaxtrigun Hell, even seeing how vegetables and shit actually grow would creep people out because we can't see how that's done unless you have a see through mirror videotaping the time-lapse of it growing underground.
I am 31 years old and STILL dealing with the PTSD i got from my bullies. If i found out one of those pieces of human trash were trying to make a movie about me, i would exhaust all the means available to me to sue them into oblivion. I hope that guy gets some legal help.
The "Supersize Me" thing is actually misleading because obviously the McDonalds stuff would do that, but what people might not have realized is that the man was also a vegan for several years prior to doing the project, he was also a heavy drinker, and almost unsurprisingly was also abstinent due to his girlfriend, who was also vegan, found him disgusting during it. (Which also lead to several harassments of him on others who were working on the project.) I know that someone did a counterargument in the documentary "Fathead" which proved that while you really REALLY shouldn't eat McD's for 30 days, you're almost never likely to get the problems that "Supersize Me" tried to blame on McD's.
Damn, so all just a big lie from a vegan who just wanted to eat some damn meat while having an excuse that he's doing it to "expose" fast food, followed by other negative consequences but you are already in too deep at that point to quit.
I grew up getting bullied so damn hard because I was neruodivergent, I had no friends and had low self esteem, and I realized that anything that really portrays bullies in that way I felt and was is just propaganda used against people like me, Not to mention how teachers are just as guilty of bullying as the children because teachers are supposed to have the responsibility with stopping bullying yet with 99% of the teachers that never happens.
Worst one I ever saw was called Hecklers and was made by the guy who played the lead character in Son of the Mask. It was about how hecklers, critics, and people online are mean to comedians and actors. The son of the mask guy even confronts a few hecklers in person and they just tell him to grow up while his own film crew agrees with the hecklers and even laugh about it. It notably features Dennis Praeger for some fucking reason. It also features other comedians and actors who all say that yeah hecklers and critics suck but its just part of the job and they all just say you gotta deal with it. Essentially its just son of the mask guy being really upset that he was a mediocre actor in a really shitty movie and it ruined his career and he blamed society for his misfortunes.
how dare you forget the great Jamie Kennedy's name. he's actually had quite a successful career. he's no Tom Hanks, but he regularly gets work. im not sure i can believe anything you've said now.
@@charleswisconsin9196 ah yes Jamie Kennedy famous for having to play second fiddle in the last few Tremors movies and absolutely disemboweling himself that one E3.
2:51 “The decision to soothe yourself with cruelty is an informed one.” Whenever Pat flexes his knowledge, we always get these eloquent sayings, and I love it!
I think this is what I like about Lost Judgement's take on bullying. It doesn't try to justify the bully's actions, it instead focuses on the idea that bullying will only effect all people involved negatively because bullies will grow up to be smug, entitled, coward assholes and turn into selfish sociopaths which makes the adult world difficult. Thus everyone should stop it before it becomes a problem, because it can negatively impact the lives of people who weren't even the victim or perpetrator.
"We're no longer bullies, but we're going to exploit the story of how we tormented you for years for our own personal gain, and completely disregard your wishes on the matter."
Jesus Christ I grew up in a divorce that was so bad that 25 years later my parents refuse to speak to each other still. I also dealt with things like a sibling dying of cancer and plenty other traumatic events and despite that I was still a good person and never once considered bullying people since I dealt with being bullied all throughout middle school. Luckily I ended up getting suspended freshman year of high school for standing up and beating up one of my middle school bullies who tried to keep it going and I was never bullied by anyone again. I really hope this piece of shit director gets what's coming to him.
To me bullying is a sense of power that people either crave or are susptable to, the other factors like shitty grades, bad family life or disabilities just add to it, if you are naturally prone to bad decisions you are most likely to end up a bully then someone who thinks critically or cant fathom hurting others
It's why I think we should let kids just hash thing out in fights sanctioned by the school. Fucking we shouldn't be punishing the victim which always happens. Little shit starts the fight and finally kid whose being bullied had enough and fights back, teacher comes over and kid being bullied gets suspended because "IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO STARTED IT!". BITCH YES IT DOES!
The way adults treat school bullies is the most asinine thing I've ever seen. We were shown a video about what to do if you're being bullied with tips like "just ignore them" or "try to walk away." I actually interrupted the video to ask how this was supposed to help since it was educating the bullies on what their victims should be doing. I was in fifth grade and that was obvious to me.
@@trashman1605 Notice that England is miserable? That's because we can see France across the channel, we are too close and they sap our life force. Pat has proven why England needs to move the entire landmass away.
@@themachoechidnaugandarandy7583 doesn't change the fact that it's enjoyable to listen to Pat talk about psychology. Also, and I can't stress this enough, fuck Liam
@@themachoechidnaugandarandy7583 1. Nobody goes into psych for drugs, that was a joke. 2. graduate or not, if you do the coursework you have the knowledge. It's not like he flunked out.
Frankly this is a problem where I genuinely agree with Pat's "insane solution." In the pre-industrial era, there was no institutional learning facility for kids to leave the direct supervision of their parents. If a parent witnesses their child being abused by another child, they intervene immediately and the bully learns in short order the "bigger fish" principle and that if they continue to mistreat others, there will be direct retaliation in the form of an ass beating. It's where the phrase "it takes a village came from. 3rd party intervention is a necessity for civilizing the savages we call children. Without adult intervention, you get Lord of the Flies every time.
I remember there was a documentary I watched before I went to Japan about Japanese history and culture that was hosted by a white guy and it was the weebiest fucking thing. Like going on about the spirituality within katanas and samurai fight scenes that were done in an anime style and all this weird shit that was just factually incorrect. Very odd documentary in retrospect.
I picked on exactly two kids in gradeschool. There was no excuse for it, I feel terribly ashamed now for having done it. I'm pretty sure the only reason I did it was because many others were doing it and I wanted to fit in. I wasn't a popular kid, I was in fact picked on myself somewhat, but never to the extent those two kids were. I'm pissed at myself that I contributed to that and that I was shitty to those two, and I'm pissed at the social dynamics that lead to shit like that.
I was pushy on three instances to three girls back in grade school. nothing physical, but still not okay and it still haunts me, and contributes to feeling suicidal. I can't fathom that this director not just made the movie, but got an award for it. it would make me honestly not give a shit about will Smith, if the Polanski, Weinstein, etc. shit didn't already do that. pretty much every person in "the academy" is a piece of shit and no one should give them a damn thing.
Man, food documentaries always bug me. I live in a town where the average wage is the minimum wage. There's a TV cook who made sure schools don't serve 'unhealthy' food, so my school stopped serving food because it couldn't afford the healthy stuff. He also said go to my local farmer's market which I don't have and would mean hours of travel. It's also worth noting the guy who did Super Size Me claimed to never have had fast food before, that always bugged me since it doesn't seem viable for a control case. On the other hand, lowering the portion sizes isn't the worst thing, 2 litres of coke is a bit much.
Based on the numbers he put out the guy from Super Size Me couldn't have gained the weight he said he did without eating around double what he claimed. Because he gained a lot of weight fairly quickly.
My bullies pushed me in front of a moving car when I was 16, and despite being in my 20s now they still yell insults at me when I run into them on the street. I am incapable of feeling sorry for people like the documentary maker because "oh but I had a tragic backstory" when they will never grow as people.
@@X_Blake eh despite not moving I barely run into them, maybe two or three times a year at most. At this point it's more just embarrassing for them that we are all grown men and women in our 20s and they refuse to change.
Listening to Pat and Woolie talking about psychology is alot like their Devil May Cry episodes that are just 40 minutes of move exhibition. Its not what we came for, but im happy its here.
The worst documentary I ever watched was “Blood into Wine” exclusively because of its janky pacing and strange obsession with all the new age bullshit associated with wine. It absolutely does not compare to “I MADE AN ENTIRE MOVIE TO TELL THE WORLD THAT I WAS AN ASSHOLE KID BUT THAT’S OKAY BECAUSE IT WAS NEVER MY FAULT AND THE PEOPLE I HURT DON’T MATTER ANYWAY! CAN’T YOU SEE HOW MUCH I CHANGED!?!”
... what new age bullshit is associated with wine? it's just alcoholic grape drank. sometimes it's very tasty, other times it's even a little better than that if you want to pay 100$ per micro-increment of quality. simple as.
I get where Woolie is coming from with the ending of 'Seaspiracy' tainting the information presented throughout the documentary. It rubs me the same way 'Dont Look Up' did - it comes across as sheltered west-coast elite types condescending to the rest of the world on how things SHOULD be run, yet doesn't actually offer any viable or meaningful solutions. Its the same energy as those commercials of starving children in Africa with a C list celebrity voiceover going "Isnt this fucked up? We can fix it NOW if you just give us your money" when actually solutions are long term endeavors that require structural and cultural changes. It also comes from a place of privilege - 60% of the developing world are dependant on fishing and industry surrounding the ocean. Just because some film student who has the luxury to abstain from eating seafood doesn't mean the rest of us can share in that luxury.
yeah like 9 times out of 10 if someone's trying to convince you the only way to save the world is down to making individual choices as a consumer they're bullshitting you
While going vegan is legitimately a great thing to do for the planet, and I hugely respect the choice to go vegan, I DESPISE this habit of moral grandstanding and straight-up colonialsm from certain first world vegans in this vein. Just this complete lack of respect or empathy for people’s sociocultural circumstances, where you have privileged western foodies with a plethora of choice, shitting on people who are in areas that have developed their entire economies and cultures to rely on things like fishing, and criticize them for not “being able” to go vegan when the vegan diet is potentially financially infeasible where they are, or they are facing all sorts of local cultural pressures to continue meat consumption, etc. Not every place in the world has a whole foods around every corner.
I’m just gonna say this cause fuck it. I still have these memories of doing mean stuff to other kids in my class and there’s nothing I want more than to change those events and not be a total piece of shit to others. But the fact that these group of people continued to make the movie anyway even when the victim clearly said he wasn’t comfortable with it, especially the fact that they couldn’t come up with any other way of how to make it up to him, that is the most disgustingly fucked up thing I’ve ever heard.
What makes Seaspiracy's conclusion even worse is that they literally say that not eating fish for the rest of your life won't help cause of the torrents of money the commercial fishing industry makes through government subsidies.
7:29 “just stop” is almost never going to be a thing people will actually do. Gotta be more realistic than that if you want to change something. Arguably The best way to make change is by convincing people they didn’t change at all
See, we all did stupid shit as a kid, said mean things to each other and such, right? Cus kids are stupid. If I met any of the people i was rude too as a kid I’d like to think we’d both acknowledge that we was stupid kids and i’d apologise if need be. But, like… and entire class, on the daily, harassing a kid and even physically attacking him? That’s not just kids being kids, man, that’s another level. And to take it even further they continue to ignore the dudes requests to not make the documentary and claim it isn’t about him. Scum, absolute scum through and through.
You know what a good post "I was a bully movie is" A Silent Voice Shinya was a bully as a kid, the girl, a deaf girl, then moved away after all the bullying then he slowly became the target of the class afterwards, he learned years later just how wrong he was for beginning the bullying in the first place and meets her years later and apologizes and even learns sign language just to properly appologize but doesnt expect her to forgive him Thats a good moral, you cant give a person back the time they lost but you should still show your regret regardless of if they want to hear it or not
@UCtZSRF0Kg7xGEdOtfxUkabw you should read the manga, it gives more time and depth to each of the characters, you obviously get to see shoyas perspective, but the time givin to see shoko's side of the story through her mom and little sister really helped me understand how kind of a soul shoko is for giving shoya a chance at all but also reminds the reader and shoya that she cant get those days back from her childhood and the scars she lives with I can understand the idea of it feels fucked up to tell a story at the expense of another persons suffering, but thats why it made me like shoko more, no matter how much life was unfair to her she never became bitter, she never lashed out at the world for being born different, she simply wanted to live life the best way she could like anyone else Part of what i feel stories that involve characters with disabilities miss is they are still like everyone else even if they cant interact with the world like everyone else
Back in high school, one of my teachers made us watch Cony 2012, before everyone found out it was a scam. I remember while watching it, towards the end it turned into a HARD advertisement and that set off my bullshit alarm and I figured it was a moneymaking scam well before it got outed.
@@RavenCloak13 African warlord doing typical African warlord things. Towards the end it became a marketing campaign for a charity that ultimately ended up being a scam that duped thousands of people.
Literally just a bully making money off of a kid he bullied by bullying him again as an adult. I hope somebody he runs into in his life will be kind enough to show him what it feels like to be on the other of his abusive behavior.
“You killed a billion people!” “My mother didn’t love me.” “Oh I understand, all is forgiven now.” Absolute garbage reasoning that I can never get behind. Just because bad things happen to people doesn’t mean those people have to turn that negativity and make someone else’s life horrible to “get even” in the system. The director is a jackass for that, and to not even respect the wishes of the person too??? Pure garbage
yeah, when the examples are less extreme it sounds at least a little more reasonable, like if you break something inconsequential out of frustration. But regardless of the scale, the fact that far more people go through the same kind of shit without turning into monsters or abusing other people, clearly shows that this isn't the "default" response.
@@BlazeMakesGames As someone who is on the spectrum and was severely bullied as a kid as a result, I wouldn't even wish that on my worst enemy because I now how much it sucks and am NOT A FUCKING PSYCHOPATH
When I was a bully in school I knew exactly what I was doing. I was bullied and I had my own issues but at no point was I just absent in the brain. I was being mean because it made my classmates happy and made me feel accepted. It is a fucking lie that you didn’t know as a kid. I feel bad about what I did. I was a stupid kid and lashed out in extreme ways because I didn’t know what else to do. I’m glad I got my ass kicked once in a while and I wouldn’t blame those people if they still hate me 20 years later, I hate the people who bullied me. No human would pay themselves on the back for growing up and being better nosy if they really understood what they did or had real regret for their actions. Scumbag director.
good to see comments like this- it's important to point out that it is possible that people CAN change, and take accountability of their actions. but this movie is the exact opposite of that. some people can be assholes for the rest of their lives
its embarrassing, they really thought the issue was "wut if you ate a bunch of unhealthy food tho" the issue of obesity was never fast food its the balances of work life and how many have less and less time to even be active along with LOTS of other aspects because obesity isn't a simple subject
There's no excuse for bullying. Society and doctors would like to believe its excusable and defend bullies and their actions. The worst thing someone can do to victims of anything is to tell them to get over it, try to rationalize to them about why it happened and that they must forgive their assailant and move on for everyones sake or even trivializing the the trauma caused to the victim cause they have to look at the bigger picture and be the better person. The disgusting mental loops folks would do to rationalize horrible situations.
The root causes behind the bullies' behaviors can be _(please note I am _*_not_*_ saying "always are" but rather "can be")_ defensible and/or sympathizable. However, the decisions made and the actions taken as a result of those causes should not be excused, especially when it leads to harm on others.
I remember one documentary that annoyed me as a teenager was "Mermaids: the body found" which aired on animal planet... it has a ton of "CGI recreations" that it tries to pass off as real footage of mermaids, and i remember being VERY annoyed that it appeared to be genuinely trying to convince people mermaids are real
Yeah, i remenber that one... the same applys to the Megalondon ones, one i remenber they kept doing a bunch of weird CGIs of the Shark being somewhere in the distance or background stalking the crew and it ended with it fucking up a vacation ship. It honeslty felt like a clickbait video at times and your really only gonna watch it for the ending massacre, wich wasnt even that great.
I won't lie, I fell for it. But when your age is measured in single digits, it's easy to fall for things on the HISTORY CHANNEL. What complete bullshit. And people wonder why no one can agree on what is and isn't real anymore.
The fishing documentary woolie is talking about is that it attributes change to individual action when it has to be systemic. That’s the problem a lot of people have when it comes to climate change or other major issues. It can’t all be solved by having a “better diet” or “using less straws” it’s bigger than that
And this is why I will always viciously counter arguments that say you shouldn't fight back against bullies. No. If you are able. Beat those guys into a bloody pulp. I tried to live and let live approach and its my one biggest regret in my school life. I in fact learned this lesson while in school (I was curious okay). Bullies surrounded me in a locker room (saw it coming but I intentionally walked into it). Held me down and took turns punching me in the face. I could break the hold at anytime, but I was looking at each of them waiting for them to feel bad about it. None of them. They just laughed and kept repeating "look at him, he's loving it." They punched like girls, so I wasn't hurt too badly, but hey be lightly slapped for long enough and your face is gonna swell regardless. This confirmed to me they would never feel any kind of pity to their victims or feel bad about their actions and I was ready to smash their skulls in. Teacher walks in the moment I break the hold and had a vice grip on one of their necks (like bro I was angry, full of adrenaline and I just purged any idea/notion that there was any good in these guys). I didn't know if I was going to badly injure or kill that guy, but I was going to make it hurt because he was the guy that was punching the most and talking the most shit. But being the good boy I was. I let them go because the teacher asked me to (I was an honour student-upper athlete and good grades-the nerd with muscle so they left my nerd friends alone when I was around). They ran off and the teacher just stood there puzzled and I was just thinking the whole time. Where the hell WERE YOU? I knew it was pointless to ask. Teachers were always useless in preventing this stuff. I knew for the rest of my school experience that only I could protect my friends from bullies. And if you lived in england you know the type these were. Little bottom feeders acting tough but quick to run away once an actual fight was coming. Thats why they'd attack the people that wouldn't fight back. Talk mad shit about how puny they are, just so they can claim just how hard they are. The kinda ppl in a brawl that would sooner sucker punch than fight fair. Never feel bad about smashing their teeth in. They were toothless to begin with.
@@CaptainTitforce oh definitely the shit that I really wanted to snap the neck of? He knew his life was in danger if the teacher didn't stop me. He didn't dare touch my friends afterwards. He'd still talk shit about how "badly he beat me up" though. He was very lucky I was good natured enough to let it go. But I often thought about the scenario where the teacher never came. I like to think I would stop at leaving them winded and bruised. But knowing how deeply unrepentant they are as bullies and how angry I was at the time upon realising it. I was in a state of mind to do anything.
@@CaptainTitforce I will clarify though. too much of a softly softly approach will cause the bully to probe you further to see how much they can push you before you either give up or beat them up. You will indeed have instances where they'll never get it unless you've knocked them on their ass and kept going. Because if you stop at them on their ass, they'll think. I should have sucker punched him there. that woulda showed him. No. You send it nice and clear. Pick a fight. You will get a fking fight and you're not coming home without limping. But yes for the most part, a bit of self assertion is enough. But these kinda lads have alot to prove and bragged alot in front of their friends. They need to get a w or get bullied themselves by their own shitty friends.
Similar thing happened to my cousin's. Elder brother got bullied until he beat him up. Then the bully had the bright idea to instead bully the younger brother. But he was on the football team. You can imagine how that went
I hate the phrase "hurt people hurt people." Aside from shifting responsibility away from perpetrators, it ignores the fact that frankly a lot of people are assholes for no reason at all.
The worst documentary I ever saw was The Devil & Father Amorth. It was just scene after scene of William Friedkin trying to look credible and failing miserably every time. He literally pulled a "just trust me bro" with a shoddy reenactment of a supposed event at the end.
My dad made me get the documentary for him. It was advertised as having a real exorcism with no editing at all. The moment the exorcism began, the amount of sound editing was through the fucking roof lmao
So I can give people who were bullies in school a little bit of leeway (emphasis on little) because children's brains don't work right, lotta factors etc etc. But this is only assuming those people at least realize that what they did was awful. THESE PEOPLE, even as adults, justifying that sort of behavior is... baffling? Alarming? How can someone go "We as an entire group made one kid's life hell and that was okay and hilarious because I was sad" and not at some point in that statement realize it's fucked up?
I’m very wary of the claim that “children’s brains don’t work right” used to justify a lot of shady, dehumanizing shit. Most kids know what they are doing
@@Flackon As somone who was once a kid the hell they know what they are doing. I did not know what the fuck I was doing in school and regret so much stupid shit I did. You gotta have a real selective memory to think "most kids know what they are doing."
@@Flackon Adolescence is when our brains begin to properly grow and develop. It's when mental disorders are most likely to show themselves, it's when our brains are most vulnerable to stress and we need more sleep to function "correctly" (which we often do not get due to a variety of factors). We're very malleable and as such we're also very vulnerable to environmental factors (home life, social pressures at school, etc). But specifically, well into our teens our prefrontal cortex is still developing which means we often can't do things like make informed decisions, plan ahead, handle our emotions effectively, or even focus on what's going on in the moment. These aren't all always going to be issues for every teen but it's all stuff that can very easily cause people to make poor choices due to an inability to properly assess said choices. That's why I said I give people who were bullies a bit of leeway as long as they recognize what they did was wrong, because it's not uncommon for teens to do stupid and/or bad shit. But no, I doubt most kids "know what they're doing."
@@WillowMelody It's possible it's not most kids, and in fact only a few. That said, "stupid" choices are due to ignorance and "bad" choices are a moral judgement. Avoiding either of these shouldn't be inherently out of reach of a teen's prefrontal cortex, in my view. Otherwise it would suggest that some humans are extraordinarily developed at an early age, while most aren't, and I don't think our biology is that different. I could be wrong, though.
The worst I’ve ever seen was this documentary on sexuality on Hulu. Name escapes me, but it was narrated by James Hetfield. There was exactly one (1) psychologist who made informed and reasonable points, and the entire rest of it was boring interviews with raving puritans and randos. The thing end with Hetfield saying “Our goal is not to demonize,” rewind thirty minutes back, some dude was shouting “EJACULATING ON A WOMAN’S FACE IS THE MOST VIOLENT THING YOU CAN DO.”
Bullying is just a quaint term for what it really is: Abuse. I was bullied as a kid. Badly. Thankfully I didn't turn it around and become an antisocial psychopath. Instead, I internalized it and blamed myself for everything until I got over it as a mature adult. At the same time, I learned empathy and an ability to relate to the people around me. Years and years later, one of the guys who bulled me up and apologized to me about having done it. He said that now that he had his own children, they really changed the way he'd thought about everything, that he didn't want his kids to end up how he had been. By that time I'd had a pretty good life, and it didn't do me any good to hold anything against anyone. I told him as much. People can and do change, but sometimes an asshole is an asshole.
I'm glad you got over it, and I'm sorry it happened. It just terrifies me to think how bullying changes people's course in life. Even if we do successfully grow past it, we never _truly_ do since there's now a foundational part of who we are at this moment that wouldn't be there if it wasn't for the bullying. Now whether or not that holds people back or is a scar they never heal from is case-by-case, but I can never stop thinking about how people have needed to change or grow their personalities from cruel things like this. It's like snapping a young tree's branch. True, it'll eventually grow past and around it, but that branch, no matter how strong of a branch it could become, will never stop bearing the signs of that break. That just horrifies me to think about.
Thank you, yes! It is abuse! I'm almost 30 and I still have issues I've carried since childhood thanks to the bullying I went through throughout all of grade school as a kid My parents may have been neglectful but they never even glared in my direction, on the contrary the kids at my school like, would come up with new ways to beat me up everyday, make fun of me, demean me, and as a girl to be beaten up by boys, specially boys that were a bit older than me, it's just, a fear and distrust and bitterness that sadly it never leaves you, it sticks with you... To this day I still feel helpless and small I blame myself I blame them I honestly don't know who to blame but to this day I harvor this irrational unconscious fear of human relationships, I fear opening up and being taken advantage of, I fear confrontation and i cant stand people touching me, I cant Doctors looked at my bruises and would confront my parents about them beating me up and I always had to explian they were made by my bullies at school that it was not my parents I was constantly anxious, jumpy and angry as a kid thanks to that and even since I've battled with depression Like People just can't fathom how much bullying can truly mess up a person
the dude telling his victim "this isn't your story, it's ours" after being asked to not make this thing is the most unbelievable batch of dogshit??? i have never wanted to gut a documentary creator like a fish quite like i want this dude, jesus as someone else in the comments already kindly put it: the title of "When We Were Bullies" implies they ever stopped, and this documentary's existance is proof nothing has changed
I can excuse and understand a child not knowing what theyve done is wrong, because unless taught through actual teaching or exposure, they dont understand; that is the point of childhood. You need to be taught to self reflect, to think ciritcally, and other behavourial emotional things from your own side and others. To then become an adult and still not be emotional mature, and lack critical thinking skills is the failure of our system. And its sad that its way more common than you think. The only space where this stuff is properly taught (and even then its still barried by 'professionals' that teach it wrong) is therapy. Im like not surprised by this at all.
I really need to see a school principal or chancellor pull the "Oh the poor bully probably has a rough home life." line. And the kids response is "So because his mommy doesn't hug him at night. That gives him the right the beat me up?" I just wanna see how that conversation goes.
Man I was nearly one of those pieces of shit. I think the only thing that stopped that was: 1 disgust in myself, 2 a notable drug experience with my friends that I’ve been told caused a positive significant character shift over a week
I remember sitting in the library at high school with my friends and the topic of parents came up and one of them said "put your hands up if your parents are divorced". All but two of us put their hands up out of a group of 12, and even though my parents were together at the time I still felt that their divorce would be innevitable. And indeed they did; they got divorced a few years after I moved out. However, none of my friends were bullies. In fact, they (especially one girl I knew who's a drummer in a band now) were the kind of people who would adopt outcasts and loners (myself included) and make them feel comfortable. They did all that despite a couple of 'em being damn near suicidal and cutting themselves up on the regular, and the rest of us worked to keep the teachers from getting in their buisiness because they'd just tell their parents and my friends would get a beating for being depressed and wanting to die. Personal pain is not an excuse to be cruel to others; I've seen kids who went through real, genuine pain and they were the best and kindest people I'd ever known. Bullies have no fucking excuse.
"Bad shit at home" is _never_ an excuse for bullying. My parents broke up when I was a kid and I was aggressively anti-bullying all through my years at school. Also, that Seaspiracy doc was more against fishing on a mass, unsustainable scale, perpetuated by super wealthy fishing companies and corrupt governments. Not fishing by individuals or (as specifically stated in the doc) local indigenous communities. The idea of giving up fish is really just a personal protest against fishing companies' over-fishing and the devastating environmental effects of their bottom trawling, as well as people not wanting to ingest microplastics.
Growing up I had parents that instead of divorcing they would just scream at each other in front of me almost daily, and yet I never became a bully or blamed any of my failures on them. You make your own choices in life, so if you bullied some poor lonely kid in school it's because YOU chose to do it, nobody forced you to.
I have said this before but Pat and Woolie, and the old crew, they have a tremendous voice when it comes to the concept of bullying and coping with its reality. I'm sure they know it and I'm sure they've realized how much genuine healing they have given to others by having these discussions, and doing so in a relatively public format. Woolie's inclusion of the audience, more or less, adds to this. Out of all the comedy these guys give us, and all the random OCD, frame data addiction rants they have gone on, they give us a gem discussion like this, and it connects with the fan base in another, meaningful way. I just had to point that out.
Imagine being a documentary film maker who put together the whole thing without getting any consent to shoot an epilogue, who clearly lined up this big last scene he never bothered to see if he had Then, when that person tells you to kick rocks, you decide to wrap up and sell it anyway Sure you're still missing bits, and there's bits you were clearly going to film like the reunion, but no one came so you pretended it was unfilmable Now imagine HBO and the Academy say "this is great, this is a high quality work" Jesus wept
Jesus christ when Pat brought up Super Size Me, that reminded me that THAT and a documentary about juice only diets were REQUIRED VIEWING for my health class in High School. We had a pair of students fail health because they had recently overcome eating disorders that would have been triggered by watching these films and the school wouldn't accept doctors notes from their therapists. This despite our teacher being smart enough to not teach abstinence only sex-ed against school board policy On a similar train of thought, there was a parody of Super Size Me called Super High Me that follows a dude who smokes weed every day and argues for legalizing recreational marijuana. It's unironically my brother's favorite movie
Seaspiracy is so frustrating because if the guy had just not let his ego get in the way and pushed his own conclusion on it, it could have been a fantastic documentary. It does talk about a lot of really really interesting and hushed up topics that do not get talked about enough. The problem comes from his beliefs getting in the way and clouding things. Fishing is a massive polluter, there are questions about food stocks and massive environmental damage, shady shit happens out at sea with labour and what they catch. That is more than enough to be a compelling documentary! But then it trys to cram all of this into a childish notion of "don't eat fish, completely stop this industry" and completely ruins all effect it could have had. The director did this with cowspiracy as well and it's fucking infuriating. This is speaking as a vegetarian, btw. Edit: I will correct pat in saying that most medication does not need to tested on animals, animal trials are basically shortcuts to screen for bad science, and that most animal trials do not find anything that is scientifically useful. Medication that needs animal products is also understandable from the patient side, but it's really not that difficult to just genetically insert the hormone producing cide or biochemical producing DNA into a cell. It's literally easier and cheaper.
When I was in elementary, I was bullied heavily in almost every grade to a horrible degree (in my opinion). However, I also did a bit of bullying of some of the other "losers". The difference here is, I *regret* what I did. I look back and I still feel bad that I bullied in turn. Me suffering does not make me making others suffer okay. Essentially saying 'I don't care if you are still mad at me and don't want me to make this documentary, I'm fine now and me having bullied is okay' is mind-blastingly narcissistic.
There's a very vicious cycle with bullied kids hurting others, because it's only during a group assault on someone else that they feel welcomed, and so they just. God, I was one of them, and I feel so terrible about the things I did but I understand why I did them, and the reasons are just tragic
@@kattastic9999 I'm not even sure how such a thing would even be fixed, because it's such a basic part of human nature to desire to feel welcomed and accepted that you can't just tell kids to be nice and see results. There are so many tribal dynamics that with some bully victims it's not even _personal,_ they're just an unfortunate sacrificial lamb in someone else's attempt at not feeling scared and alone. How FUCKED is that? That you might not even be getting tortured because they have a personal or even group interest in you specifically, but because you were just the closest available tool for a bunch of kids to unite over?
In my experience, every bully I ever met were not "going through stuff at home." Their parents were decent. They weren't poor, some of them were better off than my family was. It wasn't that they were suffering and wanted to project it onto others. It's because they had never truly suffered, and felt that they were so much better than people around them it gave them the right to treat people they didn't like poorly.
Man I love when Pat gets to apply his psych degree to people acting like psychos while Woolie tries in vain to apply reasonable sense to senseless people. It's both of them at their most powerful.
Self-replying just to say that this is at its trustet when Pat is describing MMO culture and MMO players being unreasonable weirdos who will not check back later if the servers are full, because what if it's not full now, or now, or what about now, but how about now though? And Woolie is just dying inside Jim from The Office facing at the camera, knowing this is why we drift further from God's light with each and every day.
I had a boss who talked about how he _used_ to be a bully. His whole crew called me Horatio to other customers instead of my real name because I was the "fat, unfunny guy" like Horatio Sanz. Yeah, _used_ to be a bully. Had a panic attack working for him once and my neighbor called the cops on me. They found out at work and had a good ol' time with that info. Good times...
That's rough, man. The older I get, the more I see a common thread on these sorts of things: if someone has acknowledged that they used to be a bully, get away from them as fast as humanly possible, because they've basically just told you what they're capable of. Unless a person has proven to you that they truly are changed through their actions, not words, ACTIONS, then they're basically just showing you they're a shithead who is trying to make themselves feel good at that moment and that it's only a matter of time before they changed that "used to be" to a "currently yours."
they spent their time bullying some poor kid when they were children then come back many years later to bully him again, not just in front of the school or the town but in front of the entire world. then try to assert they are no longer bullies. welcome to 2023.
the only thing that i can think of in my life that could be misconstrued as anything close to that was either in-jokes about one kid in school that he either created or leaned into (i was also one of those kids) or a kid who was so annoyingly confrontational and weird that the collective reflex response was just to regularly talk about how annoying they were. the fact that the docu maker didn't think rolling up on one kid and beating him is an unjustifiable offense worth dismissing the whole production alone is fuckin wild
Frankly the only documentaries worth watching nowadays are on UA-cam. Line Goes Up, everything by hbomberguy, Internet Historian and that crowd as a whole.
About Supersize Me -- At the time it was made, a good number of people actually didn't know or believe the food they offered had THAT many empty calories in it. I remember discussions from that time and I heard more people than you might expect actually not realize that.
Fat Head is a great documentary where a guy does the Super Size Me experiment, and actually ends up healthier in every way. It talks about the wealth inequality that drives people to fast food and calls out Super Size Me for blatantly lying for critical attention and drama
Isn't releasing the documentary despite the _one singular victim's_ protests... just a continuation of the bullying? I mean acknowledging and documenting a whole classes' cruelty doesn't really justify it. It sounds like they were hoping that by shining a light on it, they were "absolving" themselves. "See, we owned up to it in front of everyone, so it's okay now."
The scariest part of “I guess I’ll just die” is these people will say “if that the way it is” and they will Expect you to die, and if you don’t you’re wrong and they’ll hound you
"when we were bullies" literally just made a documentary to laugh about the time they all bullied a kid without the now adult's consent, how are they not STILL bullies? absolute wastes of human life if they want a new title i guess.
The title of the documentary implies that they aren't bullies anymore. The fact that they told the bullied kid "fuck you we're gonna make it anyway" proves they're still bullies.
Plus, as wooly said: some of them had the gall to laugh when retelling their stories for the documentary.
No. Recompense is made by remorse and humility. It's not merely "water under the bridge" because they were kids - adults are just grown up children, after all. It's not reincarnation - there is no absolving of fault.
@@wormwoodbecomedelphinus4131 Yea there is a dumb belief that you just change in adulthood. That you just hotswap your mind and behaviour when you "grow up". Bull shit. People dont just change. That takes work. alot of work. it doesnt just happen.
And after they sent him the movie for approval 15 years earlier and he never got back with them so in a final act these Boomers who are still clueless said sure wether it's famous or infamous I'll be remembered for that time I kicked that kid's ass 50 years ago, that'll teach him for not being dismissed from class 5 minutes ago and they called him a dick, SMH. 50 years later and they still can't step outside of themselves and realize the true damage they caused, it just felt like their grandchildren told them they might be wrong 25 years ago and then they said 15 years ago.... maybe 🤔 nope I remember nobody liked him so he deserved it 🤯
@@wormwoodbecomedelphinus4131 unfortunately a lot of people really DO believe it's just what kids do and it's water under the bridge. Which is patently bollocks. It is telling if they'll laugh about their memories of bullying, that's for damn sure. If you really grow up into a good person you'd be fucking mortified to reflect on it.
Even just hearing the background story it's obvious why this is repeating history--because why would anyone ever think that someone who had been mass-bullied by an entire class would want anyone to make a film about what happened and distribute it? Just attempting to do more public humiliation
“The decision to soothe yourself with cruelty is an informed one.”
Awesome quote by Pat. 100% agree
one of the few times I can think of where something pat said was 100% on the money
@@Gojiro7 He's gotta put that Psychology learning to use once in awhile
Its a profound statement dont get me wrong but its a little too "Only a sith deals in absolutes". Like at what age do we start applying informed decision making? is it Primary School age? Middle School Age? High School Age? Like bullies can come from any age group, literally and I personally believe any one beneath a 6th grade is acting purely on primitive impulse rather and rarely any higher rational thought process.
@@CazadorSixFour always a bit of whiplash when I'm reminded of that. I'm sure Pat's knowledge is a bit out of date, but it explains his constant good takes.
when i was a kid i realized that the bullshit “your bully has a lot of shit going on at home” thing is also just an excuse used by teachers/counselors/parents who don’t actually feel like doing anything about the problem.
Don't do anything to provoke them, otherwise it's your fault for starting it.
"Remember, it takes two to fight."
Yea, but it only takes one to get my ass kicked. Or possibly three because bullies are pack animals.
@@theotherjared9824 Yup I remember getting in a fight with a bully just defending myself. Of course we sit in the office an the principle rants about how it takes 'two to fight' like wtf? Just stand there an take it I guess? even then we still would get shit for even being involved in a fight.
I mean, mine DID (his dad got sent to jail) but also like no adult outside of my parents ever lifted a single finger about it, and the school actively supported the bully whenever he'd turn around and cry when he almost got in trouble and then blamed it on me.
I remember having to go to the principal office multiple times to deal with my highschool bully. Took about two and a half months before they did something.
“Supersize me” was shown to my class in middle school as an example of how science is not done.
Better then my experience with it. At the school I went to it was shown in Health and PE classes to tell the kids "McDonald bad"
I had to watch that movie in public school multiple times which was weird cause most of us didn't choose what we ate as 11 year olds
@@MacMens0100 Yeah, what the hell were you supposed to eat in Taco Tuesday if you didn't brought anything from home?
I watched it in health class years after the super size option was taken off the menu, so a large amount of information was outdated. The message boiled down to "don't do what this guy is doing" which we as middle schoolers either had no intention to do so or that decision was out of our hands.
@@brochebug I vividly have the same recollection. Which now makes me even more concerned for the public school system.
“A second surprising finding from recent research: bullies do not, in fact, suffer from low self-esteem. Psychologists had long assumed that mean kids were taking out their insecurities on others. No. It turns out that most bullies act like self-satisfied little pricks not because they are tortured by self-doubt, but because they actually are self-satisfied little pricks.”
- David Graeber, “The Bully’s Pulpit”
This study has conflicted with multiple large case studies. (That is, that a lot of bullies have low self esteem, although not all of them. Some seem to have a very high sense of status, but it is very hard to say if that is just a mask they are wearing while in public)
This reference also gives a very narrow look at bullies behavior and where it stems from. Even if bullies have a high esteem, their actions can be easily traced back to bad parenting, or the absence of a good father figure/teacher.
Turns out you need to have a high opinion of yourself to think others are bellow you and deserved to be picked on. Who could have seen that coming?
Every evil person in history thought they were better than everyone else, and used that unwarranted self-esteem to justify their behavior. For some reason when it's school kids people think we suddenly live in opposite world.
All I could find when I search the Bully's Pulpit is some Teddy Roosevelt stuff. Maybe Link it bud.
@@SSFhighcommandJOHN
Literally the first thing that comes out. He literally put the reference with the name of the person who penned it.
"Please don't publish this film... Everyone made my school life a living hell, I had no friends.." "BUT MY PARENTS DIDN'T LOVE EACH OTHER ANYMORE!"
"AND NOW I HAVE TO DREDGE UP YOUR OLD WOUNDS BECAUSE MY WIFE DOESN'T LOVE ME ANYMORE AND ASKED FOR A DIVORCE. i HAVE NO IDEA WHY SSHE DID THAT"
they really had the victim say "no I'm not comfortable with you releasing that" then just went "well it isn't ABOUT you" and released it anyways
Turns about people who abuse others feel extremely justified in doing so, to protect the own ego. "Well I'm not like those other bullies/abusers, I'm different!"
Tbf, it wasn't about him.
@@alastor8091 it was, it was expressly about the victim. They talked about how they bullied him, what they did, laugh about it and then give an excuse for way they did.
@@Broomer52 no, its about their mindset. The title of the documentary is "When WE were bullies". The movie is explicitly about the bullies. Did you not pay attention to the synopsis the guys gave? The focus isn't on the bullied kid.
@@alastor8091 I listened, did you? How did you pull a “this is a documentary about how the bullies think” out of a documentary built on the basis of “we all bullied this one kid in class, let’s bring them all together and talk about it and laugh about what we did” I suppose in that sense it technically is but the single unifying factor is “we bullied a kid mercilessly and want to share our work with the world and give an unjustified excuse for why and we’re going to do it without the permission of the victim and then tell him essentially ‘it’s for your own good’”
In a word: narcissism. Guy wanted to commodify his "redemption" and the story of making someone's life miserable, without the self-awareness to realise that he hasn't changed at all and that this project is just the latest act of harassment.
The fact that When We Were Bullies was nominated for an Oscar shows how low standards they have for things like Documentary Short Subject.
Hey, defo fits in for the Oscars for sure. Circle-jerking and absolute jackasses.
That, or how little the audience actually thought about it and went purely on feels
Imagen if the director gets will smithed in the oscars if he wins.
@@irondoomable He didn't win so at least there's that consolation.
Oscars, Academy Awards, Grammies, and nearly all other such masturbatory fart-fests are garbage and incestuous to a ridiculous degree. Nothing of value can be gained from watching them.
Honestly the fact that the entire group participated in the bullying indicates an external factor to the personality traits of the individuals. Something else was going on there. But the creator refusing to listen to the victim is blatant sociopathy.
Yeah, there are exceptions, but when THAT MANY people are all shitting on the same guy there's usually a reason. Recall Columbine. The reason the two guys who did it got a news reputation as having been bullied was because they were shitty white supremacists and everyone could tell they were awful people. Exactly the kind of profile you expect from the harbingers of the modern mass shooting. It's a throughline with a LOT of school violence, but it's too complicated for the breaking-news media cycle to effectively parse. OF COURSE bullying is wrong, but sometimes it really is justified.
"What? You don't forgive us for all bullying you and not feeling much remorse at all? Pfft, little pussy ass bitch, bet your wife is the breadwinner huh, gonna cry about it?"
This is peak levels of narcissism and Sociopathy, is this person even human
It's like a diffusal of responsibility thing I bet. "This can't be bad because everyone is doing it" or "I can't get in trouble because they're doing it too." That, plus add the fact that everyone wanted to fit in and/or were afraid they'd be bullied if they didn't join in and I think that explains it. The real questions are where was the authority figure to challenge this in the school and what shitstain kid started it.
Why are three out of four replies to this hidden?
Years ago I saw a documentary about "What if the Nazis won WWII and conquered America?" And with no buildup the Nazis suddenly had Wolfenstein level tech. And at the end of the documentary the conclusion the experts had was "Yeah but the Nazis wouldn't be able to hold America because the American people are too cool and would drive them out after a week because of the American spirit" while it showed a "reenactment" of a guy beating a group of Gestapo single handedly in an alleyway with an American flag while a dramatic slow version of the Star Spangled Banner played.
i get the feeling the research began and ended with playing through the wolfenstein games
@@rossman8919 this documentary was on TV and it was pre The New Order. I have no clue how it got made apart from some guy in charge just busting at the thought because "I'm American so that means I'm cool too like these experts are saying"
Merica
Honestly that entire genre of nazi fetishism is really awful. Like there's at least a dozen documentaries where the director gets almost "serial killer crush" on Hitler in trying to rationalize and pathologize the horrific shit Hitler did while trying to spin him as a dark genius or the head of some conspiracy theory garbage while having an almost fanboyish obsession with nazi tech and industry with zero time to reflect on like. How any of this could be tone deaf as hell when shit like Charlottesville happend
@@mep15067 You don't need to explain Nazi fetishism to me, I play Battlefield so I got to meet them during Battlefield V when they would write full essays complaining about DICE not selling the "fall 1943 Eastern Front blüntsmöken" camo pattern or whatever. Meanwhile when people asked for specific gear for the American or British factions those same guys would suspiciously ask "Why do you care so much about that? The defaults look fine." (For reference, the British uniform people wanted was the main uniform of the war that DICE forgot to include and not just a camo pattern that was used for 3 weeks like the Nazi players wanted.)
There was also the time when CoD Vanguard was announced and people were crying asking "Why can you play as the Soviets and not the Germans in campaign? The Soviets were way worse!"
"The decision to soothe yourself with cruelty is an informed one" might be the most poignant thing Pat has ever said.
Like yeah, I've always understood that people can lash out as a way of coping with their own emotional problems. But lashing out at innocent people who are *unrelated* to those problems in any way? All sympathy is immediately lost.
also, blaming mental illness or social ills like divorce for it is pretty icky, considering people in vulnerable positions, like the mentally ill, are up to 10 times more likely to be the victim of violence and are almost never the perpetrator (number varies depending on location, and my memory for the exact data may be faulty).
He does have a degree in psychology
So this dude really made a film that basically said "Yeah the whole class F'ed with this kid and it was rad af!"
That is literally sociopathic behavior.
No but it's ok because fifty years later he feels a twinge of guilt for it and made a whole movie justifying it.
But that is pats mentality. But outside of school.
he got a goddamn academy award for it
Not as sociopathic as that Imelda Marcos documentary where she attempts to make herself look charitable by throwing money into the impoverished streets of Manila. Which, is juxtaposed with most of her current shoe and clothing collection (a collection that she increased by embezzling the finances of the Philippines during her husband's reign of martial law). Considering the number of documentaries I've seen about some of the most eccentric lunatics in world history, "Yeah, the whole class fucked with this one kid and it was fucking rad yo!" isn't scratching the surface in regards to human sociopathy.
@@themachoechidnaugandarandy7583 But Pat WAS a bullied kid so now you've gotta make a documentary about him starting from that one soccer game he was left at, and the various rage moments of Omikron
The ending remarks of the email just remind me that some people define "conscience" as "fear of the police" instead of "voice of the angel."
Most people.
The vast majority of people act civil purely on the basis that they would get fucking bodied if they didn't walk it back a couple notches.
@@somenerd3515 lol just listened to Arin rant about why Twitter is only a horrible place for conversation because there's no threat of getting punched in the face for being an asshole, so everybody feels free to be an asshole on Twitter. Great Elden Ring commentary lol but he's not wrong
@@somenerd3515 sounds like you've had it rough. i can assure you it's not most.
@@charleswisconsin9196 humans are animals, and are inclined to act as such if not taught the alternative.
@@justanobadi6655 You worded that like there aren't animals that naturally act altruistically. Humans are >social< animals. We are inclined to act in a way that benefits others because it indirectly benefits us. It's a simple and common train of thought for us to realize that being nice to others is a good way for them to be nice to us.
Jesus Christ I wouldn't say I was "bullied" but I definitely dealt with some assholes growing up and I can't even fathom how I'd feel if I found out they were all just making a movie about me without my consent and trying to justify their behavior. I hope this guy finds himself a good lawyer and tries to at least get some money out of this.
I'd hunt them down one by one. It'd make for a wonderful true crime doc in the future.
Bully was pretty based
@@themachoechidnaugandarandy7583 As in the video game "Bully", right?
@@MrJustinArt the doc. Saw the doc, it was like whatever. Had some chuckles.
@@themachoechidnaugandarandy7583 Ah, gotcha. Never saw that particular documentary before
That bullies documentary would be better if during one of the sappy moments involving a guilty bully or whatever you could press a button on your remote and activate a Heat Action.
What about a kid who used to be bullied hunting down his classmates to perform heat actions on them?
activate a thai kick like in the gaki no tsukai batsu games
rip and tear, until it is done
*press O to shut the bully up*
@@Velvet-Octopus Needs more heat actions though
"We are still Bullies" would have been a more apt title.
Also, and not to be a McDonald's stan but the guy who did SuperSizeMe was a vegan of several years beforehand, and the experiment was swiftly repeated by other people who weren't, to much less harsh effects.
Also not to be a SuperSizeMe stan, it at least lead to more diversified menus at fast food joints and calorie counters and nutrition facts become more accessible so it became simultaneously easier and harder for people to pretend they are eating healthy.
Honestly, The Founder is the best McDonald's documentary and it isn't even one.
Guy was also binge-drinking for years
When his doctor says, "yeah your liver is like paté, I have no idea how McDonald's is doing this to you," it kind of puts a certain hue on how he says, "_Yeah man that's crazy_"
And that harder to pretend to be healthy bit was the main purpose of superizeme 2, in where he opens his own fast food chicken joint sprinkled with all the marketing buzzwords that make people buy garbage
SuperSizeMe was like a less impactful The Jungle. Also it exists PURELY to be shown in your middleschool health class. The best thing about SuperSizeMe was that it inspired SuperHighMe
Correct me if I'm wrong, It's been a while since I've seen it, but wasn't there also a point in SuperSizeMe where he talks about how eating nothing but McDonalds was making him unable to have sex with his girlfriend properly? Something about either having no energy, or unable to maintain an erection or something like that? Then shortly after the movie came out it was found out he was a piece of shit and his relationship was on the rocks anyway?
To be fair to Supersize Me, one topic it did touch on (but also failed to make any deep points about, at least as far as I recall) was the issue of portion sizes and how they're advertised. Everyone knows McD's is unhealthy, but there is perhaps a conversation to be had about the way they push their products.
Yeah people always associate bullies with “school kids” but there are PLENTY of grown-ass adult who bully others
Good example is narcissistic bosses who will “punch up and kick down” and basically do everything they can to set up their employees to fail
You would think someone like this would get weeded out, but if they are an academic professor with *_tenure_* for example, they are practically allowed to get away with what they want
A lot of politicians are bullies. One particular fuck nugget of a bully got to a pretty damn high position in the US.
middle-managers hardly ever hire anyone who could replace them, because they want to maintain their own job security.
Who would've ever thought, right? :^)
@@bahskintimulholde6191 They deserve to get shot
"The overall message of the documentary seems to be Jay saying he accepts his own apology even though Richard does not"
lmao this a real keyhole glimpse into the workings of a diseased mind
Not really, because Richard's demands for Jay to self-censor is an asinine one. The abyss gazes also into you.
@@DR3ADER1 no, it's not. it's literally a right under privacy law for most countries.
if you take a picture of someone or make a video about someone and they or their guardian do not give explicit consent, you can be sued or arrested (depending on the exact wording of the law in your area).
meaning that richard has every right to call the police and force the platforms to drop the documentary, as it is about him and he explicitly said not to make it.
@@Yal_Rathol Incorrect. Once that film is made public, it's the copyright of the filmmakers. Under this logic, no one can post anything about other people online without consenting with the persons of interest. And under this logic, Sites such as Encyclopedia Dramatica can't legally publish pages about anyone online or offline who is a person of interest without their consent.
If I write a Kiwi Farms thread about someone who is a lolcow and is publicly or privately making an arse of themselves, the site isn't allowed to make the thread public under such a law, which is incorrect in the United States, where films and other such actions are protected under the First Amendment.
@@DR3ADER1 it's always fun to encounter someone who's knowledge of the law starts and ends with the first and second amendment.
no, speech of private citizens, through most mediums, is allowed. there are exceptions, they vary from region to region, but if you post a comment about someone, like for example if i say "DR3D1 is an idiot who doesn't understand the law", that is protected speech.
but, if i took a picture of you and then posted it online without your or your parents' permission (depending on your age), you could sue me for breach of privacy. if you explicitly told me not to post it and i did, you could call the police on me.
so, for example, if someone made a documentary about you and you said you wanted it taken down, for any reason, they legally have no standing to post it and if they do, you could sue them. copyright will not protect them because you are the subject of the documentary.
@@Yal_Rathol Tell that to Encyclopedia Dramatica or tell that to Null, Kiwi Farms' webmaster. He's received requests from people you can consider to fit the "private citizens" moniker to take hundreds of forum threads down but he correctly tells them to fuck off. Because, it doesn't matter if you took an image of me with or without my permission because the moment you upload it to the internet, I can't do anything about it and it would be an act of me not understanding the law if I tried to sue you for breach of privacy. Because I didn't agree to anything in writing, since there's no evidence of me writing any motions to consent or not consent to the action in the first place.
Because private statements recorded privately CAN and will be released publicly and you can't sue people for that. Under your idiotic paralegal logic, Journalists can't record people secretly without the consent of the individuals being recorded. After all, they're private conversations. So if I record you asserting that "right to privacy" supersedes the right to record and document, or find an image of you in your house, I can legally scan/upload it, store it on my computer, post it on any blog that uses US servers (which aren't required to comply with bullshit data protection laws in Europe) and you can't do jack shit about it.
Oh, and by the way, Doxxing's legal in the US. And Harassment has a very specific definition in the United States to prevent troglodytes from using their vexatiousness to censor people (Like David A. Stebbins/Acerthorn and Alex Mauer do). Just so you know.
And cutting back to the film being available on HBO, Richard's plea was VERBAL, (read: "Not Written"). Verbal pleas and agreements are about as legally binding as your understanding of basic contract law. Or about as fragile as a statue made entirely of sugar glass. From the Privacy Act of 1974 verbatim: "Under the Privacy Act's disclosure provision, agencies generally are prohibited from disclosing records by any means of communication - written, oral, electronic, or mechanical - without the written consent of the individual, subject to twelve exceptions."
Pay attention to that "written consent" section. Richard didn't write anything, as such, the filmmakers had every right to make the film public. Does it make them arseholes? Yes, however being an arsehole is sometimes a requirement to exercise any form of freedom, be it speech, expression, information or access. And before you try anything stupid, no, "implied consent" is not sufficient. It MUST be written consent.
Top tip, when trying to assert that I "know nothing about the law" be sure to do your research properly first. Stones in glass houses are a risk for self-destruction.
Also, fun fact: in England and Wales (not Scotland and NI) they tried to impose superinjunctions to prevent people online from talking about and posting details of people's personal lives, it went as well as you think it did, hilariously badly, people just posted such info anyway in another textbook example of the Streisand Effect.
TL;DR Richard is an idiot, Null has every right to host personal information online on his forum, and so does ED. Journalists can record private "off-record" discussions and publish them, regardless of sensitivity, especially in nations and regions with one-party recording laws. Also, the Privacy Act of 1974 is very specific when it comes to "consent", in that it MUST be WRITTEN. Stones: Thrown
Glass House: Shattered
(edited for cleanup)
I can't belive the bs viliian backstory of "I was sad once so i cause even more sadness" is real
it's not like it materialized out of nowhere.
Also Woolie, big props to your cousin for working about researching Food Deserts in low income & middle class neighborhoods. That's a topic that isn't takled about enough when you talk about obesity and low income.
One minute in and already it's a shitshow. I get name-calling bc people always say stupid stuff about people they don't like but ganging up on the one kid? And then laughing about it even as adults?
Man, Lost Judgement really was right on the mark about bullies never changing even after adulthood without lots of intervention.
They even go as far as assault with fucking sewing needle stabbings. Those people are legitimately horrible and the fact that any of them would look back at that with laughter is sociopathy.
Lost Judgment was right.
I mean, even if the fandom obviously doesn't agree with his actions, there's a reason Kuwana ended up being a compelling antagonist.
It's not even sociopathy, they recognize that it was wrong of them to do; they just don't give a fuck, or justify it away to themselves. That's what the "Umm it's not about you" statement is, a justification for them to tell "their side" of the story, even though to a non-abusive person, that reason is fucking insane.
@@ubermenschen01 Sociopathy and psychopathy are different. Psychopaths are the ones without empathy, sociopaths typically do have empathy but seek to create conflict and suffering. That said, sociopaths usually have a broad-aiming aggression, to the point that in this situation they might even help the victim to antagonize the rest of the class.
So what is actually being exhibited is pure sadism.
And yet people NEVER believe the levels of cruelty people are capable of because they think it's "To unrealistic" which shows how sheltered they are.
I'm really glad Supersize Me was mentioned. They actually had us watch it in high school gym class. Like, "See how bad this is for you?" to a room full of teenagers - whose only reaction was, "I really want some McDonald's now."
F**ker made an entire moving just to shame robust people in poor communities while bragging about how awesome HE is and HIS diet.
Reminds me of when Jamie Oliver showed a bunch of young children how chicken nuggets were made. At the end he asks who wants chicken nuggets and almost every child immediately raises their hands.
@@monkaWGiga That sounds about right, lol
@@monkaWGiga I hate when people make the argument of "Have you seen how (insert X food item here) is made? It's gross and will make you not want to eat it." News flash, nearly any food item that ends up on a grocery store shelf/in a restaurant goes through some kind of process that probably would be considered gross to your average person, especially if it involves any kind of animal meat. Hell, even disregarding processed foods, I can't imagine that the process of a cow/chicken/etc being killed and cut up into various parts would be very appetizing to anyone who actually sees it happen themselves.
By that logic you might as well give up eating anything from your average grocery store or fast food restaurant.
And just because it looks/sounds gross to see/hear how a chicken is killed, defeathered, and mutilated into parts doesn't make me suddenly not want to ever eat chicken again.
@@omegaxtrigun
Hell, even seeing how vegetables and shit actually grow would creep people out because we can't see how that's done unless you have a see through mirror videotaping the time-lapse of it growing underground.
It’s like that one line from Metal Gear Rising
“LIKE I SAID…KIDS ARE CRUEL JACK…AND I’M VERY IN TOUCH…..WITH MY INNER CHILD…”
I am 31 years old and STILL dealing with the PTSD i got from my bullies. If i found out one of those pieces of human trash were trying to make a movie about me, i would exhaust all the means available to me to sue them into oblivion. I hope that guy gets some legal help.
The "Supersize Me" thing is actually misleading because obviously the McDonalds stuff would do that, but what people might not have realized is that the man was also a vegan for several years prior to doing the project, he was also a heavy drinker, and almost unsurprisingly was also abstinent due to his girlfriend, who was also vegan, found him disgusting during it. (Which also lead to several harassments of him on others who were working on the project.)
I know that someone did a counterargument in the documentary "Fathead" which proved that while you really REALLY shouldn't eat McD's for 30 days, you're almost never likely to get the problems that "Supersize Me" tried to blame on McD's.
Damn, so all just a big lie from a vegan who just wanted to eat some damn meat while having an excuse that he's doing it to "expose" fast food, followed by other negative consequences but you are already in too deep at that point to quit.
I grew up getting bullied so damn hard because I was neruodivergent, I had no friends and had low self esteem, and I realized that anything that really portrays bullies in that way I felt and was is just propaganda used against people like me, Not to mention how teachers are just as guilty of bullying as the children because teachers are supposed to have the responsibility with stopping bullying yet with 99% of the teachers that never happens.
I also had a real bad home life so again this sucks.
Worst one I ever saw was called Hecklers and was made by the guy who played the lead character in Son of the Mask. It was about how hecklers, critics, and people online are mean to comedians and actors. The son of the mask guy even confronts a few hecklers in person and they just tell him to grow up while his own film crew agrees with the hecklers and even laugh about it. It notably features Dennis Praeger for some fucking reason. It also features other comedians and actors who all say that yeah hecklers and critics suck but its just part of the job and they all just say you gotta deal with it.
Essentially its just son of the mask guy being really upset that he was a mediocre actor in a really shitty movie and it ruined his career and he blamed society for his misfortunes.
how dare you forget the great Jamie Kennedy's name. he's actually had quite a successful career. he's no Tom Hanks, but he regularly gets work.
im not sure i can believe anything you've said now.
I don't ever say this, but that is just raw copium.
@@charleswisconsin9196 ah yes Jamie Kennedy famous for having to play second fiddle in the last few Tremors movies and absolutely disemboweling himself that one E3.
2:51 “The decision to soothe yourself with cruelty is an informed one.”
Whenever Pat flexes his knowledge, we always get these eloquent sayings, and I love it!
I think this is what I like about Lost Judgement's take on bullying. It doesn't try to justify the bully's actions, it instead focuses on the idea that bullying will only effect all people involved negatively because bullies will grow up to be smug, entitled, coward assholes and turn into selfish sociopaths which makes the adult world difficult. Thus everyone should stop it before it becomes a problem, because it can negatively impact the lives of people who weren't even the victim or perpetrator.
AND WE MUST STOP IT WITH HEAT ACTIONS!
Which is wrong actually, being a cruel idiot is 1000% a benefit in adult life, smug self centered assholes fall up, not down.
"We're no longer bullies, but we're going to exploit the story of how we tormented you for years for our own personal gain, and completely disregard your wishes on the matter."
"The decision to soothe yourself with cruelty is an informed one." One of the best takes I've ever heard. Damn straight, Pat.
Jesus Christ I grew up in a divorce that was so bad that 25 years later my parents refuse to speak to each other still. I also dealt with things like a sibling dying of cancer and plenty other traumatic events and despite that I was still a good person and never once considered bullying people since I dealt with being bullied all throughout middle school. Luckily I ended up getting suspended freshman year of high school for standing up and beating up one of my middle school bullies who tried to keep it going and I was never bullied by anyone again. I really hope this piece of shit director gets what's coming to him.
To me bullying is a sense of power that people either crave or are susptable to, the other factors like shitty grades, bad family life or disabilities just add to it, if you are naturally prone to bad decisions you are most likely to end up a bully then someone who thinks critically or cant fathom hurting others
It's why I think we should let kids just hash thing out in fights sanctioned by the school. Fucking we shouldn't be punishing the victim which always happens. Little shit starts the fight and finally kid whose being bullied had enough and fights back, teacher comes over and kid being bullied gets suspended because "IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO STARTED IT!".
BITCH YES IT DOES!
It’s really sad that most of the time resorting to violence is the only way to deal with bullying.
@@RavenCloak13 ah yes, the "Nelson Muntz's bi-weekly thunderdome of punching practice" school of thought.
@@BazzBrother
More like the Hawaiian style of "Beat each other up and settle it in the fight and let bygones be bygones".
The way adults treat school bullies is the most asinine thing I've ever seen. We were shown a video about what to do if you're being bullied with tips like "just ignore them" or "try to walk away." I actually interrupted the video to ask how this was supposed to help since it was educating the bullies on what their victims should be doing.
I was in fifth grade and that was obvious to me.
I gotta say, ever since moving to BC, Pat looks so much happier and healthier. So happy for him, Paige, Gief, and Elmo
Of course he is because everyone around him is high all the time so it stands to reason that he's high all the time now too
What lack of French does to a man
@@conspiracyspider
E-even... Even the dog _and_ cat?
@@trashman1605 Notice that England is miserable? That's because we can see France across the channel, we are too close and they sap our life force. Pat has proven why England needs to move the entire landmass away.
@@admiralpepper6933 ESPECIALLY the dog and cat
I gotta say, I absolutely love when Pat gets to flex his psychology degree
But he never graduated, plus if you remember Liam called him out on only doing that to get his hands on drugs
@@themachoechidnaugandarandy7583 doesn't change the fact that it's enjoyable to listen to Pat talk about psychology.
Also, and I can't stress this enough, fuck Liam
@@themachoechidnaugandarandy7583 1. Nobody goes into psych for drugs, that was a joke. 2. graduate or not, if you do the coursework you have the knowledge. It's not like he flunked out.
@@k-jsr yea no duh I was joking. Just making a callback to a classic podcast moment. Fart gas
I too only retain psychology 102 knowledge and assume all bad children are bad forever.
Apparently this documentary got nominated for an Oscar which makes me even more angry and disgusted
hollywood is pretty much set up as a filter for "who here is callous and sociopathic enough to become a star"
Frankly this is a problem where I genuinely agree with Pat's "insane solution." In the pre-industrial era, there was no institutional learning facility for kids to leave the direct supervision of their parents.
If a parent witnesses their child being abused by another child, they intervene immediately and the bully learns in short order the "bigger fish" principle and that if they continue to mistreat others, there will be direct retaliation in the form of an ass beating. It's where the phrase "it takes a village came from. 3rd party intervention is a necessity for civilizing the savages we call children. Without adult intervention, you get Lord of the Flies every time.
I remember there was a documentary I watched before I went to Japan about Japanese history and culture that was hosted by a white guy and it was the weebiest fucking thing. Like going on about the spirituality within katanas and samurai fight scenes that were done in an anime style and all this weird shit that was just factually incorrect. Very odd documentary in retrospect.
The host probably has an anime pfp and goes on about "the symbolism behind Kill la Kill's nudity it's not a pervert show guys"
What is the name of this movie? I need to know!
I picked on exactly two kids in gradeschool. There was no excuse for it, I feel terribly ashamed now for having done it. I'm pretty sure the only reason I did it was because many others were doing it and I wanted to fit in. I wasn't a popular kid, I was in fact picked on myself somewhat, but never to the extent those two kids were.
I'm pissed at myself that I contributed to that and that I was shitty to those two, and I'm pissed at the social dynamics that lead to shit like that.
I was pushy on three instances to three girls back in grade school. nothing physical, but still not okay and it still haunts me, and contributes to feeling suicidal.
I can't fathom that this director not just made the movie, but got an award for it. it would make me honestly not give a shit about will Smith, if the Polanski, Weinstein, etc. shit didn't already do that.
pretty much every person in "the academy" is a piece of shit and no one should give them a damn thing.
Man, food documentaries always bug me. I live in a town where the average wage is the minimum wage. There's a TV cook who made sure schools don't serve 'unhealthy' food, so my school stopped serving food because it couldn't afford the healthy stuff. He also said go to my local farmer's market which I don't have and would mean hours of travel.
It's also worth noting the guy who did Super Size Me claimed to never have had fast food before, that always bugged me since it doesn't seem viable for a control case. On the other hand, lowering the portion sizes isn't the worst thing, 2 litres of coke is a bit much.
Obesity is, like most issues, really a social problem. Your town is far from alone.
Jamie Oliver?
@@jordanetherington1922 That's the one.
Based on the numbers he put out the guy from Super Size Me couldn't have gained the weight he said he did without eating around double what he claimed. Because he gained a lot of weight fairly quickly.
Wasn't the super size me guy also a vegetarian before? I feel like suddenly adding so much meat to your diet would mess with your body.
The ultimate gaslighting.
This is some Naruto sad backstory but this is the real world.
He's the coolest guy
Except at least the Naruto villain wouldn't hqve made the documentary.
Bullies are the absolute worst, and I hope they go through hell. Holy fuck.
They need to be sued.
My bullies pushed me in front of a moving car when I was 16, and despite being in my 20s now they still yell insults at me when I run into them on the street. I am incapable of feeling sorry for people like the documentary maker because "oh but I had a tragic backstory" when they will never grow as people.
@@kapkant6197 I'm sorry this is happening to you.
@@kapkant6197 I'm so sorry my dude. I hope they go through hell
@@X_Blake eh despite not moving I barely run into them, maybe two or three times a year at most. At this point it's more just embarrassing for them that we are all grown men and women in our 20s and they refuse to change.
@@kapkant6197
Legit sounds like they living in the past lmao
Listening to Pat and Woolie talking about psychology is alot like their Devil May Cry episodes that are just 40 minutes of move exhibition.
Its not what we came for, but im happy its here.
I’m reminded of all the psychology talk they had during I Have No Mouth And I Must Scream’s endgame.
I came specially for the 40+ minutes Plus move exhibition videos.
The worst documentary I ever watched was “Blood into Wine” exclusively because of its janky pacing and strange obsession with all the new age bullshit associated with wine. It absolutely does not compare to “I MADE AN ENTIRE MOVIE TO TELL THE WORLD THAT I WAS AN ASSHOLE KID BUT THAT’S OKAY BECAUSE IT WAS NEVER MY FAULT AND THE PEOPLE I HURT DON’T MATTER ANYWAY! CAN’T YOU SEE HOW MUCH I CHANGED!?!”
The Tim & Eric bits on that documentary were hilarious, I remember nothing else from it other than feeling intense second hand embarrassment.
... what new age bullshit is associated with wine? it's just alcoholic grape drank. sometimes it's very tasty, other times it's even a little better than that if you want to pay 100$ per micro-increment of quality. simple as.
@@NevetsTSmith You would be surprised
I get where Woolie is coming from with the ending of 'Seaspiracy' tainting the information presented throughout the documentary. It rubs me the same way 'Dont Look Up' did - it comes across as sheltered west-coast elite types condescending to the rest of the world on how things SHOULD be run, yet doesn't actually offer any viable or meaningful solutions. Its the same energy as those commercials of starving children in Africa with a C list celebrity voiceover going "Isnt this fucked up? We can fix it NOW if you just give us your money" when actually solutions are long term endeavors that require structural and cultural changes.
It also comes from a place of privilege - 60% of the developing world are dependant on fishing and industry surrounding the ocean. Just because some film student who has the luxury to abstain from eating seafood doesn't mean the rest of us can share in that luxury.
yeah like 9 times out of 10 if someone's trying to convince you the only way to save the world is down to making individual choices as a consumer they're bullshitting you
While going vegan is legitimately a great thing to do for the planet, and I hugely respect the choice to go vegan, I DESPISE this habit of moral grandstanding and straight-up colonialsm from certain first world vegans in this vein.
Just this complete lack of respect or empathy for people’s sociocultural circumstances, where you have privileged western foodies with a plethora of choice, shitting on people who are in areas that have developed their entire economies and cultures to rely on things like fishing, and criticize them for not “being able” to go vegan when the vegan diet is potentially financially infeasible where they are, or they are facing all sorts of local cultural pressures to continue meat consumption, etc.
Not every place in the world has a whole foods around every corner.
@@DoctorCVC going vegan is a great way to slowly kill yourself and do nothing for the earth but feel very smug about it.
I’m just gonna say this cause fuck it. I still have these memories of doing mean stuff to other kids in my class and there’s nothing I want more than to change those events and not be a total piece of shit to others. But the fact that these group of people continued to make the movie anyway even when the victim clearly said he wasn’t comfortable with it, especially the fact that they couldn’t come up with any other way of how to make it up to him, that is the most disgustingly fucked up thing I’ve ever heard.
Recognizing that you were/are a piece of shit is the first step in no longer being a piece of shit. Good on you for realizing your past faults.
What makes Seaspiracy's conclusion even worse is that they literally say that not eating fish for the rest of your life won't help cause of the torrents of money the commercial fishing industry makes through government subsidies.
7:29 “just stop” is almost never going to be a thing people will actually do. Gotta be more realistic than that if you want to change something. Arguably The best way to make change is by convincing people they didn’t change at all
See, we all did stupid shit as a kid, said mean things to each other and such, right? Cus kids are stupid. If I met any of the people i was rude too as a kid I’d like to think we’d both acknowledge that we was stupid kids and i’d apologise if need be.
But, like… and entire class, on the daily, harassing a kid and even physically attacking him? That’s not just kids being kids, man, that’s another level. And to take it even further they continue to ignore the dudes requests to not make the documentary and claim it isn’t about him. Scum, absolute scum through and through.
“The decision to soothe yourself with cruelty is an informed one” is a statement I will use whenever I talk about bullying or abuse in the future.
You know what a good post "I was a bully movie is" A Silent Voice
Shinya was a bully as a kid, the girl, a deaf girl, then moved away after all the bullying then he slowly became the target of the class afterwards, he learned years later just how wrong he was for beginning the bullying in the first place and meets her years later and apologizes and even learns sign language just to properly appologize but doesnt expect her to forgive him
Thats a good moral, you cant give a person back the time they lost but you should still show your regret regardless of if they want to hear it or not
@UCtZSRF0Kg7xGEdOtfxUkabw you should read the manga, it gives more time and depth to each of the characters, you obviously get to see shoyas perspective, but the time givin to see shoko's side of the story through her mom and little sister really helped me understand how kind of a soul shoko is for giving shoya a chance at all but also reminds the reader and shoya that she cant get those days back from her childhood and the scars she lives with
I can understand the idea of it feels fucked up to tell a story at the expense of another persons suffering, but thats why it made me like shoko more, no matter how much life was unfair to her she never became bitter, she never lashed out at the world for being born different, she simply wanted to live life the best way she could like anyone else
Part of what i feel stories that involve characters with disabilities miss is they are still like everyone else even if they cant interact with the world like everyone else
The director (who's the same person who directed Tamako Market and K-ON) has officially stated that it's NOT an "Anti-Bullying film".
@@DR3ADER1 i only mentioned this as a better "bullying movie" than the one they were talking about because the bullies their were so tone deaf
he literally stalks and harasses her until she accepts his apology, that movie sucks
Back in high school, one of my teachers made us watch Cony 2012, before everyone found out it was a scam. I remember while watching it, towards the end it turned into a HARD advertisement and that set off my bullshit alarm and I figured it was a moneymaking scam well before it got outed.
Everyone in my class was mad at me for a week when I said it was an obvious scam lol
I remember thinking it was a scam because there were like so many celebrities and people who knew about Kony but somehow no one knew who he was?
I don't think I ever saw that in schools. What was it about?
@@RavenCloak13 African warlord doing typical African warlord things. Towards the end it became a marketing campaign for a charity that ultimately ended up being a scam that duped thousands of people.
@@zaneseibert
Ah. Sounds about right.
Literally just a bully making money off of a kid he bullied by bullying him again as an adult. I hope somebody he runs into in his life will be kind enough to show him what it feels like to be on the other of his abusive behavior.
Let's hope that person knows exactly which vertebrae to forcefully extract to leave them permenantly paralysed.
“You killed a billion people!”
“My mother didn’t love me.”
“Oh I understand, all is forgiven now.”
Absolute garbage reasoning that I can never get behind. Just because bad things happen to people doesn’t mean those people have to turn that negativity and make someone else’s life horrible to “get even” in the system. The director is a jackass for that, and to not even respect the wishes of the person too??? Pure garbage
yeah, when the examples are less extreme it sounds at least a little more reasonable, like if you break something inconsequential out of frustration. But regardless of the scale, the fact that far more people go through the same kind of shit without turning into monsters or abusing other people, clearly shows that this isn't the "default" response.
@@BlazeMakesGames As someone who is on the spectrum and was severely bullied as a kid as a result, I wouldn't even wish that on my worst enemy because I now how much it sucks and am NOT A FUCKING PSYCHOPATH
*know
@@CaptainTitforce
A real cunt move.
Kylo Ren has entered the chat.
The Bully documentary should have a permanent caption in the entire video labeled, "Made by the same bullies that bullied the victim".
When I was a bully in school I knew exactly what I was doing. I was bullied and I had my own issues but at no point was I just absent in the brain. I was being mean because it made my classmates happy and made me feel accepted. It is a fucking lie that you didn’t know as a kid. I feel bad about what I did. I was a stupid kid and lashed out in extreme ways because I didn’t know what else to do.
I’m glad I got my ass kicked once in a while and I wouldn’t blame those people if they still hate me 20 years later, I hate the people who bullied me. No human would pay themselves on the back for growing up and being better nosy if they really understood what they did or had real regret for their actions. Scumbag director.
good to see comments like this- it's important to point out that it is possible that people CAN change, and take accountability of their actions. but this movie is the exact opposite of that. some people can be assholes for the rest of their lives
Oh my god SUPERSIZE ME. God they unironically showed that in my physical health class in high school as a lesson. Thats a deep cut
its embarrassing, they really thought the issue was "wut if you ate a bunch of unhealthy food tho" the issue of obesity was never fast food its the balances of work life and how many have less and less time to even be active along with LOTS of other aspects because obesity isn't a simple subject
There's no excuse for bullying. Society and doctors would like to believe its excusable and defend bullies and their actions. The worst thing someone can do to victims of anything is to tell them to get over it, try to rationalize to them about why it happened and that they must forgive their assailant and move on for everyones sake or even trivializing the the trauma caused to the victim cause they have to look at the bigger picture and be the better person. The disgusting mental loops folks would do to rationalize horrible situations.
The root causes behind the bullies' behaviors can be _(please note I am _*_not_*_ saying "always are" but rather "can be")_ defensible and/or sympathizable. However, the decisions made and the actions taken as a result of those causes should not be excused, especially when it leads to harm on others.
Richard: “you made me suicidal”
Jay: “BUT MY PARENTS”
I remember one documentary that annoyed me as a teenager was "Mermaids: the body found" which aired on animal planet... it has a ton of "CGI recreations" that it tries to pass off as real footage of mermaids, and i remember being VERY annoyed that it appeared to be genuinely trying to convince people mermaids are real
Yeah, i remenber that one... the same applys to the Megalondon ones, one i remenber they kept doing a bunch of weird CGIs of the Shark being somewhere in the distance or background stalking the crew and it ended with it fucking up a vacation ship. It honeslty felt like a clickbait video at times and your really only gonna watch it for the ending massacre, wich wasnt even that great.
That was a mockumentary that fooled people into thinking it was real, probably because it aired on a channel know for actual documentaries
I won't lie, I fell for it. But when your age is measured in single digits, it's easy to fall for things on the HISTORY CHANNEL.
What complete bullshit. And people wonder why no one can agree on what is and isn't real anymore.
The fishing documentary woolie is talking about is that it attributes change to individual action when it has to be systemic. That’s the problem a lot of people have when it comes to climate change or other major issues. It can’t all be solved by having a “better diet” or “using less straws” it’s bigger than that
And this is why I will always viciously counter arguments that say you shouldn't fight back against bullies. No. If you are able. Beat those guys into a bloody pulp. I tried to live and let live approach and its my one biggest regret in my school life.
I in fact learned this lesson while in school (I was curious okay). Bullies surrounded me in a locker room (saw it coming but I intentionally walked into it). Held me down and took turns punching me in the face. I could break the hold at anytime, but I was looking at each of them waiting for them to feel bad about it. None of them. They just laughed and kept repeating "look at him, he's loving it." They punched like girls, so I wasn't hurt too badly, but hey be lightly slapped for long enough and your face is gonna swell regardless.
This confirmed to me they would never feel any kind of pity to their victims or feel bad about their actions and I was ready to smash their skulls in. Teacher walks in the moment I break the hold and had a vice grip on one of their necks (like bro I was angry, full of adrenaline and I just purged any idea/notion that there was any good in these guys). I didn't know if I was going to badly injure or kill that guy, but I was going to make it hurt because he was the guy that was punching the most and talking the most shit.
But being the good boy I was. I let them go because the teacher asked me to (I was an honour student-upper athlete and good grades-the nerd with muscle so they left my nerd friends alone when I was around). They ran off and the teacher just stood there puzzled and I was just thinking the whole time. Where the hell WERE YOU? I knew it was pointless to ask. Teachers were always useless in preventing this stuff. I knew for the rest of my school experience that only I could protect my friends from bullies.
And if you lived in england you know the type these were. Little bottom feeders acting tough but quick to run away once an actual fight was coming. Thats why they'd attack the people that wouldn't fight back. Talk mad shit about how puny they are, just so they can claim just how hard they are. The kinda ppl in a brawl that would sooner sucker punch than fight fair.
Never feel bad about smashing their teeth in. They were toothless to begin with.
I don't know about beating them to a pulp, but showing them that you can stand up to them, is a good idea.
@@CaptainTitforce oh definitely the shit that I really wanted to snap the neck of? He knew his life was in danger if the teacher didn't stop me. He didn't dare touch my friends afterwards.
He'd still talk shit about how "badly he beat me up" though. He was very lucky I was good natured enough to let it go. But I often thought about the scenario where the teacher never came. I like to think I would stop at leaving them winded and bruised. But knowing how deeply unrepentant they are as bullies and how angry I was at the time upon realising it. I was in a state of mind to do anything.
@@CaptainTitforce I will clarify though. too much of a softly softly approach will cause the bully to probe you further to see how much they can push you before you either give up or beat them up. You will indeed have instances where they'll never get it unless you've knocked them on their ass and kept going. Because if you stop at them on their ass, they'll think. I should have sucker punched him there. that woulda showed him.
No. You send it nice and clear. Pick a fight. You will get a fking fight and you're not coming home without limping. But yes for the most part, a bit of self assertion is enough. But these kinda lads have alot to prove and bragged alot in front of their friends. They need to get a w or get bullied themselves by their own shitty friends.
Similar thing happened to my cousin's. Elder brother got bullied until he beat him up. Then the bully had the bright idea to instead bully the younger brother. But he was on the football team. You can imagine how that went
Delusion ahahah
I hate the phrase "hurt people hurt people." Aside from shifting responsibility away from perpetrators, it ignores the fact that frankly a lot of people are assholes for no reason at all.
This is that South Park episode all over again
The worst documentary I ever saw was The Devil & Father Amorth. It was just scene after scene of William Friedkin trying to look credible and failing miserably every time. He literally pulled a "just trust me bro" with a shoddy reenactment of a supposed event at the end.
My dad made me get the documentary for him. It was advertised as having a real exorcism with no editing at all. The moment the exorcism began, the amount of sound editing was through the fucking roof lmao
@@ThePandaBrawler turning her into a call of duty zombie
So I can give people who were bullies in school a little bit of leeway (emphasis on little) because children's brains don't work right, lotta factors etc etc. But this is only assuming those people at least realize that what they did was awful.
THESE PEOPLE, even as adults, justifying that sort of behavior is... baffling? Alarming? How can someone go "We as an entire group made one kid's life hell and that was okay and hilarious because I was sad" and not at some point in that statement realize it's fucked up?
I’m very wary of the claim that “children’s brains don’t work right” used to justify a lot of shady, dehumanizing shit. Most kids know what they are doing
@@Flackon As somone who was once a kid the hell they know what they are doing. I did not know what the fuck I was doing in school and regret so much stupid shit I did. You gotta have a real selective memory to think "most kids know what they are doing."
@@Geassguy360 I knew what I was doing as a child. What's your excuse? Your brain shouldn't be that much different than mine
@@Flackon Adolescence is when our brains begin to properly grow and develop. It's when mental disorders are most likely to show themselves, it's when our brains are most vulnerable to stress and we need more sleep to function "correctly" (which we often do not get due to a variety of factors). We're very malleable and as such we're also very vulnerable to environmental factors (home life, social pressures at school, etc).
But specifically, well into our teens our prefrontal cortex is still developing which means we often can't do things like make informed decisions, plan ahead, handle our emotions effectively, or even focus on what's going on in the moment.
These aren't all always going to be issues for every teen but it's all stuff that can very easily cause people to make poor choices due to an inability to properly assess said choices. That's why I said I give people who were bullies a bit of leeway as long as they recognize what they did was wrong, because it's not uncommon for teens to do stupid and/or bad shit.
But no, I doubt most kids "know what they're doing."
@@WillowMelody It's possible it's not most kids, and in fact only a few.
That said, "stupid" choices are due to ignorance and "bad" choices are a moral judgement. Avoiding either of these shouldn't be inherently out of reach of a teen's prefrontal cortex, in my view. Otherwise it would suggest that some humans are extraordinarily developed at an early age, while most aren't, and I don't think our biology is that different.
I could be wrong, though.
The worst I’ve ever seen was this documentary on sexuality on Hulu. Name escapes me, but it was narrated by James Hetfield. There was exactly one (1) psychologist who made informed and reasonable points, and the entire rest of it was boring interviews with raving puritans and randos. The thing end with Hetfield saying “Our goal is not to demonize,” rewind thirty minutes back, some dude was shouting “EJACULATING ON A WOMAN’S FACE IS THE MOST VIOLENT THING YOU CAN DO.”
You don't know, man might ejaculate really REALLY hard.
James fucking Hetfield?
Might as well have been James Rolfe
@@kricku James Rolfe's standards would've been too high for that trashfire.
@@sharkodile22 Yeah, but what the hell were they thinking?
well, the good news is that smashing babies with a wooden mallet is no longer the most violent action a man can take
Bullying is just a quaint term for what it really is: Abuse.
I was bullied as a kid. Badly. Thankfully I didn't turn it around and become an antisocial psychopath. Instead, I internalized it and blamed myself for everything until I got over it as a mature adult.
At the same time, I learned empathy and an ability to relate to the people around me. Years and years later, one of the guys who bulled me up and apologized to me about having done it. He said that now that he had his own children, they really changed the way he'd thought about everything, that he didn't want his kids to end up how he had been. By that time I'd had a pretty good life, and it didn't do me any good to hold anything against anyone. I told him as much. People can and do change, but sometimes an asshole is an asshole.
I'm glad you got over it, and I'm sorry it happened. It just terrifies me to think how bullying changes people's course in life. Even if we do successfully grow past it, we never _truly_ do since there's now a foundational part of who we are at this moment that wouldn't be there if it wasn't for the bullying. Now whether or not that holds people back or is a scar they never heal from is case-by-case, but I can never stop thinking about how people have needed to change or grow their personalities from cruel things like this.
It's like snapping a young tree's branch. True, it'll eventually grow past and around it, but that branch, no matter how strong of a branch it could become, will never stop bearing the signs of that break. That just horrifies me to think about.
Thank you, yes!
It is abuse!
I'm almost 30 and I still have issues I've carried since childhood thanks to the bullying I went through throughout all of grade school as a kid
My parents may have been neglectful but they never even glared in my direction, on the contrary the kids at my school like, would come up with new ways to beat me up everyday, make fun of me, demean me, and as a girl to be beaten up by boys, specially boys that were a bit older than me, it's just, a fear and distrust and bitterness that sadly it never leaves you, it sticks with you... To this day I still feel helpless and small
I blame myself I blame them I honestly don't know who to blame but to this day I harvor this irrational unconscious fear of human relationships, I fear opening up and being taken advantage of, I fear confrontation and i cant stand people touching me, I cant
Doctors looked at my bruises and would confront my parents about them beating me up and I always had to explian they were made by my bullies at school that it was not my parents
I was constantly anxious, jumpy and angry as a kid thanks to that and even since I've battled with depression
Like
People just can't fathom how much bullying can truly mess up a person
Hearing pat shit on super size me gave me so much joy
Every time you kick a bully's ass in Lost Judgment, you're making the world a better place.
the dude telling his victim "this isn't your story, it's ours" after being asked to not make this thing is the most unbelievable batch of dogshit???
i have never wanted to gut a documentary creator like a fish quite like i want this dude, jesus
as someone else in the comments already kindly put it: the title of "When We Were Bullies" implies they ever stopped, and this documentary's existance is proof nothing has changed
I can excuse and understand a child not knowing what theyve done is wrong, because unless taught through actual teaching or exposure, they dont understand; that is the point of childhood. You need to be taught to self reflect, to think ciritcally, and other behavourial emotional things from your own side and others.
To then become an adult and still not be emotional mature, and lack critical thinking skills is the failure of our system. And its sad that its way more common than you think. The only space where this stuff is properly taught (and even then its still barried by 'professionals' that teach it wrong) is therapy. Im like not surprised by this at all.
I really need to see a school principal or chancellor pull the "Oh the poor bully probably has a rough home life." line. And the kids response is "So because his mommy doesn't hug him at night. That gives him the right the beat me up?" I just wanna see how that conversation goes.
When we were rapists
"You don't understand... it's OUR story"
Slap that on a box and Apparently you get nominated for awards.... fml
just make them be refugees who were suffering a sexual emergency, it'll win oscars and sweep the cannes film festival.
Man I was nearly one of those pieces of shit. I think the only thing that stopped that was: 1 disgust in myself, 2 a notable drug experience with my friends that I’ve been told caused a positive significant character shift over a week
Drugs can fix your brain kids, even the "wrong" ones.
@@ElGrabnar as long as it’s not “that guy who went nuts from X” lol
I remember sitting in the library at high school with my friends and the topic of parents came up and one of them said "put your hands up if your parents are divorced". All but two of us put their hands up out of a group of 12, and even though my parents were together at the time I still felt that their divorce would be innevitable. And indeed they did; they got divorced a few years after I moved out.
However, none of my friends were bullies. In fact, they (especially one girl I knew who's a drummer in a band now) were the kind of people who would adopt outcasts and loners (myself included) and make them feel comfortable. They did all that despite a couple of 'em being damn near suicidal and cutting themselves up on the regular, and the rest of us worked to keep the teachers from getting in their buisiness because they'd just tell their parents and my friends would get a beating for being depressed and wanting to die. Personal pain is not an excuse to be cruel to others; I've seen kids who went through real, genuine pain and they were the best and kindest people I'd ever known. Bullies have no fucking excuse.
"Bad shit at home" is _never_ an excuse for bullying.
My parents broke up when I was a kid and I was aggressively anti-bullying all through my years at school.
Also, that Seaspiracy doc was more against fishing on a mass, unsustainable scale, perpetuated by super wealthy fishing companies and corrupt governments. Not fishing by individuals or (as specifically stated in the doc) local indigenous communities. The idea of giving up fish is really just a personal protest against fishing companies' over-fishing and the devastating environmental effects of their bottom trawling, as well as people not wanting to ingest microplastics.
Growing up I had parents that instead of divorcing they would just scream at each other in front of me almost daily, and yet I never became a bully or blamed any of my failures on them.
You make your own choices in life, so if you bullied some poor lonely kid in school it's because YOU chose to do it, nobody forced you to.
im sure there's someone out there who was forced to be a bully.
Super Size Me was also shown as part of many American Middle and High schools' "Health" curriculum in the mid 2000s
I have said this before but Pat and Woolie, and the old crew, they have a tremendous voice when it comes to the concept of bullying and coping with its reality. I'm sure they know it and I'm sure they've realized how much genuine healing they have given to others by having these discussions, and doing so in a relatively public format. Woolie's inclusion of the audience, more or less, adds to this. Out of all the comedy these guys give us, and all the random OCD, frame data addiction rants they have gone on, they give us a gem discussion like this, and it connects with the fan base in another, meaningful way.
I just had to point that out.
Imagine being a documentary film maker who put together the whole thing without getting any consent to shoot an epilogue, who clearly lined up this big last scene he never bothered to see if he had
Then, when that person tells you to kick rocks, you decide to wrap up and sell it anyway
Sure you're still missing bits, and there's bits you were clearly going to film like the reunion, but no one came so you pretended it was unfilmable
Now imagine HBO and the Academy say "this is great, this is a high quality work"
Jesus wept
Jesus sure cries a lot.
Jesus christ when Pat brought up Super Size Me, that reminded me that THAT and a documentary about juice only diets were REQUIRED VIEWING for my health class in High School. We had a pair of students fail health because they had recently overcome eating disorders that would have been triggered by watching these films and the school wouldn't accept doctors notes from their therapists. This despite our teacher being smart enough to not teach abstinence only sex-ed against school board policy
On a similar train of thought, there was a parody of Super Size Me called Super High Me that follows a dude who smokes weed every day and argues for legalizing recreational marijuana. It's unironically my brother's favorite movie
your brother is a stereotype.
Seaspiracy is so frustrating because if the guy had just not let his ego get in the way and pushed his own conclusion on it, it could have been a fantastic documentary. It does talk about a lot of really really interesting and hushed up topics that do not get talked about enough.
The problem comes from his beliefs getting in the way and clouding things.
Fishing is a massive polluter, there are questions about food stocks and massive environmental damage, shady shit happens out at sea with labour and what they catch. That is more than enough to be a compelling documentary!
But then it trys to cram all of this into a childish notion of "don't eat fish, completely stop this industry" and completely ruins all effect it could have had. The director did this with cowspiracy as well and it's fucking infuriating.
This is speaking as a vegetarian, btw.
Edit: I will correct pat in saying that most medication does not need to tested on animals, animal trials are basically shortcuts to screen for bad science, and that most animal trials do not find anything that is scientifically useful. Medication that needs animal products is also understandable from the patient side, but it's really not that difficult to just genetically insert the hormone producing cide or biochemical producing DNA into a cell. It's literally easier and cheaper.
When I was in elementary, I was bullied heavily in almost every grade to a horrible degree (in my opinion). However, I also did a bit of bullying of some of the other "losers".
The difference here is, I *regret* what I did. I look back and I still feel bad that I bullied in turn. Me suffering does not make me making others suffer okay. Essentially saying 'I don't care if you are still mad at me and don't want me to make this documentary, I'm fine now and me having bullied is okay' is mind-blastingly narcissistic.
There's a very vicious cycle with bullied kids hurting others, because it's only during a group assault on someone else that they feel welcomed, and so they just. God, I was one of them, and I feel so terrible about the things I did but I understand why I did them, and the reasons are just tragic
@@kattastic9999 I'm not even sure how such a thing would even be fixed, because it's such a basic part of human nature to desire to feel welcomed and accepted that you can't just tell kids to be nice and see results. There are so many tribal dynamics that with some bully victims it's not even _personal,_ they're just an unfortunate sacrificial lamb in someone else's attempt at not feeling scared and alone.
How FUCKED is that? That you might not even be getting tortured because they have a personal or even group interest in you specifically, but because you were just the closest available tool for a bunch of kids to unite over?
In my experience, every bully I ever met were not "going through stuff at home." Their parents were decent. They weren't poor, some of them were better off than my family was. It wasn't that they were suffering and wanted to project it onto others.
It's because they had never truly suffered, and felt that they were so much better than people around them it gave them the right to treat people they didn't like poorly.
Man I love when Pat gets to apply his psych degree to people acting like psychos while Woolie tries in vain to apply reasonable sense to senseless people. It's both of them at their most powerful.
Self-replying just to say that this is at its trustet when Pat is describing MMO culture and MMO players being unreasonable weirdos who will not check back later if the servers are full, because what if it's not full now, or now, or what about now, but how about now though? And Woolie is just dying inside Jim from The Office facing at the camera, knowing this is why we drift further from God's light with each and every day.
I had a boss who talked about how he _used_ to be a bully. His whole crew called me Horatio to other customers instead of my real name because I was the "fat, unfunny guy" like Horatio Sanz. Yeah, _used_ to be a bully. Had a panic attack working for him once and my neighbor called the cops on me. They found out at work and had a good ol' time with that info. Good times...
That's rough, man. The older I get, the more I see a common thread on these sorts of things: if someone has acknowledged that they used to be a bully, get away from them as fast as humanly possible, because they've basically just told you what they're capable of. Unless a person has proven to you that they truly are changed through their actions, not words, ACTIONS, then they're basically just showing you they're a shithead who is trying to make themselves feel good at that moment and that it's only a matter of time before they changed that "used to be" to a "currently yours."
The fact that this bully documentary exists, fills me with a rage that goes beyond anger.
they spent their time bullying some poor kid when they were children then come back many years later to bully him again, not just in front of the school or the town but in front of the entire world. then try to assert they are no longer bullies. welcome to 2023.
the only thing that i can think of in my life that could be misconstrued as anything close to that was either in-jokes about one kid in school that he either created or leaned into (i was also one of those kids) or a kid who was so annoyingly confrontational and weird that the collective reflex response was just to regularly talk about how annoying they were.
the fact that the docu maker didn't think rolling up on one kid and beating him is an unjustifiable offense worth dismissing the whole production alone is fuckin wild
Frankly the only documentaries worth watching nowadays are on UA-cam.
Line Goes Up, everything by hbomberguy, Internet Historian and that crowd as a whole.
About Supersize Me -- At the time it was made, a good number of people actually didn't know or believe the food they offered had THAT many empty calories in it. I remember discussions from that time and I heard more people than you might expect actually not realize that.
Holy shit that sounds like the most sociopathic documentary I’ve ever heard of
“When we were bullies”
Sounds to me like they’re still bullies.
"People always say bullies are cowards. They're wrong, they're proud because they're strong."-Abe Simpson
Fat Head is a great documentary where a guy does the Super Size Me experiment, and actually ends up healthier in every way. It talks about the wealth inequality that drives people to fast food and calls out Super Size Me for blatantly lying for critical attention and drama
Isn't releasing the documentary despite the _one singular victim's_ protests... just a continuation of the bullying? I mean acknowledging and documenting a whole classes' cruelty doesn't really justify it. It sounds like they were hoping that by shining a light on it, they were "absolving" themselves. "See, we owned up to it in front of everyone, so it's okay now."
The scariest part of “I guess I’ll just die” is these people will say “if that the way it is” and they will Expect you to die, and if you don’t you’re wrong and they’ll hound you
"when we were bullies" literally just made a documentary to laugh about the time they all bullied a kid without the now adult's consent, how are they not STILL bullies? absolute wastes of human life if they want a new title i guess.