Morrowind doesn't belong to the Empire anymore, one of the dunmers of Ravenrock explains that during the oblivion crisis, the Empire removed his troops from Morrowind, the house Redoran had to create a proper dark elf army, and then they banned house Hlaalu for having collaborated with the empire...
8:35 Ulfric doesn't show any negative thought towards the dunmer as a people. The refugees live rough, but the reason their situation hasn't been tended to is explained to be because of the war effort taking priority at the moment. You get a bad impression when entering Windhelm for the first time because you do see genuine racism. But that's the town drunk, not Ulfric. Ulfric took in the refugees within city walls, allowed them to open shops stalls, and even the chance to obtain farmland. He recognized the contention between them and the Argonians, and keep them separated to avoid bloodshed over their horrible history. As for the general Nord population, most Nords will appreciate and respect those who are hard working. Belyn Hlaalu, a dunmer owning a farm outside the city, says as much. And they will probably not respect those who don't.. and unfortunately it seems at least quite a few dunmer within the city sees working for and with Nords as something beneath them to be ashamed of. At least if Faryl Atheron's words are something to go by. He says he hopes no one from the city sees him out working the farm, and that his brother is ashamed of him working for a Nord.
@@albertobertorelli4511 Some are, sure. But I think it's a mistake to paint to wide and say it's as simple as everyone is racist. Specifically my point was that you can't just take that idea and just assume Ulfric's neglect of the dunmer within the city comes from racism. With the aid and opportunity he has given, especially in war time, I'd say it's not likely the case. If he was just racist towards dark elves, he wouldn't even allow them to live within the hold, let alone city walls.
@@Jonas_æ Those elves have been coming in for over a century. They are not loyal to Skyrim and nor do they belong there. They are a dangerous 5th column.
Ulfric is literally the one who forces the Dunmer into that slum and the Argonians at the docks. Ulfric didn't take in anyone; those Dunmer have been there since 4E 5, over 100 years prior to the birth of Ulfric. The Dunmer and Argonians didn't have any problems, Ulfric's segregation makes no sense. Ambarys Rendar makes it very clear that their conditions worsened when Ulfric took over.
@@dutchpatriot17 Actually, my segretation does make sense considering the quite recent past history of Dunmer and Argonians, they were quite recently at war with eachother and pretty much hates eachother, I know this, and separating them is only for the reason to avoid conflicts and fights between them inside the city walls.
You just gave me an Idea for a character backstory. Redguard siding with Stormcloaks so that Hammerfell has good connections with Skyrims new government.
The Crowns would never ally with anyone that’s not a Redguard. Maybe if High Rock joined in and they’d form a new Covenant, but that would require another siege of Orsinium... something I don’t suggest while fighting the Dominion at the same time.
Why would Hammerfell be overly friendly with the Empire, they basically sold the Southern part of Hammerfell to the Thalmor, forcing Hammerfell to leave the Empire to drive the Thalmor out
@@dashua1735 It was. It basically saved the Empire too if you think about it, if the Dominion controlled Hammerfell they'd have quite the advantage and could probably jumpstart the second great war a lot faster and attack from many sides
The Icelandic Viking if I remember correctly the Empire didn’t gave any instructions (otherwise the Thalmor would go after them). The Legion segment you are referring to were locals who lived & knew the land. When they fought, they weren’t part of the Legion or Empire anymore since the Empire completely gave up and bent over for some elf dick to keep Cyrodiil. I wouldn’t say it was « detrimental » afaik you don’t see any clues about it or maybe in an Imperial document. It did help for sure. But Redguards are literally the best warriors in Tamriel so no surprise they won. I’m not a fan of the Stormcloaks but the Empire is indeed shit who only look after Cyrodiil in the end, the rest can fuck off if they are pressured. The fact Hammerfell won just show how pointless the Thalmor peace treaty was and how dumb the Empire was to accept them.
@@IRedpunk Without Cyrodiil, there would be no Empire. It's literally the Imperial heartland. Don't forget, Hammerfell got the "off brand" Legion and had extra warriors. Yes they gave up some of Hammerfell, but they had other provinces that needed taking care of. We see most of the Empire is in shambles, and Hammerfell was lucky. They could've kept fighting, but if the Dominion pushed for Cyrodiil like they did, or figured Hammerfell wasn't possible to take with Imperial support... I mean, just saying, there's more to the dynamic.
Honestly a Stormcloak victory would be very interesting for the Elder scrolls as a series. We could play elder scrolls in a post empire era where the political situation would be similar to the fall of Rome, where even there race of imperial is rename Cyrodiilian or whatever the new short term is, and there could be more revolts in the dominion with Elsewayr and Valenwood. It would be interesting.
One thing you didn’t cover is that after red year, Skyrim gave solstheim to house redoran in morrowind to help as a relief, so the dunmeri people may have more cordial relations after the fact
@@ienglish4203 If anything they might be more aggro because last time an a-hole who didn't like elves was leading Skyrim, the Chimer spent who knows how many years as second-class citizens in the Nord empire until this one merchant caravan guard nobody went and became Hortator. And we ALL know that not only are Dunmer great at grudges, but Nerevar is the Redorans' patron saint.
I don't think there would be an official alliance between Skyrim and Morrowind, due to the common prejudice towards Dark Elves within the Stormcloak ranks. Also, the two provinces have a history of fighting each other.
@Adam West I'm aware of that fact, I just said cordial. Political relationships change all the time so obviously political status and rivalries might also change
As someone who usually goes Stormcloak, I'm glad you took the time to make this video, with no bias. In any other video, it's a battlefield in the comment section.
Skyrim also has a large lumber supply. There's also a lot of iron deposits scattered across, so they also have iron to provide. Their proximity to the sea also has fish. They have plenty of natural resources to trade.
As valid of a point as that is, he murdered her husband. It's the one ruler that will work to undermine him no matter what, because of non-diplomatic personal matters
Well, despite Bryling does not support them she has high opinion about and respect for Stormcloaks. She could be even better ally than reluctant Elisif
I realise this is a odd video But I just wanted to say something... If the stormcloaks won the Civil War in Canon that means that they have the last dragonborn.... In canon the bend will shout from the dragonborn DLC Is much more powerful than in game mechanics.... The stormcloaks could have the very 1st Air Force of the elder scrolls series And exterminate the high elfs
''In canon the bend will shout from the dragonborn DLC Is much more powerful than in game mechanics'' Not really. If it were, Miraak would've never been defeated. Also, speaking of Miraak, the LDB replaces him, so he won't be present.
@@dutchpatriot17 Miraak got owned by one very determined and very likeable dragon priest, and had to have Herma-Mora himself save him from getting wrecked by Vahlok, so yeah, backing you up on "the bend will shout isn't that powerful". Couldn't even sway one loyal Dragon follower, pffft. Honestly I'm pretty sure that the LDB is just an aspect of Akatosh the same way Aspera Whatever-Friend is one of Boethiah, and just popped in to smack a few people down who'd doom the world out of its place and will vanish again, cheating every Prince out of a soul they thought they'd been promised because SURPRISE THAT SOUL NEVER EXISTED.
There is an option to remain neutral though isn't there? That's always been my headcanon, the last dragonborn heads a temporary truce to deal with Alduin. What happens after that is out of their hands as they have no part in the war.
@@DeruwugenI feel like less lives are lost in the stalemate if you throw your weight behind one faction or other and deal with the war quickly. That's my headcanon. Attrition claims lives by the day, and it would help both sides to end the war asap to pivot resources toward defeating the thalmor in the immenent war
@@neoqwertythe ldb did exist canonically, why the fuck would he get married and adopt a kid if he was only an aspect of akatosh. You are sort of right though, Dragonborn's are aspects of akatosh in a way though they live normal human lives and have children. It's more likely the Dragonborn became emperor (actually that's the most likely scenario regardless of which side they picked) due to the significance of a Dragonborn and the empire. Every time the empire is Uber successful, it is because a Dragonborn is in charge.
Honestly idk if Ulfric would be willing to put someone like Balgruuf in a position as a diplomat it wouldn't seem like the smartest idea in regard s to internal stability Balgruuf might start making back door deals with the empire to reclaim his throne in Whiterun and restore imperial rule to Skyrim
Although I personally like the Stormcloaks, having been a largely Nord player since I first played an Elder Scrolls game (Oblivion), I long ago accepted that ultimate Stormcloak Victory would be highly unlikely an outcome. Does that mean that any books on the subject in ES 6 and onward will universally accept the Imperial Campaign canon? I doubt it. When it comes to faction whatnot, the Elder Scrolls generally tends to be a little vague. I expect a line about the Skyrim Civil War going something to the effect: "The Imperial Army and the Stormcloaks fought fiercely, each nearly defeating the other several times, but ultimately the Empire prevailed." As for Ulfric hating the Empire...If I may point out that the man tried, several times in fact, to work with the Empire. Yet every time he'd try to get the concessions he'd negotiated for, he'd be denied. If anything, I'd say Ulfric has great respect for the Imperial Legions and the Empire as a whole....certainly more respect for the Imperials than the Imperials have for him.
@@Son_of_Thunder_2000 Milkdrinker! Maven Black-Briar is corrupt, criminal and should absoluteley not be jarl. And good riddance for my old friend Balgruuf for drinking the Empires milk!
I wouldn't expect the Justicars to be a problem. They aren't an occupying military force, they're a small group of political commissars who can only operate because of the legal protection afforded by the White Gold Concordat. Which would no longer apply to an independent Skyrim. So if they have any sense, they'll leave to avoid getting lynched by an angry mob while the guards watch and drink mead.
To an extent yes, although the Justicars still present the consequences of the current situation political in Skyrim - any nation or country (and yes they are two totally different things obviously) has to be look at even depending on victories or political advantages which is the answer to the Thalmor’s idea of the problem but also why this can be viewed as a advantage within the new nation. So if the Justicars leave there’s multiple reasons why they could presume to understand why, because it’s their job or maybe the pressure or as you said; local violence and discrimination, this then can be viewed as an independence trait, which ultimately is why the Justicars exist; to ultimately remind Skyrim of Skyrim and most importantly the Empire, So it starts as another game of pointless political secrecy which can only be taken as an idea with advantages similar to the last, Yeah.
Exactly the moment the Stormcloaks enter Haafingar they're leaving the embassy although they'd probably leave a few intelligence units to accumulate information which would be am extreme risk
I think this was a very well thought out video that set out all variables a Stormcloak Government would need to overcome in the days following the establishment of an independent country. This video pretty much lines up with my own ideal scenario for a post Skyrim Civil War setting and would most certainly be the course that my Stormcloak Dragonborn would champion. I would like to thank the producer of this video for creating it to be as well as it came out.
I often compare Skyrim with the situation in my homeland in real life (we had a civil war some 25 years ago and from one war collapsed into quite a few tiny states) - over time, we didn't reunite, despite all the similarities that we had, but instead the relations are improving and you can say that now we are friendly nations. People still like each other despite the hardships - it's only governments that spice things up. But anyways, over time, everyone accepted the current status quo and have made peace with the fact that, while we may not be united anymore, we can at least be friendly to each other (we are often the first ones to help each other during calamities, such as floods and earthquakes) Sorry if I am politicising it a bit, but it's just how I see and compare the Skyrim civil war, as well as the overall collapse of the Tamrielic Empire
For real world parallels, I'd point to the United States after the American Revolution. Great Britain remained a major trading partner, and the Federalist Party, which was the first party to hold power, generally favored Britain and was even prepared to go to war with France. So I suspect that some relations between Skyrim and the Empire would be maintained, even if Ulfric himself isn't involved.
Jarl & High King Ulfric Stormcloak, when we win you should become friends with the redguards and imperials so that we can all go fuck up the thalmor together.
The thing that makes Skyrim different is that the protagonist actually is just there by the end. You come back from Sovengard, you don't get influenced and controlled by Hermaous Mora, you stop the Volkihar vampires. So you resolve everything and just are in Skyrim afterwards. I mean depending on the race the Dragonborn actually is I mean they could potentially exist for a few hundred years. And you can't tell me the Dragonborn wouldn't have a huge influence in Tamriel after doing so much and basically becoming a living God in the process. All the other games had a conclusion more or less for your character. But Skyrim doesn't have your character going off somewhere to never be seen again, or die. You just become basically the most powerful being in your time and you solve every major issue in the world at that time. It really will be interesting to see what happens canon wise because they can't just ignore the dragonborn in the lore at this point
I'll never surrender Skyrim into the hands of a corrupt and dying Empire!!! Damn imperial milkdrinkers!!! Soon enough, we will march on Solitude. And on that day the heroes of Sovngarde will march with us! And you and your boy Tullius will fall to your knees in fear!!!!!!
I don't see the Stormcloaks taking on the Aldmeri Dominion without the Dragonborn doing 99% of the fighting. I hope if a Stormcloak victory is cannon they don't start a war after the civil war.
4:20 5:20 Uh, Hammerfell kicked the Empire out of their province, too. In addition, High Rock is in an uneasy position with the Empire as is seen with Ulfric bothering to try and convince them to join his side.
I think one thing that is probably being overlooked is who does the Dragonborn side with depending on who the Dragonborn side with would decide who wins. Now let's say that the Dragonborn is a Nord and sides with the Stormcloaks, that would guarantee their win. As for why, number one, the Dragonborn defeats Alduin which intimidates all the other dragons. Number Two the Dragonborn doe's defeat Miraak which gives him the ability to bend dragons to his will, which it's safe to say the Dragonborn would do that to the rest of the dragons. Which brings us to number three Skyrim would then have an army of dragon riding Nords which would give them a little bit of an advantage in my opinion. Alas if the Dragonborn is an imperial and sides with the Empire that would guarantee their win and give the Empire an army of dragons to ride on fighting the Aldmeri Dominion. I digress though since I have done no Research into this matter and this is simply my opinion on the subject.
You are forgetting that most Elder Scrolls protagonists leave after their respective games, Nerevarine goes to Akavir and the Hero Of Kvatch mantles both Pelinal and Sheogorath, it is likely something similar happens to the Dragonborn - possibly something to do with Herm Mora.
We should have a Elder Scrolls Day every year so when we get into History class our History teachers teach us about 1 event in The Elder Scrolls like The Great War or the fall of the Alyeid Empire
@@elchapojunior3091 Kinda did until Gettysburg. Had Lee won that battle, the war would have been over and everyone knew it. It was literally the turning point in the war in favor of the North.
Thanks for the video. I know your strong views on this, so as a Stormcloak supporter I very much appreciate your effort.^ I do think Ulfric would seek to ally with the Empire and Hammerfell after a hypothetical victory. They need each other against the Dominion. But not only that, his rebellion wasn't about waring against the Empire. It was about sovereignty as a solution to what he sees as Skyrim loosing it's identity and self-respect under an Empire having them make too many sacrifices in its name. Talos is the reason Skyrim joined that empire, and their identity with that Empire was lost when it asked them to forsake him (at least in Ulfric's eyes). If the Empire, whatever form it takes now that the Emperor is assassinated, will recognize Ulfric's Skyrim as an independent sovereign state- I have no problem believing he will get right to negotiating an alliance with the other neighboring states.
@@davionkrueger4748 I can assure you that such accusations are fake news. I made myself into an asset to be able to escape from them, once they thought i could be trusted, they let me go.
Something I've always asked myself about a stormcloak victory how does that affect the relationship between the imperial government and it's territory of high rock would lack of direct paths to the province lead it to slipping away or would it simply be even more autonomous and simply stay within the empire
Silver and gold are key parts of ancient economic systems. Prior to the creation of a purely paper money system backed by faith in the credit of a nation which we have had for the past hundred years or so, the actual silver or gold content of your coinage was extremely important. Study the Romans as their power waxed or waned their denarii got bigger or smaller which also influenced the purchasing power of each Roman coin with some denarii ending up being worth more than other denarii simply based on size. Denarii being primarily silver and being the most commonly used coin across the empire meant that the availability of easily struck silver for coinage was paramount for the functioning of the state. In fact when they entirely replaced the denarii with a new currency in the later part of the empire the writing was on the wall as to the likely survival of the empire at least the Western half of it. Silver doesn't sound like an absolute need for a nation, but silver and gold bullion have always been the cornerstones of a healthy state prior to the last two centuries and as such the Mede Empire would likely want a strong trade relation in the extremely unlikely event of a Stormcloak victory to ensure access to the large silver and gold mines in Skyrim as well as access to the noted availability of steel. So the basis for even a reworking of the current relationship to allow a semi-independent Skyrim in an alliance with the Empire makes sense if you get past the rather absurd arguments for Skyrim winning it's independence in the first place. The Empire would want the silver and gold for striking coins alone and they would also want the pure hatred that the Nords have for the Dominion to keep flowing into the Legions. So the groundwork for a new deal is there.
Never said differently. In ancient economies you really can never have too much of either for coinage. But in the lore the Reach mines of Skyrim are supposed to be rather rich which is why there would be at least an argument for some sort of deal being struck. Also throw in the multiple sources of ivory in Skyrim, another ancient source of wealth and the Nords have some bargaining tools on their side. As I suggested at the end the real problem is finding a way that under the sort of narrative Bethesda created how the Nords ever break free of the Empire in the first place. This is why I am a proponent of either this being a purely internal civil war where the Empire doesn't care because both sides will stay within the Empire or this being a matter of the Empire agreeing to a provisions in the White Gold Concordat that stated outright that Ysmir, which was originally an ancient Nord legendary hero coming out of Atmora, is and only can be Tiber Septim and that all previous legends are purely myth and all things credited to these other non-existent Ysmirs are purely false. The implication of that would be that all of Nord culture is a lie as the reappearance of Ysmir or new Ysmirs appearing is key to the Nord cultural identity. The Empire effectively agreeing to the Nords in essence having no gods of their own as Ysmir is supposed to be involved in the Nord mythos with multiple Nord gods in different ways. The greater implication since those Nord gods are at least in part the basis of the eight divines of Saint Alessia along with the Elven gods is that the human pantheon is just a cheap knockoff of the Mer gods. @@dutchpatriot17
If the Stormcloacks win, there won’t be no empire left, the dominion includes Elseweyr and Valenwood, Blackmarsh has gone feral, Morrowind is blown up, so basically what we have left of the “Empire” is Cyrodiil, Skyrim and High Rock.
And High Rock will most likely break up with the Empire aswell since Cyrodiil doesnt share any borders with High Rock so the only way to transport troops and goods would be through sea wich isnt very viable or practical. High Rock would most likely get split into small independent city kingdoms like Camlorn, Wayrest, Daggerfall, Orsinium, Northpoint etc.
@@jarlhighkingulfricstormclo5048 That would be good! High Rock will be ripe for the taking! Just have to sail around Hammerfell but it's not like Redguards would dare challenge the Altmer at sea.
@@jarlhighkingulfricstormclo5048 i see high rock remaining stable my king there ties to the empire has made them rich and they have had set backs but there likely going to stab the empire in the back when skyrim is free from empire and then come to you as a trading partner and helping to maintain safety from navel attack from west but i do recommend not to trust them.
@@jarlhighkingulfricstormclo5048 Actually, Skyrim and Hammerfell could take advantage of that, and make a trade deal with the Empire where they let the empire supply line go through their borders for a fee.
I personally agree with the Empire, but I sort of hope the Stormcloaks win. I think they're somewhat of a chekhov's gun for ES6. If they failed, what was the point of putting them in the game?
Ulfric wouldn't need to worry about convincing any Imperial Jarls to support his claim since if the stormcloaks were victorious, all the Imperial jarls would've been replaced by stormcloak jarls (i.e. Vignar Gray-Mane replacing Balgruuf in Whiterun or Maven Black-Briar replacing Laila Law-Giver in Riften) since Ulfric needs unanimous approval from all Jarls during the Moot to be confirmed as High King.
I honestly believe that Ulfric will accept national laws, the easy way to learn from the enemy is to know the enemy, obviously, this is the functionality of his laws in order to generally make Skyrim representative to even the citizens. These laws can be used against or with the nation which is why allowing the Justicars to remain in Skyrim is a good decision, it can represent the instability of your government but obviously not to prove it, so the problems can come from anywhere - which given the slogan for national laws can identify the enemy without declaring war on them.
Very much a stormcloak supporter. Their cause is just and the Imperials are essentially collaborators of the truly vile Thalmor. I could see High Rock and Hammerfell allying themselves with Skyrim and Morrowind establishing a peaceful relationship while covertly supporting Skyrim in any conflicts with the Thalmor.
I actually like the Thalmor in some ways but I'd still support the Stormcloaks against the Imperials. It would be best if the Empire and Aldmeri dominion were to die and for each province to govern themselves and for each race to have their own nation.
Just ran across this video. I think the biggest factor in what an Independent Skyrim would be like is whether or not they have enough resources to be self sufficient. I mean obviously because of game mechanics we can see they have the ability to be self sufficient, but just how many resources do they truly have available is the question since most of what we run across in game is rather finite and not nearly enough to actually be self sufficient. Also do they return to piracy and raiding to get more resources if they do not have enough to be self sufficient?
I don't even think that this as the optimistic outcome, but rather the realistic outcome. Besides the thalmor bit, that's ending in a second great war. the thalmor would either spiral in a great war or be extremely hostile for the time being, I can even imagine the small thalmor holdings (such as the fort and embassy) being raided by the stormcloacks in a fit of rage. Otherwise, this is probably extremely accurate
I used to really like the empire. The Septim empire. The current empire is a shell of its former self. I have no love or respect for them at this point. I am in full support of Skyrim winning the Civil War and Ulfric becoming high king. He rightfully earned that position. However, I do not agree with Skyrim being completely independent. They need strong allies and resources. I am not against working with the empire. We need an alliance to overthrow those bastard elves anyway.
@@dutchpatriot17 The title of Jarl isnt just any common title of nobility, Jarl and High King are titles of royalty wich is above the common nobility. Any jarl has as much right the thone as any other.
Love the Channel but this is my favorite video of yours. Thanks for walking down the road less traveled by Elder Scrolls you tubers. Damn faithless imperials 😁
I feel like it could be similar to ww2 where it is hammerfell, skyrim, morrowind, highrock and, the empire vs elwyre and the dominion with places like black marsh being neutral
It isn't about geopolitics. It's about liberty and religious freedom, it's about standing tall against men's ancient foe that goes all the way back to the beginning of recorded history; man and mer have always been pitted against one another. Its like the whole Anu/Padomay thing. These men would rather die proudly on their own two feet, worshipping who they please, governing themselves, than live on their knees. It's a matter of pride.
I’ve always been back and forth on which side I support, and honestly I probably lean Stormcloak because of the whole religious freedom thing, and I mean, I think of a foreign country came to America and said people couldn’t be Christian anymore, people would be pretty pissed. And rightfully so. That’s just an example I don’t want to start a political debate. But I also get that the Empire wants to just keep the peace until the strength builds back up so they can all go beat the Thalmor. But when you sit at the Stormcloak camps you can see the Empire is clearly lying when they say the line “what the rebels like to forget is the Empire is what’s keeping the dominion out of Skyrim” I mean obviously it’s not true cuz they have a whole embassy in Skyrim and the justiciars walk around everywhere but some Stormcloak soldiers talk about how their cousin disappeared in the night and soon after that’s when they joined Ulfric. Idk tho I like both sides they both have pros and cons but I don’t think the Stormcloaks are as hopeless as hardcore Imperial supporters say they are
Well if you imagine that the person they don't want you to worship was a ruthless warlord who used a god machine to annihilate your capitol even though there was no declaration of war and now they are praising him as a divine, you can see why they don't want to acknowledge him as a god. To the Altmer it's like if people started praising Hitler as a god. I doubt you would have a problem if America didn't allow people to worship him.
i agree with most of what you said but wouldn't it be for the best if the empire and Skyrim were united? because if you do go in their embassy they literally state that the civil war is beneficial to them because instead of waiting until the time is right and gethering their strength they're at each others throat all the time. if they were united they could fight another war and beat them and get their religious freedom back most of the imperials worship talos too
@@logan8638 If there was a way to negotiate for partial autonomy for Skyrim it would be the best option. Ulfric is a good ruler, but all men are brothers.
All I have to say is that they fight for their religious rights and freedoms and that they always saved the empire. without the Nords, the empire is done . They back stabbed skyrim time and time again. The empire could not even defeat the reach men on their own.
i thought Bethesda said somewhere that the cannon ending has the stormcloaks winning and the Emperor is dead? (b/c of the dark brotherhood quest since all faction quest are completed either by the hero or unnamed person.)
If that were true then all of the community would be pissed as your choices dont matter. The emperors death is also a choice as you can also fight the dark brotherhood and have him live. If its true we would really need a source for that
@@ImperialKnowledge well i cant find the article but there's little doubt in the community and reddit (as it is it's own entity) about the fact that the faction quests are all completed and Emps Mede is dead by Skyrim's conclusion..
I saw this point from a meme. Pretty much, when the Civil War began, Titus Mede II should’ve let Skyrim cede, because there’s still the overwhelming half of Skyrim (and or Balgruuf) who stay loyal to the Empire, meaning that both economically, we politically, they would likely stay on the same page.
Replayed Skyrim 6 times All for Stormcloaks. Not sure why. Maybe because I hate empire more... I don't care about Lore at this point I just find Ulfrik my boi
4:20 Hammerfell is not really “good friends” with the Empire because they fought off the Dominion from their lands to the protest of the heads in Cyrodill. An independent Skyrim would be closer and more respected by the people of Hammerfell because the independent Nords, like the Redguards, fought off the High Elves from their territories. Also, the empire completely abandoned Hammerfell to the Dominion. They literally have no diplomatic reasons to be “good friends.” It’s more like aggressive neutral. They have a shared enemy, but the Redguards are no where near considering rejoining the Empire.
Considering we have evidence that Hammerfell has good trade relations with the empire, the empire helped rebuild parts of hammerfell even after it became independent (See TES:Blades dialogue, which was made by the same people as Skyrim was), they have a common enemy, its been over 25 years, and the empire left a lot of discharged troops in hammerfell to help ward off the dominion instead of leaving them alone. I would say, yeah. The Empire is likely Hammerfell's closest friend on Tamriel. Rejoining the Empire? Thats never happening I presume. But most people don't marry and move in with all their good friends lol.
@@ImperialKnowledge Yeah, also, once a people are able to rule themselves with autonomy, they prefer to not be ruled by a foreign power in a distant land. The red guards would rather have a fellow Redguard rule over them than an imperial in Cyrodill. Also, without the direct oversight of the Empire, a more domestic government is better able to protect its citizens, keep its country stable, and fight off a Thalmor invasion. This is why there was so much chaos in many of the other provinces during the Oblivion Crisis; they weren’t used to autonomy, except the Argonians. It’s as simple as that. As for how this applies to Skyrim, the Imperialization of the Nords is what left their old pantheon of Shor to be forgotten. When the empire suddenly changes away from Talos, it’s very similar to what happened between the Irish Catholics and the British Protestants. The British first converted them to Catholicism, and then, they tried to convert them to Protestantism to which the Irish refused. Regardless if the Imperials change their mind afterward, it doesn’t change the disconnect between them and the Nords. The Nords should have their own culture and not just be a spinoff of Imperial culture. Regardless if it’s Ulfric leading it, Skyrim will have a constant roaming band of rebels, like the IRA for Ireland. Even after they’re destroyed in the civil war side quest, there are still rebel camps and sympathizers. That is simply not stable and not good for the quality of life of the average Nord in Skyrim. In the long run, a more locally ran Skyrim might be more stable and able to provide better protection to its citizens. Even though he doesn’t allow them in the cities, Ulfric’s more local rulership could help patrol the roads and keep them for safe for the Khajiit caravaners. There’s evidence of this in the game with the empire appointed Jarl of Falkreath. He quite literally deals with the bandits outside the city, and he’s too corrupt to even stop them. They literally have a boulder trap installed on the road that leads directly to Falkreath. Ulfric’s men have proven to be good at taking out the Reach Men too, and by crushing them, that benefits the citizens of Skyrim. It was the Empire’s involvement that prevented him from finishing them off. That is why I think the Stormcloaks have been character assassinated by the writers. We shouldn’t be rooting for imperialism. The Nords are dumb for hating the Dark Elves, but the Dunmer at least have a sense of autonomy back in their homeland. That was a key part for the plot of Morrowind, and it sucks that the writers forgot about it completely when they were writing Skyrim’s civil war.
Also, the Thalmor definitely wouldn't recognize Skyrim as an independent state. Skyrim would ramp up border security, and Ulfric could have the Thalmor agents within custody threatened to be executed, then make a show of reigning in his bloodthirst and agreeing to simply deport them (if he doesn't just deport them outright instead of the 4D Chess play). From there, an amnesty period of perhaps a month or so where Thalmor would be allowed to leave peacefully, and then afterwards any and all would be considered enemies of the state, determined as Kill On Sight. It's not a guerilla war, either, because Skyrim isn't the home territory of the Thalmor in the first place - they have no strong encampments, they would get little to no support from the people seeing as they openly hate all races but the Altmer and are known for their cruelty, and the fact that actual Thalmor agents are almost all High Elves, there isn't really the option for them to blend in with the population in plain sight.
High Rock likely isn’t going to be with the Empire for long, so it wouldn’t be too unlikely for Skyrim, High Rock, Hammerfell, and possibly even Orsinium to create an alliance against the Thalmor. Whether that would last or not afterwards is up for debate, but it always could. Either way, the idea of the entire northwestern portion of Tamriel vs the Thalmor is a sight I’d love see.
Trade agreements can even be made between enemies as history is kind enough to show. I can see even the Thalmor entering minor trade agreements for some goods tho it would be looked at with a careful eye by both sides for potential spies and coups.
hammerfell is independent in the 4th era, When Titus Mede I took the throne, the Empire was nothing like what it used to be. The province of Black Marsh seceded from the Empire following the Oblivion Crisis,[32] and Morrowind was largely destroyed,[32] with only the most western portion being ruled by the Dunmer and the south being taken over by the now-independent Argonians. In the wake of the Oblivion Crisis, the Thalmor convinced the Altmer of the Summerset Isles that they were their saviors from the Daedra invasion and consolidated their power.[33] In 4E 29, the government of Valenwood was overthrown by Thalmor collaborators and a union with Alinor proclaimed. Thus was the Aldmeri Dominion reborn.[32] Leyawiin and Bravil had become independent city-states, and were constantly at war with one another.[34] Elsweyr had declared independence and turned into the ancient kingdoms of Anequina and Pelletine.[35] The Empire's ineffectual protection and seeming indifference to Morrowind's plights made them reviled by the Dunmer. After the Empire "released its grasp" on Morrowind, House Hlaalu, the last Imperial ally in the province, was ousted from the Grand Council,[36] and Morrowind left the Empire,[35] as had Hammerfell.[35] Additionally, it is implied that High Rock had also left the Empire,[35] leaving it with Skyrim and most of Cyrodiil.
I'm a Stormcloak Supporter...I've never thought you didn't take them seriously. You're simply extremely biased against them is all. Like calling them a racist organization when the fact is their an nationalist organization who would gladly accept Bretons, Dunmer, Argonians even Altmer in Skyrim as long as they're loyal to the nation first and foremost while respecting the old traditions of the Nords/Atmorans.
I suppose that's why racial segregation is so prominent in Windhelm, and why the Stormcloak commanders are very glad to inform us they're going to kick out the elves?
I personally find the Stormcloaks to be too shortsighted, not looking at the big picture. Plus, I find Ulfric to be a murderer, as using the Thu'um against Torryg, who had all the combat experience of my nephew (who's 4, btw) to be the ultimate dick move/cheap shot. The fight was more one-sided than a bank robber trying to go hand to hand against Wonder Woman. He could have won the fight easily without the voice. Using it turned a duel into cold-blooded murder.
@@dutchpatriot17 the Altmer lady in windhelm's market place doesn't live in the grey quarter and says that if the dunmer wouldn't pity themselves they could live normally but rather complain about the nords
Skyrim already has it laws in order if you think about it. Criminal law like stealing and murder is in hold jurisdiction, meanwhile religious freedom is a province law. that's why ulfric sees his war as justified defence of religious freedom, meanwhile dunmer are not prosecuted for worshiping good daedra, even other deadra like mehrun dagon seems to be tolerated with huge statue on the side of the mountain and a museum in Dawnstar.
Can't forget about the dragonborn you know I just imagine him going around bending Wills of dragons and crating a armyand I feel like the dragonborn would go with the stormcloaks just because the imperials did try to execute him at all just for trying to enter the country
Nordic Dragon Riders is a very real possibility. Remember, Bend Will only as a time limit in-game. Canonically, it's permanent until another dragon overpowers the Dragonborn.
@@CyberController- and depending if you cited with the blades or not he also has parthenax is on his side which had a bunch of dragons swear allegiance to him so he probably already has a head start with that. and there could be an army of the best warriors of Skyrim called Dragon Riders which I'm pretty sure is self-explanatory what they do. They'll fight for him where dragons can't go. and he's well the leader of not only the thieves Guild but the dark Brotherhood so anybody who would oppose him would either be killed or framed for something. and as an archmage of the college he might even start a Renaissance of magic in Skyrim and have a bunch of Battle mages. and already has some great warriors with the companions so even with that pending Legion on the boarder if he plays his cards right he will win. and he's also the thayn of all the jarls so that would help with the Renaissance.
@@TheDrakanMaster124 Hang on, we can't give all of that to L.D. I'd say most of the guild stories were done by other people, so there was a different person who became the Companion's leader and another person who became Listener for the Brotherhood. The only stories I think L.D should be credited for are the ones that require of reference that he's Dragonborn. Main Story, Civil War, Dawnguard, Dragonborn. So L.D himself isn't running any of the other guilds, but somebody else is.
@@CyberController- after Oblivion the reason the mage and fighting guilds collapsed was because when the hero of kavached left to the shivering Isles and didn't come back they had no leadership. which means Bethesda assume that you're going to do all the quest lines
I understand your rationality. The lore (or rather the changed lore) of Skyrim makes what should happen with what will happen two different things. It is the main flaw of the game. According to the elder scrolls lore of the Nords and Skyrim prior to the game Skyrim, Nords do not worship ANY of the "nine Divines". Not even Talos. They have their own pantheon. Their Chief deity would be Shor. Otherwise known as Larkin, and it would be the banning of HIS worship that would cause the friction. The Elves Hate Shor far more than Talos, whom is only a hero to traditional Nords and not worshipped by most of them anyway(according to the original lore as can be read in the game Oblivion) Plus, not only the Grey Beards would Know how to shout.(Oblivion, pocket guide to Skyrim) Within Every Nord battalion, there would be those with the ability to shout down gates and city defences and they would have no need for siege equipment. The "voice" was actually a gift from Kyne, Not the fake god Akatosh who is known as Aurail to the Elves and Alduin to the Nords. Here lies the true problem. Aurial, the Elves Chief God, is the equivalent of the devil to the Nords, and Shor, (larkin) is the Devil to the elves...Which is why humans especially Nords and the elves have always been at war. The "Nine divines"are all made up, watered down versions of the Nord and elven Gods. Under the true lore, Ulfric wouldn't seem quite as much like an "ass" either and much more Justified as the defender of true Nord customs and traditions...And much more justified in using a shout to defeat Torig, because it should be an ability that any Nord can acquire through training and as the High King he should have know how to shout.
The elves don’t have the military strength to take the empire anymore. It would take Less than 20 years for the empire to renew its military. something tells me it takes a lot longer for a high elf to mature and be trained. The elves would lose a second great war, which is why they are resorting to subterfuge and intrigue.
The Empire trys to behead you if the dragonborn had free will and not being controlled by the player he or she will aways choose stormcloak and the dragonborn is all the stormcloaks need to win Skyrim. plus a 5 way free for all is more interesting in the next game
What are you talking about? If the Dragonborn had free will he would help the Dominion. Because unlike the Stormcloaks and Empire, you get compensated well when you align yourself with Thalmor interests.
My point is the thalmor and the imperials have tried to kill the dragonborn so the only likely conclusion is they would side with the stormcloaks not because of a shared believe but because they HAVEN'T TRY TO CUT YOUR FUCKING HEAD OFF and who wants thalmor blood money anyway just loot the merchant chest in dawnstar
@@leafpratt Actually, the Thalmor didn't try to kill you. The only time they do is after you kill them in the embassy quest. Also the Dominion has much more than people in dawnstar lol
Considering the Dragonborn basically destroys the Imperial forces and at end game has unrivaled power and wealth, it’s not at all farfetched that an Independent Skyrim could prevail against the Dominion. I personally torch the Thalmor Embassy with Odaviig regularly whether I’m Stormcloak or Imperial.
If we all think about it the red guards beat the Dominion the Nords are actually they're basically born as Warriors so if the red guards can defeat the Dominion surely the Nords of Skyrim could as well
My Mercenary Orc Dragonborn joined the stormcloaks. He liked Ulfric, and decided to support him. He doesn't necessarily care if the outcome is good or not. If anything, if it ends badly, that just means more Mercenary work for him. XD very selfish of him, I know.
Most Gray Quarter Dunmer are House Hlaalu (FYI, you don't have to have the same family name to be part of the House, like how the Ulens are Hlaalu), so the Dunmer Grand Council don't even want them back.
After losing Hammerfell, I really doubt the empire is not going to want to lose another region of Tamriel. My expectancy is for them to send ACTUAL legions, of TRAINED troops, you know ELITE soldiers against you know, the farm hands and merchants that make up the Stormcloak army...
Tullius himself said that the empire doesn't care about what happens in Skyrim as the rebellion is seen as nothing more than a side show before the main event that is the war with the dominion. In other words the imperials won't try to retake Skyrim after it has seceded.
i think seeing the map all split up like that is pretty cool in terms of set-up for another game. Could have like an all out faction-warfare as the main plotline to establish a new empire, whether it's thalmor, some kind of imperialist Skyrim or hammerfell, or the empire trying to restore it's former glory.
@@kozhedub All of the Houses have always agreed to cohabitate and govern their areas autonomously. With Hlaalu and the Empire out, Redoran took over most of the leadership roles.
@@EiriktheNordAndersen-ju4gl The fire.... This is the most stupid thing i ve ever heard. Ulfric lost to General Tullius and his guard in 6 months.. Trying to fight Thalmore would be a suicide. Anyway, Ulfric will die for the misuse of the voice.
@@alexionut2158 We did not lose. The war has been going on for years. He did not bring enough guards with him. Ulfrik will become the High King (if he isn't already). If Hammerfell beat you Elves back, we can. And Hammerfell does not even have a standing army, just a bunch of local militias, and they are right next to the Dominion.
I mean... To support the thing about Skyrim allying with Hammerfell without the Empire, the Empire _did_ kind of abandon them after they said “fuck you” to the White-Gold Concordat and kept fighting the Thalmor.
Ulfric would have pretty good relationships with morrowind, at least with Redoran's part of morrowind since, for starters, Morrowind hates the Empire for abbandoning them during the Oblivion crisis. On top of that Ulfric is the ONLY Jarl accepting refugees, for as much talk of racism ppl do in game, i dont see the other jarls donating 1/3 of their city exclusively to refugees (tax free btw). Also Ulfric is clearly keeping very friendly relationships with Morrowind since the only way to reach Solsheim is through Windhelm's port, it's not like the Empire has no other choice but to use Windhelm's port, Solitude has massive port too, but for some reason the Redoran house removed everything belonging to the Empire from their books including Empire trade rules, to the point where East Empire Company coins have become a collectionist item in Morrowind since they are actively hunted and destroyed by the higher ups. So as soon as Skyrim becomes independent they can restart the Ebonheart pact and get a fairly good support from Morrowind, something the Empire would not have access to.
The Redoran wouldn't care for Ulfric, his views do not align with their own. Ulfric also didn't "take in" refugees, they were already there over a 100 years before Ulfric's birth... The Dunmer don't live tax free either. There won't be any such alliance. The reason why Windhelm is connected to Solstheim is because Windhelm's port had always been the destination from Solstheim, even when the EEC was still operating there.
That doesn't mean the people become pro-Stormcloak too. If you go to the Imperial towns after a Stormcloak victory, you can find a lot of civil unrest among the people.
I've always played a nord so I jumped at the opportunity of a free skyrim. I'm also Celtic so we have a long bloody history with a certain European "empire" hint hint. Ulgric isn't perfect and I dislike his treatment of the dark elves but I believe an organization of free states would go better against the high elves.
Also with an independent Skyrim can we really ca Cyrodiil an Empire anymore considering it pretty much has High Rock left? Hammerfell left, Black Marsh left, Elsweyr is doing god knows what, and Cyrodiil abandoned Morrowind after the Red Year.
Well the thing is that Bethesda tends not to give their heroes lore post gameplay. Meaning the dragonborn will likely be dead or permanently out of the picture. For example if Bethesda made the dragonborn a stormcloak supporter, or imperial supporter in canon, then that means that people who played as a neutral thief, their playthroughs would no longer count canonically. So I am personally veryyy doubtful we will see the dragonborn. But its not impossible.
@@ImperialKnowledge yh I personally think it'll be season unending tbh but even then the Stormcloaks would have truce time to upgrade their equipment to say steel armor for the most part anyway and would likely fight with the Empire in exchange for independence
@Imperial Knowledge The war was already resolved at High Hrothgar, under Season Unending. When the Dragonborn convinced both leaders to a treaty. The Dragonborn goes off and kills Alduin. When the Dragonborn comes back, the emperor has arranged his own assassination, shortly after the Dragonborn's return. When this happens, the Empire will be forced to consider the conflict in Skyrim resolved and then retreat back to Cyrodiil. I believe this is how Bethesda will make sure that it doesn't matter which side you choose. No one wins. No one loses. It will end in a draw. I think the emperor's death will be the final straw that pushes the Empire to fall apart. It will create a power vacuum and the right chaos for the next Elder Scroll's story. We may be playing in an Elder Scrolls version of a Fallout situation, full of anarchy, corruption and mayhem. The world maybe starting in complete chaos, while something really big and bad is brewing in the background. Maybe some people are still fighting for the old empire, while others are fighting for a new one or others like things the way they are.
@@DabobbyG937 I just now noticed your comment after I posted mine. Glad to see someone else agrees. We already resolved the war, through Season Unending. This all happened during a Dragon Break. So, I think the Dragonborn getting involved in the civil war are just alternative outcomes that could have played out, which they have through us the player. But the only thing that is the constant in all of them, that links us all together, is Season Unending.
I appreciate that video and I do agree you're oversimplifying the Stormcloak point of view, although you make some really good points. One of the main reasons I think the rebellion might be the right option for Skyrim is the Hammerfell precedent. 1) The Empire was so quick to betray Hammerfell and just hand it to the Aldmeri Dominion, which would make the situation there terrible for the people. That act alone makes it really difficult for me to morally side with the Empire. 2) Hammerfell rightfully rebelled against that decision and successfully fought for their independence and drove the Thalmor away. It stands to argue, if they can do it, so could Skyrim(Skyrim isn't any weaker than Hammerfell). Even more, that would make them allies, sharing common political fate. And in general, the game makes it really hard to sympathise with the Empire, even though they might be the pragmatically better option. They often come off arrogant, disregarding the Nords and their culture, mocking and insulting them and their values, etc. Furthermore, Stormcloaks are more fun from a gameplay perspective. You get to legally slaughter Thalmor agents and not let them terrorise Skyrim's people. And that's a personal preference, but their aesthetics and vibe are clores to my preferences. I like everything Nordic and Scandinavian, they remind me of the Starks from GoT, who I think are much cooler than the Lanisters and even the colour-coding, I usually take the blue side: Ravenclaw, the NCR, Team Mystic, Democracy, etc. With all that being said and my obvious bias towards the Stormcloaks, I still think the Empire is the pragmatically better option, because of economic reasons, cultural diversity and military strength(potential to drive out the Thalmor) + I really dislike Ulfric's short-sidedness, impulsiveness and racism and jarl Balgruuf is my favourite jarl - much wiser and more diplomatic leader.
As a Stormcloak supporter, i like this video, but one thing that i wonder is if you really think that treaty-enforcers within Skyrim would really be a problem. If there is one thing that all people in Skyrim will probably agree on then it is that these guys are trash which would lead to some top-tier purges inside the cities and the embassy would probably be raided or even destroyed. This would cause a diplomatic crisis, but it is not like Skyrim under Ulfric ever intended for good relationship with the Thalmor. You also mention briefly that "the thalmor could send more enforcers" which i highly doubt due to their lack of acces to a harbour. And i wonder if they would be able to launch a full-scale invasion of Skyrim (like some imperials seem to believe), when they dont control the sea of ghosts or the abyssian sea and have to be just as afraid of an imperial attack on the border as the empire is of them
Kill the Justiciars and you have the Dominion at your door. The Empire is not ready to fight the Dominion yet, so the Stormcloaks would have to face them on their own. That's not going to end well.
@@dutchpatriot17 thats pretty dumb reasoning. As i outlined above, the Aldmeri dominion has no leverage to get to skyrim, as they are not bordering each other in any way whatsoever. Meanwhile , if they still tried and gathered the naval power and the men to launch a full scale invasion of skyrim, then the dominion would have to expose its valenwood border and the empire could eaily launch a devastating attack. The Dominion has no leverage on its own in skyrim, all it's power results from the submission of the empire
@@Infiritthor Ever heard of a navy? It's that thing the Altmer are famous for, after all. The Dominion of the Second Era was able to sail all the way to the border of Skyrim and Morrowind without being attacked; and during that time, they were actively *at war* with every nation of Tamriel. The Dominion would only need a pretty small army to conqeur Skyrim. The Stormcloaks are pretty damn weak. They were losing to only half of Skyrim; that's barely anything compared to the Dominion.
@@dutchpatriot17 i dont know the sources for your claims, but they sound pretty ridiculous. Anyway, in the white gold concordate they had to surrender their dominance about the abyssean sea and would have to violate the concordate as well as imperial AND hammerfell waters to get there. And even if we assume that the empire and hammerfell will sit by and jerk off while the dominion sends a fleet arround the entire continent to invade a human nation, how are they going to supply an invasion army? How are they going to send reinforcements? And even if we assume they have the insane logistical power to supply an invasion scale force on the other side of the continent and nore the empire neither hammerfell do anything about it, all it takes is just one minor victory of the humans at ANY point of the campaign and this operation will become stalingrad for the dominion. If you really believe any of this, you are crazy
@@Infiritthor I'd like a citation for the claim regarding the Abecean, sounds like you're making that up on the spot. I think you seem to forget that the best of the Stormcloaks struggles against the worst of the Empire, while the best of the Empire was getting slaughtered by the Dominion. Let that sink in.
I fever the Empire since I played oblivion to be the winning side but just by a bit because I really understand the stormcloak side why they rebel. But if you have me pick I hope the stormcloaks win because I see a lot more potential lore wise. What I Like to see is with the stormcloak victory and the death of Titus Mead II that the Empire will fall apart. Cyrodill will start having his own cival wars because a lot of people will want to be Emperor. This would mean that the Empire's influence will dwingel and eventually fall apart with the Kingdoms of Highrock starring to rule them self more and more because the Empire is fighting itself in Cyrodill. More and more county's would start governing on them self and slowly especially in the south fall to the overwhelming power of the dominion. Some others will stant together or, what I would like to see, Bruma joining the Kingdom of Skyrim because they see that as the best way to survive. With this set there is much potential to let the human kingdoms join together and even tray to form a 4th empire to fight the altmery dominion wich is slowly taking over cyrodill and planning to attack the rest as well
@@dutchpatriot17 not really, don't forget Hammerfall fought the dominion for an other 5 years after the great war and actually won. With hammerfall, Highrock, Skyrim and some cyrodillic county's combined in a alliance the dominion has a terrible enemy
@@casthelion416 Hammerfell did not win, they fought an already weakened Aldmeri army - which did not even try to conqeur the province any longer - to a standstill, signed a treaty, and the Dominion chose to withdraw. It is canon that the Empire, including Hammerfell, would have been slaughtered without the Concordat.
@@dutchpatriot17 if you see the treaty as just an retreat from the dominion yes but I see it as a victory. Also that the dominion would have won is not canon, it isn't in any official content. And I don't think they would have. Because both sites were losing hard they both wanted peace, if the dominion could have won, they wouldn't make peace and especially not with a more fair concordat than the first over they made before the great war actually began
@@casthelion416 Except that it is in official content. Hell, within the official content it comes from a neutral source which does not suffer from the unreliable narrator; a loading screen regarding lore, aka, raw developer input.
![[9 august 2023] Cat playing Roots of Pacha](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/FkicL7dIaBI/mqdefault.jpg)
Am I a Stormcloak now?
Relevant meme now: cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/321713317221498880/534812488009777172/Meme.jpg
Welcome to the army!
Nope, you're still an imperial milk drinker. But you're our imperial milk drinker.
Imperial Knowledge The stormcloak army is coming for you now. Get ready. 😂😂😂
IgnoreMeI'mAnAutisticNEET couldn’t say it better myself
Didnt balgruuf die
Morrowind doesn't belong to the Empire anymore, one of the dunmers of Ravenrock explains that during the oblivion crisis, the Empire removed his troops from Morrowind, the house Redoran had to create a proper dark elf army, and then they banned house Hlaalu for having collaborated with the empire...
Khajiit Merchants see Skyrim is in a poor state after a Stormcloak Victory and Ripe for Merchants...
"Whispers"
It's Free Real Estate
VictoriumStudios 78 *Khajits buy all the destroyed farms* Khajit has land if you have coin 😂
"Jim, come get your damn land. It's a FREE HOUSE!" - Jarl of Falkreath
If I only knew as much about my school subjects as you know tes i would pass my exams 100%
I know the feeling
Even though we have our disagreements, I think the empire and the stormcloaks agree on one thing: The Thalmor suck.
Exactly which is a reason they should team up
@@dragonbornofnerevar1661 Or just not rebel for one man’s ambition
@@solomongrundy1618 or not try to control other land that don't like you
As a proud American . . . I mean a proud Stormcloak, I agree. Thalmor suck donkey ass.
Skyrim leaving the empire = Skrexit
Yeeesss
I agree that skyrim should not be part of the empire anymore it has failed skyrim
Ulfric's getting real hyped about those new *bloo* banners.
Make Atmora Great Again.
Farage is Ulfric in a suit. FOR THE BRITS!
Think Skyrim and the Empires relationship will kind of replicate the US and UK relations after the War of Independence.
Not really, the US and the UK weren't facing an existential threat that in part caused their war.
Skyrim doesn't have a France to save their asses. Thank God for the French... I'll always be on good terms with them because of their alliance.
@Dran Wulf And By French you mean the Bretons of High Rock?
It will probably get better over time
naw the empires should win, after all they almost won once but Alduin helped Ulfric escape.
8:35 Ulfric doesn't show any negative thought towards the dunmer as a people. The refugees live rough, but the reason their situation hasn't been tended to is explained to be because of the war effort taking priority at the moment.
You get a bad impression when entering Windhelm for the first time because you do see genuine racism. But that's the town drunk, not Ulfric. Ulfric took in the refugees within city walls, allowed them to open shops stalls, and even the chance to obtain farmland. He recognized the contention between them and the Argonians, and keep them separated to avoid bloodshed over their horrible history.
As for the general Nord population, most Nords will appreciate and respect those who are hard working. Belyn Hlaalu, a dunmer owning a farm outside the city, says as much. And they will probably not respect those who don't.. and unfortunately it seems at least quite a few dunmer within the city sees working for and with Nords as something beneath them to be ashamed of. At least if Faryl Atheron's words are something to go by. He says he hopes no one from the city sees him out working the farm, and that his brother is ashamed of him working for a Nord.
The Nords are racist towards Dunmer and vice versa. It's okay.
@@albertobertorelli4511 Some are, sure. But I think it's a mistake to paint to wide and say it's as simple as everyone is racist. Specifically my point was that you can't just take that idea and just assume Ulfric's neglect of the dunmer within the city comes from racism. With the aid and opportunity he has given, especially in war time, I'd say it's not likely the case. If he was just racist towards dark elves, he wouldn't even allow them to live within the hold, let alone city walls.
@@Jonas_æ Those elves have been coming in for over a century. They are not loyal to Skyrim and nor do they belong there. They are a dangerous 5th column.
Ulfric is literally the one who forces the Dunmer into that slum and the Argonians at the docks. Ulfric didn't take in anyone; those Dunmer have been there since 4E 5, over 100 years prior to the birth of Ulfric. The Dunmer and Argonians didn't have any problems, Ulfric's segregation makes no sense.
Ambarys Rendar makes it very clear that their conditions worsened when Ulfric took over.
@@dutchpatriot17 Actually, my segretation does make sense considering the quite recent past history of Dunmer and Argonians, they were quite recently at war with eachother and pretty much hates eachother, I know this, and separating them is only for the reason to avoid conflicts and fights between them inside the city walls.
You just gave me an Idea for a character backstory. Redguard siding with Stormcloaks so that Hammerfell has good connections with Skyrims new government.
The Crowns would never ally with anyone that’s not a Redguard. Maybe if High Rock joined in and they’d form a new Covenant, but that would require another siege of Orsinium... something I don’t suggest while fighting the Dominion at the same time.
Dude. That's a dope idea.
Why would Hammerfell be overly friendly with the Empire, they basically sold the Southern part of Hammerfell to the Thalmor, forcing Hammerfell to leave the Empire to drive the Thalmor out
Because The Empire indirectly helped them by leaving a legion that was detrimental in the victory that helped Hammerfell survive the Dominion.
@@theicelandicviking4474 That was a smart move from the Empire which left the Aldmeri Dominion with less than they've bargained for.
@@dashua1735 It was. It basically saved the Empire too if you think about it, if the Dominion controlled Hammerfell they'd have quite the advantage and could probably jumpstart the second great war a lot faster and attack from many sides
The Icelandic Viking if I remember correctly the Empire didn’t gave any instructions (otherwise the Thalmor would go after them).
The Legion segment you are referring to were locals who lived & knew the land. When they fought, they weren’t part of the Legion or Empire anymore since the Empire completely gave up and bent over for some elf dick to keep Cyrodiil.
I wouldn’t say it was « detrimental » afaik you don’t see any clues about it or maybe in an Imperial document. It did help for sure. But Redguards are literally the best warriors in Tamriel so no surprise they won.
I’m not a fan of the Stormcloaks but the Empire is indeed shit who only look after Cyrodiil in the end, the rest can fuck off if they are pressured. The fact Hammerfell won just show how pointless the Thalmor peace treaty was and how dumb the Empire was to accept them.
@@IRedpunk
Without Cyrodiil, there would be no Empire. It's literally the Imperial heartland.
Don't forget, Hammerfell got the "off brand" Legion and had extra warriors. Yes they gave up some of Hammerfell, but they had other provinces that needed taking care of.
We see most of the Empire is in shambles, and Hammerfell was lucky. They could've kept fighting, but if the Dominion pushed for Cyrodiil like they did, or figured Hammerfell wasn't possible to take with Imperial support... I mean, just saying, there's more to the dynamic.
Honestly a Stormcloak victory would be very interesting for the Elder scrolls as a series. We could play elder scrolls in a post empire era where the political situation would be similar to the fall of Rome, where even there race of imperial is rename Cyrodiilian or whatever the new short term is, and there could be more revolts in the dominion with Elsewayr and Valenwood. It would be interesting.
Imperials were named Imperials even after fall of empires, as ESO provides. So race probably won't be renamed.
My ancestors are smiling at me imperial, can you say the same?
One thing you didn’t cover is that after red year, Skyrim gave solstheim to house redoran in morrowind to help as a relief, so the dunmeri people may have more cordial relations after the fact
Yeah, the high king at the time did that. not Ulfric Stormcock
Ulfric being the idiot he is probably would try to retake it anyways
@@ienglish4203 If anything they might be more aggro because last time an a-hole who didn't like elves was leading Skyrim, the Chimer spent who knows how many years as second-class citizens in the Nord empire until this one merchant caravan guard nobody went and became Hortator.
And we ALL know that not only are Dunmer great at grudges, but Nerevar is the Redorans' patron saint.
I don't think there would be an official alliance between Skyrim and Morrowind, due to the common prejudice towards Dark Elves within the Stormcloak ranks. Also, the two provinces have a history of fighting each other.
@Adam West I'm aware of that fact, I just said cordial. Political relationships change all the time so obviously political status and rivalries might also change
As someone who usually goes Stormcloak, I'm glad you took the time to make this video, with no bias. In any other video, it's a battlefield in the comment section.
Have you read the comment section friend? Its still a battlefield lmao. Hail Ulfric.
@@franciosdeaeruiu7555 For Skyrim!
@@franciosdeaeruiu7555 :3
@@ulfricstormcloack4066 my jarl, have this sweet roll
*sweet roll added
@@toddhowarddressedasatellyt702 and you, shall have my axe.
Skyrim also has a large lumber supply. There's also a lot of iron deposits scattered across, so they also have iron to provide. Their proximity to the sea also has fish. They have plenty of natural resources to trade.
They have furs, ivory, dwemer stuff, dragon stuff etc
Places like Whiterun are good farm land so potatoes, cabbages, carrots and other veg are in good supply.
I think it's smart of Ulfric to keep Elisif in power. He never really had any real ally in Solitude, so it eases the transition.
As valid of a point as that is, he murdered her husband. It's the one ruler that will work to undermine him no matter what, because of non-diplomatic personal matters
Well, despite Bryling does not support them she has high opinion about and respect for Stormcloaks. She could be even better ally than reluctant Elisif
I realise this is a odd video But I just wanted to say something... If the stormcloaks won the Civil War in Canon that means that they have the last dragonborn.... In canon the bend will shout from the dragonborn DLC Is much more powerful than in game mechanics.... The stormcloaks could have the very 1st Air Force of the elder scrolls series And exterminate the high elfs
''In canon the bend will shout from the dragonborn DLC Is much more powerful than in game mechanics''
Not really. If it were, Miraak would've never been defeated.
Also, speaking of Miraak, the LDB replaces him, so he won't be present.
@@dutchpatriot17 Miraak got owned by one very determined and very likeable dragon priest, and had to have Herma-Mora himself save him from getting wrecked by Vahlok, so yeah, backing you up on "the bend will shout isn't that powerful". Couldn't even sway one loyal Dragon follower, pffft.
Honestly I'm pretty sure that the LDB is just an aspect of Akatosh the same way Aspera Whatever-Friend is one of Boethiah, and just popped in to smack a few people down who'd doom the world out of its place and will vanish again, cheating every Prince out of a soul they thought they'd been promised because SURPRISE THAT SOUL NEVER EXISTED.
There is an option to remain neutral though isn't there? That's always been my headcanon, the last dragonborn heads a temporary truce to deal with Alduin. What happens after that is out of their hands as they have no part in the war.
@@DeruwugenI feel like less lives are lost in the stalemate if you throw your weight behind one faction or other and deal with the war quickly. That's my headcanon. Attrition claims lives by the day, and it would help both sides to end the war asap to pivot resources toward defeating the thalmor in the immenent war
@@neoqwertythe ldb did exist canonically, why the fuck would he get married and adopt a kid if he was only an aspect of akatosh. You are sort of right though, Dragonborn's are aspects of akatosh in a way though they live normal human lives and have children. It's more likely the Dragonborn became emperor (actually that's the most likely scenario regardless of which side they picked) due to the significance of a Dragonborn and the empire. Every time the empire is Uber successful, it is because a Dragonborn is in charge.
Honestly idk if Ulfric would be willing to put someone like Balgruuf in a position as a diplomat it wouldn't seem like the smartest idea in regard s to internal stability Balgruuf might start making back door deals with the empire to reclaim his throne in Whiterun and restore imperial rule to Skyrim
Although I personally like the Stormcloaks, having been a largely Nord player since I first played an Elder Scrolls game (Oblivion), I long ago accepted that ultimate Stormcloak Victory would be highly unlikely an outcome. Does that mean that any books on the subject in ES 6 and onward will universally accept the Imperial Campaign canon? I doubt it. When it comes to faction whatnot, the Elder Scrolls generally tends to be a little vague. I expect a line about the Skyrim Civil War going something to the effect:
"The Imperial Army and the Stormcloaks fought fiercely, each nearly defeating the other several times, but ultimately the Empire prevailed."
As for Ulfric hating the Empire...If I may point out that the man tried, several times in fact, to work with the Empire. Yet every time he'd try to get the concessions he'd negotiated for, he'd be denied. If anything, I'd say Ulfric has great respect for the Imperial Legions and the Empire as a whole....certainly more respect for the Imperials than the Imperials have for him.
I just wanna be worshipped
The Empire has betrayed you and forsaken you, thats why im fighting them! To make them milkdrinkers answer for their crimes!
Quiet you! You aren't a Divine!
@@benyosefdrak2686 I achieved Chim and what have you achieved in your puny mortal life.
@@tris7794 Um, where did it say he achieved Chim?
Oh nothing much just Conquering all of Tamriel and making your Empire our puppet.
@@Son_of_Thunder_2000 Milkdrinker! Maven Black-Briar is corrupt, criminal and should absoluteley not be jarl. And good riddance for my old friend Balgruuf for drinking the Empires milk!
I wouldn't expect the Justicars to be a problem.
They aren't an occupying military force, they're a small group of political commissars who can only operate because of the legal protection afforded by the White Gold Concordat. Which would no longer apply to an independent Skyrim. So if they have any sense, they'll leave to avoid getting lynched by an angry mob while the guards watch and drink mead.
To an extent yes, although the Justicars still present the consequences of the current situation political in Skyrim - any nation or country (and yes they are two totally different things obviously) has to be look at even depending on victories or political advantages which is the answer to the Thalmor’s idea of the problem but also why this can be viewed as a advantage within the new nation. So if the Justicars leave there’s multiple reasons why they could presume to understand why, because it’s their job or maybe the pressure or as you said; local violence and discrimination, this then can be viewed as an independence trait, which ultimately is why the Justicars exist; to ultimately remind Skyrim of Skyrim and most importantly the Empire, So it starts as another game of pointless political secrecy which can only be taken as an idea with advantages similar to the last, Yeah.
LOL proof that Ulfric winning isn't the worst timeline.
Exactly the moment the Stormcloaks enter Haafingar they're leaving the embassy although they'd probably leave a few intelligence units to accumulate information which would be am extreme risk
While it’s makes more practical sense for Skyrim to stay with the Empire, a Stormcloak victory makes for many more story possibilities.
I think this was a very well thought out video that set out all variables a Stormcloak Government would need to overcome in the days following the establishment of an independent country. This video pretty much lines up with my own ideal scenario for a post Skyrim Civil War setting and would most certainly be the course that my Stormcloak Dragonborn would champion. I would like to thank the producer of this video for creating it to be as well as it came out.
9:35 yeah.... That’s TOTALLY the reason why the Dominion wouldn’t want to work with us... definitely not the fact that they despise anything non-elf.
I often compare Skyrim with the situation in my homeland in real life (we had a civil war some 25 years ago and from one war collapsed into quite a few tiny states) - over time, we didn't reunite, despite all the similarities that we had, but instead the relations are improving and you can say that now we are friendly nations. People still like each other despite the hardships - it's only governments that spice things up. But anyways, over time, everyone accepted the current status quo and have made peace with the fact that, while we may not be united anymore, we can at least be friendly to each other (we are often the first ones to help each other during calamities, such as floods and earthquakes)
Sorry if I am politicising it a bit, but it's just how I see and compare the Skyrim civil war, as well as the overall collapse of the Tamrielic Empire
@RadTheLad Yeah
@RadTheLad Couldn't agree more, it's a pity really
Yugoslavia?
For real world parallels, I'd point to the United States after the American Revolution. Great Britain remained a major trading partner, and the Federalist Party, which was the first party to hold power, generally favored Britain and was even prepared to go to war with France. So I suspect that some relations between Skyrim and the Empire would be maintained, even if Ulfric himself isn't involved.
This is nothing similar though.
As a Stormcloak supporter, I thank you for making a fair and unbiased synopsis of what would happen in a best case scenario for a Stormcloak victory.
Talos is a god though
Not to the Thalmor. They are milkdrinkers, all of them!
Jarl & High King Ulfric Stormcloak, when we win you should become friends with the redguards and imperials so that we can all go fuck up the thalmor together.
@John Marston Sr never mind because i changed my mind.
And yet, he didn't help the Stormcloaks in the Civil War.
No he is a bitch
The thing that makes Skyrim different is that the protagonist actually is just there by the end. You come back from Sovengard, you don't get influenced and controlled by Hermaous Mora, you stop the Volkihar vampires. So you resolve everything and just are in Skyrim afterwards. I mean depending on the race the Dragonborn actually is I mean they could potentially exist for a few hundred years. And you can't tell me the Dragonborn wouldn't have a huge influence in Tamriel after doing so much and basically becoming a living God in the process. All the other games had a conclusion more or less for your character. But Skyrim doesn't have your character going off somewhere to never be seen again, or die. You just become basically the most powerful being in your time and you solve every major issue in the world at that time. It really will be interesting to see what happens canon wise because they can't just ignore the dragonborn in the lore at this point
Lol you think my boy Tullius will fail? Think again
Said the Emperor before he dies in Tullius city
Lol do you trust Penitus Oculatus? Think again.
I'll never surrender Skyrim into the hands of a corrupt and dying Empire!!! Damn imperial milkdrinkers!!! Soon enough, we will march on Solitude. And on that day the heroes of Sovngarde will march with us! And you and your boy Tullius will fall to your knees in fear!!!!!!
but his legate murdered you, with WORDS!!!!
@@jarlhighkingulfricstormclo5048 You're even more nationalist then the French Revolutioneries lol.
I don't see the Stormcloaks taking on the Aldmeri Dominion without the Dragonborn doing 99% of the fighting. I hope if a Stormcloak victory is cannon they don't start a war after the civil war.
I mean, that one dual wield build i did was kind of op. Put my dual wield dragonborn against all of tamriel, im confident he would win
I hope they do, so they get f***ed over xD
4:20
5:20
Uh, Hammerfell kicked the Empire out of their province, too.
In addition, High Rock is in an uneasy position with the Empire as is seen with Ulfric bothering to try and convince them to join his side.
Ulfric himself says; ''nah, bretons never had any problem with the empire'' with anger. he was just desperate
I think one thing that is probably being overlooked is who does the Dragonborn side with depending on who the Dragonborn side with would decide who wins. Now let's say that the Dragonborn is a Nord and sides with the Stormcloaks, that would guarantee their win. As for why, number one, the Dragonborn defeats Alduin which intimidates all the other dragons. Number Two the Dragonborn doe's defeat Miraak which gives him the ability to bend dragons to his will, which it's safe to say the Dragonborn would do that to the rest of the dragons. Which brings us to number three Skyrim would then have an army of dragon riding Nords which would give them a little bit of an advantage in my opinion. Alas if the Dragonborn is an imperial and sides with the Empire that would guarantee their win and give the Empire an army of dragons to ride on fighting the Aldmeri Dominion. I digress though since I have done no Research into this matter and this is simply my opinion on the subject.
You are forgetting that most Elder Scrolls protagonists leave after their respective games, Nerevarine goes to Akavir and the Hero Of Kvatch mantles both Pelinal and Sheogorath, it is likely something similar happens to the Dragonborn - possibly something to do with Herm Mora.
We should have a Elder Scrolls Day every year so when we get into History class our History teachers teach us about 1 event in The Elder Scrolls like The Great War or the fall of the Alyeid Empire
The Stormcloaks never intended to win a war against the Empire, they just need to make one so costly that the Empire pulls out.
That’s a dumbass thing the stormcloaks are doing.
Ya that worked real well for the confederates
@@elchapojunior3091 Kinda did until Gettysburg. Had Lee won that battle, the war would have been over and everyone knew it. It was literally the turning point in the war in favor of the North.
@@RealAugustusAutumn A storm cloak fan and a confederate simp, color me surprised lol
Thanks for the video. I know your strong views on this, so as a Stormcloak supporter I very much appreciate your effort.^
I do think Ulfric would seek to ally with the Empire and Hammerfell after a hypothetical victory. They need each other against the Dominion. But not only that, his rebellion wasn't about waring against the Empire. It was about sovereignty as a solution to what he sees as Skyrim loosing it's identity and self-respect under an Empire having them make too many sacrifices in its name. Talos is the reason Skyrim joined that empire, and their identity with that Empire was lost when it asked them to forsake him (at least in Ulfric's eyes).
If the Empire, whatever form it takes now that the Emperor is assassinated, will recognize Ulfric's Skyrim as an independent sovereign state- I have no problem believing he will get right to negotiating an alliance with the other neighboring states.
*Bumps in*
Skyrim never willingly joined the Empire. It was conqeured by the Legions.
@@dutchpatriot17 Have you ever read your history? The Empire started in Skyrim and wasnt conquered by anyone, read your history!!!
Or he runs all public relations because he is a sleeper agent... and he screws skyrim because they turned him into the winter soldier.
@@davionkrueger4748 I can assure you that such accusations are fake news. I made myself into an asset to be able to escape from them, once they thought i could be trusted, they let me go.
@@jarlhighkingulfricstormclo5048 You will do as you're told puppet!
Something I've always asked myself about a stormcloak victory how does that affect the relationship between the imperial government and it's territory of high rock would lack of direct paths to the province lead it to slipping away or would it simply be even more autonomous and simply stay within the empire
Silver and gold are key parts of ancient economic systems. Prior to the creation of a purely paper money system backed by faith in the credit of a nation which we have had for the past hundred years or so, the actual silver or gold content of your coinage was extremely important.
Study the Romans as their power waxed or waned their denarii got bigger or smaller which also influenced the purchasing power of each Roman coin with some denarii ending up being worth more than other denarii simply based on size. Denarii being primarily silver and being the most commonly used coin across the empire meant that the availability of easily struck silver for coinage was paramount for the functioning of the state. In fact when they entirely replaced the denarii with a new currency in the later part of the empire the writing was on the wall as to the likely survival of the empire at least the Western half of it.
Silver doesn't sound like an absolute need for a nation, but silver and gold bullion have always been the cornerstones of a healthy state prior to the last two centuries and as such the Mede Empire would likely want a strong trade relation in the extremely unlikely event of a Stormcloak victory to ensure access to the large silver and gold mines in Skyrim as well as access to the noted availability of steel.
So the basis for even a reworking of the current relationship to allow a semi-independent Skyrim in an alliance with the Empire makes sense if you get past the rather absurd arguments for Skyrim winning it's independence in the first place. The Empire would want the silver and gold for striking coins alone and they would also want the pure hatred that the Nords have for the Dominion to keep flowing into the Legions. So the groundwork for a new deal is there.
But Cyrodiil itself is home to plenty of Silver and Gold mines.
Never said differently. In ancient economies you really can never have too much of either for coinage. But in the lore the Reach mines of Skyrim are supposed to be rather rich which is why there would be at least an argument for some sort of deal being struck.
Also throw in the multiple sources of ivory in Skyrim, another ancient source of wealth and the Nords have some bargaining tools on their side.
As I suggested at the end the real problem is finding a way that under the sort of narrative Bethesda created how the Nords ever break free of the Empire in the first place.
This is why I am a proponent of either this being a purely internal civil war where the Empire doesn't care because both sides will stay within the Empire or this being a matter of the Empire agreeing to a provisions in the White Gold Concordat that stated outright that Ysmir, which was originally an ancient Nord legendary hero coming out of Atmora, is and only can be Tiber Septim and that all previous legends are purely myth and all things credited to these other non-existent Ysmirs are purely false. The implication of that would be that all of Nord culture is a lie as the reappearance of Ysmir or new Ysmirs appearing is key to the Nord cultural identity. The Empire effectively agreeing to the Nords in essence having no gods of their own as Ysmir is supposed to be involved in the Nord mythos with multiple Nord gods in different ways. The greater implication since those Nord gods are at least in part the basis of the eight divines of Saint Alessia along with the Elven gods is that the human pantheon is just a cheap knockoff of the Mer gods.
@@dutchpatriot17
Empire Fans: *Triggered*
I was triggered all the way while writing this video
@@ImperialKnowledge LOL
Damn imperial milkdrinkers.
Stormcloaks have no future
@@jarlhighkingulfricstormclo5048 hail you, king Ulfric
If the Stormcloacks win, there won’t be no empire left, the dominion includes Elseweyr and Valenwood, Blackmarsh has gone feral, Morrowind is blown up, so basically what we have left of the “Empire” is Cyrodiil, Skyrim and High Rock.
And High Rock will most likely break up with the Empire aswell since Cyrodiil doesnt share any borders with High Rock so the only way to transport troops and goods would be through sea wich isnt very viable or practical. High Rock would most likely get split into small independent city kingdoms like Camlorn, Wayrest, Daggerfall, Orsinium, Northpoint etc.
@@jarlhighkingulfricstormclo5048 That would be good! High Rock will be ripe for the taking! Just have to sail around Hammerfell but it's not like Redguards would dare challenge the Altmer at sea.
@@jarlhighkingulfricstormclo5048 i see high rock remaining stable my king there ties to the empire has made them rich and they have had set backs but there likely going to stab the empire in the back when skyrim is free from empire
and then come to you as a trading partner and helping to maintain safety from navel attack from west but i do recommend not to trust them.
And Orsinium... for now.
@@jarlhighkingulfricstormclo5048 Actually, Skyrim and Hammerfell could take advantage of that, and make a trade deal with the Empire where they let the empire supply line go through their borders for a fee.
Ulfric in the thumbnail: hi everyone!
The Empire needs to push the Argonians out of Morrowind and then convince them to join the empire if they arent already
No, if the Empire takes Riften, they talk about _invading_ Morrowind "just in case".
I personally agree with the Empire, but I sort of hope the Stormcloaks win. I think they're somewhat of a chekhov's gun for ES6. If they failed, what was the point of putting them in the game?
You can say the same thing about the Thalmor.
@@dutchpatriot17 and if the Thalmor won, that would be a really good set up for ES6 as well
@@dutchpatriot17 Thalmor aren't a playable faction.
@@DarkAdonisVyers Are you a troll, or just a stalker?
@@dutchpatriot17 Imagine thinking that I'm watching ES videos just to stalk you.
So….
The Redguards, the Nords, the Imperials, the Wood Elves, and the Dunmer are united in their hatred of the Thalmor?
Maybe use that?
Ulfric wouldn't need to worry about convincing any Imperial Jarls to support his claim since if the stormcloaks were victorious, all the Imperial jarls would've been replaced by stormcloak jarls (i.e. Vignar Gray-Mane replacing Balgruuf in Whiterun or Maven Black-Briar replacing Laila Law-Giver in Riften) since Ulfric needs unanimous approval from all Jarls during the Moot to be confirmed as High King.
I honestly believe that Ulfric will accept national laws, the easy way to learn from the enemy is to know the enemy, obviously, this is the functionality of his laws in order to generally make Skyrim representative to even the citizens. These laws can be used against or with the nation which is why allowing the Justicars to remain in Skyrim is a good decision, it can represent the instability of your government but obviously not to prove it, so the problems can come from anywhere - which given the slogan for national laws can identify the enemy without declaring war on them.
Very much a stormcloak supporter. Their cause is just and the Imperials are essentially collaborators of the truly vile Thalmor. I could see High Rock and Hammerfell allying themselves with Skyrim and Morrowind establishing a peaceful relationship while covertly supporting Skyrim in any conflicts with the Thalmor.
I actually like the Thalmor in some ways but I'd still support the Stormcloaks against the Imperials.
It would be best if the Empire and Aldmeri dominion were to die and for each province to govern themselves and for each race to have their own nation.
Just ran across this video. I think the biggest factor in what an Independent Skyrim would be like is whether or not they have enough resources to be self sufficient. I mean obviously because of game mechanics we can see they have the ability to be self sufficient, but just how many resources do they truly have available is the question since most of what we run across in game is rather finite and not nearly enough to actually be self sufficient. Also do they return to piracy and raiding to get more resources if they do not have enough to be self sufficient?
I don't even think that this as the optimistic outcome, but rather the realistic outcome. Besides the thalmor bit, that's ending in a second great war. the thalmor would either spiral in a great war or be extremely hostile for the time being, I can even imagine the small thalmor holdings (such as the fort and embassy) being raided by the stormcloacks in a fit of rage. Otherwise, this is probably extremely accurate
I used to really like the empire. The Septim empire. The current empire is a shell of its former self. I have no love or respect for them at this point. I am in full support of Skyrim winning the Civil War and Ulfric becoming high king. He rightfully earned that position. However, I do not agree with Skyrim being completely independent. They need strong allies and resources. I am not against working with the empire. We need an alliance to overthrow those bastard elves anyway.
Ulfric didn't ''earn'' anything, certainly not rightfully.
@@dutchpatriot17 The title of Jarl isnt just any common title of nobility, Jarl and High King are titles of royalty wich is above the common nobility. Any jarl has as much right the thone as any other.
@@jarlhighkingulfricstormclo5048 I know you're a massive troll RPing to death, but no. That's not how it works.
@@dutchpatriot17 Yes they do, if there is no direct "heir" to the king or queen who died. and Torygg and Elisif had no child.
Empire died with martin septim
Man by the end of the video you have earned our heart. Don't worry too much you've made a hell of a video my friend. *Applauds*
Love the Channel but this is my favorite video of yours. Thanks for walking down the road less traveled by Elder Scrolls you tubers. Damn faithless imperials 😁
I feel like it could be similar to ww2 where it is hammerfell, skyrim, morrowind, highrock and, the empire vs elwyre and the dominion with places like black marsh being neutral
I don't see why skyrim couldn't become friends with the empire look at America and the British
It isn't about geopolitics. It's about liberty and religious freedom, it's about standing tall against men's ancient foe that goes all the way back to the beginning of recorded history; man and mer have always been pitted against one another. Its like the whole Anu/Padomay thing. These men would rather die proudly on their own two feet, worshipping who they please, governing themselves, than live on their knees. It's a matter of pride.
I support the Dragonborn killing the Emperor and Motierrre and claiming the throne for himself.
Modernist lore:
Teacher: White bad. Brown good. White bad. Brown good.
Kids: White bad. Brown good!
Videogame: White not bad.
Adults: ?!
I’ve always been back and forth on which side I support, and honestly I probably lean Stormcloak because of the whole religious freedom thing, and I mean, I think of a foreign country came to America and said people couldn’t be Christian anymore, people would be pretty pissed. And rightfully so. That’s just an example I don’t want to start a political debate. But I also get that the Empire wants to just keep the peace until the strength builds back up so they can all go beat the Thalmor. But when you sit at the Stormcloak camps you can see the Empire is clearly lying when they say the line “what the rebels like to forget is the Empire is what’s keeping the dominion out of Skyrim” I mean obviously it’s not true cuz they have a whole embassy in Skyrim and the justiciars walk around everywhere but some Stormcloak soldiers talk about how their cousin disappeared in the night and soon after that’s when they joined Ulfric. Idk tho I like both sides they both have pros and cons but I don’t think the Stormcloaks are as hopeless as hardcore Imperial supporters say they are
Well if you imagine that the person they don't want you to worship was a ruthless warlord who used a god machine to annihilate your capitol even though there was no declaration of war and now they are praising him as a divine, you can see why they don't want to acknowledge him as a god.
To the Altmer it's like if people started praising Hitler as a god. I doubt you would have a problem if America didn't allow people to worship him.
@@benyosefdrak2686 Maybe the Altmer should mind their own business.
i agree with most of what you said but wouldn't it be for the best if the empire and Skyrim were united? because if you do go in their embassy they literally state that the civil war is beneficial to them because instead of waiting until the time is right and gethering their strength they're at each others throat all the time. if they were united they could fight another war and beat them and get their religious freedom back most of the imperials worship talos too
An empire letting the enemy abduct, torture and kill it's people for praising the man who founded it is not an empire I could support.
@@logan8638 If there was a way to negotiate for partial autonomy for Skyrim it would be the best option. Ulfric is a good ruler, but all men are brothers.
All I have to say is that they fight for their religious rights and freedoms and that they always saved the empire. without the Nords, the empire is done . They back stabbed skyrim time and time again. The empire could not even defeat the reach men on their own.
i thought Bethesda said somewhere that the cannon ending has the stormcloaks winning and the Emperor is dead? (b/c of the dark brotherhood quest since all faction quest are completed either by the hero or unnamed person.)
If that were true then all of the community would be pissed as your choices dont matter. The emperors death is also a choice as you can also fight the dark brotherhood and have him live.
If its true we would really need a source for that
it only likely if the Ebonheart pact is cannon witch i do hope is the case as a Ne Pact could be Forged
@@ImperialKnowledge well i cant find the article but there's little doubt in the community and reddit (as it is it's own entity) about the fact that the faction quests are all completed and Emps Mede is dead by Skyrim's conclusion..
@@aftergood Factions are not completed unless if stated/implied differently.
I'm not saying he is but popular opinion is that he will be assassinated by the dark brotherhood
I saw this point from a meme. Pretty much, when the Civil War began, Titus Mede II should’ve let Skyrim cede, because there’s still the overwhelming half of Skyrim (and or Balgruuf) who stay loyal to the Empire, meaning that both economically, we politically, they would likely stay on the same page.
Replayed Skyrim 6 times
All for Stormcloaks. Not sure why. Maybe because I hate empire more... I don't care about Lore at this point I just find Ulfrik my boi
4:20
Hammerfell is not really “good friends” with the Empire because they fought off the Dominion from their lands to the protest of the heads in Cyrodill.
An independent Skyrim would be closer and more respected by the people of Hammerfell because the independent Nords, like the Redguards, fought off the High Elves from their territories. Also, the empire completely abandoned Hammerfell to the Dominion.
They literally have no diplomatic reasons to be “good friends.” It’s more like aggressive neutral. They have a shared enemy, but the Redguards are no where near considering rejoining the Empire.
Considering we have evidence that Hammerfell has good trade relations with the empire, the empire helped rebuild parts of hammerfell even after it became independent (See TES:Blades dialogue, which was made by the same people as Skyrim was), they have a common enemy, its been over 25 years, and the empire left a lot of discharged troops in hammerfell to help ward off the dominion instead of leaving them alone. I would say, yeah. The Empire is likely Hammerfell's closest friend on Tamriel. Rejoining the Empire? Thats never happening I presume. But most people don't marry and move in with all their good friends lol.
@@ImperialKnowledge
Yeah, also, once a people are able to rule themselves with autonomy, they prefer to not be ruled by a foreign power in a distant land. The red guards would rather have a fellow Redguard rule over them than an imperial in Cyrodill. Also, without the direct oversight of the Empire, a more domestic government is better able to protect its citizens, keep its country stable, and fight off a Thalmor invasion. This is why there was so much chaos in many of the other provinces during the Oblivion Crisis; they weren’t used to autonomy, except the Argonians. It’s as simple as that.
As for how this applies to Skyrim, the Imperialization of the Nords is what left their old pantheon of Shor to be forgotten. When the empire suddenly changes away from Talos, it’s very similar to what happened between the Irish Catholics and the British Protestants. The British first converted them to Catholicism, and then, they tried to convert them to Protestantism to which the Irish refused. Regardless if the Imperials change their mind afterward, it doesn’t change the disconnect between them and the Nords. The Nords should have their own culture and not just be a spinoff of Imperial culture.
Regardless if it’s Ulfric leading it, Skyrim will have a constant roaming band of rebels, like the IRA for Ireland. Even after they’re destroyed in the civil war side quest, there are still rebel camps and sympathizers. That is simply not stable and not good for the quality of life of the average Nord in Skyrim. In the long run, a more locally ran Skyrim might be more stable and able to provide better protection to its citizens.
Even though he doesn’t allow them in the cities, Ulfric’s more local rulership could help patrol the roads and keep them for safe for the Khajiit caravaners. There’s evidence of this in the game with the empire appointed Jarl of Falkreath. He quite literally deals with the bandits outside the city, and he’s too corrupt to even stop them. They literally have a boulder trap installed on the road that leads directly to Falkreath.
Ulfric’s men have proven to be good at taking out the Reach Men too, and by crushing them, that benefits the citizens of Skyrim. It was the Empire’s involvement that prevented him from finishing them off.
That is why I think the Stormcloaks have been character assassinated by the writers. We shouldn’t be rooting for imperialism. The Nords are dumb for hating the Dark Elves, but the Dunmer at least have a sense of autonomy back in their homeland. That was a key part for the plot of Morrowind, and it sucks that the writers forgot about it completely when they were writing Skyrim’s civil war.
Hail Ulfric Stormcloak
"Stole Skyrim" - you mean *took it back*.
Also, the Thalmor definitely wouldn't recognize Skyrim as an independent state. Skyrim would ramp up border security, and Ulfric could have the Thalmor agents within custody threatened to be executed, then make a show of reigning in his bloodthirst and agreeing to simply deport them (if he doesn't just deport them outright instead of the 4D Chess play). From there, an amnesty period of perhaps a month or so where Thalmor would be allowed to leave peacefully, and then afterwards any and all would be considered enemies of the state, determined as Kill On Sight. It's not a guerilla war, either, because Skyrim isn't the home territory of the Thalmor in the first place - they have no strong encampments, they would get little to no support from the people seeing as they openly hate all races but the Altmer and are known for their cruelty, and the fact that actual Thalmor agents are almost all High Elves, there isn't really the option for them to blend in with the population in plain sight.
High Rock likely isn’t going to be with the Empire for long, so it wouldn’t be too unlikely for Skyrim, High Rock, Hammerfell, and possibly even Orsinium to create an alliance against the Thalmor. Whether that would last or not afterwards is up for debate, but it always could. Either way, the idea of the entire northwestern portion of Tamriel vs the Thalmor is a sight I’d love see.
Yea, it has been confirmed that TES 6 will take place in hammerfell and high rock, so we will be able to see in 4-5 years
Trade agreements can even be made between enemies as history is kind enough to show. I can see even the Thalmor entering minor trade agreements for some goods tho it would be looked at with a careful eye by both sides for potential spies and coups.
hammerfell is independent in the 4th era, When Titus Mede I took the throne, the Empire was nothing like what it used to be. The province of Black Marsh seceded from the Empire following the Oblivion Crisis,[32] and Morrowind was largely destroyed,[32] with only the most western portion being ruled by the Dunmer and the south being taken over by the now-independent Argonians. In the wake of the Oblivion Crisis, the Thalmor convinced the Altmer of the Summerset Isles that they were their saviors from the Daedra invasion and consolidated their power.[33] In 4E 29, the government of Valenwood was overthrown by Thalmor collaborators and a union with Alinor proclaimed. Thus was the Aldmeri Dominion reborn.[32] Leyawiin and Bravil had become independent city-states, and were constantly at war with one another.[34] Elsweyr had declared independence and turned into the ancient kingdoms of Anequina and Pelletine.[35] The Empire's ineffectual protection and seeming indifference to Morrowind's plights made them reviled by the Dunmer. After the Empire "released its grasp" on Morrowind, House Hlaalu, the last Imperial ally in the province, was ousted from the Grand Council,[36] and Morrowind left the Empire,[35] as had Hammerfell.[35] Additionally, it is implied that High Rock had also left the Empire,[35] leaving it with Skyrim and most of Cyrodiil.
High-Rock is still apart of the Empire
i could see bulgruuf getting power back in whiterun with the trade union due to popularity and the a,bassitor reason
I'm a Stormcloak Supporter...I've never thought you didn't take them seriously. You're simply extremely biased against them is all.
Like calling them a racist organization when the fact is their an nationalist organization who would gladly accept Bretons, Dunmer, Argonians even Altmer in Skyrim as long as they're loyal to the nation first and foremost while respecting the old traditions of the Nords/Atmorans.
*laughs in grey quarter*
I suppose that's why racial segregation is so prominent in Windhelm, and why the Stormcloak commanders are very glad to inform us they're going to kick out the elves?
I personally find the Stormcloaks to be too shortsighted, not looking at the big picture. Plus, I find Ulfric to be a murderer, as using the Thu'um against Torryg, who had all the combat experience of my nephew (who's 4, btw) to be the ultimate dick move/cheap shot. The fight was more one-sided than a bank robber trying to go hand to hand against Wonder Woman. He could have won the fight easily without the voice. Using it turned a duel into cold-blooded murder.
At least they let the gray elfs refugees have a place to stay they didn't have to do that. They could have left them out in the cold wilderness.
@@dutchpatriot17 the Altmer lady in windhelm's market place doesn't live in the grey quarter and says that if the dunmer wouldn't pity themselves they could live normally but rather complain about the nords
The thumbnail, now that's a guy i want in charge! Look how friendly he looks 🙂
Thanks for making this video! Glad to see a realistic prediction on a stormcloak victory!
Skyrim already has it laws in order if you think about it. Criminal law like stealing and murder is in hold jurisdiction, meanwhile religious freedom is a province law. that's why ulfric sees his war as justified defence of religious freedom, meanwhile dunmer are not prosecuted for worshiping good daedra, even other deadra like mehrun dagon seems to be tolerated with huge statue on the side of the mountain and a museum in Dawnstar.
Can't forget about the dragonborn you know I just imagine him going around bending Wills of dragons and crating a armyand I feel like the dragonborn would go with the stormcloaks just because the imperials did try to execute him at all just for trying to enter the country
I agree friend.
Nordic Dragon Riders is a very real possibility. Remember, Bend Will only as a time limit in-game. Canonically, it's permanent until another dragon overpowers the Dragonborn.
@@CyberController- and depending if you cited with the blades or not he also has parthenax is on his side which had a bunch of dragons swear allegiance to him so he probably already has a head start with that. and there could be an army of the best warriors of Skyrim called Dragon Riders which I'm pretty sure is self-explanatory what they do. They'll fight for him where dragons can't go. and he's well the leader of not only the thieves Guild but the dark Brotherhood so anybody who would oppose him would either be killed or framed for something. and as an archmage of the college he might even start a Renaissance of magic in Skyrim and have a bunch of Battle mages. and already has some great warriors with the companions so even with that pending Legion on the boarder if he plays his cards right he will win. and he's also the thayn of all the jarls so that would help with the Renaissance.
@@TheDrakanMaster124 Hang on, we can't give all of that to L.D. I'd say most of the guild stories were done by other people, so there was a different person who became the Companion's leader and another person who became Listener for the Brotherhood.
The only stories I think L.D should be credited for are the ones that require of reference that he's Dragonborn.
Main Story, Civil War, Dawnguard, Dragonborn.
So L.D himself isn't running any of the other guilds, but somebody else is.
@@CyberController- after Oblivion the reason the mage and fighting guilds collapsed was because when the hero of kavached left to the shivering Isles and didn't come back they had no leadership. which means Bethesda assume that you're going to do all the quest lines
Um the empire kicked out the redgaurds
I understand your rationality. The lore (or rather the changed lore) of Skyrim makes what should happen with what will happen two different things. It is the main flaw of the game.
According to the elder scrolls lore of the Nords and Skyrim prior to the game Skyrim, Nords do not worship ANY of the "nine Divines". Not even Talos. They have their own pantheon.
Their Chief deity would be Shor. Otherwise known as Larkin, and it would be the banning of HIS worship that would cause the friction. The Elves Hate Shor far more than Talos, whom is only a hero to traditional Nords and not worshipped by most of them anyway(according to the original lore as can be read in the game Oblivion)
Plus, not only the Grey Beards would Know how to shout.(Oblivion, pocket guide to Skyrim) Within Every Nord battalion, there would be those with the ability to shout down gates and city defences and they would have no need for siege equipment. The "voice" was actually a gift from Kyne, Not the fake god Akatosh who is known as Aurail to the Elves and Alduin to the Nords.
Here lies the true problem. Aurial, the Elves Chief God, is the equivalent of the devil to the Nords, and Shor, (larkin) is the Devil to the elves...Which is why humans especially Nords and the elves have always been at war.
The "Nine divines"are all made up, watered down versions of the Nord and elven Gods.
Under the true lore, Ulfric wouldn't seem quite as much like an "ass" either and much more Justified as the defender of true Nord customs and traditions...And much more justified in using a shout to defeat Torig, because it should be an ability that any Nord can acquire through training and as the High King he should have know how to shout.
The elves don’t have the military strength to take the empire anymore. It would take Less than 20 years for the empire to renew its military. something tells me it takes a lot longer for a high elf to mature and be trained. The elves would lose a second great war, which is why they are resorting to subterfuge and intrigue.
The Empire trys to behead you if the dragonborn had free will and not being controlled by the player he or she will aways choose stormcloak and the dragonborn is all the stormcloaks need to win Skyrim. plus a 5 way free for all is more interesting in the next game
What are you talking about? If the Dragonborn had free will he would help the Dominion. Because unlike the Stormcloaks and Empire, you get compensated well when you align yourself with Thalmor interests.
Because if I try to stab u and miss and then say wanna make some gold your just gonna say yes?
@@leafpratt Sorry, I don't understand what you are implying.
My point is the thalmor and the imperials have tried to kill the dragonborn so the only likely conclusion is they would side with the stormcloaks not because of a shared believe but because they HAVEN'T TRY TO CUT YOUR FUCKING HEAD OFF and who wants thalmor blood money anyway just loot the merchant chest in dawnstar
@@leafpratt Actually, the Thalmor didn't try to kill you. The only time they do is after you kill them in the embassy quest. Also the Dominion has much more than people in dawnstar lol
Considering the Dragonborn basically destroys the Imperial forces and at end game has unrivaled power and wealth, it’s not at all farfetched that an Independent Skyrim could prevail against the Dominion.
I personally torch the Thalmor Embassy with Odaviig regularly whether I’m Stormcloak or Imperial.
If we all think about it the red guards beat the Dominion the Nords are actually they're basically born as Warriors so if the red guards can defeat the Dominion surely the Nords of Skyrim could as well
My Mercenary Orc Dragonborn joined the stormcloaks. He liked Ulfric, and decided to support him. He doesn't necessarily care if the outcome is good or not. If anything, if it ends badly, that just means more Mercenary work for him. XD very selfish of him, I know.
Mine ended up with the Imperials because they have plenty of coin.
Both sides have flaws yet I always go Stormcloak. I'm more of a rebel to be honest but I still do love Imperial Armor.
Dark Elves will make Morrowind great again, we hate it in Skyrim. As soon as that dust cloud over Red Mountain settles we're going back
Most Gray Quarter Dunmer are House Hlaalu (FYI, you don't have to have the same family name to be part of the House, like how the Ulens are Hlaalu), so the Dunmer Grand Council don't even want them back.
After losing Hammerfell, I really doubt the empire is not going to want to lose another region of Tamriel. My expectancy is for them to send ACTUAL legions, of TRAINED troops, you know ELITE soldiers against you know, the farm hands and merchants that make up the Stormcloak army...
Tullius himself said that the empire doesn't care about what happens in Skyrim as the rebellion is seen as nothing more than a side show before the main event that is the war with the dominion. In other words the imperials won't try to retake Skyrim after it has seceded.
Lots of Stormcloaks are legion veterans.
i think seeing the map all split up like that is pretty cool in terms of set-up for another game. Could have like an all out faction-warfare as the main plotline to establish a new empire, whether it's thalmor, some kind of imperialist Skyrim or hammerfell, or the empire trying to restore it's former glory.
Also, what's the political situation in Morrowind? all the different houses are now fully independent?
@@kozhedub All of the Houses have always agreed to cohabitate and govern their areas autonomously. With Hlaalu and the Empire out, Redoran took over most of the leadership roles.
Once we are done with the empire their elven masters are next
Don't hold your breath.
The Stormcloaks will be thralls to teh thalmor..
@@alexionut2158 We Nords ain't no Atmorans, but we still have the fire.
@@EiriktheNordAndersen-ju4gl The fire.... This is the most stupid thing i ve ever heard. Ulfric lost to General Tullius and his guard in 6 months.. Trying to fight Thalmore would be a suicide. Anyway, Ulfric will die for the misuse of the voice.
@@alexionut2158 We did not lose. The war has been going on for years. He did not bring enough guards with him.
Ulfrik will become the High King (if he isn't already). If Hammerfell beat you Elves back, we can. And Hammerfell does not even have a standing army, just a bunch of local militias, and they are right next to the Dominion.
We need to show this to your professor
I mean... To support the thing about Skyrim allying with Hammerfell without the Empire, the Empire _did_ kind of abandon them after they said “fuck you” to the White-Gold Concordat and kept fighting the Thalmor.
Just the kind of video I need! Where's the Mead?!
In a imperial prison
good job youtube, this comment is written 21 minutes ago but that response is 30 minutes ago, lm fucking ao
@@smarrkidd5538Shows how much the empire tolerates those with different opinions...
Ulfric would have pretty good relationships with morrowind, at least with Redoran's part of morrowind since, for starters, Morrowind hates the Empire for abbandoning them during the Oblivion crisis.
On top of that Ulfric is the ONLY Jarl accepting refugees, for as much talk of racism ppl do in game, i dont see the other jarls donating 1/3 of their city exclusively to refugees (tax free btw).
Also Ulfric is clearly keeping very friendly relationships with Morrowind since the only way to reach Solsheim is through Windhelm's port, it's not like the Empire has no other choice but to use Windhelm's port, Solitude has massive port too, but for some reason the Redoran house removed everything belonging to the Empire from their books including Empire trade rules, to the point where East Empire Company coins have become a collectionist item in Morrowind since they are actively hunted and destroyed by the higher ups.
So as soon as Skyrim becomes independent they can restart the Ebonheart pact and get a fairly good support from Morrowind, something the Empire would not have access to.
The Redoran wouldn't care for Ulfric, his views do not align with their own. Ulfric also didn't "take in" refugees, they were already there over a 100 years before Ulfric's birth... The Dunmer don't live tax free either.
There won't be any such alliance. The reason why Windhelm is connected to Solstheim is because Windhelm's port had always been the destination from Solstheim, even when the EEC was still operating there.
@@dutchpatriot17 Actually, the Redoran would appreciate Ulfric mistreating the Hlaalu.
@@DarkAdonisVyers They're Dunmer. Not Hlaalu.
@@dutchpatriot17 They are the Dunmer of House Hlaalu (again, _House_ not necessarily family, like the Ulens).
But the pro imperial Jarls are replaced with pro stormcloak Jarls if the stormcloaks win.
That doesn't mean the people become pro-Stormcloak too. If you go to the Imperial towns after a Stormcloak victory, you can find a lot of civil unrest among the people.
I've always played a nord so I jumped at the opportunity of a free skyrim. I'm also Celtic so we have a long bloody history with a certain European "empire" hint hint.
Ulgric isn't perfect and I dislike his treatment of the dark elves but I believe an organization of free states would go better against the high elves.
Hail to our free people brother.
@@odyn6882 Hail Ilfmundur.
Independent territory over any empire! Always!
Also with an independent Skyrim can we really ca Cyrodiil an Empire anymore considering it pretty much has High Rock left? Hammerfell left, Black Marsh left, Elsweyr is doing god knows what, and Cyrodiil abandoned Morrowind after the Red Year.
As a die hard stormcloak I like this scenario however people always forget we have the Dragon Born on our side...
Well the thing is that Bethesda tends not to give their heroes lore post gameplay. Meaning the dragonborn will likely be dead or permanently out of the picture. For example if Bethesda made the dragonborn a stormcloak supporter, or imperial supporter in canon, then that means that people who played as a neutral thief, their playthroughs would no longer count canonically. So I am personally veryyy doubtful we will see the dragonborn. But its not impossible.
@@ImperialKnowledge yh I personally think it'll be season unending tbh but even then the Stormcloaks would have truce time to upgrade their equipment to say steel armor for the most part anyway and would likely fight with the Empire in exchange for independence
@Imperial Knowledge The war was already resolved at High Hrothgar, under Season Unending. When the Dragonborn convinced both leaders to a treaty. The Dragonborn goes off and kills Alduin. When the Dragonborn comes back, the emperor has arranged his own assassination, shortly after the Dragonborn's return. When this happens, the Empire will be forced to consider the conflict in Skyrim resolved and then retreat back to Cyrodiil. I believe this is how Bethesda will make sure that it doesn't matter which side you choose. No one wins. No one loses. It will end in a draw.
I think the emperor's death will be the final straw that pushes the Empire to fall apart. It will create a power vacuum and the right chaos for the next Elder Scroll's story. We may be playing in an Elder Scrolls version of a Fallout situation, full of anarchy, corruption and mayhem. The world maybe starting in complete chaos, while something really big and bad is brewing in the background. Maybe some people are still fighting for the old empire, while others are fighting for a new one or others like things the way they are.
@@DabobbyG937 I just now noticed your comment after I posted mine. Glad to see someone else agrees. We already resolved the war, through Season Unending. This all happened during a Dragon Break. So, I think the Dragonborn getting involved in the civil war are just alternative outcomes that could have played out, which they have through us the player. But the only thing that is the constant in all of them, that links us all together, is Season Unending.
I appreciate that video and I do agree you're oversimplifying the Stormcloak point of view, although you make some really good points.
One of the main reasons I think the rebellion might be the right option for Skyrim is the Hammerfell precedent.
1) The Empire was so quick to betray Hammerfell and just hand it to the Aldmeri Dominion, which would make the situation there terrible for the people. That act alone makes it really difficult for me to morally side with the Empire.
2) Hammerfell rightfully rebelled against that decision and successfully fought for their independence and drove the Thalmor away. It stands to argue, if they can do it, so could Skyrim(Skyrim isn't any weaker than Hammerfell). Even more, that would make them allies, sharing common political fate.
And in general, the game makes it really hard to sympathise with the Empire, even though they might be the pragmatically better option.
They often come off arrogant, disregarding the Nords and their culture, mocking and insulting them and their values, etc.
Furthermore, Stormcloaks are more fun from a gameplay perspective. You get to legally slaughter Thalmor agents and not let them terrorise Skyrim's people.
And that's a personal preference, but their aesthetics and vibe are clores to my preferences. I like everything Nordic and Scandinavian, they remind me of the Starks from GoT, who I think are much cooler than the Lanisters and even the colour-coding, I usually take the blue side: Ravenclaw, the NCR, Team Mystic, Democracy, etc.
With all that being said and my obvious bias towards the Stormcloaks, I still think the Empire is the pragmatically better option, because of economic reasons, cultural diversity and military strength(potential to drive out the Thalmor) + I really dislike Ulfric's short-sidedness, impulsiveness and racism and jarl Balgruuf is my favourite jarl - much wiser and more diplomatic leader.
As a Stormcloak supporter, i like this video, but one thing that i wonder is if you really think that treaty-enforcers within Skyrim would really be a problem.
If there is one thing that all people in Skyrim will probably agree on then it is that these guys are trash which would lead to some top-tier purges inside the cities and the embassy would probably be raided or even destroyed. This would cause a diplomatic crisis, but it is not like Skyrim under Ulfric ever intended for good relationship with the Thalmor. You also mention briefly that "the thalmor could send more enforcers" which i highly doubt due to their lack of acces to a harbour. And i wonder if they would be able to launch a full-scale invasion of Skyrim (like some imperials seem to believe), when they dont control the sea of ghosts or the abyssian sea and have to be just as afraid of an imperial attack on the border as the empire is of them
Kill the Justiciars and you have the Dominion at your door. The Empire is not ready to fight the Dominion yet, so the Stormcloaks would have to face them on their own. That's not going to end well.
@@dutchpatriot17 thats pretty dumb reasoning. As i outlined above, the Aldmeri dominion has no leverage to get to skyrim, as they are not bordering each other in any way whatsoever. Meanwhile , if they still tried and gathered the naval power and the men to launch a full scale invasion of skyrim, then the dominion would have to expose its valenwood border and the empire could eaily launch a devastating attack. The Dominion has no leverage on its own in skyrim, all it's power results from the submission of the empire
@@Infiritthor Ever heard of a navy? It's that thing the Altmer are famous for, after all. The Dominion of the Second Era was able to sail all the way to the border of Skyrim and Morrowind without being attacked; and during that time, they were actively *at war* with every nation of Tamriel.
The Dominion would only need a pretty small army to conqeur Skyrim. The Stormcloaks are pretty damn weak. They were losing to only half of Skyrim; that's barely anything compared to the Dominion.
@@dutchpatriot17 i dont know the sources for your claims, but they sound pretty ridiculous. Anyway, in the white gold concordate they had to surrender their dominance about the abyssean sea and would have to violate the concordate as well as imperial AND hammerfell waters to get there.
And even if we assume that the empire and hammerfell will sit by and jerk off while the dominion sends a fleet arround the entire continent to invade a human nation, how are they going to supply an invasion army? How are they going to send reinforcements? And even if we assume they have the insane logistical power to supply an invasion scale force on the other side of the continent and nore the empire neither hammerfell do anything about it, all it takes is just one minor victory of the humans at ANY point of the campaign and this operation will become stalingrad for the dominion.
If you really believe any of this, you are crazy
@@Infiritthor I'd like a citation for the claim regarding the Abecean, sounds like you're making that up on the spot.
I think you seem to forget that the best of the Stormcloaks struggles against the worst of the Empire, while the best of the Empire was getting slaughtered by the Dominion.
Let that sink in.
Who would have won without the dragonborn's help ?
Now that's a good question .
I fever the Empire since I played oblivion to be the winning side but just by a bit because I really understand the stormcloak side why they rebel. But if you have me pick I hope the stormcloaks win because I see a lot more potential lore wise.
What I Like to see is with the stormcloak victory and the death of Titus Mead II that the Empire will fall apart. Cyrodill will start having his own cival wars because a lot of people will want to be Emperor. This would mean that the Empire's influence will dwingel and eventually fall apart with the Kingdoms of Highrock starring to rule them self more and more because the Empire is fighting itself in Cyrodill. More and more county's would start governing on them self and slowly especially in the south fall to the overwhelming power of the dominion. Some others will stant together or, what I would like to see, Bruma joining the Kingdom of Skyrim because they see that as the best way to survive.
With this set there is much potential to let the human kingdoms join together and even tray to form a 4th empire to fight the altmery dominion wich is slowly taking over cyrodill and planning to attack the rest as well
If the Empire falls apart, Tamriel is doomed to the Dominion.
@@dutchpatriot17 not really, don't forget Hammerfall fought the dominion for an other 5 years after the great war and actually won. With hammerfall, Highrock, Skyrim and some cyrodillic county's combined in a alliance the dominion has a terrible enemy
@@casthelion416 Hammerfell did not win, they fought an already weakened Aldmeri army - which did not even try to conqeur the province any longer - to a standstill, signed a treaty, and the Dominion chose to withdraw.
It is canon that the Empire, including Hammerfell, would have been slaughtered without the Concordat.
@@dutchpatriot17 if you see the treaty as just an retreat from the dominion yes but I see it as a victory. Also that the dominion would have won is not canon, it isn't in any official content. And I don't think they would have. Because both sites were losing hard they both wanted peace, if the dominion could have won, they wouldn't make peace and especially not with a more fair concordat than the first over they made before the great war actually began
@@casthelion416 Except that it is in official content. Hell, within the official content it comes from a neutral source which does not suffer from the unreliable narrator; a loading screen regarding lore, aka, raw developer input.
Another great video from the best ES lore youtuber (according to me).
The Stormcloaks have my support!
P.S. This is Shor.