Anderson Mall, Anderson, SC | Detailed history of a struggling mall.

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  • Опубліковано 27 лют 2024
  • Anderson Mall in SC opened in 1972 and has faced numerous challenges over its lifetime. From anchor changes to tenant closures, Anderson Mall hangs on for dear life as a struggling mall.
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    Footage was filmed in early 2024.
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КОМЕНТАРІ • 112

  • @user-qv8vd8wu3y
    @user-qv8vd8wu3y 4 місяці тому +36

    When you showed a shot of the mall in 1986 and said you wished you could have seen one when they looked like that, I felt a pang of sorrow for you. I'm a gen Xer who graduated in 1986 and I worked in a couple of different stores in my local mall around then. It really was a different time. You could meet your friends, hang out and get an Orange Julius. Play some games, etc. It was a time long gone and yes, lots of brown tile lol. Thanks for your great work. It's appreciated.

  • @disturbingthepieces6395
    @disturbingthepieces6395 2 дні тому +3

    Mannnn...so many memories here. This was our middle school hangout spot & when I turned 18 I was the manager at the Arby's (closed down years ago) in 2002 before I moved for college 😂 good times. Makes me sentimental to see it like this now.

  • @loviedovie223344
    @loviedovie223344 12 годин тому

    I was just talking about this mall today and happened to get recommended this video! I still hope that it can come back because I loved going when I was younger

  • @heatherspeer2769
    @heatherspeer2769 4 місяці тому +9

    This is my hometown mall…really nice memories of it from when I was a kid. There was a fountain there that I loved!

  • @functionatthejunction
    @functionatthejunction 2 місяці тому +7

    This was my happy place. I havent seen it in decades, and I will never see it in person again, but in this place I'll always be young and it will always be a Saturday. You made an old man cry with this one, sir, and Im very thankful for it.

  • @blakev2365
    @blakev2365 13 годин тому

    I live here. It's crazy this I your most viewed video. Anderson mall has always been a struggle but it was amazing in the 90s. My grandma took me here for my school clothes and it was great back then.

  • @sushicat.3707
    @sushicat.3707 4 місяці тому +8

    I grew up in this area. Haywood Mall opened in Greenville in the early 80’s. None of the other area malls were the same after that. It was so much bigger than the others that it became the destination.

  • @reneastle8447
    @reneastle8447 4 місяці тому +5

    It's a good thing there'll be good people who can help struggling malls like this get back on top.

  • @TikisPlayhouse
    @TikisPlayhouse 2 дні тому

    Been in the town for 2 years now, hard to imagine this place was once booming.

  • @NorthCdogg22
    @NorthCdogg22 4 місяці тому +5

    Nice vid!! I really enjoyed your narration of the history, and showing us the little Easter eggs around the mall. Neat stuff!!

  • @jg85rocks
    @jg85rocks 7 днів тому +2

    Haven’t been to the Anderson Mall in probably 10+ years but went there to socialize some and buy cds and video games back in the late 90’s/early ‘00s. Spent a lot of quarters at the old Pocket Change arcade by the food court as a kid. Went shopping there a lot with my wife years ago too. Lot of memories at that place, glad to see it’s still hanging on as good as it is. Side note I always thought the old palmetto tree mall logo was supposed to be like the back part an old timey skeleton key, guess not 😀.

  • @amandastyles-uh6zx
    @amandastyles-uh6zx 4 місяці тому +6

    Out of all our malls haywood mall is still thriving and going strong❤❤

    • @gav3267
      @gav3267 4 дні тому +1

      Yeah Haywood mall seems to be more busy actually than in the past

  • @christopherjunkins
    @christopherjunkins Місяць тому +4

    I do recall the fountain at the Anderson Mall... sooo many coins tossed for wishes as a kid XD... the trees and lights... it was a great space, now it's just ... even with stores in it... It's dead... though Anderson Express is the BEST restaurant there, with the best food at a great price (except the ramune drinks)

  • @cobolsaurus
    @cobolsaurus 4 місяці тому +5

    I know how you feel. I was born in 1967, and I always felt like I had missed a lot of cool things since I wasn't alive in the 1950s and the first part of the 1960s, although I was very influenced by the 60s culture music-wise and otherwise. It is surprising to me that someone - you - yearns for a time when I was alive - the 70s, 80s, and 90s. I guess this thing happens to many of us.

  • @jakezepeda1267
    @jakezepeda1267 2 місяці тому +4

    Malls are depressing now. Westgate Mall out in Spartanburg has been around my whole life, and while I was never a mall-goer I still have lots of memories because my grandmother worked at Gordon's, which is no longer a store there.

    • @TheMallFox
      @TheMallFox  2 місяці тому +3

      I've recorded westgate and it will be a video in the future on my channel!

  • @iluvcamaros1912
    @iluvcamaros1912 День тому

    I bought a Michael Kors wool coat here at Dillards in October 2023. I actually went to Belks first because I try to support my favorite traditional southern department store, but they didn't have coats out yet...in late October? Am I weird, or is that weird? Dillards actually didn't have a huge selection out either. Anyway I occasionally do my part to keep it open. My parents both were big on Sears in the 90s and my mom always had a habit of parking at the Sears no matter where in the mall we were going. I can remember when it had fountains and plants still. Full of people thru the early 2000s. It was a disappointment when Simon sold it, because before that it felt like a baby Haywood that had solid support behind it. It has felt a lot more precarious ever since.

  • @Sleepysnorlax1
    @Sleepysnorlax1 9 днів тому +1

    I grew up in Greenville SC (a few miles from Anderson). This looks just like the malls we had as a kid. Never this empty though.
    Surprising how much things have changed since 80’s/90’s. I can remember avoiding malls during holidays cause they were too packed with people. Not being able to find a spot to park. I don’t know how they stay in business like this.

  • @socksal
    @socksal 4 місяці тому +4

    Spent a lot of time here in high school. It was thriving then.

  • @Drakey_Fenix
    @Drakey_Fenix 4 місяці тому +3

    Never been to that mall, but just looking at it makes me feel nostalgic.

    • @VrantusOfficial
      @VrantusOfficial 3 дні тому

      I see. I am from anderson. And we are REAL close to that mall. I as a kid, used to go there a lot and i would be jumping around and looking at each store, wondering what it was. And now being grown up, i feel younger in some way from seeing it.

  • @earthprimescott
    @earthprimescott 4 місяці тому +7

    First off, I want to say thank you for this video. I worked at various stores in the Anderson Mall for a little over twenty years. It's nice to see someone document the place without trash talking it. Those walls hold countless stories that played themselves across my teenage years, twenties and thirties. Sometimes it's feels like I'm the only one who remembers, but this video makes me feel a little less like a ghost. You do us an honor.

    • @duncanburns9645
      @duncanburns9645 Місяць тому

      Do you know what was in the separate building in the parking lot behind the movie theater? Looks like it was torn down the same time the theater was to build dillards.

    • @earthprimescott
      @earthprimescott Місяць тому

      ​​@duncanburns9645 it was a Bingo Parlor when it was shut down. I'm not sure if that's what it started as though.

    • @TheMallFox
      @TheMallFox  21 день тому

      @@duncanburns9645 Originally, this was an Ingles Grocery Store, and it ended life as a Bingo Hall. Seems to have been built at or around the same time as the mall, it was there previous to the 1984 expansion.

  • @GregoryAlanBaileygamereviews
    @GregoryAlanBaileygamereviews 4 місяці тому +3

    Thanks for giving us a look at a mall that I never would've seen had you not posted this video. Reminds me a bit of Merle Hay Mall here in Des Moines.

  • @gav3267
    @gav3267 4 дні тому

    Great video bro! I’m 18 and have been to this mall literally countless times. From getting Chinese food on Sunday afternoons to going with my friends and laughing as they try to get in the kiddy rides and even buying my graduation shirt at the Dillards. While unsurprising it’s been very interesting to see the decline. I’ll sometimes go just to see if BAM got any new action figures and just walk around for half an hour taking it in. Just a couple more interesting things to note - There use to be a bungee jumping thing right in the middle of the food court. Recently it’s started closing at like 7 on Friday nights. I’m pretty sure that spot by the gym has gone through multiple different stores in the last year or two (sounds like I’m being dramatic but it seems like every third time a go it’s a different store) anyway… great video bro it was amazing to see the history of a place pretty significant to me

  • @jmd76family
    @jmd76family 4 місяці тому +6

    Dragon Den was up front with original arcade

  • @Jose-fq1lj
    @Jose-fq1lj 6 днів тому +1

    Wow this was some strong nostalgia. I grew up in the Anderson area and still live in the next county over. I remember when I was a kid I'd go the mall to go to Software ETC before it became a GameStop. I also remember loving going to the arcade. As I got older I would go to Hot Topic, American Eagle, and radio shack. I actually worked at Sears for about a year while going to Tri-County Tech. That was about 5 or 6 years before they closed. I can't remember the last time I went. I'm pretty sure it was pre COVID. Thanks for making the video. It was cool to hear some of the history I didn't know about.

  • @bumblebee4me4ever
    @bumblebee4me4ever 7 днів тому +1

    If it wasn't for this mall, I would literally not exist right now. My parents met at the arcade in the mall on Halloween in the 70s. I can remember visiting the toy store near the old RadioShack and Sears, and taking home a few. There used to be an ice cream shop where the (new, now defunct) Chick Fil A is/was, and I can remember eating Superman ice cream there. I want to say there was another kids fashion show around 2006/2007 as I participated in that for Belk. I even had a family member that owned a shop in the mall in the early 00s. Thank you for this video!

  • @CaptainLamb6
    @CaptainLamb6 Місяць тому +1

    I go here sometimes lol, I enjoy the somewhat empty mall aesthetic, walking around when it’s chilly inside and has only a few people walking around makes those trips to Anderson mall the best ones

  • @churrocapitan9380
    @churrocapitan9380 4 місяці тому +3

    I miss the planters and fountains that used to be in the malls. It introduced natural elements and gave you places to sit for a bit and talk with friends/family.

  • @digitalfrisc0
    @digitalfrisc0 4 місяці тому +3

    Appreciate the narration of this video. Never heard of this mall as I am from California but it looked like it went through it's prime when malls were booming. Really enjoyed those photos you took near the end of the video which gave that liminal feel. Gave me nostalgia even if I never set foot in this mall. At least you took some videos/photos before any other major changes or demolishing happens. Hopefully they find a way to make use of the property without having to rid of it.
    Thanks for sharing!

  • @vistatiger7493
    @vistatiger7493 4 місяці тому +2

    I remember when that mall was just the front wing between JCPenney and Dillards. Meyers/Arnold was where Dillards is now. The former Meyers/Arnold store became Uptons in the 90's and then a Belk Men's/Childrens store before it was torn down for Dillards.

  • @marvalcomicsfan123
    @marvalcomicsfan123 6 днів тому +1

    I remember going to the Gamestop that used to be in there for years. I believed the first thing we bought in there was a Playstation 1 and a copy of Spyro the Dragon. This was some time in the early 2000s before the PS2 had come down in price. Before it closed, the last thing I bought from there was a copy of LA Noire on release day. After a few weeks, it closed down shortly after. I still go to this mall almost any chance I get and usually go shop at the Game Cache, the game store you passed by when walking to the old Sears entrance. They got a nice selection of new and retro games. If you go again to this mall, you should check them out.

    • @TheMallFox
      @TheMallFox  5 днів тому

      @marvalcomicsfan123 this is actually the sole reason I went to the mall. I used to stop in there and browse their stuff, bought a DS lite from them. I hope they can stick around, they've been there since 2019.

    • @marvalcomicsfan123
      @marvalcomicsfan123 5 днів тому +1

      @TheMallFox From what the owner has told me, business is doing good, so I think they will be around for a long time.

  • @nathanhenderson353
    @nathanhenderson353 4 місяці тому +3

    I'm glad you didn't call this property a dead mall in the video name. Seems people nowadays are willing to throw that term up very loosely even if a mall is still doing decently.
    I have been to the Anderson Mall a few times due to having relatives in the area- with my most recent visit being in May 2023. Having been to nearly 100 malls myself (Random Retail on Flickr), I'd still classify this a 'B' mall- for now. It still has the typical mall chain mid-tier brands you expect. Having small local businesses isn't necessarily a bad thing as long as they plan to operate long term. Kohan has a horrible track record of letting malls they own fall into disrepair, so chances are rather high though that this property could slip and perhaps even go into a freefall at some point. However, if the property has a good manager, it could hang on a little while longer.

  • @gwgux
    @gwgux 4 дні тому

    Never been there, but the look of it feels like other malls I've been to where there's history in the building. I guess all malls have history, but not all of them have a building that just feels different. It's hard to explain, but that's what I thought of when I saw the building.

  • @margaretclick2125
    @margaretclick2125 11 днів тому

    Sad to see the Mall so lifeless. Years ago I worked at the mall for a short time. It was a busy lively place. The food court was a good place to meet up with friends. Also a great place to walk for exercise in bad weather. I miss it.

  • @PatKingDoesThings
    @PatKingDoesThings 4 місяці тому

    Dude so glad I came across your channel. I’ve been wanting to get into this and you inspired me to actually do it. Great vids!

  • @crazyadventuresandreviews
    @crazyadventuresandreviews 4 місяці тому +2

    I did a video of this mall a couple weeks ago, u did a better job. It’s a nice mall my favorite in the state

  • @steves_retail
    @steves_retail 4 місяці тому +2

    Awesome video bro!

  • @sunsetrecords2548
    @sunsetrecords2548 4 місяці тому +2

    Great Video!

  • @jerrysanders9101
    @jerrysanders9101 4 місяці тому

    Good work with this video bud, 🎉thanks!

  • @SnitchGaang0
    @SnitchGaang0 4 місяці тому

    Awesome video I moved to SC in 2015 and for the first year I lived in the Hudson Apartments right near that mall and remember going into that Sears along with the Kmart that was in Anderson before Kmart shut down.

  • @RetroManVideos
    @RetroManVideos 4 місяці тому +1

    Appreciate this very well done video! Just subbed.

  • @lambo485
    @lambo485 4 місяці тому +2

    nice vid:)....ive been to this mall in my trips:)

  • @realistic.skate.
    @realistic.skate. 4 місяці тому +1

    Very very high quality man ❤

  • @SamtheBravesFan
    @SamtheBravesFan 7 днів тому

    Yeah I remember from when I was a kid how busy it used to be. Loved going to the arcade. Books-A-Million and the Lids store is still good to go to. Dillard's and JCPenny is probably what keeps it going.

  • @Dezeberbro
    @Dezeberbro Місяць тому +1

    You should do the Spartanburg, SC mall. Even thought it was just purchased and might get new life breathed into it.

    • @TheMallFox
      @TheMallFox  Місяць тому +1

      This one is in my backlog :)

  • @furious3383
    @furious3383 3 місяці тому +1

    Great Documentary.

  • @vonDumpy
    @vonDumpy 21 день тому +1

    Many dates were had at this mall during my high school/college years

  • @creeps4lulz
    @creeps4lulz 4 місяці тому

    Great video and detail. Keep it up

  • @jaynelson8450
    @jaynelson8450 4 місяці тому

    Well-done! I'd love to see a similar video for Northwoods Mall in North Charleston, SC! It's still pretty busy at times, not quite dead, but I'd kill to see an early history of the mall I grew up with. :)

  • @jopiaspieder1184
    @jopiaspieder1184 4 місяці тому +2

    I miss Anderson Mall I went there alot, but once the arcade was gone it went downhill.

  • @themobilemage2137
    @themobilemage2137 2 місяці тому +1

    I remember this mall, from the '80s and '90s. I lived over in Georgia but my family and I went here to shop and hang out. I'm sad to see it's declined. But, with people having far less disposable income....

  • @reizendecamera
    @reizendecamera 4 місяці тому

    Nice video, I live in the Netherlands and thought JCPenny was bankrupt for several years. Nice to see there are still some stores of JCP.

  • @furious3383
    @furious3383 3 місяці тому

    I’m surprised that more screens weren’t added for the theaters.

  • @RyanPennington87
    @RyanPennington87 4 місяці тому +2

    Good content

  • @charlestonpinballarcade
    @charlestonpinballarcade 4 місяці тому +6

    Just a heads up, as more malls keep closing …. Traveling out of state to the ones that are left can be very time and money consuming. Please make sure to grab some other content (retail or roadside attractions) along your travels for your content backlog. You can work on editing all that great stuff when you burn out on malls.

    • @TheMallFox
      @TheMallFox  4 місяці тому +3

      Ill keep this in mind as a potential thing to do

  • @ZOMBIEGUNPOWDER
    @ZOMBIEGUNPOWDER 3 місяці тому

    I am from anderson sc, born and raised. Currently 26 years old. there used to be a gamestop inside the anderson mall.

    • @TheMallFox
      @TheMallFox  3 місяці тому

      Yup, its where Lids Is now, was Software ETC for a while, then it became gamestop.

  • @salvation2979
    @salvation2979 4 місяці тому +7

    It’s an absolute shame. We have become a lazy, online amazon shopping society with no public social skills.

    • @nole8923
      @nole8923 4 місяці тому

      It’s not the internet. Malls are dying because of many reasons but the two biggest reasons are
      1. The decimation of our once great middle class.
      2. Decades of neglecting our infrastructure has made going to a mall a pain that will consume most of your day because of traffic congestion.
      Mainstream media uses the internet as an excuse to cover for their Wall Street buddies who caused this.

    • @nole8923
      @nole8923 4 місяці тому +2

      This is weird. I replied and UA-cam shows I replied but my actual reply doesn’t show up.

    • @nole8923
      @nole8923 4 місяці тому +1

      Anyway here’s what my original reply was.
      It’s not the internet. That’s the excuse mainstream media tries to sell us to cover for their Wall Street buddies. Malls are dying for many reasons but the two biggest reasons are
      1. The decimation of our once great middle class
      2. Decades of neglect of our infrastructure has made getting to and from the mall a pain that will consume most of your day. This is because of traffic congestion and horrible planning by state and local governments.
      I order from Amazon not because I want to but because Walmart stuff sucks and the mall is a pain in the arse to get to.

    • @horseathalt7308
      @horseathalt7308 4 місяці тому

      @@nole8923 YT is censoring free speech! It's happening to almost everyone that has a viewpoint
      that doesn't agree with TPTB.

    • @thewiseowl8804
      @thewiseowl8804 4 місяці тому

      @@nole8923This happens to me too now.

  • @charlestonpinballarcade
    @charlestonpinballarcade 4 місяці тому +4

    Great video! Again, you have a good tone for voiceovers. The video and images make it seem like the mall is well lit. Is it actually well lit or is your camera boosting the light?
    I still haven’t made it up to this mall, but should get there before Kohan totally ruins it.

    • @TheMallFox
      @TheMallFox  4 місяці тому +2

      the mall is decently well lit. The footage was filmed at night and it certainly isnt dark in there. The camera will boost the light a little bit, but it isnt a thing in this case.

  • @adriantallent8557
    @adriantallent8557 2 дні тому

    Heyyy, it's my mall! I wouldn't call it a dead mall, though it did go through a really rough patch during the War on Terror years. It's...hanging in there? They have more bespoke stores using a lot of the empty spaces now...so-called 'mom&pop' shops instead of national retailers, which is probably how it's going to be going forward. It's location in town means it's not a bad retail space, though most of the more modern retail draws are further up the road.

  • @zero64734
    @zero64734 4 місяці тому +4

    you should check out greenwood mall

    • @TheMallFox
      @TheMallFox  4 місяці тому +2

      I've been several times and I think it'll be a video on the channel at some point!

  • @JayLiszte
    @JayLiszte 2 місяці тому +1

    It’s funny how the only stores I think actually make money are Books and million, Bath and body works, and hot topic. It’s the most random 3 stores that actually have some business.
    Also props to Jcpenny for sticking around.

  • @crazyao3896
    @crazyao3896 19 годин тому

    this is my local mall... I stopped going there after the shooting in 2022.

  • @charlieperez5017
    @charlieperez5017 4 місяці тому

    If you’re ever in Fort Worth, Texas. We have another dead mall called the Ridgemar Mall.

  • @SRW_
    @SRW_ 4 місяці тому

    Beautiful mall

  • @gianpolignano2632
    @gianpolignano2632 4 місяці тому +1

    What can be done to bring Anderson Mall back to its former glory?

  • @schonkable
    @schonkable 4 місяці тому

    I've been to this mall before, and honestly it was never as bad as I thought it would be.

  • @shaunhaselton
    @shaunhaselton 4 дні тому

    my hometown mall

  • @TravisDoesKayakFishing
    @TravisDoesKayakFishing 4 дні тому

    As a resident, they need to do something drastastic. Use half the lot as a jocky lot or something. Anything to draw people and businesses in.

  • @marsy_mcmarsface
    @marsy_mcmarsface 5 днів тому

    IIRC, a man was shot and killed right at the window at the Joe Muggs. Everyone around me just thinks of violence now and are scared to shop there. When I was a kid I took karate there. The only time I visit there now is to go to The Game Cache.

  • @ethanmyers4882
    @ethanmyers4882 4 місяці тому

    I really enjoy our Anderson mall I don’t get to go as much as id like whether that’s schedule or me just forgetting about it but yeah the book store is phenomenal I’d hate if it closed

  • @amandastyles-uh6zx
    @amandastyles-uh6zx 4 місяці тому +1

    Thank god i live in the state i do where we have successful businesses and repurpose old ones that people loved going to!! #upstatesouthcarolina

  • @amandastyles-uh6zx
    @amandastyles-uh6zx 4 місяці тому +1

    You should check out westgate mall in Spartanburg sc!

  • @nole8923
    @nole8923 4 місяці тому +3

    It seems UA-cam is a little sensitive if you mention W-all S-treet in a comment. It mysteriously gets deleted.

    • @horseathalt7308
      @horseathalt7308 4 місяці тому

      The sparkling grape juice crowd disapprove and control most mass media and social media.

  • @jimmybeans6029
    @jimmybeans6029 2 дні тому

    You should do the one in Spartanburg, it's practically the same and just got sold.

    • @TheMallFox
      @TheMallFox  2 дні тому

      I have this one recorded, and its been highly requested, so it'll show up on my channel this year!

  • @benb8407
    @benb8407 4 місяці тому

    Glad to see that the mall isn't in decline with a leaky roof or dirty floors I'll give slumlord Kohan that they keep the malls clean they also own the mall where I live The Crossroads mall in Kazoo MI. Good to see Anderson Mall doing alright with the national brands and some local mom & pop stores. I like the UA-cam videos that give the history of the malls that will be gone in the next decade or 2.

  • @apickle8458
    @apickle8458 4 місяці тому +1

    More, please! I'd appreciate more info on the Things That Were Here. Like, what's that Asian-style peaked tile roof jutting out there? Chinese restaurant?

    • @TheMallFox
      @TheMallFox  4 місяці тому +1

      I'd love to do a follow up video one day discussing some of the Former stores. I have info on that kind of stuff. Food Court tenants, what major brands left with the Pandemic, and etc.
      By the way, the Shingle roof store by Sears is a classic Hollister design. 😊

  • @drknstodstny4141
    @drknstodstny4141 Місяць тому

    Social media killed the malls. People used to come together. Now people just log on together. I would gladly pay more to shop at a mall from the times of way back when.

  • @AudiophileTommy
    @AudiophileTommy 2 місяці тому

    In 2 more years the Anderson mall will be a hub for Damn Amazon delivery drivers 🎉🎉🎉🎉

  • @bradye21playsIndieHorror
    @bradye21playsIndieHorror 4 місяці тому

    Kohan? It's doomed...

  • @igsfilmsupstate
    @igsfilmsupstate 4 місяці тому

    I filmed my zombie film there in June of 2023

  • @clarky417
    @clarky417 4 місяці тому +1

    may i suggest Waterfront Dining as background music for mall videos. WallieB26 uses this group. it fits.

  • @PTE-e2n
    @PTE-e2n 4 місяці тому

    O QUE DEVERIA ESTAR FUNCIONANDO?É O JAMESTOWN MALL CINE 14
    E NÃO ESSE!!!
    REALMENTE OS AMERICANOS SÃO ESTRANHOS!

  • @igenszia
    @igenszia 4 місяці тому

    hot fr

  • @cobolsaurus
    @cobolsaurus 4 місяці тому

    When were you born?

    • @TheMallFox
      @TheMallFox  4 місяці тому

      I'm a Gen Z so I missed out on the golden era of malls.

  • @AgentLazarus
    @AgentLazarus Місяць тому

    Dude Anderson itself SUCKS. No wonder the mall is garbage

  • @user-kj1mz3dk5o
    @user-kj1mz3dk5o 3 місяці тому

    Great job ... Come on every body let's go to the mall lllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll....