Grey Knights in in Warhammer 40K 10th Edition - Full Index Rules and Datasheets Reviewed
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- Опубліковано 22 лип 2024
- Let's talk through the Grey Knights index in Warhammer 40K
Index downloads available here - www.warhammer-community.com/w...
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0:00 Intro
1:00 Contents
3:02 Teleport Assault
6:15 Teleport Shunt
8:20 Stratagems
13:26 Enhancements
17:05 Datasheets
20:03 Power Armour Squads
26:37 Terminator Squads
29:46 Servitors
30:39 Vehicle Units
39:48 Generic Characters
48:20 Epic Heroes
53:54 Forge World Units
55:41 Closing Thoughts - Ігри
CORRECTION: Grandmaster Dreadknight can use any stratagem for 1CP , not just heroic intervention. I misread there. I guess could help a few of the pricier ones be a bit more viable on him.
Hey you didn't include the land raider banisher with the other land raiders :/
They really desperately need anti tank guns now. They already had this in Problem in 9th and now it’s so much worse
Can confirm, even anything as chonky as other terminators are problems
Indeed. My Nids are hungry for Grey Knights!
.byyjmbth. .. ..d 20:03 @@emperornapoleon6204ok
In 9th, Grey knights struggled with anti-tank. They somewhat compensated with some really good offensive psychic. Now, In 10th with all the psychic nerffed into the dirt.. They virtually can not deal with anything S10 and up.
Idk I have felt their psychic powers when my belakor took about 14 mortals from 2 models
@@Aselore Sure Kaldor Draigo will murder a daemon monster with his one psychic power having anti-daemon, but if you had a generic tank instead he'd barely scratch it.
@@des-trina I'm talking about 2 regular librarians
@@Aselore that is an extremely unlikely outcome.
@@Aselore So he rolled at least one 6 on vortex then rolled above average damage. Yes you are able to spike a lot of mortals if you roll hot, but they average 4 Mortals per turn, so that was almost double expected damage.
Grey Knights got seriously Nerfed from Psychic powers to losing Hammers.
Really need hammers back at like, S9 AP2 D3 or something to give units something to deal with heavy stuff.
I saw that all the weapon profiles got boiled down and I cried 😢
@@MrBlandUsernameback to bringing Razorbacks and Standard Land Raiders
@@JynxBlack13the idea was to simplify the game for 10th we'll just see how much complexity gets add back in when the codexes come out
@@embalancer6146the game is definitely not simpler 😂
As a grey knight player in 9th yes our mortal wound factory was fantastic however that was what made us actually keep up with everyone else who had good anti tank.
Yea we were dependent on those 30+ mortal wounds per game
I feel like you forgot to mention that the Psychic key word is now more or less a debuff on units. Since it seems to be the most common thing that has a FNP to protect against, but no balance on a buff for it. This has also made the Daemon Slaying faction worse Daemon slayers than your standard SM.
@27:25 About the Brotherhood Terminator Squad - you don't have to trade in a Storm Bolter for the Ancient's Banner. You can just take the banner. Not that that fixes all their problems or anything, just clarifying.
Add actual psychic abilities/shooting back to the army's units, give them back their Nemesis Hammers, unnerf their entire Dreadknjght weapon profile list that is currently incapable of dealing with anything, more than T6, and undo the needless 30-60% points increase that has this army costed like Custodes, and theyll be back to the middle of the pack for 10th Ed armies.
Umm I’m ok with the cost just make us as good as banana bois. I really don’t like the idea of staying the same on the cards at all. I know it is sooooo much easier to just make the units cheaper but I just want to be out numbered and still win. Not a huge fan of like 70+ grey knights on the table.
GW please, give them back their hammers and psychic powers...
Grey Knight are an all phyker army the fact that we only have the librarian for that is the worst decision ever made
@@animefan8254 I just started, chose Grey Knights because they seemed cheap and i like psychic stuff... and they don't all have psychic abilities? What the fuck.
@@disastrousdwarf 9th edition was peak time for grey knights also they are still good in 10th but its more dependant on getting the charge first with terminators or paladins or dreadknights for heavy hitting attacks
They are such a cool force in style, lore, and rules. But badly need to be upgraded to true scale
Laughs In 3d printer.
Still have the feeling the grey knights will get some love as a counter force to the Emperors children
Agreed but as this upgrade will likely be the last in our life time I don’t mind they take the time to really nail the design
well....get ready for more lore breaking "primaris Grey knights".
Yeah and they'll use the chance to change the very good combat patrol into a much less efficient box to push individual sales because we can't have good things.
It’s insane how much you can solve most of our issues, or at least even it all out heavily, if they rediversify the nemesis force weapons.
48:05 One correction that helps out the Grand Master Dreadknight, whenever you use ANY stratagem it only costs 1. So he is a great target for Haloed in Sunfire, the psychic weapon one, counter offensive, or if the enemy makes one cost extra.
Painted my first strike marine last night and the Auspex oracle drops this for me 🎉
Don't give up, the struggle may be hard brother but the Imperium needs you! WE ARE THE HAMMER!
An army that has to advance, wants to charge. Gets an auto 6 on advance and fly. Has no advance and charge, no charge buff, range weapons are not assault, so if you do a mass charge you can end up doing nothing. Melee army with no str 6 or higher weapons on infantry. Basic weapon is str4 ap- which is nothing. Psyker keyword has ZERO synergies, for the army , but multiple ones that make some match ups really bad. Worse marine army to fight against chaos and demons. Is the anti demon faction in lore. Ton of space marine minus rules. Worse land raiders , worse techmarines, one per game 0Cp (other factions have it per turn) rule on the grandmaster. NDK became less resiliant then they were in prior edition yet somehow cost premium. No way to deal with tanks, knights, heavy infantry, hordes. Point costs as if they were custodes. Terminators have a negative synergy between their own rules and the stratagem, that is suppose to help them kill big stuff in melee. And so on and so one.
Ty facts
Not to mention lack of spells and actual mortal wound damage. Also can we talk about how almost every army has a unit that will get a buff from just fighting our army? Like FFS 1Ksons have basically a stop hitting yourself button.
While I agree that the army has fundamental flaws that need serious addressing to overcome, I have no idea where this nonsense about weak melee weapons comes from, as the Nemesis Force Weapons are basically the only thing we have that *is* going for us (*Golden Bois laughing in background*). S6/AP-2/D2 is as solid a melee profile as you'll find in 10E and is present across our whole army (*Golden Boi laughing intensifies*).
Our melee problem is the lack of adv & charge or boosted charges from Deep Strike (sans Draigo).
The lack of meaningful anti-tank is a far more glaring issue.
I’ve waited a good month for this video, seeing all the in 10th videos I’ve been waiting for you to cover my army, glad it finally arrived!
I’m so glad they got some massive points drops. Hoping you can do an updated version and maybe talk about when the new Grey Knights Codex might come out.
Anything over toughness 7 is unbeatable for GK right now.
Or strike first.
Even just T7, my squighogs just bullied them last time I used them
While I have about 0 interest in playing gray knights I gotta say that the whole teleport in an out mechanic is really cool and thematic.
But the Interceptors could do that anyway.
The Auspex work ethic is unbeatable
work has an Auspex ethic
Death from the warp gives +1 to Hit in melee as well because it doesn't specify RANGED attacks
It does... Read it again
@@jean-philippecarrier2216it says “ranged weapons equipped by models in your unit have the [ASSAULT] ability and each time a model in your unit makes an attack, add 1 to the hit roll”. So it pretty clearly does not say that it’s only +1 to hit at range. The range specification is because it means nothing to give a melee weapon assault.
@@trey6883 hmmmm thats right... Good to know thanks !!
@@jean-philippecarrier2216 no problem!
Alright. Here’s how to fix the problem.
When the Codex comes out, assuming no range refresh yet, make the following changes:
- Add an option for hammers. I know, free points costs and everything - maybe make limits per squad, as it comes in the box?
- Give them back psychic - e.g. a table of powers to choose to cast like Thousand Sons have. Come on. They don’t even have to be as strong
- Add a psychic ranged damage detachment to buff the aforementioned
I don’t think high points costs is a bad thing though, fewer models on the table looks better for Grey Knights.
People should not sleep on some of the Power Armoured versions. Both the Strike Squad and Purifiers are very good value for their points.
A 2+ save is twice as much survivability compared to a 3+ save. A Storm Bolter can have up to +100% firepower compared to a regular Bolter, which with the Deep Strike rules is not difficult to achieve.
The Nemesis Force Weapons are much better than most close combat options for standard marines.
For every 2 Terminator Brotherhood squads, you can field 3 units of Strike Squads or Purifiers instead, which overall gives you far more attacks(shooting and melee) for your points.
The real issue is the characters that can join your Power Armour units. Only the Tech Marine and the Champion can join the Strike Squad, which limits their tactical flexibility a bit. Castellan Crowe is the only one who can join Purifiers.
You could technically add an Inquisitor from Agents of the Imperium, but they do not have the same special rules, so while they add some bonuses, they also comes with extra restrictions.
I did not mention Purgation squad, because they are simply too expensive and specialized for what they bring, and have very little merit. More special weapons means fewer good melee attacks. The price per model is above that of Purifiers, but they are generally worse in an anti-infantry role and potentially worse at dealing with anything but light vehicles. They only have the Champion as a leader option, a melee specialist, in a squad focused on ranged firepower.
Interceptors are fast, but no characters can join them and they are, yet again, fairly expensive. The mobility is less awesome when you have so much deep strike potential and another squad that can make objectives sticky. If the Champion could join them, it might be a different story.
Fully agree, friends of mine run loads of terminators and baby carriers. The army doesn't hit hard, it's not numerous enough to play primaries or secondaries, and dies easily.
I've had single 'scalpel' units run through half the army because overpriced, squishy walkers and blocks of terminators are a lot of eggs in one basket.
Absolutely right about purgation squads, they can't shoot tanks and purifiers have anti infantry 2+ for less, they're shocking.
From what I've seen you go wide, play secondaries
Naw can't let this go uncontested grey knights is alot of feel bad and it needs to be known or gw won't fix it.
2+ save good
Whole army over costed proven as units with similar rules and abilities are cheaper which mean we are paying a premium to deep strike and have this 2+ save.
6s ap2 dmg 2. Lack of re rolls and buffs make us pillow fisted also majority wise to get into combat 9+ charges bad.
Storm bolters have volume not fire bower s4 ap nothing throwing 20 shots on 3s missing a few wounding on 4s dropping some more doesn't amount to much they don't kill much of anything which is fine but you making Storm bolters seem great is nuts
2nd teleporting is great but we need to be on the table to score. Removing units is removing options for your opponent who will happily decide to shoot at what they can and units very much die
@@thelegendsmith3063 I am saying this compared to the GK Terminator variants and other standard marines, not that the units themselves are "OP" or great value compared to other faction's specialists.
As for your pointers, I think it is a bit more nuanced than that. They are not paying just for the 2+ save and Deep Strike. You also get every model with a Storm Bolter and a Nemesis Force weapon.
A 10 man squad is 40 attacks at strength 4 from range 12"(or below), and 30 Strength 6, -2AP, dam 2 in melee. For 270 pts.
That is twice the firepower of a Tactical Squad, with more than twice the melee capability, and twice the survivability, but less than twice the cost. That is the point.
It means that a 5 man Grey Knight Squad at 135 pts have roughly the same capabilities as a 175 pts 10-man Tactical squad in terms of damage output and survivability.
As for lack of rerolls, they do have some. The Venerable Dreadnought gives every nearby GK infantry reroll 1's on hit and wound rolls.
Once per battle round, one Grandmaster in Nemesis Dreadknight can reroll hits, wounds and damage rolls in the fight phase for themself.
Grey Knight Razorback gives Reroll Wounds for the unit that disembarked.
A Brother Captain gives all psychic weapons in the unit Sustained Hits 1 and can reroll his own Wound rolls.
The Champion can reroll his own hit and wound rolls against characters in melee.
Sure, they do not have something like Oath of Moment, but on the other hand, it is not concentrated onto a single enemy either.
Then we have a few ways to add to the roll. Chaplain still adds a +1 to wound in melee for the unit. Death from the Warp adds +1 to hit for the unit.
I agree that a lot of people overvalues the teleport rule. It is great for mobility and it forces your opponent to play a certain way. GK relies a lot on how they deploy their units each turn, more so than any other factions, so it is not hard to imagine that a lot of players end up making a lot of mistakes as well.
And yes, to score, you need to staying on the board. But they can do that as well.
As I said, a lot of people underestimates just how tough 2+ save is with cover and the Truesilver Armour stratagem. Most Overcharged plasma weapons only score 1 kill out of 10 shots, so to take out 5 models, you would need 50 overcharged Plasma shots(at BS 3+).
@fendelphi @fendelphi you are aware all other terms can use power fist thunder hammers chain fist cyclone muscle launcher are also have a 2+ save so my point remains premium to teleport.
Vulnerable dreadnought doesn't get fiction ability so can't keep up with anything to give re rolls.
3rd premium due hiw expensive we are we have 7 units on the table compared yo everyone else's 10+
Your comparison with strikes to tactical is several misplaced if your gonna give them a strat for silver armor hell blasters can get several strats one of which ignore covers and adds extra ap no cp regen or utility in gk at all so odds are you don't even have that cp cause you had the deimos out of dodge but I didn't come at you to argue just to make points you are wrong otherwise gw will never fix the problems. So ima drop it there
@@thelegendsmith3063 It seems like you are not listening to what I am actually saying. Maybe you are one of those who are sleeping after all.
GK Terminators are 45 pts per model, regular SM Terms are 41 pts, while the Strike Squad is 27 pts, so my point still stands.
For 27 pts per model, you get a unit full of Storm Bolters and what is essentially upgraded Power Weapons, both of which is usually reserved for Terminator units.
Dreadnought moves along and supports the pieces that stay on the board. You can at best teleport 5 units around anyway, and you want to be scoring as many points as possible, so it will be supporting the big infantry blocks near the center.
The thing is, your opponent will have to decide if they want to use their high AP attacks against your Dreadnought or your potentially more dangerous infantry.
If you want some cheap units on the board or more point generation, get some Agents of the Imperium.
Hellblasters are a specialist unit. They are not the standard Tactical squad and have nothing to do with what I am talking about.
That said, they are terrible in melee for their cost and ineffective against hordes. They have their own vulnerabilities, so most lists will not bring more than 1, unless the player expects to be fighting a lot of marines.
If they decide to blast apart one of your 5-model Strike Squads, you assault them next turn with a different unit.
I mean, you could field five 5-model Strike Squads for 675 pts. Again, with roughly the survivability and power of five 10-model tactical squads(which would have costed 875 pts).
With the change of wording, the death from the warp gives +1 to hit in melee aswell after the faq. Quite nice on the babycarriers if they wasnt priced to oblivion. First to the fray also allows a t1 rapid ingress, i think thats the big use
Out of phase rules don’t work according to design commentary. Look it up on the app but basically you can’t rapid ingress T1 with first to the fray
@user-zh8dr1qt1s first to the fray isn't out of phase though. The restriction of rapid ingress is only in the end of enemy movement phase. But I might be wrong, was it something with rapid ingress drop pods to stop it? Got hit with it the other day, love to tell the guy he was wrong :)
To clarify: the reason you can't rapid ingress t1 is the restriction that you can't ds/reserve t1. This problem is explicitly dropped by first to the fray
Yep death from the warp gives +1 to hit until the end of the turn shooting and melee. Also the rapid ingress t1 is legal in normal games but WTC did an FAQ on not allowing it on t1.
@@jonasandersson5838 Both FttF and Drop pods don't work with Rapid ingress.
Both rules explicitily allow you to arrive in *your* first movement phase... since it's bound to *your* movement phase, it becomes an "out-of-phase" rule when you use rapid ingress in *your opponents* movement phase.
However, it seems to be played wrong quite often, so a lot of people think it works because they see it being used in some battlereport on youtube... Most people don't bother to actually read the rule for FttF/Drop Pod and just paraphrase it to make it sound like it voids the T1 restriction in general, which is NOT the case...
Some context: at least the specific case of "Rapid ingress + FttF" was explicitily forbidden at Tacoma (US Open in July). Don't know about Drop pods specifically, but would assume the same.
For the GMNDK his Heroism's Favour ability isn't just for heroic intervention. He can use any strat for only 1cp.
I’d love to see a general review of 10th ed in Boarding Actions type play. The buffs to vehicles seems to have really messed with the system. So many comments refer to units lacking the needed anti-tank abilities.
Looks like we got candidate for faction overhaul
GKs will become excellent when they finally get primaris/new model line. Till then they will languish, suffering for the sins of the Matt Ward dex.
There was a small mistake in the GMNDK as his ability is not 1CP heroic intervention but all strats cost 1CP. Meaning that one could use for example interrupt or Halloed in soulfire with 1CP, instead of 2CP.
The cool thing about the Techmarine, is that if he joins a Strike squad (with a heavy weapon), the servitors are allowed to join the Techmarine's unit during the Declare Battle Formations step (Servitor Retinue).
Which makes the entire squad; Techmarine (60points) with 5 Strike Squads (125 points, 1 Heavy Weapon) & 4 Servitors (50 points, 2 Heavy weapons) AND the entire ordeal is allowed to Deepstrike.
I ran this last night in a friendly game. Very effective but I misplayed the priority target with them but they were still impactful and I very much recommend the combo.
YES, I will never play grey knights but these videos are my life blood
Good analysis!
Played 2 games of 10th ed with gk vs guard - first game 1k game short edges - lost by 15 points due to getting some rules wrong on my side - with nemisis, he did fairly well
second game lon edges - i took 1gm knight and two normal ones, used first to the fray and put both of the knights in reserves, put down gm down turn 1, he survived, dropped the other two next round survived 1,5rounds which was fine moving up the board with 2x terminator squads and screening out the backfield with calladius und henchmen. won by a huge margin due to the moveability
The Grand Master dreaknight discounts all stratagems to 1 cp not just heroic intervention.
He's too expensive for me to feel worth taking regardless but I'd argue the best use for him is actually discounting haloed in soulfire for safe positioning to threaten a vehicle/monster
Ya know, I kinda like how the grey knights are looking this edition. I feel like they’re more useful against non-demon factions now, and as much as I think a points reduction could make them a lot more playable, I’m pretty happy as GK player. Even though it’d be better to build around terminators, I really like the idea of running some purifiers with Crowe as warlord then some terminators to back them up. I really like Castellan Crowe’s datasheet this edition
I'm watching this video from 10 months in the future -- the GK point drops have been amazing (e.g. Purgator from 190 to 130)
Bounce around the map hoping to win on VP, make no bad moves or you'll die...
are grey knights able to teleport behind enemy lines in turn two or do the same rules apply as if you were deep striking normally?
Is there no specific brotherhood champion model? It would kinda suck to use a different model and be left with only 9 strike squad models for example
Welcome to grey knights where we have no unique models for non-named characters. You have to make your grand masters, brother captains, etc. out of standard terminators, and champions out of standard strikes.
@@des-trina Sounds fun... Thank you.
Havent had many issues killing armor, ive had trouble surviving long enough to do so.
They ported our heavy weapons from 8th editon - they rely on stratagems to make viable and we didn't get any in the Index. Winning as GK right now means just hiding in a corner or sitting on an objective and dying as slow as possible. Killing things just isn't an option.
Then you have stratagems and army rules that punish psychic weapons...
It might have been a 1 off game but I played hyper aggressive against tyranids and won by 8 points
This is my Boarding Actions army, playing the first BA of 10th tonight, should be fun. Still annoyed gw don't have any support on the app for boarding actions though, no way to build a list at all, hoping battlescribe still does
The purgation squads is 5 points cheaper than a repulsor lol that’s crazy
Wow, you mean to say that practically removing Psychic Powers negatively impacted Psychic Focus Armies? They don't need AT Guns, they need their Psychic Powers back.
The worst part is they could already teleport all over the place and, honestly, could do it better in 9e. They've lost so much to 'gain' a worse version of something they could already do better and more interestingly.
Even as a Nid player the Nemesis Dreadknight has some awful rules!! It’s less than a hive tyrant only T8 with S10 greatsword they should be at least T10 With S12/14 weapons WTF games workshop?
I tried with a hammer to help with T10 up stuff. If you get bracketed, you hit on 5s even as a GM. It basically makes taking them pointless.
@@consoleviking7775 Yeah the data sheet is tragic I’m not gonna lie! Feel bad for you Greg knight players because model is EPIC! 🤩
Should easily be redempter dread level in terms of stats and damage capabilities
Primaris resculpted Grey Knights should get their squad types consolidated and adjusted to include proper anti-armor weapons such as melta guns, plus Grey Knight-tailored Primaris vehicles such as Redemptor Dreadnoughts.
Why should they be Primaris?
Got into grey knight partly because of auspex tactics, partly because of Baldermort. Loving the army because of one last blade
Always love it when Auspex covers my knights.
Isn't the "Once per battle" free stratagem on the grandmaster a typo? it seems strange too me since any other model with that rule can do it once per turn.
It didn't get changed in the recent FAQ, so I guess its just another random nerf for specifically GK, as if they needed more.
I sure hope it was.
I dont think so. Generally speaking, GK stratagems are much more impactful in terms of keeping units alive(entire unit gets Lone Operative or teleports away when an enemy gets close) or scoring VPs compared to most factions. If they could easily be spammed across multiple units each turn, there would be no real counterplay.
The army need a tune up here and there(generally, they lack AP capabilities outside of melee), and some more adjustments to certain units.
A big issue is how bad Melta weaponry generally is across all armies. If Melta weaponry had a better payoff(say, standard S10 and Melta 3), TM with Multi-meltas would be a fairly reliable way to remove enemy tough targets.
Some factions do have S12 melta weapons as well.
@@fendelphichaos space marines get lone operative with the mark of nurgle, I think GSC also get it. And they both have free strategem access so can do it every turn. Grey knights strategems are nothing special. I guess it protects from overwatch in addition but it’s not that great. Hell soace msrines get the librarian in Phobos armor which gives the whole unit lone operative permanently which I think is underrated. Melts was annoying late edition I am glad it’s a little harder to wound with it it does still retain awesome AP and for armies that can get a bonus to wound it still does work.
I play GKs, I can confirm that telaport assult is quite useful, but after turn 2 everone ahould already be in optimal position, thus no longer needed. The Shunt is way to niche to be an attachment, I think it should be a strat and the detatment rules should be replaced with something combat related.
I just got into 40k after years of watching from afar, and went with the Grey Knights Combat Patrol. I know everyone says to just get the faction that you think is cool, but I can’t deny that I’m a little bummed to hear how bad GK are right now. Luckily I’ll be playing casually for the foreseeable future anyways so I guess it doesn’t really matter!
Does anyone know if we are going to get some rereleases of units in the index? I can’t seem to find some of the vehicles and the gunships.
Cheers!
Do you guys think Grey Knights will see a primaris style model refresh soon? Wondering if I should go all out buying models to start an army or wait. They look a bit dated but I hear they are the forgotten children.
They aren't scheduled to have a model release this edition. There are kitbashing guides if your willing to buy 2 kits to upscale them.
Otherwise as much as the comments here are shitting on the rules don't be discouraged from painting some up. We all still love our knightly boys just unhappy that we aren't given good rules yet.
Its unlikely well get Primaris scale anytime soon, as Mrbones mentioned you can use Primaris bits to upscale them or use "totally GW proxies" such as the Silver Wardens if your cool with Resin
Id advice against getting them now as our current rules we struggle hard vs any kind of armor with even a half decant save
Read the lore and maybe get some Termies since they are the core of the army and wait till we get the point cuts we need or a new codex comes out.
All factions are getting new models in 10th alongside their codexes, so while it’s still a ways off it’s entirely possible for them to get upgrades, especially when they only need to redo 2 boxes to get 90% of the faction, even if just one gets an update that’ll be a large portion of the faction upgraded.
@@BrotherVoidBomberwhere you getting this info from?
@perrybailey5565 1. If there is ill gladly eat my hat but even so it's going to take atleat a year before GK's new release comes out. We may get something but with the release of 9th we didn't really get any new models except for Crowe. More then likely it will just be Mister dragio.
2. Unless your Space marines you really don't get much in range refreshes.
Maybe change somebody to Gravis armor like paladins for toughness 6.
Man I miss the FW GK psychic dread.
GK really need a moderate overhaul, but it's not that far from being really cool.
Fix 1, split nemesis force weapons into the old 5 types just by using keywords.
Falcions get Sustained 1,
Halbards lethal wounds,
Swords Precision,
Staffs anti monster 2+
Daemonhammers need to be Str8
And give all of the nemesis weapons Anti-deamon 3+
This gives them enough bite to actually get stuck in and provide a real fight and let's you specialise units roles on the battlefield.
Second fix. Baby carriers are overcosted. Discount them both by 40 points. Right now they are unusable bad for their points.
3rd fix. Grandmasters free stratagem ability should be every turn, in line with all the other armies characters who have this grand strategist ability. Regular space marine captains have this every turn and phobos cappy-bois are less than 100 years of experience. This nerf makes no damn sense.
4th fix. Cut the cost of all power armoured units by 5 points per mini. You would be surprised how far this would go with the specialist units and may make incepters even slightly interesting.
It's only 4 headings but these changes would solve a lot of niggles and some real problems.
I think keeping Falchions, Halberds and swords as one is fine. Hammers need their own stats, as do warding staves. Nothing was more frustrating that having to change my melee weapon loudouts every edition because GW kept changing how swords, halberds and falchions worked.
As a grey knight player I don't want points reductions for my units, I want my data sheets to be WORTH the points they cost
the banner does not replace the stormbolter , it says "1 brotherhood terminator equipped with a stom bolter can be equipped with 1 ancients banner " it is purely additive
Nope your wrong. It replaces it
@@perrybailey5565 I want you to go read it in the index again before you so confidently be wrong about something.
grey knights are neat but damn are they low on the totem poll. i have such a hard time trying going against high toughness targets that it feels like a waste of time doing it.
Love em, the only battle line marines that feel like marnes. Though, decent shooting and good melee
When the codex for grey knight gets released we should atleast be granted armywide anti daemon 6+ and advance and charge aswell as our nemesis daemon hammers
Remind me, can you play Grey Knights under the Gladius SM detachment or are they too special for that?
Too special for that.
I’ve been reading 40k books for a few years now. Decided I want to play and I hit Amazon to get a Grey Knight army. I quickly realized… i needed help. Thank you. Subbed.
Can you use mist of diemos while in combat
Nope it states that your unit cannot be within engagement range of an enemy unit(s)
Can’t use it I. Engagement range. But you can use sigil in melee combat if someone shoots.
Grand Master in Nemesis should hit on 2+... he is the only captain in 40k to hit on a 3+ thats BS... Overall the rest is cool, but a big lack of firepower against big toughness like vehicles or Monster... GW have to had firepower and reduce the cost of points
If you want to play grey knights competitively, play thousand sons
From playing against Grey Knights I'd say you need to go wide, play the mission and fixed secondaries.
You're not realistically out fighting anything, but they cant kill you in return if you're not there.
I'm waiting for the codex. I hate the index rules
Some points drops, and balance changes to the cards (extra psychic attacks or higher strength weapons) might help. Sadly looks like we will be one of the last to get a codex, so we are stuck with the launch detachment for potentially most of 10th. It's possible different detachments could have made all the difference with an early codex.
Whoever wrote their index was such a hack.
Back from the future, now the past. Their points reductions now make them the little brothers of custodians.
I think one of the main things that Teleport Assault does is that it forces opponents to screen out deepstrikes, preventing them from committing their entire force. Other armies will eventually run out of units to deepstrike with. Grey Knights will not.
Strategic Mastery on the Grand Master is garbage.
Grey night's spending 2 cp for dev wounds on psychic weapons when tsons can just pick them for free. Yikes
Grey Knights have 3 major problems, and probably a half dozen minor problems that hamper their ability to compete even at a middling level.
1.) The lack of meaningful anti-tank/Knight is a glaring weakness that makes several matchups essentially unwinnable. (Note to my fellow Grandmasters: Run at least 2 Ven Dreads until we get some balancing, it doesn't solve all the problems, but it is at least a snowball's chance.)
2. Storm bolters need to have Assault. At the very least this would make the detachment rule more useful.
3. Character attachment rules are a MESS. That most characters have to attach to over-costed Terminator units makes list-building far more constrained than it should be. There need to either be non-Terminator versions of at least a few leaders or the ones in Terminator armor should be able to lead non-Terminator units.
Extra credit: Give the GMNDK 2+ to hit and lower the cost of all NDKs significantly, the nerfs to their weapons are crippling at their current price tag.
Bonus note to other GK GMs: Take Crowe and a full brick of Purifiers with Incinerators and learn to love Prognosticated Arrival with them.
Wait wait is my old GK army now legal again? I ran GK with Inquisition (essentially Guard) allies. My question...can infantry embark in allied transports after game start, in the current edition? And if so, do chimera or any other allied transport have a firing deck of 4, or something akin to the old Open Top rule? Maybe I will return to 40k, if my old models are legal again...
You can disembark and re-embark again just not in the same phase
@@grahamwilliamson5306 My question is, can my GK infantry embark in the transport brought by allies? And if any of the allies available to GK have a transport with 4 fire points, or something akin to the old Open Top rule?
Ive not played 40k in many years, but if the above is allowed and if there is a allied transport with fire points I can take, my old list may work. I have GK and Inquisition models and used to embark my GK infantry into Inquisition chimera on turn 1.
@40kNationPhilly I imagine if it's allied as in playing with a friend yes. But they can't add any allied tank units themselves. The rhino does have firing deck 2 so 2 units inside can still shoot
@@grahamwilliamson5306 Ah I did not mean “playing as a friend”, I meant “allies” in the army list sense. In this video he mentioned that GK had access to allies. In the old days we could take an allied detachment from another codex.
If GK do not have access to any allies transport unit, then my old army remains illegal sadly. It used Rhino and Chimera, and started turn one with all infantry on foot. Turn 1, the GK units embarked in the Inquisition Chimera, and the Inquisition units embarked in the GK Rhino.
@40kNationPhilly they still have their own rhino, and on the 40k app, they have access to 2 imperial Armour units, one of them being a banisher which can transport units. No firing deck tho
After several games they seem to lack that special source. Teleporting is great, but you're just average at best against most things cost for cost, some than most. Certainly a balance pass is needed and some points tweaking. Hope GW isnt lazy about it though and just makes them cheaper. They should be a small elite force, not cheap and spammy. We'll see what happens i suppose. Thanks for the vid.
Agreed I hate having to field 70+ models
Still so fucking weird to me GW went and decided to represent the most powerful Imperium psychic force of daemon hunters by... building their army rule around teleporting a lot? something not even really associated with them in the lore?
The Grey Knight are really lacking of an anti-tank unit!
Whole army feels oddly costed... I could go for some cheaper weaker units to get more models on the table
Tbh why are we expecting a rock paper scissors army to be balanced in open play. They should have an 80% win rate against chaos, and be overcosted and average everywhere else. They clearly brought out custodes to create generalist superboys.
The loss of Nemesis Daemon hammers is criminal, as is what is essentially a debuff.. the Psyker/Psychic attack Keyword. Purgation squads are pointless, Interceptors lost their role due to the army rule, dreadknights are over costed for their damage/survivability, paladins are a joke.
Grand master in nemesis dreadknight hit on 3+ and 4+
……..
Couple corrections. Terminator units. 1 can take a banner with out dropping any storm bolter. Narthurim can be picked up by a different model if drops bolter.
The narthurim only works in command phase so only can bring I model back if you choose not to TA. Does not help change distances
GMNDK is just a CP reduction to 1 not a heroic intervention.
Love the review and hopefully we get some love in September.
Noice
They need there own unique tank, maybe with a weird blink defense ability or something
I don't like how they threw all melee weapons into the same category. I liked having the choice between 1 dmg but more atts, 2 dmg more ap or str, 3 dmg but -1 to hit. I love that war gear doesn't have an additional points cost anymore.
Given that the indexes are temporary it’s entirely possible that all of the weapons that got grouped together will be separated back out once the actual rules come out… we’ll know for certain if that’s the case with the SM and nid codexes
About the First to the Fray, I have a question.
Does it allow the Transport to deep strike as well?
The only models that can take the Enhancement are models with Deep Strike, which is a redundant restriction, since all Grey Knight characters have the ability. Which leads me to think that it is mentioned due to a different reason.
The rule then mentions the unit and "any transport it is embarked within" as a package, and then goes on to say "That unit can Deep Strike". It does not mention what happens to the Transport(if it is only allowed to come in at the board edge or if it is part of the deep strike itself).
The fluff text kind of support the deep strike aspect of it: "whether braving premature teleportation assaults or leaping from the hatch of a transport still aglow from atmospheric entry...".
This suggest that the transport is used basically like a drop pod.
It just allows the transport to be not counted against reserve limits.
@@simoneengelleitner947 The unit is Embarked on the transport though. How is the unit supposed to deep strike/arrive on turn 1, while embarked?
I just bought in the gray nights. Somewhat aware that they're just sort of in a mediocre spot with 10th edition. And yeah that's been my impression with a couple games as they just need a little bit more. Not massive changes. There's some point reductions and maybe reworking that teleport shunt ability it's just not that useful.
The detachment rule really feels like a waste
ITS NOT LOOKIN GOOD GREY BOIS
Fluffy, watch this video and Git Gud
People are relying on librarians and damage instead of embracing their movement and stratagems. 2 10 man terminator squads and 1 10 man paladin squads are the core of the army I have been having the best results with. The grand Master is the best non named character, run him with terminators or paladins. Drago is a monster and helps a lot with his FNP to mortals. The last one I run is either a brother captain or chaplain depending on points with the paladin squad. Now you have 3 tough, relatively killy units that you can teleport around with your army rule. I run the sigil always. First to the fray is optional but I try to run if I have the points. Callidus assassin give you a 4th deepstrike unit for secondaries. 1 or 2 5 man Voidsmen or exaction squad for screen/back field objective holder/secondaries. What you do with the last few points is up to you. I've switched one unit of either terminators or paladins with purifiers and Crowe a few times and it was ok.
How should i put it.. like most of the players, you failed to see the true potential of GK. And most of their strengh is hidding behind their rules and abilities that s have to be red carrefully.
1rst death for the warp startagem gives [assault] to the ranged weapons, but the +1 to hit bonus dosent specify that it apply on ranged weapon only. This is a huge boost for DK which can move, advance, fire on 2+, charge using tank shock, and hit with there great hammer with a WS of 3+; with all of that a DK can statically crush an armiger in one round.
The second one are the interceptors and Rhinos: the core rules specify that a unit cant embark or disembark in the same PHASE, which means that interceptors can disembark from a rhino during the mouvement phase, then in the ranged one, they can fire, move 6" and embark in the vehicule. Then, the Rhino can shoot himself using the interceptor's heavy weapons, as allowed by the rhino's firing deck rule. Thus, even if an interceptor squad has only two heavy weapons, they can shoot twice with it in one round.
The third mistake concern the servitors' and the techmarines which are probably the most profitable GK unit's . The core rules makes clearly a difference between a "model" and a "unit". The servitor's retinue rule specify that only one servitor unit can join a UNIT already led by a techmarine; not that the techmarines can only have 4 servitors as bodyguards. Since the techmarine can led a strike squad, or a servitors' squad, you can actually makes a squad of 8 servitors, with 4 heavy weapons. Moreover, if you give a sigil to the techmarine you can safely teleport the entire squad up to 3" of an ennemis unit ( using the pronostical arrival stratagem) and fire with 4 heavy melta at short range. If your ennemy try to move or shoot you, teleport again using the Sigil or mist of deimos stratagem. You think that the domina liber daeminica is just average? Just put it on a techmarine, and he will make 8 attacks that will wound most of vehicules and monsters on 4+, which make him as deadly as voldus in close combat.
Finally, the stratagems have to be well used too. If you just use mis of deimos, put your GK unit in reserve and deep strike in your next mouvement phase, you will have have to roll a 9" charge. But if you combine mist of deimos, and rapid ingress, your next charge is guaranteed.
In conclusion, there are plenty of strong combo available in GK army, but most of GK players focus on the terminators, and epic characters, which is why, in my opinion, they are struggling against the others. In fact, currently, most of the players are using terminators-like unit in their own list, and every competitive army are well prepared against them.
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Nah they about 2nd to 3rd last.
Bad rules and a bad model range why woukd you?
Dreadknights seem the way to go at 215 pts they’re cheaper than terminators 🤨
Whether they're amazing or awful on the tabletop atm, cant see anyone in their right mind putting together a new GK army w/ how dated their minis look. It's a crime how bad they look top to bottom.
With a 3d printer many things are possible. Like truescale GK. Geedubs can continue slurping primaris schlong all day for all I care.
I've just started an army of Grey Knights.
Models are old but still good, and with a lot of personalization options, better than most of the new, enormous kits with basically mono pose models.
I don't see a problem there, tbh. They're a bit old but still looking good with lots of detail. Only thing that's kinda weird is seeing them next to any Primaris Marines
I’m okay with Grey Knights being horrible, what I’m not okay with is Custodes being good.
Screw all the super marines.
Of all the faction subreddits, the GK sub is utterly awful. Just constant crying, 10 paragraph fantasy codex updates and “derp we can’t win, how do you deal with this??” Literally daily. My sister complained less when diagnosed with cancer. That sub is peak cringe
Aren't they like the third worst army
@@Wyrm7774 they’re on par with Tau and BA, and way above Votann and DG. But is crying and writing fanfic FAQs going to help, or could they recognize that it’s a game and GW will balance things as they always do? Just the loudest group of whiners, it’s embarrassing AF.
GK have been bad for 4 editions now. 5 if you want to play terminators. Imagine being unhappy for 10-12 years
@@crashingatom6755it took GW the entire 9th ed to realise that abhore the witch lets other armies double dip vs GK . The entire 8th ed thry were a bottom tier army like the last one , and not only was this not fixed but GK were getting a nerf every FAQ, IA etc to a point where it became a meme. Also no other army gets as little model support as GK. In the time inquisition wasn't a playable army it got more new models , then GK. In 8th our "new" model was (according to GW) an NDK with arms and head swamped with voldus.
@@crashingatom6755on par with tau and blood angels isn't something to brag about. And yes whining usually gets developers to hear the problems out
2 cp for devastating wds in melee 😂 wtf gw
Grey knights and orks both suck in 10th