Funnier yet that the ones who demand to be tolerated. Are the ones calling these people up and making death threats. Forget the business. These people sought to devour the Christians. That's what they do. They didn't go to another bakery, they didn't ask a Muslim baker or a Jewish baker. It's sad its gross. He didn't deny making them a cake. He just didn't want to make a homosexual cake. He offered to make something else with another message on it. Because of that they threaten and ruined his life. Shame on them.
laynn 10 we unwilling to tolerate being treated unfairly, so we will refuse to show tolerance to those who do not show us or our freedom any kind of respect.
He didn’t refuse to sell them a product, he refused to create artwork that went against his beliefs. No one should be forced to create something that violates their own ethics.
But the artwork on the cake is part of the product. & whist I agree he has a right to choose who he does his artwork for, he doesn’t have a right to deny service based on sexual orientation. If the court rule in the bakers favour & sets a precedence. Where will it end? Will a paramedic be allowed to discriminate against a patient because their lifestyle or religion etc is against their beliefs? Whilst I feel for the couple who feel they’ve been discriminated against, It’s just a cake. All this couple had to do was go & get a cake from another bakery.
Then don’t open a business. If you want to be an artist then make paintings / cakes at home . Don’t open a buissnsss and then shut down someone because you believe that some man in the sky said it was wrong”
Michael Weiss he didn't want to sell a product. That's why.They should have bought a nice cake from him, like he offered ,and put the two men symbol on top of it by them selves. But they didn't want to, they had to sue him.He has a right to practise his religion ,it's his legal right.Try asking a pastor or rabbi or mullah to wed two men or women. Some might do it, most wouldn't.
Actually, if the bakery specifically offers custom wedding cakes, that's the catch. If you offer it to one, you have offer it to all. If you don't, that's discrimination. Now, they say they don't offer Halloween cakes because of thier Christian values. That is totally legal because they aren't offering Halloween cakes to only certain groups. Their simple solution would be a sign saying they specialize in Christian wedding cakes. At that point, their covered because they aren't offering wedding cakes as a general practice. That being said, i don't agree with their stance. And i wouldn't operate a business that way. Money is money. But, if you offer a specific service, custom decorated wedding cakes, you can't withhold that service based on gender, age, race or religion; unless you are specifically only offering Christian wedding cakes. Now that being said. This couple shouldn't rely on Uncle Sugar to be their bully. They should have been polite and said cool, I'll take my money and business elsewhere and let others know. Uncle Sugar is not the solution to every problem.
Bottom line is he has the right to say no to any request imo. I'm against anything alcohol/drug related so I wouldn't make a cake depicting the use of either. Does that mean I'm discriminating against drugs/alcohol? Find another cake maker.
GoldenEra 4ever You can refuse, but you subject yourself to potential lawsuit. Legally speaking you refusing to provide a service based on someone else practices or personality which is basically discrimination. Judges and lawyers see things through a legal lens. It's not about if you're a nice guy or not?
+Brad B. By the looks of things. He isnt a a bad guy. He's following the rules of his religion and his belief to a T. You say he is half witted because he doesnt want to partake in something that he doesnt believe in. You can force, tolerance, but you cant force acceptance. It's the same with racism and sexism. Also, assuming he's stupid or half witted makes you appear childish. Picking on a man who cant defend himself.
Yeah, the legal argument she is making is a slippery slope argument. The fact is, in all other civilized nations discriminating based on sexuality is illegal, that doesn't mean a leftwing speechwriter is ever forced to create speeches for right-wingers. For your beliefs to be taken seriously as a genuine basis for discriminating against gays you first have to: A). demonstrate god's existence. B) Demonstrate that your beliefs is in accordance with his belief. +Terrell Williams I disagree if he were following the rules to a T, and being consistent he would be turning people down who eat shellfish. He also looks like he's wearing mixed threads which are prohibited under the Abrahamic God's law. This is why his argument is very stupid because he's unable to act consistently within his own religious dogmas, and basically using it as a shield for his bigotry...
Okay, but now expand that to it's extreme. If the law sides with that baker here, and the socity all holds the same views, now that person can't get a cake because of who they are.
Patti Thompsett But still if everyone held the same views then they wouldn’t be able to get a wedding cake anywhere where as heterosexuals would be treated with a lot more respect. Respect and serve others regardless of their sexuality.
Monique White you ate disgusting if you encourage discriminating against a group of people doing absolutely no harm to you. Religion can not be used as a smoke screen to be a horrible person.
JJ that is the most ridiculous comment I’ve ever seen!!! All those ‘examples’ you gave, were things that were harmful. The KKK?? a woman MOLESTED by a priest??? Those examples are ludicrous because they actually meant harm to people. Homosexuals are did no harm to you, did they?
Bryan Phillips What messaging is involved in the tasks of a Dr? Since when do hospitals heal you with art? In what way does a Dr violate their religious beliefs to care for someone? Both are bad examples. To be a proper example it would have to violate: 1. Freedom of speech 2. Freedom of religion 3. Freedom of association Like a muslim seamstress forced to make a baptismal gown. Or a catholic graphic designer forced to design an ad for an atheist group. It’s compelled speech that violates your religious beliefs.
I see the point you’re trying to make but a Muslim owner restaurant wouldn’t have pork in the first place (if the business model is targeted towards Muslims), and if they did then it would mean they’d be willing to sell pork.
If you can prove that you were not provided service based on race, religion, sexuality, that is illegal. If a bar doesn't allow a drunkard in that's fine. But they can't refuse service to every black person who tries to enter.
@The Christian he did nothing wrong. He has a right to refuse service and homosexuals can just go to another place to get their cake. What’s so hard about that???
I agree and don’t agree. He doesn’t state that his bakery is a religious establishment as far as I know so that makes it very different. Whatever you do sell you should sell to everybody. A kosher restaurant and bakery should sell their kosher products regardless of sexual orientation.
@@mylifepostpain3705 He never refused to make them a cake, he just refused to put a certain design on it. The guy said he'd make them a cake, but there was certain artwork that he'd be uncomfortable putting on the cake.
The couple is after the money! Its plain and simple. They can go to another baker but they insisted and pressured the Philips to go against his religious conviction.
Nope. Colorado law doesn't allow them to collect a cent. It's not nice to commit false witness. The only remedies allowed by the law are injunctive - like court orders. This bakery was punished by Colorado ordering it to: (i) cease and desist from violating the law; (ii) educate its employees about the law; and (iii) file quarterly reports for a 2-year period (which expired a couple of years ago) detailing all instances of refusal of service. That's it. Here's the decision (see p. 4): www.aclu.org/legal-document/craig-and-mullins-v-masterpiece-cakeshop-commissions-final-order
It broke my heart when hearing how the community would sent death threats to his wife and they lost up to 40% of profits. These people have gone too far.😓
Exactly yet God forbid it happens to them, then the whole world must stand still? Such hypocrisy. I really have lost all respect for the LGBT community
@@Angeloflight7 Did you ever really have any? And if you're talking about toleration, it is plain stupid and a move backward to tolerate intolerance and that is exactly the backward mentality you portrait. Do you even understand what it is you're saying? The only hypocrisy you could possibly see is in a mirror.
@Ethan Hobigant Roche lol dude I'm not even American so I don't even understand ur rant but each to their own. The truth shall be revealed very soon. I just pray you receive it and have your eyes opened. God bless you
Why wud you want to give your business to someone that didnt agree with your lifestyle anyways?......take it somehwere else....and all would be good.he has the right to refuse service.
Rebecca Brown we CAN NOT nor will we follow laws that go against God's laws, proof is all around you, everything was made by Him, even you and me, im not trying to convince you of this truth, niether does that make He who made all things not exist, its the truth, and truth does not always make others happy, people like to be lied to, (to make them feel better about themselves) but lieng to make someone feel better is not loving
I am a member of the lgbt community and if this were me I would simply say, “okay” and go to another cake shop. I find it unfair to force the artist to make something is they do not want to.
I agree he has this right.... Those guys are hurt but they can go to other shops...me I believe in karma...but we should respect others belief...there is a place for everyone....such as bad and good guys... The cake man is a nice guy...like the couple
Well, that's the problem. The marginalized are supposed to just grin and bear it when bigots exercise their hatred. But the hate and exclusion remains. Its time for the hateful to bear the brunt of their hate.
Yeah, when you are denied to live in an apartment building, or a job, or participate in events, hum, then I would call that discrimination. Resolved would to be get rid of religion! Stop the madness people. Follow the law of LOVE and then problem solved. Not crazy dogma that is set up by man/woman who says it is religion. Wow, the brain washing that has been going on for centuries!
William Rogers, who made the law of love? Brain washing? You don't realize you already have your own belief and your own religion. Get rid of your own religion first.
You don't get it. The way you make an absolute statement and the way you emphasize your own belief makes you really look like you have own religion. You do have your own religion!!
I’m in two minds. He should be able to follow his religious beliefs but he shouldn’t be able to deny a product just because someone or in this case two people are gat
Hey I know how Christians behave ok, It's just a dame 🎂 Jesus said when you love one another you'll be know as my disciples simple as that, I think Christians must read their bibles cause they are judging and that's not the will of GOD just remember our relationship with God is personal, the great commission is go share the gospel not judge. Please do not react like religious act as a child of GOD.
@@southwestlondonerbrown2737 He didn't deny a product. He just refused to provide his services to give them a finished product. They were offered ANYTHING else in the store, but they chose to go after him anyway. It became more about principle then the cake.
@@jesst1306 sound like gentil pretending to do the right thing using our LORD name and word uh..? Just think about this what is the difference ÷ you " Gods people " and the LGBT.... People? And I want you think about this because God told me that when I was trying to do the right think but I was judging people, and of course my first reaction was puuffff obio God, .... But He told me the way you are describing this person for who he is what he did you be came like him, so theres no diference ÷ him and you then He make me think deeply and I say yes LORD you are right, I'm sorry. So what I learned is that I wouldn't think highly fo me just because I am saved because I'm the LORD people, or just because " I know the truth". There's a lot to learn dear sis, we do not know the truth completely yet, really just think about who is JESUS how he act and aprouch situations, I think he shares his love to every body so yes He would make that 🎂. For God's love just be who God wants you to be. But I cant blame you fir everything, God has a purpose in our life and he do unimaginable things just to see our reaction and see who we are and give you a chance over and over just to teach us and open our 💕 👀 and learn to see people the way He sees people.
Doll Steak but you gotta think real. There is no “if”so that’s it. I know your just saying but did it happen? No. Is it a situation that could happen? yes, but it didn’t. Okay? :)
Larry 306 Then you shouldn't be a baker, and wouldn't for much longer. There's a difference between freedom of choice and denying business to someone due to prejudice. That is not allowed. Do you enjoy living in ignorance or....?
Brianna Gordy yea you should force him to make things he doesn't want to,,,we are such a great country....... we should force people to do things that are right i mean this is stupid he hurt their feelings and that is sad he shouldn't be allowed to own a business if he doesn't agree with them..... thank god and the gays we have women like you......
He probably won't (make cakes) for much longer either. His business has suffered due to his prejudiced attitude; God has nothing to do with it. Where is his God now?!? Yeah, that's what I thought...
+mk Silly except he doesn't. A bakery (of any kind) is a PUBLIC (For all) accommodation, service cannot legally be denied in Public (Not private) accommodations for any reason not related to safety or the breaking of laws in relation to the business. - There is also specific groups protected from discrimination outside of that, 23 states include LGBT individuals in that list. - The state this bakery was in included in that list of 23 states. Simply put: No he doesn't, and the court has affirmed that on all levels. The challange to the supreme court isn't even that that law should change, it's that Wedding cakes would be considdered Art, not an accommodationary object. (as it is now), which has been attempted before without success. Why? Just because something contains art, doesn't mean the purpose of said object is Art. A painting, can be made using food, and it'll still be a painting. A piece of food can be made with decorative Art(s), but it'll still be a food.
I kind of agree with the bakers. I mean if I'm a doctor I shouldn't be forced to perform an abortion, right? And it seems like he was nice. He didn't say you can't purchase smthg. here....he just said I have certain beliefs and I choose not to make one for you. Why don't they just get cake at another bakery?
re2dance you are right. I run a Mexican restaurant. I don't like serving smug, White people at my business. It goes against my basic principles and ethics. Bye, bye 🙋🏽♂️
And if all the bakeries in the state "exercise" the same "religious belief" and discriminate, THEN WHAT? The happy couple can fly to New York to get a cake?
We'll make you a deal. Show me a state where every single baker in a medium sized city refuses such a service, then we'll talk. Until then, it is a straw man fallacy.
@@bohemiangod3658 problem? What r u talking about? There is no problem! Should I whine and cry over not being able to buy a TV at McDonald’s and sue them instead of just going to best buy or something?! Cakeshop is a private owned business that’s allowed to sell what they want as long as it’s not illegal items.
no, the point is the couple came in and asked him to do a service he does not provide and instead of going to another bakery they tried to strong-arm him into giving them what they wanted this is a violation of freedom of speech. no one is entitled to your services since you are a private corporation you are allowed to serve who you want.
he stuck to his intolerance in a behaviour Jesus would have said to him.....are you serious - saying you are a christian (in my name) and treating this couple in this way - have i taught you nothing???. If the bible has taught us nothing else, and it hasnt, its that you should make cakes for homosexual couples.
@JaniahOnfroy would you defend that? If he said his religion called for that discrimination, would you accept it? What if it was a Jewish person who said they didn't wanna serve Christians. Would you defend that?
Exactly! Freedom is for everybody but they want it for them only refusing to be bullied and yet bullying others for their choices! what kind of logic is that
What if he doesn't want to serve you or your child because of your color? Your gender? Were do you draw the line?Is there no line? So if you have a child birthday party at a place, it would be ok for the company to pick and choose who to serve among the children?
Its his own shop.. whats the freakin' problem... its his loss in income, so he can do whatever he wants... When he's a die hard New York Knicks fan and doesnt wanna put a Boston Celtics Logo on a cake its his right to do so...
Yes but if he sells the cake in exchange for a remuneration as a result of the service he provides, he needs to be consistent and also abide by the law. If you're not a supporter of Trump and you're asked to bake a cake with his face and MAGA on it, is it ok to refuse the customer that service because you don't approve of Trump? I think the main issue they are concerned about is that this can lead to extreme discriminatory practices.
That's a design based refusal and it's not discrimination. If the baker for example refused to make that Celtics logo cake, that is where you could argue a free speech right. It's also not discrimination because he wouldn't make that cake for anyone who walked into his shop no matter who they were.
My husband has faced similar challenges. He is an artist and sometimes people asked him to do illustration about death, satan,..etc. He respectfully had to reject certain projects that were against his beliefs. That's it! Not the persons, but the message.
I'm sorry to the couple that cried & got their feelings hurt. It's his business- he has the right to refuse service to anyone. Is this really necessary?? Over a cake......
Daleylife we can all start doing that. I have a Mexican restaurant and a coffee shop. I'm Buddhist, and from now on refuse to serve Christian freaks! Maybe we should start registering everyone based on their religion to see who 'offends' us based on our beliefs and who we can refuse service to. Sounds great. 😎
@@jacksonsmith3698 And if u didnt read Jesus was the one who cured them... Every heard the story of the 2 Homesless men? Jesus literally goes around curing people of blindness of deafness or death of whatever else is out there. That was used to show that people should help them... How is refusing a service because it directly goes against what your religious beliefs are wrong. And no, Christians do not act persecuted here in the States. Some may, but most don't care as long as you don't touch their church. And race is completely different from S.O. so bringing it up was invalid. And for Muslims and Christians, it depends on what the Activity is. If a Christian asked for food to eat, then they should be served. But if he asked for pork, than the Muslim should refuse service because it is in direct correlation of their religions beliefs.
This man has morals, honor and courage!! My respects to you Mr. Baker!! Hope you and your family can recover from all the money and time you lost from having to go to court with those 2 guys.
Kudos to the baker for standing his ground and sticking to his beliefs I would've took the same stance its more important to obey God then to obey men.
as long as it doesn't discriminate from other people, you're free to do what you want as long as you're not causing harm or discriminating against other people
I have great disdain for the comparison of sexual orientation discrimination to racial discrimination. They are not the same at all. This business owner has the legal right to refuse service to anyone for whatever reason. I don't understand why the couple can't just patron another bakery. No one is trying to force them to marry women.
"This business owner has the legal right to refuse service to anyone for whatever reason" NO HE DOESN"T. That's not a "legal right" it's a $2 plastic sign. Posting a BEWARE OF DOG sign doesn't make your chihuahua into a doberman. my god, conservatives have gone completely round the bend...
Jane Lin, lol. I am not conservative or liberal. It is a legal right. You really should educate yourself of US general and business law. Your ignorance is showing.
lol, being as stupid as a conservative, while not being a conservative, is not an accomplishment. It is NOT a legal right. It's a piece of plastic. NO ONE has the right to refuse service to "anyone" for any reason. Because: The Constitution.
Read and learn, little boy: Do Restaurants Have the Unrestricted Right to Refuse Service? No. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 explicitly prohibits restaurants from refusing service to patrons on the basis of race, color, religion, or national origin. In addition, most courts don’t allow restaurants to refuse service to patrons based on extremely arbitrary conditions. For example, a person likely can’t be refused service due to having a lazy eye. www.legalmatch.com/law-library/article/restaurants-right-to-refuse-service.html
It’s his right as a provider of service and his TALENT. ITS HIS RIGHT PEOPLE GET A GRIP. He’s from my area it’s BS !! Move on get another cake baker. This is political correctness gone berserk 🙄😬
+Dawn Baker Incorrect, he does not have such right. That is because a Bakery is a PUBLIC Accommodation (PUBLIC in this case, a serve for (all) people, PRIVATE, which is not possible for this kind of business, would mean under personal contract). Public Accommodation cannot deny for any reason that is not directly related to safety (Including of the business) or the breaking of laws related. - Specific groups protected from discrimination in this case are listed in most (Not all) states as well. In the state the bakery was in LGBT individuals where listed in said law. Conclusion: No, He does not have such legal right. Not in that state at the very least. There is simply nothing more to say then what you are saying isn't correct.
Dawn Baker he has others who worked for him so technically he could have asked one of those people to do the job for him and it would not have taken up any of his time or talent. Got any other stupid comments?
He should and does sell generic cakes to everyone. He shouldn't have to create art or write a message on a cake that doesn't gel with his religious beliefs.
Fleur Bandito Perfect sense! He should be forced to make it because he has a business and can't discriminate against people but I think he should have the tight to be able to say he doesnt want to say "congrats in getting married James and John" that part should be his right
shamika slater asking the government to force people to do thinks they don't believe in is dangerous ground. The free market takes care of itself. If you don't sell a cake you don't get the money.
Nobody has a right to anybody's labor. Thats why you enter in a contract by agreement, there is a offer and acceptance. The couple had an offer and he didnt accept it... take your money somewhere else... done deal.
You treat one person like a second class citizen where does it stop? your argument could be used to bar black people from restaurants and such as well! so it is you who speaks nonsense who completely lacks and kind of vision of the bigger picture! maybe you believe the races shouldn't mix for example. its all just excuses to justify bare faced bigotry
Bigoted man. Why am I not surprised to see Christians defending segregation like we tried to end in the 1960s? By "we," I mean the left, the entire right hated MLK, the civil rights movement, etc. 70% disagreed with MLK the year he died. If you are against the BLM movement, you'd have been against the civil rights movement, just like your bigoted daddies grand-daddies were.
A baker in California just won her case for the same scenario. She explained her faith & declined to bake their cake. She introduced them to several bakers in the area which were just as good as a baker/cake designer & one of which was a part of the LBGTQ community. The couple did in fact use her referral & enjoyed their wedding. The audacity they would want to violate her religious belief & behavior to honor their rights is totally absurd!
"We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" sign come to mind. He shouldn't be forced to make a cake. The couple has to know it's all about the baker, and not about them. They have yet to understand another lesson, don't take anything person. Plus, there are other bakeries who would jump at the opportunity to make their cake.
"We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" will get thrown out in Court. Retail establishment's can put up whatever signs they want, but will lose a legal battle.
Mara Fernandez there was a time not too long ago when people with Hispanic names couldn't use the Post Office, use pools or enter certain businesses. We should go back to those days in the name of freedom of speech and religious rights. Because the government and private businesses had the 'right' to refuse those services due to their 'beliefs'. Let's go back to that, it's a great idea. It's their right to not give you service. 😎
I would. Bc I have enough self respect to say hey f you too. This has nothing to do with race it has to do with morals. Don't be low brow enough or think that other ppl are , to conflate the two different things.
This is not about RACE . Conflating race and someone's core beliefs is a ludicrous argument. How free are we as a country if our gov. Can force us to physically do things against our core beliefs, or ruin our livelihoods if we don't. it's not free...it's a tyranny. That's 1930's brown shirt GERMANY. I WISH THESE STUPID, OFFENDED SJW'S WOULD GO READ A HISTORY 📚 and get a clue!
Why are they acting like Jack is the only bakery on the planet? Here is an idea...FIND ANOTHER FREAKING BAKERY! It’s honestly not that hard. Why waste all your time trying to take this man’s business away? Focus on your marriage and forget about some little bakery that didn’t give you what you want, UGH. This whole situation is just so stupid!
@@nicolasoke7421 you're comparing the civl rights act to this. These people could choose any other bakery that isn't christian. If they can choose to get married he can choose not to make a cake supporting that. Would you force a black person to do something for a kkk member or for a jew to make something for a nazi. I don't think so.
yeah, and those black folks in Montgomery could have gone to another lunch counter... no, wait... that's 100% wrong, and you're just profoundly ignorant.
Jane Lin ugh! Please stop talking! The only reason black people couldn't "go to another lunch counter" is because it was against the law NOT to segregate by the same government you want to force this man into agreeing with you. Genius.
Frankie Drummond Thats a funny thing for a man to say to a woman, but even if I hadn't it wouldnt change the fact that what this couple is doing is wrong. They are ruining this man's life over a cake.
This is crazy! Forcing someone to do something against their beliefs is wrong. These two men should be ashamed and made to pay the 40% loss back. Who cares if they cry...🙄
Robert, what do you mean by this question? If you do not like to watch her it is a excellent time for you to go walk outside. Please do not waist your precious time on this planet doing something you do not like. cheers
This cakeshop is a private business. It’s not like target or Walmart. The person that owns the place has the right to decide what they sell. As long as it’s not illegal items, of course.
Good for him! Many do not agree with this type of weddings but they are cowards. He is brave man. Besides that, he was not mean to them when he denied. These couples have to learn to respect others. 1st. Amendment ladies and gentleman!
aguilacec! I think your comment is disgusting for being senseless; I really hope you have LGBTQ family member soon to come out, in the future, or even better a son or daughter, so you will learn what is to be discriminated or being treated as second-class citizen. And just then your opinion in the subject will change.
Shalon Garcia, why should people be forced to tolerate nonsense? Why? It's repulsive. I'm glad the owner of the shop stood their ground. It came with a price but they stood their ground. You guys always have to force or have it your way but enough is enough. It's wrong and that's the bottom line. What's next paedophilia? Oh that already in the works. Enough is enough!
Shalon, you have the right to think and express your disagreement. Thank you for doing it in respectful matters. I only tell you that, unlike you, I do not think that an LGTBQ person is a disgrace for no one. If I had one, I would do my best for him to be happy by respecting himself and others.
I think that you are mixing one thing with the other; and Ineed to answer with what I said before: I really hope you have LGBTQ family member soon to come out, in the future, or even better a son or daughter, so you will learn what is to be discriminated or being treated as second-class citizen. And just then your opinion in the subject will change.
It’s his bakery and he has the right to refuse any order he doesn’t wanna make. Why all the drama about a cake. Go to another bakery and get as much cakes as you want. Attention seekers.
@@kamusta3446 You ask for tolerance but cant give any. Every service provider has a right to refuse service. You dont believe in God, but in science I suppose. When there is no dichotomy.Well, biology will tell you whether you are male or female. But I suppose science is irrelevant as well.
He provides a service and has the right to refuse his services to anyone for any reason. Just like a bartender can refuse service to someone for any reason. But nowadays that bartender will be taken to court if that person is LGBTQ and feels like his rights were violated. It's disgusting. They don't want equal rights they want everyone to never say no to them because their feelings get hurt.
Kelly Villines! I think your comment is disgusting for being senseless; I really hope you have LGBTQ family member soon to come out or in the future, so you will learn what is to be discriminated or being treated as second-class citizen. And just then your opinion in the subject will change.
That's a harsh thing to say Shalon. I agree with Kelly. Just because we have different opinions and beliefs to YOU, doesn't mean you can belittle us. Some people choose to live a godly life. We are not here to please people. We should only please GOD and not offend him. Live your life but don't force people to agree with your lifestyle choices.
Shalon, based on what? Why are so sure that the bible is written by prejudiced men? If the Bible is written by God, would you obey what's written on the Bible?
It's so ridiculous. If someone doesn't want to do your cake, go to another bakery. I'm from Spain, and really, we don't have this kind of problems. If someone doesn't want to do business with you, go to another place. It's so simple.
Nothing says I love you like forcing someone to perform a service for you that goes against their beliefs. Why don't they ask a Muslim baker to make them a wedding cake? If I was denied a service i would just go someplace else. It's a free market.
I’m not a homophobe, but it’s HIS shop, he can do whatever he wants. Don’t think he’s just giving Gays a hard time, he closes the shop on Sundays, and refuses to make cakes for people who have divorced.
@@MJGiebels That doesn't give them the right to force people of religion to do something they are against. They should at least be able to tolerate one another, but exerting force to do something is beyond boundaries.
+Jojo Jo He kind of can't due to the product that he is selling being classified as an object under public accommodation law, he is to provide PUBLIC (Aka, to everyone, except if impossible for safety reasons), not PRIVATE (Which would allow somewhat more choice in that). - That seems to be forgotten by nearly everyone discussing here.
Frankie Drummond and how exactly does a wedding cake equate to someone needing life saving medical attention?? Do you see the false equivalency? You are either putting too much importance on a specialty item, or minimalizing the work of doctors... therefore you cannot equate the two.
+Fernandez Thomas This has nothing to do with comparing the two fields. It has to do with the fact they are both public accommodation falling under the same legal protections against discrimination.
I think tolerance is like kindness. So how Is that possible that some people who positioned themselves as tolerant (kind) threatened to Jack?! Its just horrible! Awful double standards!
We have become a society of whiners and complainers. It's called freedom for a reason and slowly we are giving it up to the higher ups. FREEDOM the choice to choose !!!
What penalties? "I acted like a bigot and people didn't want to be associated with a bigot, so they left me, but it's not my fault, it's their fault for not liking bigots!" LMAO
Isn't funny how those who demand to be tolerated are unwilling to tolerate?
In the end, Progressivism brooks no rivals.
laynn 10 So true... well said
Funnier yet that the ones who demand to be tolerated. Are the ones calling these people up and making death threats. Forget the business. These people sought to devour the Christians. That's what they do. They didn't go to another bakery, they didn't ask a Muslim baker or a Jewish baker. It's sad its gross. He didn't deny making them a cake. He just didn't want to make a homosexual cake. He offered to make something else with another message on it. Because of that they threaten and ruined his life. Shame on them.
laynn 10 we unwilling to tolerate being treated unfairly, so we will refuse to show tolerance to those who do not show us or our freedom any kind of respect.
laynn 10 outstanding comment!!
He didn’t refuse to sell them a product, he refused to create artwork that went against his beliefs. No one should be forced to create something that violates their own ethics.
True, especially if they are sinless and live saintly lives. smh
But the artwork on the cake is part of the product. & whist I agree he has a right to choose who he does his artwork for, he doesn’t have a right to deny service based on sexual orientation. If the court rule in the bakers favour & sets a precedence. Where will it end? Will a paramedic be allowed to discriminate against a patient because their lifestyle or religion etc is against their beliefs? Whilst I feel for the couple who feel they’ve been discriminated against, It’s just a cake. All this couple had to do was go & get a cake from another bakery.
A cake is a product. end of story
Then don’t open a business. If you want to be an artist then make paintings / cakes at home . Don’t open a buissnsss and then shut down someone because you believe that some man in the sky said it was wrong”
@@maranathacomelord7115 actually no one is free of sin it's stated in the bible ☝🏼🤓
For heaven's sake, go find another bakery or bake the cake yourself.
For heaven's sake, obey Colorado's public accommodation laws if you want to sell a product.
They sell wedding cakes to everyone except gays. That's a class of persons.
thank you
Michael Weiss he didn't want to sell a product. That's why.They should have bought a nice cake from him, like he offered ,and put the two men symbol on top of it by them selves. But they didn't want to, they had to sue him.He has a right to practise his religion ,it's his legal right.Try asking a pastor or rabbi or mullah to wed two men or women. Some might do it, most wouldn't.
So can he not sell to black people and Mexicans as well?
This is America right? Shouldn't he have a right to say no?
Obviously, but now it's official official.
Actually, if the bakery specifically offers custom wedding cakes, that's the catch. If you offer it to one, you have offer it to all. If you don't, that's discrimination.
Now, they say they don't offer Halloween cakes because of thier Christian values. That is totally legal because they aren't offering Halloween cakes to only certain groups.
Their simple solution would be a sign saying they specialize in Christian wedding cakes. At that point, their covered because they aren't offering wedding cakes as a general practice.
That being said, i don't agree with their stance. And i wouldn't operate a business that way. Money is money. But, if you offer a specific service, custom decorated wedding cakes, you can't withhold that service based on gender, age, race or religion; unless you are specifically only offering Christian wedding cakes.
Now that being said. This couple shouldn't rely on Uncle Sugar to be their bully. They should have been polite and said cool, I'll take my money and business elsewhere and let others know.
Uncle Sugar is not the solution to every problem.
@@tsdt4ever This man has prioritized God over money, and bless him for that
Natalie Gamble shouldn’t they have a right to cake
@@tsdt4ever 🤡🤡🤡
Bottom line is he has the right to say no to any request imo. I'm against anything alcohol/drug related so I wouldn't make a cake depicting the use of either. Does that mean I'm discriminating against drugs/alcohol? Find another cake maker.
GoldenEra 4ever You can refuse, but you subject yourself to potential lawsuit. Legally speaking you refusing to provide a service based on someone else practices or personality which is basically discrimination. Judges and lawyers see things through a legal lens. It's not about if you're a nice guy or not?
+Brad B. By the looks of things. He isnt a a bad guy. He's following the rules of his religion and his belief to a T. You say he is half witted because he doesnt want to partake in something that he doesnt believe in. You can force, tolerance, but you cant force acceptance. It's the same with racism and sexism. Also, assuming he's stupid or half witted makes you appear childish. Picking on a man who cant defend himself.
Yeah, the legal argument she is making is a slippery slope argument. The fact is, in all other civilized nations discriminating based on sexuality is illegal, that doesn't mean a leftwing speechwriter is ever forced to create speeches for right-wingers. For your beliefs to be taken seriously as a genuine basis for discriminating against gays you first have to: A). demonstrate god's existence. B) Demonstrate that your beliefs is in accordance with his belief.
+Terrell Williams
I disagree if he were following the rules to a T, and being consistent he would be turning people down who eat shellfish. He also looks like he's wearing mixed threads which are prohibited under the Abrahamic God's law. This is why his argument is very stupid because he's unable to act consistently within his own religious dogmas, and basically using it as a shield for his bigotry...
GoldenEra 4ever i agree. I seen a sign that said, 'no shirt, no shoes, no service' Same concept
He can say no, but should he? Refusing is being UNchristian anyway!
Hey can you make me a cake?
No, I cannot make you a cake
Ok, I'll just go to another baker
Ok, cool.
1Galan what’s the reason why you can’t make me a cake?
Okay, but now expand that to it's extreme. If the law sides with that baker here, and the socity all holds the same views, now that person can't get a cake because of who they are.
@@Capybarrrraaaa but thats not what happened.the baker was very specific and did not refuse them service
Patti Thompsett if everyone has the same views then where would they be able to get the specific wedding cake they want for their wedding?
Patti Thompsett But still if everyone held the same views then they wouldn’t be able to get a wedding cake anywhere where as heterosexuals would be treated with a lot more respect. Respect and serve others regardless of their sexuality.
Good for standing up for your religious belief.
Monique White in other words standing up for discrimination. Bravo
+Katie Zientek do you have to like gays or serve them?! no
& good for the couple for standing up for their equal rights & discriminatory bigoted business.
Monique White you ate disgusting if you encourage discriminating against a group of people doing absolutely no harm to you. Religion can not be used as a smoke screen to be a horrible person.
JJ that is the most ridiculous comment I’ve ever seen!!! All those ‘examples’ you gave, were things that were harmful. The KKK?? a woman MOLESTED by a priest??? Those examples are ludicrous because they actually meant harm to people. Homosexuals are did no harm to you, did they?
This is ridiculous...if somebody doesn't want to do something they shouldn't have to, that's real freedom and this is just childish
Unfamiliar with anti-discrimination laws, are you?
@@vreedlak7268 he didnt want to make art that went against his beliefs. That's perfectly fine
@Amanda Charlebois he refuses anti-lgbtq cakes too though
@@ronanmullins3740 And the supreme court stood by him.
@@vreedlak7268 P.S. Their lawsuit against him is discriminatory against his beliefs.
It is just like asking pork at a muslim owned restaurant.
That's totally not what it's like. If the baker gets away with it, then so do hospitals and doctors.
Bryan Phillips What messaging is involved in the tasks of a Dr? Since when do hospitals heal you with art? In what way does a Dr violate their religious beliefs to care for someone? Both are bad examples. To be a proper example it would have to violate:
1. Freedom of speech
2. Freedom of religion
3. Freedom of association
Like a muslim seamstress forced to make a baptismal gown. Or a catholic graphic designer forced to design an ad for an atheist group. It’s compelled speech that violates your religious beliefs.
I see the point you’re trying to make but a Muslim owner restaurant wouldn’t have pork in the first place (if the business model is targeted towards Muslims), and if they did then it would mean they’d be willing to sell pork.
And making them make it
Bryan Phillips dimwit, doctors swear an oath
Doesn't he have the right to refuse service to anyone? A bar sure does
If you can prove that you were not provided service based on race, religion, sexuality, that is illegal. If a bar doesn't allow a drunkard in that's fine. But they can't refuse service to every black person who tries to enter.
yes he does. and i have the freedom to picket his bakery and make him lose customers. hence, go him out of business. how do you like them apples?
Not really. It's discrimination.
Eva Staitz apples are just fine. yep both have those rights. so?
Brad B. This is more like a reason being put IN the butt! 🤭
This man is being bullied by a community of people that are against bullying....? The irony is strong
not really bullying its just showing, that simply enough intolerance shouldn't be tolerant
True
@The Christian lol he can say no and those morons should just proceed to go to another baker
@The Christian Change your name, you are a false pos and its disgusting
@The Christian he did nothing wrong. He has a right to refuse service and homosexuals can just go to another place to get their cake. What’s so hard about that???
Why don't they demand a Kosher deli make them a pork sandwich?
Right??
EXACTLY!!
Exactly
I agree and don’t agree. He doesn’t state that his bakery is a religious establishment as far as I know so that makes it very different. Whatever you do sell you should sell to everybody. A kosher restaurant and bakery should sell their kosher products regardless of sexual orientation.
@@mylifepostpain3705 He never refused to make them a cake, he just refused to put a certain design on it. The guy said he'd make them a cake, but there was certain artwork that he'd be uncomfortable putting on the cake.
The couple is after the money! Its plain and simple. They can go to another baker but they insisted and pressured the Philips to go against his religious conviction.
Nope. Colorado law doesn't allow them to collect a cent. It's not nice to commit false witness. The only remedies allowed by the law are injunctive - like court orders. This bakery was punished by Colorado ordering it to: (i) cease and desist from violating the law; (ii) educate its employees about the law; and (iii) file quarterly reports for a 2-year period (which expired a couple of years ago) detailing all instances of refusal of service. That's it. Here's the decision (see p. 4): www.aclu.org/legal-document/craig-and-mullins-v-masterpiece-cakeshop-commissions-final-order
@@vreedlak7268 it all seems more like a fake story, though.
The baker couple? Absolutely. The far right ate this up, gave them all kinds of free publicity, what a grifter!
It broke my heart when hearing how the community would sent death threats to his wife and they lost up to 40% of profits. These people have gone too far.😓
Exactly yet God forbid it happens to them, then the whole world must stand still? Such hypocrisy. I really have lost all respect for the LGBT community
@@Angeloflight7 Did you ever really have any? And if you're talking about toleration, it is plain stupid and a move backward to tolerate intolerance and that is exactly the backward mentality you portrait. Do you even understand what it is you're saying? The only hypocrisy you could possibly see is in a mirror.
@Ethan Hobigant Roche lol dude I'm not even American so I don't even understand ur rant but each to their own. The truth shall be revealed very soon. I just pray you receive it and have your eyes opened. God bless you
I don't endorse death threats but people have the right to decide not to work for them or patronize them for this statement.
@@Angeloflight7 Oh no! What will we do without your respect random internet person?
Why wud you want to give your business to someone that didnt agree with your lifestyle anyways?......take it somehwere else....and all would be good.he has the right to refuse service.
Kristine Tank it’s not their “lifestyle,” it’s their identity. Is your heterosexuality a “lifestyle”??
Kristine Tank they went out of their way to screw his life over wich intails harassment!
Mans laws, that go against Gods laws, do not count.
Randycadkins actually they DO count and you still have to follow them because god isn’t proven to exist.
Rebecca Brown we CAN NOT nor will we follow laws that go against God's laws, proof is all around you, everything was made by Him, even you and me, im not trying to convince you of this truth, niether does that make He who made all things not exist, its the truth, and truth does not always make others happy, people like to be lied to, (to make them feel better about themselves) but lieng to make someone feel better is not loving
I am a member of the lgbt community and if this were me I would simply say, “okay” and go to another cake shop. I find it unfair to force the artist to make something is they do not want to.
He even offered to make them another cake or other stuff. He didn't refuse them service. He refused to make a specific design.
@@volourn9764 Right!
@@yodamatino9223 still disagree
I agree he has this right.... Those guys are hurt but they can go to other shops...me I believe in karma...but we should respect others belief...there is a place for everyone....such as bad and good guys... The cake man is a nice guy...like the couple
Well, that's the problem. The marginalized are supposed to just grin and bear it when bigots exercise their hatred. But the hate and exclusion remains. Its time for the hateful to bear the brunt of their hate.
Just go to a different bakery to get the cake you want. Resolved.
Yeah, when you are denied to live in an apartment building, or a job, or participate in events, hum, then I would call that discrimination. Resolved would to be get rid of religion! Stop the madness people. Follow the law of LOVE and then problem solved. Not crazy dogma that is set up by man/woman who says it is religion. Wow, the brain washing that has been going on for centuries!
William Rogers, who made the law of love? Brain washing? You don't realize you already have your own belief and your own religion. Get rid of your own religion first.
I have no religion.
You don't get it. The way you make an absolute statement and the way you emphasize your own belief makes you really look like you have own religion. You do have your own religion!!
I am so glad I do not get what you are saying.
you don't have to hate someone to not agree with them,this man is in the right. #Leavehimalone!
I support LGBT+ all the way but on the bakers side 100%
I’m in two minds. He should be able to follow his religious beliefs but he shouldn’t be able to deny a product just because someone or in this case two people are gat
Hey I know how Christians behave ok, It's just a dame 🎂 Jesus said when you love one another you'll be know as my disciples simple as that, I think Christians must read their bibles cause they are judging and that's not the will of GOD just remember our relationship with God is personal, the great commission is go share the gospel not judge.
Please do not react like religious act as a child of GOD.
@@southwestlondonerbrown2737 He didn't deny a product. He just refused to provide his services to give them a finished product. They were offered ANYTHING else in the store, but they chose to go after him anyway. It became more about principle then the cake.
@@jesst1306 sound like gentil pretending to do the right thing using our LORD name and word uh..? Just think about this what is the difference ÷ you " Gods people " and the LGBT.... People?
And I want you think about this because God told me that when I was trying to do the right think but I was judging people, and of course my first reaction was puuffff obio God, .... But He told me the way you are describing this person for who he is what he did you be came like him, so theres no diference ÷ him and you then He make me think deeply and I say yes LORD you are right, I'm sorry. So what I learned is that I wouldn't think highly fo me just because I am saved because I'm the LORD people, or just because " I know the truth". There's a lot to learn dear sis, we do not know the truth completely yet, really just think about who is JESUS how he act and aprouch situations, I think he shares his love to every body so yes He would make that 🎂. For God's love just be who God wants you to be.
But I cant blame you fir everything, God has a purpose in our life and he do unimaginable things just to see our reaction and see who we are and give you a chance over and over just to teach us and open our 💕 👀 and learn to see people the way He sees people.
I'm with the baker. poor man.what has the world come to?.
I hear...Poor little bigot
moog Dome exactly dude
Doll Steak but the couple is straight so...no
Doll Steak but you gotta think real. There is no “if”so that’s it. I know your just saying but did it happen? No. Is it a situation that could happen? yes, but it didn’t. Okay? :)
Doll Steak cool
Freedom of choice.. I wouldn't in a thousand years make that cake if I didn't want to..
Larry 306 Then you shouldn't be a baker, and wouldn't for much longer. There's a difference between freedom of choice and denying business to someone due to prejudice. That is not allowed. Do you enjoy living in ignorance or....?
Brianna Gordy yea you should force him to make things he doesn't want to,,,we are such a great country....... we should force people to do things that are right i mean this is stupid he hurt their feelings and that is sad he shouldn't be allowed to own a business if he doesn't agree with them..... thank god and the gays we have women like you......
And I don't believe in god and think these people are nuts.
He probably won't (make cakes) for much longer either. His business has suffered due to his prejudiced attitude; God has nothing to do with it. Where is his God now?!? Yeah, that's what I thought...
Larry 306 Amen!
Go to another baker..He has his right too
+mk Silly except he doesn't. A bakery (of any kind) is a PUBLIC (For all) accommodation, service cannot legally be denied in Public (Not private) accommodations for any reason not related to safety or the breaking of laws in relation to the business. - There is also specific groups protected from discrimination outside of that, 23 states include LGBT individuals in that list. - The state this bakery was in included in that list of 23 states.
Simply put: No he doesn't, and the court has affirmed that on all levels.
The challange to the supreme court isn't even that that law should change, it's that Wedding cakes would be considdered Art, not an accommodationary object. (as it is now), which has been attempted before without success.
Why? Just because something contains art, doesn't mean the purpose of said object is Art. A painting, can be made using food, and it'll still be a painting. A piece of food can be made with decorative Art(s), but it'll still be a food.
What he has the right to discriminate? No he doesn't discrimination is against the law.
Douglas Roth We are all "discriminated" to certain extent.
Does not mean that it's "against the law."
Brad B. You have that backwards.
AutoGamerz it's a private company.
I kind of agree with the bakers. I mean if I'm a doctor I shouldn't be forced to perform an abortion, right? And it seems like he was nice. He didn't say you can't purchase smthg. here....he just said I have certain beliefs and I choose not to make one for you. Why don't they just get cake at another bakery?
re2dance unfortunately the government is trying to force Dr's to perform abortions against their beliefs as well.
re2dance you are right. I run a Mexican restaurant. I don't like serving smug, White people at my business. It goes against my basic principles and ethics. Bye, bye 🙋🏽♂️
And if all the bakeries in the state "exercise" the same "religious belief" and discriminate, THEN WHAT?
The happy couple can fly to New York to get a cake?
Jane Lin then they could make their own cake.
We'll make you a deal. Show me a state where every single baker in a medium sized city refuses such a service, then we'll talk. Until then, it is a straw man fallacy.
I think it’s ridiculous.
They could of taken their money some where else and left that man alone. Point blank!
So leave when there is a problem?
@@bohemiangod3658 problem? What r u talking about? There is no problem! Should I whine and cry over not being able to buy a TV at McDonald’s and sue them instead of just going to best buy or something?! Cakeshop is a private owned business that’s allowed to sell what they want as long as it’s not illegal items.
@@bohemiangod3658 there wasn't a problem
God bless all men that are brave like Jack.
Maria Vargas If god did exist he wouldn't really be a good.
Jose Anzures that's the weirdest comment I've read yet haha
Jose Anzures think you said your statement wrong buddy
Brad B. No that's not it at all bud.
no, the point is the couple came in and asked him to do a service he does not provide and instead of going to another bakery they tried to strong-arm him into giving them what they wanted this is a violation of freedom of speech. no one is entitled to your services since you are a private corporation you are allowed to serve who you want.
I agree...I wouldn't make the cake either if I didn't want to. Its my business.
Carol Benson "your business" in NOT above the law! It comes with obligations towards the public/customers
Carol Benson then be prepared to lose your business and deservedly so
LMAO, it's discrimination though! It's so f*cking homophobic, and discrimination is against the law.
K. Smith yes it is. Sadly once again, the courts have ruled in favour of homophobic behaviour. One step forward two steps back
Yeah..
despite everything, he stuck with his faith-- such an admirable person... my heart goes out for this person
he stuck to his intolerance in a behaviour Jesus would have said to him.....are you serious - saying you are a christian (in my name) and treating this couple in this way - have i taught you nothing???. If the bible has taught us nothing else, and it hasnt, its that you should make cakes for homosexual couples.
@@yttommy76 I see you haven't read of page of the bible huh?
@@bryantstudentd3831 none of it - its a made up rag
@@yttommy76 Okay then Shut up and and don't talk about what you don't know instead of pretending to quote Jesus.
@@bryantstudentd3831 of course I have read it you halfwit
Wow! He doesn’t make Halloween cakes?! I’m impressed. This man stand firmly for what he believes in 😊😊😊😊
Norwegian 787 that’s true, many Christians believe that
@C Back for information hmmm, he probably is
AMEN!! I pray to be like him, and esp like Jesus
@@learning.growing.1017 amen!!!!!
@@learning.growing.1017 Jesus would never have treated anyone like that
Good for him! Way to stand up for your religion!!! 🇺🇸
Wow, he has also said it was against his religion to serve black people. Way to encourage discrimination!
@@ThompsonFlash9999 that’s not true. Jesus was a black man so please explain that to me
@JaniahOnfroy would you defend that? If he said his religion called for that discrimination, would you accept it? What if it was a Jewish person who said they didn't wanna serve Christians. Would you defend that?
If he doesn’t want to bake a cake for you, he doesn’t have to. They choose their business. Move on, go somewhere else😂
several businesses prior to that accepted to make them a cake but that couple kept looking to find someone who would refuse, so pathetic
They did and he lost 40% profits
Exactly!
Freedom is for everybody
but they want it for them only
refusing to be bullied and yet bullying others for their choices! what kind of logic is that
exactly
What if he doesn't want to serve you or your child because of your color? Your gender? Were do you draw the line?Is there no line? So if you have a child birthday party at a place, it would be ok for the company to pick and choose who to serve among the children?
Its his own shop.. whats the freakin' problem... its his loss in income, so he can do whatever he wants... When he's a die hard New York Knicks fan and doesnt wanna put a Boston Celtics Logo on a cake its his right to do so...
Yes but if he sells the cake in exchange for a remuneration as a result of the service he provides, he needs to be consistent and also abide by the law. If you're not a supporter of Trump and you're asked to bake a cake with his face and MAGA on it, is it ok to refuse the customer that service because you don't approve of Trump? I think the main issue they are concerned about is that this can lead to extreme discriminatory practices.
That's a design based refusal and it's not discrimination. If the baker for example refused to make that Celtics logo cake, that is where you could argue a free speech right. It's also not discrimination because he wouldn't make that cake for anyone who walked into his shop no matter who they were.
clrscr you're right but the government is making him make the cake or loss his business were he can't do a single thing that he wants to do
@@nyc4233 Yes, it is totally okay to refuse to bake a cake with trumps face on it.
Amazing news right?
My husband has faced similar challenges. He is an artist and sometimes people asked him to do illustration about death, satan,..etc. He respectfully had to reject certain projects that were against his beliefs. That's it! Not the persons, but the message.
That attorney is amazing.
Jack is not allowed to talk to any media without her approval - she has done more to limit his freedom than any cake request
She's also hot.
@jfsfrnd Also known as good debate skills. She's also not wrong
I'm sorry to the couple that cried & got their feelings hurt. It's his business- he has the right to refuse service to anyone. Is this really necessary?? Over a cake......
It's also illegal to discriminate
You do NOT have the right to refuse to do business
Agreed that is ridiculous, someone trying to make a name for theirselves by being controversial
How would you feel if you went into a bakery and the baker said, "I'm sorry, but I don't bake cakes for women."
Daleylife we can all start doing that. I have a Mexican restaurant and a coffee shop. I'm Buddhist, and from now on refuse to serve Christian freaks! Maybe we should start registering everyone based on their religion to see who 'offends' us based on our beliefs and who we can refuse service to. Sounds great. 😎
I agree with him 100%!!!! He has right to his religion! You can't force him to abandon his religion!
If it's against my religion to serve white people, that's cool, right?
What a beautiful gentle man, stand strong in your beliefs
He declined respectfully and told them why. Good for you!
May God bless you and your family Mr. Jack
Zola zola if i knew you were coming,i,d have BAKED a cake.
We, as believers cannot condone what God has condemned.
Seka Lechita thou shall not judge is exactly what your doing as well if have never sinned throw the first stone
ITS HIS CHOICE! PERIOD!
Steven Nagy his choice is against the law!!!
Ice Cream Lover Your IQ test scores are also privately held business. Don’t bring them up, we don’t need to know that your in the special ed class
so no blacks signs are fine as well then?
@@nyc4233 His choice is with the constitution, therefore above Colorado Law... So is it really aganist the Law?
@@jacksonsmith3698 And if u didnt read Jesus was the one who cured them... Every heard the story of the 2 Homesless men? Jesus literally goes around curing people of blindness of deafness or death of whatever else is out there. That was used to show that people should help them... How is refusing a service because it directly goes against what your religious beliefs are wrong. And no, Christians do not act persecuted here in the States. Some may, but most don't care as long as you don't touch their church. And race is completely different from S.O. so bringing it up was invalid. And for Muslims and Christians, it depends on what the Activity is. If a Christian asked for food to eat, then they should be served. But if he asked for pork, than the Muslim should refuse service because it is in direct correlation of their religions beliefs.
This man has morals, honor and courage!! My respects to you Mr. Baker!! Hope you and your family can recover from all the money and time you lost from having to go to court with those 2 guys.
Kudos to the baker for standing his ground and sticking to his beliefs I would've took the same stance its more important to obey God then to obey men.
So right.
Way to stand up for bigotry
@@fahadshahid5185 well those gays are the bigots here!
he has all the right to say no
So, you're against the civil rights movement, as long as the bigots thought they were following god? That's disgusting
Wow...finally a true believer that took a stand and didn’t allow for “trials and tribulations” to make him wander 👍🏽
Aren’t liberals for freedom of choice? Umm 😐
Only if it's their choice.
ClassicFIHD haha for real.
Isn’t it obvious, liberals are always contradicting themselves to benefit them!😂
as long as it doesn't discriminate from other people, you're free to do what you want as long as you're not causing harm or discriminating against other people
Wolf Titan Reading correct
I have great disdain for the comparison of sexual orientation discrimination to racial discrimination. They are not the same at all. This business owner has the legal right to refuse service to anyone for whatever reason. I don't understand why the couple can't just patron another bakery. No one is trying to force them to marry women.
"This business owner has the legal right to refuse service to anyone for whatever reason"
NO HE DOESN"T. That's not a "legal right" it's a $2 plastic sign. Posting a BEWARE OF DOG sign doesn't make your chihuahua into a doberman.
my god, conservatives have gone completely round the bend...
Jane Lin, lol. I am not conservative or liberal. It is a legal right. You really should educate yourself of US general and business law. Your ignorance is showing.
lol, being as stupid as a conservative, while not being a conservative, is not an accomplishment. It is NOT a legal right. It's a piece of plastic. NO ONE has the right to refuse service to "anyone" for any reason. Because: The Constitution.
Jane Lin, lol. More of that illogical temperament. Hope you educate yourself. Good day, madam.
Read and learn, little boy:
Do Restaurants Have the Unrestricted Right to Refuse Service?
No. The Civil Rights Act of 1964 explicitly prohibits restaurants from refusing service to patrons on the basis of race, color, religion, or national origin. In addition, most courts don’t allow restaurants to refuse service to patrons based on extremely arbitrary conditions. For example, a person likely can’t be refused service due to having a lazy eye.
www.legalmatch.com/law-library/article/restaurants-right-to-refuse-service.html
Baker won with flying colors..
I don’t know why we still listening to the same predictors that keep on getting it wrong!
jfsfrnd the highest court sided with the baker. Pick your own colors
jfsfrnd in other words the baker WON. Cut it which ever way you want
Singer Nah bro.
Singer considering he can't bake wedding cakes anymore sounds like he lost.
Paul Kirk He made the decision by himself to no longer bake cakes. He didn't lose anything.
It's not a fight against discrimination, it's a huge temper tantrum
It’s his right as a provider of service and his TALENT. ITS HIS RIGHT PEOPLE GET A GRIP. He’s from my area it’s BS !! Move on get another cake baker. This is political correctness gone berserk 🙄😬
you keep using that word "right"
The Constitution doesn't think it means, what you think it means.
You don't have the right to discriminate.
Jane Lin yep. You do.
+Dawn Baker
Incorrect, he does not have such right.
That is because a Bakery is a PUBLIC Accommodation (PUBLIC in this case, a serve for (all) people, PRIVATE, which is not possible for this kind of business, would mean under personal contract).
Public Accommodation cannot deny for any reason that is not directly related to safety (Including of the business) or the breaking of laws related. - Specific groups protected from discrimination in this case are listed in most (Not all) states as well. In the state the bakery was in LGBT individuals where listed in said law.
Conclusion: No, He does not have such legal right. Not in that state at the very least.
There is simply nothing more to say then what you are saying isn't correct.
Dawn Baker he has others who worked for him so technically he could have asked one of those people to do the job for him and it would not have taken up any of his time or talent. Got any other stupid comments?
His bakery is public so that means he has to serve every one and not just people that he agrees with.
He shouldn't be forced to make a cake
not forced...he is providing a service and receiving money. This is such a touchy subject.
He should and does sell generic cakes to everyone. He shouldn't have to create art or write a message on a cake that doesn't gel with his religious beliefs.
Cameron just as you have the right to accept homosexuality.....people have the right to not agree with it.
Fleur Bandito Perfect sense! He should be forced to make it because he has a business and can't discriminate against people but I think he should have the tight to be able to say he doesnt want to say "congrats in getting married James and John" that part should be his right
shamika slater asking the government to force people to do thinks they don't believe in is dangerous ground. The free market takes care of itself. If you don't sell a cake you don't get the money.
Nobody has a right to anybody's labor. Thats why you enter in a contract by agreement, there is a offer and acceptance. The couple had an offer and he didnt accept it... take your money somewhere else... done deal.
if you take that to its logical conclusion thats an argument to bring back segregation as well,
@@katakisLives Absolute nonsense.
You treat one person like a second class citizen where does it stop? your argument could be used to bar black people from restaurants and such as well! so it is you who speaks nonsense who completely lacks and kind of vision of the bigger picture! maybe you believe the races shouldn't mix for example. its all just excuses to justify bare faced bigotry
@@katakisLives this decision won't lead to a segregation style of society. Most people aren't bigoted. This ain't the 1950s.
I mean lots of store can say no to you if you are not able to stay in the guide lines of the store policy.
Civil rights should never be about sexual acts in the bedroom.. I'm glad you won Jack.
Facts.
Brave man ❤️ May the Lord keep him and bless him. To God all the glory!
Bigoted man. Why am I not surprised to see Christians defending segregation like we tried to end in the 1960s? By "we," I mean the left, the entire right hated MLK, the civil rights movement, etc. 70% disagreed with MLK the year he died. If you are against the BLM movement, you'd have been against the civil rights movement, just like your bigoted daddies grand-daddies were.
There’s a fine line between actual discrimination and refusing to engage with actions that go against your religion.
This snobby self-entitled couple should be sued for the destruction of this man's business.
He chose to make the decision to discriminate !
Really disappointed in Megyns inability to see his side as valid. I guess I was wrongfully expecting her to still be fair and balanced. Go figure!
My guess is that she was supposed to play devil's advocate. Usually how these things go so they can get a more complete conversation.
The object was to be one sided. These people are pro homosexual, so they're only gonna side with them.
A baker in California just won her case for the same scenario. She explained her faith & declined to bake their cake. She introduced them to several bakers in the area which were just as good as a baker/cake designer & one of which was a part of the LBGTQ community. The couple did in fact use her referral & enjoyed their wedding. The audacity they would want to violate her religious belief & behavior to honor their rights is totally absurd!
Just find another bakery. Don't cry and sue the man.
Bizznisss
This man has a right not to create anything that is against his religion.
60th to like.
Bullies! Get a cake somewhere else.
"We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" sign come to mind. He shouldn't be forced to make a cake. The couple has to know it's all about the baker, and not about them. They have yet to understand another lesson, don't take anything person. Plus, there are other bakeries who would jump at the opportunity to make their cake.
"We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" will get thrown out in Court. Retail establishment's can put up whatever signs they want, but will lose a legal battle.
Mara Fernandez there was a time not too long ago when people with Hispanic names couldn't use the Post Office, use pools or enter certain businesses. We should go back to those days in the name of freedom of speech and religious rights. Because the government and private businesses had the 'right' to refuse those services due to their 'beliefs'. Let's go back to that, it's a great idea. It's their right to not give you service. 😎
Mara Fernandez yeah you see that sign literally everywhere,. I guess it doesn't actually matter.
I would. Bc I have enough self respect to say hey f you too. This has nothing to do with race it has to do with morals. Don't be low brow enough or think that other ppl are , to conflate the two different things.
This is not about RACE . Conflating race and someone's core beliefs is a ludicrous argument. How free are we as a country if our gov. Can force us to physically do things against our core beliefs, or ruin our livelihoods if we don't. it's not free...it's a tyranny. That's 1930's brown shirt GERMANY. I WISH THESE STUPID, OFFENDED SJW'S WOULD GO READ A HISTORY 📚 and get a clue!
Why are they acting like Jack is the only bakery on the planet? Here is an idea...FIND ANOTHER FREAKING BAKERY! It’s honestly not that hard. Why waste all your time trying to take this man’s business away? Focus on your marriage and forget about some little bakery that didn’t give you what you want, UGH. This whole situation is just so stupid!
Yea. While were at it, maybe those black people should find a dinery that will serve them. So entitled🙄
@@nicolasoke7421 you're comparing the civl rights act to this. These people could choose any other bakery that isn't christian. If they can choose to get married he can choose not to make a cake supporting that. Would you force a black person to do something for a kkk member or for a jew to make something for a nazi. I don't think so.
@@nicolasoke7421 BLM is a joke
@@jesst1306 your exsistance is a joke
Preach! 😃👏
So sad. He can't just get another cake shop, but that couple could have easily gone to another cake shop.
Clearly you never experienced discrimination
yeah, and those black folks in Montgomery could have gone to another lunch counter... no, wait... that's 100% wrong, and you're just profoundly ignorant.
Jane Lin ugh! Please stop talking! The only reason black people couldn't "go to another lunch counter" is because it was against the law NOT to segregate by the same government you want to force this man into agreeing with you. Genius.
Frankie Drummond Thats a funny thing for a man to say to a woman, but even if I hadn't it wouldnt change the fact that what this couple is doing is wrong. They are ruining this man's life over a cake.
Yeah. Could've gone to a Muslim cake baker and harassed them.
He has every right he is not racist...He has a belief...God. give me a break these other that made these stupid comment
Thank you Jack Phillips for taking a stand!
This is crazy! Forcing someone to do something against their beliefs is wrong. These two men should be ashamed and made to pay the 40% loss back.
Who cares if they cry...🙄
Tell them to stop whining if they whine.
Only In America can two grown men be denied a cake and throw a tantrum 🤣🤣🤣
Why did NBC hire Megyn Kelly anyway?
Those responsible should be out of job soon - along with Megyn Kelly The ratings are terrible. She sucks.
Robert, what do you mean by this question? If you do not like to watch her it is a excellent time for you to go walk outside. Please do not waist your precious time on this planet doing something you do not like. cheers
She probably blew one of the NBC executives
looks?
Blonde?
When he started to cry- uff.. my heart:(
yeap because we should feel bad for a bigot. Its such a shame.
@@wolftitanreading5308 stfu
@@wolftitanreading5308 🤡🤡🤡
This cakeshop is a private business. It’s not like target or Walmart. The person that owns the place has the right to decide what they sell. As long as it’s not illegal items, of course.
Nope. Even a private business cannot deny a black man service for being black
@@ThompsonFlash9999 Businesses do have that right, it is just infringed upon by the government
Serve GOD first😊
"The thin veneer of religion?" Not for this baker.
camerrill I heard that too was insulted as well
Corey Booker is a bigoted JERK. What a tool. New Jersey needs to vote him out of office asap.
Even someone who we could all agree is a bigot should have that right , even a admitted bigot . It’s his believe and his business.
Good for him! Many do not agree with this type of weddings but they are cowards. He is brave man. Besides that, he was not mean to them when he denied. These couples have to learn to respect others. 1st. Amendment ladies and gentleman!
I totally agree with you. Two thumbs up!!
aguilacec! I think your comment is disgusting for being senseless; I really hope you have LGBTQ family member soon to come out, in the future, or even better a son or daughter, so you will learn what is to be discriminated or being treated as second-class citizen. And just then your opinion in the subject will change.
Shalon Garcia, why should people be forced to tolerate nonsense? Why? It's repulsive. I'm glad the owner of the shop stood their ground. It came with a price but they stood their ground. You guys always have to force or have it your way but enough is enough. It's wrong and that's the bottom line. What's next paedophilia? Oh that already in the works. Enough is enough!
Shalon, you have the right to think and express your disagreement. Thank you for doing it in respectful matters. I only tell you that, unlike you, I do not think that an LGTBQ person is a disgrace for no one. If I had one, I would do my best for him to be happy by respecting himself and others.
I think that you are mixing one thing with the other; and Ineed to answer with what I said before: I really hope you have LGBTQ family member soon to come out, in the future, or even better a son or daughter, so you will learn what is to be discriminated or being treated as second-class citizen. And just then your opinion in the subject will change.
I can't believe this man hasn't got the liberty to bake a cake to whoever he pleases
Why can’t people just make their own cakes.
why can't people not be biggot's
It’s his bakery and he has the right to refuse any order he doesn’t wanna make. Why all the drama about a cake. Go to another bakery and get as much cakes as you want. Attention seekers.
No one can NEVER force unwavering loyal Christians to go against their God or biblical beliefs.
Reiko Myles But he is not a Christian he is a religious bigot . Big difference
Nikki forever He is a Christian. Your politically correct buzzword doesn't change that.
"no one can never" So, you mean to say everyone does at least once?
AMEN! preach!
He respects you as a person but does not agree with your lifestyle.
Why not do the same?
Respect the guy as a person, find another baker.
@@kamusta3446
You ask for tolerance but cant give any. Every service provider has a right to refuse service.
You dont believe in God, but in science I suppose. When there is no dichotomy.Well, biology will tell you whether you are male or female. But I suppose science is irrelevant as well.
He provides a service and has the right to refuse his services to anyone for any reason. Just like a bartender can refuse service to someone for any reason. But nowadays that bartender will be taken to court if that person is LGBTQ and feels like his rights were violated. It's disgusting. They don't want equal rights they want everyone to never say no to them because their feelings get hurt.
Kelly Villines! I think your comment is disgusting for being senseless; I really hope you have LGBTQ family member soon to come out or in the future, so you will learn what is to be discriminated or being treated as second-class citizen. And just then your opinion in the subject will change.
That's a harsh thing to say Shalon. I agree with Kelly. Just because we have different opinions and beliefs to YOU, doesn't mean you can belittle us. Some people choose to live a godly life. We are not here to please people. We should only please GOD and not offend him. Live your life but don't force people to agree with your lifestyle choices.
Ana Santos! "A bible written by prejudiced men (not God) hundreds of years ago, who also, by the way thought the world was flat."
Shalon, based on what? Why are so sure that the bible is written by prejudiced men? If the Bible is written by God, would you obey what's written on the Bible?
Bible says to reject what is bad, so he was not discriminating in his correct refusal
Baker Jack is my Hero now.
God bless you!
He has a right to say no. Case closed. Go somewhere else.
Nope. His corporation is subject to anti-discrimination laws - like all other businesses open to the public.
He won on 6/5/2018
It's his bakery he has the right to choose who to bake for or not.
Good for him, standing for what you believe is the only thing we have left and nobody cant take it away from it.
"Omg it's very emotional, we wanted to cry, he doesn't want to bake our cake" Wth is this, how is this emotional, pull yourself together and man up.
It's so ridiculous. If someone doesn't want to do your cake, go to another bakery. I'm from Spain, and really, we don't have this kind of problems. If someone doesn't want to do business with you, go to another place. It's so simple.
makes me sick to my stomach that people even have a problem with him not making a cake to a non-marriage between two men
Nothing says I love you like forcing someone to perform a service for you that goes against their beliefs. Why don't they ask a Muslim baker to make them a wedding cake? If I was denied a service i would just go someplace else. It's a free market.
im going to order my wedding cake from him
I’m not a homophobe, but it’s HIS shop, he can do whatever he wants. Don’t think he’s just giving Gays a hard time, he closes the shop on Sundays, and refuses to make cakes for people who have divorced.
Ever watch Sienfeild? :) That soup guy refuses to sell his soup to anyone he doesn't like.
Conservative Nellie hahaha!
Yeah but that was in the 90s when people didn't get butthurt over not getting their way.
Yeah, but he doesn't single out ONE specific group ONLY!
No soup for you!!!
@@MJGiebels That doesn't give them the right to force people of religion to do something they are against. They should at least be able to tolerate one another, but exerting force to do something is beyond boundaries.
Good for you for standing by your beliefs!!!! The baker!!!!
"Do not conform to this world." Stand firm in your Christian beliefs!
So they were tearing up and emotional? Why didn't they just shop around?
Let your love be without hypocrisy.
Abhor what is wicked;
cling to what is good. Romans 12:9
Clearly rejecting those false couples.
Grown men crying over a cake?!
Immatured boys is the proper term.
He can choose what he wants to create.
Huh? then if he needed surgery .... a doctor has a right to let him die then. How is that any different?
Frankie Drummond because surgery is not a cake. That's how.
+Jojo Jo He kind of can't due to the product that he is selling being classified as an object under public accommodation law, he is to provide PUBLIC (Aka, to everyone, except if impossible for safety reasons), not PRIVATE (Which would allow somewhat more choice in that). - That seems to be forgotten by nearly everyone discussing here.
Frankie Drummond and how exactly does a wedding cake equate to someone needing life saving medical attention?? Do you see the false equivalency? You are either putting too much importance on a specialty item, or minimalizing the work of doctors... therefore you cannot equate the two.
+Fernandez Thomas This has nothing to do with comparing the two fields. It has to do with the fact they are both public accommodation falling under the same legal protections against discrimination.
God Bless You Jack Phillips!
I think tolerance is like kindness. So how Is that possible that some people who positioned themselves as tolerant (kind) threatened to Jack?! Its just horrible! Awful double standards!
We have become a society of whiners and complainers. It's called freedom for a reason and slowly we are giving it up to the higher ups. FREEDOM the choice to choose !!!
Slowly? Where were you in the 1865, when the first anti-discrimination law prohibiting businesses open to the public from discriminating was passed?
I have so much respect for this Baker. He is abiding by his faith despite penalties that he should never have had to endure.
What penalties? "I acted like a bigot and people didn't want to be associated with a bigot, so they left me, but it's not my fault, it's their fault for not liking bigots!" LMAO