Thanks for these videos. I'm so excited about finally getting an MS-20. It's great to know that it's as close to a vintage MS-20 as someone would probably want to get in reissue. Can't wait!
The MiniBrute is one of my favorite modern synths. I can't get enough of the thing. The re-release of the MS-20 had reinvigorated my attraction to it. They're really both quite different, but I love both of them. Ultimately, it comes down to which interface suits you best! The MS-20 is a great way to learn about control voltage.
The MS-20 oscillators respond normally to Hz/V signals and all the trigger inputs and outputs listen for inverted gate signals (S-trig as opposed to V-trig). The Analog 4 supports both of those. So, yes, the A4 can sequence both the original and the mini MS-20.
Yeah, the MiniBrute is fantastic to link up in a vintage set up.It has all the vintage ports.I am thinking of also buying the Minibrute for my vintage jams.
@automaticgainsay I really appreciate your videos. I watch them periodically to refresh my memory on the details of this synth. Thanks so much. It makes a hige difference when the person in the video really enjoys what the synthesizer can do.
There is SO MUCH you can do with just the default patch! I was thinking that envelope 2 wasnt working but now I know it was because env 1 was cutting it off thanks!
hey marc, i left a message on the 'ms20 mini intro' page regarding this!! according to the specs/ instructions on korg's site, it claims that the ms20 mini uses 'oct per volt' as opposed to the original 'hz per volt'!! in theory, this should make it more compatible with modern cv stuff (such as the frostwave fat controller or analogue solutions oberkorn)!!
Oh my god, do you think that by fiddling with the frequency modulation EG1 knob and the EG1 and EG2 knobs as well as adding in some portamento you could replicate the opening synth notes from Emerson Lake & Palmer's song "Hoedown"?
The SH-101 has a cult following because of its genre association. Previous to that, it was considered a cheap budget synth... being plastic, limited to a single oscillator, and having only basic functions. I personally don't see anything special about its oscillator. The MiniBrute, however, has a much more complex oscillator functionality which results in a MUCH more diverse set of possible sounds. The same goes for the filter.
Another analog 4 question. I'm tempted to preorder one of these but I only want it if I can sequence it with the cv gate track on my analog 4. I've heard that the original ms-20 does not respond to cv gate levels that work fine with a majority of synths. Could you get a solid yay or nay about that being updated. I've heard it was from sales reps but they said I could return it too. :)
They both cross 0v, but they are different texturally. I'm all talk since I don't have one. A comparison video would be a fun afternoon project but $1700 is way past the fun threshold for a 101. The yellowed, crusty plastic, casio sliders, cigarette burns, knobs that feel like wheels on a toy car, and it's dependent on an equally expensive drum machine for the proper use of the arp/ sequencer. You can expect more for your money for sure.
Bit strange way to say you have ”delayed attack time”? As i see it that you INCREASED it. As i see that delaying something makes it take some time until that particular ”something” takes an effect. But increasing it just makes it rise slower, but it does still start immediately, ie. it is NOT delayed at all. And that sliding on higher notes might be because you had portamento time set higher than zero? Maybe? But other than that, good videos! Keep em coming.
man, go check out Martial Canterel play live. He will do things with an SH-101 that will blow you away. I never really thought much of them myself until I saw him play live for the first time. Sometimes it takes seeing someone really rock out an instrument to get you to be like, "oh....yeah! You can do THAT!!!"
I thought you were going to break into the funky worm while tuning this up. Can you do a good "granny voice". I'm hoping this will be available through best buy dot com.
im honestly not a huge fan of the sh-101, its alright for a couple things, but i prefer the minibrute to it for functionality (i also havent played with a 101 enough to know the sound difference) plus, i dont like comparing them, because they are very different machines in my opinion...
i'm getting nervous looking at that heavy-ass adapter/plug/cable combination. like it's just going to break off at the tip in the jack from all the weight.
Honestly, the oscillator is too weak on the minibrute to compare to an SH-101. Those murky expanses where the minibrute loses musicality and sounds like vip vip vip instead of the notes you're entering is not a common issue with an SH-101. From what I've heard the Eowave Magma sounds punchy and rubbery to make me think it's a 101 but the price point is high for what it is. I had three SH-101s when they where $500, now that they are $1700 I would love to see a good replacement.
I've lost count of how many times I've watched this video series, it's simply great. Also, it sort of makes it easier to keep waiting for my MS-20 Mini to actually arrive. Seriously, there are still 56 people ahead of me who haven't received their units, the store in question (which is a large store in Stockholm) has only received 6 (six) units to date =(
Here in the future, mine is coming next week! I agree that Marc is "simply great," & his videos definately make it easier to wait!! Cheers from the future!
A good demonstration-explanation Marc! When I look to your demonstration and those knobs, it let me think on my Korg Delta.The Delta and the MS-20 were made in the Korg factory/ies at the same time for some years.So no wonder that we find something of the Delta in the MS-20 and vica versa.
i wonder if there are any popular mods for the original ms-20 that this will be receptive to? on another note i'm thinking it will be hilarious to run the korg ds-10 plus for nintendo dsi through the filters. that will neat bridge across the world of korg.
I played with A4, and yes, it's a beast. By far the best analog synth for the money, and not only that, it has some clever unique features. But that doesn't make the MS20 mini less interesting...
I had a little session where I routed the cv/gate from a minibrute to a minitaur and routed the audio back to the minibrute. It was pretty cool to see the amp env, arpeggiator and lfo effect the oscillator of the minitaur and mix in with the filter, noise, and sub of the mb. As I played I would switch to the mb osc I'm cool now. It's good. :)
thanks Mark and PoLLasQue, I have a sh 101 and a polysix, and in this moment I wanna a new sinth for do basses, leads and atmospheres. If Minibrute is the sh101 of the 21 century I prefer take me in the first time the dark synth, and when I have money again buy the minibrute to return to the XXI century. thanks again for the information
The EG1 > Pitch doesn't "start at zero". Did you mean zero hertz? Regardless that explanation is incorrect. The EG pitch modulation sustains at whichever note you press and the intensity knob sets how far below that note that the EG modulation starts. You DO correct yourself later in the video. The full range of EG pitch modulation that can be set by the intensity knob is like 59 semitones. It's a figure I've been meaning to retest though. I find EG1's delayed start is most useful as a mod intensity control, specifically for vibrato via the tri LFO. Maybe you go over that in a later vid.
Seems you're misunderstanding my comment. Again EG1 SUSTAINS at whatever note you press. It's start position is offset below that note by the EG1 > Pitch Mod Intensity knob. The point is that the intensity knob is determining how far below the pressed note that the pitch starts gliding up from... You even demonstrate that later in the video. Did you think the EG1 Pitch intensity knob was choosing an absolute start frequency independent of whatever note you play? That would be incorrect. For example you can make the EG1 to pitch start exactly an octave below whichever note you're pressing... you're NOT making it start at some specific frequency like 110Hz or something. (unless you play A3 220 while it starts an octave below obvs).
The sustain is the voltage reached after the attack AND decay have done their thing. The sustain certainly defines a frequency, but it is NOT the start-point of the envelope.
"Certainly the keyboard defines the pitch of the oscillator... but the keyboard does NOT define the start point of the envelope." Again the start point of EG1's effect on pitch is offset to whatever note you're playing. Do you disagreeing with that statement? The amount of offset gets further below the note you're playing the more you turn up EG1 Frequency Modulation. How much more clear can that explanation get? Are you confused by what I mean when I say offset? If you turn the EG1 Frequency Modulation knob up and EG1 has some amount of delay, the MS-20 will initially emit a note that is below whatever note you're pressing on the keyboard. If you continue holding the note down in the keyboard it will eventually climb in pitch and sustain at the frequency that would have sounded had there been no EG modulation on pitch. I have never given any other explanation other than those points right there. I'm trying to use plain english here. What part of that doesn't make sense? What I'm saying is 100% correct so you're either misinterpreting or misunderstanding what I wrote. "The sustain is the voltage reached after the attack AND decay have done their thing. The sustain certainly defines a frequency, but it is NOT the start-point of the envelope." We're talking about Envelope Generator 1 in this conversation, not the behavior of envelopes in general. EG1 doesn't have a sustain or decay parameter. If you were to compare it to an ADSR, EG1 would be functionally the same as an ADSR with full sustain. Decay wouldn't matter in that case. We don't need to lecture each other on envelopes. Keep your points germane to EG1's influence on Pitch. Seriously try to point out where you think I'm misinterpreting something about the behavior of the MS-20.
10yrs later still giving value back to the world… good work.
Thank you
I've had a couple of these synths in the past ... Now I've bought this mini and it blew me away .... I forgot how low this beast goes . THANK YOU KORG
TeeBee 303 I finally bought one too! Have been using Korg’s vst’s for a long time and wanted the real thing
Thanks for these videos. I'm so excited about finally getting an MS-20. It's great to know that it's as close to a vintage MS-20 as someone would probably want to get in reissue. Can't wait!
Great series of tutorials. I like that you started with the env gen 1 off so you could focus just on the oscillator.
Excellent! The clearest explanation the MS-20 that I've seen. Thank you!
The MiniBrute is one of my favorite modern synths. I can't get enough of the thing. The re-release of the MS-20 had reinvigorated my attraction to it. They're really both quite different, but I love both of them. Ultimately, it comes down to which interface suits you best! The MS-20 is a great way to learn about control voltage.
Thank you Marc! Nine years on & "Still rockin' in the Free World!" 👽🥁♥
I can't believe that it's been that long.
@@automaticgainsay "That's what SHE said!" 🤣🤣🤣 (Sorry I couldn't stop myself!:)
Great video, definitely learned more about the MS-20. Cannot wait for mine to arrive already!
That depends on what you're looking for. As is probably evident, I'm quite a fan of both!
I'm impressed about how the vco's sounds when in tune... Lovely detune. :)
The MS-20 oscillators respond normally to Hz/V signals and all the trigger inputs and outputs listen for inverted gate signals (S-trig as opposed to V-trig). The Analog 4 supports both of those. So, yes, the A4 can sequence both the original and the mini MS-20.
This is awesome. I'm actually using the iMS-20 (iPad app) and this is really helpful. Thanks for this!
Yeah, the MiniBrute is fantastic to link up in a vintage set up.It has all the vintage ports.I am thinking of also buying the Minibrute for my vintage jams.
Your videos are great. Thanks for making them!
Great series of videos - thanks so much for these :)
i am buying this in a week or so,,, Thanks my friend. This will come in handy :)
I love it at 2:05, "It's never a hassle it's actually really fun."
@automaticgainsay I really appreciate your videos. I watch them periodically to refresh my memory on the details of this synth. Thanks so much. It makes a hige difference when the person in the video really enjoys what the synthesizer can do.
It would be nice if you do some videos on the sq1 and the korg mini. Your videos are the best !
You can, but you disable the keyboard pitch control of VCO2 when you do it. Which is mostly fine for a ringmod effect!
There is SO MUCH you can do with just the default patch!
I was thinking that envelope 2 wasnt working but now I know it was because env 1 was cutting it off thanks!
I'd like to thank Korg for this, too!
hey marc, i left a message on the 'ms20 mini intro' page regarding this!! according to the specs/ instructions on korg's site, it claims that the ms20 mini uses 'oct per volt' as opposed to the original 'hz per volt'!! in theory, this should make it more compatible with modern cv stuff (such as the frostwave fat controller or analogue solutions oberkorn)!!
You are a star and Korg should employ you......NOW!
Oh my god, do you think that by fiddling with the frequency modulation EG1 knob and the EG1 and EG2 knobs as well as adding in some portamento you could replicate the opening synth notes from Emerson Lake & Palmer's song "Hoedown"?
Thank YOU!
The SH-101 has a cult following because of its genre association. Previous to that, it was considered a cheap budget synth... being plastic, limited to a single oscillator, and having only basic functions. I personally don't see anything special about its oscillator. The MiniBrute, however, has a much more complex oscillator functionality which results in a MUCH more diverse set of possible sounds. The same goes for the filter.
Brilliant, Thanks!
Hmm, can you control just VCO2 with the envelope? For making those vast ringmod sweeps?
Another analog 4 question. I'm tempted to preorder one of these but I only want it if I can sequence it with the cv gate track on my analog 4. I've heard that the original ms-20 does not respond to cv gate levels that work fine with a majority of synths. Could you get a solid yay or nay about that being updated. I've heard it was from sales reps but they said I could return it too. :)
Thank you Korg for this !!
They both cross 0v, but they are different texturally. I'm all talk since I don't have one. A comparison video would be a fun afternoon project but $1700 is way past the fun threshold for a 101. The yellowed, crusty plastic, casio sliders, cigarette burns, knobs that feel like wheels on a toy car, and it's dependent on an equally expensive drum machine for the proper use of the arp/ sequencer. You can expect more for your money for sure.
Hi Marc, I have a question for you. I have to choose between a ms-20 mini and a minibrute. Which one would you suggest me? thanks
hmm does this have pad point 56? i was on an older forum that had a mod for pwm. "gots to love dat internets?!"
Bit strange way to say you have ”delayed attack time”? As i see it that you INCREASED it. As i see that delaying something makes it take some time until that particular ”something” takes an effect. But increasing it just makes it rise slower, but it does still start immediately, ie. it is NOT delayed at all. And that sliding on higher notes might be because you had portamento time set higher than zero? Maybe? But other than that, good videos! Keep em coming.
man, go check out Martial Canterel play live. He will do things with an SH-101 that will blow you away. I never really thought much of them myself until I saw him play live for the first time. Sometimes it takes seeing someone really rock out an instrument to get you to be like, "oh....yeah! You can do THAT!!!"
Or if you still have it, connect it to the cv outs of a voyager and see if it tracks and triggers the same. Pweeze?
great video,thank you!
I thought you were going to break into the funky worm while tuning this up. Can you do a good "granny voice". I'm hoping this will be available through best buy dot com.
whew, that thing sounds nice!
im honestly not a huge fan of the sh-101, its alright for a couple things, but i prefer the minibrute to it for functionality (i also havent played with a 101 enough to know the sound difference) plus, i dont like comparing them, because they are very different machines in my opinion...
i'm getting nervous looking at that heavy-ass adapter/plug/cable combination. like it's just going to break off at the tip in the jack from all the weight.
My understanding is that it is Hz per volt. This will not inspire the Voyager to do its bidding!
Honestly, the oscillator is too weak on the minibrute to compare to an SH-101. Those murky expanses where the minibrute loses musicality and sounds like vip vip vip instead of the notes you're entering is not a common issue with an SH-101. From what I've heard the Eowave Magma sounds punchy and rubbery to make me think it's a 101 but the price point is high for what it is. I had three SH-101s when they where $500, now that they are $1700 I would love to see a good replacement.
h'es still waiting for a cheque from Elektron
Väntar också på min, tror jag är 12a i kön och de räknar med december :(
My names Marc Doty, reach over and give yourself!
Only free synthesizers, which are better than money :P
HA HA HA HA HA.
But seriously, that's not funny. I have never been given money for a demo.
I've lost count of how many times I've watched this video series, it's simply great. Also, it sort of makes it easier to keep waiting for my MS-20 Mini to actually arrive. Seriously, there are still 56 people ahead of me who haven't received their units, the store in question (which is a large store in Stockholm) has only received 6 (six) units to date =(
Here in the future, mine is coming next week! I agree that Marc is "simply great," & his videos definately make it easier to wait!! Cheers from the future!
Have you had an opportunity to play with the electron analog 4 yet? Its a bit of a beast in my humble opinion.
A good demonstration-explanation Marc! When I look to your demonstration and those knobs, it let me think on my Korg Delta.The Delta and the MS-20 were made in the Korg factory/ies at the same time for some years.So no wonder that we find something of the Delta in the MS-20 and vica versa.
i wonder if there are any popular mods for the original ms-20 that this will be receptive to? on another note i'm thinking it will be hilarious to run the korg ds-10 plus for nintendo dsi through the filters. that will neat bridge across the world of korg.
You sound a little bit like Jordan Schlansky.
I hear it now too :)
So you gonna buy one, Marc? That portamento sounds really "you" :)
Yeah man - agreed. Best place to learn how to use all the new crap we buy
I played with A4, and yes, it's a beast. By far the best analog synth for the money, and not only that, it has some clever unique features. But that doesn't make the MS20 mini less interesting...
I had a little session where I routed the cv/gate from a minibrute to a minitaur and routed the audio back to the minibrute. It was pretty cool to see the amp env, arpeggiator and lfo effect the oscillator of the minitaur and mix in with the filter, noise, and sub of the mb. As I played I would switch to the mb osc I'm cool now. It's good. :)
thanks Mark and PoLLasQue, I have a sh 101 and a polysix, and in this moment I wanna a new sinth for do basses, leads and atmospheres. If Minibrute is the sh101 of the 21 century I prefer take me in the first time the dark synth, and when I have money again buy the minibrute to return to the XXI century.
thanks again for the information
Would have been nice to have included this guy's email so we can ask him specific questions..
Thank you!
oh they will, they will...
The EG1 > Pitch doesn't "start at zero". Did you mean zero hertz? Regardless that explanation is incorrect. The EG pitch modulation sustains at whichever note you press and the intensity knob sets how far below that note that the EG modulation starts. You DO correct yourself later in the video.
The full range of EG pitch modulation that can be set by the intensity knob is like 59 semitones. It's a figure I've been meaning to retest though.
I find EG1's delayed start is most useful as a mod intensity control, specifically for vibrato via the tri LFO. Maybe you go over that in a later vid.
Are you saying that the EG starts at whatever frequency the keyboard generates? The envelope generator doesn't know what note you're pressing.
Seems you're misunderstanding my comment. Again EG1 SUSTAINS at whatever note you press. It's start position is offset below that note by the EG1 > Pitch Mod Intensity knob. The point is that the intensity knob is determining how far below the pressed note that the pitch starts gliding up from... You even demonstrate that later in the video.
Did you think the EG1 Pitch intensity knob was choosing an absolute start frequency independent of whatever note you play? That would be incorrect. For example you can make the EG1 to pitch start exactly an octave below whichever note you're pressing... you're NOT making it start at some specific frequency like 110Hz or something. (unless you play A3 220 while it starts an octave below obvs).
Certainly the keyboard defines the pitch of the oscillator... but the keyboard does NOT define the start point of the envelope.
The sustain is the voltage reached after the attack AND decay have done their thing. The sustain certainly defines a frequency, but it is NOT the start-point of the envelope.
"Certainly the keyboard defines the pitch of the oscillator... but the keyboard does NOT define the start point of the envelope."
Again the start point of EG1's effect on pitch is offset to whatever note you're playing. Do you disagreeing with that statement? The amount of offset gets further below the note you're playing the more you turn up EG1 Frequency Modulation. How much more clear can that explanation get? Are you confused by what I mean when I say offset?
If you turn the EG1 Frequency Modulation knob up and EG1 has some amount of delay, the MS-20 will initially emit a note that is below whatever note you're pressing on the keyboard. If you continue holding the note down in the keyboard it will eventually climb in pitch and sustain at the frequency that would have sounded had there been no EG modulation on pitch.
I have never given any other explanation other than those points right there. I'm trying to use plain english here. What part of that doesn't make sense? What I'm saying is 100% correct so you're either misinterpreting or misunderstanding what I wrote.
"The sustain is the voltage reached after the attack AND decay have done their thing. The sustain certainly defines a frequency, but it is NOT the start-point of the envelope."
We're talking about Envelope Generator 1 in this conversation, not the behavior of envelopes in general. EG1 doesn't have a sustain or decay parameter. If you were to compare it to an ADSR, EG1 would be functionally the same as an ADSR with full sustain. Decay wouldn't matter in that case. We don't need to lecture each other on envelopes. Keep your points germane to EG1's influence on Pitch.
Seriously try to point out where you think I'm misinterpreting something about the behavior of the MS-20.