@@redhotsonic But I read that the June (or is it the July one, the one that didn't work. ) Sonic Chaos Proto writes to a game gear exclusive memory address, which on a Master System, will Cut out much of the Ram.
MY THEORY IS by the time this Sonic Chaos was being programmed Aspect was using Mega Drive hardware to test the game, so they didn't bother testing it on original hardware so early. You should try it in a master-gear converter!
This is my thought too. 1993 was really late for the MS and it's likely that dev teams opted to use the much more powerful MD development kits during initial production and demo stages.
As someone else has mentioned, the game is actually looking for a port that doesn't exist on the consumer Master Systems that was used for music development. Thus, the game hangs. I'd imagine that if it works on the Mega Drive, it may work on the FM Master System.
They probably used the MD dev kits to develop chaos and then when they found out it didn't work on the SMS and GG that's when they started to rework/optimize the game for those consoles. As people have said before, it is likely they used a more powerful and up to date dev kits of the MD since it surprisingly had backwards compatibility with SMS games with the OG hardware still there. But, since it is a more updated version of SMS's hardware, when testing on the original outdated SMS, the game crashes.
"The game will hang on a black screen after the title screen on some Master System models due to writing to a Game Gear-exclusive I/O port, which happens to map to a port that handles memory mapping on these models, effectively disabling most memory regions." "If this crash is bypassed, it is found once again when trying to select Tails in the character select menu, and at the end of the title card screen."
A bunch of Sonic prototype tests in one, nice. I was surprised to see Sonic Chaos working using the Everdrive MD on the Mega Drive instead of on the Game Gear or Master System. Was really helpful to see various methods. 10:34 bouncing in style!
Awesome review redhotsonic! Loved every minute of it. Aside from the world wide Game Gear version in 60Hz, it's funny you call the PAL Master System the (rubbish one) because Sonic Chaos if purchased for the SMS was intended to be played in 50Hz back in 1993 and it was only released in PAL regions. Would love for you to do a quick review of these hacks on real hardware: 1. Sonic Redemption 2. Sonic 1 The Blue Blurr 3. Sonic 1 & 2 Three of my all time favourite (broken Sonic hacks).
Prediction: you will call the sonic 3 prototype partially because it crashes when tails grabs anything Although it’s not the genesis’s fault it’s actually because some sprites don’t exist for tails so it crashes
Kinda wish the sonic 3 & knuckles pc version was ported to consoles with their menu intact, just adjusted for the system. Those who aren't aware, loading the pc version (which many know has midi versions of the prototype songs in an official release) will bring up a window to select the game you want. Sonic 3, sonic & knuckles and sonic 3 & knuckles. Meaning you got pretty much 3 versions of the original game in one pack; but it gets better! It also comes with a wallpaper and a cool animated screensaver (it was cool for the time okay!) so imagine say, releasing this on the 3ds or switch with the choice of 3 games + a new theme for sonic 3!
Does the June Sonic Chaos build work if you put it on a Master System Everdrive and put that in a Power Base Converter? That seems like a useful data point for tracking down the problem.
1:52 I found it quite interesting since I played this on Genesis Plus GX and when I went to the past the first time, it actually functioned correctly and took me to the past, rather than staying in the present.
Hey how do i get Sonic cd v.0.02 on Kega fusion 3.64 running? It did the same thing that happened (aka crashed on the "Copyright" screen or the big 3d sega screen). Please help me!
something i'm a bit curious about is what happens if you try playing the master system prototypes on a game gear, since if i'm not mistaken, the game gear can play master system games natively. i wonder if it'd be any different from playing on a master system or mega drive
For some odd reason, when i tried playing Sonic CD version 0.02 on my mega-cd, i got no audio except for the SFX of sonic jumping, spindashing etc. Is there a reason for this Redhotsonic?
I can't say for sure but sounds like when you burned the ISO, it was not including the tracks. So the game is probably trying to play the music, but it's non-existant.
Do you know that all of the Genesis and Master System very first prototype versions up until the later builds, The European versions (50hz) have the same music speed as Sonic 1? Please do a comparison to these when you test them!!! Sorry this was long, I'm excited for you to do it!
It's interesting when they decided to fix the games vs when they didn't. Also why they only chose to fix the music, and not the game speed as a whole. In a more general sense it's interesting seeing which companies bothered to fix the speed differences and which didn't, because this problem persisted into the Playstation and N64... For instance, Blast Corps on n64 runs slower on a PAL machine. They DID adjust the target times for the missions to take this into account, but they didn't fix the game speed. (Another interesting question you can ask with games is which is the 'correct' speed? Faster isn't always the intended behaviour. And for instance, Blast Corps is developed by Rare, which is a british company, thus you would assume the PAL version is the original, and the NTSC is a conversion... And thus faster than intended.) Meanwhile, on the SNES you never had the audio problems that the Mega Drive/Genesis had, but you still had games running slower. At first glance that seems weird. But I think I know why that is. - the Mega Drive uses the z80 for audio, but also for Master System compatibility. For this reason the z80 in a PAL system has to run at PAL compatible clock speeds. The Audio CPU in a SNES is JUST for audio processing, and never for any other purpose. On top of that it's default clock speed is something like 2.4 mhz, so it doesn't match up with any other CPU in the system anyway. Presumably that means the PAL audio CPU simply runs at the exact same speed. (similarly, I think the SuperFX on a pal machine still runs at 10.74/21.477 mhz, even though these are NOT PAL frequencies...) Even more interesting than all the games which mess up the speed due to lazy conversion, are the games which do in fact fix things. Did you know that Mario Kart on SNES runs at the same speed on both PAL and NTSC machines? I was surprised, since that's unusual. (yes, the PAL system is running 50 fps, and the NTSC 60 fps - but the actual ingame movement speeds are identical - they took the altered framerate into account and adjusted the timings to match.) That's pretty surprising given how indifferent developers tended to be to the whole issue...
@@redhotsonic I didn’t know I could get a reply from someone who has not uploaded in 11 MONTHS! Please make a new But Does It Work On Real Hardware video
It might be one of those cases that Works in the Dev Consoles but not in the Real hardware since both consoles are different, the Devs one are usually slightly Faster and potent than the Retail one
Yeah it works I used to have one with a everdrive and sonic and tails worked what worked it seems is as soon as dirt got into the thing it worked? Don’t have it anymore never recorded it and yes it’s the same version
Technically, these games work cause it's the ORIGINAL EPROM with all hardware pass, but for someway, can't pass the blackscreen (maybe model/region/lock)?
![Sonic the Hedgehog 3 (PROTOTYPE) LOST BITS | Cut Content & Debug Mode [TetraBitGaming]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/TxaDg3UITow/mqdefault.jpg)
5:21 _And so, all out of options and running out of hope, I did the only thing I could and I booked a flight to Japan._
i got it
he went there for a f***ing sticker
damn you Nick
Pizza
I didn't expect a Nick Robinson reference in a redhotsonic comment section
3:36 That's interesting. Perhaps it could be a sign that the game was made for the Master System first and then ported to the Game Gear.
Yeah, I think that's exactly the case here :)
@@redhotsonicRed-Hot-Sonic, do you know Sonic the Hedgehog on Master System has some secret codes?
@@redhotsonic But I read that the June (or is it the July one, the one that didn't work. ) Sonic Chaos Proto writes to a game gear exclusive memory address, which on a Master System, will Cut out much of the Ram.
@@redhotsonic hedgehog
Wait! What happens if you lock on the Sonic 3 Proto to S&K? Is that even possible?
Unfinished s3&k?
@@_danu Maybe. More likely just blue spheres.
@Katherine sonjon ...what? I mean, I get what you're saying, but we're in a timeline where there is no Sonic 1 prototype.
@Katherine sonjon Hm.
Revolution Team not really, he’s able to get the game working on the everdrive, so any s&k cart wont affect any game.
MY THEORY IS
by the time this Sonic Chaos was being programmed Aspect was using Mega Drive hardware to test the game, so they didn't bother testing it on original hardware so early. You should try it in a master-gear converter!
This is my thought too. 1993 was really late for the MS and it's likely that dev teams opted to use the much more powerful MD development kits during initial production and demo stages.
As someone else has mentioned, the game is actually looking for a port that doesn't exist on the consumer Master Systems that was used for music development. Thus, the game hangs. I'd imagine that if it works on the Mega Drive, it may work on the FM Master System.
or a power base converter
@@VancouverFan or a master system converter II
Yeah or they where using a development SMS console (if those existed)
6:54 This music makes it sound like he needs to do this to live and is under so much pressure
Wow.
I'm a simple man. I see RHS, I click.
Me too! 😁
@@cm-ih1jb What is this, a crossover episode?
@Pero Perić thanks
Same.
@Fluffy TKC going pretty well. How's yourself?
redhotsonic: “You can undislike the video now”
97 people: n o
124*
edit: i just only said "124*" and theres a war here
Эльмира Гарифуллина you know this was made 2 months ago right?
128*
Jakyrin Rutherford *138*
*140
"it's a prototype of the original game,of course it will work on real hardware"
Sonic chaos (sms) (june 30): Are you sure about that?
They probably used the MD dev kits to develop chaos and then when they found out it didn't work on the SMS and GG that's when they started to rework/optimize the game for those consoles.
As people have said before, it is likely they used a more powerful and up to date dev kits of the MD since it surprisingly had backwards compatibility with SMS games with the OG hardware still there. But, since it is a more updated version of SMS's hardware, when testing on the original outdated SMS, the game crashes.
8:50 Dying on Emerald Hill... SMH :P
Title:
Sonic 3 Prototype
Reality:
Guy tries to get Sonic Chaos Prototype to work on Master System
At least he didn't clickbait it
I think I actually prefer the beta Hydrocity background to the release version. Would have been nice to see it in act 2 of Mania
really? it looks kinda messed up
Even in encore mode It would have been acceptable
"The game will hang on a black screen after the title screen on some Master System models due to writing to a Game Gear-exclusive I/O port, which happens to map to a port that handles memory mapping on these models, effectively disabling most memory regions."
"If this crash is bypassed, it is found once again when trying to select Tails in the character select menu, and at the end of the title card screen."
A bunch of Sonic prototype tests in one, nice.
I was surprised to see Sonic Chaos working using the Everdrive MD on the Mega Drive instead of on the Game Gear or Master System. Was really helpful to see various methods.
10:34 bouncing in style!
5:35 advertisement break.
Awesome review redhotsonic!
Loved every minute of it.
Aside from the world wide Game Gear version in 60Hz, it's funny you call the PAL Master System the (rubbish one) because Sonic Chaos if purchased for the SMS was intended to be played in 50Hz back in 1993 and it was only released in PAL regions.
Would love for you to do a quick review of these hacks on real hardware:
1. Sonic Redemption
2. Sonic 1 The Blue Blurr
3. Sonic 1 & 2
Three of my all time favourite (broken Sonic hacks).
Prediction: you will call the sonic 3 prototype partially because it crashes when tails grabs anything
Although it’s not the genesis’s fault it’s actually because some sprites don’t exist for tails so it crashes
For a single crash like that, it still would have passed.
plus it's not a fault of the real hardware@@redhotsonic
Kinda wish the sonic 3 & knuckles pc version was ported to consoles with their menu intact, just adjusted for the system.
Those who aren't aware, loading the pc version (which many know has midi versions of the prototype songs in an official release) will bring up a window to select the game you want.
Sonic 3, sonic & knuckles and sonic 3 & knuckles. Meaning you got pretty much 3 versions of the original game in one pack; but it gets better! It also comes with a wallpaper and a cool animated screensaver (it was cool for the time okay!) so imagine say, releasing this on the 3ds or switch with the choice of 3 games + a new theme for sonic 3!
oh hell nah i prefer michael jackson's songs
@@scoundrel8440 That version is already on the DS and steam btw.
Does the June Sonic Chaos build work if you put it on a Master System Everdrive and put that in a Power Base Converter? That seems like a useful data point for tracking down the problem.
10:36 Eecks, that looks headache-inducing.
Wow nice vid Red.
the sonic three prototype was made 15 years before I was born
Then your 11
Ronan Stout made made 13.5 years before I was born.
-SONIC CHAOS-
OR
-SONIC AND TAILS-
*_Different Game Names in a Nutshell_*
imagine if the games name was actully SONIC CHAOS
OR
SONIC AND TAILS
@@Pokycraftgamer9 xD
sliaT dna cinoS
ro
soahC cinoS
1:52 I found it quite interesting since I played this on Genesis Plus GX and when I went to the past the first time, it actually functioned correctly and took me to the past, rather than staying in the present.
Hi jason
How was the sound on the Sonic 3 prototype on actual hardware? I know there were lots of sound issues in emulation.
Yeah, it was buggy on hardware as well. Seemed extremely similar to KEGA.
@@redhotsonic I assumed this was likely the case. Thanks for the info!
10:35 Top 5 villains in Sonic:
5. Metal Sonic
4. Shadow
3. Chaos
2. Dr. Eggman
1. *The springs in Carnival Night*
Maybe the prototype for Sonic Chaos was MADE for the Megadrive
According to some guy, Aspect used MD Dev Kits at this point instead of MS Dev Kits
2:22 3:48 8:26 9:27 10:32 YES.
For some Reason in Hydrocity Zone when the drowning Jingle starts when you go in Debug/Air it plays an early Version of Mushroom Valley Zone Act 1
During that video I also heard a bone crack. Ouch! XD
imagine if someone clicked off the video before he even said he was kidding about the fake ending...
10:34 "Okay, who puts springs in the middle of a damn ̶f̶o̶r̶e̶s̶t̶ circus."
I knew that the S3 proto worked on hardware beforehand because I checked myself :P
OH BOY I HAD LOTS OF FUN PLAYING THIS PROTOTYPE!
How come sonic 2 time attack dont work for me? I start and it stops.
I love the dancing mega cd logo 0:10
7:50 oh commo- (BLEEP)
Either he said:"Oh commo- (beeeep)" or :"Oh god- (beeeep)"
6:54 The BGM almost has that feel of an enemy in pursuit in Bosconian.
0:31 so there’s the average UA-camr, then there’s possibly you hacking into it.
Sonic 3 complete works on real hardware?
Luis Mediavilla that actually does exist with a cartridge you don’t a emulator for it
@@jamesrgamesoffical :V
Hey how do i get Sonic cd v.0.02 on Kega fusion 3.64 running? It did the same thing that happened (aka crashed on the "Copyright" screen or the big 3d sega screen). Please help me!
I like how June 30th Prototype (Sonic Chaos) is on my birthday and it doesn't work due to there not being a port.
What's the beeta or baeta about? ( silly question! but please answer. )
how do you pronounce "beta"
He Asked for Disliking So I am
Im liking.
Your script writing gets better with each video. Very good!
Actually, this wasn't scripted. I didn't have time so I winged it. I guessed it worked out!
I’m pretty sure that the SEGA Mark III with a everdrive for the mark III would work!
Hi! Redhot Sonic!
I Liked The Vid I Like Your Content Alot! My Fav Video is this one
people: its zero!
redhotsonic: *N O T*
*naught
@@redhotsonic just imagine making an equation and putting "something - N A U G H T ="
something i'm a bit curious about is what happens if you try playing the master system prototypes on a game gear, since if i'm not mistaken, the game gear can play master system games natively. i wonder if it'd be any different from playing on a master system or mega drive
Ah yes, my favorite portable console, the mega drive
Sega nomad will embarrass you
Still waiting for the Sonic chaos remake.
First video i've watched of yours, awesome!
For some odd reason, when i tried playing Sonic CD version 0.02 on my mega-cd, i got no audio except for the SFX of sonic jumping, spindashing etc.
Is there a reason for this Redhotsonic?
I can't say for sure but sounds like when you burned the ISO, it was not including the tracks. So the game is probably trying to play the music, but it's non-existant.
@@redhotsonic ah ok, also the ISO file was from Sonic Retro 😂
@@redhotsonicalso did you know that the Member called "Lee Clark" was me back in 2019?
Beautiful, my boy is back
Friend:DUDEEEEE! I FOUND THE SONIC 1 PROTOTYPE!!!! DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS?
Other friend:cool! But...
*does it work on real hardware?*
can the sonic 3 proto be used with the sonic & knuckles cart in any way?
I believe it loads Sonic & Knuckles
@@nuggetpotato5471 I meant if you hacked it, or used the edmdv3 route
@@SkeleGamer101 it's not like it will load S3&K
@@nuggetpotato5471 still worth it to try
Too bad undisliking or disliking the video doesn’t matter anymore…
Do you know that all of the Genesis and Master System very first prototype versions up until the later builds, The European versions (50hz) have the same music speed as Sonic 1? Please do a comparison to these when you test them!!! Sorry this was long, I'm excited for you to do it!
It's interesting when they decided to fix the games vs when they didn't.
Also why they only chose to fix the music, and not the game speed as a whole.
In a more general sense it's interesting seeing which companies bothered to fix the speed differences and which didn't, because this problem persisted into the Playstation and N64...
For instance, Blast Corps on n64 runs slower on a PAL machine.
They DID adjust the target times for the missions to take this into account, but they didn't fix the game speed.
(Another interesting question you can ask with games is which is the 'correct' speed? Faster isn't always the intended behaviour. And for instance, Blast Corps is developed by Rare, which is a british company, thus you would assume the PAL version is the original, and the NTSC is a conversion... And thus faster than intended.)
Meanwhile, on the SNES you never had the audio problems that the Mega Drive/Genesis had, but you still had games running slower.
At first glance that seems weird.
But I think I know why that is. - the Mega Drive uses the z80 for audio, but also for Master System compatibility.
For this reason the z80 in a PAL system has to run at PAL compatible clock speeds.
The Audio CPU in a SNES is JUST for audio processing, and never for any other purpose.
On top of that it's default clock speed is something like 2.4 mhz, so it doesn't match up with any other CPU in the system anyway.
Presumably that means the PAL audio CPU simply runs at the exact same speed. (similarly, I think the SuperFX on a pal machine still runs at 10.74/21.477 mhz, even though these are NOT PAL frequencies...)
Even more interesting than all the games which mess up the speed due to lazy conversion, are the games which do in fact fix things.
Did you know that Mario Kart on SNES runs at the same speed on both PAL and NTSC machines? I was surprised, since that's unusual. (yes, the PAL system is running 50 fps, and the NTSC 60 fps - but the actual ingame movement speeds are identical - they took the altered framerate into account and adjusted the timings to match.)
That's pretty surprising given how indifferent developers tended to be to the whole issue...
Should have tried the june master system sonic chaos on the game gear, the game gear basically being a handheld master system
Wow Sonic’s design closet matches his S3 design in that SonicChaosGG prototype
I love the handheld megadrive that plays Sonic chaos. :v
I like when the sign says beeta or baeta its beta
Awesome Video
*When glitchy stages exist in prototypes* MY BRAIN HURTS
Is that just me or in the Sonic 3 prototype there was a dropdash?
5:50 I didn’t know Japanese was a a frequency!
The Chaos Proto is for mega drive because that was already launched
I have the genesis emulator in my phone and I have sonic 3 prototype in my emulator
Sonic 3 Prototype + Sonic & Knuckles Prototype - does it work on Real Hardware or Sonic 3 Limited Edition Prototype - does it work on Real Hardware?
It is pronounced ZEE, not ZED!
Edit: im dumb and forgot accents existed
It's pronounced mum, not mom.
I'm British so it's Zed.
@@redhotsonic ok
@@redhotsonic I didn’t know I could get a reply from someone who has not uploaded in 11 MONTHS! Please make a new But Does It Work On Real Hardware video
@@GoldenMonkeGTVR will soon twitter.com/redhotsonic_RHS/status/1542132937554026498?t=W_XWxDO3BcIERaFIi4ei5Q&s=19
@@redhotsonic thanks
7:29 NO.
Yo
I hate ads I'm gonna remove ads 7:29
My favorite prototype is the Sonic 2 & Sonic 3 prototype ‘s
in the sonic 3 prototype you can drop dash. up and b.
I say, he must try to see if "An Ordinary Sonic ROM Hack" work on real hardware, could be fun.
Maybe on October 31st =P
Ok, hope you'll maybe get chased by Sonic.exe on real hardware =P
I dont remember sonic surfing in sonic 3
This is a prototype a version of the Game before the full game has been released to the public.
@@syedfahim2973 damn that would have been nice :)
It might be one of those cases that Works in the Dev Consoles but not in the Real hardware
since both consoles are different, the Devs one are usually slightly Faster and potent than the Retail one
Wait but it’s sonic cd at start
Ok.
He already did Sonic 1, That was the first one TCRF streamed, and it's canonically in between 1 and 2.
The Sonic Chaos prototype title screen looks *MILES* (pun not intended) better. They even look like their AOSTH counterparts!
It's kinda crazy that it's possible to sonic 3 prototype on a mobile device with an emulator
We tested NTSC-U, PAL, and NTSC-J, but it doesn't work on real hardware
*SECAM has left the game*
What do you mean you didn't show off Sonic 3 prototype and Knuckles?
Its just blue spheres
You can use a master system controller on a sega genesis/mega drive
On real hardware
But
What if you attach sonic & knuckles to the 2 and 3 protos?
2:05 why does the cd have a label next to the 700 saying: Sex?
gender…
It says 52X 💀
Fun Fact: Did You Know Sonic 2 Used To Have Time Travel?
We Can Know This Because Wood Zone Is A Past Version Of Metropolis.
No it was supposed to be present For Casino night
Maybe the Jun 30th prototype has an anti-piracy feature.
Yeah it works I used to have one with a everdrive and sonic and tails worked what worked it seems is as soon as dirt got into the thing it worked?
Don’t have it anymore never recorded it and yes it’s the same version
Sonic 3 proto songs like angel islands zone 1&2 are glitchy if you play through the levles
9:44 biten video başlarken hepsinim bir şaka olduğu ortaya çıkıyor.
You can also find cartridges of Sonic 2 prototypes on bootleg websites
you make the video 2 days befor my 9 years birthday :D
Technically, these games work cause it's the ORIGINAL EPROM with all hardware pass, but for someway, can't pass the blackscreen (maybe model/region/lock)?
B A E T A
O R
Incorrect? 😉
Hello Knuckles channel I'm I Fan Of You!
Can the Nov. Proto of Sonic 3 lock on with Sonic and Knuckles?
Next time you show off the sonic 3 Prototype you should see what would happen if you attached sonic and knuckles to the prototype
put the sonic 3 prototype in sonic and knuckles
Why the heck did u called a Game Gear a Mega Drive?
I almost left
What
I wanna see what happens if you connect the sonic 3 prototype to the final version of sonic and knuckles
Unfinished s3&k or maybe a broken glitchy(as fuck) tails
i`m pretty sher that the Sega logo is glitched because it borrowed from sonic 2