Do You Even Want This Kind of Marriage? - Episode 225
Вставка
- Опубліковано 4 жов 2024
- Episode 225: Would our reaction to Christian marriage advice change if we realize how many people who write that advice are actually in abusive or destructive marriages? What if people in those marriages are more drawn to write marriage advice to process how they're feeling?
Today we look at two different women that Focus on the Family have held up to be emulated. One is a woman who has written prolifically for them, and when you look at her articles and what she reveals about her relationship, a TON of red flags are present. The other is a woman whose husband was jailed for domestic violence, but then she prayed, he repented, and now they lead Love & Respect seminars together. And Focus on the Family thinks this is a positive message.
Today Sheila Gregoire is joined by her husband Keith and by abuse educator Sarah McDugal.
To Support Us:
Join our Patreon for as little as $5 a month to support our work
/ baremarriage
Or, for tax deductible donations in the U.S., support our Good Fruit Faith Initiative through the Bosko Foundation
secure.qgiv.co...
And check out our Merch at our store!
sheilawraygreg...
Things Mentioned in the Podcast:
The article in the Revealer about Elisabeth Elliot's marriage
therevealer.or...
My article detailing Focus on the Family's Facebook post praising the man who was jailed for domestic violence, as well as the letter I sent to Jim Daly
baremarriage.c...
My article on TradWife influencers and my concern for them
baremarriage.c...
Our Podcast on Power of a Praying Wife:
baremarriage.c...
Our one sheet download on Love & Respect
baremarriage.c...
Focus on the Family's article "It's the Little Things"
www.focusonthe...
Our Open Letter to Focus on the Family
baremarriage.c...
Find Sarah McDugal:
Follow Sarah on Facebook
/ sarahmcdugalauthor
Find her at Wilderness to Wild
www.wilderness...
Man, I am so thankful for your work, Sheila. I grew up in a church really close to Nancy Leigh DeMoss' ministry headquarters and your last episode on Lies Women Believe was really hard and sad for me. I somehow never read her book, but I've seen the evidence of bad fruit from those teachings in a lot of people I know and love. I am grateful that my parents focused more on God's love for us being the heart of the gospel, but I do think some of that disappointed God theology did make it's way in from sources like this.
I think you hit the nail on the head that a lot of these books were written by desperate folks trying to make meaning out of their hard and unhealthy marriages or unhappy lives. I'm actually really happy that I'm still single at 30, because it's given me some time to unlearn these bad teachings.
I love that you've hiked the PCT! I live near Mt. Hood, so recognized lots!
@@sherylj586 That's so kind! I loved that area near Mount Hood and I ate so much food at the Timberline Lodge haha. Hiking the PCT was the biggest, scariest dream I've ever pursued and I'm so thankful that I didn't let my fear keep me from doing it.
Some of us were taught to clean up after them. However I believe women have the right to ask their husbands to clean up after themselves and to help around the house more. I stopped listening to Focus several years ago. Thanks for reminding me to ask for what I want 😊❤
Better yet: don't ask husbands to "help" around the house because they shouldn't be "helping you"; they should be cleaning their home that they share equal ownership of
“They end up blogging to try to convince themselves that things are ok.” Whoa. That’s heavy. But you are so right!
And another point to note is that “it’s the little things” author is a pastor’s wife. It is worth exploring the extra pressures placed on these women to behave “properly.”
Yes! Absolutely. And they've been teaching on marriage together for years and this is the evidence of what their relationship is like.
Right off the bat, when you said (paraphrase), “every problem is treated as a lack of faith on your (the reader’s) part”, and I had to chuckle (ruefully). Earlier this morning on an unrelated topic, I saw someone commenting (again, paraphrase) that “Jesus commanded us to heal the sick and raise the dead-lack of healing is just a sign of lack of faith! Anything or anyone that suggests otherwise is not Biblical!”
… it took all my self control to refrain from asking them when the last time was that they raised the dead.
And on the tarantula incident … okay, so since he knew it was harmless, why did he initially choose such a painful death for it? Why not catch and release? Why encourage his wife’s misperception of the danger with his first actions, then laugh at her? Why not from the get-go teach her “it’s not by going to hurt you but it does have a vital job to do … outside. So this is how we get him back outside where he belongs?”
I can’t help but question the character of someone who chooses to torture something that they admit to knowing is harmless-even if it is just a “bug”.
@@rivendells_shonaand it certainly wasn’t harmless once it was panicking and on FIRE! Forget bites, it would’ve burned anything it ran into! This poor woman was scared out of her mind and it leaps out of the fire like a demon, no wonder she lost it on her jerk husband!
@@paigelego4027oh, I absolutely agree. Almost brought it up but wanted to grant him at least one benefit of the doubt that he didn’t consider that it wouldn’t immediately die in the fire.
Man, I REALLY wish you had!
Really sad about Elizabeth Elliott. I've been a great fan of hers. Being in a covert abusive marriage I totally get it. You want to err on the side of being gracious, kind, tolerant,understanding, patient, self-sacrificing, etc. For me, seeing that my enabling his sinful was harming him, my kids, and the church is what finally gave me the clarity to act.
That makes me so sad about Elizabeth, though 😢
This woman, like my own mom, and like myself years ago, are gaslighting themselves into thinking all this is normal and that they are in the wrong.
If you assume "good motives" on top of bad/disrespect behavior.....yeah, nothing will change and your spouse will continue to be another child instead of a spouse and YOU will continue to be the one in the wrong, along with stuffing all your feelings instead of having a safe place to talk about them~ with a fellow adult! (Your spouse) 😢
Great podcast guys!! ❤
There's a psychologgist who specializes in narcissistic abuse and she is passionate the phrase "give them the benefit of a doubt" is one of the most enabling phrases you can use.
My mom is abusive and my dad--though (thankfully) divorced and engaged to an awesome woman-- still advocates I give my mom "the benfit of a doubt" because he can't tell the difference between an abusive woman as opposed to a garden-variety sinner
I remember reading Passion and Purity in the 90s and thinking her first husband was not really good to her.
I genuinely respected his martyrdom, but definitely thought at the time that if he had not died young, their marriage would have gone badly.
I failed to be inspired by their relationship because something was not right with the way he treated her.
Thank you so much for your work and calling out toxic theology. The sad thing is when we are having marital problems our parents generation is still toting the same messages they group up with in the 80’s and 90’s. You are empowering our generation to speak up and stand up against mistreatment and in some cases abuse. The books challenging the men are few and far between but I know that there are men out there recommending the non toxic book. My husband went to a retreat on how to be a better man and husband and when he told the leader about my challenges being raised in the purity culture the male leader told him he should read YOUR book the Great Sex Rescue. I was floored. You are doing the work and the word is getting round. Imagine a group of men who are referring YOUR books to struggling marriages. It is happening. Keep fighting the good fight. 🎉🎉🎉🎉
That's AMAZING! Thank you for sharing!
Thank you for all you do, Sheila. Don’t let the naysayers get you down. ❤
THIS
Amen
I'm no fan of spiders, but why would that husband try to burn alive a harmless tarantula? That shows his character right there.
It's basically "Tell me your husband is a psychopath without calling him a psychopath."
Right? He KNEW it was harmless, he could have gently carried it outside. Maybe even used it as an opportunity to show his wife to not be afraid of them, but nah - he just throws it in the fire!
Also to not realize that a burning spider running loose is 1000% nightmare fuel. A tarantula is harmless but one on fire running around is how a house catches on fire & people get burned. & there were babies in that house. It never ceases to boggle my mind when people tell stories like this that are huge red flags but to them it's just another Tuesday.
God bless you both in your work❤ I loved Sarah's piece on women's innate need to shop for luxe goods every 72 hours! What a blessing to have humor in such oppressive circumstances! And Sheila is doing more for relationships between men and women than anyone in the past 50 years!
That is so heartbreaking about Elisabeth Elliot! She was such an intelligent woman and I read two of her books.
Luke 10 vs 38-42. Martha was convinced that her value was in serving men. So much so that she was angry that Mary was not doing the same. (Much like the women teaching in the church) Martha complained to Jesus basically saying command her to be like me, do like me. Jesus response (basically) you do you..but Mary has chosen the good thing....
I think what makes a lot of these kinds of teachings you describe so dangerous is that in each case I could pick a bible verse that, read entirely in isolation and ignoring the entirety of the rest of scripture, could be used to justify them, and that have pushed an anti-intellectual and simplistic view of biblical authority that says that if you can quote a single verse like that they you are above contradiction and do not need to think. Was it you a few weeks ago who said all these things were related? If not it was someone equally wise!
Amen
I am so very grateful to have found your channel, Sheila. The work you are engaged in is invaluable, as well as the team work you and Keith exemplify. I am looking forward to viewing/listening to all of the treasure you have stored here on your channel.🕊
Very insightful. Thank you, both.
You girls are on fire! 🔥
Sheila, how do you process or interpret Luke 16 v 18 and mark 10 v 11 that many churches say mean absolutely no divorce under any circumstance? I know people who have been told this even though the pastor knows the husband doeesn't want or love the wife.
Abusers like to isolate. Stay vigilant
This 💯 😥
This is disgusting. If it were about any religion other than Christianity, this would be hate speech.
I'm not sure what you mean? What is hate speech? What exactly did you disagree with?
Cool video