While the D apache is very is nice, I would disagree that its better for the average player than the AH-1Z for the following reasons: 1. True the viper only gets 2 AIM-9L's compared to the apache 4 stingers, however in my experience as well as others, the L's are much more viable for striking aircraft than the stinger, and with how current ground battles play out, you will most likely never need more than 2 AAM's 2. Its a much shorter grind. While it the viper only has 4 helicopters in the way of grinding out the viper, the D apache has 5. While this may not sound like much, that extra helo( that being the AH-64A) is an extra 390k rp to research before getting you're desired chopper. Pair this with the fact that most people use Helo EC and are not in a ka-50 if you're doing US helos, the shorter then grind, the better. 3.overall similar performance. While it is no secret that having ground radar is a distinct advantage, both helos already get crisp thermal imaging, which is what you only really need. 4. The apache 30mm is definitely better than the 20mm on the viper when it comes to air-to-ground true, but imo the 20mm is much better with handling any helos or CAS u might run into in GRB. Furthermore, if you are close enough to use the apache cannon on tanks, you're probably blasting away with the hydra's and by the time you run out of rockets you will usually be shot down, so you will only be using the 30mm for ground attacking in a limited number of cases. All these points and observations were made from my personal experience playing both the AH-1Z, as well as the AH-64A Peten. While the peten may not be the exact same as the AH-64D, it is similar enough to make an educated guess on how it would preform. Lemme know what u guys think of my idea's!
Yup the viper is better than apache in game from my experience. Ah1z can have aams and maw while apache D cant. More flares, same payload, and overall more useful cannon, plus very sexy
Its a small maneuverable heli with four hellfires and 2nd gen thermals at 9.7 where it doesnt actively face SAM carriers and is especially deadly in a down tier. Suffice to say its worth the grind and very good for its BR.
@@unspec6647 grinding any heli line without premium heli is very difficult to say the least. Some helis are not even designed to be playable, like french 9.7 gazelle where your only armament is 14x mighty mouse rockets without ccip and gaijin expects you to go into heli ec and do something
Mangusta CBT is basically the most op heli in the game. It sits at 9.7 while being decked out as 10.7 heli. It even has auto tracking, a feature reserved only for 10.0 or higher helis. The only reason people are not crying about it is because Italian high tier tanks are not that good or popular at the moment.
Something minor, but AH-1Z can comfortably use flares and MAW at the same time, while AH-64D needs to sacrifice either air to air missiles for more flares and MAW, or no MAW with A2A missiles but less flares. Recently they've tweaked the way AH-1Z's engines and it feels better while flying. Until Longbow Hellfire's are added to AH-64D, I think AH-1Z will be the better helicopter in US tree. And even then, AH-1Z could technically equip longbow radar on one of the wingtip pylons.
With this aircraft in particular there are a lot of things War Thunder gets wrong in terms of performance. It's almost like they took the real life predecessor the AH-1N and slapped the skin of the modern Zulu on top of it and made it a little faster. Not going to be one of those guys that leaks classified specs onto the wiki but the in game representation of the Zulu is a far cry from it's real world performance compared to the AH-64D. Hoping it eventually gets nudged in the right direction since I worked on this aircraft in real life and I've got a bit of a soft spot for them and their brother the Uh-1Y. The in-game model is actually from one of the squadrons (hmla-303) that I worked very closely with and there is a good chance that over the years I maintained the specific aircraft actually in game.
I would grind to the AH-64D Apache. Firstly you get hellfire K , maw and rwr, 4 stingers which aren’t as good as aim 9 L but most important it can pull more manoeuvres without crashing. I have grinded the AH-1Z and I don’t use it at all in ground rb. The rain currently of SPAA bullying heli means you need to be able to manoeuvre a lot to avoid sams which is not possible with the AH-1Z because if you do like a a dive you need to pull up VERY early or you will probally crash your self. Oh and I forgot about the longbow radar which is very useful to make sure when your guiding a missile you know if an enemy jet is about to gun you down or you can look for enemy’s on the field a lot faster. Thermals are useful but dead vehicles look very similar to alive vehicles so the radar is very helpful. And the armour on the Apache is a lot more useful in helicopter EC and ground rb gun SPAA. There is lots of armour protecting the pilot and gunner so you get more time before they are probally killed. And also the gun on the Apache is a 30mm not a 20mm. The 20mm has a higher fire rate but a large spray so not loads of rounds hit the target. It overall isn’t as good as the 30mm of the Apache.
Here is the thing AH-1Z Viper, AH-64A/D, and the premium AH-64A Peten are all like delicious burgers where each one is slightly better than the other. They are all worth the grind and purchase.
I have the answer for you: after unlocking the Ah-64D and the AH-1Z, as well as buying the KA50, the Viper had to be one of the worst too tier helos. The engine is so underpowered for how big it is and the help really does not want to stay in the air. It responds a lot slower than the Apache, let alone the KA50. It is so much less agile than it looks. The climb rate is god awful and while it has a high top speed, you will only reach it if traveling at sea level without changing vector for a solid few minutes; turn at all and you'll dump speed fast, which is not how to Ka50 behaves. The Aim-9J and the gun are very nice when dueling jets, and I think it does this better than any help in the game, but because it doesn't have a radar, they will always get the jumb in you. Bottom line: don't buy it. It was good until the KA50 was added.
The viper is smaller than the apache and I can say that speed and as smaller the chopper in RB . I have Apache , all Hinds and now grinding for Mi28 and this chopper in the us tech tree.
everyone sais grinding choppers are very hard but I managed to grind the 2 hueys and I'm currently on the ah1f within 3 days witch is the time it takes to research like half of a rank 5 vehicle
Note I would rather have the aim9l cuz the stingrs don’t work thy just lose lock on slow jets flying in a straight line without the jet ever even knowing you fired a missle and thy have no proximity fuze you need 4 of them to get a kill the aim9l on the other hand hits almost every time and most of the time will just ignore flares when the stingers will sometimes will lose lock to track a rock that’s been in the sun too long it is literally useless
Did they nerf the speed of this thing? The stat card now says Max speed is 250kmh or something. That's kinda stupid and no where near it's top speed irl
The viper handle inaccurate to how it should. She behaves like a bus but In reality, the viper is both light an has stronger engines than the Apache. If you seen it in real life you’ll know that she more than capable a being agile
I disagree, imo Viper is better than Apache. 20mm is far better gun than 30mm will ever be due to higher muzzle velocity which is far more important than pen considering the main use of a gun on heli is short range defence against aerial targets. AIM-9L are actually great unlike Stingers that are effectively nothing but dead weight since they struggle to hit even AI let alone a player they are so shit I rather take AMASE. Also Viper is 10.7 and not 11.0 which makes it cheaper to spawn by just a bit. 114K is not that much better than 114B. Like I've used both and I was never in situation I would say "ohh damn I wish I had 114Ks" The difference is so miniscule that it can be disregarded. The only actual advantage Apache has over Viper is agility which is mostly due to Gajub wrongly modeling Vipers FM
Nope I don’t think that’s correct. The 30mm is very strong and better that the 20mm will ever be. You are definitely right about the missile side of this debate but not the gun
@@PitchLost how is 30mm better? It has better pen sure but thats not that iportant when the main A2G gameplay of helis is ATGM slinging. Using gun in A2G role is rare and in that regard both 30mm and 20mm are both about as bad(unlike 2A42 on SOV/RF helis). And in A2A role 20mm is better you can't dispute that due to higher muzzle velocity it's far more lethal against maneuvering attacking jet which is the most common use of a gun on heli, the defence against aerial threats. So no the 30mm on Apache is not better than 20mm on Viper
Pen is by far more important, it can take pit tanks from quite a range away, not to far but quite far. The only time you would ever need a 20mm is for shooting down incoming aircraft, and the 30mm can do that just fine if not better.
@@PitchLost You are missing my point here. With how helis are played A2G capability of a gun is IRELEVANT. The gameplay of heli is to yeeet ATGMs from 4+km which means you will not use your gun against ground targets anyway. So yes pen is not important its flat out irrelevant. And sorry M230 is for sure NOT better than M197 against aerial targets. Thats why imo M197 is better, its simply based on the main use of a gun on heli which is killing air targets and in that regard M197 is superior. IF you would use heli gun against tanks often(which you are not in current meta) then yes M230 would be better, but as I said thats NOT the case.
While the D apache is very is nice, I would disagree that its better for the average player than the AH-1Z for the following reasons:
1. True the viper only gets 2 AIM-9L's compared to the apache 4 stingers, however in my experience as well as others, the L's are much more viable for striking aircraft than the stinger, and with how current ground battles play out, you will most likely never need more than 2 AAM's
2. Its a much shorter grind. While it the viper only has 4 helicopters in the way of grinding out the viper, the D apache has 5. While this may not sound like much, that extra helo( that being the AH-64A) is an extra 390k rp to research before getting you're desired chopper. Pair this with the fact that most people use Helo EC and are not in a ka-50 if you're doing US helos, the shorter then grind, the better.
3.overall similar performance. While it is no secret that having ground radar is a distinct advantage, both helos already get crisp thermal imaging, which is what you only really need.
4. The apache 30mm is definitely better than the 20mm on the viper when it comes to air-to-ground true, but imo the 20mm is much better with handling any helos or CAS u might run into in GRB. Furthermore, if you are close enough to use the apache cannon on tanks, you're probably blasting away with the hydra's and by the time you run out of rockets you will usually be shot down, so you will only be using the 30mm for ground attacking in a limited number of cases.
All these points and observations were made from my personal experience playing both the AH-1Z, as well as the AH-64A Peten. While the peten may not be the exact same as the AH-64D, it is similar enough to make an educated guess on how it would preform. Lemme know what u guys think of my idea's!
Yup the viper is better than apache in game from my experience. Ah1z can have aams and maw while apache D cant. More flares, same payload, and overall more useful cannon, plus very sexy
Yeah but the viper handles like a truck. You can do some downright dirty positioning in the Apache, hugging the dirt around mountains.
Whenever I see the Viper Im reminded alot of the previous battlefield titles, namely 2,3, and 4. Idk why but they just look super cool to me
Yeah, with zuni rockets mounted on helis
Can you talk about the italian 9.7 top heli aka the Mangusta CBT, i rarely see any videos on it. Thanks!
++
Its a small maneuverable heli with four hellfires and 2nd gen thermals at 9.7 where it doesnt actively face SAM carriers and is especially deadly in a down tier. Suffice to say its worth the grind and very good for its BR.
I am currently grinding for the 9.7 itallian heli and the AB205-A1 heli doesn't make it any easy.
@@unspec6647 grinding any heli line without premium heli is very difficult to say the least. Some helis are not even designed to be playable, like french 9.7 gazelle where your only armament is 14x mighty mouse rockets without ccip and gaijin expects you to go into heli ec and do something
Mangusta CBT is basically the most op heli in the game. It sits at 9.7 while being decked out as 10.7 heli. It even has auto tracking, a feature reserved only for 10.0 or higher helis. The only reason people are not crying about it is because Italian high tier tanks are not that good or popular at the moment.
Something minor, but AH-1Z can comfortably use flares and MAW at the same time, while AH-64D needs to sacrifice either air to air missiles for more flares and MAW, or no MAW with A2A missiles but less flares. Recently they've tweaked the way AH-1Z's engines and it feels better while flying. Until Longbow Hellfire's are added to AH-64D, I think AH-1Z will be the better helicopter in US tree. And even then, AH-1Z could technically equip longbow radar on one of the wingtip pylons.
With this aircraft in particular there are a lot of things War Thunder gets wrong in terms of performance. It's almost like they took the real life predecessor the AH-1N and slapped the skin of the modern Zulu on top of it and made it a little faster. Not going to be one of those guys that leaks classified specs onto the wiki but the in game representation of the Zulu is a far cry from it's real world performance compared to the AH-64D. Hoping it eventually gets nudged in the right direction since I worked on this aircraft in real life and I've got a bit of a soft spot for them and their brother the Uh-1Y. The in-game model is actually from one of the squadrons (hmla-303) that I worked very closely with and there is a good chance that over the years I maintained the specific aircraft actually in game.
That's cool as hell mate
quick question, does the ah1z use kilo and romeo hellfires ?
We mainly use AGM-114K. AGM-114R's are used by drones. We also use JAGM-179's.
I would grind to the AH-64D Apache. Firstly you get hellfire K , maw and rwr, 4 stingers which aren’t as good as aim 9 L but most important it can pull more manoeuvres without crashing. I have grinded the AH-1Z and I don’t use it at all in ground rb. The rain currently of SPAA bullying heli means you need to be able to manoeuvre a lot to avoid sams which is not possible with the AH-1Z because if you do like a a dive you need to pull up VERY early or you will probally crash your self. Oh and I forgot about the longbow radar which is very useful to make sure when your guiding a missile you know if an enemy jet is about to gun you down or you can look for enemy’s on the field a lot faster. Thermals are useful but dead vehicles look very similar to alive vehicles so the radar is very helpful. And the armour on the Apache is a lot more useful in helicopter EC and ground rb gun SPAA. There is lots of armour protecting the pilot and gunner so you get more time before they are probally killed. And also the gun on the Apache is a 30mm not a 20mm. The 20mm has a higher fire rate but a large spray so not loads of rounds hit the target. It overall isn’t as good as the 30mm of the Apache.
These fly over my house all the time, and 2 came around yesterday!
How about reviewing the Tiger HAD next ? Good work on the recent helicopter videos lately.
Can you do a video about the BO-105?
Greeting from Germany
best heli in the game, comes practically spaded out of the box, the only thing it lacks are thermals.
well if grindig hellis wasnt a sanity suicide...
Here is the thing
AH-1Z Viper, AH-64A/D, and the premium AH-64A Peten are all like delicious burgers where each one is slightly better than the other. They are all worth the grind and purchase.
Stop lying
No. Not at all. AH64D is the only one that has any business being in top tier battles.
I have the answer for you: after unlocking the Ah-64D and the AH-1Z, as well as buying the KA50, the Viper had to be one of the worst too tier helos. The engine is so underpowered for how big it is and the help really does not want to stay in the air. It responds a lot slower than the Apache, let alone the KA50. It is so much less agile than it looks. The climb rate is god awful and while it has a high top speed, you will only reach it if traveling at sea level without changing vector for a solid few minutes; turn at all and you'll dump speed fast, which is not how to Ka50 behaves. The Aim-9J and the gun are very nice when dueling jets, and I think it does this better than any help in the game, but because it doesn't have a radar, they will always get the jumb in you. Bottom line: don't buy it. It was good until the KA50 was added.
AIM-9Ls
For me the ah 1z is better for Air to Air but the Apatche is better for Ground
The viper is smaller than the apache and I can say that speed and as smaller the chopper in RB . I have Apache , all Hinds and now grinding for Mi28 and this chopper in the us tech tree.
everyone sais grinding choppers are very hard but I managed to grind the 2 hueys and I'm currently on the ah1f within 3 days witch is the time it takes to research like half of a rank 5 vehicle
All good but in ground rb you instantly dead if tunguska is on map. There are no mode for helis.
Is there any difference between 2 hellfire variants in the game apart from extra penetration on the K variant?
From my experience k variant has better tracking. Earlier variant has greater chance to miss if you don't use the optical target lock.
Can you do a vid on the mig 21 sps k pls i wanna know if its worth it
Note I would rather have the aim9l cuz the stingrs don’t work thy just lose lock on slow jets flying in a straight line without the jet ever even knowing you fired a missle and thy have no proximity fuze you need 4 of them to get a kill the aim9l on the other hand hits almost every time and most of the time will just ignore flares when the stingers will sometimes will lose lock to track a rock that’s been in the sun too long it is literally useless
Did they nerf the speed of this thing? The stat card now says Max speed is 250kmh or something.
That's kinda stupid and no where near it's top speed irl
review the YAH64 please.
I'd like to request the YAH-64
Can you talk about the Fw-190 d-13
Review on the Khrizentema ATGM vehicle?
I miss atgm jousting with 16 tow2s
The best looking helicopter
The viper handle inaccurate to how it should. She behaves like a bus but In reality, the viper is both light an has stronger engines than the Apache. If you seen it in real life you’ll know that she more than capable a being agile
Sad France tiger video when?
I disagree, imo Viper is better than Apache.
20mm is far better gun than 30mm will ever be due to higher muzzle velocity which is far more important than pen considering the main use of a gun on heli is short range defence against aerial targets.
AIM-9L are actually great unlike Stingers that are effectively nothing but dead weight since they struggle to hit even AI let alone a player they are so shit I rather take AMASE.
Also Viper is 10.7 and not 11.0 which makes it cheaper to spawn by just a bit.
114K is not that much better than 114B. Like I've used both and I was never in situation I would say "ohh damn I wish I had 114Ks" The difference is so miniscule that it can be disregarded.
The only actual advantage Apache has over Viper is agility which is mostly due to Gajub wrongly modeling Vipers FM
Nope I don’t think that’s correct. The 30mm is very strong and better that the 20mm will ever be. You are definitely right about the missile side of this debate but not the gun
@@PitchLost how is 30mm better? It has better pen sure but thats not that iportant when the main A2G gameplay of helis is ATGM slinging. Using gun in A2G role is rare and in that regard both 30mm and 20mm are both about as bad(unlike 2A42 on SOV/RF helis).
And in A2A role 20mm is better you can't dispute that due to higher muzzle velocity it's far more lethal against maneuvering attacking jet which is the most common use of a gun on heli, the defence against aerial threats. So no the 30mm on Apache is not better than 20mm on Viper
Pen is by far more important, it can take pit tanks from quite a range away, not to far but quite far. The only time you would ever need a 20mm is for shooting down incoming aircraft, and the 30mm can do that just fine if not better.
@@PitchLost You are missing my point here. With how helis are played A2G capability of a gun is IRELEVANT. The gameplay of heli is to yeeet ATGMs from 4+km which means you will not use your gun against ground targets anyway. So yes pen is not important its flat out irrelevant.
And sorry M230 is for sure NOT better than M197 against aerial targets.
Thats why imo M197 is better, its simply based on the main use of a gun on heli which is killing air targets and in that regard M197 is superior. IF you would use heli gun against tanks often(which you are not in current meta) then yes M230 would be better, but as I said thats NOT the case.
Does it works for console?
Please do the ka 29
can you do the a-7d?
He already did.
Free GE app is a scam, I have done plenty of missions for gaining GE not iven one I have earn
I've done the easier missions and got around 150 GE. The other missions require me to grind on other games so I'm not doing that.
The missions also depends on the country you live in. I think asian countries have the shittitest missions.
Pretty sexy looking machine
Thank u
It is currently one of the best helicopters in the world, but in the game it is average...
its not one of the best but its still useful
Isn't one of the best but isn't bad
@@EDP-6000 it is one of the best
@@americanmig160 no its too light okay?
@@EDP-6000 how is it too light, just because it’s light doesn’t mean it’s not one of the best
HAHAHAHA 10 eagles....... you serious.. that will get you .... nothing because gaijin
Let’s gooo
do NOT grind helis its not fun and its not worth the grind or the money for the premium helis
Kinda is ngl
I disagree I grinded for the british ahMK1 Apache and it’s one of my best decisions on warthunder!
@@whp-A I Agree
They are highly useful if you know how to use them, plus while the grind isn't fun it is awarding getting your hands on your favorite helis