I agree with you. If youre a gun guy, you know that Glock has their famous G19 platform and so many companies have copied it, made cheaper versions, made nicer versions. If it works, other companies hop on the trend. Like Polymer80, PSA, Shadow Systems, Agency Arms, and many more, all have copied the Glock platform. In the firearm community there never really is any debate on "oh you shouldn't buy that because its a Glock clone!". People buy what they can afford/ want. I think it would be nice to see more clones trying to be different though. Like with CHAB has zen pins and makes it different from the original. I think it would be cool if the clone companies would take the original design and make it their own a bit so its not a 1 to 1 replica.
Real JK stuff is pretty much as overpriced and underdelivering stuff you can buy at the moment... i've heard about cases where the clones held up much better and haven't lost the handle gap. I do agree on the whole counterfit vs just a clone topic... most people in the balisong community call everything a clone, even if it just mildly resembles it. The meaning of a clone is a 100% identical counterfit and people in the community just don't understand that... plus people claim that legit companies are losing money due to clones and i really don't see how that would be the case. Would like to hear your take on that aspect.
Interesting point on the real JK stuff. I have 0 experience with them but I have heard horror stories! I feel like the people who buy clones do so because they either can't afford the real thing, or the real thing is too difficult to come by, like a tsunami. I currently own and have owned several $500+ balis and I love them and have no issue paying that amount for them, I am however very blessed to be in a position to do that and a lot of folks aren't. If an 18 year old kid can't afford a serif, they're not buying one. So if they buy a clone, it's not taking money from machinewise. Just my opinion. At the end of the day people should do what they feel is right (and is legal) and not worry about others opinions.
The orca pinless should hold up just as good as a 42. They work the same way except the orca uses a zen nipple and the 42 uses a single tang but they ultimately function the same way. Plus the inside of the channel where it bounces, where there would be zen pins is instead titanium that wasn't milled out that acts as the zen pin which people can see in the video. I have flipped the hell out of mine for 3 months and still no gap decrease. It should hold up just fine
Hi thank you for your video! I had a chab before | sold it but I regretted it so I bought one. But the thickness of the blade seems thinner than my old one. Can you tell me what is the blade thickness on yours in mm? Thank you 🙏
The new blades on the latest baliplus tsunami trainers have the baliplus logo. They got rid of squids logo. I have the orca trainer and I feel you. The orca clone is just...really good. Such an awesome beater knife
Could you explain how the the Krake Raken is a better made knife than the Orca clone? I am new to flipping and just got an Orca clone and it is a very nice Bali to me. If the Krake Raken is aluminum I can't see how it is better if they both maintain similar tolerances.
All I mean is that the craftsmanship and quality of materials is better. The finish on the Krake Raken is of higher quality as well. The machining and edges are perfect and it is obvious when holding both which is more expensive. The orca is fantastic and flips almost as well as the krake IMO. For the money, it’s unbelievable how good of a balisong it is.
Also the krake raken bushings are a bit smoother and require absolutely no maintenance or tuning. I haven’t touched them once. The orca required minor tuning and loctite
Does the orca blade get damaged when it hits the handle? Because a pinless design seems like a bad idea when the handles are so much harder than the blade.
Handles are a lot softer than the blade... it's titanium against hardened steel if it was just normal mild still that would be different and it doesn't get damaged because the inside of the channel is milled like zen pins, so the blade doesn't just hit the inside of the handles
I have no problem with so-called morality. if there is someone (anyone) in this world who can produce a thing (knife, car or perfume) 5 times cheaper than the original and just as good, it means that the producer of the original does not respect his customers. I mean us. Why would we respect him??
I know it's late but a low price tag can imply that the blade is manufactured on the back of exploitative practices(like everything under capitalism but even more so) e.g. if I had a labor force of technically not but pretty much slaves then I could probably churn out reasonable quality knives(by copying others homework) at quantities and prices no ethical(ish) company could afford, that's more so the "morality" problem I'd have than it being counterfeit or copyright infringement. Ideally the price should be resonably proportional to the labor & materials or as close to without fucking over consumer or the worker which doesn't even exist in America where we are both getting fucked let alone countries with more laxed labor laws.
I’m not sure! I have an Atropos on the way and a couple other Atropos knives I need to do videos on. After I get all those videos maybe I’ll order one to do a video on. Thanks for the suggestion!
The main issues I see with clones is not that it’s copying, it’s IP theft which is illegal. For larger companies it’s somewhat drowned down by manufacturing capabilities and quantity and quality both being non issues, but most makers in the balisong community are independent and make most if not all of their money from making knives. It’s also disheartening to see your designs stolen by and produced by factories that can produce products much quicker and much cheaper. It’s like David vs Goliath except Goliath stole David’s sling and is now hurling stones at him much faster than David ever could’ve by himself. Sure they’re not as accurate but they’re faster and more of them hit David.
That's a great point and I agree! However, I believe that many people are unable to spend 300-500 dollars on the originals and most of the time they aren't actually available! But I do completely agree with you. Well said!
@@JacobD596 Second hand markets are getting much easier to purchase from and trading and buying for nicer grails is much easier. In addition to proxies and selling websites like bladebae, people temp trade to try new knives to see if they'd like them before buying, usually at meetups or through a pass around.
I agree with you. If youre a gun guy, you know that Glock has their famous G19 platform and so many companies have copied it, made cheaper versions, made nicer versions. If it works, other companies hop on the trend. Like Polymer80, PSA, Shadow Systems, Agency Arms, and many more, all have copied the Glock platform. In the firearm community there never really is any debate on "oh you shouldn't buy that because its a Glock clone!". People buy what they can afford/ want.
I think it would be nice to see more clones trying to be different though. Like with CHAB has zen pins and makes it different from the original. I think it would be cool if the clone companies would take the original design and make it their own a bit so its not a 1 to 1 replica.
Real JK stuff is pretty much as overpriced and underdelivering stuff you can buy at the moment... i've heard about cases where the clones held up much better and haven't lost the handle gap.
I do agree on the whole counterfit vs just a clone topic... most people in the balisong community call everything a clone, even if it just mildly resembles it.
The meaning of a clone is a 100% identical counterfit and people in the community just don't understand that... plus people claim that legit companies are losing money due to clones and i really don't see how that would be the case. Would like to hear your take on that aspect.
Interesting point on the real JK stuff. I have 0 experience with them but I have heard horror stories! I feel like the people who buy clones do so because they either can't afford the real thing, or the real thing is too difficult to come by, like a tsunami. I currently own and have owned several $500+ balis and I love them and have no issue paying that amount for them, I am however very blessed to be in a position to do that and a lot of folks aren't. If an 18 year old kid can't afford a serif, they're not buying one. So if they buy a clone, it's not taking money from machinewise. Just my opinion. At the end of the day people should do what they feel is right (and is legal) and not worry about others opinions.
The orca pinless should hold up just as good as a 42. They work the same way except the orca uses a zen nipple and the 42 uses a single tang but they ultimately function the same way. Plus the inside of the channel where it bounces, where there would be zen pins is instead titanium that wasn't milled out that acts as the zen pin which people can see in the video. I have flipped the hell out of mine for 3 months and still no gap decrease. It should hold up just fine
Hi thank you for your video! I had
a chab before | sold it but I
regretted it so I bought one. But
the thickness of the blade seems
thinner than my old one. Can you
tell me what is the blade
thickness on yours in mm? Thank
you 🙏
How has the CHAB clone held up?
The One just came out with a tsunami clone and it’s supposed to be phenomenal
Thanks for letting me know!!
I was thinking the same since I have mine coming
It is. Have it in fade
The new blades on the latest baliplus tsunami trainers have the baliplus logo. They got rid of squids logo. I have the orca trainer and I feel you. The orca clone is just...really good. Such an awesome beater knife
Good to know! I may have to order a tsunami.
I want to see an Orca Clone vs a Viper Clone, which one is better?
I think zen pins are better tbh so sometimes I get clones for that reason
Can original hardware be mounted on this Chab clone?
I do not know!
Could you explain how the the Krake Raken is a better made knife than the Orca clone? I am new to flipping and just got an Orca clone and it is a very nice Bali to me.
If the Krake Raken is aluminum I can't see how it is better if they both maintain similar tolerances.
All I mean is that the craftsmanship and quality of materials is better. The finish on the Krake Raken is of higher quality as well. The machining and edges are perfect and it is obvious when holding both which is more expensive. The orca is fantastic and flips almost as well as the krake IMO. For the money, it’s unbelievable how good of a balisong it is.
Also the krake raken bushings are a bit smoother and require absolutely no maintenance or tuning. I haven’t touched them once. The orca required minor tuning and loctite
Does the orca blade get damaged when it hits the handle? Because a pinless design seems like a bad idea when the handles are so much harder than the blade.
I never noticed any damage!
Handles are a lot softer than the blade... it's titanium against hardened steel
if it was just normal mild still that would be different
and it doesn't get damaged because the inside of the channel is milled like zen pins, so the blade doesn't just hit the inside of the handles
I have no problem with so-called morality. if there is someone (anyone) in this world who can produce a thing (knife, car or perfume) 5 times cheaper than the original and just as good, it means that the producer of the original does not respect his customers. I mean us. Why would we respect him??
I know it's late but a low price tag can imply that the blade is manufactured on the back of exploitative practices(like everything under capitalism but even more so) e.g. if I had a labor force of technically not but pretty much slaves then I could probably churn out reasonable quality knives(by copying others homework) at quantities and prices no ethical(ish) company could afford, that's more so the "morality" problem I'd have than it being counterfeit or copyright infringement. Ideally the price should be resonably proportional to the labor & materials or as close to without fucking over consumer or the worker which doesn't even exist in America where we are both getting fucked let alone countries with more laxed labor laws.
Does Slash2Gash ship to Europe? I haven't found any information about it...
I'm not sure! slash2gash.com/
Sup man, where did u buy the clone balisongs?
Slash2gash.com
Sry but the orca flips better then the krake raken lol
Especially when the kraken is a clone as well...
Will u get a madko by theone?
I’m not sure! I have an Atropos on the way and a couple other Atropos knives I need to do videos on. After I get all those videos maybe I’ll order one to do a video on. Thanks for the suggestion!
Interesting opinions ! I can agree
Man, you're saying "for a 170 bucks" like it's nothing, like it's 20 bucks xD
Ya but the real knive version cost 1200 and 370 so it kinda feels like 20 compared to that
The main issues I see with clones is not that it’s copying, it’s IP theft which is illegal. For larger companies it’s somewhat drowned down by manufacturing capabilities and quantity and quality both being non issues, but most makers in the balisong community are independent and make most if not all of their money from making knives. It’s also disheartening to see your designs stolen by and produced by factories that can produce products much quicker and much cheaper. It’s like David vs Goliath except Goliath stole David’s sling and is now hurling stones at him much faster than David ever could’ve by himself. Sure they’re not as accurate but they’re faster and more of them hit David.
That's a great point and I agree! However, I believe that many people are unable to spend 300-500 dollars on the originals and most of the time they aren't actually available! But I do completely agree with you. Well said!
@@JacobD596 Second hand markets are getting much easier to purchase from and trading and buying for nicer grails is much easier. In addition to proxies and selling websites like bladebae, people temp trade to try new knives to see if they'd like them before buying, usually at meetups or through a pass around.
nice