@@L2SFBC What is the reason in your opinion that CTIS has not hit the 4WD community in Australia ? There are portal axles; various locker systems; ECDS shock absorbers etc. But CTIS not promoted by anyone for Landcruisers, Patrols,Hinos and for Isuzu trucks. Tyre pressure is a crucial element which should be in the apex from anyone’s modification list. You should have the ability to adjust tyre pressure on the fly depending on the terrain.
@@prasannakurukuladithya7630Probably the added complexity issue. Most manufacturers can barely make their chassis strong enough to withstand the off-road touring conditions in Australia, let alone CTIS.
This is what I've been looking for - a true review of the IG's off-road systems and abilities. Thank you Robert and to the lucky owner for making it happen. Very well structured, filmed and produced. Nice to have a credible reviewer on the case! Cheers from Sydney - Dave
As others have said, best Grenadier off road review worldwide to date. 🙂 Very much looking forward to driving mine in similar conditions. So far I’ve only done high range tracks. One thing you might be interested in … an INEOS rep in one of the overseas videos said that Off Road mode also changes throttle response. I’m not sure if that’s true. Not mentioned in the Owner's Manual.
Thanks Michael, appreciated! I didn't notice a difference in throttle response, nor did INEOS mention it in emails to me, or in the owner's manual. I don't think it's necessary. Chances are it's remapped in low range anyway, or maybe with a centre lock.
A very informative assessment t of some important aspects of the vehicle that I have not seen well addressed in other reviews. I really appreciate Robert's evenhanded approach - such a welcome contrast to so much commentary.
I have a Defender with rear lockers. I drive defensively. I avoid trouble. That said, all I have to do when I get inside is, turn it on and drive and I must say, being off road a lot, that is still very appealing. They are like a horse - feed them, love them and use them. I hope the Grendadier evolves in the same way.
Easily the most comprehensive review to date, by anyone, anywhere. What stands out is that an owner of this vehicle is going to have to love it to forgive its sins. And that is a conundrum.
Taking the rough with the smooth is not exactly a new problem to those of us that typically run iconic 4x4 vehicles for ten years plus, with the superiority of effortless capability offset from getting cricks in the neck admiring the thing when walking away, ripping endless items of clothing on sharp door latches when getting out, putting up with the noise, vibration, water leaks, glacial acceleration, conceding modern ABS might be useful, with the biggest regrets being the ultimate selling, not the buying. And often losing very little money annually in the lifecycle process. Grenadier seems to tick most of the positive boxes.
Great review; actual vehicle driven, objectivity and analysis. Unlike an self absorb UA-camr conducting criticism from behind a microphone. Looking forward to your further reviews.
I've got a lot of respect for Andrew, I like the way he goes about bringing his builds to fruition using new innovative but simple design ideas. The problem Ineos has is its developed a vehicle in the 2020's and not the 1980's so it has to meet all the stringent legislation of today. Can't wait to see the new Toyota Prado compared to it.
@Br1anuk yes I think he has worn all the T Shirts, he's a clever man, and has been a pioneer for 4x4 enthusiasts and his films, for many years, goal posts have moved in the last 10yrs, though, in 4x4 circles there's a lot more people building vehicles nowadays, so makes Andrew less unique. Atb.
FAQ: Thank you for all the supportive comments, much appreciated! Some common themes are emerging: - I will do a follow up video on Touring Suitability which will include weights and a towing capabilty analysis - Also hope to put it up against the L663 Defender and Puma Defender and maybe LC300/Y62. I have people for all of this, just have to organise. - Requests for tow test/high speed dirt road; yes if I can get a car on loan - I have been informed that if you put the car in "carwash mode" ??? you can operate the winch without the engine running. Not exactly a solution but interesting. - 285/70/17s fit it seems - there is a conflict between engineering for safety/warranty and the full control 4x4ers like us need. The restrictions on the Grenadier are not unique to it, and there for good reasons I'll explain later. However...when you're out in the field you need 100%, full control because you just don't know what trick you'll need to pull to get out of a situation. - many carmakers get ground and running clearance wrong, quoting the latter when it is in fact the former. Toyota, Ford, others. Toyota even had to a pull a press release and re-issue after I found their Fortuner clearance was 220 not 279mm for example. So this is not unique to Grenadier. But regardless, 245-250mm is excellent so have no clearance concerns. INEOS seem intent on their definition which excludes unsprung mass...I refer again to my tape measure and the ADR defintions.
Robert, the best Ineos review to date. Thanks for sharing this video and thanks to your supporters for sharing there new Ineos. It’s about time for reviews from experience for drivers, and independent to Ineos controlled testers. I’m shocked at the short winch rope and the lack of easy access to the winch. So I look forward to your road report and I think it’s time to wait for the next revision for offroad adventure use .
Red Winch (a local company to my area, and very helpful) emphasised that the Grenadier winch is a self recovery winch, and that alone. They also explained in detail how they had to conform to European Pedestrian Impact laws which cost them (and Ineos) a fortune to comply to. That’s why the winch is set back in the front chassis crossmember as opposed to being further forward (which would result in non compliance of impact regs). However, Red Winch have released an aftermarket alternative (thereby freeing up Ineos from OE fitment litigation issues) called the Nomad, which has double the rope capacity to that of the factory fitted winch. But the owner (in Europe) would have to declare the fitment for Off Road Use Only, as with any exposed winch that could injure a pedestrian.
@@robinireland810 fair enough, but down underwear allowed to have bow bars on the front of the Ineos Grenadier so why not a normal winch from one of the more popular brands like Warn etc. My personal Suzuki Jimny has a 5,500 lb Axom winch and a number of people point out that my 15 metre cable is too short and it’s a pain but works for me just. Why would anyone pay for an overpriced winch with a short cable?
@@overland_adventure_nz being UK based, I can’t answer to NZ or Australian legislation; you may well be able to mount an exposed winch in your countries. The addition of bull bars and other protection measures would be a no brainer too, but here in the UK we’re limited to what type of cotton wool we can tie on the front (as long as it carries an allergy warning). We can’t even add the optional chequer plate wing top protectors, as they too contravene European Pedestrian impact regs!! I looked at the pricing of the Ineos accessory list and compared their prices to the retail market; surprisingly, Ineos have put minimal markup on their accessories, with most of them showing no more than 5% at current prices. Fundamentally, I’d agree with you that the Grenadier winch is overpriced. If it was delivered in a cardboard box on its own, then yes, it would be massively overpriced. However, without wishing to defend their pricing, you have to take into consideration how much it costs a vehicle manufacturer to obtain Type Approval for a winch (or other externally fitted device) to be fitted as an OE fitment option as opposed to being an aftermarket accessory. As briefly touched on in previous post, it took Ineos and Red Winch (who I think were formally branded as Warne) two years to get Type Approval to fit a winch as OE fitment. Some of the price is probably reflected in that (in my opinion). Also, you’re not just buying the winch. You’re paying for upgraded suspension, a modified front chassis member, a fully approved wiring harness built into the vehicles main loom, plus all the bracketry and extra manhours it takes for Pierre and Gaston to install it all. Plus you’re getting a full Ineos warranty for at least 2 years on the winch, which is more than what Red Winch offer if purchased independently. You can’t buy the OE winch from Red Winch as it was designed exclusively for Ineos and can only be installed during the vehicle’s manufacture. I wholeheartedly agree that 15m of rope is not enough, but the physical constraints of the chassis crossmember and having to set it back made it impossible for the designers to up the rope capacity. So if you’re seriously considering buying a Grenadier and you’re expecting to be using a winch on a regular basis to recover other vehicles as well as your own, then the OE fitment winch most likely isn’t suitable, and an aftermarket item, plus all related suspension and fitting upgrades would be the best route. Again, in my humble opinion. All the best. My 2 seater Commercial Grenadier will come with the OE winch, and part of my permanent kit will include recovery gear (from Red Winch) as well as trauma 1st Response kit and a defibrillator. I’m hoping I never have to use any of them.
@@robinireland810 Hi, thanks. I didn’t know that the chassis was upgraded for the winch, and I do appreciate the pre wiring of the winch. Just disappointed that a manual transmission is not available standard and I would have to replace the automatic transmission myself once it comes. I’m going to now wait a few more months before thinking about placing an order.
That's true but I think it has very very poor ground clearance. I've heard others say that also. And you can't fit bigger tires very easily. I'm surprised they can print it to an old disc go when it's a brand new vehicle over 20 years newer. Gosh if they would have had a Jeep Wrangler Rubicon on here with the factory disconnecting sway bars and front and rear lockers it would have put the Grenadier to shame so bad the video would have met people like the Jeep too much so maybe that's why they didn't use one. You can even fit 35s on a factory Jeep or a Bronco Sasquatch which actually has really good articulation in the front even for IFS
@@ronaldrrootiii6040…after playing in the mud you should drive the Rubicon and the Grenadier back home 200 miles over a German Autobahn. I guess you will be impressed about the fact that the difference in capabilities on-road is a lot bigger between the two than off-road. Overall, the Grenadier is the most capable 4x4 to date, taking On/Offroad, price, factory fittings etc. into account. Just like that…😊
Great video and very nice and measured coverage. Its made me feel better about my purchase of the Grenadier. I like how it seems to be very well controlled in offroad scenarios. I see so many over-lifted vehicles that become unstable and downright dangerous....especially in the hands of idiots! You clearly know what you are doing and its very refreshing!
Excellent video thank you so much for covering the Grenadier so thoroughly as I'm super interested in them and future iteration. Looking forward to more!
I hope you feel validated Robert that you have such a scoop on other tubers getting to review this. You know the guys I mean that get all emotional about how they think and feel with a vehicle. You are just factual and on point giving objective, quality information. Well done.
This is the grenadier video I was looking for! Great coverage. I would love to see a comparison video of a 2020-21 LC200! Also, I appreciate that you acknowledged the vehicle was empty. One of my pet peeves of reviewers is that they never consider that!
@L2SFBC Subscribed and definitely plan to! Interest with the 200 series and the grenadier is that they are 2 vehicles we can do popup rooftop conversions in the states!
What an outstanding review. Balanced, to the point and excellent reference comparisons. 10/10. I really like the Grenadier, but my heart is with our Defender 110. We will probably get a Grenadier when V1.1 comes out, but it will sit beside the Defender. The Defender is an heir loom. Daughter has already claimed it.
Finally the video I was looking for. Trust an Aussie to come up with the goods! Cheers for the thorough analysis. Possible future video on how it behaves loaded? Thanks!!
This was good,very good it has not dampened my enthusiasm, no bull, in this video true to life, its definitely as good as anything out there, as it should be, built for purpose, that was the brief and i think they've achieved it,from Steve near Chester England 🇬🇧 where the Roman's once lived.
I would doubt that any potential purchases are put off the car as a result of this review. Maybe not buy the winch if there's an alternaitve, but there's not.
Based on Robert's usual high technical quality and objectivity in his material, I shouldn't have been extra impressed with this review. But here we have, as others have said, the best 4x4 assessment so far of Grenadier, greatly aided by comparisons with some other reference vehicles. What would be great and another first, although probably a severe ask, would be a back-to-back review session with Grenadier, old and new Defenders, G Professional and 79.
That was a great exposure video and to date a more aussie revelation of capability than the UK versions simply driving around muddy paddocks. looking forward to a more in depth driving appreciation from you, ie fast, corrugated, gravel outback roads.
Hopefully I can get lent a car and evaluate that, and tow! I did some dirt-road driving in high range but insufficient for me to form conclusions. However, AWD, decent handling...I'm expecting it to be okay to good.
@@L2SFBC Yes, agree but curious about front wheel wobble at speed as depicted in earlier video's, much the same gremlin as that plaquing Jeep. Steering geometry should have been sorted I hope.
@@trickster8635 so called death wobble is a characteristic of all solid axle 4wd's. all of them can or will do it with worn parts incorrect castor or wheel alignment.
This was very nice & balanced review, none of the daydreaming of what it could be/should be instead but just clear undisputable facts almost. I am fan of this car for the very reason more choice is always better and it's better to offer differently positioned niche each time than carbon copy competitor to someone else. The US guys want it to be like Bronco/Wrangler (but also cheaper), the UK guys want to be absolute spiritual successor to Defender (so mainly cheaper), the AUS guys want it to be 70-series copy but also miraculously cheaper at same time.. If I didn't have LC 150, and the upcoming one wasn't looking as great as it does (love the new GX 550), this would have been my choice. Perhaps they slightly missed the launch opportunity and it doesn't absolutely live up to the hype of 3 years (nothing ever does when we're allowed to dream for too long) but they have done amazing job nonetheless. The looks of it alone make it easy to love imho :- ).
Yeah I was thinking the same thing. Unfortunately I feel like it doesn't have very good ground clearance though. I'm surprised that compared to an old disco I mean it's 20 years newer they should compare to a Wrangler Rubicon and a Bronco Sasquatch
I always love your thorough and detailed assessment. It's nice you use similar terrain in your videos, too. Keep up the great work...it's a real service to the community! In a future video, I would love to see at what speed you can engage the Grenadier's center diff. The use case would be when traveling at speed on high traction surface like tarmac and then transitioning to a low traction surface like loose gravel or even snow / ice.
Excellent assessment. Fair and reasoned, unbiased. It strikes me as a unique vehicle in the modern 4x4 sector - combining modern TC and drivetrain/transmission with traditional chassis, suspension and axle design (isn't this what we've all been looking for?). Do you think the slightly inferior (to LR/T) BTC is a firmware update away from making it as capable as other BTC systems on metal sprung vehicles (ie no ability to shuttle spring rate/ride height as on Defender/Discovery)? I can't see any reason mechanically why it couldn't be 'upload update' refined to be as capable as Toyota's.
Thanks - the BTC may be a firmware issue, depends if the underlying hardware can handle it. Probably can. For BTC to be effective you need very sensitive and granular wheel speed sensors and then braking capability. I would expect the hardware to be in place, and the calibration need improvement. Possibly they took the view that people would just always use lockers. Well, doesn't work like that, lockers aren't always better.
Cheers fella. Interesting. I'd imagine JLR/Toyota's wheel speed sensors are third party supplier products anyway, but the software very much proprietary (and in JLR's case with TR2, their most important piece of intellectual property). Considering how long it's taken for BTC to exceed good ol' mechanical grip, there must be a lot of development required. Will be interesting to see if Ineos are happy to offer firmware updates as and when, rather than requiring you buy a new vehicle... As you know in soggy blighty, BTC performance is vital on simple wet climbs and its here that I've found modern JLR product unbeatable (though we have no LC300 or Patrol).@@L2SFBC
One thing about the Ranger and BT50 diff locks: they continue to indicate that the the locker is fully functional, even when they don't actually work because the crown wheel has eaten the wires to the solenoid.
My understanding is that Ineos would not allow such intense and challenging reviews with its official press vehicles which seems strange because as evidenced from this outstandingly detailed and comprehensive review, it is an extremely capable vehicle. (damper)
Not quite - at the time of the test there were no press vehicles available. I doubt INEOS would restrict me from that test if I had a press vehicle, it's not extreme and didn't hurt the car. I've done harder with other cars quite often.
I'd love to see: high range washboard road performance - comfort, noise, etc. I'd love to see this analysis repeated with 33s to see whether the low range/weight transfer are effected with more tire. I'd also love to see your take on on-road performance given the slow steering. Last, I'd love to see this track repeated with ~80% of max load.
From an engineering standpoint, slow disingaugement of axle difflocks is caused by binding of the metal surfaces of the wound up diff internals due to half shafts to each wheel slightly twisting against eachother.... I think Ineos are quite daring offering this feature in a mainstream vehicle, Land Rover didnt do this for years possibly because they thought that people would keep snapping the axle internals due to misuse? ( totally my opinion) or cause massive wear on them..... Fair play to them for making this Vehicle, really like 90 percent of it, to develop a new vehicle from the drawing board and to be this good is a huge achievement. Great video analysts as always, enjoy your ideas and theories, very in depth and thoughtfull Cheers
Thanks, I agree it's great the lockers are there. Land Rover only used lockers as auto-activated, but plenty of other carmakers - Jeep, Toyota, Mercedes to name but three - offer vehicle with front/rear lockers, and many more rear only.
Great video, thanks for the format and structure of the review. Bit of a shame the Disco 2's traction control wasn't working, that would have made a nice comparison to the system on the Grenadier.
Great seeing someone with excellent 4wd knowledge reviwing this on a proper track (not a fabricated couse) and comparing to other proper 4wd's. Great review, best yet.
Thanks for putting this first look of the Grenadier together! I know the front and rear locker engagement/disengagement was a real problem for the early press event in Scotland, and I was hoping they would have sorted out that issue before customers took delivery. Looks like there still needs to be a software update to fix it. If Ineos is right about it disengaging earlier, and it's just the indicator that is lagging, that is reassuring, but they still need to get the indicator light to react in real time so the driver is confident lockers have been disengaged. Thank you for sharing. I appreciate it and look forward to more videos on the Grenadier!
Ditto other comments on how good this review is. As a note, you can factory option 18” wheels which may correspond with Ineos’s ground clearance claims. Red Winch should have released their Grenadier compatible Nomad winch by now, which doubles the rope capacity. So it may be prudent to configure your Grenadier without a winch and talk to Red Winch about availability. They are local to me, and super helpful. They also made it clear that their Grenadier winch is a self recovery winch, nothing more. So bear that in mind when ordering. I’m assuming your testing was performed with an unloaded vehicle? If so, it would be good to chuck a dozen bags of cement in the back and do the same test, as I’d assume most Aussie’s are going to be fairly well laden, if not overladen! Top channel, Robert. By a long way.
Thanks! The 18" wheels would use lower profile tyres so the overall diameter of the tyre and thus ground clearance remains the same. What's a "self recovery winch" as opposed to any other type?
@@L2SFBC I’ll pass that on to Red Winch, as that was their response to me when I discovered their Grenadier winch had only 15m of rope (of which they claim has a usable 13m) and questioned the limited capacity. They’re local to me, and were extremely helpful and informative when explaining the nightmare of gaining Type Approval for supplying Ineos with an OE fitment winch. They also mentioned that their new Nomad winch would address the rope capacity issue. It has a Grenadier fitting kit (external I presume), so should be ideal for the Australian market. If fitted to a UK Grenadier I imagine there would be an issue with insurance if involved in a collision on a public road as externally fitted (read aftermarket) winches would be for “off road use only” with the exception of Emergency Services and military.
I would like to see it up against vehicles of same year, dicovery 2, 20 years+ old, your ranger has a few years under its belt now. Would be great to see it against new Defender, new Everest etc. A lot of points you mentioned were great. Need to scratch my head. Thanks for your honest review. Need to rethink.
Just found the channel and really enjoyed the content, subbed. Great to see the Grenadier on real tracks. No chance I would option that winch now, especially considering the price of it. As for the locker light not turning off that would drive me crazy, no real excuse for it.
Hi Robert great review you can get the winch to work with the engine off say for instance you want to spool some rope without the engine running just put it in "carwash mode" and the winch and NATO socket are powered.
Just found your channel Robert. Very informative and a great way of explaining the capabilities of the IG. Must look at mine, I am sure the labelling of switches on the OH panel are different. I will be back to see the 2nd episode.
Thanks Robert, interested in fuel as in capacity & economy. Also payload, towball weight and towing weight. Can’t find the majority of these on their web site. Regards.
Many thanks Robert for a great off road review. The weight of the Grenadier is considerable (around 2900kg in diesel version with bull bar & fuel). Did you experience that additional weight and/or did you find it a mild negative off road? Are you planning a further review that would include both gravel and bitumen road driving, including driving at some speed?
If I can get a car, then yes, also towing. The touring video will be a weights analysis for towing - spoiler - it's looking good. But I'd like to tow practically too. Weight is not much of a drawback offroad, and in some cases, heavier vehicles perform better. I have important things to say on weight in the next video.
What I want to see in the next video is how you can take an angle grinder to the DPF under the floor on the BMW engine to create enough clearance to then hammer the footwell flat on a RHD model. Then you might have some room for your left foot! This vehicle has massive potential to be modified by the owners if they want to start hacking it around (and invalidate the warranty) but thats good right, its your vehicle do as you choose if you want
looking forward to the touring issue. Hope it will include such things as spring sag with different ball weights and loading conditions. Have never seen a video of a loaded vehicle. Just wonder why Ineos have never shown a fully-loaded vehicle.
@@L2SFBC We in Africa have a lot of "middelmanekis". Not a good idea to bottom out. Our faithful Defenders and others can very well cope with that - the diff goes up according to wheeltravel. The advantage of solid beam axle is corrupted by the low steering damper! It looks you know how to tackle difficult terrain. Well done!
Great 4WD video, awesome breakdown of vehicle pro’s and con’s. It would be interesting to see an Ineos kitted out with Australian designed/engineered off-road equipment (i.e. winch, bar, rock sliders/steps). Maybe even a Grenadier fitted with Marks 4WD type portal axles. Consider a test with a kitted Grenadier Quartermaster. 👍🏼👍🏼
Thank you for the best review so far. Would like to see: -Sand performance -Rock Performance -Wading performance -Towing /Hauling with Accessories info (this is a must) -Mileage city/ highway -Storage and roof rack
The 300 Series GR-S is equipped with 265/65x18" which is same nominal diameter as the Grenadier's 265/70x17" - I do agree that this is a slightly small size compared to what is standard for Y62 Patrol, etc. Disengaging / engaging the lockers is a general pain in the butt for even ARB air lockers. The best system is the computer controlled Land Rover Defender. But the jury is out on the Defender's locker reliability in the long run. Land Rover's traction control is head and shoulders above every other make but the Grenadier's system looks reasonably well calibrated.
Yes, same size; I feel that given how offroad-oriented the Grenadier is, it should have gone larger. I did not make the same criticism of the LC300 when I did the preview drive as that car is more multi-purpose than the Grenadier.
The thumbs-out thing is more for vehicles without power steering or dampers. My thumbs are not hooked hard in, and if they've not been broken yet, I doubt they ever will be. I have driven Series Land Rovers and G60s etc offroad, that's an entirely different steering story!
could be interesting to see on a skid pan/snow ,maybe if back heavy it spins rather than drifts...i can see you might choose 1st gear low instead of descent mode on a steep winding snowy road...it isnt necessary to be balanced in a skid sideways but it adds confidence
Very interesting. You mentioned that lockers are not always better than brake traction control. Do you have a video on that topic? It would be very interesting to understand that.
an excellent review. I think it did really well for an unmodified vehicle. traction control is no replacement for articulation is it! Good compromise for on and off road use though i guess.
Well, traction control IS a replacement for articulation - it has allowed fully independent suspension vehicles to go places they otherwise could not. And, fully indie offers huge ground clearance - look at Y62, Discovery 3/4/5, L663 Defender as examples.
@@L2SFBC A wheel off the ground has no benefit, still they are incredible tech. even if they don't have 6' of travel like i want. ineos looks like more than any normal individual needs.
Quite literally the best offroad review of the Grenadier I've seen, thank you and the owner for allowing it and filming it too..
Best Grenadier review yet, by far. You nail it with pragmatic appraisal supported by clear facts and comparisons. Looking forward to the next part.
Glad you enjoyed it, please share :-)
@@L2SFBC What is the reason in your opinion that CTIS has not hit the 4WD community in Australia ?
There are portal axles; various locker systems; ECDS shock absorbers etc. But CTIS not promoted by anyone for Landcruisers, Patrols,Hinos and for Isuzu trucks.
Tyre pressure is a crucial element which should be in the apex from anyone’s modification list.
You should have the ability to adjust tyre pressure on the fly depending on the terrain.
@@prasannakurukuladithya7630Probably the added complexity issue. Most manufacturers can barely make their chassis strong enough to withstand the off-road touring conditions in Australia, let alone CTIS.
And I didnt have to hear again why it was created!
@@MTNDOG39 YES! If I hear that backstory one more time…
This is what I've been looking for - a true review of the IG's off-road systems and abilities. Thank you Robert and to the lucky owner for making it happen. Very well structured, filmed and produced. Nice to have a credible reviewer on the case! Cheers from Sydney - Dave
As others have said, best Grenadier off road review worldwide to date. 🙂
Very much looking forward to driving mine in similar conditions. So far I’ve only done high range tracks.
One thing you might be interested in … an INEOS rep in one of the overseas videos said that Off Road mode also changes throttle response. I’m not sure if that’s true. Not mentioned in the Owner's Manual.
Thanks Michael, appreciated! I didn't notice a difference in throttle response, nor did INEOS mention it in emails to me, or in the owner's manual. I don't think it's necessary. Chances are it's remapped in low range anyway, or maybe with a centre lock.
A very informative assessment t of some important aspects of the vehicle that I have not seen well addressed in other reviews. I really appreciate Robert's evenhanded approach - such a welcome contrast to so much commentary.
Thank you, I do try and be fair.
Great review with facts..unlike other youtube influencers/fans with crazy arguments
I have a Defender with rear lockers. I drive defensively. I avoid trouble. That said, all I have to do when I get inside is, turn it on and drive and I must say, being off road a lot, that is still very appealing. They are like a horse - feed them, love them and use them. I hope the Grendadier evolves in the same way.
Great review Robert - always appreciate your unbiased view and technical analysis.
Robert - just brilliant. Best review so far on the Ineos. Congrats to you and those who donated the vehicle. Thanks
Glad you enjoyed it
@@L2SFBC your style reminds me of Peter Wherrett - a former credible motoring journalist from a bygone era.
Easily the most comprehensive review to date, by anyone, anywhere. What stands out is that an owner of this vehicle is going to have to love it to forgive its sins. And that is a conundrum.
Why "forgive its sins" and isn't that the same for any other car?
Taking the rough with the smooth is not exactly a new problem to those of us that typically run iconic 4x4 vehicles for ten years plus, with the superiority of effortless capability offset from getting cricks in the neck admiring the thing when walking away, ripping endless items of clothing on sharp door latches when getting out, putting up with the noise, vibration, water leaks, glacial acceleration, conceding modern ABS might be useful, with the biggest regrets being the ultimate selling, not the buying. And often losing very little money annually in the lifecycle process. Grenadier seems to tick most of the positive boxes.
Great review; actual vehicle driven, objectivity and analysis. Unlike an self absorb UA-camr conducting criticism from behind a microphone. Looking forward to your further reviews.
Andrew St Pierre White?
@@Br1anuk yes that's the fella, I take it you watched his last video then ! What a sham!
@@stephenhankey688 had to turn it off half way through.
I've got a lot of respect for Andrew, I like the way he goes about bringing his builds to fruition using new innovative but simple design ideas. The problem Ineos has is its developed a vehicle in the 2020's and not the 1980's so it has to meet all the stringent legislation of today. Can't wait to see the new Toyota Prado compared to it.
@Br1anuk yes I think he has worn all the T Shirts, he's a clever man, and has been a pioneer for 4x4 enthusiasts and his films, for many years, goal posts have moved in the last 10yrs, though, in 4x4 circles there's a lot more people building vehicles nowadays, so makes Andrew less unique. Atb.
Wow! I'm thoroughly impressed by the amount of detail and useful information in your review. You sir just earned a subscriber!
Welcome aboard! Thanks
Excellent video. This should be the standard for all off road vehicle reviews.
Wow, thanks!
As others have said, best review of this vehicle by far, and really appreciate the unbiased no-nonsense presentation.
Thank you
FAQ:
Thank you for all the supportive comments, much appreciated! Some common themes are emerging:
- I will do a follow up video on Touring Suitability which will include weights and a towing capabilty analysis
- Also hope to put it up against the L663 Defender and Puma Defender and maybe LC300/Y62. I have people for all of this, just have to organise.
- Requests for tow test/high speed dirt road; yes if I can get a car on loan
- I have been informed that if you put the car in "carwash mode" ??? you can operate the winch without the engine running. Not exactly a solution but interesting.
- 285/70/17s fit it seems
- there is a conflict between engineering for safety/warranty and the full control 4x4ers like us need. The restrictions on the Grenadier are not unique to it, and there for good reasons I'll explain later. However...when you're out in the field you need 100%, full control because you just don't know what trick you'll need to pull to get out of a situation.
- many carmakers get ground and running clearance wrong, quoting the latter when it is in fact the former. Toyota, Ford, others. Toyota even had to a pull a press release and re-issue after I found their Fortuner clearance was 220 not 279mm for example. So this is not unique to Grenadier. But regardless, 245-250mm is excellent so have no clearance concerns. INEOS seem intent on their definition which excludes unsprung mass...I refer again to my tape measure and the ADR defintions.
Very comprehensive video that actually answers a serious users questions. I am waiting for my Trailmaster to be delivered any week now - can't wait!!!
Robert, the best Ineos review to date.
Thanks for sharing this video and thanks to your supporters for sharing there new Ineos.
It’s about time for reviews from experience for drivers, and independent to Ineos controlled testers.
I’m shocked at the short winch rope and the lack of easy access to the winch.
So I look forward to your road report and I think it’s time to wait for the next revision for offroad adventure use .
My pleasure!
Red Winch (a local company to my area, and very helpful) emphasised that the Grenadier winch is a self recovery winch, and that alone.
They also explained in detail how they had to conform to European Pedestrian Impact laws which cost them (and Ineos) a fortune to comply to.
That’s why the winch is set back in the front chassis crossmember as opposed to being further forward (which would result in non compliance of impact regs).
However, Red Winch have released an aftermarket alternative (thereby freeing up Ineos from OE fitment litigation issues) called the Nomad, which has double the rope capacity to that of the factory fitted winch.
But the owner (in Europe) would have to declare the fitment for Off Road Use Only, as with any exposed winch that could injure a pedestrian.
@@robinireland810 fair enough, but down underwear allowed to have bow bars on the front of the Ineos Grenadier so why not a normal winch from one of the more popular brands like Warn etc.
My personal Suzuki Jimny has a 5,500 lb Axom winch and a number of people point out that my 15 metre cable is too short and it’s a pain but works for me just.
Why would anyone pay for an overpriced winch with a short cable?
@@overland_adventure_nz being UK based, I can’t answer to NZ or Australian legislation; you may well be able to mount an exposed winch in your countries. The addition of bull bars and other protection measures would be a no brainer too, but here in the UK we’re limited to what type of cotton wool we can tie on the front (as long as it carries an allergy warning).
We can’t even add the optional chequer plate wing top protectors, as they too contravene European Pedestrian impact regs!!
I looked at the pricing of the Ineos accessory list and compared their prices to the retail market; surprisingly, Ineos have put minimal markup on their accessories, with most of them showing no more than 5% at current prices.
Fundamentally, I’d agree with you that the Grenadier winch is overpriced. If it was delivered in a cardboard box on its own, then yes, it would be massively overpriced.
However, without wishing to defend their pricing, you have to take into consideration how much it costs a vehicle manufacturer to obtain Type Approval for a winch (or other externally fitted device) to be fitted as an OE fitment option as opposed to being an aftermarket accessory.
As briefly touched on in previous post, it took Ineos and Red Winch (who I think were formally branded as Warne) two years to get Type Approval to fit a winch as OE fitment. Some of the price is probably reflected in that (in my opinion).
Also, you’re not just buying the winch. You’re paying for upgraded suspension, a modified front chassis member, a fully approved wiring harness built into the vehicles main loom, plus all the bracketry and extra manhours it takes for Pierre and Gaston to install it all. Plus you’re getting a full Ineos warranty for at least 2 years on the winch, which is more than what Red Winch offer if purchased independently.
You can’t buy the OE winch from Red Winch as it was designed exclusively for Ineos and can only be installed during the vehicle’s manufacture.
I wholeheartedly agree that 15m of rope is not enough, but the physical constraints of the chassis crossmember and having to set it back made it impossible for the designers to up the rope capacity. So if you’re seriously considering buying a Grenadier and you’re expecting to be using a winch on a regular basis to recover other vehicles as well as your own, then the OE fitment winch most likely isn’t suitable, and an aftermarket item, plus all related suspension and fitting upgrades would be the best route. Again, in my humble opinion.
All the best.
My 2 seater Commercial Grenadier will come with the OE winch, and part of my permanent kit will include recovery gear (from Red Winch) as well as trauma 1st Response kit and a defibrillator. I’m hoping I never have to use any of them.
@@robinireland810 Hi, thanks.
I didn’t know that the chassis was upgraded for the winch, and I do appreciate the pre wiring of the winch.
Just disappointed that a manual transmission is not available standard and I would have to replace the automatic transmission myself once it comes.
I’m going to now wait a few more months before thinking about placing an order.
Although a quick production, this has been the best review of the Grenadier which I've seend. Thank you Robert.
Best review so far, factual objective and informed
might be the best video on this vehicle i have seen so far. very thorough.
Glad you liked it!
It's amazing how level the Grenadier stays on an uneven terrain compared to other vehicles. Good review Robert.
That's true but I think it has very very poor ground clearance. I've heard others say that also. And you can't fit bigger tires very easily. I'm surprised they can print it to an old disc go when it's a brand new vehicle over 20 years newer. Gosh if they would have had a Jeep Wrangler Rubicon on here with the factory disconnecting sway bars and front and rear lockers it would have put the Grenadier to shame so bad the video would have met people like the Jeep too much so maybe that's why they didn't use one. You can even fit 35s on a factory Jeep or a Bronco Sasquatch which actually has really good articulation in the front even for IFS
@@ronaldrrootiii6040…after playing in the mud you should drive the Rubicon and the Grenadier back home 200 miles over a German Autobahn. I guess you will be impressed about the fact that the difference in capabilities on-road is a lot bigger between the two than off-road. Overall, the Grenadier is the most capable 4x4 to date, taking On/Offroad, price, factory fittings etc. into account. Just like that…😊
Very happy with your recent videos. Thanks for getting us some great answers regarding the Grenadier.
Fantastic review mate. Good, honest warts and all review unlike some other reviews from other so called influencers.
Great video and very nice and measured coverage. Its made me feel better about my purchase of the Grenadier. I like how it seems to be very well controlled in offroad scenarios. I see so many over-lifted vehicles that become unstable and downright dangerous....especially in the hands of idiots! You clearly know what you are doing and its very refreshing!
It's a VERY good offroader, that's for sure, and thank you!
Thanks, this is best review video for this vehicle so far
Glad you liked it!
I concur. This is the best Grenadier vid out there at the moment.
A very honest appraisal, given the impromptu nature of the test . Thanks Robert , well done (again).
At last a proper off road review of the Grenadier. Thank you.
Glad you liked it!
This has been great video review of the Grenadier, the best I have seen to date. #respect
Thanks, please share!
Superb knowledge and production...no fluff, just right proper expertise.
Glad you enjoyed it!
@@L2SFBC You put all these other blah blah hyperbole merchants to shame. So refreshing to have someone composed and to the point.
The best Grenadier test drive- Thank you.
Glad you liked it!
Excellent video thank you so much for covering the Grenadier so thoroughly as I'm super interested in them and future iteration. Looking forward to more!
More to come!
I hope you feel validated Robert that you have such a scoop on other tubers getting to review this. You know the guys I mean that get all emotional about how they think and feel with a vehicle. You are just factual and on point giving objective, quality information. Well done.
Thanks John!
Nice to see a clear unbiased video
Glad you liked it!
This is fantastic! A very thorough approach not covered by any other channel.
Much appreciated!
Spectacularly useful review, thanks for the thoroughness and candidness
This is the grenadier video I was looking for! Great coverage. I would love to see a comparison video of a 2020-21 LC200!
Also, I appreciate that you acknowledged the vehicle was empty. One of my pet peeves of reviewers is that they never consider that!
Thanks, check out my Grenadier vs LC300 vs Defender vs Patrol playlist!
@L2SFBC Subscribed and definitely plan to! Interest with the 200 series and the grenadier is that they are 2 vehicles we can do popup rooftop conversions in the states!
What an outstanding review. Balanced, to the point and excellent reference comparisons. 10/10.
I really like the Grenadier, but my heart is with our Defender 110. We will probably get a Grenadier when V1.1 comes out, but it will sit beside the Defender. The Defender is an heir loom. Daughter has already claimed it.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Finally the video I was looking for. Trust an Aussie to come up with the goods! Cheers for the thorough analysis. Possible future video on how it behaves loaded?
Thanks!!
If I can get one, yes!~
Best test I’ve seen yet. Well done!
Just found your channel, love your review, you have a voice that would keep me calm in a multiple roll over. Cheers from USA
thank you so much! would prefer you kept rubber-side down :-)
This is the type of review I have been waiting for. Thank you.
Finally, a proper off-road review!! Thank you.
More to come! Please share :-)
This was good,very good it has not dampened my enthusiasm, no bull, in this video true to life, its definitely as good as anything out there, as it should be, built for purpose, that was the brief and i think they've achieved it,from Steve near Chester England 🇬🇧 where the Roman's once lived.
I would doubt that any potential purchases are put off the car as a result of this review. Maybe not buy the winch if there's an alternaitve, but there's not.
Based on Robert's usual high technical quality and objectivity in his material, I shouldn't have been extra impressed with this review. But here we have, as others have said, the best 4x4 assessment so far of Grenadier, greatly aided by comparisons with some other reference vehicles. What would be great and another first, although probably a severe ask, would be a back-to-back review session with Grenadier, old and new Defenders, G Professional and 79.
Thanks! Maybe in the future...
Absolutely excellent video. As informative as it’s possible to get. Appreciated the comparisons against other vehicles on the same stages. Thank you.
Glad you enjoyed it!
That was a great exposure video and to date a more aussie revelation of capability than the UK versions simply driving around muddy paddocks. looking forward to a more in depth driving appreciation from you, ie fast, corrugated, gravel outback roads.
Hopefully I can get lent a car and evaluate that, and tow! I did some dirt-road driving in high range but insufficient for me to form conclusions. However, AWD, decent handling...I'm expecting it to be okay to good.
@@L2SFBC Yes, agree but curious about front wheel wobble at speed as depicted in earlier video's, much the same gremlin as that plaquing Jeep. Steering geometry should have been sorted I hope.
Only one way to find out!!!
@@trickster8635 so called death wobble is a characteristic of all solid axle 4wd's. all of them can or will do it with worn parts incorrect castor or wheel alignment.
Excellent presentation! I immediately subscribed and will now search our channel for other videos and wait eagerly for new content. Thanks
Fabulous review - thanks so much. Just took delivery of mine - can't wait to get it out on the rough stuff.
This was very nice & balanced review, none of the daydreaming of what it could be/should be instead but just clear undisputable facts almost.
I am fan of this car for the very reason more choice is always better and it's better to offer differently positioned niche each time than carbon copy competitor to someone else. The US guys want it to be like Bronco/Wrangler (but also cheaper), the UK guys want to be absolute spiritual successor to Defender (so mainly cheaper), the AUS guys want it to be 70-series copy but also miraculously cheaper at same time..
If I didn't have LC 150, and the upcoming one wasn't looking as great as it does (love the new GX 550), this would have been my choice. Perhaps they slightly missed the launch opportunity and it doesn't absolutely live up to the hype of 3 years (nothing ever does when we're allowed to dream for too long) but they have done amazing job nonetheless. The looks of it alone make it easy to love imho :- ).
It's not Bronco/Wrangler. The USA doesn't really do workhorse wagons like this one. Thanks for the comment!
AT last a technically focussed review! Thankyou. Would love to see suspension flex / droop measurements.
Yeah I was thinking the same thing. Unfortunately I feel like it doesn't have very good ground clearance though. I'm surprised that compared to an old disco I mean it's 20 years newer they should compare to a Wrangler Rubicon and a Bronco Sasquatch
I always love your thorough and detailed assessment. It's nice you use similar terrain in your videos, too. Keep up the great work...it's a real service to the community! In a future video, I would love to see at what speed you can engage the Grenadier's center diff. The use case would be when traveling at speed on high traction surface like tarmac and then transitioning to a low traction surface like loose gravel or even snow / ice.
Lots of practical and concrete insights. Thumbs up for Robert 😎👍
Glad you enjoyed it
SHALOM BROTHER. EXCELLENT REVIEWS. ACTUALLY,, THE BEST OF THEM ALL
Yes best Grenadier off road review with actual hard conditions - glad it preformed very well - considering its grenadiers first build !
Excellent assessment. Fair and reasoned, unbiased. It strikes me as a unique vehicle in the modern 4x4 sector - combining modern TC and drivetrain/transmission with traditional chassis, suspension and axle design (isn't this what we've all been looking for?). Do you think the slightly inferior (to LR/T) BTC is a firmware update away from making it as capable as other BTC systems on metal sprung vehicles (ie no ability to shuttle spring rate/ride height as on Defender/Discovery)? I can't see any reason mechanically why it couldn't be 'upload update' refined to be as capable as Toyota's.
Thanks - the BTC may be a firmware issue, depends if the underlying hardware can handle it. Probably can. For BTC to be effective you need very sensitive and granular wheel speed sensors and then braking capability. I would expect the hardware to be in place, and the calibration need improvement. Possibly they took the view that people would just always use lockers. Well, doesn't work like that, lockers aren't always better.
Cheers fella. Interesting. I'd imagine JLR/Toyota's wheel speed sensors are third party supplier products anyway, but the software very much proprietary (and in JLR's case with TR2, their most important piece of intellectual property). Considering how long it's taken for BTC to exceed good ol' mechanical grip, there must be a lot of development required. Will be interesting to see if Ineos are happy to offer firmware updates as and when, rather than requiring you buy a new vehicle... As you know in soggy blighty, BTC performance is vital on simple wet climbs and its here that I've found modern JLR product unbeatable (though we have no LC300 or Patrol).@@L2SFBC
There is precedent. Ford improve the BTC in the Everest (you don't get that in the UK) with a software update, so there is hope.
One thing about the Ranger and BT50 diff locks: they continue to indicate that the the locker is fully functional, even when they don't actually work because the crown wheel has eaten the wires to the solenoid.
I’ve been awaiting this. Thanks so much
You are so welcome!
Very straight forward sensible review - thank you
Great video for people considering buying one for sure!
My understanding is that Ineos would not allow such intense and challenging reviews with its official press vehicles which seems strange because as evidenced from this outstandingly detailed and comprehensive review, it is an extremely capable vehicle.
(damper)
Not quite - at the time of the test there were no press vehicles available. I doubt INEOS would restrict me from that test if I had a press vehicle, it's not extreme and didn't hurt the car. I've done harder with other cars quite often.
Best review I have watched thanks
Wow, thanks! Please share :-)
I'd love to see: high range washboard road performance - comfort, noise, etc. I'd love to see this analysis repeated with 33s to see whether the low range/weight transfer are effected with more tire. I'd also love to see your take on on-road performance given the slow steering. Last, I'd love to see this track repeated with ~80% of max load.
Great suggestion!
Learn a lot about disengage the locker. Thanks. 😊
Glad to help
From an engineering standpoint, slow disingaugement of axle difflocks is caused by binding of the metal surfaces of the wound up diff internals due to half shafts to each wheel slightly twisting against eachother....
I think Ineos are quite daring offering this feature in a mainstream vehicle, Land Rover didnt do this for years possibly because they thought that people would keep snapping the axle internals due to misuse? ( totally my opinion) or cause massive wear on them.....
Fair play to them for making this Vehicle, really like 90 percent of it, to develop a new vehicle from the drawing board and to be this good is a huge achievement.
Great video analysts as always, enjoy your ideas and theories, very in depth and thoughtfull
Cheers
Thanks, I agree it's great the lockers are there. Land Rover only used lockers as auto-activated, but plenty of other carmakers - Jeep, Toyota, Mercedes to name but three - offer vehicle with front/rear lockers, and many more rear only.
Excellent review . The Grenadier will only get better going forward.
I expect so yes!
a long way to go forward yet
If this company is still around in 10 years I’ll give it a look. Great review,
Ineos is a huge company, massive in chemical production. The cars are just a passion project. Would be interesting to see how long they do it for.
Whatta' scoop! Hadn't even heard of these before this. Well done.
Great video, thanks for the format and structure of the review. Bit of a shame the Disco 2's traction control wasn't working, that would have made a nice comparison to the system on the Grenadier.
Thanks for watching!
And THAT is why you do not count on traction control, you count on LOCKERS!
Great seeing someone with excellent 4wd knowledge reviwing this on a proper track (not a fabricated couse) and comparing to other proper 4wd's. Great review, best yet.
Thanks! 👍
Thanks for putting this first look of the Grenadier together! I know the front and rear locker engagement/disengagement was a real problem for the early press event in Scotland, and I was hoping they would have sorted out that issue before customers took delivery. Looks like there still needs to be a software update to fix it. If Ineos is right about it disengaging earlier, and it's just the indicator that is lagging, that is reassuring, but they still need to get the indicator light to react in real time so the driver is confident lockers have been disengaged. Thank you for sharing. I appreciate it and look forward to more videos on the Grenadier!
hmm was the issue reported in any reviews? I didn't spot it, I did watch a couple of videos off the release event. I agree it needs to be fixed.
Ditto other comments on how good this review is.
As a note, you can factory option 18” wheels which may correspond with Ineos’s ground clearance claims.
Red Winch should have released their Grenadier compatible Nomad winch by now, which doubles the rope capacity. So it may be prudent to configure your Grenadier without a winch and talk to Red Winch about availability.
They are local to me, and super helpful.
They also made it clear that their Grenadier winch is a self recovery winch, nothing more. So bear that in mind when ordering.
I’m assuming your testing was performed with an unloaded vehicle? If so, it would be good to chuck a dozen bags of cement in the back and do the same test, as I’d assume most Aussie’s are going to be fairly well laden, if not overladen!
Top channel, Robert. By a long way.
Thanks! The 18" wheels would use lower profile tyres so the overall diameter of the tyre and thus ground clearance remains the same. What's a "self recovery winch" as opposed to any other type?
@@L2SFBC I’ll pass that on to Red Winch, as that was their response to me when I discovered their Grenadier winch had only 15m of rope (of which they claim has a usable 13m) and questioned the limited capacity.
They’re local to me, and were extremely helpful and informative when explaining the nightmare of gaining Type Approval for supplying Ineos with an OE fitment winch.
They also mentioned that their new Nomad winch would address the rope capacity issue. It has a Grenadier fitting kit (external I presume), so should be ideal for the Australian market. If fitted to a UK Grenadier I imagine there would be an issue with insurance if involved in a collision on a public road as externally fitted (read aftermarket) winches would be for “off road use only” with the exception of Emergency Services and military.
I would like to see it up against vehicles of same year, dicovery 2, 20 years+ old, your ranger has a few years under its belt now. Would be great to see it against new Defender, new Everest etc. A lot of points you mentioned were great.
Need to scratch my head.
Thanks for your honest review. Need to rethink.
I may do that in future
Just found the channel and really enjoyed the content, subbed. Great to see the Grenadier on real tracks. No chance I would option that winch now, especially considering the price of it. As for the locker light not turning off that would drive me crazy, no real excuse for it.
Thanks for the sub. Yes, I've had a comment someone from for ONE KILOMETER before it switched off. Reason is no wheel speed difference. Annoying!
I would love to see how the Ranger Raptor stacks up off road!
Great comprehensive review.
An excellent off road review.
Glad you liked it!
Hi Robert great review you can get the winch to work with the engine off say for instance you want to spool some rope without the engine running just put it in "carwash mode" and the winch and NATO socket are powered.
No, won't work with the engine off, confirmed with INEOS. Yes, a pain for the reason you mentioned and others.
@@L2SFBC I have a Trialmaster and it does I can run the winch with the engine off .
Great a proper review thanks, i just found you channel and subscribed. keep up the good work
Thanks!
Just found your channel Robert. Very informative and a great way of explaining the capabilities of the IG. Must look at mine, I am sure the labelling of switches on the OH panel are different. I will be back to see the 2nd episode.
Thanks, is yours left hand drive?
Grenadier looks so good
Thanks Robert, interested in fuel as in capacity & economy. Also payload, towball weight and towing weight. Can’t find the majority of these on their web site. Regards.
I will do a towing weights analysis, and if I get a car, a practical tow test too.
Wow!
Great review!
Glad you enjoyed it
Many thanks Robert for a great off road review.
The weight of the Grenadier is considerable (around 2900kg in diesel version with bull bar & fuel). Did you experience that additional weight and/or did you find it a mild negative off road?
Are you planning a further review that would include both gravel and bitumen road driving, including driving at some speed?
If I can get a car, then yes, also towing. The touring video will be a weights analysis for towing - spoiler - it's looking good. But I'd like to tow practically too. Weight is not much of a drawback offroad, and in some cases, heavier vehicles perform better. I have important things to say on weight in the next video.
What I want to see in the next video is how you can take an angle grinder to the DPF under the floor on the BMW engine to create enough clearance to then hammer the footwell flat on a RHD model.
Then you might have some room for your left foot!
This vehicle has massive potential to be modified by the owners if they want to start hacking it around (and invalidate the warranty) but thats good right, its your vehicle do as you choose if you want
One owner has removed the footrest and found it to be much larger than required, so there's that.
looking forward to the touring issue. Hope it will include such things as spring sag with different ball weights and loading conditions. Have never seen a video of a loaded vehicle. Just wonder why Ineos have never shown a fully-loaded vehicle.
Won't be fully loaded sorry but will cover other items
Thanks for the good report.
Now I know why that front bash-plate is protruding so low!!
To protect the steering damper!
I was wondering....
It should be even lower!
@@L2SFBC We in Africa have a lot of "middelmankis".
Not a good idea to bpttom out
@@L2SFBC We in Africa have a lot of "middelmanekis".
Not a good idea to bottom out.
Our faithful Defenders and others can very well cope with that - the diff goes up according to wheeltravel.
The advantage of solid beam axle is corrupted by the low steering damper!
It looks you know how to tackle difficult terrain.
Well done!
Great 4WD video, awesome breakdown of vehicle pro’s and con’s. It would be interesting to see an Ineos kitted out with Australian designed/engineered off-road equipment (i.e. winch, bar, rock sliders/steps). Maybe even a Grenadier fitted with Marks 4WD type portal axles. Consider a test with a kitted Grenadier Quartermaster. 👍🏼👍🏼
Great review Rob ! Would love to have a closer look at this vehicle….it’s what I’d choose if I was in the market for a 4WD….and could afford one.
Thank you for the best review so far.
Would like to see:
-Sand performance
-Rock Performance
-Wading performance
-Towing /Hauling with Accessories info (this is a must)
-Mileage city/ highway
-Storage and roof rack
May do some of that
Excellent video.
Thank you.
Great review. I would like to see the performance of this vehicle on the same terrain loaded for a trip
My old VW Syncro with vacuum lockers was just the same, needed steering angle on to get the locker to disengage.
The 300 Series GR-S is equipped with 265/65x18" which is same nominal diameter as the Grenadier's 265/70x17" - I do agree that this is a slightly small size compared to what is standard for Y62 Patrol, etc.
Disengaging / engaging the lockers is a general pain in the butt for even ARB air lockers. The best system is the computer controlled Land Rover Defender. But the jury is out on the Defender's locker reliability in the long run.
Land Rover's traction control is head and shoulders above every other make but the Grenadier's system looks reasonably well calibrated.
Yes, same size; I feel that given how offroad-oriented the Grenadier is, it should have gone larger. I did not make the same criticism of the LC300 when I did the preview drive as that car is more multi-purpose than the Grenadier.
Great video Rob. I always enjoy your content. One thing I noticed though is you have a bad habit of driving with your thumbs in the wheel. 👍
The thumbs-out thing is more for vehicles without power steering or dampers. My thumbs are not hooked hard in, and if they've not been broken yet, I doubt they ever will be. I have driven Series Land Rovers and G60s etc offroad, that's an entirely different steering story!
Nice off road test 👍 But I would have liked to see it compared to the New Defender 😉
Maybe soon...
Excellent review thank you 🙏
My pleasure!
could be interesting to see on a skid pan/snow ,maybe if back heavy it spins rather than drifts...i can see you might choose 1st gear low instead of descent mode on a steep winding snowy road...it isnt necessary to be balanced in a skid sideways but it adds confidence
Very interesting. You mentioned that lockers are not always better than brake traction control. Do you have a video on that topic? It would be very interesting to understand that.
Yes, search my channel for 'traction control'. BTC is better in situations where you need to turn.
@@L2SFBC Thanks
an excellent review. I think it did really well for an unmodified vehicle. traction control is no replacement for articulation is it! Good compromise for on and off road use though i guess.
Well, traction control IS a replacement for articulation - it has allowed fully independent suspension vehicles to go places they otherwise could not. And, fully indie offers huge ground clearance - look at Y62, Discovery 3/4/5, L663 Defender as examples.
@@L2SFBC A wheel off the ground has no benefit, still they are incredible tech. even if they don't have 6' of travel like i want. ineos looks like more than any normal individual needs.