when it comes to the MOST THOROUGH review of a h-d your hands down the best ive seen. thank u for all the attention u give. your takin em to school in this game!
Matt you re video's were very helpful in my decision to buy a 2017 electra glide classic Itest rode road glide ultra and a limited the twin cooled bikes made a funny noise in the timing chain area maybe it was the water pump.Ialso did not like the fact that H-D did not put an oil cooler on twin cooled bikes.I am more concerned with a cool crank case not my legs being cooler.Besides I cant get any cooler.
I got the kit on my 2018 Road King. I had heard numerous bad things about this kit, but I love it. I did make sure to get it done before my 60 day grace period so it would fall under my warranty. Passing power is great. I also put the screaming eagle header, autotuner, and rims on it. It is a beast for sure. I was worried more about slow speed riding with this kit, but its all good too! Thanks Matt for all of the videos!!
Anthony Ellis hey man!I maybe upgrading my 2016 110 Slim S to a 2017 Road King S that has the Stage IV kit. Was wondering...does your bike shake at idle more than stock RKs? Comparing to my bike, that was one thing I notice and was wondering is that common cuz of the Stage IV upgrades added on. Appreciate your feedback! Big decision to make lol
My 2015 Harley-Davidson FLHP Road King Police too me is exactly like you commented on this Stage 4 Milwaukee Eight upgrade, well except the 130-140 mph top end. I do 80 mph at 3,000 rpm with plenty more on tap. I'm 67 now and have nothing to prove by speeding. I did that in my younger years. We called it cafe racing and riding my then new Triumph T140V Bonneville 750 and winning every road race for 10 consecutive years. I still have that Triumph but I do not ride her because she will never , ever, allow any motorcycle to put a wheel ahead of her! My FLHP is so comfortable and handles as well as my Triumph with the caveat that she is not 365 lbs but over 825 lbs. So no, she can't match the Triumph move for move but she is just as fast and has a higher top speed. Also my FLHP has one finger front brakes. I always ride with the other finger wrapped securely around the hand grip for better control under all conditions. You can't be bounced out of the saddle if you ride that way! Because your hand will never be pulled off the grip. That's a real safety tip. Again, one finger breaking and I am not even as strong as a husky 12 year old at this time of my life. Ha, the clutch pull is easy as well. You need to try my old Triumph's clutch. Men were men in those day's and I guarantee that after only 15 min. riding my Triumph for the first time you would come home and your left arm and wrist will be so tight it will be locked up for day's. Of course since I rode her every day for a decade even in the snow I did not notice that at all. Only once when I did not ride her for a few years and when I started riding again and then compared her to my new 1994 Harley-Davidson 883 Sportster Deluxe did I realize how hard the clutch pull is on my Triumph. As far as a speed wobble, no way does my 2015 FLHP have in her genetic make up anything that could lead to a speed wobble. I trust her completely with my life. If a modern Harley-Davidson wobbles it's all because the rider provided the wrong input and caused the wobble. Heck if you wanted to you could make any motorcycle on earth get into a speed wobble once you know what you are doing. Accordingly once you know, really know how to ride your new Harley-Davidson will never wobble. I guess that riding skill is the last thing that separates the men from the boy's. Everyone, I hope you have a wonderful riding season on your Harley-Davidson's, as they are they highest quality Motorycle's in the WORLD and if you wash them and clean them befor every ride they will look show room new for over 20 years. You have to see how poorly my 1976 (41 year old) Triumph has aged compared to my almost show room new looking (23 year old) Harley-Davidson 883 Sportster.
Colorado born and raised but I don’t just ride in seventy five degree weather. In Colorado I ride 365 days a year rain snow 30 degrees out but to end this my stage four kit will be installed starting the 28 of June can’t wait to rip the highway because I going to see what this has lots of open roads around here and going to get my money out of this softail breakout keep making those videos that what sold me on the stage four and the fact Harley sticks behind the motor for 2 years
Ok Matt, the stage 4 is nice, but why can't one order the upgrade straight from the factory. As it is now one has to pay for the original parts, which go into the dust bin, then pay the labor to have them removed, purchase the new kit, again pay the labor to have them installed. and dyno-tune the bike. The bike has to be field stripped, and rebuilt by local technicians with various backgrounds and experience levels so that quality assurance may suffer. The labor at the factory to install the upgraded parts should be about the same as the standard issue. Not having to pay for the additional labor and original parts should save a chunk of change. This should also decrease their exposure to warranty issues. Frankly, an engine of this size should come stock from the factory with the power and torque of the stage 4, so why detune the bike? One can order an automobile with the desired engine option. Harley needs to wake up on this issue as it has been a thorn in riders sides for many years.
Shenandoah: True, it would be nice and customer friendly to be able to purchase the 117ci from factory, but not being able too is by specific marketing design from HD. It's the same reason they put those rock hard grips on as stock and too many other items to mention. It's all about the after market sales. HD is already having to rethink revenue stream in the maintenance dept, and thus for the whole store, due to the better quality expected from the new 107! Less top end jobs and so forth and on and on....So, the after market is probably where they will try and make that up. To me, that means more, less comfortable and or practical odds and ends on a stock bike, so you are inclined to purchase the upgrades!!! I'm a proud Harley Owner and on my 4th bike, most recent being a 2017 Road glide Ultra. I traded my 2013 FLHX. I had so much Burst collection (everything they had) on my bike including LED's throughout, and lower fairings with speakers. When it was time to consider trade, they appraise your bike as a stock bike. That's just the way it is. Determined to not make that same mistake with the 2017, I've already felt like I had to get the Tour Pack detach kit ($569) and replace those extremely uncomfortable hand grips ($109) and only had the bike for two weeks. So, no I don't think marketing will change what is working very well for them, until we stop buying all the after market shit. LOL.
Cofoi, The question was addressed to Matt but it seems he only responds to what he perceives as positive comments. You are probably correct in that this is part of a marketing strategy, however, in the early years Harley was just trying to catch up with the "after market". This borders on the unethical when you build a product which is not your best, but can be markedly improved if you just buy these additional items. I can understand the personalized and bling items being extras, but not the engine and drive train, they should be an option from the factory. I have been told that Harley sells the upgrades as a dealer upgrade, because they are circumventing some of the Federal Government's certification rules, but I have no way of validating this. They were recently fined by the EPA for selling and installing non certified off-road parts for street use, so I am not sure how or if they sell the "Stages" without EPA approval.
I remember matt addressing this on one of his videos. Has to do with HD global compliance , emissions. Etc. I feel it though. I wish new HD would come out of the box with full exhaust
Shenandoah Hills Cofoi, The question was addressed to Matt but it seems he only responds to what he perceives as positive comments. Matt SHOULD RESPOND to ALL PEOPLES COMMENTS and CONCERNS ! NOT JUST the COMMENTS HE FEELS LIKE RESPONDING TO. This is FUCKING BULLSHIT
OMG. I had no intention of commenting on this video but the stuff people post make it impossible. I honestly don't know how Matt keeps doing videos knowing he's going to have to listen to what some people post. First of all somebody's complaining about the image of bikers and ,oh my God, riding on the sidewalk. Give me a break. He wasn't going fast or yelling at them to move. I don't see anything wrong with what he did and who gives a shit what some people think about bikers. Then there's those people concerned about miles per gallon. Do you really have to ask if it affects it? You're going to a bigger bore and increasing the size of the injectors what do you think? Is it going to turn into a Dodge Ram pickup truck and get 11 miles per gallon? No. Is it going to get the same 41? No. If you're so concerned with miles per gallon go get a scooter they get 80 to 100 and I can guarantee you that if u are someone focusing on miles per gallon this kit is not for you. Finally, the usual comment someone always has to make. Why do I have to pay for this, the bike is so expensive it should come with it. God I hate that one. The reason it doesn't come with it is because high-horsepower is not what everybody wants. To some, torque is more important. It all depends on how you ride. Who cares that it's a Touring bike, that has nothing to do with it? What does that mean, you shouldn't be able to get an increase in Horsepower over stock? I have a 2016 Road Glide Special, a touring bike. I never ride 2 up. I'm on the highway a lot and sometimes I like to ride aggressively. That does not apply to everyone. So they build the bike in such a way that it can appeal to many people and then each individual can customize it to their liking. All Matt's doing here is showing you one option. It's a horsepower kit. If that's not what you're looking for, don't buy it. Some people will like it. Just because it doesn't fit how you ride, doesn't mean it's not what someone else would want.
Richie sak NEVER SEEN so MANY FUCKING ASS-KISSERS on a SITE IN MY ENTIRE LIFE ! WHY DON'T YOU FUCKERS BEND OVER SO Matt CAN FUCK YOU GUYS IN THE ASS. Then SAY Matt, CAN I HAVE ANOTHER
What’s most important to my riding style, is having passing power when two-up in the saddle, out on a road trip, off the freeways, riding 500 miles a day, crossing mountain passes along the way. I’m not drag racing from sport bar to sport bar. Most Harley Road King, Street Glide, Road Glides have plenty of power with a tweek to exhaust and cam upgrades. Above finding addition power and torque, I love the sound the 2016 Twin Cam can bring versus the quieter M8. Both a great performing motors.
Just bought a 2017 Ultra Limited yesterday at Deluxe HD in Gillette Wy. Ordered the stage 4 kit, D & D Cat pipe. HD heavy breather. Should be riding it next week and will post a video. I also have a 2015 CVO streetglide with the 117 upgrade awesome power.
A great bike for our wide open Wyoming roads. I am 300lbs of muscle, the torque increase is what I am interested in; not bogging or hesitating going up the high pitch inclines (hills). If I ever have that much disposable income to spend on more power in my bike... maybe. Until then, I'll pack light and rely on the fact that my wife is a skinny little thing who doesn't add much weight. Thanks again for another great vid.
Matt, keep up the great work! Your videos are very informative and that you are an experienced rider, gives me a real perspective with all of your reviews.
Awesome videos as always Matt! Test rode the 107 and 114 yesterday on 3 different softails and man!, you are right the stock torque is mind blowing already! Great job and good advice about doing the mod within the first 60 days of new ownership. Please keep up the good work and ignore the haters and naysayers they just don't understand brother. Peace.
Matt. Awesome!!!!!!!!! I did the same to my Street Glide, but did the 117 with Vance and Hines power duals with Rhinehart high flow baffle exhaust. New flywheel. Removed as much weight as possible. I just completed the break in on a restrictive map. Its going on the dino this week with a new race map. All I can say it the bike is a fucking beast!!!!!!!!!!! I rule the road and choose where I want to be. Putting a chain drive on as well. Will be drag racing my bagger this summer at Rocky Mountain Raceway in Salt Lake City this summer. Will keep you posted on my times!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
james wilson. First of all there is always someone faster. Second, the rider has a lot to do with how fast you corner, accelerate and stop. Harley's aren't for everyone and if you want to ride a Triumph you a free to do so. Ride safe.
I almost bought a triumph thunderbird but the dealers are rare, and have several other brands to, i bought a road king, because there is a dealership 12 miles from me and about 6 dealerships within a hour or two, and they only specialize in hd, and they are fully staffed with very competent professional ppl, who are passionate about the brand, u gotta buy one to understand...
Awesome Matt. Cool video and answers a couple of questions I had about the Stage 4 for the M8. Having the upgrade installed inside of 60 days and getting the warranty makes this attractive proposition for sure.
Awesome screaming eagle upgrade 👍🏻 Sounds very nice when you got on it Matt. But I know what you mean by public roads and other people property.. Thanks for Video..
Brilliant!! I felt like I was on that Glide going down the highway. Incredible!. I may have to look into that kit when I get my Road King Special. Thanks again Matt. Great vlogs man keep them coming.
Thanks for showing, i sure didn't like the Milwaukee 8 when i seen and herd my first, because of this Video the new Harley is growing on me really fast. Again, Thank you!!!
My 2009 Low Rider has a crazy speed wobble around 80, and I've had the tire balanced, then lower bearings replaced, then tire replaced. neck was checked etc. Definitely looking to upgrade this fall to an M8 touring bike.
Actually, yes. I've got 16" Roland Sands King Apes on there. I tightened up the risers a bit, and it was better but still there at higher speeds. The problem these days, is after 20 years my wife is finally wanting to ride with me so a little more in the suspension department would be good, and I'd like a fairing and some cargo room. (I never could find bags that fit the low rider well, that I liked the looks of).
Good video Matt. The question I would like to ask I have a 2018 Fat Bob 114 motor and I'm getting the stage 4 Kit what will this do for the drivability of the bike. I will mainly be on the highway as I have 47 miles to get to work but I do like to drive it inside the neighborhood will bike suffer performance-wise doing this type of driving or is it mainly made for the highway use. Thanks luis
Great review as always Matt, you are right on point with everything that you touched on, I have 2015 street glide special and its been an awesome bike.
WOW!!!! Finally catching up to my old stock VTX 1800 I paid cash for less than eight grand. Maybe a few more versions, Harley bazzillion cost bikes might catch up to me. See you in my rear view.
I am a Harley guy through and through but ...... back in 2004 Kawasaki came out with a 2053cc Vulcan - 125 cu.in. 116 Hp, 141 ft lbs of torque. This bike seemed a bit larger than a Harley and really stretched your arms leaving you with a grin from ear to ear. I saw one last summer for sale at $6500 CDN. It would never replace my Harley but it is a blast to ride - If you have the nerve:)
Been hearing from many engine builders you can install stage 3 and have them CNC port your heads put screaming eagle injectors in with a power vision tune with D&D 2-1 and make better power.
After watching this video, I think my mind is finally made up as to what Harley model is right for me..the stage 4 included! Funny how this video made me see the light, when all the trips to my local dealer still left me in the dark! Thanks so much Matt... ride safe brother.
The Stage 4 kit with the Stage 3 Cam is the way to go as it makes mountains of torque in a lower rpm range. Also substituting an S&S or Fueling Cam Plate and Lifters will ensure engine longevity although you will lose the Factory warranty.
I love Harley. I'm on my 2nd Vrod now (2016 Muscle). With that being said, good God...the prices. Pay ~$25k for a new SG, then add another ~$5k for the Stage 3 kit (including labor) to obtain ~110rwhp. I just installed a Stage 1 on my Vrod a few weeks back. It took me about 1.5 hours. The bike put down 119rwhp. Between the bike and the parts, I'm at $18k. Anyways, those are some sweet bikes!
2017 ultra classic 1111 miles front rocker box oil leak can believe it not sure why so soon this is my second oil leak 275 miles rear rocker box oil leak !!! So I asked the dealership if they can check it's it's running to lean , I haven't changed anything on bike. I purchased the bike in August 1 2017 and also ordered they fan assisted oil cooler from Harley and having the dealership install this at the same time it's in the shop for this oil leaks hopeful this will help me out and be able to ride more with out oil leaks from California , Santa Clara area
Justin Dockery I have the 117 on my 2014 CVO Ultra. (NOT a Milwaukee 8) 118 HP & 122 ft pound of torque. I get anywhere between 35 & 42 mpg. (depending on highway or mountain riding......and how hard I ride the throttle) Even 2 up, she FLIES!!!
Hi Matt, quality informative real world review as always. Really tempted. I note on the Dyno graphs with the expected power gain they state "High flow exhaust system". Did you still get that horsepower gain using just the slip on Screaming Eagles you mentioned?
You're right, I overlooked that. We do not have the Highflow full exhaust system on there. We didn't do our own Dyno on it so I don't know how our numbers compared to H-D's published numbers. The exhaust system I'm sure helps but I'm sure the numbers are only marginally less with out that system installed.
Matt, why did the MOCO do away with the Stage V? I could've sworn that when the M8 was launched there was a Stage V option? I could be wrong about that...
I have a 2020 Slim, at Stage 2, considering in a year or so going up to Stage 4, I have the extended service Screaming Eagle. Living out in West Texas I can open it up a bit and fully appreciate going up to Stage 2 and eventually to 4. Though I am thinking going from 107 to 114 or 128.
Run your new stock ride till it needs a rebuild or at least till your outta warranty. Then do this build with a kit from Fuel Moto, or S&S. As much as I love horse power, me ,personally, I have a hard time tearing into something new.
What will this be like compared to the 103, Matt? Practically speaking, are you able to spin the tiers just by taking off? Is it too overwhelming? I'm considering this when they move it the Dyna in the coming years. Thanks!
I love the layout of the big twin Harley's(i.e. seperated engine / transmission). I however can't seem to understand what dealers talk about when they say the big twins have "way more power making potential" (the transmissions are definitely way nicer than the sportster setup). The big twin bikes definitely ride more comfortable I have seen people making ridiculously good numbers with 1200/1250 setup sportsters (well over 100hp - some over 120hp). A bike that weighs (in a worst case scenario) 100 lbs less or so than a dyna and makes as much power tuned (most of the twin cams i have seen dyno'd struggled to break over 105hp or so - even after 110+ci upgrades). I am on the fence of upgrading my iron further or just trading in on a new Dyna. I love the more refined feel of the Dyna, but it definetely does not feel faster to me (more TQ for sure - but thats dampened by the fact that the Dyna is a heavier bike). What are your thoughts/recommendations ? I guess I am just looking for that final nail to seal the deal on me buying a new Dyna but I can't rationalize me taking on another loan (especially when my bike is paid off).
Joeseph Wolfe To me there is A LOT MORE than just the horse power on a Dyno chart. Power is Important but ride quality and equipment is just, if not more, important. Power is no good unless your enjoying the ride quality and ergonomics of that ride. I'd take a less powerful touring bike over a 120 HP sportster any day.
joeseph trade up if you want a stable ride the best Dyna is the fat bob. It is heavier than the street bob wider front end wider tires/wheels best of all dual disc brakes.all big twins are much better than sportsters besides sportster riders are always teased a.e. girls bike or half a bike.Personally i dont care what others ride .If you can i would get a MIL 8 street glide or road glide I love my 17' Electra Glide and the 2011 FatBob I bought used and gave to my brother.The only strings I attached is I can ride my brother,s bike anytime I dig my MILWAUKEE 8 so much i hardly ever ride my bro's bike these day,s
riding a "fast harley" is like riding in a "fast diesel truck" the torque feels great and something that Heavy and large gives you the sensation of "fast". and that is worth every penny to those folk's. but just don't mess up and get beside an actual fast bike like ducati, vmax any sport bike really. it kinda puts things into perspective. but to each his own. like he said, riding the bike YOU love and adding real power is always a blast! to each his own. just stay in the wind brothers! peace.
True the word fast is relative. If a Ducati wasn't faster than a Harley with it's water cooling, lighter weight, no radio, no storage, smaller gas tank, Build for Moto GP style racing etc etc then that would be pathetic. Definitely not a "fast Diesel truck" though. This thing is still very fast even when compared to most all motorcycles. Of course an over-square 1000cc++ water cooled bike that weighs 450 pounds is going to beat it. I would hope so.
Hey Matt, Great review. I bought a 2017 Road Glide Ultra in June and I'm trying to make up my mind between doing the Stage 3 and Stage 4 upgrades. What's your perspective?
Anthony Cuomo NOT TRUE, I OWN ONE ! They are FUCKING OVERPRICED , that's WHY the YOUNG GUYS TODAY CAN'T AFFORD to BUY ONE ;( ALSO WHY HARLEY is STRUGGLING WITH SALES and GOING DOWN the TOILET
See how you ease next to a lot of cars before you pass to check they won't make surprise lane change. And like the comparison to others on sport bike then you being in a recliner. Any thoughts on fairings or windshields ... or is street glide or is road glide fairing size sort of a minimum for you on longer highway stretches ?
AWESOME VID MATT!! I'm droolin. But how do u riders cope with the terrible LA traffic down there?? I have some friends there that say it's pretty awful & getting worse. Add to that I saw a news report recently that stated that LA had the worst traffic in the country. So how do u guys cope, especially on a bagger???
thinking of doing these stage 4 upgrade on my 217 Street Glide and put in 14 inch handlebars what do you think of the hand of us stay with stocks appreciate your comment Matt thank you
Just brought home my new (20 mi) 18 RGS (blacked out) w/ the 114. Comin off my traded 16 FXDLS w/ the 110. It will be interesting to see any noticeable power difference keeping in mind the weight difference between the 2 rides. Thanks for the vid👌
Matt, great video! I have the 2014 CVO limited with the 110 upgraded to the 117 kit. How do you compare this engine to the milwaukee 8 stage 4 kit in this video?
Matt excellent video, hmm maybe I'll get the kit in a few yrs, looks cool, but the stock 107 is already amazingly powerful, ive recently bought Rinehart's slip on's, they sound so cool!
I bought a 2017 Road King and contemplated the upgrade while it was under warranty, but decided it had enough power for me. Now I keep thinking about it and was wondering what the upgrade would do to the life of the engine. Do you think the upgrade will cause the motor to wear out faster, or do you think it's not a significant difference.
+aytes44 a lot of that question comes down to how you ride it. I think people who do engine work want to squeeze everything out of their engine and ride it harder. The HD Kits are very good (reliable) kits. I do however think the stock engine untouched will be a little more reliable in the long term. The HD kits are a heck of a lot more reliable then taking it to the local “speed shop”.
Hey Matt, Thanks for the video. I’ve been thinking of picking up a knew street glide and wanted to do the stage three or four kit but haven’t been able to decide what is going to be better for two up, Lower end torque. Can you suggest a cam that would give either of these kits better Lower end torque for 2000 - 4500 rpms and would you suggest changing out the stock cam plate-oil pump with the billet cam plate-high volume oil pump? Great job with the infovids.
I have been trolling videos with dyno results on all the upgrades, and to me it appears the 107 to 114 upgrade is a waste unless you go with the CNC heads. Stage 2 torque cam with labor is about $900.00, gives you 98 HP, and 107 F lb torque. Stage 3 is $1600.00 just for the kit, no clue but guess at least $1000.00 labor, for 100.9HP, and 107.56 F lb torque. Stage 4 to 117 is $2600.00 just for the kit, not sure if you can even get there starting with a 107, but on the dyno that takes you to 112HP, and 118Flb torque. Looks to me like stage 2 should be plenty of bang for the buck without breaking the bank, any more than that your probably just making up for something your lacking somewhere else.
Hi Matt, thanks for the video, I'm just about to have the HD Stage IV installed but the dealer mentioned cam options, a higher Torque or more HP cam, can you please outline the difference a rider would experience.
The torque is going to be more of that low end (RPM) pulling power. The horse power cam is going to continue increasing in power further along in the higher RPM. What’s your riding preference? Twisting the throttle hard and heavy or immediate low end grunt
Hi Matt, sincerely appreciate your reply, awesome. I dont ride at high RPM but I do like the acceleration from the getgo, so torque at the lower end would be my preference as I cruise around 80MPH in Europe with occasional higher speeds, not sustained for any length of time. I currently have a stage IV on a Heritage with 259e cams and I find they are brilliant at the higher revs but the bike runs very clunky at low city traffic speed, I have to drop to 2nd gear to avoid this at say 25-30mph! My new bike is a 2017 Ultra Limited where I am doing the upgrades.
Just knowing I can accelerate out of a situation is what I like the most, the power is there when required and that initself is my fun in riding, more like having an insurance policy that always kicks in when you want it to pay out!
I should add finally, I am adding the V&H power duals with high output slip-ons, screaming eagle air filter and adding the Power Vision tuner on a Dyno with professional HD technicians.
Great video. I rode a 17 SG. The ergonomics are good, but not enough for me to change from my Heritage. Heritage is the only HD I've ridden that I call perfect ergonomics. I sold a EG Classic Ultra and bought the Heritage. Huge improvement in rider seating position. I'll be getting a new M8 Heritage Stage 4 later this year. I'm sure you've sat on a Heritage before. I'd like to hear what you think about the seating position after you refresh your memory. Thanks for the video.
I've had three harleys.My last one was a 2014 Road Glide.Rode it home(about 500 miles)...sold it the next day.Their claim was...'gobs of torque for those 'higher speed passes' and such.For one,it apparently had some sort of limiter.And also,dangerously,trying to downshift to pass and get that 'increased torque' going,it would limit.Just when I needed it to push.Naturally,shifting back up wide open to TRY and get it to get around a vehicle,it no longer had the torque to really pull.Dangerous.I almost got hit head-on ...and this was starting at 70 mph downshift and pass(shifting up halfway through).It also had the famous Harley wobble at about 105 mph...i got it to 110 mph max...that's all she had.Very disappointed. You mention 'beast' and 'going fast'. I ride a zx14R(2013) and an H2(2015).THESE are beasts.These are fast.No worries about..'will I run out of pull'.Those Harleys are quite pretty though.I hope this new motor REALLY comes through as it should...very nice.That kit sounds very nice as well....;) I was watching your video there..yep,you should've taken er all the way up.That's what I'd like to see..the top end and performance PLUS the torque of higher speed downshifts and upshifts.
If you almost got hit you misjudged the speed and or distance of the oncoming vehicle, thats called rider error and that carries over, no matter what bike you ride or how fast the bike is. Please change your attitude before you become a statistic. Ride safe.
great article Matt but unfortunately you left out some very valuable information and that is all the problems and or issues they're having with the Milwaukee 8 when the stage 4 kit is installed, which is the oil pump is not working correctly, my good buddy Dan just took his new 2017 road glide in for the 4th time and this is his 2nd motor first one seized up so bad they couldn't even pull the heads off and yes he is taking it to a harley dealer so yes a certified tech is doing and did all the work to his bike, now the manufacture knows about this issue cuz he's on his 3rd oil pump in an attempt to correct the issue but it did not fix the issue because its back in the shop again, the techs call this issue oil sumping - where the oil doesn't flow right thru the motor, no I'm not a tech nor mechanic, I also know a few other guys that are having the same issue with their new bikes as well so my suggestion to future buyers hold off on the stage 4 til they fix this issue
Yea. We have seen a couple with oil sumping issues. More than 90% of the people that have bought these kits absolutely love them though. They have changed the oil pump at this point.
Matt....love all of your videos...I have stage 3....and noticed that I lost some fuel range. What does stage 4 do to the fuel range? Can you still go 250 miles between fuel stops if you drive easy?
It bumps the compression ratio so you might gain a little fuel mileage if you stay out of the power, but why would do a stage 4 and stay out of the power?
I love the way the Simpson helmet looks but I've heard so many negative reviews. Complaints about wind noise among others so it's kind of turned me away from it. What are your thoughts?
justnmegs I really like mine. There are helmets that have better wind cancellation but the wind noise isn't bad. The styling is extremely good. I don't think there is a better looking helmet out there. There isn't great ventilation. It's DOT AND SNELL approved which is nice. It's a good helmet. I like mine.
Great blog for the shop. I'd pay the extra , for either shop here in Tucson AZ to rebuild it for me. Good Mechanics and Techs. Or Bobby over in Yuma. I was waiting to see what a Stage IV turned out to be. I still haven't ridden any of the M8s. The TC Engine runs hot out here.
Very few people if any need a upgrade to a M8 engine/motor. If you have extra money laying around do it. Before my 2017 street glide I had a road king with a 96ci twin cam with gear cams. That 96ci was a good motor and put 79k miles on it with no motor work other than the gear cam kit and still sold the bike. You don’t need a big ass motor to get it in and have fun.
Hi Matt, quick question... I just bought a 2018 Roadking and was going for a stage IV upgrade. Do I need to run in the engine before doing the upgrade? Also what about post the upgrade, does it need to be run in?
You don’t need to run the engine before the upgrade. A lot of our customers do it before they have more than 100 miles on the bike. There is however a break in method that you should definitely adhere to once the kit is installed for the first 500 miles.
I have a 2018 Heritage classic 107" with stage 4 . i bought this bike at 655 miles with the stage 4 already on it.. this motor is not impressing me as it should. it doesn't run that strong. it feels tight as i get to the 3000 rpms and up .. has a vibration thru the mirrors at about 2500 rpms and up.. it just doesn't let loose like the 17 107" road king special i rode .. this bike has a lot of pep runs great.. Also i just bought a 14 road king FLHR with the 103" hight output motor.. it also runs stronger than the heritage with quicker throttle response... how can i remedy the Heritage M8 engine response problem? Different cams? this bike was dyno tuned with upgraded air breather and Bassani 2 to 1 exhaust..
Sounds like you’re running the bike at too low of an RPM and also you might be losing low end torque to bad tuning or improper back pressure. Something I always warn against with the M8 engine when you’re going to a full exhaust system.
@@MattLaidlaw It came with screamin' eagle cannons mufflers, sounded crappy. i installed RCX 3" mufflers 2" baffles better sound and ran some better. idle about 840 rpms , idled fine, smooth. acceleration not that impressive or smooth. it was mapped for stage 4, dyno tuned with this setup. 102.80 hp/113.25 torque.. had Bassani 2 to 1 long exhaust installed and screamin' eagle breather that looks like the 114' breather. helped with performance some. after tune it idles about 950 rpms. Is decel pop normal after tuning? it didn't do it before the tune.. also are the 515 cams that come with the stage 4 any good for lower rpms. i want cams that make this bike run great at low to about midrange rpms, say up to about 4000 or so. Or could something else be causing the engine not be as strong as it should . By the way really like your videos ..
Matt, you explain things so well and inform your video viewers with the information they have been searching for. Keep these well informed videos coming. Thanks again.
I see they offer a 117 cu in for the CVO Street Glide, but if you do the 114 cu in conversion on a Street Glide Special, can you do the 117 after or are you stuck with just the 114 option ?
Once again, you have done it again. Great video. Thank you for all that you do for us here in UA-cam land. I am looking to pick up a Road Glide Ultra some time before Christmas. What would I be looking at out the door with that upgrade, ball park figure?
when it comes to the MOST THOROUGH review of a h-d your hands down the best ive seen. thank u for all the attention u give. your takin em to school in this game!
Jason Harden Thank you! Thanks for the good word. Enjoy the ride.
Matt you re video's were very helpful in my decision to buy a 2017 electra glide classic Itest rode road glide ultra and a limited the twin cooled bikes made a funny noise in the timing chain area maybe it was the water pump.Ialso did not like the fact that H-D did not put an oil cooler on twin cooled bikes.I am more concerned with a cool crank case not my legs being cooler.Besides I cant get any cooler.
I got the kit on my 2018 Road King. I had heard numerous bad things about this kit, but I love it. I did make sure to get it done before my 60 day grace period so it would fall under my warranty. Passing power is great. I also put the screaming eagle header, autotuner, and rims on it. It is a beast for sure. I was worried more about slow speed riding with this kit, but its all good too! Thanks Matt for all of the videos!!
Anthony Ellis hey man!I maybe upgrading my 2016 110 Slim S to a 2017 Road King S that has the Stage IV kit. Was wondering...does your bike shake at idle more than stock RKs? Comparing to my bike, that was one thing I notice and was wondering is that common cuz of the Stage IV upgrades added on. Appreciate your feedback! Big decision to make lol
My 2015 Harley-Davidson FLHP Road King Police too me is exactly like you commented on this Stage 4 Milwaukee Eight upgrade, well except the 130-140 mph top end. I do 80 mph at 3,000 rpm with plenty more on tap.
I'm 67 now and have nothing to prove by speeding. I did that in my younger years. We called it cafe racing and riding my then new Triumph T140V Bonneville 750 and winning every road race for 10 consecutive years. I still have that Triumph but I do not ride her because she will never , ever, allow any motorcycle to put a wheel ahead of her!
My FLHP is so comfortable and handles as well as my Triumph with the caveat that she is not 365 lbs but over 825 lbs. So no, she can't match the Triumph move for move but she is just as fast and has a higher top speed. Also my FLHP has one finger front brakes. I always ride with the other finger wrapped securely around the hand grip for better control under all conditions. You can't be bounced out of the saddle if you ride that way! Because your hand will never be pulled off the grip. That's a real safety tip. Again, one finger breaking and I am not even as strong as a husky 12 year old at this time of my life. Ha, the clutch pull is easy as well. You need to try my old Triumph's clutch. Men were men in those day's and I guarantee that after only 15 min. riding my Triumph for the first time you would come home and your left arm and wrist will be so tight it will be locked up for day's. Of course since I rode her every day for a decade even in the snow I did not notice that at all. Only once when I did not ride her for a few years and when I started riding again and then compared her to my new 1994 Harley-Davidson 883 Sportster Deluxe did I realize how hard the clutch pull is on my Triumph.
As far as a speed wobble, no way does my 2015 FLHP have in her genetic make up anything that could lead to a speed wobble. I trust her completely with my life. If a modern Harley-Davidson wobbles it's all because the rider provided the wrong input and caused the wobble. Heck if you wanted to you could make any motorcycle on earth get into a speed wobble once you know what you are doing. Accordingly once you know, really know how to ride your new Harley-Davidson will never wobble. I guess that riding skill is the last thing that separates the men from the boy's.
Everyone, I hope you have a wonderful riding season on your Harley-Davidson's, as they are they highest quality Motorycle's in the WORLD and if you wash them and clean them befor every ride they will look show room new for over 20 years. You have to see how poorly my 1976 (41 year old) Triumph has aged compared to my almost show room new looking (23 year old) Harley-Davidson 883 Sportster.
Colorado born and raised but I don’t just ride in seventy five degree weather. In Colorado I ride 365 days a year rain snow 30 degrees out but to end this my stage four kit will be installed starting the 28 of June can’t wait to rip the highway because I going to see what this has lots of open roads around here and going to get my money out of this softail breakout keep making those videos that what sold me on the stage four and the fact Harley sticks behind the motor for 2 years
i LOVE that the rpm gauge is just chillen Matt! it sat so clean when you were pulling ever so gently! Still a savage beast!
Bought the stage IV for my 2018 RK Standard this week. Install happens next week! Really looking forward to it!!
How is it, I'm getting it next week, was it worth it
Ok Matt, the stage 4 is nice, but why can't one order the upgrade straight from the factory. As it is now one has to pay for the original parts, which go into the dust bin, then pay the labor to have them removed, purchase the new kit, again pay the labor to have them installed. and dyno-tune the bike.
The bike has to be field stripped, and rebuilt by local technicians with various backgrounds and experience levels so that quality assurance may suffer.
The labor at the factory to install the upgraded parts should be about the same as the standard issue. Not having to pay for the additional labor and original parts should save a chunk of change. This should also decrease their exposure to warranty issues.
Frankly, an engine of this size should come stock from the factory with the power and torque of the stage 4, so why detune the bike? One can order an automobile with the desired engine option.
Harley needs to wake up on this issue as it has been a thorn in riders sides for many years.
Shenandoah: True, it would be nice and customer friendly to be able to purchase the 117ci from factory, but not being able too is by specific marketing design from HD. It's the same reason they put those rock hard grips on as stock and too many other items to mention. It's all about the after market sales. HD is already having to rethink revenue stream in the maintenance dept, and thus for the whole store, due to the better quality expected from the new 107! Less top end jobs and so forth and on and on....So, the after market is probably where they will try and make that up. To me, that means more, less comfortable and or practical odds and ends on a stock bike, so you are inclined to purchase the upgrades!!! I'm a proud Harley Owner and on my 4th bike, most recent being a 2017 Road glide Ultra. I traded my 2013 FLHX. I had so much Burst collection (everything they had) on my bike including LED's throughout, and lower fairings with speakers. When it was time to consider trade, they appraise your bike as a stock bike. That's just the way it is. Determined to not make that same mistake with the 2017, I've already felt like I had to get the Tour Pack detach kit ($569) and replace those extremely uncomfortable hand grips ($109) and only had the bike for two weeks. So, no I don't think marketing will change what is working very well for them, until we stop buying all the after market shit. LOL.
Cofoi, The question was addressed to Matt but it seems he only responds to what he perceives as positive comments.
You are probably correct in that this is part of a marketing strategy, however, in the early years Harley was just trying to catch up with the "after market". This borders on the unethical when you build a product which is not your best, but can be markedly improved if you just buy these additional items. I can understand the personalized and bling items being extras, but not the engine and drive train, they should be an option from the factory.
I have been told that Harley sells the upgrades as a dealer upgrade, because they are circumventing some of the Federal Government's certification rules, but I have no way of validating this. They were recently fined by the EPA for selling and installing non certified off-road parts for street use, so I am not sure how or if they sell the "Stages" without EPA approval.
Shenandoah Hills
I might be wrong but I thought harley does that and give the bike a CVO designation. Again I could be wrong.
I remember matt addressing this on one of his videos. Has to do with HD global compliance , emissions. Etc. I feel it though. I wish new HD would come out of the box with full exhaust
Shenandoah Hills
Cofoi, The question was addressed to Matt but it seems he only responds to what he perceives as positive comments. Matt SHOULD RESPOND to ALL PEOPLES COMMENTS and CONCERNS ! NOT JUST the COMMENTS HE FEELS LIKE RESPONDING TO. This is FUCKING BULLSHIT
This video just pumps me up for what I can do to my new '17 Road King with this engine. Great video. Thanks Matt!
OMG. I had no intention of commenting on this video but the stuff people post make it impossible. I honestly don't know how Matt keeps doing videos knowing he's going to have to listen to what some people post. First of all somebody's complaining about the image of bikers and ,oh my God, riding on the sidewalk. Give me a break. He wasn't going fast or yelling at them to move. I don't see anything wrong with what he did and who gives a shit what some people think about bikers. Then there's those people concerned about miles per gallon. Do you really have to ask if it affects it? You're going to a bigger bore and increasing the size of the injectors what do you think? Is it going to turn into a Dodge Ram pickup truck and get 11 miles per gallon? No. Is it going to get the same 41? No. If you're so concerned with miles per gallon go get a scooter they get 80 to 100 and I can guarantee you that if u are someone focusing on miles per gallon this kit is not for you. Finally, the usual comment someone always has to make. Why do I have to pay for this, the bike is so expensive it should come with it. God I hate that one. The reason it doesn't come with it is because high-horsepower is not what everybody wants. To some, torque is more important. It all depends on how you ride. Who cares that it's a Touring bike, that has nothing to do with it? What does that mean, you shouldn't be able to get an increase in Horsepower over stock? I have a 2016 Road Glide Special, a touring bike. I never ride 2 up. I'm on the highway a lot and sometimes I like to ride aggressively. That does not apply to everyone. So they build the bike in such a way that it can appeal to many people and then each individual can customize it to their liking. All Matt's doing here is showing you one option. It's a horsepower kit. If that's not what you're looking for, don't buy it. Some people will like it. Just because it doesn't fit how you ride, doesn't mean it's not what someone else would want.
Very well said, you saved me from having to do this! Chest Pump.
Damn right. Why it even has to be said is the part I don't understand.
@@Steelviper61 FUCK OFF ASS-KISSER
@Joseph Marton FUCK OFF ASS-KISSER
Richie sak
NEVER SEEN so MANY FUCKING ASS-KISSERS on a SITE IN MY ENTIRE LIFE ! WHY DON'T YOU FUCKERS BEND OVER SO Matt CAN FUCK YOU GUYS IN THE ASS. Then SAY Matt, CAN I HAVE ANOTHER
What’s most important to my riding style, is having passing power when two-up in the saddle, out on a road trip, off the freeways, riding 500 miles a day, crossing mountain passes along the way. I’m not drag racing from sport bar to sport bar. Most Harley Road King, Street Glide, Road Glides have plenty of power with a tweek to exhaust and cam upgrades. Above finding addition power and torque, I love the sound the 2016 Twin Cam can bring versus the quieter M8. Both a great performing motors.
Just bought a 2017 Ultra Limited yesterday at Deluxe HD in Gillette Wy. Ordered the stage 4 kit, D & D Cat pipe. HD heavy breather. Should be riding it next week and will post a video. I also have a 2015 CVO streetglide with the 117 upgrade awesome power.
gary Last very nice man. Congrats. Enjoy.
A great bike for our wide open Wyoming roads. I am 300lbs of muscle, the torque increase is what I am interested in; not bogging or hesitating going up the high pitch inclines (hills). If I ever have that much disposable income to spend on more power in my bike... maybe. Until then, I'll pack light and rely on the fact that my wife is a skinny little thing who doesn't add much weight. Thanks again for another great vid.
Matt, keep up the great work! Your videos are very informative and that you are an experienced rider, gives me a real perspective with all of your reviews.
Awesome videos as always Matt! Test rode the 107 and 114 yesterday on 3 different softails and man!, you are right the stock torque is mind blowing already! Great job and good advice about doing the mod within the first 60 days of new ownership. Please keep up the good work and ignore the haters and naysayers they just don't understand brother. Peace.
+Joseph Smith thanks brother. I appreciate the positivity.
Matt. Awesome!!!!!!!!! I did the same to my Street Glide, but did the 117 with Vance and Hines power duals with Rhinehart high flow baffle exhaust. New flywheel. Removed as much weight as possible. I just completed the break in on a restrictive map. Its going on the dino this week with a new race map. All I can say it the bike is a fucking beast!!!!!!!!!!! I rule the road and choose where I want to be. Putting a chain drive on as well. Will be drag racing my bagger this summer at Rocky Mountain Raceway in Salt Lake City this summer. Will keep you posted on my times!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Jason Hodge awesome! Yes, keep me posted !
You may rule the road in the Harley world but in the world of Truimph Rocket's you would be sadly disappointed in a race.
I am also a very good looking man
james wilson. First of all there is always someone faster. Second, the rider has a lot to do with how fast you corner, accelerate and stop. Harley's aren't for everyone and if you want to ride a Triumph you a free to do so. Ride safe.
Harleys bring up the rear, like the street cleaners after the horses in the parade.
Riding on the roads in the county, my old evo goes as fast as I need. She never breaks down
either.
Karl C 🤘
127 cid Evo! All the power I need!! 🤙
Great job Karl. Tomorrow you will graduate to finger painting.
I almost bought a triumph thunderbird but the dealers are rare, and have several other brands to, i bought a road king, because there is a dealership 12 miles from me and about 6 dealerships within a hour or two, and they only specialize in hd, and they are fully staffed with very competent professional ppl, who are passionate about the brand, u gotta buy one to understand...
Awesome Matt. Cool video and answers a couple of questions I had about the Stage 4 for the M8. Having the upgrade installed inside of 60 days and getting the warranty makes this attractive proposition for sure.
K Porter glad I could help.
Awesome screaming eagle upgrade 👍🏻 Sounds very nice when you got on it Matt. But I know what you mean by public roads and other people property.. Thanks for Video..
Brilliant!! I felt like I was on that Glide going down the highway. Incredible!. I may have to look into that kit when I get my Road King Special. Thanks again Matt. Great vlogs man keep them coming.
Clint Young thanks man
Thanks for showing, i sure didn't like the Milwaukee 8 when i seen and herd my first, because of this Video the new Harley is growing on me really fast.
Again, Thank you!!!
I'm Bryan's buddy! He's been telling me all about this!!! Hopefully I could get approved!!
My 2009 Low Rider has a crazy speed wobble around 80, and I've had the tire balanced, then lower bearings replaced, then tire replaced. neck was checked etc. Definitely looking to upgrade this fall to an M8 touring bike.
Wierd, did you do custom wheels or bars?
Actually, yes. I've got 16" Roland Sands King Apes on there. I tightened up the risers a bit, and it was better but still there at higher speeds. The problem these days, is after 20 years my wife is finally wanting to ride with me so a little more in the suspension department would be good, and I'd like a fairing and some cargo room. (I never could find bags that fit the low rider well, that I liked the looks of).
To help support Matt in the creation of good content you can find him on Patreon. I included a link below.
www.patreon.com/mattlaidlaw
Good video Matt. The question I would like to ask I have a 2018 Fat Bob 114 motor and I'm getting the stage 4 Kit what will this do for the drivability of the bike. I will mainly be on the highway as I have 47 miles to get to work but I do like to drive it inside the neighborhood will bike suffer performance-wise doing this type of driving or is it mainly made for the highway use. Thanks luis
Great review as always Matt, you are right on point with everything that you touched on, I have 2015 street glide special and its been an awesome bike.
WOW!!!! Finally catching up to my old stock VTX 1800 I paid cash for less than eight grand. Maybe a few more versions, Harley bazzillion cost bikes might catch up to me. See you in my rear view.
I'll wave at you when I'm passing Aldi's
I am a Harley guy through and through but ...... back in 2004 Kawasaki came out with a 2053cc Vulcan - 125 cu.in. 116 Hp, 141 ft lbs of torque. This bike seemed a bit larger than a Harley and really stretched your arms leaving you with a grin from ear to ear. I saw one last summer for sale at $6500 CDN. It would never replace my Harley but it is a blast to ride - If you have the nerve:)
Been hearing from many engine builders you can install stage 3 and have them CNC port your heads put screaming eagle injectors in with a power vision tune with D&D 2-1 and make better power.
Excellent video and review like always Matt....👍🏽👍🏽 can't wait to put this on a 17 road king.
Harley-Davidson riders always have the best gear
After watching this video, I think my mind is finally made up as to what Harley model is right for me..the stage 4 included!
Funny how this video made me see the light, when all the trips to my local dealer still left me in the dark! Thanks so much Matt... ride safe brother.
Great video. I liked the riding on the public sidewalk part!😃 Sold!
I loved my road king classic and wish they still sold them in the states.. got my sights on a new ultra ...
nice bikes really liked the all blacked out one.
The Stage 4 kit with the Stage 3 Cam is the way to go as it makes mountains of torque in a lower rpm range. Also substituting an S&S or Fueling Cam Plate and Lifters will ensure engine longevity although you will lose the Factory warranty.
I love Harley. I'm on my 2nd Vrod now (2016 Muscle). With that being said, good God...the prices. Pay ~$25k for a new SG, then add another ~$5k for the Stage 3 kit (including labor) to obtain ~110rwhp. I just installed a Stage 1 on my Vrod a few weeks back. It took me about 1.5 hours. The bike put down 119rwhp. Between the bike and the parts, I'm at $18k. Anyways, those are some sweet bikes!
119 that's it? laughable. HD can't get out of their own way. sorry ass bikes.
Love the blacked out bike. Looks like it was a fun ride!
2017 ultra classic 1111 miles front rocker box oil leak can believe it not sure why so soon this is my second oil leak 275 miles rear rocker box oil leak !!! So I asked the dealership if they can check it's it's running to lean , I haven't changed anything on bike. I purchased the bike in August 1 2017 and also ordered they fan assisted oil cooler from Harley and having the dealership install this at the same time it's in the shop for this oil leaks hopeful this will help me out and be able to ride more with out oil leaks from California , Santa Clara area
I love that build👌 Keep up the good work, Matt. Great vids
Sounds Beautiful...I want one....
Matt, you forgot to mention that the stage 4 kit or any kit requires a fuel map from HD designed for the increased displacement.
Another great video Matt, keep it up.
How does the fuel consumption change with this kit? I am doing the same kit for my 103.
Justin, I agree, doesn't make much sense if it only gets 20 MPG.
Justin Dockery
I have the 117 on my 2014
CVO Ultra. (NOT a Milwaukee 8) 118 HP & 122 ft pound of torque.
I get anywhere between 35 & 42 mpg. (depending on highway or mountain riding......and how hard I ride the throttle) Even 2 up, she FLIES!!!
there is always less fuel mileage when you add more power if you want to save on fuel get a vespa or a grom
Luther Khachigian II my 120R rebuilt by TMan Performance gets about the same mpg and has 130hp @ 3000 rpm and 145tq @ 4000 rpm.
Hi Matt, quality informative real world review as always. Really tempted. I note on the Dyno graphs with the expected power gain they state "High flow exhaust system". Did you still get that horsepower gain using just the slip on Screaming Eagles you mentioned?
You're right, I overlooked that. We do not have the Highflow full exhaust system on there. We didn't do our own Dyno on it so I don't know how our numbers compared to H-D's published numbers. The exhaust system I'm sure helps but I'm sure the numbers are only marginally less with out that system installed.
Hi Matt , thanks for prompt reply. Cool, it's good to know it works that well with just the slip ons.
Matt, why did the MOCO do away with the Stage V? I could've sworn that when the M8 was launched there was a Stage V option? I could be wrong about that...
Thanks Matt for the excellent videos - keep them coming!
I have a 2020 Slim, at Stage 2, considering in a year or so going up to Stage 4, I have the extended service Screaming Eagle. Living out in West Texas I can open it up a bit and fully appreciate going up to Stage 2 and eventually to 4. Though I am thinking going from 107 to 114 or 128.
Go for it man. 👍🏼
Nice review. As for the street riding it's impossible to tell anything. I'm sure you could feel it though.
Super nice kit!
Keep the great videos coming!
Thanks Matt!
Run your new stock ride till it needs a rebuild or at least till your outta warranty. Then do this build with a kit from Fuel Moto, or S&S. As much as I love horse power, me ,personally, I have a hard time tearing into something new.
Amazing stuff !
What will this be like compared to the 103, Matt? Practically speaking, are you able to spin the tiers just by taking off? Is it too overwhelming? I'm considering this when they move it the Dyna in the coming years. Thanks!
I love the layout of the big twin Harley's(i.e. seperated engine / transmission). I however can't seem to understand what dealers talk about when they say the big twins have "way more power making potential" (the transmissions are definitely way nicer than the sportster setup). The big twin bikes definitely ride more comfortable I have seen people making ridiculously good numbers with 1200/1250 setup sportsters (well over 100hp - some over 120hp). A bike that weighs (in a worst case scenario) 100 lbs less or so than a dyna and makes as much power tuned (most of the twin cams i have seen dyno'd struggled to break over 105hp or so - even after 110+ci upgrades). I am on the fence of upgrading my iron further or just trading in on a new Dyna. I love the more refined feel of the Dyna, but it definetely does not feel faster to me (more TQ for sure - but thats dampened by the fact that the Dyna is a heavier bike). What are your thoughts/recommendations ? I guess I am just looking for that final nail to seal the deal on me buying a new Dyna but I can't rationalize me taking on another loan (especially when my bike is paid off).
Joeseph Wolfe To me there is A LOT MORE than just the horse power on a Dyno chart. Power is Important but ride quality and equipment is just, if not more, important. Power is no good unless your enjoying the ride quality and ergonomics of that ride. I'd take a less powerful touring bike over a 120 HP sportster any day.
I agree. I am going to see what moving to street bob looks like on paper and just take it from there.
joeseph trade up if you want a stable ride the best Dyna is the fat bob. It is heavier than the street bob wider front end wider tires/wheels best of all dual disc brakes.all big twins are much better than sportsters besides sportster riders are always teased a.e. girls bike or half a bike.Personally i dont care what others ride .If you can i would get a MIL 8 street glide or road glide I love my 17' Electra Glide and the 2011 FatBob I bought used and gave to my brother.The only strings I attached is I can ride my brother,s bike anytime I dig my MILWAUKEE 8 so much i hardly ever ride my bro's bike these day,s
HD get you every step off the way,will never change $$$$$
Nice! and thats from an old flat tracker, limey bikes and rice burners.
So cool just ordered one for my Softail slim S will see......
riding a "fast harley" is like riding in a "fast diesel truck" the torque feels great and something that Heavy and large gives you the sensation of "fast". and that is worth every penny to those folk's.
but just don't mess up and get beside an actual fast bike like ducati, vmax any sport bike really. it kinda puts things into perspective.
but to each his own. like he said, riding the bike YOU love and adding real power is always a blast! to each his own. just stay in the wind brothers!
peace.
True the word fast is relative. If a Ducati wasn't faster than a Harley with it's water cooling, lighter weight, no radio, no storage, smaller gas tank, Build for Moto GP style racing etc etc then that would be pathetic. Definitely not a "fast Diesel truck" though. This thing is still very fast even when compared to most all motorcycles. Of course an over-square 1000cc++ water cooled bike that weighs 450 pounds is going to beat it. I would hope so.
Great video, really interesting and informative!! Thanks so much for doing it for us!!
The exhaust not alone is worth the price of admission. Any idea how the MPG is affected by the kit?
Hey Matt, Great review. I bought a 2017 Road Glide Ultra in June and I'm trying to make up my mind between doing the Stage 3 and Stage 4 upgrades. What's your perspective?
Great videos, very informative. One question, can a HD transmission have a slipper clutch put on?
People who comment that Harley Davidson’s are overpriced just cant afford it haters are always going to hate
Anthony Cuomo
NOT TRUE, I OWN ONE ! They are FUCKING OVERPRICED , that's WHY the YOUNG GUYS TODAY CAN'T AFFORD to BUY ONE ;( ALSO WHY HARLEY is STRUGGLING WITH SALES and GOING DOWN the TOILET
See how you ease next to a lot of cars before you pass to check they won't make surprise lane change.
And like the comparison to others on sport bike then you being in a recliner.
Any thoughts on fairings or windshields ... or is street glide or is road glide fairing size sort of a minimum for you on longer highway stretches ?
AWESOME VID MATT!! I'm droolin. But how do u riders cope with the terrible LA traffic down there?? I have some friends there that say it's pretty awful & getting worse. Add to that I saw a news report recently that stated that LA had the worst traffic in the country. So how do u guys cope, especially on a bagger???
thinking of doing these stage 4 upgrade on my 217 Street Glide and put in 14 inch handlebars what do you think of the hand of us stay with stocks appreciate your comment Matt thank you
Thomas Angelo I don't understand the question. Please restate it.
Just brought home my new (20 mi) 18 RGS (blacked out) w/ the 114. Comin off my traded 16 FXDLS w/ the 110. It will be interesting to see any noticeable power difference keeping in mind the weight difference between the 2 rides. Thanks for the vid👌
Matt, great video! I have the 2014 CVO limited with the 110 upgraded to the 117 kit. How do you compare this engine to the milwaukee 8 stage 4 kit in this video?
Matt excellent video, hmm maybe I'll get the kit in a few yrs, looks cool, but the stock 107 is already amazingly powerful, ive recently bought Rinehart's slip on's, they sound so cool!
Thanks. Yea the 107 has good power out of the box. Good choice on mufflers. That’s what I have. I like them.
Hi Matt! Thanks for vid! Want about consumption of petroleum with this kit?
You’d be surprised. The fuel economy isn’t much worse than stock. I don’t have exact numbers though. It varies significantly on how you ride it.
I bought a 2017 Road King and contemplated the upgrade while it was under warranty, but decided it had enough power for me. Now I keep thinking about it and was wondering what the upgrade would do to the life of the engine. Do you think the upgrade will cause the motor to wear out faster, or do you think it's not a significant difference.
+aytes44 a lot of that question comes down to how you ride it. I think people who do engine work want to squeeze everything out of their engine and ride it harder. The HD Kits are very good (reliable) kits. I do however think the stock engine untouched will be a little more reliable in the long term. The HD kits are a heck of a lot more reliable then taking it to the local “speed shop”.
Hey Matt, Thanks for the video. I’ve been thinking of picking up a knew street glide and wanted to do the stage three or four kit but haven’t been able to decide what is going to be better for two up, Lower end torque. Can you suggest a cam that would give either of these kits better Lower end torque for 2000 - 4500 rpms and would you suggest changing out the stock cam plate-oil pump with the billet cam plate-high volume oil pump? Great job with the infovids.
Go stage 3. The cam that comes in that kit has a lower RPM power delivery. Are you getting a 2018 with the M8?
Matt Laidlaw yes 2018 M8. I was unsure if a different cam would give the stage 4 better low end torque.
Its not about fast - Its about how quick is it to get to fast.
Hey.. Great Job for sure... Just curious what
A stage IV does to a 117 engine? What’s changed from 117 ci
I have been trolling videos with dyno results on all the upgrades, and to me it appears the 107 to 114 upgrade is a waste unless you go with the CNC heads. Stage 2 torque cam with labor is about $900.00, gives you 98 HP, and 107 F lb torque. Stage 3 is $1600.00 just for the kit, no clue but guess at least $1000.00 labor, for 100.9HP, and 107.56 F lb torque. Stage 4 to 117 is $2600.00 just for the kit, not sure if you can even get there starting with a 107, but on the dyno that takes you to 112HP, and 118Flb torque. Looks to me like stage 2 should be plenty of bang for the buck without breaking the bank, any more than that your probably just making up for something your lacking somewhere else.
As always great video.
Wow that was cool, very nice bike
Hi Matt, thanks for the video, I'm just about to have the HD Stage IV installed but the dealer mentioned cam options, a higher Torque or more HP cam, can you please outline the difference a rider would experience.
The torque is going to be more of that low end (RPM) pulling power. The horse power cam is going to continue increasing in power further along in the higher RPM. What’s your riding preference? Twisting the throttle hard and heavy or immediate low end grunt
Hi Matt, sincerely appreciate your reply, awesome. I dont ride at high RPM but I do like the acceleration from the getgo, so torque at the lower end would be my preference as I cruise around 80MPH in Europe with occasional higher speeds, not sustained for any length of time. I currently have a stage IV on a Heritage with 259e cams and I find they are brilliant at the higher revs but the bike runs very clunky at low city traffic speed, I have to drop to 2nd gear to avoid this at say 25-30mph! My new bike is a 2017 Ultra Limited where I am doing the upgrades.
Just knowing I can accelerate out of a situation is what I like the most, the power is there when required and that initself is my fun in riding, more like having an insurance policy that always kicks in when you want it to pay out!
I should add finally, I am adding the V&H power duals with high output slip-ons, screaming eagle air filter and adding the Power Vision tuner on a Dyno with professional HD technicians.
Great video. I rode a 17 SG. The ergonomics are good, but not enough for me to change from my Heritage. Heritage is the only HD I've ridden that I call perfect ergonomics. I sold a EG Classic Ultra and bought the Heritage. Huge improvement in rider seating position. I'll be getting a new M8 Heritage Stage 4 later this year. I'm sure you've sat on a Heritage before. I'd like to hear what you think about the seating position after you refresh your memory. Thanks for the video.
Last I checked the Milwaukee 8 wasn't in anything but the touring bikes yet so how are you getting a heritage with it?
I've had three harleys.My last one was a 2014 Road Glide.Rode it home(about 500 miles)...sold it the next day.Their claim was...'gobs of torque for those 'higher speed passes' and such.For one,it apparently had some sort of limiter.And also,dangerously,trying to downshift to pass and get that 'increased torque' going,it would limit.Just when I needed it to push.Naturally,shifting back up wide open to TRY and get it to get around a vehicle,it no longer had the torque to really pull.Dangerous.I almost got hit head-on ...and this was starting at 70 mph downshift and pass(shifting up halfway through).It also had the famous Harley wobble at about 105 mph...i got it to 110 mph max...that's all she had.Very disappointed.
You mention 'beast' and 'going fast'.
I ride a zx14R(2013) and an H2(2015).THESE are beasts.These are fast.No worries about..'will I run out of pull'.Those Harleys are quite pretty though.I hope this new motor REALLY comes through as it should...very nice.That kit sounds very nice as well....;)
I was watching your video there..yep,you should've taken er all the way up.That's what I'd like to see..the top end and performance PLUS the torque of higher speed downshifts and upshifts.
If you almost got hit you misjudged the speed and or distance of the oncoming vehicle, thats called rider error and that carries over, no matter what bike you ride or how fast the bike is. Please change your attitude before you become a statistic. Ride safe.
great article Matt but unfortunately you left out some very valuable information and that is all the problems and or issues they're having with the Milwaukee 8 when the stage 4 kit is installed, which is the oil pump is not working correctly, my good buddy Dan just took his new 2017 road glide in for the 4th time and this is his 2nd motor first one seized up so bad they couldn't even pull the heads off and yes he is taking it to a harley dealer so yes a certified tech is doing and did all the work to his bike, now the manufacture knows about this issue cuz he's on his 3rd oil pump in an attempt to correct the issue but it did not fix the issue because its back in the shop again, the techs call this issue oil sumping - where the oil doesn't flow right thru the motor, no I'm not a tech nor mechanic, I also know a few other guys that are having the same issue with their new bikes as well so my suggestion to future buyers hold off on the stage 4 til they fix this issue
Yea. We have seen a couple with oil sumping issues. More than 90% of the people that have bought these kits absolutely love them though. They have changed the oil pump at this point.
Matt....love all of your videos...I have stage 3....and noticed that I lost some fuel range. What does stage 4 do to the fuel range? Can you still go 250 miles between fuel stops if you drive easy?
Thomas S Spencer I have never been able to do 250 miles. On the 6 gallon tank I usually fill up around 200 miles.
It bumps the compression ratio so you might gain a little fuel mileage if you stay out of the power, but why would do a stage 4 and stay out of the power?
Damn, this thing is fucking awesome Matt 👍🏼
I love the way the Simpson helmet looks but I've heard so many negative reviews. Complaints about wind noise among others so it's kind of turned me away from it. What are your thoughts?
justnmegs I really like mine. There are helmets that have better wind cancellation but the wind noise isn't bad. The styling is extremely good. I don't think there is a better looking helmet out there. There isn't great ventilation. It's DOT AND SNELL approved which is nice. It's a good helmet. I like mine.
Very cool thanks for the info
Great blog for the shop. I'd pay the extra , for either shop here in Tucson AZ to rebuild it for me. Good Mechanics and Techs. Or Bobby over in Yuma. I was waiting to see what a Stage IV turned out to be. I still haven't ridden any of the M8s. The TC Engine runs hot out here.
Very few people if any need a upgrade to a M8 engine/motor. If you have extra money laying around do it. Before my 2017 street glide I had a road king with a 96ci twin cam with gear cams. That 96ci was a good motor and put 79k miles on it with no motor work other than the gear cam kit and still sold the bike.
You don’t need a big ass motor to get it in and have fun.
Hi Matt what do you think the the fan assisted oil cooler? Does it help performance?
Great video. I have a question, which has more hp, a stock 114 or a 107 with a stage IV?
Hi Matt, quick question... I just bought a 2018 Roadking and was going for a stage IV upgrade. Do I need to run in the engine before doing the upgrade? Also what about post the upgrade, does it need to be run in?
You don’t need to run the engine before the upgrade. A lot of our customers do it before they have more than 100 miles on the bike. There is however a break in method that you should definitely adhere to once the kit is installed for the first 500 miles.
Matt Laidlaw thanks a ton 👍🏻
Is it a specific method that I need to follow for the run in post install? Anything on the HD website? My dealership doesn’t have a clue...
I have a 2018 Heritage classic 107" with stage 4 . i bought this bike at 655 miles with the stage 4 already on it.. this motor is not impressing me as it should. it doesn't run that strong. it feels tight as i get to the 3000 rpms and up .. has a vibration thru the mirrors at about 2500 rpms and up.. it just doesn't let loose like the 17 107" road king special i rode .. this bike has a lot of pep runs great.. Also i just bought a 14 road king FLHR with the 103" hight output motor.. it also runs stronger than the heritage with quicker throttle response... how can i remedy the Heritage M8 engine response problem? Different cams? this bike was dyno tuned with upgraded air breather and Bassani 2 to 1 exhaust..
Sounds like you’re running the bike at too low of an RPM and also you might be losing low end torque to bad tuning or improper back pressure. Something I always warn against with the M8 engine when you’re going to a full exhaust system.
@@MattLaidlaw It came with screamin' eagle cannons mufflers, sounded crappy. i installed RCX 3" mufflers 2" baffles better sound and ran some better. idle about 840 rpms , idled fine, smooth. acceleration not that impressive or smooth. it was mapped for stage 4, dyno tuned with this setup. 102.80 hp/113.25 torque.. had Bassani 2 to 1 long exhaust installed and screamin' eagle breather that looks like the 114' breather. helped with performance some. after tune it idles about 950 rpms. Is decel pop normal after tuning? it didn't do it before the tune.. also are the 515 cams that come with the stage 4 any good for lower rpms. i want cams that make this bike run great at low to about midrange rpms, say up to about 4000 or so. Or could something else be causing the engine not be as strong as it should . By the way really like your videos ..
Matt, you explain things so well and inform your video viewers with the information they have been searching for. Keep these well informed videos coming. Thanks again.
Thanks man👍🏻 that’s exactly my goal. Glad you got some Info.
I see they offer a 117 cu in for the CVO Street Glide, but if you do the 114 cu in conversion on a Street Glide Special, can you do the 117 after or are you stuck with just the 114 option ?
Parabéns pelo canal, abraços de Brazil!!!!!!!
I have the stage 2 and luv it!
Thank you for the information. Great video.
Benito Acevedo You're welcome. Thanks for watching.
Once again, you have done it again. Great video. Thank you for all that you do for us here in UA-cam land. I am looking to pick up a Road Glide Ultra some time before Christmas. What would I be looking at out the door with that upgrade, ball park figure?
still have the tc88 5speed. everytime I get on the interstate I look for a 6th gear. just can't afford another harley or a trans upgrade.
These bike are so expensive they should come stock with most of this shit
Amen