1. pick a good looking character 2. train and learn basic attacks 3. try to learn the games rules because not all fighting games are the same. 4. beat arcade on easy, normal, hard, very hard and hell ( unless the game has a unfair ended boss) if so just play VS mode to you feel that you're better than the computer and continually up the difficulty. 5. go back to training to try to learn as many attacks and combos as you can. 6. Repeat 1,2,4 and 5 7. The computer is not very smart and you got bored 8. friends don't want to play you 9. play on online 10 the rest will come together like a puzzle. Ta-dah you are somewhat good are average
Same here. I love the games, but lack the time and patience to really be good. I'll find a few characters I'm naturally halfway decent with, specials that are fairly easy for me to trigger, combos I can execute at will, etc. Where I run into problems are the more advanced things. Cancels, reversals, ultras, and hypers for example. I guess you could say I fail to even reach level one...I may know my character, but there are several powerful techniques I just cannot seem to master...if I pull it off, its because I did it by accident while trying to do something else. The training room often lets me see the inputs I made, so I can see what is going wrong when I'm trying to trigger. The problem is how to fix it? The most common issue is the required D pad motions. I make the proper motion, but some of the directions don't reflect properly on the input. When I keep trying over and over again and get nothing but fail after fail, and can see on the screen that it literally is not doing what I'm telling it to do...that becomes maddening. Because of that, I start to grow bored. Its like I hit a roadblock that I can see, but can't get past. I can play and have fun up to that point, but that is a very limited playground.
this is why I can play only fighters with simple buttons combinations, like Mortal Kombat, injustice and Guilty Gear Xrd (which also has a helpful tutorial)
jedisquidward Level 4 I believe is playing urself. Studying ur tendencies, reducing the amount of waste in your build ups. As an amateur fighter, it's building multiple flows of something as basic as the jab, a sway. When it doesn't matter what ur opponent does because you realize you are the one who makes yourself available to eat damage. When u discover infinite possibilities, u attain access to a conscious godlike unpredictable that's something akin to transforming into a rubric cube that fights back.
I'll be completely honest here. I suck at fighting games, but I still love playing them simply because they're just fine and enjoyable to play. I'm not a competitive player by any means. I mainly just play for enjoyment
Smash Bros, especially SSB4. Execution in my honest opinion isn't a problem and everything save for Smash Attacks is something you need to do on whim without the need to 236 or 214 and that crap. All you need to know is what the hell to do and when to do it. Things like pivot grabs and stuff are mainly a personal bonus. Reason why I say Smash 4 is due to the lack of crazy mechanics like wavedashing and L-cancelling. Brawl however is a bit too awkward in comparison, and everyone hates prat-falling.
Some more tips for newcomers to the FGC: 1. Once you've chosen your main, and practiced a bit, break your characters abilities down into a flowchart when you fight people online. I like to open up with certain moves and see my opponents capabilities to block them. If they can't, I exploit it. If they can, I move to a different set and try to pick them apart systematically until I find something I can exploit. 2. Know your matchup, some characters just aren't meant to win against others. For example, Vega usually gets torn up by Guile or Ryu. 3. Fundamentals are the most important thing to your game. Sure if you can pull off fancy combos you may win. However, if you can't defend, or you don't know your basic buttons despite knowing fancier moves, any good opponent will recognize this and exploit it to your advantage. Practice your basics, even after you think you have mastered them. 4. This applies once you get beyond beginner stratus; Trust in yourself. You will never win a match if you don't have confidence. Most players let fear control them when they see high tier opponents and this will affect your gameplay. However, alot of high tier opponents can be tricked and deceived by a player who they consider lowtier if you plan your matchup accordingly. 5. Know your ground. This applies to some more advanced maneuvers and tactics in fighting games. If you know your opponent can't withstand pressure in a corner, do your best to push him back there. If you know your opponent favors corner positions (Guile I'm looking at you) try to get him out of position by any means possible. This may seem common knowledge, but true application requires quite a bit of mastery. Some of this was covered in the video, but I wanted to go a little more into depth on how some more advanced players think in fighting games.
I would stress 4. alot. You have no idea how many times I would play someone with like an 10000 or 9000 ranking on SFV and I'd get psyched out thinking how good they are. But they likely aren't expecting you to be any good. Alot of the time, I just use my good defense game and punish the unsafe things they do on shield. As I whittle them down, they'll get desperate and that's when they expose themselves.
It wasn't until I went online that I realized very quickly how bad I really was at fighting games. Getting my butt handed to me match after match really took the fun out of it for me. Im no sore loser but after so many loses I stopped having fun. It became very clear to me that I am more of a casual player and will never be able to play at a level where online could be fun for me. I respect the players that really put in the time to get as good as they do at theses games. Is there anyone else that feels the way I do?
I've felt that way since I was a kid playing virtua fighter with my father and brother. It sucks bro but learn a character,their moves,their strengths and weaknesses and you should be good. I used to be shit at the game but now I'm not half bad. Also,choose a game you really enjoy playing casually then step up to playing in a competitive mindset. Take it slow,practice with a character,and you might get that fighting game spirit in you yet.
I was the same when I started playing Tekken a few months ago; I just kept losing and losing. I stuck to it though, watching tutorial videos, going into practice mode and learning my character, learning frame data, etc. Once you start to learn the basics, you might enjoy the game more than the usual casual player. Also don't focus just on winning, focus on improvement. If you lose, think about why you lost that match and maybe what you can do to fix that next time. If you stick to it, you might really enjoy the fighting game. It does take dedication, but it can feel really satisfying when you finally get something down.
Same. Nowadays I've just put the controller down and moved on to other games. Call me a sore loser if you will, but the fun stopped in 2013 with TTT2. Ruined itself and every other fighting game for me
I was the opposite. I didn't really have much of an interest in fighting games until I on a whim played Melty Blood against somebody online about three and a half years ago and got perfected to no end. I'm not sure why it made me want to continue playing to such an extent. I guess something about there being such a huge gap between people was intriguing to me. Until then I had been playing FPS and MMOs against other people for years, and in those games it seems pretty much anybody, through either teamwork, items or just investing a lot of time can win games. This is not the case with fighting games, and since that first online match of Melty Blood three and a half years ago, I've completely lost all interest in non-fighting multiplayer games. I'm having a hard time finding people to play offline though, because most people are like you; they stop playing when they lose instead of looking into how to get better. No offense; just the way of the world it seems.
Roy Bread i think you've inspired me to give fighting games another chance Ive avoided it for years because of how bad my ass has been handed to by friends or online, I guess everybody starts somewhere now i just gotta invest in an arcade stick :D
+Silver Kaizer (Kaiomaster) I agree games have made inputting a super moves more difficult. SF4 input ir mk9 input is more demanding than mk2 or sf2 or the alphas. SF x Tekken addresses this with a gem system to allow easier super moves. I hate charge moves those are the worst when trying a character ultra combo.
Well Samurai Shodown's moves aren't that bad. I just wish the SF 3&4 had the input sensitivity of SF2 and SF Alpha. Back then it was easier pulling off a Hadoken or dragon punch. I still cannot do an Ultra with any charge characters like blank, m bison, balrog.
Knowing the range and speed of your attacks as well as the range and speed of the enemy's attacks is paramount. You'll want to open up with the fastest attack that will reach the enemy, usually. After that you can learn all the interesting movement options, combos, and high-low mixups. Lastly you can figure out the interesting tricks like cross ups, frame traps, visually obscured high-low mixups, unblockable setups, etc. Knowing how to use those techniques will teach you how to block those techniques because you will start to recognize your opponents moves. Recognizing the attack is all you need to do, then you will block it by instinct. Same with recognizing grab opportunities and when you are going to be grabbed. I hope this helps!
Zadamanim Honestly I find myself in the position of the OP, wanting to know what the secret is. And I DO know what all those terms mean, and check frame advantage numbers when I start a new character, and so on. And I DO practice combos, high-low-throw mixups, crossups, etc. I think the issue I have is that there are a very select few games (SSBM + SC4 is about it) in which I watch the ENEMY rather than my own character, so my defense is balls. Notably those were the two games that I played a locally ranked guy every day, so maybe it all comes down to practice after all... I had just started to watch the enemy in P4A when P4AU came out Stateside, and I had to relearn everyone.
pondrthis1 That's something I totally overlooked! "Learning your character" should always come first, even if its just learning a few "best moves" at the start (like hadouken, low roundhouse, and jab for Ryu) and after that, always watching the enemy. Your character never changes, so you should always know what your own character is going to do. After that, playing against every other character (even computer opponents) will give you an idea of what you should look out for from each enemy (like Kanji's dive-throw in P4A and P4U, or dragon punches) The enemy player's should be the only mystery on the battlefield! If you find yourself getting hit by some seemingly unstoppable set up, like Chie has in P4U, then maybe you could save the replay and look at it later? When I watch replays I see all these openings I didn't see in the original match. Sometimes I think I finally learned an opponent's block string, and then they make it longer-mid fight! I think it takes a long time to learn every possible situation, but it always helps to be analytic, so that if you see that same set up again, you'll get out of it the next time. Fighting people who use the same character(s) as you can teach you some new moves or styles too, especially if the computer never uses that option :P
I would have added a level 0: understanding the game mechanics. KoFs play diferent than SFs or MK. There are theese core game mechanics like parrying, max mode, contering, jumping or canceling movements, common to all the characters of a game.
Awesome! This is the way I normally learn a fighting game: 1. Tutorial (learn system mechanics) 2. Picking a character (any character that appeals to you & just play with him/her) 3. Training Room/Trials (go over normals, specials, combos, and other character-specific details) 4. Building Fundamentals (spacing, hitconfirms, blockstrings, mixups, and combos) 5. Improve Execution (repeat 3 & 4 until you are capable of doing what you want at will) 6. Fully understand character (maximizing damage, meter usage, matchup knowledge) 7. Fight against the CPU a lot (not the best, but perfect for practicing hitconfirms; hardest setting) 8. Fight other players (where most matchup knowledge accumulates over time; experience different playstyles) 9. Watch replays of top players (for visual learners, best way to fully utilize characters is by knowing what moves to use in what situations) 10. You've come this far; will you keep going or move on to another fighting game? (In my case, I move to another fighting game, but I'm starting to break that habit ;))
Hmmm...that depends, because some games are best learned hopping into training and seeing what you could come up with (Ultimate Marvel vs Capcom 3; I learned better by hopping into the training mode and learning what the game allows and disallows me to do) but if that doesn't work, I'd say just keep playing and it will come to you over time.
Unfortunately, there is no shortcut to learning fighting games, as cliche as it sounds. You'll only learn through experience, so that statement confuses me. If you say fighting games don't come to you over time, then it may have to do with the mentality you have while playing. My best advice would be to either become more serious about those games or find a more accessible fighting game to play.
The effect itself, I have no idea. What I CAN tell you from experience is that if you forget you have more moves than you are accustomed to using, then you should try going to the training room and familiarize yourself with each special move. It's a start to learning what your characters can and cannot do in any given situation.
it's psychological too. Some times i get too excited and botch combos. This only happens in Tekken though. Margin of error in Tekken can be unforgivable.
Me I try to do everything in the fighting games I use every single character I play every single level I try to use every single characters moves and the reason why I even like to play fighting games is to win but have fun doing it and I know I'm not the best at it
Step 0 is deciding if you even want to get better at the game. Some people only play a game because they feel obligated to, like if someone gifted it to them and asked to play together. If you suck at fighting games and just want to get "good enough" to be able to play with your friends on near-equal ground, starting off playing against them is a terrible idea. You'll get trounced every single time and likely not learn anything from your losses as frustration and anger start to consume you. Start off with the tutorial, and when you're finished with it, do it again.
My problem is i still don't understand the logic. I still don't know how to pull off stick rotation moves at all even after trying for a few hours. I need help with the basic mechanics.
Sono Try out Rising Thunder! It's a free to play fighting game (by Seth Killian) on PC and doesn't have stick rotation at all. It's in its open technical alpha.
Sono Well dang, I don't know what to tell you. SG has the most lenient inputs in the genre, and even has a special thing that detects when you're doing a 360 so you don't jump. Are you making a full circle quickly?
I still constantly find myself rewatching this video, I can actually say you made get into the Street fighter 3rd strike community and for that, I will forever be grateful. Mad respect for you man, keep up the great work
I play fighting games to have fun. I love the action, and I love the martial arts. Being a Martial artist myself, I love mastering characters like Ibiku, or Ryu. They're mastery of martial arts is incredible.
It is weird to say this, but.. I think I am good at Level 1 and 3, but I think I would need more experience with playing the rest of the characters to fill in void 2. I pretty much am in the opposite stance of you on the terms of What motivates me to play and get better. I adapt what I call, The Ryu method and style of fighting. I realize for me, it is not about winning or losing, but learning what lesson I can get out of the battle to perfect my own skill. I even borrow elements from previous players if I notice they have a good idea that could work if I experiment with it more. My style comes from Ryu's quote from Third Strike actually." A good fighter is constantly learning. During that fight, you taught me how to defeat you."
I Love Fighting Games. I Understand my favorites Character Moves, block, and Special moves, Understanding the Match-Ups, and knowledge to what am suppose to do in which level.
I ended up teaching a lot of people I know Smash Bros. Melee and Marvel 3, and let me tell you. This is one of the FIRST THINGS I send anybody. I also send them Max's other videos on getting good. Not only does it iron out whatever misconceptions they may have, but it is presented so well by someone who is so good that they are eager to improve!
This makes so much more sense. Especially regarding Mortal Kombat 9. The guidebook actually tells you which characters are stronger or weaker against specific characters. An outline like that is really helpful.
huh this... actually could be used for dark souls pvp as well like... level 1- learning a character equates to learn a weapon, how to use it etc... level 2- learn match-ups equates to learning what weapon works against what weapons level 3- mindgames... well... yeah that's the bulk of dark souls pvp right there- faking out your opponent, making them think you're gonna do one thing so that they do another thing so that you can hit them... so in short, i already /knew/ how to get good at fighting games, all this video did is show me that i already knew... like i didn't know that i knew. thanks for showing me that.
Dunno if you know, but Dark Souls is really popular among people who are into fighting games. People who really like Dark Souls PvP could likely also be suited for fighting games.
***** There are some ridiculous quick swapping tricks, but yes, you're right about that. Once you get past the input barrier though, the game is similar in many ways.
***** It is hard. Especially if you want to be good. I find myself cursing at myself constantly for dropping an input that should have won me the round. Even the top pros do it every once in a while. At least my game of choice; Melty Blood is lenient enough that inputs don't stop people from even getting into the game. My little brother tried playing Street Fighter once and couldn't even get past the first (or one of the first) trials where he was asked to link two normals together. I made it on the first try when he asked me to do it, probably because I have some experience with that sort of thing, but I think it's a real problem that something as basic as that requires strict inputs. It's addicting once you get into it though. No other games give me the same amount of satisfaction upon success anymore.
Ryan Kwak Totally agree! Practice and repetition! Everything else will fall into place if you just keep practicing consistently. You'll get your ass handed to you online in the beginning, but stay diligent and the improvement will come.
I'm fully focused on Blazblue. I don't play and learn to be a competitive player. But i try to learn my best so i don't fully suck at it. I play fighting games for my enjoyment, but at the same time, i try to learn at least 30% on how to be really good, just so i don't suck balls. But if you had to ask if i play to be competitive or not. Not really. Just trying to learn my pros and cons with each characters i main.
Other important things to touch on to beginners are Links, how to perform/ practice the timing of the button presses, getting used to short jumping, buffering, getting over mashing your combos, remembering the combo inputs and applying those inputs into getting comfortable with them on a fightstick/ controller, getting well acquainted into tier lists and which character suits you, getting over the fear of being beaten over and over, start out and expect how long it will take you in order to rise up against your opponents, understand that fighting games are not something that can be completely mastered in an hour, having strong discipline and patience, know that whoever beats you is more acquainted with the game more than you are, practicing motion specials to both P1 and P2 sides, knowing certain abbreviations for moves such as qcf and hcb..... now I gotta admit that this video is well made in it of itself but these are very common things that almost anyone getting into fighting games miss over. Hopefully you can do a video explaining at least 4 of these concepts considering you inspire a lot of people to still go out there and try to become the best. Fighting games is kinda like art, you WILL suck ass at first and may even consider quitting, but eventually you'll grow more and become better than you were once before.
I wasn't at all into fighting games until I tried Guilty Gear Xrd Sign around the time it released. At that point I decided I wanted to become good at it. It took some time before I could even accomplish commands/specials. All this time later and I still suck. I go online and consistently get whooped. I think my biggest problems are my inability to block correctly and my lack of understanding of safe and unsafe moves. I'm just really unsure where to go from this point to become better. I know Dustloop wiki is a good source of info, but I don't entirely understand how to utilize the info. If anyone has any advice at all, I'd greatly appreciate it.
I try not to stray away because fighting games are domestic to me. I like the different points and they've psychologically helped me. I'll continue to watch your videos in hopes of getting better. Thanks, Dude!
The thing I love most about fighting games..... Playing with your friends and making killer comebacks that shock the players. Also trying to take the next step in creating your own way and style of play for any character. You are who you play.
Why do I want to get good at a fighting game? Because Mortal Kombat X is a little more than two weeks away and from the very little I've played from MK9, and the decent bit MK1 and 2 on mame, I can not pull off combos and would like to not come across as a noob online. :) (I mean a gaming noob, not noob saibot) What brought everyone else here?
With MK9 I practiced a lot, played the ladders a lot thinking it would prepare me for online (which I was super hyped for). I was blown out of the water most of the time and there was bad Netcode. Meaning don't be afraid to practice a little before jumping online that is were you are really going to learn. Just learn one or two small pop up combos that leads into juggling.
I think a big part of the mind games aspect is being able to keep your cool. Sometimes when I lose online, it can get discouraging or frustrating. People tend to do better in any type of competition if they take it easy and move on from their past losses. Great video as usual! I love the Real Talk series! :)
I think the only game I'm level 3 at is Melee. I mean, let's be honest...there are only like 8 real characters. Everyone else is kinda bad and you already know their moves and how to beat them. It's real easy to know your character's moves, the hard part is getting the required tech skill to do them all the time. As a Falco main, I'd say I have this mastered about 76%. I can do almost any tech, there are only a few things I can't do. Like ledgedash consistently, OoS options, and sweetspotting the ledge. Everything else I can pretty much do. When I want to. I know all that matchups for my character too. Against Fox, you wanna focus on reads and making sure that you control the center stage. Fox can bullied off stage, but he has the edge in frames and he's a faster character. Luckily, Fox is pretty lightweight, you can zero to death him quickly if you can capitalize off a read. Marth's main threats are his grab range and disjointed hitbox. You wanna take potshots with lasers and use them to close the distance and prevent him from swinging that massive disjoint. Mastering DI is crucial in this matchup, because Marth can otherwise chaingrab you to death. These are just two matchups I've learned, mostly through trial and error. The third level is mind games, which has been the bane of my existence for a very long time. For me, learning tech and playing the matchup according to data was easy. I'm like a robot, I enjoy that kind of thing. But trying to read my opponent? Predictions? I didn't like it, none of it was surefire. I could easily be wrong and that could cost me the game. Eventually, I got past this and tried the mindgames route. Against a friend, I had to face the reality that he was simply a faster Falco than I was. Anything that I wanted to do, he could have already done it...and then some. I remember one game, he short hopped down-aired alot. But me, being the braindead Falco player I was....didn't do anything about it. Until it made sense in my head. It suddenly occurred to me that he was merely doing it because it worked. It was at this I point, I started wavedashing back slightly just as he came down and got a grab. I did this all the time, eventually causing him to change it up and do a different spacing. But if he did a different spacing, that gave me time to simply dodge and punish with a nair. This was only a few months ago mind you, and it was at this point I realized what mindgames were. Thinking about what the opponent will do, even if it means eating an L to find out what their patterns are. Then acting on it.
I'm not such a smash player myself, but I've learned a few tech along while playing against other. Except my Samus main sucks against anyone that is fast enough to evade most of any charged shots or deflect it. And my only hope is that I can try to chain combos on the ground to get it working (Since most of her air attacks are useless, except for Bair and Nair, and dair if you're lucky to hit someone with it). Ground, missiles and charged shots still work, if it ain't Fox or Falco. But hey. Good tips you just gave out. Keep up the good work.
You kind of remind me of m2k in regards to mindset. You know the mechanics very well but when someone (like mango) starts doing stuff that you're not used to you tend to start panicking and ultimately end up tilting out.
Exactly, thats mindgames, people do things because they work, and stop doing things when they don't, reading them, watching their old matchs, and just generally learning how they work, and countering that, can change how they approach you, and from there, put them out of their comfort zone, at which point you can start preying on the cracks you are making, Grapplers in normal 2d fighters work heavily on this, due to being a clusterfuck and a half of giant threat zones, you catch a guy on wakeup with a powerful command grab a few times, and they'll start worrying about it and waking up differently, at which point you prey on the new response with a different grab
I only got to level 3 in a SSB fan game called Super Smash Flash. It's actually pretty good and it's being updated to this day, being completely free. I love it.
So I've picked up Street Fighter 3 and 4... And I'm terrible at both. Because I spent $50 on them, I'm not letting myself quit. But I have done multiple training methods and none work... This is the last resort... Would anyone be interested in playing online with me so I can eventually get better at the games and my money and time won't have been wasted?
This video clearly reminded me of the journey I had with fighting games. Thank you. :) I used to suck at fighting games as I started as a button masher and repeating commands, until I learned how to play a game title properly with mastering a character then understanding a game system. I started learning fighting games thru anime fighters and this proved difficult adjusting to traditional fighters like Street Fighter. But for some reason this helped getting me back on returning to my roots when I picked up Tekken again last 2016 after understanding my own play style from 2D fighters then incorporate it on the 3D environment, and with Akuma being announced back then as playable in Tekken 7. Since September 2016 though, I'm still at the doorsteps of Level 3 on Tekken 5 DR as this was the affordable way I have for now in terms of 3D movement training, then at the late stages of Level 2 for the later Tekken Games, then still on mid stages of Level 2 for Tekken Tag 1.
I would assume level 4 would be something like influencing the opponent's actions or play. 1) This can be done by forcing them into a situation where opponent options are limited (example: knock downs, forcing opponents into the corner) 2) Exploiting known tendencies, feeding back into level 3 of knowing the opponent, by creating situations you know will trigger tendency you know your opponent has, and then having your best response at the ready to fully capitalize on successfully getting your opponent to go forward with that tendency (example: shimmy throw bait, parry bait moves in SF3, moving yourself to a distance where you make the opponent think you're going to throw a fireball). 3) It could also be done with psychological dominance. If you can get your opponent flustered or in a state where they feel they can't beat you, it makes it all the easier for you since their execution and decision making will suffer (example: the Justin Wong effect, or what happens after Daigo takes up residence in your brain -- "PRESS SOME BUTTONS COLE!").
lled78 idk man I play tekken and I sucked and it's not hard to do. there are consistent set ups for grabs do those until they duck the grab then launch. simple mixup tactic
Man, I wish you had a live radio show so I could just listen to you talk about the gaming community while driving to work. Its tough finding places/people who like to analyze gaming as much as you, which is why I consider you a pillar to the gaming community. Keep up the good work, sir.
Here's the problem Max, fighting games aren't fighting games. I see them as dance dance revolution. It's all about finding an opening and putting in a sequence, that's somewhat fighting but not really. The closest thing to a fighting game out there is Fight Night. These fighting games like Tekken, Streetfighter, Soul Calibur, ect they feel too coded. Sometimes they say press square(2x) and triangle to do a combo but you press what they say and your character does something else. Too focused on input timing and juggles. A true fighting game let's us create our moves, combos, ect like in Fight Night.
lets not focus on combos and focus on fundumentals, like spacing, footsies, anti-airing, reading the opponent, rushdown, turtle, matchups, excution, etc..
Keith Wayne say what you feel, but it doesn't make my statement any less correct. fighting games are about button sequence, juggling, and timing. Like I said before, it's somewhat related to fighting but not close enough. It doesn't feel like fighting, it feels like dance dance Matrix.
That's not true. It may sound look like it, cuz that's where you're focusing most of your time to. Fighting games are not about button presses and timing, it's not about combos. What are you doing as soon as the round starts? Fishing for a combo? Uber risky. Turtling? You'll need ultimate SPACE CONTROL for that. Rushdowning the opponent? You need execution, space control, reading the opponent, and matchup knowledge for that. There are soo many things in fighting games besides "button presses and timing."
Keith Wayne Yes and no. There is still coded commands we have to focus on to pull things off. Then each system is different where certain moves or guards cancel out frames and it just doesn't feel like fighting at all. The dashing, and don't get me started on the overuse of life bars. Fighting games are generally too focused on the coded timing system from Japan. I don't know, I'm known for thinking ahead and out of the box, which is why my ideas don't usually make sense to some people at first. In real life if you get hit and wait it out, the pain goes away. Life bars only seem to refill on parries. If anything there should only be a stamina and damage bar like Fight Night or WWE, sports games understand this and most 2d or 3d fantasy fighters don't. In order to get the real feel of combat you have to be somewhat realistic. Soul Calibur should just trash all of the coded commands and make their game about whoever lands the most effective few blows first win like in real life weapons combat. Tekken should follow fight night's or Def Jam FFNY's system, it'll be DIFFERENT from it's previous titles and more... better.
OverthereLook Well you are comparing 2 different types of games. Wrestling/sports games with 3d/2d fighters. Having health and stamina regen in those games works because there is a more than 1 way to win (pins, submissions, knockouts, etc). In WWE and Def Jam, you can submit or pin someone regardless of their health or stamina, which balances the game and makes it so matches don't take forever. 2D/3D fighting games don't have that. You can only incapacitate/kill them. A regenerating health system would encourage even campier gameplay in games like SSF4, something no one wants to see. Without an alternate way of winning, a best of 3 match in street fighter or tekken would practically double in length, ruining the excitement or intensity. There's a reason Street Fighter and Soul Caliber have a huge competitive seen and WWE 2k14 does not
No its not. The concepts in this video apply to smash as well. Mastering your character, knowing the match ups, and mind games are all a part of doing well in smash and any other fighting game.
you're absolutely right about how if you play more you eventually settle in and become better, i play tekken a lot and i began by using characters that i really didn't like but then i started using one because i was curious and i eventually started kicking some serious butt with her, after that i unlocked some other characters and found another i kicked butt with, its all about finding who you like and using them to get better and better :)
You're channel (along with Mike Ross vs. Combofiend) are the reason I understand and enjoy fighting games today. Am I a high level evo contender, no, but I understand the magic that lays within competitive games that is as captivating as the experience of something like Bioshock Infinite. You may not be the pinnacle of Fighting Games but you helped sweep away the confusing nature of these games and I am a better person for it :)
And lvl 4 would be understanding and adapting to your opponents moves, before they even make them. In martial arts its called a preemptive strike. You realize the next move your opponent is going to do. If you have the clarity and calm to perceive and act upon this. Your opponent will be devastated. He will not know what hit him. Or to put it in another manner, your opponent is moving the way you want him to because you are making him move the way you want.
Its the long running impact of mindgames, and the yomi, the reads, that come from this, Grapplers need a lot of this, especially in their wakeup game, both against downed foes and when getting up themselves
I was just recently asking myself on how can I get better and this video popped up I always pick up fighting games fast and then I just get stuck and can't progress and further, get my ass kicked and get frustrated. This is great info that I never even considered.
Thanks Max, I don't mean to sound cocky but I have made it to level three, and I did it through all of my own training, websites, guides, and UA-cam vids like this one:). I'm happy that with my 6 month experience with fighting games (playing competitive at least) I can beat people who have played fighting games for 15, maybe a little more years. Thanks for vids like these, they really work
My motivation to get good at fighting games started with my brother kicking my ass as Mortal Kombat when I was young, and that was my first ever video game. I practiced as hard as I could until I eventually managed to beat him, but whenever I make friends I always seem to find a rival to go up against, and then I'm motivated to improve to see if I can push past that. I've always had a bar set through these people. I guess I've been lucky.
I played games since I was a kid. If not my first game one of em was street fighter 2. Over the years ive kept up with my love for them with datkstalkers, guilty gear, mortal kombat, KI, and street fighter ex and alpha series. But as I continued to grow old I fell out of love with them. One day I found your page and you insoired me to get back into the games. And now that I play them I look at the game totally different. fighting games are very strategic and the variety of moves they give...
I want to get better because fighting games are just so awesome! They look and feel great when you pull off a huge combo in a game like killer instinct. I love the hype behind them and your channel has defiantly inspired me to play more. My biggest problem is my hands can't always execute what my mind wants them to, if you know what I mean. But, I'll keep trying and one day I'll get it.
I want to learn in fighting games because i find it fun to get better at it, like for example in injustice, i found it so much fun learning the ins and outs of that game, seeing my self progressing and getting better and better until i found that a lot of people tell me that i am the best green lantern they have ever played. even though i dont think so i certainly have fought gls better than me but it still is a nice compliment none the less, and the fact that when you fight people at your skill level, the fight becomes so intense and so much damn fun! i dont even care if i lose, just that it was one hell of a fun match. that is my reasoning for learning new fighters
He made a good point. What Max says can be translated into any competitive game, not just fighters. Learning to adapt with game you're playing is the first step at becoming good at it, and the top comments say examples that help build upon that idea.
Having fun and keeping a positive attitude is also something I tend to consider. I know it's pretty obvious, but I find myself getting frustrated at times and I often ignoring this simple thing, which is bad. It only makes me perform worse in that situation. And if you do start to get upset just take a break. Calming yourself down before you get back into the game definitely helps.
I recently stumbled upon your channel and I have to say... you're fucking amazing! Great articulation, great production values, and great personality make stand head and shoulders above most Utube creators. Continue the fantastic work and I'm looking forward to more stuff from you. Cheers.
I think another thing that definitely needs mentioning is just how to play fighting games at its core. Before even picking a character and learning set-ups and whatnot, just knowing how fighters work. My friends will play fighting games sometimes casually but they don't grasp the actual games. They mash and expect that to work. I try actually sitting down with them and letting them know, when you actually play your inputs are much slower than you realize.
i've train with kazuya since tekken 5 it's been years ago. and im so lucky that his move doesnt change so much. it helped me to improve my skills rather than learn to use new moves
My main reason to get good at Marvel is actually James Chen via Twitter. I wished him a happy birthday, thanking him for being such a big part of the FGC, even for the nobodies like me. He responded: "Thank you sir. I do it for the "nobodies" because I believe nobody is a nobody." That seriously impacted me.
In my opinion, "Fancyness" is a great part of fighting games. Pulling out fancy combos really helps you, because you start to know the game mechanics and you can pull any combo much easier and raise your ego, you actually feel great when you are playing with someone else and make a great comeback with some combo fancyness That's why fighting games is my favourite genre. But my only problem, is that I get to good at them, and I don't have any friends at my level to play fighting games with
Those points you gave, are so true max. I was the type of gamer that would play any fighting game,even the ones that weren't popular,like king of fighters and virtual fighter. I would find info about how to be good, but there was no point since I couldn't find opponents, just my friends. This was before online gaming and internet so i couldn't keep the drive of learning and adopting to the games(the arcades were too far as well).so I gave up learning but still had passion for fighting games
For those wondering, in my opinion, Level 4 is the Surprise Effect. How original one can be with the character they're using (whether they discovered new techniques with them or play it differently) or even what character they're using. This is what wins many tournaments.
thanks for the tips max actually went to a local tournament earlier in the month of march and took third in umvc3 it was a really stress ful time but the fact remains that if it wasnt for alot of the toutalige that you bring to the channel every single day i probably wouldnt have done so well thanks again for the great vids you produce
It's really all down to the nature of independent learning. As a gamer grasping every different knowledge in different games and seeing all the potential this game has to offer. It's the same way of applying this to any type of revision.
i picked up under night in birth back in february and i want to say, the first thing to learning that game was to understand the game's system - too many factors to take note of. but after a while, it grew on me and now i'm like somewhat decent
imo it's also important to try not to act following your habits. there are situations where a player tends to always do the same thing, probably without even realizing it. once you get to know your own bad habits and start working to fix them, you're gonna improve immensly
level 4: you become one with the game, you are able to put all your focus and attention in the match, disregarding any environmental/emotional distraction that may disturb your gameplay. Hence the consistent top-placing tournament players.
im at Level 3 in a half when it comes to fighting games & shooters i Agree with this video, my favorite game is the street fighter series i Played tekken i would say, i was a level 4 on there its a easy game My word of advice to others that wanna improve on fighting games is to Use every character in game why? learning there fighting style Can also give you the edge at beating them Playing online helps and train daily even watch youtube videos Learn your character advantages & weaknesses i.e
I think the first step is admitting that you're bad but remembering that you can and will get better as long as you keep playing. Everything you said is on point though. I'm trying to get out more now to play against more characters to become familiar. ECT is in May, gotta get ready....
A good game to learn fundamentals with is Super Turbo. It's basic but at the same time is filled with so much info and tools that will make your knowledge with fighting games grow.
Great explanation. My main problem is execution of real difficult combos. Usually the ones where you have to do some EX cancellations and things like that.
1. pick a good looking character
2. train and learn basic attacks
3. try to learn the games rules because not all fighting games are the same.
4. beat arcade on easy, normal, hard, very hard and hell ( unless the game has a unfair ended boss) if so just play VS mode to you feel that you're better than the computer and continually up the difficulty.
5. go back to training to try to learn as many attacks and combos as you can.
6. Repeat 1,2,4 and 5
7. The computer is not very smart and you got bored
8. friends don't want to play you
9. play on online
10 the rest will come together like a puzzle.
Ta-dah you are somewhat good are average
mk2 ai laughs in the face of this comment
@@armoredmilkman3288*Points* "YOU SUCK"
yeah unfair, cheap boss like saiki and dark ash back to back on kof XIII
1: Pick Yoshimitsu
2: Fuck with people’s heads
3: fuck your own head
4: Do some crazy shit , and say “I meant to do that “
My friends don’t play fighting games with me ;-;
God, i suck at fighting games, but I love them so much... T_T
same here
I really feel you on that, man!!! :'(
Same here. I love the games, but lack the time and patience to really be good. I'll find a few characters I'm naturally halfway decent with, specials that are fairly easy for me to trigger, combos I can execute at will, etc. Where I run into problems are the more advanced things. Cancels, reversals, ultras, and hypers for example. I guess you could say I fail to even reach level one...I may know my character, but there are several powerful techniques I just cannot seem to master...if I pull it off, its because I did it by accident while trying to do something else.
The training room often lets me see the inputs I made, so I can see what is going wrong when I'm trying to trigger. The problem is how to fix it? The most common issue is the required D pad motions. I make the proper motion, but some of the directions don't reflect properly on the input. When I keep trying over and over again and get nothing but fail after fail, and can see on the screen that it literally is not doing what I'm telling it to do...that becomes maddening. Because of that, I start to grow bored. Its like I hit a roadblock that I can see, but can't get past. I can play and have fun up to that point, but that is a very limited playground.
random stuff I understand.You are exactly like me.On the D-pad my thumbs are slipping too and I seem to be unable to do half of the special moves.
this is why I can play only fighters with simple buttons combinations, like Mortal Kombat, injustice and Guilty Gear Xrd (which also has a helpful tutorial)
Playing the Game
Playing Your Character
Playing the Matchup
Playing Your Opponent
Well put.
jedisquidward
Level 4 I believe is playing urself. Studying ur tendencies, reducing the amount of waste in your build ups. As an amateur fighter, it's building multiple flows of something as basic as the jab, a sway. When it doesn't matter what ur opponent does because you realize you are the one who makes yourself available to eat damage. When u discover infinite possibilities, u attain access to a conscious godlike unpredictable that's something akin to transforming into a rubric cube that fights back.
Played yourself (DJ KHALED)
this dude predicted the brain expanding meme
I'll be completely honest here. I suck at fighting games, but I still love playing them simply because they're just fine and enjoyable to play. I'm not a competitive player by any means. I mainly just play for enjoyment
Dude try killer instinct they just added a combo assist where u can do combos with 1 button and 1 button special inputs I bet u will love it
Same
+HerkyDerky Does it look like we Care about you?
+HerkyDerky noone asked for your opinion.... Gtfo
Smash Bros, especially SSB4.
Execution in my honest opinion isn't a problem and everything save for Smash Attacks is something you need to do on whim without the need to 236 or 214 and that crap.
All you need to know is what the hell to do and when to do it. Things like pivot grabs and stuff are mainly a personal bonus.
Reason why I say Smash 4 is due to the lack of crazy mechanics like wavedashing and L-cancelling. Brawl however is a bit too awkward in comparison, and everyone hates prat-falling.
Some more tips for newcomers to the FGC:
1. Once you've chosen your main, and practiced a bit, break your characters abilities down into a flowchart when you fight people online. I like to open up with certain moves and see my opponents capabilities to block them. If they can't, I exploit it. If they can, I move to a different set and try to pick them apart systematically until I find something I can exploit.
2. Know your matchup, some characters just aren't meant to win against others. For example, Vega usually gets torn up by Guile or Ryu.
3. Fundamentals are the most important thing to your game. Sure if you can pull off fancy combos you may win. However, if you can't defend, or you don't know your basic buttons despite knowing fancier moves, any good opponent will recognize this and exploit it to your advantage. Practice your basics, even after you think you have mastered them.
4. This applies once you get beyond beginner stratus; Trust in yourself. You will never win a match if you don't have confidence. Most players let fear control them when they see high tier opponents and this will affect your gameplay. However, alot of high tier opponents can be tricked and deceived by a player who they consider lowtier if you plan your matchup accordingly.
5. Know your ground. This applies to some more advanced maneuvers and tactics in fighting games. If you know your opponent can't withstand pressure in a corner, do your best to push him back there. If you know your opponent favors corner positions (Guile I'm looking at you) try to get him out of position by any means possible. This may seem common knowledge, but true application requires quite a bit of mastery.
Some of this was covered in the video, but I wanted to go a little more into depth on how some more advanced players think in fighting games.
thank you so much mate
I would stress 4. alot. You have no idea how many times I would play someone with like an 10000 or 9000 ranking on SFV and I'd get psyched out thinking how good they are. But they likely aren't expecting you to be any good.
Alot of the time, I just use my good defense game and punish the unsafe things they do on shield. As I whittle them down, they'll get desperate and that's when they expose themselves.
4 l8r
Dawg you shoulda made the video.
On shield? Beni your Melee history is showing ;)
It wasn't until I went online that I realized very quickly how bad I really was at fighting games. Getting my butt handed to me match after match really took the fun out of it for me. Im no sore loser but after so many loses I stopped having fun. It became very clear to me that I am more of a casual player and will never be able to play at a level where online could be fun for me. I respect the players that really put in the time to get as good as they do at theses games. Is there anyone else that feels the way I do?
I've felt that way since I was a kid playing virtua fighter with my father and brother. It sucks bro but learn a character,their moves,their strengths and weaknesses and you should be good. I used to be shit at the game but now I'm not half bad. Also,choose a game you really enjoy playing casually then step up to playing in a competitive mindset. Take it slow,practice with a character,and you might get that fighting game spirit in you yet.
I was the same when I started playing Tekken a few months ago; I just kept losing and losing. I stuck to it though, watching tutorial videos, going into practice mode and learning my character, learning frame data, etc. Once you start to learn the basics, you might enjoy the game more than the usual casual player. Also don't focus just on winning, focus on improvement. If you lose, think about why you lost that match and maybe what you can do to fix that next time. If you stick to it, you might really enjoy the fighting game. It does take dedication, but it can feel really satisfying when you finally get something down.
Same. Nowadays I've just put the controller down and moved on to other games. Call me a sore loser if you will, but the fun stopped in 2013 with TTT2. Ruined itself and every other fighting game for me
I was the opposite. I didn't really have much of an interest in fighting games until I on a whim played Melty Blood against somebody online about three and a half years ago and got perfected to no end.
I'm not sure why it made me want to continue playing to such an extent. I guess something about there being such a huge gap between people was intriguing to me.
Until then I had been playing FPS and MMOs against other people for years, and in those games it seems pretty much anybody, through either teamwork, items or just investing a lot of time can win games. This is not the case with fighting games, and since that first online match of Melty Blood three and a half years ago, I've completely lost all interest in non-fighting multiplayer games.
I'm having a hard time finding people to play offline though, because most people are like you; they stop playing when they lose instead of looking into how to get better. No offense; just the way of the world it seems.
Roy Bread i think you've inspired me to give fighting games another chance Ive avoided it for years because of how bad my ass has been handed to by friends or online, I guess everybody starts somewhere now i just gotta invest in an arcade stick :D
The hardest thing for me when it comes to fighting games in the input.
playing defensively and reading opponents is the hardest
+Silver Kaizer (Kaiomaster) I agree games have made inputting a super moves more difficult. SF4 input ir mk9 input is more demanding than mk2 or sf2 or the alphas. SF x Tekken addresses this with a gem system to allow easier super moves. I hate charge moves those are the worst when trying a character ultra combo.
+Mark S I feel it's worse with SNK. The inputs they expect from you are insane.
Well Samurai Shodown's moves aren't that bad. I just wish the SF 3&4 had the input sensitivity of SF2 and SF Alpha. Back then it was easier pulling off a Hadoken or dragon punch. I still cannot do an Ultra with any charge characters like blank, m bison, balrog.
Mark S I have an alpha game(3, I think). Input sensitivity is my biggest grip. Ultra kind of fixes it. It's much easier to pull of a Hadouken now.
I have always tried and tried but sadly I'm still in button mash limbo
Knowing the range and speed of your attacks as well as the range and speed of the enemy's attacks is paramount. You'll want to open up with the fastest attack that will reach the enemy, usually. After that you can learn all the interesting movement options, combos, and high-low mixups. Lastly you can figure out the interesting tricks like cross ups, frame traps, visually obscured high-low mixups, unblockable setups, etc. Knowing how to use those techniques will teach you how to block those techniques because you will start to recognize your opponents moves. Recognizing the attack is all you need to do, then you will block it by instinct. Same with recognizing grab opportunities and when you are going to be grabbed. I hope this helps!
***** Well that's why I said first, then second, then last. If he hasn't done the first then he shouldn't worry about the second or last, etc.
Me too I just press random buttons without knowing what they do
Zadamanim Honestly I find myself in the position of the OP, wanting to know what the secret is. And I DO know what all those terms mean, and check frame advantage numbers when I start a new character, and so on. And I DO practice combos, high-low-throw mixups, crossups, etc. I think the issue I have is that there are a very select few games (SSBM + SC4 is about it) in which I watch the ENEMY rather than my own character, so my defense is balls. Notably those were the two games that I played a locally ranked guy every day, so maybe it all comes down to practice after all...
I had just started to watch the enemy in P4A when P4AU came out Stateside, and I had to relearn everyone.
pondrthis1 That's something I totally overlooked! "Learning your character" should always come first, even if its just learning a few "best moves" at the start (like hadouken, low roundhouse, and jab for Ryu) and after that, always watching the enemy. Your character never changes, so you should always know what your own character is going to do. After that, playing against every other character (even computer opponents) will give you an idea of what you should look out for from each enemy (like Kanji's dive-throw in P4A and P4U, or dragon punches) The enemy player's should be the only mystery on the battlefield! If you find yourself getting hit by some seemingly unstoppable set up, like Chie has in P4U, then maybe you could save the replay and look at it later? When I watch replays I see all these openings I didn't see in the original match. Sometimes I think I finally learned an opponent's block string, and then they make it longer-mid fight! I think it takes a long time to learn every possible situation, but it always helps to be analytic, so that if you see that same set up again, you'll get out of it the next time. Fighting people who use the same character(s) as you can teach you some new moves or styles too, especially if the computer never uses that option :P
That mammoth really wants to catch that hovercraft; probably mating season.
I would have added a level 0: understanding the game mechanics. KoFs play diferent than SFs or MK.
There are theese core game mechanics like parrying, max mode, contering, jumping or canceling movements, common to all the characters of a game.
He did mention learning systems with Lv1, since learning your character includes core mechanics they work within
Awesome! This is the way I normally learn a fighting game:
1. Tutorial (learn system mechanics)
2. Picking a character (any character that appeals to you & just play with him/her)
3. Training Room/Trials (go over normals, specials, combos, and other character-specific details)
4. Building Fundamentals (spacing, hitconfirms, blockstrings, mixups, and combos)
5. Improve Execution (repeat 3 & 4 until you are capable of doing what you want at will)
6. Fully understand character (maximizing damage, meter usage, matchup knowledge)
7. Fight against the CPU a lot (not the best, but perfect for practicing hitconfirms; hardest setting)
8. Fight other players (where most matchup knowledge accumulates over time; experience different playstyles)
9. Watch replays of top players (for visual learners, best way to fully utilize characters is by knowing what moves to use in what situations)
10. You've come this far; will you keep going or move on to another fighting game? (In my case, I move to another fighting game, but I'm starting to break that habit ;))
Hmmm...that depends, because some games are best learned hopping into training and seeing what you could come up with (Ultimate Marvel vs Capcom 3; I learned better by hopping into the training mode and learning what the game allows and disallows me to do) but if that doesn't work, I'd say just keep playing and it will come to you over time.
Unfortunately, there is no shortcut to learning fighting games, as cliche as it sounds. You'll only learn through experience, so that statement confuses me. If you say fighting games don't come to you over time, then it may have to do with the mentality you have while playing. My best advice would be to either become more serious about those games or find a more accessible fighting game to play.
The effect itself, I have no idea. What I CAN tell you from experience is that if you forget you have more moves than you are accustomed to using, then you should try going to the training room and familiarize yourself with each special move. It's a start to learning what your characters can and cannot do in any given situation.
It's been 9 years and this video is still matters.
it's psychological too. Some times i get too excited and botch combos. This only happens in Tekken though. Margin of error in Tekken can be unforgivable.
Me I try to do everything in the fighting games I use every single character I play every single level I try to use every single characters moves and the reason why I even like to play fighting games is to win but have fun doing it and I know I'm not the best at it
Super Smash Bros. is for you
Step 0 is deciding if you even want to get better at the game. Some people only play a game because they feel obligated to, like if someone gifted it to them and asked to play together.
If you suck at fighting games and just want to get "good enough" to be able to play with your friends on near-equal ground, starting off playing against them is a terrible idea. You'll get trounced every single time and likely not learn anything from your losses as frustration and anger start to consume you. Start off with the tutorial, and when you're finished with it, do it again.
My problem is i still don't understand the logic. I still don't know how to pull off stick rotation moves at all even after trying for a few hours. I need help with the basic mechanics.
Sono Try out Rising Thunder! It's a free to play fighting game (by Seth Killian) on PC and doesn't have stick rotation at all. It's in its open technical alpha.
Sono There's an awesome video with Gootecks about learning to play with an arcade stick!
What game are you trying it on? Some games have more leniency than others.
Garrett Thomas
Last time was Skullgirls I believe.
Sono
Well dang, I don't know what to tell you. SG has the most lenient inputs in the genre, and even has a special thing that detects when you're doing a 360 so you don't jump. Are you making a full circle quickly?
so my problem is when i play against a real person. i just like freeze and forget like everything..any advise?
Same xD I start spamming square and triangle lmfaoo
It's hard but make sure to play with people that don't spit in the face of beginners, or befriend an advanced/expert player
Sounds like performance anxiety there's a real good book called the inner game of tennis about performance anxiety give it a read
ODST Agent indeed
SEVERAL STERALLZ same lol
I still constantly find myself rewatching this video, I can actually say you made get into the Street fighter 3rd strike community and for that, I will forever be grateful. Mad respect for you man, keep up the great work
This is... the truth right here Max! Unfortunately most people are just casual players but it's all good!
Justin Chang That's their choice.
NEON 7 thus why I said it's all good lol.
I play fighting games to have fun. I love the action, and I love the martial arts. Being a Martial artist myself, I love mastering characters like Ibiku, or Ryu. They're mastery of martial arts is incredible.
It is weird to say this, but.. I think I am good at Level 1 and 3, but I think I would need more experience with playing the rest of the characters to fill in void 2.
I pretty much am in the opposite stance of you on the terms of What motivates me to play and get better. I adapt what I call, The Ryu method and style of fighting. I realize for me, it is not about winning or losing, but learning what lesson I can get out of the battle to perfect my own skill. I even borrow elements from previous players if I notice they have a good idea that could work if I experiment with it more. My style comes from Ryu's quote from Third Strike actually." A good fighter is constantly learning. During that fight, you taught me how to defeat you."
I Love Fighting Games. I Understand my favorites Character Moves, block, and Special moves, Understanding the Match-Ups, and knowledge to what am suppose to do in which level.
decent ideas, i don't agree with the tiers. Like you're not going to completely master a character and do every combo before moving onto match ups.
It's the button combinations that always throws me off. I seem to never get those right and I really struggle with it.
I just started trying to get into fighting games. I've been playing fps/rpg games for awhile and got a little bored
I ended up teaching a lot of people I know Smash Bros. Melee and Marvel 3, and let me tell you. This is one of the FIRST THINGS I send anybody. I also send them Max's other videos on getting good. Not only does it iron out whatever misconceptions they may have, but it is presented so well by someone who is so good that they are eager to improve!
i want to play Bayonetta now thnx to the music
This makes so much more sense. Especially regarding Mortal Kombat 9. The guidebook actually tells you which characters are stronger or weaker against specific characters. An outline like that is really helpful.
huh this... actually could be used for dark souls pvp as well like...
level 1- learning a character equates to learn a weapon, how to use it etc...
level 2- learn match-ups equates to learning what weapon works against what weapons
level 3- mindgames... well... yeah that's the bulk of dark souls pvp right there- faking out your opponent, making them think you're gonna do one thing so that they do another thing so that you can hit them...
so in short, i already /knew/ how to get good at fighting games, all this video did is show me that i already knew... like i didn't know that i knew.
thanks for showing me that.
Dunno if you know, but Dark Souls is really popular among people who are into fighting games. People who really like Dark Souls PvP could likely also be suited for fighting games.
yeah i discovered this
I read that whole thing in Shinjiro's voice by accident.
*****
There are some ridiculous quick swapping tricks, but yes, you're right about that. Once you get past the input barrier though, the game is similar in many ways.
***** It is hard. Especially if you want to be good. I find myself cursing at myself constantly for dropping an input that should have won me the round. Even the top pros do it every once in a while.
At least my game of choice; Melty Blood is lenient enough that inputs don't stop people from even getting into the game.
My little brother tried playing Street Fighter once and couldn't even get past the first (or one of the first) trials where he was asked to link two normals together. I made it on the first try when he asked me to do it, probably because I have some experience with that sort of thing, but I think it's a real problem that something as basic as that requires strict inputs.
It's addicting once you get into it though. No other games give me the same amount of satisfaction upon success anymore.
Jazz music shouldn't work with this gameplay. But it does. Interesting combo
Smooth ass Bayonetta music = Awesome
I learn my fighting games so I can teach other players, feels awesome when u see people grow and knowing you were a part of that. :D
yomi means "read" in Japanese
lesson: reading your opponent to defeat them.
seems like a fitting term
VGFanatic Yeah, we use that word for things like "reading ahead" in chess.
nanoday1 is it true that there's a best move in every situation in chess?
Keith Wayne Probably? I think people could debate about that.
I just meant that we use the word "read" in a similar way in English as well.
nanoday1
what's oshiri?
Starting with na F-Zero Jazz álbum song, Max you're awsome
How to get better? Starts with p and ends with ractice
Ryan Kwak Totally agree! Practice and repetition! Everything else will fall into place if you just keep practicing consistently. You'll get your ass handed to you online in the beginning, but stay diligent and the improvement will come.
OMG thank you SO MUCH for having that smooth jazz Big Blue in the background, Max!! I LOVE YOU
Around the 4:00 mark, the music changes to "The Gates of Hell" from the Bayonetta Soundtrack
I'm learning to play kof02 for the last 2 years, its the first fighting game that I really feel that I'm level 3, and let me tell you, its awesome!
I'm fully focused on Blazblue. I don't play and learn to be a competitive player. But i try to learn my best so i don't fully suck at it. I play fighting games for my enjoyment, but at the same time, i try to learn at least 30% on how to be really good, just so i don't suck balls. But if you had to ask if i play to be competitive or not. Not really. Just trying to learn my pros and cons with each characters i main.
Other important things to touch on to beginners are Links, how to perform/ practice the timing of the button presses, getting used to short jumping, buffering, getting over mashing your combos, remembering the combo inputs and applying those inputs into getting comfortable with them on a fightstick/ controller, getting well acquainted into tier lists and which character suits you, getting over the fear of being beaten over and over, start out and expect how long it will take you in order to rise up against your opponents, understand that fighting games are not something that can be completely mastered in an hour, having strong discipline and patience, know that whoever beats you is more acquainted with the game more than you are, practicing motion specials to both P1 and P2 sides, knowing certain abbreviations for moves such as qcf and hcb..... now I gotta admit that this video is well made in it of itself but these are very common things that almost anyone getting into fighting games miss over. Hopefully you can do a video explaining at least 4 of these concepts considering you inspire a lot of people to still go out there and try to become the best. Fighting games is kinda like art, you WILL suck ass at first and may even consider quitting, but eventually you'll grow more and become better than you were once before.
I wasn't at all into fighting games until I tried Guilty Gear Xrd Sign around the time it released. At that point I decided I wanted to become good at it. It took some time before I could even accomplish commands/specials. All this time later and I still suck. I go online and consistently get whooped. I think my biggest problems are my inability to block correctly and my lack of understanding of safe and unsafe moves. I'm just really unsure where to go from this point to become better. I know Dustloop wiki is a good source of info, but I don't entirely understand how to utilize the info.
If anyone has any advice at all, I'd greatly appreciate it.
Did you get better at it?
Melee I feel is the easiest to get in tandem, but the hardest to master because of the freedom you have. Knowing potential etc
LEVEL 0.5: Don't be anything like DarkSydePhil!
I try not to stray away because fighting games are domestic to me. I like the different points and they've psychologically helped me. I'll continue to watch your videos in hopes of getting better. Thanks, Dude!
The Bayonetta music is real. And great video, as usual
Matthew Morella what song is this?
The thing I love most about fighting games..... Playing with your friends and making killer comebacks that shock the players. Also trying to take the next step in creating your own way and style of play for any character. You are who you play.
Why do I want to get good at a fighting game? Because Mortal Kombat X is a little more than two weeks away and from the very little I've played from MK9, and the decent bit MK1 and 2 on mame, I can not pull off combos and would like to not come across as a noob online. :) (I mean a gaming noob, not noob saibot) What brought everyone else here?
Same lol, preparing for MKX. I don't want to be that noob xD
LOL
With MK9 I practiced a lot, played the ladders a lot thinking it would prepare me for online (which I was super hyped for). I was blown out of the water most of the time and there was bad Netcode. Meaning don't be afraid to practice a little before jumping online that is were you are really going to learn. Just learn one or two small pop up combos that leads into juggling.
Injustice
I want to get Injustice 2, but i know damn well im going to get my ass handed to me repeatedly.
I think a big part of the mind games aspect is being able to keep your cool. Sometimes when I lose online, it can get discouraging or frustrating. People tend to do better in any type of competition if they take it easy and move on from their past losses.
Great video as usual! I love the Real Talk series! :)
I think the only game I'm level 3 at is Melee. I mean, let's be honest...there are only like 8 real characters. Everyone else is kinda bad and you already know their moves and how to beat them.
It's real easy to know your character's moves, the hard part is getting the required tech skill to do them all the time. As a Falco main, I'd say I have this mastered about 76%. I can do almost any tech, there are only a few things I can't do. Like ledgedash consistently, OoS options, and sweetspotting the ledge. Everything else I can pretty much do. When I want to.
I know all that matchups for my character too. Against Fox, you wanna focus on reads and making sure that you control the center stage. Fox can bullied off stage, but he has the edge in frames and he's a faster character. Luckily, Fox is pretty lightweight, you can zero to death him quickly if you can capitalize off a read.
Marth's main threats are his grab range and disjointed hitbox. You wanna take potshots with lasers and use them to close the distance and prevent him from swinging that massive disjoint. Mastering DI is crucial in this matchup, because Marth can otherwise chaingrab you to death.
These are just two matchups I've learned, mostly through trial and error.
The third level is mind games, which has been the bane of my existence for a very long time. For me, learning tech and playing the matchup according to data was easy. I'm like a robot, I enjoy that kind of thing.
But trying to read my opponent? Predictions? I didn't like it, none of it was surefire. I could easily be wrong and that could cost me the game. Eventually, I got past this and tried the mindgames route.
Against a friend, I had to face the reality that he was simply a faster Falco than I was. Anything that I wanted to do, he could have already done it...and then some. I remember one game, he short hopped down-aired alot. But me, being the braindead Falco player I was....didn't do anything about it. Until it made sense in my head.
It suddenly occurred to me that he was merely doing it because it worked. It was at this I point, I started wavedashing back slightly just as he came down and got a grab.
I did this all the time, eventually causing him to change it up and do a different spacing.
But if he did a different spacing, that gave me time to simply dodge and punish with a nair.
This was only a few months ago mind you, and it was at this point I realized what mindgames were. Thinking about what the opponent will do, even if it means eating an L to find out what their patterns are. Then acting on it.
Ayyy a fellow smasher. I'm an aspiring Melee/Sm4sh player, and I'm starting to attend more tournaments. Good luck with Melee :)
+Mirage_SSB4 Hello there fellow smasher.
I'm not such a smash player myself, but I've learned a few tech along while playing against other. Except my Samus main sucks against anyone that is fast enough to evade most of any charged shots or deflect it. And my only hope is that I can try to chain combos on the ground to get it working (Since most of her air attacks are useless, except for Bair and Nair, and dair if you're lucky to hit someone with it). Ground, missiles and charged shots still work, if it ain't Fox or Falco.
But hey. Good tips you just gave out. Keep up the good work.
You kind of remind me of m2k in regards to mindset. You know the mechanics very well but when someone (like mango) starts doing stuff that you're not used to you tend to start panicking and ultimately end up tilting out.
Exactly, thats mindgames, people do things because they work, and stop doing things when they don't, reading them, watching their old matchs, and just generally learning how they work, and countering that, can change how they approach you, and from there, put them out of their comfort zone, at which point you can start preying on the cracks you are making, Grapplers in normal 2d fighters work heavily on this, due to being a clusterfuck and a half of giant threat zones, you catch a guy on wakeup with a powerful command grab a few times, and they'll start worrying about it and waking up differently, at which point you prey on the new response with a different grab
I only got to level 3 in a SSB fan game called Super Smash Flash. It's actually pretty good and it's being updated to this day, being completely free. I love it.
Love Smash Flash 2!
So I've picked up Street Fighter 3 and 4... And I'm terrible at both. Because I spent $50 on them, I'm not letting myself quit. But I have done multiple training methods and none work... This is the last resort...
Would anyone be interested in playing online with me so I can eventually get better at the games and my money and time won't have been wasted?
Wilson Maddles do you have ultra street fighter and on what console?
I have Ultra Street Fighter 4 on PS3. Along with Street Fighter 3 Online for PS3.
Wilson Maddles im gonna buy it on the console, i play on pc almost daily, i'll try and get back to you when i get it on the console
Thank you for the help. I truly appreciate your efforts.
Yeah I'm also terrible for street fighter too. I'm on ps3 also... So yeah.
This video clearly reminded me of the journey I had with fighting games. Thank you. :)
I used to suck at fighting games as I started as a button masher and repeating commands, until I learned how to play a game title properly with mastering a character then understanding a game system. I started learning fighting games thru anime fighters and this proved difficult adjusting to traditional fighters like Street Fighter. But for some reason this helped getting me back on returning to my roots when I picked up Tekken again last 2016 after understanding my own play style from 2D fighters then incorporate it on the 3D environment, and with Akuma being announced back then as playable in Tekken 7.
Since September 2016 though, I'm still at the doorsteps of Level 3 on Tekken 5 DR as this was the affordable way I have for now in terms of 3D movement training, then at the late stages of Level 2 for the later Tekken Games, then still on mid stages of Level 2 for Tekken Tag 1.
give us level 4!!! great video.
I would assume level 4 would be something like influencing the opponent's actions or play.
1) This can be done by forcing them into a situation where opponent options are limited (example: knock downs, forcing opponents into the corner)
2) Exploiting known tendencies, feeding back into level 3 of knowing the opponent, by creating situations you know will trigger tendency you know your opponent has, and then having your best response at the ready to fully capitalize on successfully getting your opponent to go forward with that tendency (example: shimmy throw bait, parry bait moves in SF3, moving yourself to a distance where you make the opponent think you're going to throw a fireball).
3) It could also be done with psychological dominance. If you can get your opponent flustered or in a state where they feel they can't beat you, it makes it all the easier for you since their execution and decision making will suffer (example: the Justin Wong effect, or what happens after Daigo takes up residence in your brain -- "PRESS SOME BUTTONS COLE!").
lled78 idk man I play tekken and I sucked and it's not hard to do. there are consistent set ups for grabs do those until they duck the grab then launch. simple mixup tactic
Man, I wish you had a live radio show so I could just listen to you talk about the gaming community while driving to work. Its tough finding places/people who like to analyze gaming as much as you, which is why I consider you a pillar to the gaming community. Keep up the good work, sir.
Here's the problem Max, fighting games aren't fighting games. I see them as dance dance revolution. It's all about finding an opening and putting in a sequence, that's somewhat fighting but not really. The closest thing to a fighting game out there is Fight Night.
These fighting games like Tekken, Streetfighter, Soul Calibur, ect they feel too coded. Sometimes they say press square(2x) and triangle to do a combo but you press what they say and your character does something else. Too focused on input timing and juggles. A true fighting game let's us create our moves, combos, ect like in Fight Night.
lets not focus on combos and focus on fundumentals, like spacing, footsies, anti-airing, reading the opponent, rushdown, turtle, matchups, excution, etc..
Keith Wayne
say what you feel, but it doesn't make my statement any less correct. fighting games are about button sequence, juggling, and timing. Like I said before, it's somewhat related to fighting but not close enough. It doesn't feel like fighting, it feels like dance dance Matrix.
That's not true. It may sound look like it, cuz that's where you're focusing most of your time to. Fighting games are not about button presses and timing, it's not about combos. What are you doing as soon as the round starts? Fishing for a combo? Uber risky. Turtling? You'll need ultimate SPACE CONTROL for that. Rushdowning the opponent? You need execution, space control, reading the opponent, and matchup knowledge for that. There are soo many things in fighting games besides "button presses and timing."
Keith Wayne
Yes and no. There is still coded commands we have to focus on to pull things off. Then each system is different where certain moves or guards cancel out frames and it just doesn't feel like fighting at all. The dashing, and don't get me started on the overuse of life bars. Fighting games are generally too focused on the coded timing system from Japan. I don't know, I'm known for thinking ahead and out of the box, which is why my ideas don't usually make sense to some people at first.
In real life if you get hit and wait it out, the pain goes away. Life bars only seem to refill on parries. If anything there should only be a stamina and damage bar like Fight Night or WWE, sports games understand this and most 2d or 3d fantasy fighters don't.
In order to get the real feel of combat you have to be somewhat realistic. Soul Calibur should just trash all of the coded commands and make their game about whoever lands the most effective few blows first win like in real life weapons combat. Tekken should follow fight night's or Def Jam FFNY's system, it'll be DIFFERENT from it's previous titles and more... better.
OverthereLook Well you are comparing 2 different types of games. Wrestling/sports games with 3d/2d fighters. Having health and stamina regen in those games works because there is a more than 1 way to win (pins, submissions, knockouts, etc). In WWE and Def Jam, you can submit or pin someone regardless of their health or stamina, which balances the game and makes it so matches don't take forever. 2D/3D fighting games don't have that. You can only incapacitate/kill them. A regenerating health system would encourage even campier gameplay in games like SSF4, something no one wants to see. Without an alternate way of winning, a best of 3 match in street fighter or tekken would practically double in length, ruining the excitement or intensity. There's a reason Street Fighter and Soul Caliber have a huge competitive seen and WWE 2k14 does not
I really like this series DO NOT STOP THIS SERIES it actually gets me thinking about what I seriously need to work on
Is it weird that I'm watching this for the new smash?
Yes
Smash is a bit different compared to other fighting games. If you need a guide look for a smash specific one.
No its not. The concepts in this video apply to smash as well. Mastering your character, knowing the match ups, and mind games are all a part of doing well in smash and any other fighting game.
Smash has to be the worst fighting game ever
The Chaotic Afro I'll bite, why?
This was really educational, thanks Max! I think these 3 levels work with any competitive videogame out there, like LoL, SC2 etc.
you're absolutely right about how if you play more you eventually settle in and become better, i play tekken a lot and i began by using characters that i really didn't like but then i started using one because i was curious and i eventually started kicking some serious butt with her, after that i unlocked some other characters and found another i kicked butt with, its all about finding who you like and using them to get better and better :)
You're channel (along with Mike Ross vs. Combofiend) are the reason I understand and enjoy fighting games today. Am I a high level evo contender, no, but I understand the magic that lays within competitive games that is as captivating as the experience of something like Bioshock Infinite. You may not be the pinnacle of Fighting Games but you helped sweep away the confusing nature of these games and I am a better person for it :)
It doesn't hurt to have a friend or two that are super competitive and will play fighting games for days with you.
Yes it does
And lvl 4 would be understanding and adapting to your opponents moves, before they even make them. In martial arts its called a preemptive strike. You realize the next move your opponent is going to do. If you have the clarity and calm to perceive and act upon this. Your opponent will be devastated. He will not know what hit him.
Or to put it in another manner, your opponent is moving the way you want him to because you are making him move the way you want.
Its the long running impact of mindgames, and the yomi, the reads, that come from this, Grapplers need a lot of this, especially in their wakeup game, both against downed foes and when getting up themselves
that Bayonetta music was just so relaxing to listen to...thank you for that Max, way to set the mood of the video
I was just recently asking myself on how can I get better and this video popped up I always pick up fighting games fast and then I just get stuck and can't progress and further, get my ass kicked and get frustrated. This is great info that I never even considered.
Thanks Max, I don't mean to sound cocky but I have made it to level three, and I did it through all of my own training, websites, guides, and UA-cam vids like this one:). I'm happy that with my 6 month experience with fighting games (playing competitive at least) I can beat people who have played fighting games for 15, maybe a little more years. Thanks for vids like these, they really work
My motivation to get good at fighting games started with my brother kicking my ass as Mortal Kombat when I was young, and that was my first ever video game. I practiced as hard as I could until I eventually managed to beat him, but whenever I make friends I always seem to find a rival to go up against, and then I'm motivated to improve to see if I can push past that. I've always had a bar set through these people. I guess I've been lucky.
I played games since I was a kid. If not my first game one of em was street fighter 2. Over the years ive kept up with my love for them with datkstalkers, guilty gear, mortal kombat, KI, and street fighter ex and alpha series. But as I continued to grow old I fell out of love with them. One day I found your page and you insoired me to get back into the games. And now that I play them I look at the game totally different. fighting games are very strategic and the variety of moves they give...
The music that kicks in at 3:57 is so good that i couldnt concentrate or pay enough attention to what you were saying at the moment haha.
I want to get better because fighting games are just so awesome! They look and feel great when you pull off a huge combo in a game like killer instinct. I love the hype behind them and your channel has defiantly inspired me to play more. My biggest problem is my hands can't always execute what my mind wants them to, if you know what I mean. But, I'll keep trying and one day I'll get it.
Thank you Max 6 years later and I still come back to this video
I want to learn in fighting games because i find it fun to get better at it, like for example in injustice, i found it so much fun learning the ins and outs of that game, seeing my self progressing and getting better and better until i found that a lot of people tell me that i am the best green lantern they have ever played. even though i dont think so i certainly have fought gls better than me but it still is a nice compliment none the less, and the fact that when you fight people at your skill level, the fight becomes so intense and so much damn fun! i dont even care if i lose, just that it was one hell of a fun match. that is my reasoning for learning new fighters
Thanks dood. I really needed this pep talk.... as I almost always get online pwned.
He made a good point. What Max says can be translated into any competitive game, not just fighters. Learning to adapt with game you're playing is the first step at becoming good at it, and the top comments say examples that help build upon that idea.
Having fun and keeping a positive attitude is also something I tend to consider. I know it's pretty obvious, but I find myself getting frustrated at times and I often ignoring this simple thing, which is bad. It only makes me perform worse in that situation.
And if you do start to get upset just take a break. Calming yourself down before you get back into the game definitely helps.
I wish Max would make more content like this
I recently stumbled upon your channel and I have to say... you're fucking amazing! Great articulation, great production values, and great personality make stand head and shoulders above most Utube creators. Continue the fantastic work and I'm looking forward to more stuff from you. Cheers.
I think another thing that definitely needs mentioning is just how to play fighting games at its core. Before even picking a character and learning set-ups and whatnot, just knowing how fighters work. My friends will play fighting games sometimes casually but they don't grasp the actual games. They mash and expect that to work. I try actually sitting down with them and letting them know, when you actually play your inputs are much slower than you realize.
i've train with kazuya since tekken 5 it's been years ago. and im so lucky that his move doesnt change so much. it helped me to improve my skills rather than learn to use new moves
I do it to learn from my mistakes and get better even though its kind of hard to learn from my mistakes
My main reason to get good at Marvel is actually James Chen via Twitter. I wished him a happy birthday, thanking him for being such a big part of the FGC, even for the nobodies like me. He responded: "Thank you sir. I do it for the "nobodies" because I believe nobody is a nobody." That seriously impacted me.
This is one of my biggest hurdles. I get discouraged so so easily, So I absolutely agree with what your saying.
In my opinion, "Fancyness" is a great part of fighting games.
Pulling out fancy combos really helps you, because you start to know the game mechanics and you can pull any combo much easier and raise your ego, you actually feel great when you are playing with someone else and make a great comeback with some combo fancyness
That's why fighting games is my favourite genre.
But my only problem, is that I get to good at them, and I don't have any friends at my level to play fighting games with
My inspiration for playing fighting games is to have fun and enjoy the challenges that come with it.
Those points you gave, are so true max.
I was the type of gamer that would play any fighting game,even the ones that weren't popular,like king of fighters and virtual fighter. I would find info about how to be good, but there was no point since I couldn't find opponents, just my friends. This was before online gaming and internet so i couldn't keep the drive of learning and adopting to the games(the arcades were too far as well).so I gave up learning but still had passion for fighting games
Totally agree, intelligence is the most powerful weapon of great fighters. I wish I saw this video earlier.
Like a lot of people say, if you want to do better at something then practice. Practice makes perfect
I like the big blue remix you have playing in the background.
I was just talking with my friend about this. Glad to see an entry concerning it!
For those wondering, in my opinion, Level 4 is the Surprise Effect.
How original one can be with the character they're using (whether they discovered new techniques with them or play it differently) or even what character they're using. This is what wins many tournaments.
thanks for the tips max actually went to a local tournament earlier in the month of march and took third in umvc3 it was a really stress ful time but the fact remains that if it wasnt for alot of the toutalige that you bring to the channel every single day i probably wouldnt have done so well thanks again for the great vids you produce
It's really all down to the nature of independent learning. As a gamer grasping every different knowledge in different games and seeing all the potential this game has to offer. It's the same way of applying this to any type of revision.
i picked up under night in birth back in february and i want to say, the first thing to learning that game was to understand the game's system - too many factors to take note of. but after a while, it grew on me and now i'm like somewhat decent
On a more positive note, I love you Max. Keep it up man.
imo it's also important to try not to act following your habits. there are situations where a player tends to always do the same thing, probably without even realizing it. once you get to know your own bad habits and start working to fix them, you're gonna improve immensly
level 4: you become one with the game, you are able to put all your focus and attention in the match, disregarding any environmental/emotional distraction that may disturb your gameplay. Hence the consistent top-placing tournament players.
im at Level 3 in a half when it comes to fighting games & shooters
i Agree with this video, my favorite game is the street fighter series
i Played tekken i would say, i was a level 4 on there its a easy game
My word of advice to others that wanna improve on fighting games is
to Use every character in game why? learning there fighting style
Can also give you the edge at beating them
Playing online helps and train daily even watch youtube videos
Learn your character advantages & weaknesses i.e
I'm lovin' the F-Zero music in the background.
Excellent choice Max.
I think the first step is admitting that you're bad but remembering that you can and will get better as long as you keep playing. Everything you said is on point though. I'm trying to get out more now to play against more characters to become familiar. ECT is in May, gotta get ready....
A good game to learn fundamentals with is Super Turbo. It's basic but at the same time is filled with so much info and tools that will make your knowledge with fighting games grow.
Great explanation. My main problem is execution of real difficult combos. Usually the ones where you have to do some EX cancellations and things like that.