Having used a Model O- and Endgame Gear XM1, i prefer the weight of the XM1. Lightweight mice is nice and all, but when they get too light, i tend to overshot my flicks. Its all preference, i typically do well with mice that are around 70-80 grams.
Redegade same man used the model o- for a month and a half with sweaty Hands claw style. Some how all the sweat was on the Mose buttons and nothing in the actual mouse
I have been using the "brick" for around 2 years and while it might not be the optimal mouse for shooters, it definetely does have a good shape for larger hands and has quite a decent feature set. Also, the build quality appears to be pretty good (it survived 2 years of daily and long usage, including left clicking a lot of people in Minecraft lol).
Very nice comparison! The fact that you review these mice with a much more critical eye (not to mention a much higher dose of common sense) than a lot of other channels, which can sometimes behave like cheerleaders for whatever the new trend is, is also much appreciated!
Once mice gets below to 100g the limiting factor in its usability become the cord. 50g and less and you start to realize that having cord REALLY sucks a lot, even more than before. I'm all in for 45g and less but it has to be wireless otherwise I wouldnt bother
i like this video because this talks about how weight isn't everything. in fact i don't think that weight has much to do with mice and aim at all. use a model o and a g502 interchangeably with arm aim and i see improvements with each switch between the mice. i believe that body and trial and error is the way to go. if you like a mouse like a g502 or a model o then go for it. you can be just as good with either option. just try a bunch of mice and find the best one for you.
g305 has been my main for 2 years. I've tried like 8 other mice but they just don't do it for me. Razer Viper Ultimate was awesome but the shape just wasn't my favorite. I have the Pwnage Ultra Custom Wireless coming soon in the mail so i'm excited to see how that turns out - 69g / wireless / ergonomic - it's a kickstarter
explosivo yoo rockin the same bro... but I bought custom honeycomb 3d printed for the back so its lighter. Only thing is it use aa battery which dramatically increase the weight. I wish they had built in battery
Lighter gaming mice do make a difference. You may take a while to get use to it but worth it imo. The pro top mice list may not be up-to-date and most likely will change in the future since light gaming mouse is still new for some people
Don't think anyone characterized it as a problem. It is optimization, innovation. Athletes train hundreds of hours to shave off a few milliseconds. Why?
I'm using the G305 with a AAA battery. I don't play competitively thus never tried to gauge any improvements there, but it certainly makes other mice feel more cumbersome by comparison. The wireless is a really nice feature and I still haven't had to swap the battery after nearly 5 months on performance mode. Maybe I've gotten used to it, but it doesn't feel that light to me in general use. Only when I compare it to something else does it feel light. Clicks feel good, pretty good mouse overall. Only complaints are that I enjoy having more buttons to play with and G Hub software is trash so I had to use the older LGS instead to even get the mouse into performance mode, but I only used the software one time to set it up then it's saved to the device.
fun fact, I started playing Overwatch with a G502, and got pretty far into competitive gameplay, even getting started into e-sports with an amateur team (we got up to the Open Division week 2 at one point and that was really fun). I was a main hitscan DPS in my team, and frankly was doing great. I was playing at 1600dpi and a sensitivity of almost 20 in game. I bought lighter mice afterwards, even after our team disbanded and I quitted esports for good, and right now I play at 800dpi with an in-game sensitivity of 5, and I REALLY con't know how I could play comfortably with such a high sensitivity back in the day. I have the feeling to have considerably improved my aim since then though
Personally as someone who uses low sensitivity I prefer wireless because even paracord gets in the way sometimes. I also prefer a solid shell. All the honeycomb ones I've tried will have either my finger somehow landin on a hole or it feels like a cheese grater on my palm.
I'm glad you brought up the point that these lighter mice will not help everyone. I actually prefer to use higher dps as well since I dislike the feeling of using a light mouse. To me this is like people putting on swimming suits without actually knowing what type of swimmer they are. I remember this girl in my class nobody paid attention to her cause she was a slow surface swimmer. This is all changed when we did a diver type class, and she did a whole lap underwater without taking a breath. When she came up we were all shocked to hear her say, she only surfaced cause her eyes started to hurt (no googles). These companies advertise these mice like they will make everyone into pro players even if they never been in a competive match.
Bought a Corsair Scimitar because at the time I had absolutely no idea that weight and grip style was important. Felt fine in my palm, and mOsT iMpOrTaNtLy had lots of buttons. I don't use many but do appreciate having at least 4 thumb buttons. Still have yet to find a light-ish mouse that has that.
Thank you for this video, I was starting to feel like the lightweight mouse, are helpful somewhat, but not as important as mouse shape that is suited for your hand size. I've tried all these mouse mentioned and more, and I still find my way back to the Logitech 305...this is my baby!
my mice path until now: DA Chroma -> G403 -> DA Elite -> ZA13 -> FK2 -> EC2-b -> MX518 Legendary -> Model O -> G305 -> GPW -> Model O minus ->Viper Mini -> M711-> currently waiting for Xtrfy M4 and DA mini -> want to try Viper Ultimate, Model D, DA v2, Model D minus
Weight is a stabilizer. With light weight, your movements will be more expressive, as an artist sketching with a light touch. If you need that for your playstyle, e.g. low sens+accel+twitchy with adjustments, the light weight may help quick movements with less fatigue. For tracing though, stable control is best. The artist switches pens - you can hold a button to switch sens. This limits the range, however. If you don't use a "sniper button", there will be some weight that's a good compromise between "twitch" and "trace" for the style you use vs. the game's combat requirements.
yessuh yessuh it is tho it’s just rare and you can’t really be sure if someone’s just looking for attention when they say they have it or if they actually do
To people saying that shape is more important than weight, no it's not. If you have a 1lb mouse and the shape is perfect for you, you wouldn't be effective in game unless you're Superman. If two people of the same skill and dexterity were to battle each other, one using a heavy mouse and the other using a light mouse, who do you think will win? The guy with the lighter mouse will win because he will have less strain and fatigue, it will be easier to stop the mouse and control for him. It's simple physics, shape is not the most important, its size and weight.
Reminds me of the Ultralight backpacking community. They'll sacrifice all creature comforts just to save a few grams and believe it'll somehow enhance your backpacking trip. It's just playing the number game that doesn't really effect real world performance.
I'm too jittery with extremely light mice. It's a bit of a crutch I suppose, but the weight acts as a bit of a filter for me. I may unfortunately just have a low ceiling for accuracy.
"how light is too light" this question was asked by many when the original Finalmouse UL released, and before that too I'm sure. We will see lighter and lighter mice as time goes on, sub 40g isn't far away. No such thing as too light
Subbed man just for how clean your production studio is. I bet your sock drawer is perfect huh? All cleanliness aside you have some good info man. I have most of these mice starting with the Razer Viper Ultimate, Razer Viper, Razer Viper mini, Logitech G Pro wireless, Cooler Master MM710, Glorious Model o/o-, EndGame Gear, Glorious Model D, Razer DeathAdder v2/v2 mini, Zowie S2 and S1, Logitech G305, Roccat Kone Pure Ultra, Zowie EC2, Rival 310 and the HK Mira S. Out of all these mice my top 3 are the Viper Mini, MM710, G305. Thanks man for not being Linus, and you and RocketJumpNinja should hook up and do a video. Ha
I am an Ultralight 2 user, not because of the weight and hype/hate behind the brand - But because of the size and shape, it has improved my aim in the titles I play coming from the G305 and Air 58 prior. Also tried the Model O- and Divina S2, but those really didn't suit me at all.
It really depends on the position of your hand and the grip. If you are low dpi FPS gamer that uses the movement of the whole arm, than sure, lighter is better. But for me, i need higher and well shaped mouse (example Logitech MX 518), because i control my mouse mainly with my wrist and fingers, my elbow is below the level of the desk, and it needs to be quite heavy (desirably about 80-100g) to have more control and reduce unwanted mouse movement. So in my situation weight doesn't really matter, the shape and the grip texture is the #1 concern (beside the sensor quality, but today even cheap sensors are still very good, not like 10 years ago).
Great video as usual! A lighter mouse has definitely improved my aim. To address the lightweight+wireless situation to anyone who may be interested, I bought myself a Pwnage Ulta Custom, it's like a wireless Glorious Model D, under 75g and it's been a joy to use!
Holes in the shell are a dealbreaker for me. I am quite picky in regards to shape and contact points on the mouse (I'm a claw grip user) so even though I haven't had any mouse with this hex pattern I feel like it would get annoying pretty quickly. Weight is important but comfort for longer sessions is even more important for me.
With the weights we're talking about here, from 45 up to 120/150g's the individual matters immensely, so much so I don't think you can draw a definitive line under where weight stops/starts being a factor clearly at all. These are minuscule ranges when compared to the variance of poundage per square inch of force different people can produce/maintain control over. I'm a guitar player and teach 4-6 hours a day, while I've got thin/long fingers the lower arm/wrist itself can generate a lot more power than the usual person my size, on the scale of a larger man with more mass behind him. Think of it like I skipped everything but hand day, everyday. For me, 120 feels light and easy to manipulate, but 60 feels like I could throw it across the room at any point if I'm not kinda "clamped" on it, it's too easy to overshoot if I'm not being very wary of the force I'm putting in because that upper threshold is higher. Not to say I couldn't get used to it, but it immediately feels like it's not compatible comparatively to a heavy boi. On the other hand, If I were a woman/man with smaller/less beefy hands 120 could potentially feel extremely sluggish and they'd find an immense advantage to cutting that weight in half. This is one of those things I wouldn't buy sight unseen and just hope it'll be alright. Ideally (not always possible) If you can get a feel for it in a shop you'll likely make a much better purchase for you personally.
I switched to the Viper Mini and fingertip grip and my aim has improved greatly, it’s 61 grams so in that 60-80 gram range. The optical switches are probably my favorite part of the mouse.
Simple answer, is when you play a game that requires an intense level of focus and engagement, and not once do you realise you have a mouse in your hand, it is probably a good mouse. But the moment it 'slips' on the mat, or the scroll wheel doesn't register being rotated, or you press a button and it is too stiff or slow to react (due to travel), then you remember you have a mouse in your hand. Reducing weight is great, because it reduces friction, but if the buttons are shit, if the sensor is shit or requires a specific mouse mat, then you will notice it letting you down. Having your brain and your hand in perfect harmony, with no distractions caused by the mouse, that is when you know the mouse is good. Measuring the width, height, weight etc, might matter for comfort, but ultimately your ability to forget you have it in your hand when you are engaged, is what determines a brilliant mouse.
I dont think G502 is that bad as people say it is Yes it is heavy Yes it does not have good cable or good skates But its really comfortable also infinite scroll wheel is really good and with mouse bungee it is not bad at all PS: using G502 for FPS CSGO: 400 DPI , 1.69 Sensitivity
Switched to the g502 lightspeed about a year ago coming from Razer. Valorant forced me to drop from my 1200 DPI to 450. Starting to see the ways lmao. Looking for a lighter mouse now but hate that my current options mean I lose at least 4 buttons on my mouse 😫
i have very big hands, XXL glove size, so even the 502 feels small and cramped to me. i absolutely cannot use anything smaller than it as it cramps up my hands and hurts in a matter of minutes. i'm stuck with the chunky ones but i actually like the weight. had some lighter mice before and i typically do worse with them
I actually improved with my switch to the Cooler Master MM710. I used the Zowie S1 Divina before but I didn't like the glossy finish. So I picked up another mouse. However build quality on the Zowie is much better.
"shape is more important than weight" true to a certain extent. I've been using the basilisk ult at 107g for 3 years, kinda cancer. 20 hrs on aimlabs master 1. switched to the superlight at 63g went on aimlabs, took a bit to get used to the weight and grip but jumped to gm 4 instantly
Your aim improves from practice not getting a lighter mouse. I started off with the 87g razer diamondback and then switched to the 120g g502 and my aim is as good as ever. I'm also using a pretty low sensitivity.
I have the g502 hero and I love it. I’ve never tried a 40 gram mice or anything but I love the way the mouse feels and the two buttons directly to the left of left click, I cannot live without anymore. Might get the light speed one day but we will see
Sorry but that weight range is what some have been asking for a decade. From light you can then go heavier with mods, going the other way is actually more difficult since it require special tools and mouse structure knowledge. Variety of choices is what makes this era of mice product great. Truth is EVERY ASPECT MATTERS and CHOICE VARIETY IS INCREASING and that's a WIN-WIN for everybody.
I've been using a G305 and G900 back and forth. While the weight of my G305 is really nice I feel like the G900 fits my hand perfectly. I feel like I perform better because of the shape of the G900
I went from the Mamba Wireless to the UL2 since it released. A pretty drastic change in how I play came soon after the UL2 arrived. I have very large hands so the shape is not perfect for me but I also only fingertip grip the mouse since it makes small adjustments easier in my experience. (I will mention that I do play on 200 DPI) Although I have not had the luxury to try such a wide variety of mice, I don't think anything will beat the UL2 for me until I have the chance to try other FinalMouse offerings or some of Glorious'/G-Wolves products.
The best mouse is the one that's wireless and has the lowest weight without putting holes in it, which by my accounts is still the logitech GPW which is why i use one. Shape is also important, perhaps the #1 thing for some, then the rest.
I had a model O, I liked the shaped but ultra-light weight isn't really important and made absolutely no difference to me... I still hit my shots just like I would otherwise and it didn't boost anything in Kovaaks aim trainer. I also absolutely HATE the honeycomb design and after a few months dead skin cells get inbetween them and you have to scrape it off with a toothpick... yuck. I'm going back to Logitech mice. Currently using a mix between g703 wireless and G-pro hero. Gonna buy a G-pro wireless tomorrow.
Sad how much weight is over hyped at the moment. Depends on shape, surface, feet, quality, clicks...ect. Most people have terrible mouse mats and using wrong shape or grip. Its about controlling the mouse well. Think of it like a mechanical key switch. Most springs are 45-65g. Too light you lose the control and too heavy you lose the feel. Thank you for this video, RJN should be saying things like this and hes the OG mouse guy.
From My own experience, the glorious model O minus, has pretty much the perfect balance, for me. Finalmouse capetown is actually to light in my opinion.
I'm not a competitive FPS guy (blind in one eye, so it's kind of pointless for me) but I have tried some light gaming mice. My problem is something you touched on: I have large hands. Virtually without exception these mice all disappear under my hand. I've been using a Logitech G6 (got it mainly for playing mmo's). It's large enough that it's more comfortable in my hand. It weighs a ton as mice go, however, heh.
I use the Glorious Model O, not the minus one though. The larger one fits my hand better and I just feel like the smaller one would've been too light. I was coming from a Logitech G502, and the difference was astounding.
I'm an asian American 24 year old male and am an above-average fps player. I have been using the G502 Proteus. Bought a light 55gr coolermaster mouse and it is night and day difference. Lighter to this extent is better.
I use a coolermaster mm710 mouse at 600 dpi and I find it to be very accurate. The only thing I didn't like about the mouse is you can only adjust the dpi in increments of 100 instead of 50 in the software.
EC2-B Is a heavy mouse but the shape is there. For me a heavy mouse helps steady my aim when doing fast movements rather rid I used a light weight mouse which I could overshot with because of the weight
Tiny mice are surprising good. I used a $20 Lenovo basic cordless mouse size about 2/3 or maybe less of a normal mouse and I loved it. Light! Fast. Ok didn’t last forever but for $20 is was excellent.
I think low sens gamers have more room to play with, they can go with lighter mice like around 45/50/60 and instead of affecting their aim, it feels more comfortable as they are constantly moving their whole arm but for high sens gamers like myself, which is a minority group, the sweet spot like you said is around 80g, depending on how high your sens is, maybe even around 60g would be good too, but anything below 60 i find starts to affect my aim negatively, like i am just handicapping myself for no reason, it's not like 80g is too heavy, nor is 100g, i feel like there is no gaming mice out there that is too heavy, and no one is going to buy a heavy logitech office mice that weighs like 140g for gaming, it feels like gaming mice can't actually be too heavy because no one makes heavy gaming mice, they are all within the 100g now, and nowadays, 2 years later, it's more like within 80g, i think it's because most gamers are actually on low sens, especially fps gamers, most fps gamers play on low sens, on mnk and on controller, so it makes sense they are going lighter and lighter, but i feel like when they hit the 30 gram range, that will be when even low sens user's aim will start to suffer. In conclusion, high sens users should go for 60g+ mice if they don't want to hurt their aim, and going for 60g - mice doesn't make it so that you don't strain your wrist or it's more comfortable because there are no heavy gaming mice in the market, they are all within 100g range so they are all light enough that it's basically impossible to hurt your arm/wrist if you play on high sens, so in going for a mice 60g - , your just making it harder for yourself trying to fit in with the superlight mouse club which is full of low sens users which is why no one complains about superlight mouse being bad for your aim.
Hi Ali! I really like your videos. I'm thinking of starting a youtube channel, can you share a tutorial on how you make a video? Since your videos are very high quality (visually), you got good music too! Please share a tutorial.
@@currentlykent4593 His videos are visually similar to MKBHD & DAVE2D. If you see their videos on any screen be it OLED/IPS or any lower quality panel. It looks good in all screens! I think the secret is in their editing/color grading. Colours look very bright & pleasing in all of their videos along with good music ofcourse!
Brian D'Souza lets not forget some pretty quality cameras and lenses. Ali is also super creative. Plays with shadows by moving his lighting around during shots, and using different colored paper instead of just a plain white desk.
what type of hand grip do you use? i'm planning to buy cooler master mm710. I'm using a g102 for 2 years and im planning to buy a new one. Now my style of grip iiiiis fingertip? or idk, it doesn't touch my palm, only my fingertips. would you recommend mm710? thanks!
I used to play competitive FPS, mostly Overwatch (got to Top 500) with the G502. I found I was decent at flick shots to my right, but never to my left. What's your experience? I stopped playing cause I would get too absorbed and have to spend a lot of time maintaining my mechanical skill, but recently started playing single player shooters and man, I miss that FPS rush.
Im more concearned on the use of optical switches for reduce the input lag even more, hope Logitech and other brands release some mice options wired or wireless because the control quality of Razer Products are questionable.
I really love my Cooler Master MM710. Really affordable and comfortable especially for FPS gaming. If you need a new mouse or a lighter mouse without breaking the bank, you will not regret buying it!
I feel like shape is more important than weight
depends if youre a casual or not imo
I mean why would you use something that causes discomfort?
You're onto something here
i was about to wrote the same thing
Having used a Model O- and Endgame Gear XM1, i prefer the weight of the XM1. Lightweight mice is nice and all, but when they get too light, i tend to overshot my flicks. Its all preference, i typically do well with mice that are around 70-80 grams.
How long before someone makes a carbon fibre mouse that'll cost a fortune
brooo
There is one already, forgot the name but I think there's a Kickstarter for it haha.
ill buy it
Zaunkoenig M1K
Carbon fibre isn't any lighter than plastic, also it's not a really good idea to have much skin contact with it.
Started with a 502? My old ass remembers gaming on ball mice. Razer boomslang, anyone?
im still using my old g102
@ which staple 5$ ?
My first mouse was the stock Amiga mouse.
First mouse a Compaq by Logitech Ball Mouse. Then the First optical - the mostly respected Microsoft Intellimouse Explorer
i used to use the razer mcfly i think it was called, it was the best mouse ever
My favorite tech reviewer. Always straight to the point and never feels like an ad.
When I see all these honeycomb mice, what I don't hear about is sanitation. All those holes seem like skin cell, oil, dust traps.
Exactly what I have been thinking!
Jeremy Tines Ives been using a cooler master mm710 for 2 months there is no dust or oil problems.
Gotta feed those bedbug
Surprisingly enough, my Model O isn't very dirty even after about 2 months of daily use. I have very sweaty hands, especially when playing.
Redegade same man used the model o- for a month and a half with sweaty Hands claw style. Some how all the sweat was on the Mose buttons and nothing in the actual mouse
I have been using the "brick" for around 2 years and while it might not be the optimal mouse for shooters, it definetely does have a good shape for larger hands and has quite a decent feature set. Also, the build quality appears to be pretty good (it survived 2 years of daily and long usage, including left clicking a lot of people in Minecraft lol).
yes
butterflying and jitter lkike me
“Weight is sign of reliability. If it doesn’t work, you can always hit him with it.”-Boris the Blade/Bullet Dodger
D'ya like dags ?
I like caravans more
Fifty grand for half a day’s work
In the words of the Virgin Mary, "Come again?"
3:02 Narrator: "He did not"
Edit: now it's up! Thanks dude
You have to step up your timing game
What?
Very nice comparison! The fact that you review these mice with a much more critical eye (not to mention a much higher dose of common sense) than a lot of other channels, which can sometimes behave like cheerleaders for whatever the new trend is, is also much appreciated!
I absolutely love the Cooler Master MM710 personally, I have had zero issues with pinching or creeking.
0:30 windows with Catalina wallpaper, nailed it
Expertly made video. Great take on mouse weight. I feel like people are going over board with it like they used to with high DPI.
Once mice gets below to 100g the limiting factor in its usability become the cord. 50g and less and you start to realize that having cord REALLY sucks a lot, even more than before. I'm all in for 45g and less but it has to be wireless otherwise I wouldnt bother
69 grams is the sweet spot for me.
Nice
Nice
Get the D!
Nice
Nice
i like this video because this talks about how weight isn't everything. in fact i don't think that weight has much to do with mice and aim at all. use a model o and a g502 interchangeably with arm aim and i see improvements with each switch between the mice. i believe that body and trial and error is the way to go. if you like a mouse like a g502 or a model o then go for it. you can be just as good with either option. just try a bunch of mice and find the best one for you.
I really love the XTRFY M4, ergonomic shape and the cord is super light I never notice it
The cable is kinda garbage
g305 has been my main for 2 years. I've tried like 8 other mice but they just don't do it for me. Razer Viper Ultimate was awesome but the shape just wasn't my favorite. I have the Pwnage Ultra Custom Wireless coming soon in the mail so i'm excited to see how that turns out - 69g / wireless / ergonomic - it's a kickstarter
explosivo yoo rockin the same bro... but I bought custom honeycomb 3d printed for the back so its lighter. Only thing is it use aa battery which dramatically increase the weight. I wish they had built in battery
Lighter gaming mice do make a difference. You may take a while to get use to it but worth it imo. The pro top mice list may not be up-to-date and most likely will change in the future since light gaming mouse is still new for some people
The pinnacle of first world problems lol
Most tech channels sound really first world problemy lol
Don't think anyone characterized it as a problem. It is optimization, innovation. Athletes train hundreds of hours to shave off a few milliseconds. Why?
leave now.
@@addlemm44 welp that made me cringe.
@@Zach-yg4tv he's right.
I'm using the G305 with a AAA battery. I don't play competitively thus never tried to gauge any improvements there, but it certainly makes other mice feel more cumbersome by comparison. The wireless is a really nice feature and I still haven't had to swap the battery after nearly 5 months on performance mode. Maybe I've gotten used to it, but it doesn't feel that light to me in general use. Only when I compare it to something else does it feel light. Clicks feel good, pretty good mouse overall. Only complaints are that I enjoy having more buttons to play with and G Hub software is trash so I had to use the older LGS instead to even get the mouse into performance mode, but I only used the software one time to set it up then it's saved to the device.
fun fact, I started playing Overwatch with a G502, and got pretty far into competitive gameplay, even getting started into e-sports with an amateur team (we got up to the Open Division week 2 at one point and that was really fun). I was a main hitscan DPS in my team, and frankly was doing great. I was playing at 1600dpi and a sensitivity of almost 20 in game. I bought lighter mice afterwards, even after our team disbanded and I quitted esports for good, and right now I play at 800dpi with an in-game sensitivity of 5, and I REALLY con't know how I could play comfortably with such a high sensitivity back in the day.
I have the feeling to have considerably improved my aim since then though
i’ve gotten many lightweight mice but i always come back to my g305
Personally as someone who uses low sensitivity I prefer wireless because even paracord gets in the way sometimes.
I also prefer a solid shell. All the honeycomb ones I've tried will have either my finger somehow landin on a hole or it feels like a cheese grater on my palm.
I'm glad you brought up the point that these lighter mice will not help everyone. I actually prefer to use higher dps as well since I dislike the feeling of using a light mouse. To me this is like people putting on swimming suits without actually knowing what type of swimmer they are. I remember this girl in my class nobody paid attention to her cause she was a slow surface swimmer. This is all changed when we did a diver type class, and she did a whole lap underwater without taking a breath. When she came up we were all shocked to hear her say, she only surfaced cause her eyes started to hurt (no googles). These companies advertise these mice like they will make everyone into pro players even if they never been in a competive match.
Bought a Corsair Scimitar because at the time I had absolutely no idea that weight and grip style was important. Felt fine in my palm, and mOsT iMpOrTaNtLy had lots of buttons.
I don't use many but do appreciate having at least 4 thumb buttons. Still have yet to find a light-ish mouse that has that.
Thank you for this video, I was starting to feel like the lightweight mouse, are helpful somewhat, but not as important as mouse shape that is suited for your hand size. I've tried all these mouse mentioned and more, and I still find my way back to the Logitech 305...this is my baby!
my mice path until now: DA Chroma -> G403 -> DA Elite -> ZA13 -> FK2 -> EC2-b -> MX518 Legendary -> Model O -> G305 -> GPW -> Model O minus ->Viper Mini -> M711-> currently waiting for Xtrfy M4 and DA mini -> want to try Viper Ultimate, Model D, DA v2, Model D minus
I'm pretty fond of heavy mice because they help you make small adjustments when sniping.
Same had a 129g mouse switched to 69g and im going to sell the 69g mouse
Depends on the sensitivity.
Same here
"logitech brick502" HAD ME DYING LOL
The M4 is strangely god like, I didn't like it first but now I am hooked. :D
Just bought an ultralight 2 because my model o- broke. Excited to try out that 50g
Weight is a stabilizer. With light weight, your movements will be more expressive, as an artist sketching with a light touch. If you need that for your playstyle, e.g. low sens+accel+twitchy with adjustments, the light weight may help quick movements with less fatigue. For tracing though, stable control is best. The artist switches pens - you can hold a button to switch sens. This limits the range, however. If you don't use a "sniper button", there will be some weight that's a good compromise between "twitch" and "trace" for the style you use vs. the game's combat requirements.
6:05 Just a casual Super founders edition card and an IPhone 11 sitting in the background nothing too special .
@@Perceptence and that’s a flex lol
2:33 - *Trypophobia intensifies*
Trypophobia is the only reason why I haven't gone with the super light mice.
@@COMM_DUMPST3R too bad trypophobia isnt real its
yessuh yessuh it is tho it’s just rare and you can’t really be sure if someone’s just looking for attention when they say they have it or if they actually do
To people saying that shape is more important than weight, no it's not. If you have a 1lb mouse and the shape is perfect for you, you wouldn't be effective in game unless you're Superman.
If two people of the same skill and dexterity were to battle each other, one using a heavy mouse and the other using a light mouse, who do you think will win? The guy with the lighter mouse will win because he will have less strain and fatigue, it will be easier to stop the mouse and control for him. It's simple physics, shape is not the most important, its size and weight.
I kinda wanna see you doing a G305 weight mod...
G305 is my daily. And I bought the model o when it first came out. Keep going back to g305
FunkMaster model O doesn't have a nice shape, but the model D has a nice shape.
Reminds me of the Ultralight backpacking community. They'll sacrifice all creature comforts just to save a few grams and believe it'll somehow enhance your backpacking trip.
It's just playing the number game that doesn't really effect real world performance.
I'm too jittery with extremely light mice. It's a bit of a crutch I suppose, but the weight acts as a bit of a filter for me. I may unfortunately just have a low ceiling for accuracy.
Practice.
"how light is too light" this question was asked by many when the original Finalmouse UL released, and before that too I'm sure.
We will see lighter and lighter mice as time goes on, sub 40g isn't far away. No such thing as too light
True because you can always lower your dpi but theres the catch that it makes the mouse shape too small for most people
@@Oliver-bn7jt Maybe lighter sensor will be made in comming years with smaller size
Sry, just plain wong.
No such thing as too light but shape and durability are far more important.
Good weight distribution,good build quality and good shape makes more sense than a trypophobic nightmare imo
The nick name with that comment is absolutely funny. You need more upvotes.
your vids are always well put together man
Subbed man just for how clean your production studio is. I bet your sock drawer is perfect huh? All cleanliness aside you have some good info man. I have most of these mice starting with the Razer Viper Ultimate, Razer Viper, Razer Viper mini, Logitech G Pro wireless, Cooler Master MM710, Glorious Model o/o-, EndGame Gear, Glorious Model D, Razer DeathAdder v2/v2 mini, Zowie S2 and S1, Logitech G305, Roccat Kone Pure Ultra, Zowie EC2, Rival 310 and the HK Mira S. Out of all these mice my top 3 are the Viper Mini, MM710, G305. Thanks man for not being Linus, and you and RocketJumpNinja should hook up and do a video. Ha
I am an Ultralight 2 user, not because of the weight and hype/hate behind the brand - But because of the size and shape, it has improved my aim in the titles I play coming from the G305 and Air 58 prior. Also tried the Model O- and Divina S2, but those really didn't suit me at all.
It really depends on the position of your hand and the grip. If you are low dpi FPS gamer that uses the movement of the whole arm, than sure, lighter is better.
But for me, i need higher and well shaped mouse (example Logitech MX 518), because i control my mouse mainly with my wrist and fingers, my elbow is below the level of the desk, and it needs to be quite heavy (desirably about 80-100g) to have more control and reduce unwanted mouse movement.
So in my situation weight doesn't really matter, the shape and the grip texture is the #1 concern (beside the sensor quality, but today even cheap sensors are still very good, not like 10 years ago).
Great video as usual! A lighter mouse has definitely improved my aim. To address the lightweight+wireless situation to anyone who may be interested, I bought myself a Pwnage Ulta Custom, it's like a wireless Glorious Model D, under 75g and it's been a joy to use!
Holes in the shell are a dealbreaker for me. I am quite picky in regards to shape and contact points on the mouse (I'm a claw grip user) so even though I haven't had any mouse with this hex pattern I feel like it would get annoying pretty quickly. Weight is important but comfort for longer sessions is even more important for me.
Well produced video, with transparency and morphing animations.
With the weights we're talking about here, from 45 up to 120/150g's the individual matters immensely, so much so I don't think you can draw a definitive line under where weight stops/starts being a factor clearly at all. These are minuscule ranges when compared to the variance of poundage per square inch of force different people can produce/maintain control over.
I'm a guitar player and teach 4-6 hours a day, while I've got thin/long fingers the lower arm/wrist itself can generate a lot more power than the usual person my size, on the scale of a larger man with more mass behind him. Think of it like I skipped everything but hand day, everyday. For me, 120 feels light and easy to manipulate, but 60 feels like I could throw it across the room at any point if I'm not kinda "clamped" on it, it's too easy to overshoot if I'm not being very wary of the force I'm putting in because that upper threshold is higher. Not to say I couldn't get used to it, but it immediately feels like it's not compatible comparatively to a heavy boi. On the other hand, If I were a woman/man with smaller/less beefy hands 120 could potentially feel extremely sluggish and they'd find an immense advantage to cutting that weight in half.
This is one of those things I wouldn't buy sight unseen and just hope it'll be alright. Ideally (not always possible) If you can get a feel for it in a shop you'll likely make a much better purchase for you personally.
I switched to the Viper Mini and fingertip grip and my aim has improved greatly, it’s 61 grams so in that 60-80 gram range. The optical switches are probably my favorite part of the mouse.
Thank you so much, big fan of how you make your videos
Simple answer, is when you play a game that requires an intense level of focus and engagement, and not once do you realise you have a mouse in your hand, it is probably a good mouse. But the moment it 'slips' on the mat, or the scroll wheel doesn't register being rotated, or you press a button and it is too stiff or slow to react (due to travel), then you remember you have a mouse in your hand.
Reducing weight is great, because it reduces friction, but if the buttons are shit, if the sensor is shit or requires a specific mouse mat, then you will notice it letting you down. Having your brain and your hand in perfect harmony, with no distractions caused by the mouse, that is when you know the mouse is good. Measuring the width, height, weight etc, might matter for comfort, but ultimately your ability to forget you have it in your hand when you are engaged, is what determines a brilliant mouse.
I dont think G502 is that bad as people say it is
Yes it is heavy
Yes it does not have good cable or good skates
But its really comfortable also infinite scroll wheel is really good
and with mouse bungee it is not bad at all
PS: using G502 for FPS
CSGO: 400 DPI , 1.69 Sensitivity
Switched to the g502 lightspeed about a year ago coming from Razer. Valorant forced me to drop from my 1200 DPI to 450. Starting to see the ways lmao. Looking for a lighter mouse now but hate that my current options mean I lose at least 4 buttons on my mouse 😫
i have very big hands, XXL glove size, so even the 502 feels small and cramped to me. i absolutely cannot use anything smaller than it as it cramps up my hands and hurts in a matter of minutes. i'm stuck with the chunky ones but i actually like the weight. had some lighter mice before and i typically do worse with them
ThroughFallenEyes same for me. Only XL gloves, but that definitely limits options for mice.
I actually improved with my switch to the Cooler Master MM710. I used the Zowie S1 Divina before but I didn't like the glossy finish. So I picked up another mouse.
However build quality on the Zowie is much better.
the GLossy Divina isn't worthy? im thiking to buy one but im gonna try the Rubber one
I'm in it for the shape and size. The weight is something I don't care all that much about as long as its under 90g.
same
erganomics and sensor quality are my priority
So you do care.
@@artyte_b Yeah, imma rephrase that.
@@artyte_b no as long as its under 100 grams im fine with it.
"shape is more important than weight" true to a certain extent. I've been using the basilisk ult at 107g for 3 years, kinda cancer. 20 hrs on aimlabs master 1. switched to the superlight at 63g went on aimlabs, took a bit to get used to the weight and grip but jumped to gm 4 instantly
2030: 0 gram mouse
2031 -300gram mouse
2032 5kg mouse
2033 Rat
John Titor such a cutie john titor
That's a hand motion detector, not a mouse XD
Your aim improves from practice not getting a lighter mouse. I started off with the 87g razer diamondback and then switched to the 120g g502 and my aim is as good as ever. I'm also using a pretty low sensitivity.
I have the g502 hero and I love it. I’ve never tried a 40 gram mice or anything but I love the way the mouse feels and the two buttons directly to the left of left click, I cannot live without anymore. Might get the light speed one day but we will see
Sorry but that weight range is what some have been asking for a decade.
From light you can then go heavier with mods, going the other way is actually more difficult since it require special tools and mouse structure knowledge.
Variety of choices is what makes this era of mice product great.
Truth is EVERY ASPECT MATTERS
and CHOICE VARIETY IS INCREASING and that's a WIN-WIN for everybody.
Brick 502? The g502 is a god! A sight to behold.
It's not about the weight it is about the....... FRIGGIN RGB!!!
For me a mouse has to be 65-107 that makes me feel comfortable a 45 gram mouse feels like it would fly off the table when u turn on the AC
I've been using a G305 and G900 back and forth. While the weight of my G305 is really nice I feel like the G900 fits my hand perfectly. I feel like I perform better because of the shape of the G900
Actually battery isn't so heavy , so u can use any shell u want (like model o-'s one) and make ur own lightweight wireless mice
Just bought the G305 a month ago. With a lithium AAA battery, it's just about the perfect mouse for me.
I went from the Mamba Wireless to the UL2 since it released. A pretty drastic change in how I play came soon after the UL2 arrived. I have very large hands so the shape is not perfect for me but I also only fingertip grip the mouse since it makes small adjustments easier in my experience. (I will mention that I do play on 200 DPI) Although I have not had the luxury to try such a wide variety of mice, I don't think anything will beat the UL2 for me until I have the chance to try other FinalMouse offerings or some of Glorious'/G-Wolves products.
Mouse sensor at the tip of a pen will be the easiest and most accurate mouse ever, clicks can be thought and placed at ergonomic positions
pr03 Pen mouse Weight16.7g + AAAA/AAA-battery 6.5g/8.4g
Reg model o is the best mouse it’s cheaper than most mouses and it just feels amazing
The Model O is definitely not the best mouse tf ? Where did you get that idea from
The best mouse is the one that's wireless and has the lowest weight without putting holes in it, which by my accounts is still the logitech GPW which is why i use one. Shape is also important, perhaps the #1 thing for some, then the rest.
I had a model O, I liked the shaped but ultra-light weight isn't really important and made absolutely no difference to me... I still hit my shots just like I would otherwise and it didn't boost anything in Kovaaks aim trainer. I also absolutely HATE the honeycomb design and after a few months dead skin cells get inbetween them and you have to scrape it off with a toothpick... yuck.
I'm going back to Logitech mice. Currently using a mix between g703 wireless and G-pro hero. Gonna buy a G-pro wireless tomorrow.
Sad how much weight is over hyped at the moment. Depends on shape, surface, feet, quality, clicks...ect. Most people have terrible mouse mats and using wrong shape or grip. Its about controlling the mouse well. Think of it like a mechanical key switch. Most springs are 45-65g. Too light you lose the control and too heavy you lose the feel. Thank you for this video, RJN should be saying things like this and hes the OG mouse guy.
From My own experience, the glorious model O minus, has pretty much the perfect balance, for me. Finalmouse capetown is actually to light in my opinion.
I’m using a Skoll Mini after my O- broke. Honestly it’s the best mouse I’ve ever used.
I'm not a competitive FPS guy (blind in one eye, so it's kind of pointless for me) but I have tried some light gaming mice. My problem is something you touched on: I have large hands. Virtually without exception these mice all disappear under my hand. I've been using a Logitech G6 (got it mainly for playing mmo's). It's large enough that it's more comfortable in my hand. It weighs a ton as mice go, however, heh.
I use the Glorious Model O, not the minus one though. The larger one fits my hand better and I just feel like the smaller one would've been too light. I was coming from a Logitech G502, and the difference was astounding.
it's been 2 years but was the hero at 121g? And you got the O wired at 69g? How is it keeping up?
I'm an asian American 24 year old male and am an above-average fps player. I have been using the G502 Proteus. Bought a light 55gr coolermaster mouse and it is night and day difference. Lighter to this extent is better.
I use a coolermaster mm710 mouse at 600 dpi and I find it to be very accurate. The only thing I didn't like about the mouse is you can only adjust the dpi in increments of 100 instead of 50 in the software.
there is actually an ultra light wireless mouse on Kickstarter right now iirc, i think it's called the ultimate custom, can't remember the company
Pwnage ultimate custom or something
EC2-B Is a heavy mouse but the shape is there. For me a heavy mouse helps steady my aim when doing fast movements rather rid I used a light weight mouse which I could overshot with because of the weight
Love ur mice reviews
yo Ali, i assume u use custom video config for apex, seeing from how clear the subjects are. mind sharing those configs?
I think he's just not using TSAA, should look much sharper for you without that.
Tiny mice are surprising good. I used a $20 Lenovo basic cordless mouse size about 2/3 or maybe less of a normal mouse and I loved it. Light! Fast. Ok didn’t last forever but for $20 is was excellent.
u forget to mention G-wolves skoll, it's the same size as the zowie ec1 (also shaped like it) and its lighter.
Yeah, cable whip can be noticable if your bungie is so far from your mousepad and you have so much slack to whip around ...
I love gaming with the g502. Still using the first edition of it that came out.
Now that you have found the lightest mouse, open it and remove the scroll and side buttons and make it even lighter lmao
I think low sens gamers have more room to play with, they can go with lighter mice like around 45/50/60 and instead of affecting their aim, it feels more comfortable as they are constantly moving their whole arm but for high sens gamers like myself, which is a minority group, the sweet spot like you said is around 80g, depending on how high your sens is, maybe even around 60g would be good too, but anything below 60 i find starts to affect my aim negatively, like i am just handicapping myself for no reason, it's not like 80g is too heavy, nor is 100g, i feel like there is no gaming mice out there that is too heavy, and no one is going to buy a heavy logitech office mice that weighs like 140g for gaming, it feels like gaming mice can't actually be too heavy because no one makes heavy gaming mice, they are all within the 100g now, and nowadays, 2 years later, it's more like within 80g, i think it's because most gamers are actually on low sens, especially fps gamers, most fps gamers play on low sens, on mnk and on controller, so it makes sense they are going lighter and lighter, but i feel like when they hit the 30 gram range, that will be when even low sens user's aim will start to suffer. In conclusion, high sens users should go for 60g+ mice if they don't want to hurt their aim, and going for 60g - mice doesn't make it so that you don't strain your wrist or it's more comfortable because there are no heavy gaming mice in the market, they are all within 100g range so they are all light enough that it's basically impossible to hurt your arm/wrist if you play on high sens, so in going for a mice 60g - , your just making it harder for yourself trying to fit in with the superlight mouse club which is full of low sens users which is why no one complains about superlight mouse being bad for your aim.
Hati vs Model O I’m leaning towards Hati
i like as many buttons on the side as possible even if I don't use all 12 its nice to have media controls or push to talk on the mouse
Hi Ali! I really like your videos. I'm thinking of starting a youtube channel, can you share a tutorial on how you make a video? Since your videos are very high quality (visually), you got good music too! Please share a tutorial.
Brian D'Souza I’ve been asking for the same thing! I think I just need to try harder maybe?😂
@@currentlykent4593 His videos are visually similar to MKBHD & DAVE2D. If you see their videos on any screen be it OLED/IPS or any lower quality panel. It looks good in all screens! I think the secret is in their editing/color grading. Colours look very bright & pleasing in all of their videos along with good music ofcourse!
Brian D'Souza lets not forget some pretty quality cameras and lenses. Ali is also super creative. Plays with shadows by moving his lighting around during shots, and using different colored paper instead of just a plain white desk.
Im in love with my mm710, the shape feels perfect.
Tangerine agreed I love it
what type of hand grip do you use? i'm planning to buy cooler master mm710. I'm using a g102 for 2 years and im planning to buy a new one. Now my style of grip iiiiis fingertip? or idk, it doesn't touch my palm, only my fingertips. would you recommend mm710? thanks!
@@TimothyTabanao I heard that mm710 might not be as good for fingertip, you might want to maybe consider the razer viper mini
@@TangerineTypes noted! thanks for the insight!
I used to play competitive FPS, mostly Overwatch (got to Top 500) with the G502. I found I was decent at flick shots to my right, but never to my left. What's your experience? I stopped playing cause I would get too absorbed and have to spend a lot of time maintaining my mechanical skill, but recently started playing single player shooters and man, I miss that FPS rush.
I have Logitech g402 and it’s not crazy heavy and I like the programmable buttons
I learnt to arm aim without having your elbow on the desk! Much better for games where you need to look up and down alot
Today: this mouse is 45 grams
2021: this mouse defies gravity
lol corona
i e s
Im more concearned on the use of optical switches for reduce the input lag even more, hope Logitech and other brands release some mice options wired or wireless because the control quality of Razer Products are questionable.
Picking up this mouse is like picking up the milk when u think its full and its almost empty
I really love my Cooler Master MM710. Really affordable and comfortable especially for FPS gaming. If you need a new mouse or a lighter mouse without breaking the bank, you will not regret buying it!
For those worried about the build quality issues, that was just with the first batch, but with the new batches everything is much sturdier :)