Conversational narcissism
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- Опубліковано 28 вер 2020
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DISCLAIMER: THIS INFORMATION IS FOR EDUCATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY AND IS NOT INTENDED TO BE A SUBSTITUTE FOR CLINICAL CARE. PLEASE CONSULT A HEALTH CARE PROVIDER FOR GUIDANCE SPECIFIC TO YOUR CASE. THIS VIDEO DISCUSSES NARCISSISM IN GENERAL.
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I used to be a conversational narc due to social anxiety..and I think it was because of my isolated upbringing. Once I started mingling with society as an adult, I was like a kid in a candy store and would just talk my brains out to anyone who would listen. Then, I started slowly picking up on people's social cues showing me that they were exasperated or that I would constantly interrupt because I couldn't contain my emotions. Now that I'm healthier, I do more listening than talking and can't help but notice others that are guilty of this. The biggest difference between me and someone who didn't care about their need for dominance is that I was actually really embarrassed when I realized what I was doing and made a conscious effort to improve.
Perfect example of why people shouldn’t be so quick with labels.
You have totally outlined my experience as well - thank you. I’m so happy you were able to recognize this and make changes. Gives people hope 🙏
I think this might be me too.
Good for you!
This really hit home for me because I was also brought up very isolated. My mother was an abusive narcissist and kept me away from everyone and everything only homeschool and church 3x a week. She would come home and sit in front of a TV never talked to me only yelled. I wasn't socialized at all until I got to go to public high-school so I wasn't used to people actually wanting to talk to me, i was just excited, unfortunately I'm also autistic so im not great at picking up on social cues, im trying my best but...Man, I really really dont want to be seen the way my mom was, ill literally do anything to keep that from happening.
I got a friend who does this non stop. If I can even sneak a sentence in edge wise he's not even listening to me, he's just holding onto what he wants to say next. When I finish speaking he goes right into what he wanted to say rather than to comment on what I said. He didn't even listen. He just can't wait to talk. Its like I'm talking to a wall.
Oh, I know people like that. They are very frustrating. Sometimes it's ADD and sometimes it's extreme immaturity. They just don't understand what they are doing.
😂 very much same with my friend!🤣
@@ellenoid It depends what age they are. Regardless of that, certain types do exactly what they're doing when they do it but they just show that they have a lack of consideration for not only you but for the rest of the world if you hear badly they talk about other people if it's like the specific instance that I just escaped as a close friend for 15 years
Dude my roomate is exactly like this. He always just starts talking about himself, whether it’s his job, his son, his truck… he just starts talking about himself out of nowhere, then he doesn’t stop. If I say something about my version, it’s like I’m not even there. He just waits until I’m finished talking, then picks up where he left off before I said something. It’s like he doesn’t even realize that he’s talked about himself for the past hour. Then has to nerve to say it was a good talk or a good “politicking” session. He says something like “we always have good talks man”…when really it was just him talking for an hour about himself while I just say “yea” and “right”. He doesn’t care if I’m watching a video on my phone or texting someone back and forth, he’ll just keep talking as if he has my full attention. It’s extremely exhausting. I’ve gotten to the point where I just continue to look at my phone and not respond….he will get upset and say a passive comment like “these phones are taking everyone’s attention, people are always in their phone”. So his idea is that I should sit and listen to him talk about himself for an hour and not check my phone, text anyone or watch a video. He sucks so much of my time and attention. I’ve recently started to walk out of the room and just got to my room and shut the door. He will just continue to talk until he realizes I can’t hear him or that I’m not responding. I just can’t take it anymore. If I’ve had enough, I’ll just get up as walk away. I refuse to be his dumping ground.
@@KingMark33 I just recently got rid of a friend just like the one you talkin about. One time we were talking on the phone and he was doing such a monologue without taking my words into interest that I just simply put the phone down on my couch, walked 90 ft into the bathroom of my place and then arrived back to the couch and he was still talking three minutes later on that phone.
This is crazy that he will follow you to your room after you close the door and still talk. Maybe you don't want any more drama than you're already getting with that roommate. But if I were in your shoes I would take the calculator risk of having a come-to-jesus moment speech with him about his weird behavior. (Presuming that you have an idea of a Plan B if that blows up on you)
I am CONSTANTLY being interrupted and talked over by the people in my life. It’s very frustrating. It’s also very refreshing to talk with someone who can have a balanced conversation!
I am sooooo with you. It definitely is very frustrating and rightfully so. And yes it is refreshing AF when you encounter someone who engages in a balance way, it is like an energetic orgasm not to sound inappropriate, its like a thirst being quenched. With me this pattern of communication only reinforces my feelings of feeling unheard, unseen myself and triggering that narrative that is everpresent of I DO NOT MATTER when the other person shifts the conversation back to themselves consistently. I have now come to a place where I realize I find more pleasure in being alone than being around people. I get anxiety at the prospect of meeting up with people as I am scared that dynamic will happen again and because I have a need to feel heard underneath and hate the thought of cutting people off bc I do not want them to feel unheard but then I betray myselfwhile simultaneously I worry about how do I kindly communicate to them how I feel without them feeling attacked which then more likely they will gaslight me. That in itself adds to the exhaustion. I'm just tired of being disappointed as I want the interaction to feel mutually nourishing, a decent balance of give and take. I feel used when I spend time listening and empathising with others but when I have something to say they become uninterested and dismissive. How do we let people we care and want to know them: BY ASKING QUESTIONS, actively listening and it being reciprocal, by the way not asking questions in an interrogative way. How we engage with others take mindfulness. Theres is a lot of learning on both sides. Great comment on your end Nikki Holley.
Me to!
Same here, but only by certain people. Sometimes i get to talk a lot and steer the conversation towards myself, but only because no one else wants to contribute to the conversation, and i'm trying to fill up awkward silences :)
It is confusing when someone shows they are listening, and is supportive isn't it? i have instructions i got in a dbt course for active listening taped on my fridge, my kid has read it, i can tell, and besides myself i think it gets ignored. i think the ones who do listen acquired these skills before i met them so. but my name is Niki, too, all the best to you Nikkiholley5060
@@jaclynh9343 I find it easier to live in the forest too
"Even if you get a chance to talk, they ain't listening to you any how"
So, so true Dr. Thanks for this video👌😊
Veryyyyyy trueeeee
Spot ON indeed!
just on to the next hustle...they ain't listening just getting their own. They just go through people like locust and leeches
Wha'd you say?
Right!
I have an old friend that I believe is a conversational narcissist. She can talk for hours and hours about herself. She's lived a difficult and interesting life and is highly intelligent, so I often don't mind listening to her ramble on. Recently we spent a few days together camping. I noticed that every single time I tried to share something, she'd interrupt me or cut me off mid-sentence to either finish my sentence or tell me she already knows what I am about to say... or to change the topic entirely. It irritated me to the point that I just stopped trying to talk at all, even if she would try to get me to talk after interrupting me. Eventually she noticed my silence and made a comment about it. I shared that I found it exceedingly frustrating to be interrupted so often. She then attacked me for being passive-aggressive and proceeded to list examples of my passive-aggressive behaviors she'd witnessed from me in the previous 48 hours. She then said that she's so proud of herself because she's completely eliminated passive-aggressive behaviors from herself and is seriously questioning whether or not she wants to keep friends in her life that demonstrate passive-aggressive behavior. Yes, I may have been passive aggressive after being continuously interrupted every time I tried to say something but to then be attacked verbally for my frustration and then be chastised because she's no longer passive aggressive was ridiculous. Needless to say I was grateful when our camping trip came to an end and will be keeping more than 6 feet away from her in the future.
I don't think you were being passive aggressive.
Your friend is just crazy.
Don't go camping with these people.
Her interrupting you saying that she "knows what you're going to say" crosses a line for what I would put up with without at least during a confrontation. (I'm not saying it has to be an aggressive one from you but I think it should at least be fair and firm... Or, if that's not what you prefer, do it whatever way you want. Do you!
Get a restraining order don't bother to give a reason as she would probably not be bothered to read it
I literally got a friend like that😂😂.. too bad he cut from the team...💪✌️
You know what I also find in dealing with a narcissist is that many of the ones I came across have a very EXTREME oppositional conversation style too. Not only do they constantly shift the focus of the conversation to themselves but they love to oppose EVERYTHING you say even if you are agreeing with something they said.
I think the term for this is 'parallel conversation.' Dr. Todd Grande has a REALLY good video on this! Basically, they don' t always talk about themselves but they will always somehow divert it from what you're trying to talk about
Omg - you are spot on with that! I’m too agreeable but these people have to disagree with literally everything. It makes me sick.
I had a friend like this for over 10 years!! 😭 Trust me when I say, *it doesn't get better* so don't waste your time! CUT THEM LOOSE ✂️
bay leaf thank you, good to know.
Yep. I agree. I'm in the middle of setting some serious boundaries on some and cutting some loose in my life.
What if you love em and you still have good times with them?
@@EphemeralProductions If they drain you emotionally, it's better to stay away. You can still love them from afar. My friend wasn't a bad person per se.. but her conversational self-centeredness consumed almost all my energy. Even after my brother died, she still somehow made our conversations all about her. Eventually I just had enough and cut her off. The fact that I'm doing way better now (mental health wise) proves that my friendship with her wasn't ever good for me.
Take a step back from your friend and see how you feel. If you're happier away from them, that's a big indicator to keep them away.
tall32guy There are more people worthy of your love and you will have an even better time without them!
It’s a way of establishing Dominance over you. when it’s tour turn to speak they literarily stop listening. Walk away and let them talk to themselves
You are spot on, its social domiance,
Power games. That's how immature and fragile emotionally they are. Best part is that there's nothing there to fix. Best is to turn around and leave.
I do that now at work with cowrkers who have shown no care or consideration when I talk but love when I invest my time into listenin to them. I am done with being used for my willingness to listen bc it is not reciprocated.
@@jaclynh9343 trying to be professional and co exist is really been tough at work. It will be ok. 🌈💐🌹
My father does this. He listens for 5-10 seconds before going through papers/turning on the television/changing the subject entirely. 😬
In this world of ours, I actually find most people don’t really listen. It’s like an epidemic. Rarely do people ask questions and really pay attention, without you feeling that they just want you to finish speaking so they can take over.
I completely agree with this.
Music lover You are completely absolutely right.I have just recently told my close friend this reality
Was about to write this when I saw your comment. Listening & the art of conversation is a long forgotten skill.
Instead of teaching things in school that we will never need…wouldn’t it be nice if social skills, empathy, management of finances and real world things would be taught? We are in an epidemic of narcissism now. I’m guilty of when I’m lonely etc doing this but as I’ve gotten older really working on it. We all should do the “conversation” changes and is more important
I've experienced it as unbelievable "one upmanship" .
I can relate to this too! It's very exhausting
Absolutely they always have to be right! Even when they’ve wrong they don’t want to hear the truth or your opinions. It’s not really a conversation it’s more a chance for them ‘in their minds’ to demonstrate how smart they are or how much they think they know then you do.
One upmanship sum it up and a smirk when they think they're making feel bad like a devil 😈 lol
Yes, it's so boring and predictable, and really rubs in how much they don't care for you at all.
Totally totally agree!
A ‘chatty Kathy’ is a humble person that can’t stop yapping. A conversational narcissist is someone that believes they are better than everyone else, and therefore only worthy of speaking and being heard.
I'm perfect bait for the "Listener's Trap" being that I am an active listener. I've been reeled into 2-hour monologues where this person did not take a breath to the point of getting pink in the face and even starting to sweat like they were working out. It was disturbing to see that level of talking addiction and lack of awareness that the other person (me) had no interest and has not spoken a work in the entirety of the two hours. When I just got up to leave and go use the bathroom, the talking rate went from 300 words per minute to like a 1000 because they knew their time to keep talking was coming to an end.
Damn. :/
I hear you. This person might not be a narc but too lonely, anxious or some other way emotionally unbalanced. Many narcs I know control what they share about themselves and also control what other people talk around them. But they might also talk a lot about themselves. The style tells if it’s a narc or something else the problem... A narc always tries to get admiration with their talk. I had similar type of experience with someone who always turned everything I said about themselves, and she was presenting this image that she’s God’s love child. Maybe she is, but she didn’t have any empathy towards me.
MsJeesus I tried to give this person that benefit of the doubt but it’s usually endless boasting of how beautiful she is and how everyone everywhere admired her youthful beauty...but oh! She’s not boasting because she’s ONLY sharing what others tell her. Trust me..after years of this and seeing her lack of empathy for the pain and suffering of her only child...it’s outright narcissism. When anyone tells her they aren’t up to talking and just want to enjoy the movie or dinner..she goes into another monologue of how she’s entitled to keep talking. I used to entertain it out of sympathy and hope but now I just avoid and walk away
Omg😫😂
Yes - this is what often happens to those of us that are active listeners... I've had similar experiences (beginning in kindergarten...) throughout my life... Because, word gets around in the circles that you move in, and people find out and approach You, since they've heard about "what an excellent listener You are!" At times, it feels like someone is trying their best to eat you alive...
💙💛🌹💜🍎🇺🇸
I once had a "conversation" with a narcissistic manager who would not stop talking. I was about five feet away from her and after about 20 minutes of her monolog, I picked up a book and started reading. She still didn't stop talking for another half hour and only then when her phone rang and she had to answer it. I scurried out of that room fast.
Of course, this is one of the reasons it is so difficult to talk to my father. I had a game where I would try to guess how long it would take him to turn the conversation back to himself when we text. It turned out to not be much fun, because the answer was always one text.
A few weeks ago I texted, "Our city is covered in smoke. It's very difficult to breathe. It feels like the end of the world." He replied back, "I ate too many ribs and got my usual stomach ache. Tums is not working for me like it used to."
@ Charles Poker, that is horrible. Did it even occur to him, he could lose you?!?! Life is far more important than a stomach ache. Good grief!
Sorry you deal with that. Sounds really rough. It's really hard when the narc in your life is someone you would have liked to be close to like a parent. I can really relate. Great idea picking up a book with your manager. That's hillarious!! I'll have to try that. It's comical that they don't even notice that they prattle on for hours, if you let them, without noticing anyone else in the room.
IKR,
It’s as if we’re all mirrors with ears to a narcissist
@Elle D, exactly. So invalidating. It's not even a conversation. It's a monologue. ;)
wow... what a GREAT observation.
my father is dealing with dementia.. so he is now officially NOT a conversational narc BUT he just has non-sequitur after non-sequitur and I just laugh at him... with him. I just sit back and enjoy...
dementia and Alzheimer's SUCKS. Yet... I'm just enjoying hearing him talk... he gets lost. I just play along. It's one of the few times I'm not interested in what I have to say... and I contact him to find out about him. He's too far gone for me to actually think he wants to know about me (that hasn't always been the case, of course... it just is what it is now... forever more, I guess).
HOWEVER... your situation with the fires, the smoke, the lung issues... I totally get it... and so I just laugh at your father's response. No... it's NOT much fun. You could make it a lot more fun if you wanted. AND if you wanted to fuck with him you could LAUGH at him for having stomach problems. Text him (the objective is to exaggerate to absurdity): "I guess you should eat ribs every day, Dad... then you'll have problems everyday... you can tell me about them EVERY DAMN DAY if you want. EVERY FUCKING DAY." If he doesn't get the absurdity than, yeah, your Daddy IS a piece of work. He doesn't want you to have PEACE. He wants you to be IN PIECES.
AND DAMN... how lucky are you? You KNOW exactly what to get him for his birthday, Christmas (your particular religious holiday if you're practicing), Father's Day et al. [Do you need more Tums? Should I send you some? Don't ask him if you decide to fuck with him... because as Dr. Sam Vaknin, UA-cam Channel and self-admitted NPD, advises: NEVER let the narc get away with it. Point fingers. Shame them. Expose them. Humiliate them.).
Good Luck... I know it wasn't your intention but because I've been studying NPD for 5 years now... I am able to see the hilarity of the situation. My heart breaks for you that he's just not there for you... I'm sorry. Now... it's your turn to RESPOND in the best way you know to protect yourself... IF you can't go, decide not to go, NO CONTACT.
As of late... almost everything has some component of humor in it. Without being cruel... I'm so grateful you expressed your situation... thank you.
Before we had been together very long, he said, "I dont know hardly anything about you. You dont talk about yourself." I said, " do you know why that is? It's because you talk so much, I never have a chance, and if I begin talking, you interrupt me". He heard me and occasionally catches himself doing that. Not very often.
I got the identical response from my ex-girlfriend for why I didn't ever talk at her family's dinners. Each of her family members (Dad, Mom, and Sister) would all talk over one another, and then talk loudly to assert control. I also think this is symptomatic of American culture. Europeans stereotype Americans as loud.
I always changed the conversation back to myself simply because I was trying to give an example that I empathize with them. I always thought that was a good thing to do to exhibit empathy and that I understand how they feel, but now that I am older, I realize that is not a good plan and does the opposite of showing empathy.
I’ve learned to relax while I listen. I say to myself “ you dont have to do anything here. Just receive. Take a break.”
Yezzir
I like that! I tell myself to "ask them three questions to your one statement." Let them take the lead. Practice makes better, if not perfect.
I was with a conversational narcissist for 12 years. Unfortunately that’s what attracted me to him because I thought he was so intelligent and articulate. Boy was I wrong. He knew it all and I didn’t know crap in his eyes. Every time I would start having a discussion he would turn it around on himself.
OMG I know a few people like that. No matter whatever you say, the conversational narcissist just has to play devil's advocate and tell you your wrong. You can even say things they've acknowledged they agree with but may still say you are wrong. They tend to say, "Well not exactly...". or "Not really..." I just end up "grey rocking" such people and distancing myself as quickly as I can. It's very exhausting dealing with people who feel the need to constantly belittle and discount you as they brag about how "right" they are and how much they know.
@@jzen1455
Spot on! So many out there. A friend used to send me clips, music, talked about her family and how she loved them etc and I would always comment on what she sent me, but, when I did similar she never acknowledged one thing and turned the story into what she was doing.
It used to really annoy me of her lack of empathy, now I just let her rabbit on and say yeah ok at the end, i can't be bothered with it anymore. And she still doesn't get the messge.
People who talk lots are not that smart. When you're talking you ain't learning .
Oh my goodness! This was my exact experience with my ex and that is what attracted me to him initially as well. He was so articulate and seemed so intelligent. I even told him that on several occasions. I would just look at him in awe. I remember him telling me that he liked the way I looked at him and I'm sure he did because it fed his ego. Over time I started to resent him during conversations because he would hijack them, always correct me, never agree with me, but instead make me feel like and idiot. It got to the point where I'd pretend I was listening but basically was rolling my eyes on the inside. He acted so egotistical, arrogant and entitled it made me sick. I knew something was off, but I didn't realize conversational narcissism was a thing. He's a combination of that and a neglectful narcissist. I'm glad I walked away.
@@rw2452 Empty vessels make the most noise.
Whenever I say something witty or clever around guests, my narcissist dad & sister will shout over me and say that thing as if they were the ones to come up with it (I'm soft spoken, so it's easy to do). And then people will be like "hey that's a smart observation" Or "oh that's funny". Then they get all smug about how great they are. It's rather sad actually
Yes, this resonates with me, and also in the workplace too which is infuriating!
A narc can be identified by their self-referential language. I, me, mine.. etc.
It is sad and that you observe that puts you already on a path for getting the heck out of there and minding your life. I know how it is as my father is also a narc. I went ZERO contact after I confronted him (subtly) last Christmas. He sometimes tries to sneak in when I call my mother and answers the cellphone on her behalf but I hung up immediately. You can imagine his rage and how he tries to manipulate my mother to tell me how hurt he is (bla bla bla) without once telling me, actually, honestly what he feels. Best is to do 180° and never engage ever again with these people. They don't deserve you. 😌🙌🏻💪🏻👍🏻✌🏻🤗💜
Wow, that's weird.
@@pantsenfuego9986 Disagree. They could just be telling a story. It's when they dont let *you* use the words I, me, and mine.
Sometimes, people share about themselves as a way of identifying with the topic and the people discussing it. I think it's easy to see when people have no regard for anyone else in the conversation vs just trying to participate and relate
Well said. Right on.
That's what I did mostly when I was really socially awkward. People mistook it for vanity or self-centeredness.
Annie Carbonneau me too and learning more about narcissistic behavior and being the daughter of a narcissistic mother I worry that I turned into one. I get excited to share similar experiences but the excitement comes from being able to relate not to take over. These videos have been so helpful!!!
@@KajuanaBritt I'm also glad the videos help me understand how to make conversation without seeming like a narcissist. I learned a lot, too.
It took a while for me learn to just be present and listen. I still have to remind myself sometimes. I think it was more showing you could relate and not being about me.
I have a coworker, who tells me the same story every single day. And I’ve started saying yeah I know you’ve told me. It’s mind-boggling.
Personal revelation day. I am guilty of chiming in with my own experiences on a given topic. I didn't realize others saw this unfavorably. I just want a point to relate to others and a common subject seemed safe. I will keep watching the video and I hope gain more insight. Thank you Dr. Ramani.
I do this too, and thought it’s a normal part of the give and take of conversation. It’s also how I relate to others and become a part of the conversation instead of being the silent one in a group of other dominant me me me people. I’m not sure I can unlearn this....
I do that also. I feel like part of the reason I do it, is because I'm thinking the other person will feel validated or maybe comforted by hearing that others have been there or have similar feelings about what the topic is. I'm also guilty of just being a motor mouth sometimes, and have to catch myself, and start asking the other person questions, so they can bring up a topic that is on their mind.
@@utubejunkie2013 maybe you don't have to unlearn it; there's a big difference between 'chiming in' and dominating! its important to participate in conversations and allow our own voices to be heard! Otherwise we become one-sided listeners, and the 'talkers' dominate, which doesn't serve anyone!
Neurodiverse people often reply with stories of our own because that's how we try to convey understanding of what the other person said, which neurotypical people see as trying to hijack the conversation. Neurotypicals listen by making nonverbal sounds or very short comments, which can seem rote and insincere to neurodiverse people who then don't feel heard.
@@katphish30 I think you're making a really good and important point! CPTSD has impacted how my brain developed from a really early age, combined with harsh negative reactions to asking my parents questions about themselves and their feelings on things, possible ADHD, plus a polarized Fawn/Flight response, so I end up lapsing in my focus on how long I've been talking, have difficulty keeping my mind focused on the subject they're talking about, internally scream when I do miss a part of their sentence/something I feel might be vital to their story or response, too fearful to interject to apologize and ask them to repeat what I missed (because of the narcissistic abuse), and a constant worry that if I don't relate by sharing a personal experience to show I empathize with and am interested in what they are sharing that I might make them feel like I don't care enough to also show vulnerability in return. I just sent a friend Medcircle's video on this, and asked them for their opinion on my behaviors, and they said that I do kind of take up a lot of space in conversations, but that from how long he's known me that it seems like a nervous tick/habit rather than self-absorption/a need for self-validation. Definitely was painful to take in, but I wanted to because I don't want to hurt other people, especially since I know how hurtful and draining it is to have no space in a conversation - for me it was from narcissistic parents, who removed space by invalidation and dry, exasperated responses, so maybe I'm suffering a rebound effect where I Over respond? Either or, what's important to me is how the behavior is making the other person feel, and if my unintentional habits are hurting them, then I'm going to do the work to find a better balance of mindfulness, response length, and asking questions
My solution : After my narc friend finished talking, I sent him a meme of a cat pretending to listen intently. That really blew his top 🤣🤣🤣
This is literally amazing.
I love this idea!!!
😂😂😂😂
Another "tell" that your conversation partner is a narcissist: s/he NEVER identifies with (empathizes) your stories of misfortune or ordeal. What does the narcissistic person say in these instances? A few typical responses will be: teaching you what you did wrong; explaining that what happened to you never happens to them. 😆
Or invalidating your feelings, telling you they’ve had it worse.
The most reliable and easiest tell of a narc is their frequency of singular self/other referential language. I, me, mine... You, yours, etc.
Also, "I don't know what to say" followed by the end of the conversation
@@cosmicgregg Yes, but at least admitting that is honest.
@@pearlyq3560 I'll give you that for a lot of people. We however are not talking about that. When this is done over and over and over to you sorry it's not being honest.
In professional coaching, some coaching schools call this "level one listening." It's all about ME. (I found some research at one point that said we tend to listen for about 17 seconds before our brains start processing what this means to ME. I timed it and that is about 10 words!) We teach that you simply can't coach (or counsel, or even be a good friend) from there, you have to train yourself to listen to both the person's words and energy. But the natural inclination to connect what someone else says to our own experience will always be there. People with good emotional awareness naturally know that it isn't healthy to always talk about yourself, so they learn to inhibit that "me too" response, or limit it. (I think it's totally fine to say "Oh, I love Italy too! What did YOU like about it?) And all of this is to say that you are absolutely right--narcissists don't have the desire or probably the ability to inhibit that response. Ugh.
Sad lol
We should make a virus whereas their hearing their own voice sounds plain awful to them. Covert mom was not returning pre-lock calls so I brought her bud up to speed on why that was, I'd never spoken to Helena before and was a little surprised to hear her say how "I" sounded so much like my mom! 🙂
I agree with this, and I also think there can be a "me too" component of simply sharing their own experiences as a way of showing that they understand how the other person feels. (this probably isn't narcissistic though)
@@ladybaabaa3294 but it Is still selfish no one can actually feel the same pain or experience unless you are that person now if its literally speaking amongst emaths then we do feel its better communication others that aren't just talk about everything it's annoying at some point.
@@telesamorrison2238 I do get that. I think for me personally, it helps me to have a friend who shares their similar experiences when I share mine, and they show they understand at least partly how I feel, and I honestly don't feel it's all about them, as we discuss both of our experiences and feelings. I find it a time for more bonding, sharing, and I find it more comforting than someone listening without "comparing" or "sharing" their own similar experiences, because if someone JUST listens, I feel like they don't understand as they haven't experienced whatever it is I'm talking about.
But I am also a "me too" person myself as a way of sharing and showing I understand, have been there, and the person is not alone.
For example, last year a new friend shared that her dog had died in March. I shared that my cat had died exactly a year before, in March. She found it comforting that I understood. It bonded us, and neither of us interpreted it as a negative "me too" thing.
We are possibly both narcissists though. lol
I like that you don't love this term. I know that I was guilty of not listening and contributing only my own stuff to conversation. Social anxiety was the reason. I grew up in a high speed area -- within 2 hours travel to New York City. I noticed in my early adulthood -- 1970's and 1980's -- there was a lot of pressure to talk fast and be snappy, to not be boring. It took me a while to realize that I wasn't boring if I let people around me talk, and I asked questions to draw people out more, and remembered what they said. As I did this, I became very interested in the people around me, and developed an ability to interview people about what interests them. Life has been richer because of this.
There several things I recognize although I lived in totally different place and culture. But I recognize the anxiety of collective ”trend” of communicating. I like to pause and think about the words, things. I almost never get to say what I really want to say. I’ve been really hard on myself because of this. And I also started to fill this gap by learning to make other people tell their stories. I think my anxiety is about realness too, I’ve tried to drop the joker / clown / empathetic mood lifter role I was forced / put as a kid. Social anxiety is really hard thing to over come at least for me!
Relate to the pressure not to be boring as a gateway to conversational appropriation - good point!
@Kim Slone, my late husband once told me that I asked people too many questions. (This was in a church fellowship setting.) I told him that was the only way some people would speak...if they were answering a question about themselves.😋
Yep, It's always about them.
It’s always about them until it’s negative, then it’s all about you.
It's my turn to confess. My need to dominate the conversation has been intermittent throughout the years. A lot of times, I was "needy", I had lots of issues and just needed someone to listen to me and help me process. At other times, the conversation was more balanced, and I really enjoyed listening to the other person, as we developed good mutuality in our friendship. I had one friend call me out in a gentle way and demand equal time. I graciously acquiesced. Sometimes I just get excited. High energy and enthusiastic. But I've always been known as a "talker". Dr. Ramini was right about the Covid thing. I'm definitely more isolated, so when I get out and talk to people, I just can't help myself.
It's great that you're more aware of it. Good luck x
I get that!
I talk a lot too, and when I was younger it was all about me. Not because I meant to be selfish -- I was just a talker like you and very eager to share. I talked a lot and I talked quickly.
One day it hit me that I talked too much and I realized that the people I admired the most were those who took an active interest in me and my life. I decided I needed to learn to be that kind of person myself.
I still talk a lot, but I listen just as much if not more. I try to make it a point to really care about the other person instead of tuning them out to focus on what I want to say next. Sometimes during their conversation, I catch myself getting amped up to talk, but realize that my energy needs to be redirected at them, and I make sure to acknowledge what they just finished saying before I add my own two cents.
I really care about people and try to show it by not always making it about myself like I used to.
People who actively listen and empathize are the true lovers. And I want to be loved the way I love.
💘
Same here. I was pretty introverted until I got out of hell house at 18 and was giddy. But I swung waaay too far and became this happy manic chatterbox. I'm much more aware now and really focus on the person I'm chatting with and if I see THAT expression, I know it's time to hit the pause button, take a breath, and turn the conversation back to them. I'll even apologize "Sorry! I started going off the rails, what were you saying about....I think you had a really good point, can you expand on that?"
Oh, whew! I'm pretty sure it's more "socially anxious/isolated" in my case. 😆 5:54 I'll definitely take the cue and knock it off, no hard feelings, if it's brought to my attention. 👍
I have Autism and find it difficult at times to converse with people, other times I can't shut up. It depends on the person and subject I am engaged with.
Your videos really help me DR. Ramani. My ex never allowed me to express myself, it was always about her. It meant that when I did have the chance to chat I would fully unload. I have learned to stop and listen before it is my turn to talk.
Just Passing Through Bravo on honing those social skills and learning to recognize those social cues! I have an HFA adult son so I know it takes practice and perseverance. 👍👍💪💪
@@floxendoodle942 I am far from perfect, I am still learning everyday. Practice makes perfect, or in my case... Just enough to get through!.
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Just Passing Through Indeed! You’d be surprised how many neuro-typical people don’t master the art of two-way conversation! It’s all good though . . . we all have our issues to work on. 🤓🤓
@@floxendoodle942 we are people before we are a label. 👍
I was going to mention this as well!
The narc I used to be friends with did this ALLLLL the time. I got to the point where I stopped talking to them about anything meaningful in my life because they would always cut me off and start talking about themselves for hours non stop. One time that really sticks out is the day I decided to never talk about anything personal or deep with this person again- I had a close family member suddenly pass away & as I was talking about it this “friend” cut me off & started talking about her mom separating from her step father who she HATED, but proceeded to say “I can’t believe this, my parents are separating!”. I remember thinking to myself but they got together in your 20’s and now you’re in your 30’s & you’ve always hated him...but I just stayed quiet & the convo continued for another hour until I finally said I gotta take another call. After that, I never spoke about another personal issue or event ever again! Thankfully I’ve finally cut that “friendship” out of my life. Draining af!
I had a 3 1/2 year “friendship” with a woman who was a conversational narcissist. Looking back I could tell you the topic she droned on about each year. Yes, each year had a favorite topic. She had one moment of clarity about a year before I couldn’t take it anymore. I told her about my daughter who had told me six months earlier she never wanted to speak to me again. It took that long for me to get a word in. Her response was priceless. “Oh. (Pause)I guess other people have problems too.” And then the fog came back and we talked about her again.
Thank you for such a brilliant example ... I have goose bumps! I hope things are well regarding your daughter, hugs.
I am so sorry that you had that experience and I hope the you are healing from the estrangement from you daughter. I imagine that must be very painful. I also hope that you walked away from your relationship from that so called "friend".
Your example is brilliant
The more people i meet the more i like to be alone with my You-Tube Family. I thank God for this precious mode of information exchange. And when i get bored with someone on UA-cam I just change the channel.
I told her I had a doctors appointment for a possible cancer diagnosis ,the talking duracell rabbits on about bowel cancer tests ,I never even got to tell her where my problem was and I made it clear conversation was over when she finally copped on she'd blown it , have just told her I cannot be friends cos of my Intermittent Explosive disorder (true) next time I tried PTSD,still stopped her car to say she can't stop ! All within context of my beloved dying 6 months ago ,THIS ILLNESS should be taught about in schools
eeek....as someone with severe ADHD + mild ASD who is often socially isolated due to social anxiety.....yikes lol sorry @everyone
but to be fair I try to remember to ask people questions about themselves and pay attention to the conversational balance
Me too, I have Autism and find it difficult to shut up, or even engage in a conversation. I am learning to listen and to be involved. I share your point on this...
😷👍
It's normal to hijack a conversation now and then. We're humans, and we share some of the self-centered behaviors with narcissists because we can't always do the right thing. No one is perfect.
Where a non-narcissist differs from a narcissist is that the non-narcissist has the ability to be mindful and to own up to the self-centered behavior when called out on it.
I understand you may be struggling with mindfulness, and if you do, that's totally fine as long as you own that and try your best to work on it. That's what we all do. A narcissist, however, may believe that doing that work is, in a way, beneath them.
I have adhd as well and used to talk all the time . Now that I am more self aware I just keep conversations polite with people I'm not friends with. Or know not to talk to everyone I meet if I don't need to talk to them. People with adhd are usually sensitive and have empathy.
It’s the way we communicate as neurodivergents. We think we are being empathetic and expressing that we’ve also been through what they are going through so they aren’t alone, but it doesn’t read that way. We do have to remember that neurotypicals do not speak “neurodivergent”. Our brains and neurochemistry are literally different in the areas that make us pick up on social cues. We lack the impulse control to realize that others might just need to vent. It’s difficult because for ADHDers it gives us the dopamine we want and need to feel normal and engage. It’s okay that we communicate differently, but we do need to take the time to learn how to communicate in a way that is mindful of others and like you said, ask about others and include them in the conversation. The reverse is also true though... neurotypical need to be honest with us and communicate where we need to better as well as learning how we communicate especially if they know we are neurodivergent. Expecting us to willpower our brain structures and chemistry to be something they will never be is ableist. Example: Telling a friend about movie and saying “OMG it was so good. I didn’t once want to look at my phone and I sat still the entire time” is high praise coming from an ADHDer.... ND and allies will understand that and then ask questions. A NT person might get frustrated... so they do need to recognize our way of communication and ask us questions that will get us to say “(insert actor/actress name)‘a acting was amazing and the story was told so well.” But we also have to read their cues/nonverbals and switch to neurotypical if they don’t or we unintentionally monopolized a conversation. It’s a give and take.
sharpest shed tool YES! Cognitive Based Therapy (CBT) opened my eyes in so many ways, but it’s something that’s a lifelong challenge and takes work! I can’t speak for others, but my ADHD symptoms have gotten significantly worse with the stress of the pandemic. I started CBT again because I realized the ways I’ve been communicating haven’t been the most effective or healthy and it was leading to frustration and my feeling unheard/misunderstood. I can do something about that and learn better coping strategies in these times. Kudos for being able to learn and implement coping strategies... and thank you for being open about and normalizing therapy! If I may, were there any particular coping strategies that worked better at being mindful and communicating more effectively for you and your ADD in times of stress and social isolation like *gestures at everything* the times we are going through? Is there any advice you have for when we are feeling “neutral” (not happy, sad, angry, peaceful... not feeling numb but like all the emotions cancel out and you’re disengaged) to better engage with others?
Yes, my mother and MIL's monologues. My mother actually said I had nothing to say of interest. I've had to sit through literally thousands of hours of her monologues over the years!
lol..you can thank her for her honesty next time she says that to you and say that you feel the same about her and are glad it's out in the open now, then get up and leave. I have a MIL like that and just ignore her now and if other people are around, I just start talking to someone else while she's having her one-way talking orgasm. If no one is around, I just get up and pretend to go do something that is out of her line of sight.
My mother said this behind my back to my husband (but I was listening on the other side of the door in another room). I have walked out of the room MANY times out of boredom, due to her never-ending (drunken) monologues!
Alex Baird That’s not very nice of her..how awesome would it have been if your husband were the one to say it...what a terrible mother figure to be gossiping about your own children to their spouse of all people! 🙄
never allow others to diminish u..stand up for ur self!!!!
I usually avoid talking about myself when I’m socially anxious. I ask others questions about themselves and encourage them to expound on that theme. In that way, I’m kind of a conversational narcissist enabler.
But what if you become comfortable with someone? Do you sometimes talk about what interests you? The point is that you may not be enabling toxic behavior if you perhaps stick with people who have a mutual conversation with you and if you don't encourage conversational narcissism when it is obviously toxic to yourself or others.
Daniel Kaiser I have tried that. But coming from a narcissistic family, I tend to get sucked into "friendships" with narcissists. It’s taken me a long time to recognize this pattern, and I’m trying to learn how to set boundaries and respect myself. But being interested in astrophysics, cosmology, and the Grand Unification Theory, I often feel like I’m dropping words into a bottomless well. 🙃
Im with you.
I do find that I enjoy it when someone empathises with me, jumps in and says "me too"...I feel understood. There are so many shades of grey..........As long as they are not too narcissistic and dominant, I don't mind a lively conversation, where others get enthusiastic and might talk over each other a bit. It's also a cultural thing....it's normal in some countries to interrupt and talk over each other. It's often just emotionality.
I think saying “me too” and letting you continue is different than me too and highjacking the conversation outright.
My husband does the “oh I’m ADD” thing, but now since he cares less now he does the “I wasn’t listening because you took too long” or “I already know what you’re thinking”, or “you already said that”, but when he’s talking all of my attention must be given all of the time and god forbid if I don’t give a good enough response.
It sounds like you need someone who has patience and will give you encouragement to express what you need to express. To actually listen. To echo your words back to you, to show they understand. And to pay attention to the pattern of the things you're saying, not just how you say them. It's rude and dismissing for someone to interrupt because they know what you're going to say. My guess is, they don't always know but they interrupt anyway. All this does is hinder the communication, it's not helpful or respectful. Especially not when a spouse does it.
Sounds like you need a different husband! He sounds like he doesn't care for or respect you and wants a servant not a wife. Sorry you are in this situation.
u need to put foot down!!!!! he is trying to dominate u....show him no fear!!!! that will get his attention to change
It sounds like a therapist to help both of you understand the difference in expectation on his part is required. Hopefully he is empathetic and interested at other times.
My former friend is a conversational narcissist! When we saw each other, I barely got a word in edgeways. When I did manage, she either found a way to talk about herself, change the subject or put me down. We're no longer friends.
One story that sticks out was that I'd been to the dentist with my children whereafter the dentist said she'd now only need to see me once a year but wanted to keep seeing my children every six months. I suspected that this may have had something to do with too few people having access to an NHS dentist so dental practices were trying to make room for these people who needed but couldn't manage to see a dentist. I was going to ask my friend if her dental practice were doing the same thing but never got very far, "I went to the dentist the other day and..." She interrupted saying she'd also been to the dentist and began giving me the low down on hers, her husband's and their daughter's dental health. I never got to ask my question 🙄
I had a friend like that - your opening paragraph I could have written myself! Once, when I insisted on being heard, she later accused me of being negative all the time, and when I asked how and when (because I never got to talk long enough to ever even make a negative observation), she said: "that time when you explained to me that you thought the State you came from had a better real estate buying system than what we have here! I was explaining it to her because it was a better idea that I thought she might be interested in knowing about!
What she really meant was: "that one time you insisted on being heard made me feel negative". We are no longer friends it was bad for my health being verbally abused, insulted and bossed around.
I'll never forget when my sister came to see me after I gave birth to my daughter. She asked me how the labor went and from that moment as I started to answer, my then partner interrupted me and proceeded to talk non stop about his recollection of it all, how he'd supported me and how it all went from his perspective. He went on for ages, I couldn't get a word in edgeways.
Any time I was in a conversation that's what he did. He took over , the conversation always came back to be about him. Thank you for providing another piece of the puzzle.
My mother in law is a narcissist all around, and when she interrupts ANYONE that is speaking, which she does often....if that person tries to speak up, she has said (with her finger in the air) excuse me IM SPEAKING. It is so uncomfortable, and I dread birthdays, holidays and any kind of get together with her. She was just at my house for my sons birthday and within 10 MINUTES of sitting down in front of the appetizers I put out...she demanded I bring out the food because she was starving and didnt each lunch. In front of my parents, and my brother and I was mortified. I took a sandwich out and plopped it down in front of her and she ate alone without waiting for anyone else. Welcome to my hell 🤦🏼♀️
Jessica Isherwood I think we share a MIL. That finger is a bad habit with mine too. With the holidays approaching in a couple months, I too am dreading the upcoming “Spanish Inquisition” questions that bring conversation to a grinding halt at the dinner table. We had some of her family visiting from Germany last summer and she too loudly shared how she was “starving” because she didn’t eat anything earlier. I asked if she’d like some cheese and crackers to tide her over while we we’re waiting for other people to arrive, but of course not, Mary the Martyr just sighed loudly and said she could wait. She is OBSESSED with talking about everyone’s weight, especially people who have gained weight. In fact, at my FIL’s funeral last year she loudly told an extended family member “Oh X you got SO fat”. I’ve gone minimal contact and my husband is totally supportive. With his father gone, he told me his eyes are wide open now and that he now realizes how she sabotaged his previous relationships.
@@cathywidener991 Thank you for sharing your experience with me :) Its refreshing to know I am not alone. That sounds awful by the way :( How nice your husband is so supportive. Mine is to an extent, but hes in deep denial about her, says hes used to it because that's how he grew up. I believe he doesnt want to see how she really is, maybe it's too much for him? I have no idea. But it gets worse as each year goes by. I'm so thankful I found Dr. Ramanis videos, they've helped alot. I have no idea how to handle any of this most of it the time, her insight helps me get a little clarity on this situation. My FIL passed 6 months before I met my husband. It's my first marriage, weve been married 6 years now, and I've tried explaining to my husband that just because he grew up with this, and hes used to it, doesnt mean its normal for anyone else and that we need to turn our heads when she behaves like this. I remember when we first started dating, her me and my husband went to dinner and she treated the server like such crap, I was appalled and embarrassed. That was my first red flag.
Jessica Isherwood hang in there. My husband and I have been married for 14 years, together for 21+, a second marriage for us both. Both my husband and FIL would regularly say “she’s always been this way”....”that’s the way she is”....”if you think she’s bad, her two sister are even worse”. Neither one of them EVER confronted her or stood up for me. They excused her bad behavior.because it’s all they knew, in my opinion OR (and the real truth) they didn’t want to be the target of her wrath and her temper tantrums. Yes, right down to talking like a baby and stamping her feet...she’s almost 95 yo. The stories are endless of the thoughtless and unkind things she’s said to everyone. My husband would often respond that he didn’t hear her comments and in fairness, I think he’s blocked her out. Often at the dinner table after eating, he will deliberately turn his chair sideways, giving her his back....if that’s not a sign I don’t know what is. I am totally grateful to Dr. Ramani for these videos. I’ve learned also I am not alone. Her video on Telling Someone About a Narcissist helped. She will never change as you know, so the best thing you can do is to limit contact, don’t engage in conversation where you divulge too much....just answer her questions with mono syllables. I know it’s mortifying to have your family exposed to this “center of attention” behavior, I cringe too. The other video that helped was Ruminating About the Narcissist. That really helped me stop replaying these incidents over and over in my mind, and becoming as resentful and angry as the day she said it. Your husband may never deal with her behavior. The only person you can change is yourself, so put yourself first. Hang in there !
@@cathywidener991 Perfectly said...thank you so much !! 🙏🤗 And thank you Dr. Ramani for bringing us all together in this 😁
I made the mistake of sharing birthdays and holidays with my mil for 23 years. She ruined so many holidays for us. Now, I have 2 out 3 grown children out of state. Holidays together are extra special and I will not be giving her the opportunity to ruin more moments together. Time is short.
Great point about not becoming infatuated with impressive talkers! Observing my temptation to do this helped me identify it as a red flag!
It may not be a red flag if the impressive talkers also consistently want to hear what you have to say, showing a sincere interest in understanding you and your ideas. A narcissist will not consistently be able to share the spotlight or have a genuine two-way conversation.
@@danielkaiser8971 well yes, I would be more impressed by someone like that! That would be nice 😊
This is most of the conversations with my parents when I speak to them throughout my entire life. This is just one example of so many. I lost my job and am concerned about the rising number of COVID cases in LA where I live and where there is work. Taking no interest, the conversation was hijacked and became a competition that in OC the COVID cases are worse. After repeatedly trying to bring back the conversation back to me and my situation to no avail, I just agreed because I got exhausted and there was no way that they will ever listen to me. All I wanted was a little bit of sympathy and a shoulder to lean on.
Dang..sorry to hear about that. It's tough times right now and it's natural for you to want some emotional support especially from your own parents. Hang in there..we're all in this together with you. I hope things start to look up for you soon.
All of that bites.
u should say that.....i wish u could give me some sympathy and shoulder to lean on.....if they respond with kindness u can reprogram them :)
I remember one phone conversation with my narcissistic mother. She had called (as she usually did) to endlessly complain about all her problems. When she did ask how I was I told her I was feeling very sad as my best friend had suddenly dropped dead from meningitis that day. She paused and then carried on talking about herself. I actually said ‘did you hear what i just said?’. And she just carried on....
@@elizabethhill6915 I have a mom like that, too. It's weird.
An ebb and flow of patience, respect, and empathy are just a few of many virtues that contribute to a healthy conversation between two people. Conversation is a learned art, one that should be modeled by parents to their children. If you were raised by a narcissist, you realize how much you were not taught.
I've decided this morning to cut off a "friend' whom I was best friends with when we were kids. Now as adults, the connection feels fake and forced, but only because this is her to the T. She ONLY talks about herself and I have come to find out that she only reaches out for free 3-hour therapy. LOL. Too many attempts to change the topic to something neutral and she fails everytime. She will call and tell me about a guy who has wronged her, and when I say "Girl, he is a loser- you should...."she would snap at me and defend him. And the few times I have tried to interject myself into the conversation, she will pretend to be talking to her child or busy with something, so that I feel like I'm talking to myself- hell, because I am! I'm so over it.
My niece was enthusiastically sharing some of her school accomplishments with my mom (her grandma) and I was surprised about how bad my mom was at acting interested. I know from my own past that my mom holds academic accomplishments very highly, and she becomes very proud if I ever did well, but maybe I just didn't notice when I was a kid? With my niece, she was acting happy for her, but some things gave it away to me. Her tone of voice sounded forced and she was very distracted, like she cut my niece off in the middle of talking to mention how windy it was outside. It was jarring to me, I never saw it before. Idk how I never noticed how uninterested she really was when someone was sharing happy news to her
I'm in the process of cutting my narcissist friend off as I just find her too exhausting now! I lost my best friend this year to suicide this year and my job. Bumped into an old friend and as usual she was lovely whilst we were surrounded with a few others. We went back to her place for a few glasses of wine and a chat, after 2 seconds and an "oh honey" the conversation switched from the loss of my best friend to the fact a mutual friend of ours who'd been staying at her place who'd forgotten to return her key. I attempted to ask why she kept turning the conversation back to her and I got the fruit salad response "well actually I thought the conversation was all about you" - I feel awful in a lot of ways but I just can't do it anymore. Thanks so much for your videos, Doctor Ramani
I have a relative who calls me and starts talking about her stuff non stop until I say I have to go. Then she’ll first ask how I am!! Then she will either turn the topic back to herself or pepper me with questions to get gossip about family members.
Sounds familiar. I have a couple of people in my life who use the “how are you” intro as a hook to show a kind of surface level caring, but once they’re in the convo is 90% about them.
I’ve found that some people do what I call “ self referencing” , filtering everything through their own experience. They believe this is a way in which others can relate to them or visa versa. It’s a point of connection for them. They do not realize that it is a shallow and self centered approach to relating. Empathic relating requires entering the other persons experience from THEIR vantage point, not ours.
Thanks for explaining the difference between those who have social anxiety or just are isolated/need to talk, vs the narcissist who dismisses others opinions or just wants to be heard... eye opener!
That was very comforting and encouraging.
Conversational narcissists tend to sigh and shrug a lot when the conversation isn't about them. Of if you're talking about something important to you and they could care less.
But the minute they need emotional support, they come running and expect you to drop everything for them. They can buzz off.
❤️ I love you for waking me up and helping me fix my life my whole family is narc I feel I’m the only one that cares mom dad grandma brother sister it’s just a sad story but with your knowledge and sharing helped me so much thank you so much.
So sad. I know for one that the urban areas are a hotbed for narcs. It is ramped and most urban blacks take it as normal and have no clue what is happening
And my immediate family is exactly the same. Husband as well. So sad
@@thaqafahstyle I am so sad for you! You have to find and attract good people to be around...I say family is definitly overrated. Its very disappointing, but some of us just dont get to have that warm family life we hoped.
@@colette2612 Thankfully I got away from my family, now just have to get away from the husband. As I stated in urban areas this behaviour is normal but we didn't know what is was called. So it is difficult not to run into this type of person amongst blacks in America. So many of us have the same stories and we witness this behaviour all the time. I am mixing with different people from different countries and haven't encountered this type of madness. Convinced it's really ramped in our culture. So sad. I know there are narcissists in all societies but I am having a good time with other cultures for now.
My abusive Ex turned my family and children against me. It is just me now and I am okay with that. Time and understanding will allow us all to heal. Stay strong and be brave.
Thank you for sharing with us, we are a good community and Dr. Ramani has helped me more than I can ever thank her for.
😷👍
HIM _ "The doctors thought my infection was coming from my kidney stones, so they blasted them and gave me antibiotics... but the infection came back. I dont have time for this. I keep getting sick and that is not who I am. I dont like being sick all the time. If its not one thing, its another. Now they think the infection is coming from the prostate, but I think they are just guessing. I wish they would get on the ball, do their job and figure out where my infection is coming from. Im not a doctor but I think they should check my circulatory system for the infection not my prostate..."
ME - "They are not guessing, they just cant always tell where an infection comes from. They have to go through steps - a process of elimination if they dont know where the infection is. Do you remember mom used to get infections all the time, and the doctors said it was somewhere in her body but never figured out where they came from."
HIM _ ....REALLY LONG UNCOMFORTABLE PAUSE.... Anyway, back to me...
And that was just yesterday
Doctor: Some people's kidneys simply creates stones. There's no really good advice to avoid it but to eat healthy. Be happy that you got away much easier then most and let hope and fresh foods be your medicine.
Me after changing my voice by screeming to kidneys at war: I just can't totally avoid each and every fabricated food there is, as that seemed to take (more then) all of my time, but by using kidney gravel as some sort of test, there'll be no question of it to me that keeping food as green as starvation will allow, even if both avocado and olive oil is now a bit further right on the f-specter, rather adding the garlic and the union to soups (pea, or spinach/kale which by me needs time with coconut milk after time with broth) then to raw food if my mucous membranes (stomach) are sore (I also love chilli - advice sais "not the seeds"), meet problematic digestion with finely chopped garlic and ginger together in kefir milk, and problematic kidneys and/or prostate with real, raw apple juice which is "too expensive to buy", where I also try to get hold of carrot juice as well as beetroot juice, then my hopes of being a true norwegian through (most of) christmas shall be good for the second time this year. My very best hopes for both of you, and thanks a lot for telling of meeting it together, even if I had at a point to say "I've got to let myself screem this pain alone" and I pray that you will get the rewards of new health on the way, where perhaps, if possible, a decent air cleaner and an exercise bike might in time be an advice. Mine is in front of my TV, and this has from one point mostly allowed me also to talk enough to people to in turn get rejected.
I have social anxiety and discovered years ago that listening and asking open-ended questions almost always takes the pressure off me. I can listen all day...it's not always interesting, but it's a relief!
Thank you, DRA. Ramani - you are wonderful!!
Right when I saw the title of this video I knew it'd be a great one!
Here's my conversational narcissist story: (well, the most recent at least!)
My boyfriend and I are in a band together and we just released a new album. We went over to his uncles house, and his uncle is a musician too. He records instrumental music on his keyboard. We were more than happy to hear his music, but we just started laughing after a while when we realized that this man has been making us listen to his songs (literally making sure we don't talk through any of it) for about 3 hours... he was aware that my boyfriend and I just released a studio album with a full rock band that we spent a fortune producing.. any time him and I tried to slip anything into the conversation about it, he would divert right back to himself.. absolutely no interest in the people in front of him, not a single glimmer of back-and-forth conversation... we didn't even bother to try to have our turn to speak cause we knew he just did not care. Sigh!
Luckily, him and I were able to drive home and laugh together about it. Thank god my man is such an excellent conversationalist. Haha!
You're lucky that you can share in your intimate relationship. Good luck in your projects.
The conversation thief in our family is my daughter. She takes the conversation every time and I don’t agree with most of her theories. It becomes a struggle inside me to not laugh at the theories with no science to back them up.Like DT she says something and so it is fact according to her anyway. On a recent family gathering we were discussing who would bring the dessert etc and I added that I was bringing the conversation box! Explanation:: the conversation box is a little empty box which allows only the possessor (of the box) to speak while everyone else listens! When the finish talking the pass the box to the next person. Just mentioning this changed the day!
You had to one up everyone. CN
The conversation stealer in my family is my dad. It's always about him and no one else.
The one on my husbands side is his dad and his sister in law. Lol 🤣 my husband asked me once why I barely said anything around his parents it's because I just enjoy listening and honestly they wouldn't care about what I had to say it would just spin back to them.
he probably also just jealous
Love how you specify the differences between narcissists & "socially anxious/socially isolated" communication habits.. I almost feel like you were reading my mind!! 😆
No she was reading MY mind ;D But srsly I thought the same as you.
My 93 year old nana. Bless her.
You mentioned how being authentic is something that gets stolen when we have narcissistic parents. That's something I struggle with. It's hard for me to know what I really want and feel and to live authentically after reflecting my narcissist mother's wishes and ideas for so long. Can you talk about finding authenticity for those who've experienced narcissistic abuse?
Yes, this topic is relevant to me as well. Related to finding your authentic self - is the ongoing and persistent issue of constantly looking at others for mirroring the transient “Presented self”. My NARC family has left me somewhere between “who am i” and “I’m anyone you want me be”, just go away happy and leave me be!
As an only child of a narcissistic mother I found small relief when i moved over 700 miles away from her. It wasn’t until i was in my early 60s and she in her late 80s that she said (quite angrily) to me on one of my visits ‘You’ve changed. You even sound different’. I think cutting them loose is the first step to regaining your own authenticity and sense of self. But it’s a long and difficult path.
@Elizabeth Hill I believe the distance thing! I even felt better moving a couple of towns away. I keep up a schedule of talking to her once or twice a month because I'm a single mom and she sits the kids in emergencies but I'll be so glad when I don't need that anymore either.
Wow i relate SO much. I get stuck in the listener trap often, and sometimes I feel like I dont even have anything to say or sometimes I have feelings of a strange emptiness. And so I just let the other person talk and talk and dont even know what I feel. Its crazy. Hope this resonates with you. Dr. Ramani, please make a vid about this!
To relate this to conversational narcissism: those kinds of people have a tendency to make you feel small. By dominating the conversation, they "encompass" you and your world, almost like they're defining it or replacing it with THEIR reality. To be more authentic, you have to step out of their reality and into yours. Go back into your own feelings and separate your perspective from theirs. Over time, this will "ground" you and nobody will be able to take over anymore or project their own views and opinions onto you. Don't readily agree and empathize with what they say. If you're not sure of your own feelings, don't automatically take on theirs.
This is my first time commenting on your videos, and this really struck home for me. I’ve been aware of my tendency to bring a conversation back to myself. For me, I think it’s due to poor social skills and social anxiety. I’m often embarrassed afterwards when I realize people have tuned me out. I am going to make more effort to practice at being a more balanced conversationalist. Thank you Dr. Ramani for heightening my awareness of this problem.
You are such a life saver! Every time I'm forced to deal with my toxic family I come here!! Having it explained helps release the rage that narcissists so easily generate. Thank you!! ❤❤❤
It's not so much about the fact that a conversational narcissist talks about themselves and personal experiences with a topic, but it is the AMOUNT of time they spend on talking about themselves in the conversation, and how they don't respond to others in the conversation, or show interest in other people's experiences.
But then some narcissists are really really good at asking questions to the point where you feel somewhere between flattered and interrogated. I guess the main thing is to be mindful and keep a good balance. If I'm talking too much about myself I start to get uncomfortable, and if I'm listening too much to the point of tiring concentration I get uncomfortable. So yeah, gotta just be mindful and trust instincts. Go with the flow and accept what is and not push anything.
precisely
I had a friend that called me when I came home from a two week trip in Asia and I just got home from the airport. This person went into drama mode about their ordeal of issues they were having at their previous job and did not once ask me on the phone how my fuckin trip was and wasn’t even considerate that I had jet lag and was tired. Looking back I should have been more blunt and told them to not call me, but the fact that they made the entire conversation about their drama and didn’t even ask me how I was for the damn two weeks I was gone appalled me.
I really good tip for anyone who is socially anxious about conversations:
A good conversationalist is Interesting, and interested. 50/50
I'm in customer service over 20 yrs now. People share experiences to bond. I don't see it maybe the same way as she is describing helpful to get ideas about a city or hobby learn something new, I actually like that.
Was quiet for a very long time think now finding that voice again you overcompensate trying to be heard or even acknowledged after narcissistic abuse you are not for so long. Truly see this as more others trying to connect or come out of and shell also, heal. Talking something helps, yet will say they railroad a convo, then again isn't your whole career based on listening? Conversation? Hard for a patient to grow if they never talk about themselves even harder to help.
But, I understand your perspective. So often I hear folks say "You never said that before!"
Actually I did, you just weren't listening or didn't care....
I get that a lot.
I agree. I used to just listen and love listening. Again, working with people you learn to ask questions and just listen. People need to be heard. It can be hard to find your voice after years of having it invalidated or ignored.
He not only took over conversations, but eventually he would take over the whole bible study until he was the one teaching the class and dispensing he great and profound wisdom!
When meeting new people he presents them with a verbal resume.
I think it's important that we also express our gratitude for the effort this person is putting into delivering such good quality content frequently and even more importantly: adapted to our needs. Thank you so much Dr. Ramani for fighting for your cause and making us benefit from it, being part of it and enriching our lives with every video you upload. This educational content is crucial and should be seen by everyone. There is always hope in humanity when you find people like you, who believe in a better world and DO something to make it better.
I sure do second that. Dr Ramani is wonderful. Hope you have a 'blessed' 2022.
Definitely!
This is very common and very tiring ! It is so hard to find someone who really can listen..
truth
I’ve met a fair amount of people that after speaking with them I’ve often ended up knowing all about them but they don’t know anything about me since they never cared to ask. Not sure if that makes them a narc or not but nicer folk generally want to get to know you better or at least take some interest in others.
The narcs I’ve known will listen to you if it is to their advantage or indeed, something about how great they are or how great something they have done.
I just try not to have expectations of anyone and that way I’m never disappointed. Being a good listener doesn’t come naturally to a lot of people, which is quite a sad reality really.
Be careful, many covert Narcs don’t talk enough and cause anxiety which makes the other person talk too much, as for it not to be awkward.
My parent takes over a conversation.. then when she’s done I start to talk, Now she’s focused on someone or something else immediately.. looking at her phone, talking about unrelated things .. Like WTF
Lol, I had a co-worker like this. She would work so hard to get my attention to talk then when she said her piece and I was going to reply to her my girl would then go and make a call! Like WHAT! I can laugh now but it was hella irritating. I told her about it and she looked clueless.about what I was telling her and again I'm like Weeerrtttt?! 🤷
Ricia Ali All they wanted to do is grab your attention that’s their supply, once gotten they drive the conversation back to them.. when their done and it’s not about them anymore they loose interest Sad, and Irritating frfr
I know that man
My ex took out his phone every time I had a story i even said ok well might as well just talk to myself literally my biggest pet peeve and makes u feel so small in someone's life
That is so aggravating. It seems that people have lost the art of conversation. On one hand Zoom was good, so we could still work from home. Yet, it didn't help with this problem.
I recently ended a relationship with a friend who is a conversational narcissist. And I feel so god d*mn free! It’s like I finally can breathe again.
She had multiple ways of turning the “conversation” back to her again. She would often interrupt me when I stopped to take a breath in the middle of a sentence, and after that she was unstoppable with the words.
But there’s particularly one method she used that always hurt me, every single time. When I began to explain whatever was on my mind or whatever had me stressed out, she would interrupt me and say “you don’t need to explain, I understand eeeexaaactly what you mean”. And if I resumed talking about it, she’d repeat that sentence over and over and over again til I stopped talking. Then it was all about her again.
It hurt me, because maybe I actually needed to explain, maybe just to get it out of my system and feel validated. That’s the way most of us interact with friends. But she was genuinely not interested in me (I have other anecdotes from our time together that makes me certain of that).
Sorry for wall of text, I’m a professional at not keeping it short. In writing, I should add. And also, English isn’t my first languages, so sorry for any grammatical mistakes.
When my dog died, and I was grieving, my narcissistic "friend" turned the conversation to her neighbor's dogs and how loud they are, and how much she WISHED someone would poison them!!
OMG. 😒
And this is how children of narcissists pick up their bad manners in the family dynamic.
"Holding court" Dr Ramani?!! You said it!!
In group settings, they won't let anyone get a word in. Then, if called out, they say "well, no one else was talking." But they never look to see if anyone was trying to speak.
truth right there
I call it the Professor syndrome. They would be naked without there phone and Google to always prove someone wrong! One accusation the Narc was on her high horse pointing fingers and lecturing the guests while in general conversation. After trying to speak several times, but over ridden by the Narc . I just stopped and stared at the narc, the guests were wondering why I was looking so intent at the narc, This made her uncomfortable. When the Narc stopped lecturing, I said did you you take your nice in public pill this morning? Everyone broke up laughing, the Narc was quiet the rest of the day....Win!!
this is dangerous if they have any way at all of getting back at you though lol. they'll throw anything at you if you injure their ego
Yes watch your back!
"Enjoy it for the movie that it is." 😅 love that, will remember that summary and smile when I uave to deal with a couple people in my life who are most definitely conversational narcissists.
I think a person whit "conversational narcisism" focuses on telling theyr story/es instead of listening with the intention of coming up whith an intresting question, joke or pun or maybe kind words... I think that you can have this as a "learned behaviour " if you had a narcisistic parent...my Guess based on my personal expirience...I tend to have this sometimes....( Narc Dad)
Same. Totally get where you’re coming from.
@@elizadarcy8641 cool nickname or super lucky to have this as a real Life name? Eatherway...thank you at least I know there is another person that feels the same! I mean...as a daughter I was a realy " Good girl" tipe never talking back, never disobaying...and I felt horribly confused because I litteraly NEVER KNEW WTF was expected of me from my father....FEAR expecialy of " Rage slaps"...Going into therapy I understood how much of he's behaviours I mirrored as an adult by not understanding they were wrong and "meaning good" doing so...
Or it could be @4:20(in the video not the plant)
Same here. I'm trying to work on it.
Yes I have had the same experience as both my parents are narcs
A friend of ours (now ex friend- long story), a narcissist, told us how he went to London and didn't like it. He said it was "just like New York". We said we were going there (2 years ago), after many attempts of his to try to get us to go with him somewhere HE wanted to go. A waitress at a local pub was British. He told her, "I've been to your country, not impressed". I just think that was not only rude, but demeaning. Fortunately, she was a tough cookie.
Yes indeed, what you describe about your ex-friend sounds exactly like narcissistic behavior. It is not possible for him to visit a country once and become an expert, nor is it appropriate to have expectations that the country should impress him. That's just crazy.
I really appreciated this video. This is the ONE area where I feel like I'm becoming my ndad. I'm terrible about interrupting people. I then dwell on interactions afterwards and feel the other person must hate me because I talked too much about me or didn't ask them enough about themselves. I'm also just awkward and say some pretty "foot in mouth" things I wish I could take back but feel so uncomfortable about it that I never apologize for it. I've constantly thought, this is me becoming my ndad. He interrupts people within a sentence or two and you never get to finish what you were saying.
Mindfulness is becoming the name of the game for me, but it's hard work. Especially now that I never get to talk to people like I used to 😕
I used to do this, out of insecurity, as a way of saying, "me too.") I don't do it anymore after I learned what I was doing
I think it's perfectly fine to contribute in this way as a way to show that you understand what they are talking about. Just keep it to the point.
I understand what you’re saying. Sometimes people do this to illustrate that they’ve experienced the same thing as a way of expressing empathy. One trait doesn’t make a narc and there are degrees to everything.
@@Mmax389 💙💙💙💙I was so afraid I was a narc until that sunk in,🙏💙🙏💙🙏💙
@@lisbethbird8268 tyou💙 so much I still have problems with keeping things in perspective; I still tend to catastrophize.
So rightly said, I had a Narcissist friend n she was always gaga about herself. She would be always come up with one after one! It was overwhelming.
I had the displeasure of having Christmas dinner with a communal and religious narcisist from my church. We had just sat down at the table and I mentioned that I had been to the cinema a few days earlier. Two sentences later she hijacked the conversation and went on about how she doesn't watch films because they are full of demons! The rest of us tried to change the subject, but it was no use and it went on for the rest of the dinner. I try to avoid her as much as possible, as she is very self-righteous and dominating
My mother was the master of this! Whatever the conversation started out as it always came back to her and how badly the world had treated her. (It was actually the other way round!)
Oh man, there's definitely been times in my life where I keep bringing the conversation back to me and my situation. Sometimes I talk about my problems to friends in hopes that they will share with me theirs but sometimes that doesn't happen and it accidentally ends up being about me. I do struggle with social anxiety too and sometimes I answer quick questions about me, and ask none in return because I just want the conversation to end so I can disappear into the background. 😅 Apart from that I usually enjoy listening to people one on one and bonding that way.
You're not a conversational narcissist. You want others to take the spotlight and tell you about themselves. You want to share stories to strengthen the friendship. You care about what others have to say, even if you guide them into the subject. This is just normal, healthy discourse as no one is being dismissed, resented for speaking, or denied a chance to share what's important to them. You're probably a wonderful friend to have, and your friends are lucky to have you in their life -- knowing they are free to share their stories and you will listen wholeheartedly.
Asking about you to talk, for endless minutes, only about themselves as soon as you finished answering their question.
The ultimate in listening skill is to take note how often people use the word “I” in conversation.. and ESPECIALLY oneself.
We all do this, it’s all about subtly catching it in the moment.
Oh my gosh, I never knew there was a term for these "all about me" conversational quirks that I have had since I quit being a "silent and seen but not heard child". Putting a cigarette in my mouth or passing out drunk seemed to be the only ways that I could "self control". So now that I no longer smoke and no longer drink, my conversations are either "complete silence" or "stumbling attempts to listen healthily". Being an "overly enthusiastic personality" makes it even more difficult to find the happy medium. Thank you so much for talking about this issue and offering ideas. You are the best, Dr. Ramani.
My husband does this constantly. It's so annoying
What about people who know they are narcissistic but hide it really well because they are highly intelligent?
Your channel is bleach!! Gross !!
Using curse words like a 13 year old to describe vegans that stand against animal abuse/slaughter
Not narcissistic at all🙄
You seem super enlightened I would love a crystal necklace made by someone cussing at good people,like yourself
@Rose-Cross Magick and DivinationI I know a narcisistic girl that reads books on narcisism
I find that a lot of them are really bright people.
Rose-Cross Magick and Divination well put. Lol 😂
@Rose-Cross Magick and Divination actually I think this could be true, I mean...we know it's true but psychologists could investigate, does the lack of distraction, caring, etc., permit easier or fluid access to memory and other intellectual functions? Dr. Ramani? What do you say?
Thank you for doing this one so much!!!
There was a man who once, while I was empathizing with friends who were enduring a lot of violence and grief and loss in their city, hijacked the conversation and stated that this famous singer he likes has just passed. That’s one of many examples of things he does. He has since unfollowed me after years of “friendship” after I stopped giving him supply. Whew!
Thanks as always Dr Ramani for opening my eyes to this world of narcissists and making my life much less stressful!
I’m definitely the second and third kind of people.
I was bullied as a child and to this day I have a hard time making long lasting friendships and trusting people to stay around once they get to know me (I am working on it!) it does get lonely and when I finally do befriend someone or get heard by anyone on any topic, providing input and advice from my own life and personal experiences as evidence to my knowledge is just easier.🤷♀️
I’m glad you brought this topic up!!
I do have to correct: as someone with ADHD who is literally fighting those stigmas everyday!... the scenarios you mentioned? It actually is something someone with ADHD can experience!
We can actually hyper focus when we talk about ourselves, or when we talk or care about any topics that catches our attention, but lose that focus if the conversation changes and the new topic no longer hold out interest. It is tricky.
I have had this happened multiple times.
When we have had meetings in the office I have to have something in my hand to play with, or I find myself checking my phone, or shuffling my feet or just doodling, because my brain won’t sit still!
Office meetings are my enemy, people yammering on and on and on.. I am truly sorry... I lose focus, I don’t mean to but it happens.
As someone who wasn’t diagnosed until adulthood, having a name for why I am the way I am, knowing I am not just bored or a bad person for doing this.
Oh my gosh this is so funny because for the past few years I've been looking at my man saying to myself I believe he is narcissistic to a degree for sure..and then hearing you say people turn things around on themselves without even giving you acknowledgment of what you say.... I have been going nuts cleaning scrubbing my bathroom walls and everything in the midst of having a cyst rupture on my right ovary and bleeding heavily..😬 sorry if it's too personal LOL but I mentioned it to my guy the discomfort and the ache and my right lower back ..first thing he does is state" my back hurts so bad " imagine if you did the job I did" !
🤔 Okkkkkk
Lol
It was like a kick in the face feeling like my feelings are disregarded... That's just one example LOL it's hard because I'm at a point where I'm starting to feel resentful towards him..😔 ☯️
Feel this i find it better to just shut up lol.. xxxx
This is something my bf would say I was a cage fighter snapped my leg and hes like aww its not that bad my ex had it worse blah blah blah you know the story xxxxxxx
Dear Dr. Ramani,
Thank you so much for the precious presentation on this topic. I had the choice to take part in the birthday party of my narcissistic former husband (30 years of marriage) and my 5-years old granddaughter in the house of my narcissistic daugter next Saturday.
I had to say "NO" because of the conversational narcissism of my former husband. We met last time on 2 January 2020 in my house. He hijacked our conversation always in the course of their 2-hours.long presence.
When I gave my granddaughters a bible for children as a Christmas gift, my former husband said so many bad things about God, religion, churches and my belief in God. His sentences lasted more than 30 minutes. I should have shown him the exit from my apartment, but I didn't.
Thank you again for being so brave in your position as a psychological therapist and saying the truth to people - your light is shining brightly into my life.
Kind regards to you and the followers of your channel - from Annemarie in Germany :-)
My Mom: no matter what the topic, the response was invariably “well what do you think about ME?🤦🏻♀️. Even when her brother was dying from lung cancer, she stood over him and said “I’d rather have what you’ve got than what I’ve got-macular degeneration. Afterwards, I called her out on what a horrible thing that was to say to a dying brother-she denied she said it. Class A Narc, gives me the shivers just thinking about it!
I am living in the same room with one of my friends..all the time if I say “I had a long day today” she straight away turned it and responds “did you have a bad day? What should I say then? I worked 8 h”
If I say to her “I am not feeling great today.I might have a cold” and I laid in bed 4 days because of it.. she responds..”I had very bad cold remember?it doesn’t matter that I was sick just one day and not 4 days like you that day I was sick was so bad that made up for all those 4 days you were sick, “(when she barley had a cold)
I decided to stop sharing with her the way I am feeling as she minimises everything .she is consistently in a victim mode..But it is not easy for me when I am living in the same room.you don’t want to hold yourself and to be so mindful 24/7.you should be able to relax in your own house .
It is absolutely true that some people do this as a result of social anxiety or isolation. Can’t tell ya how many strangers I’ve met who just go on and on about their lives, and in all honesty, I can tell that it’s because they’re isolated and unhappy. They go unheard at home so they have to talk whenever they have the opportunity. I do my best to listen and try to escape when the monologue doesn’t seem like it’s going to end. 😂
I think it’s easier to make the distinction between anxiety vs. conversational narcissism when you actually get to know a person. Because after a while, you really can’t use the anxiety or ADHD excuse anymore, lol. And based on my personal experience, the actual conversational narcissists that I know/have known are all extroverts who really don’t suffer from any form of social anxiety. They’re pretty much the opposite and know how to obtain the attention they want in any conversation.
@papasfritas extroverted people can have social anxiety, it doesn’t mean they feel at ease in situations. Also people who might seem to be fluent can have anxiety and maybe just talk about things just to keep talking and hiding their anxiety. There’s just also people who are quick with words or who talk even if they didnn’t want to. It can ease if the other person makes gestures or says something nice and caring that relax the situation. But if there’s a feeling of having to live up to some standards all the time, the anxious person might never relax. 😞 I have social anxiety and I’m quite ”skillful” hiding it sometimes, but if I’m very nervous I just talk and I don’t even hear what I say: I’m so nervous. It’s very very rare though. But some people exude something that brings forth trust - I feel there’s no competition, there’s no constant evalueing of me, then I relax and can be at my best, funny, attentive, empathetic. But people who feel like having a hidden agenda make me so very tense!!! That’s when I might talk things I don’t want to say. Mostly mindless small talk etc Just weird ramblings... It’s becoming more rare though as I feel less and less obligated to keep everyones mood happy. And I’m more skillful at channelling the nervous energy into more meaningful topics and asking things from people...
MsJeesus I understand what you mean and totally agree. Things aren’t always what they appear to be. That’s why I mentioned it is easier to make the distinction between real narcissism vs. social anxiety when you have really gotten to know someone. The people that I’m referring to, I know without a shadow of a doubt to be true extroverts who do not deal with social anxiety. I’ve known them for years. These extroverts just happen to also be narcissists in varying degrees and exhibit conversational narcissism very consistently. I also don’t mean to suggest only extroverts are conversational narcissists or narcissists in general. 😅 It’s just based on personal experience is all.
MsJeesus 💯 this exactly how I feel too (oops I made it about me again 🥴)
Nothing drives my narcissistic boyfriend more nuts than when I point it out. “Not everything is about you”/“there you go, making it about you again”. Makes him so mad. that part isn’t always fun but depending on his reaction a lot of the time that can be very entertaining for me. This is always conversations between just us though, I’m so isolated he’s literally thee only adult I can have conversations with so it’s entertaining to see how he turns EVERYTHING into a conversation about himself especially when it starts off as a conversation that is sooo far off from even being close to something that could be about him. It’s almost fascinating. It blows my f*ing mind. He just can’t help not talking about himself.
Doctor Ramani you are so wise and genuine. I enjoy listening to you and learning a lot also. Please keep doing that great job!
And yes, they are absolutely self-centered.