How Fast can You Rank up in Smash Bros as Sheik?
Вставка
- Опубліковано 30 вер 2023
- People complain sheik is one of the most brain dead easy characters in smash bros melee. So how fast can i rank up with no sheik experience?
• Patreon - / ludvix
• Twitter - / ludvixyt
• Instagram - / ludvixyt - Ігри
what game should i do next? (it has to have some form of a ranked mode / or a certain character)
Does Rivals of Aether have a ranked? Idk
Bugsnax
im not going to say that you should play Quake
but Quake is a video game
and Quake Champions is free
and bhopping and circle jumping is cool
How about Rocket League?
@@honk1419 Let's Revive Quake Champions, as a _meme_
I personally think you should incorporate short/full hop needles into your edge guarding toolkit for spacies. I helps cover those pesky side b recoveries and helps cover low up Bs when you are out spaced and are running from the other side of the stage. Takes practice to dodge the platforms and not lose your needles to nothing. Also I would say 80% of the cast can be chain grabbed by sheik at various percents, so you could be taking more percent in your down throw strings. Going hand in hand with the chain grabs would be learning your tech chase followups. Otherwise just have fun with the learning process, she is not as braindead as people want you to think.
If you want to keep practicing Sheik at all feel free to hit me up with questions! I'd be down to offer some insight on the character
Not even a single Puff in 200 games, wow.
I’m blessed
I think this might be a statement about both how unpopular Jigglypuff is and how hard she is at mid level (not a jiggs player btw)
@@simanolastname2399 a lot of Puff haters say she's easy, but I wouldn't really know about how things change from low skill to mid level.
A whole Sheik video without a single mention of "chaingrab" or "tech chase"
I read Sheik as Shrek and thought we were gonna get a fusion with Super Slam
Lmao same
newchallengers mod hours
pretty often people's least favorite stage is their best win rate in Bo3 since it'll mostly come up as an opponent counterpick--basically only against subset of opponents you already beat
Love this type of video. Very entertaining and meditative to watch you figure this out
Love these types of videos! I’m curious as to how much you analyzed other Sheik players’ sets during this, if any. I know you mentioned how you did research for certain matchups, and I wonder if watching what other players did was part of that.
it twas
I just smoked the entire video. It was very entertaining to see the grinding, especially if it is a character that you are not normally used to play. It helps you a lot with the neutral game and some of that is transferred to your main. And as always, good video Lud =D
As a dual spacie main that plays sheik for fun (crazy I know), two of the biggest things I learned was that holding down and just being good at tech chasing is broken. Additionally, I think the best way to improve punish on species is to recognize when a tech chase situation is possible and capitalizing on that (i.e will my f-tilt confirm into another f-tilt or are they really close to the ground). Obviously I can just say "get good" at tech chasing, but that's just some homework a person has to figure out. In terms of tech chasing from my perspective, I always like to wavedash forward after down throw if they move forward or wavedash back/in-place if they move behind. I hope all these tips help!
I really like these videos where you pick up some random thing and try to become good with it. Super inspiring and good at showing how the best way to reach the top quick is to start.
Ok I started off taking notes on each set for fun but I didn't realize how long the video was LOL so here's a quick summary of my thoughts and then some individual notes for the first 20 sets or so:
This was great! You quickly picked up on a lot of the necessary Sheik fundamentals. I'd say the biggest things you're missing (besides obvious character control stuff like punish game, microspacing, fast fall timings, etc.) are:
1) aerial needles!! they are great against crouch/ASDI down and lead into all sheik's great moves (grab, ftilt, downsmash). They also contest air space against floaties and help during edgeguards to cover low angles.
2) crouch cancel / ASDI down: these are so strong for sheik because she is fast and gets huge openings off her normals (ftilt, dtilt, grab, downsmash) so crouching an opponents hit and counterhitting them is massive for sheik. A more advanced technique is hold down -> dash out of crouch -> grab, but dashing out of crouch is a tricky technique if you're not used to it.
3) nair out of shield and wavedash out of shield: I saw you use a lot of shield grabs, rolls, and jumps out of shield, which are quite limited in utility compared to nair oos or wavedash oos (usually followed by something like ftilt, grab, or just a continuation of neutral). Nair oos is hard but worth it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Individual Set Notes:
Set 1 (Fox): once you get fox off stage, grab the ledge (either turnaround wavedash back, or short hop needle turnaround) and then backair that fool
Set 2 (Luigi): recovering as sheik is hard! usually trying to DI well enough that you have a mixup between (a) deep upb far into the stage or onto side plat, (b) straight up upb above the ledge, (c) slight angle upb above the ledge, (d) fadeback upb to sweetspot ledge, (e) airdodge onstage, or (f) airdodge drift back to snap to ledge. There's also other little tricks like walljump airdodge when you have a wall to jump off of, but it takes a while to figure out which of these options are useful to find holes in your opponent's ledge punish flowchart
Set 3 (Fox): great job noticing that ftilt is good for covering spacie side b! This is a good option if you don't think you'll be fast enough to get to ledge before they side b. With regards to reading missed tech, be careful, because that's a habit that'll get you punished at higher levels of gameplay.
Set 4 (Peach): yeah this matchup is great for Sheik, for a lot of the reasons you mentioned (Peach is slow so she has trouble contesting needles, edgeguarding Sheik, keeping up in neutral) and Sheik has great confirms into basically any aerial off grab, I saw you do downthrow upair which is one of her best kill confirms. Try using aerial needles and short hop back air to contest the aerial ranges where Peach likes to float
Set 5 (Luigi): like you mentioned, Luigi recovery is bad. I'd recommend using backair instead of forward air though to hit him away, it's safer and you can do it invincibly from the ledge (once you confirm he isn't going to side b onto stage).
Set 6 (Peach): sadly downthrow upsmash does not work against Peach if they airdodge out, but at that percent you can get downthrow -> uptilt -> fair (or upair) and probably kill
Set 7 (Young Link): falling nairs like this can be good when you have a hard read on their recovery pattern, but be careful not to miss because you will probably die.
Set 8 (Ganondorf): the reason you feel like you "can't follow up" when Ganon is in shield is because he's shielding on reaction to your jumps, and you aren't using empty land -> grab. With any character but especially Sheik, empty land grab is a crucial option to use because otherwise they can shield every time you jump and always be safe from your aerials. And the reason you're getting hit with double jump aerials is that you're most likely trying to punish his landing lag (assuming he is going to land with an aerial) but instead of doing that he double jumps, baits your move (ftilt, grab, whatever), and then aerials you back. Try to sustain your neutral interactions a little bit longer without committing to a move, you'll find that your opponent will become uncomfortable or throw something punishable out much faster than you'd expect. And yes, Ganon can chaingrab Sheik (Sheik can also chaingrab Ganon though, or zero to death without chaingrabbing even, so its a good matchup for Sheik).
Set 9 (Luigi): lol
Set 10 (Falco): hahahahaha yes Falco is pain to play against, you have to play an entirely different style of neutral game. Think of yourself as James Bond moving through the lasers, that's what I try to do. Focus on grab and spaced aerials at low percents. Take laser into dashback/ftilt/nair can all be good, you can also try crouching in neutral to duck underneath lasers (Sheik gets real low) and sneak in some dtilts (broken move). Also if you get good at powershielding, it forces the Falco to shoot high lasers (harder to powershield, but easy to run underneath directly), so it gets interesting. For edgeguards, just try to force him to low upb. Then backair him immediately or just hold ledge and do a close ledgehop backair to hit him back off.
Set 11 (Peach): when trying to edgeguard better Peach players, remember that she's bad at getting off of the ledge, so I would stay on the stage and threaten with bair, fair, ftilt, etc. Then, if she goes to ledge, try to snipe her with needles (probably fail) and then focus on punishing her for trying to get back on the actual stage. To deal with crossups, practice short hop nair out of shield, or wavedash out of shield (this doesn't directly punish, but gets you back to neutral).
Set 12 (Fox): you're right that you need to anticipate his movements better in neutral, but you also need to improve your punish game to win this matchup, aka tech chasing for getting that crucial percent that you need to set up a good edgeguard.
Set 13 (Sheik): nice job clutching your first game 3! I recommend learning to chaingrab in this matchup since that will start happening as you get better
Set 14 (Luigi): so many Luigis man..
Set 15 (Marth): good job whiff punishing, but be careful against Marths who do aerials in place or retreating aerials because he can dash back before you get the punish and punish you back.
Set 16 (Fox): oh no... the Vessel needles.. don't do that it's bad I promise it's bad JUST TRUST ME DON'T DO IT
Set 17 (Fox): it's not that he knows exactly when you're gonna throw out a move, he's intentionally dashing and jumping slightly outside of your threat ranges, baiting you to throw out the move, and then just reacting to that and running in to punish it. It's really good (and really lame) and the way to beat it is to slowly take space in such a way that if he rushes you down, you can react with an ftilt, grab, downsmash, etc. That way he either has to force an interaction or give you space, but you want to avoid starting the interaction until he's actually going to be in range, otherwise you're gonna get owned
Set 18 (Falco): you were just better than this guy
Set 19 (Sheik/Falco): yes, punishing sheik coming down is really good!! and yes being in shield is pretty bad against falco, but if you learn how to nair oos and wavedash oos that will help a lot.
Set 20 (Marth/Fox): nice edgeguards against the Marth, those low backairs offstage are fantastic. You also discovered how good DI mixups are in Sheik's punish game, one that I like in particular is reverse dash attack. Basically if you think someone will DI your dash attack well, you can dash all the way through them and cross them up with the hitbox. DI out on the normal dash attack would mean DI in on the reverse dash attack, giving you a followup. Sheik has lots of little 50/50s like this in her punish game that if you lock onto your opponent's mental state can really net some huge punishes. And yes, waiting / playing reactively is extremely powerful with Sheik, great pickup :)
Set 21 (Marth): make sure to use lots of grab against Marth, you have guaranteed downthrow followups that lead into huge combos at low percent, and edgeguards/kills at higher percents, in particular, try to use boost grab (dash attack + Z in first 3 frames of animation) instead of dash attack in neutral, it hits more often and nets better results.
Set 22 (Captain Falcon): he's really fast! but his aerials come out slowly. so stay in the corner (he can't cross you up as easily in the corner) and shield when you see him jump. You can crouch cancel -> grab his neutral airs, and you can punish his stomps and knees out of shield (although you might need to watch out for jabs afterward). Tech chase him! It's much easier than the space animal tech chases.
Goated
This is super helpful and I don't even play sheik! 🐐
How to play like the biggest loser.
i aint readin allat🤣
Would love to see this with different characters or even different games. rlly good video format.
of course the first captain falcon you fight is bab
Was that really Bab? Bab is ranked grandmaster, what would he be doing fighting a Gold player
I've been playing unranked for about a year and I still don't know how to play against Capt. Falcon. But this video makes me want to try ranked finally. I play Sheik as well.
I REALLY like this video format, it's like a sped up version of the journey i have before me. Would love to see it with more chars. (Marth)
dope concept homie! sick you played a character you weren't super comfortable with at first
Would love to see you try this with Peach, been tryna learn her myself but she's so much different than any other character I've played prior, with her float tech and such
Yep, Peach is underrated as hell. You can feel people slowly losing braincells throughout the match the more you down smash lol.
@@ThePsymonator yeah bro check out my 40% peach combo * down smashes one time *
21:00 shoutout to scarlott for waiting ❤😊
16:55 That was Bab Activated lol you had no chance. Check out his combo videos!
Ive found Fox to definitely the hardest character to figure out how to beat as Sheik as well, feels like you have be on the defense but if they’re super fast you can’t even do that
On the flip side Jigglypuff is the easiest matchup for me even though Sheik loses to her too. You just have to outplay the Jigglypuff at their own game carefully spacing out back-airs and mixing in your other tools like needles
Your best winrate stage is FoD because you never choose it. So games against wayyy better opponents go to your fav counter-picks (aka not FoD) and your games that you were gonna win anyways have the enemy counterpick to FoD. Basically, it’s a statistics and selection bias example, and it’s kinda proof that stage pick matters much less outside of the top level
but why would they choose fod if its not their strongest pick? and if i truly was bad at fod wouldnt fod be a lower winrate? genuine question. or is sheik just good on paper playing fountain of dreams?
It may be their strongest counterpick but if they already lost game 1 to you they'll likely lose game 2 aswell no matter the stage, so if you never pick FoD then you're only playing on it generally when you're playing against someone worse than you or at least worse at that given matchup.
Its pretty rare to run into someone you go even with on Slippi most times its either you beating them over and over or them beating you over and over.
Love this series
As an on again off again shiek player, try wavedashing forward/back and ftilting against falcon. Youll catch alot of nairs and approaches, and you can dashback if you whiff! Also, ita really easy to get powershields against falco. Duck under, and then shield as the lazer goes over. Youll power shield for free and can convert it into a grab.
I like these videos alot, even if I don't care about the game (starcraft). It's just a shame you don't get any traffic going anymore.
I get that everybody wants the "old" kind of videos back. We all miss lud and papa's mid level melee banter.
But you can only do so many of those. I don't think just uploading gameplay is gonna do much in the long run, if there's no gimmick/mod.
Good on ya ludvix, wish ya the best.
appreciate the feedback! and its nice that u get my sentiments, those type of videos (the banter) prob will come back once in awhile in the future, right now i really enjoy improving/story telling styles more nowadays, and im trying to improve the videos itself as much as i continue uploading, i appreciate the comment :)
@@Ludvix I'm glad to hear you're still having some fun making and experimenting with videos on here. YT really is a tough game, not even talking money or algorithm.
Keep it up bud. Just don't force yourself.
If you’re far from the ledge then a down tilt or a no fast fall nair ledge cancel might cover it.
15:32 Can't speak for anyone in Melee, but from playing a lot of Smash 4 and Smash Ultimate online (in the for glory modes), I'll tend to be playing with a character that I have fun with and am fairly competent with, but isn't my main, and if I play against someone who is actually good and either beats, or nearly beats me, I'll switch over to my main for a "real challenge", since I would have been holding back using a non-main character. Like, "now I'll show you my real power", or something like that lol
29:30 - don't beat yourself up over losing "unlosable" matchups or 80/20s. Those assume that you know the matchup and what to exploit. First time ever playing bowser with shiek, and that bowser has probably played that matchup 100s of times. Not crazy to lose.
dope video man.
as a marth main I'd want to take shiek to yoshi's potentially if stadium or fd are off. to get into marth you have do a lot of platform movement with jumping needles. jumping needles on the ground work until they don't to get grabs. also boost grab would beat dashdance if you want to approach. but cc marth's aerials and dtilt into grab is great because it limits marth to just position wins or grabs.
good job luvdix
hold up, "my WIFE called me". That's crazy if it's that true
When fox is recovering just throw lots of needles to interrupt his starting animation on his recovery
ggs man i was the bowser
the first one 💀
U a legend
I have never played slippi ranked so im not sure how stage bans work on there, but you lost game 1 in your first match and then counterpicked fox to pokemon stadium. that is never a good idea. Dreamland, battlefield, or fountain would all be better
What’s wrong with PS compared to bf?
@@Ludvix low ceiling means fox up air and upsmash kills hella early as well as yoshis and FD+FD also has no platforms to land on while recovering meaning you get killed off recovery more frequently, I talked about this in my comment too :3
@@Ludvix also adding on to this, ps has much further away side blast zones than bf does, so fair's kill power is nerfed. sheik loves to kill horizontally whereas fox loves to kill vertically, ps does a lot for fox and not much for you
Finally someone showing that this character is not a Win Button and you need to know what are you doing to be good with he (or she)
its not a win button but its not hard to understand sheik and how to play her if you just understand melee. or tech chase regrabs which is not hard to do at all and was largely absent in the video. sheik is really hard to deal with as spacies unless you know how to actually play and dont just spam muscle memory. very hard to actually be good with sheik against good spacies
needles are gg
chain is a good troll tool
Sheik is commonly described as having a "bad" recovery, but from my perspective after playing the character for years I don't quite quite agree with the objective description of bad. Sheiks recovery is unique in the sense that it has polarizing strengths and weaknesses. Her ability to control and snap to the ledge is second to only spacies with shine turnaround, and the sami stall (I think that's what it's called, which is the same technique as shino stalling but instead of poofing above the ledge with hitbox you simply drop ledge a bit lower and regrab with the upwards part of up b) can be done in a way that gives her full intangibility, as well as resetting her ECB to give you a more consistent perfect ledgedash. Its great for stalling, very hard to contest unless done with a perfect callout, and can be mixed up very well to create a tight execution test for an edgeguarding opponent. The biggest downsides to the recovery are how it loses to rinse and repeat edgeguards, a la fox bair off ledge, but this is where the new school of Sheiks like jmook and krudo have shown innovations. Sheiks recovery is only bad when it is used on it's own, but many of it's issues can be mitigated with amsah teching and slideoff DI's, not to mention the ever elusive edge cancel poof and various angles and shortens that box players have started to cook with. She's similar to falcon in the sense that the flaws and limitations in their recoveries often drive their players to higher levels of technical skill and creativity in spite of it.
I think it's mainly that Sheik's recovery is one of the only exploitable parts of her kit is why it gets mentioned so much, but it's definitely not worse than Falcon.
@@WhoPlaysMc Oh yeah she definitely has a much better time than Falcon. Just using the comparison as an example of aspects of the character that are gradually getting pushed farther and farther in terms of how top players are learning to patch up the inherent weaknesses with godlike tech skill
As a Marth main, it is REALLY refreshing to see somebody outside of the Marth/Sheik sphere point out how EASY it is for Sheik to beat Marth. That matchup is BROKEN. The fact that a new Sheik doesn’t even struggle with Marth until Gold rank shows just how simple it is for Sheik to beat Marth.
That matchup is either 55/45 or 60/40 at top level, but at the intermediate, I would even go as far as to say that it is 70/30. Absolutely a braindead matchup. I’ll play people who boot up Unranked as Sheik, but if I beat somebody and then they switch to Sheik because they want a braindead win and an undeserved taunt, I just taunt and disconnect.
Same I struggle against Sheik at mid-level and can put up a better fight with my way-less experienced falco. Kinda makes sense from this vid, as it seems Sheik has a harder time dealing with lasers / punishing falco than I thought
Please do another one of these as another character you haven't played yet. Maybe falcon would be sick?
This series of videos is alot of fun to watch (except when he played lily. Watching bad versions of your main is always hard)
Ludwig
It's no wonder you lost to that first Falcon. It was frigging bab
7:43 his internet mightve just cut out
lmao I love the first Falco game. "How do people play this matchup? I literally cannot do anything." As somebody who just kinda plays Melee every once in a while for a little fun on Slippi, and a Sheik player, this was very nice to hear. Glad it's not just me.
The matchup can be really annoying. But platforms are sheik’s best friend when it comes to finding openings and avoiding laser.
Fox is definitely a harder matchup for sheik, but I find Falco so much more annoying.
34:03 As a Luigi player, using needles as Sheik can be really oppressive and hard to deal with because he relies so heavily on ground game. So if I had an idea for an easy fix, get better at using needles against Luigi and you will do much better in the future. Also, you were on FD but if you can find a way to camp platforms against Luigi by light-shielding you basically just win against Luigi because he has no counter-play in the air. Other than that, you just have to play a really good neutral and generally just try to not engage Luigi, don't disrespect him but you just want to play really defensively and he will never get in.
I feel like it's common practice in fighting games to look at other players' matches of your character, especially when you know what areas and matchups you're struggling with. Is "I'll just grind it out" a more common sentiment for smash players?
That bowser is from my region. Playing him weekly is so rough LOL
(Any tilt) into (any ariel) is such a hard conversion….
Bro don't even feel bad about losing to that Bowser. I've played against Osufan multiple times and that guy is a low rank DEMON. I don't think I've won against him at all yet he's a hard knowledge check for sure
"Why do people do this" in regards to switching characters, it's for the same reason you talked about how difficult it is for you to fight Falco as Sheik. I main both Sheik and Marth, and in general I just think it's "easier" to deal with the Spacies as Marth, but it's way easier for me to deal with another Sheik with Sheik as it is with Marth.
until they counter pick u back
Don't worry that Bowser was just a genius
This would be me, but for luigi or the other low tiers
Not a bad overall ranking for just 200 ? Pretty damn good
definitely look at the ninja a complete sheik guide and practice getting your bairs to land with the hitbox you actually want
Ludvix only beats Papa Johns!
Good video, but might be worth adding some stuff like music or maybe jazz it up a little with a story, because I feel like the narration is currently a little dry. A narrative of how you got better with the character might be good, or something. Still good video though 👍
Sheik: easy my dude,super easy
8:00 bro, I am a complete beginner, but glad to see spacies fk up everyone. They are the only unfun matchup to play against for me.
how to edgegaurd as shiek: needle
I like how sheiks walk is faster than Zelda’s run
I love Ludvix
This is good content
How does he get the missed l cancel color when he misses? Id love to know when I miss
Look up “gecko code miss L cancel” for a better visual guide, but u right click ur iso and look for the checkbox
I think you need to go into uncle punch and practice your reaction tech chasing in combo mode
I like reaction tech chasing spacies using F and D tilt once they are at knock down percent for the move
Tech chasing is such a huge part of Sheik's game, and I just didn't see much tech chasing from you
even though you were doing a lot of other great stuff :)
whada guys think? what should he have done? leave your comments below.
beast.
sheik is pretty simple tbh just hit ur tilt combos and chaingrabs and implement spacing, but also be ready to scrap and tech chase as well. Edgeguards include the use of needles, run off fairs, back air from ledge, even nair.
She can get pretty technical, so she definitely gets hard to actually MASTER what with her abysmal recovery as well as advanced techniques such as her poof tactics and turnaround needles, but its hard for me to imagine Sheik being difficult at low level. You're messing up pretty big on some of the basic concepts.
sheik may be overloaded but…. yeah shes pretty cool😊
Now do one for puff, the easiest character tech skill wise.
Best falco plays brain dead character
1. Uncle Punch
2. Armada shine training
3. Pick Shiek
Mindless flowchart edgeguard, perfect for handwarming too
Oh that’s a great idea!
Ya know, it always surprises me when i see a Fox like the one at the start make silly mistakes that should be a death sentence even for mid-level play, and then for some reason they can do things like ledge dashing
Like, i regularly see players on unranked who can shield drop and ledge dash (admittedly basic tech at this point) and then i still beat them (when i cant do either tech). I'm not saying you shouldn't learn all the tools available, but its emblematic of an issue of prioritization that i guess has existed since the dawn of fighting games. Heck, someone like Borp should put all that to rest: game sense is how you win, not by out-muscling your opponent
Nice
Starving rich family's assassin trained daughter
@17:33 casually playing against bab in gold 1
Abuse grabs and tech chases more against spacies
does this mean that you'll be taking matches off of Papa J's yoshi?
22:38 but it IS though xD
number 1 rule of EZ mode sheik usage: CHAINGRAB ANYTHING YOU CAN CHAINGRAB. Literally day 0 sheiks abuse this xD
Good vid. Play zelda! Just use downsmash, fair/bair and jab.
always downthrow tech chase big bodies like dk or bowser
lost twice to bowsers... all you have to do is needle grab pummel down throw grab pummel down throw....... upsmash
Shiek is tough for doc. Shiek Fair is really good against Marios.
I'd say you don't grab enough.
Probably her most annoying feature.
Mostly throw spacies down and floaties up.
Why am I watching this LMAO
How do you play ranked on this game?
Watch my video “melee beginners guide”
Chess video def inc.
28:34 "we got the same character select screen" bro you are playing the same CHARACTER 😭
naw das zelda
I guess that against bowser you just chaingrab him untill 90% and then go for the stock, cz sheik has a free chaingrab in most of the low tiers
Edit: Ices are really hard, iirc, Chudat have never been defeated by a Sheik
Based 100 gec peach main
how do you play melee online?
Check out my “absolute beginners guide” goes over that :)
@Ludvix thank you, do you have a video explaining how to play one gamecube/wii on 2 TVs?
Nope, but there is many guides out there for that. I would look into softmodding a wii since that’s super easy and fast and also check FBM for a CRT tv near u some people give them away or check ur local melee discords, they can help u out and they might live super close to u too
Sheik has always been easy in lower to mid level
after that Sheik gets a lot more difficult because of the average neutral & horrible recovery
My favorite part was when he said “it’s sheik’n time” and sheiked all over them. Truly another classic Ludvix moment
Do you guys like seriously find this funny ?
Why is this still a thing
@@fayssega yes, no need to break the ambiance
I always see comments like this and somehow it hasn’t got old yet
Npc ass comment
Needle is op Grab the ledge weak Bairr
Sheik
O yeah? If sheik is the easiest character to learn how come I keep losing? Checkmate
im 7 mins in and JUST GRAB
can you do kirby