RB having the 4th best average really goes to show how shocking Checo's performance is, and how enormous of a gap there is between him and Max. Good work summarizing it all!
Both mclarens way overrated. Lando has consistently made mistakes and bottled wins. Oscar had some stinker races where he was nowhere in terms of pace and tyre management. To rate them higher than george and charles and even carlos or lewis is purely absurd.
@@askeladden450 I agree that Oscars Performances up to Belgium were often overrated, But I think Lando is about right. He has made many mistakes, but He is the only driver other than max who can consistently take it to another level when needed. Maybe Hamilton too. He seems motivated again. So if he has a 9/10 pace over the weekend and 1 silly costly mistake, that's often an 8 in my books. Belgium was Landos first rather bad race. But he has had a champions raw pace consistently, While all but max had major drop-offs in performance
In the landscape of youtube duos just falling apart left and right, the moments like the Teletubbies breakdown this episode just warms my heart to know that Matt and Tommy are at the very least still buds despite working professionally in the spotlight for so many years
I feel like this is where the driver ratings are a bit flawed. Like if one of the drivers from the top 4 teams finishes 7th/8th which is the lowest they should be finishing, they still get a 6/7, whereas someone in the other teams finishing say 13th/14th is almost guaranteed a 4/5. Hulk should be top 5 minimum for me.
@@davidreichert9392 exactly. Feels like in these ratings that the top 8 would always be from the top 8 teams unless someone has had an absolute shocker (hello Sergio). Like their absolute baseline is always higher than that of the other teams.
@@davidreichert9392yes car should be factored in but you should also factor in that if you compete near the front end you're driving better drivers. Getting P5 in formula A means you have beaten 2 out of the 8 best drivers on the grid.
@@daarom3472 Exactly what you said..they do not factor in that driving against /Ham/Ver/Norris/Lec/Piastri isnt the same as driving anyone from the bottom 4 teams, No matter how good you are
I'm well aligned with Tommy, Piastri has the same kind of "I don't care anybody's opinion, I just want to be the best", attitude as Max has, and therefore could well be Max's challenger.
@@As-qz5lrExcept that Max’s teammates were either rookies just like him or mediocre honeybadger, where as Piastri’s teammate, One Lap Lando as some use to call him, is in his sixth year in Formula 1 and has had the team cemented around him until very recently with upgrades delivered exclusively for him in some races until Piastri received them too
Piastri getting 2nd/3rd showing the unbelievable talent he is. And I really want to see him fight wheel to wheel with Max, unstoppable force vs immovable object
Piastri getting 2nd/3rd shows how overrated he currently is especially in Tommy’s rankings. He has had a good season but still not better than Lando Leclerc Hamilton and Russel. Same can be applied to Norris but still his season has been better and more consistent
@@errikos9968I agree. Piastri has been overrated due to the recent good performances. Where was he in china and Spain for example. And he is trailing Lando 12-2 in the quali head to head.
@@inahole2678 sometimes maybe. But him being in top 5 in the crowd of Max, Norris, Piastri, George and Lewis? I think you're bit overrating him my man. He's an amazing driver, but haas did not have a good start of the season. Only in recent races he's been banging
@@thecompanioncube4211 And you sort of made the point right there without realising it - HAAS has been terrible at times, to the point even if you put Hamilton (etc) into that car you'd be stuck with much the same results, maybe the absolute best of the best or very lucky driver could have managed a little bit more, but when the car is hopeless... Same thing with Bottas, quiet all year in effect because the car is so darn awful massively outperforming the only guy in the same hardware overall doesn't count in these driver rankings....
The first driver you should beat is your team-mate. Oscar by losing to Lando by every metric is somehow one of the best by default?? The Oscar propaganda is crazy
@@mmww1127 i would post here a screen of 2024 statisctics if i could, but for short, there these categories - Wins, poles, fastest laps, points, laps, dnf, average finish position, average grid position. Draw is in win category (1:1) and DNF (0:0 - Lando completed 90% of Austria so no DNF counted). Oscar wins number of laps (only one who finished every lap) and fastest laps (1:2). In every other cathegory Lando wins. Just pure statistics. Oscar is very good and talented driver and he is doing awesome work in his second year career but numbers dont lie. Happy we have two very talented drivers in one team.
Don't expect Audi to be coming in firing. It takes quite a lot of years to be competitive, except for something like Mercedes when they bought last years WCC car
I hope Saintz will show how good or bad Albon really is. I have a feeling that this Williams is even worse than most think and Albon is driving better than we think.
I think that Williams are easily 8th fastest and people think Albon is amazing as he's getting points when the car is quick. I do think Albon is very good but I think 2025 will show how much I guess
IMO it's a flaw with every driver rating from every outlet, not picking on P1 here, but drivers in the back half of the grid nearly always get middling rankings because their results are middling driving the worst cars, and the drivers in the front half of the grid nearly always get boosted by the fact that they're driving better cars. The Haas has been a decent car this year but at the same time, unless the drivers in the bottom ~5 teams are putting in astonishing races they tend to just go under the radar and get low to mid ratings.
I mean thats how averages work. If he won a race, and got 25 points, but was last in everything else, even taking in the car, you cannot say he's done exceptionally. just because you have a bag of points does not mean you're as good as drivers who consistently score hauls as big as that
Regarding Zhou and Bottas, my personal opinion is that when Bottas realized that Audi was planning to sack both him and Zhou, he just went like "wait guys, actually I was just taking a vacation" and then remembered how he drove back at Merc.
Lance stroll is underrated for how he performs lately. Sure he's more than 10 points behind but he is literally just after alonso in drivers standings.
Gasly above Ocon is not right. Ocon is ahead in qualifying and is ahead in laps in front AND finishing ahead, and If it wasnt for alpine in canada they would be level on points. Ocon was wiping the floor with gasly the first ten races. It took till race 5 for gasly to out qualify him..
@@Miguel-yf4yc they had the same chassis the first 5 races, then they gave it first to Ocon because he was the clear better driver and then they swapped around, for example the last 3 races Gasly had the better chassis
A note to the editor: Have both Matt and Tommy say the full intro, whatever it is, rather than each one doing just a few words. It’ll make swapping between the two sound a bit more natural.
We should get a “Best of the Memes: Midseason Edition” where yall collect the best memes from the first half of the season, both from the races and other moments
How can Lando be 2nd, he had the best car for 8 consecutive races, got 1 win with safety car help. Both Merc drivers doing better with what they had, Ferrari drivers doing wonders with 4th best car for 8 consecutive races. Crazy stuff guys
The max you can get from a win is a 10 so they don’t drastically improve your averages. It makes sense especially when you consider the fact that a second place performance would still probably net you a 9.
Your opinion, in my opinion the mclaren hasnt been the outright best in all circumstances and certainly not 10 seconds up the road better, thoufh i agree that lando deserves less for messing up to much im quite sick of this but duhdur the mclaren is the best car, its extremely close between the 3 teams and even towards ferarri still close depending a damn lot on the track which is a bit better in the race
Feel sorry for Lando. He has really gone from being “NoWins” to “ThroWins” in half a season. I never thought he was WDC material or as good as Lewis or Max or Charles or George. But I do feel sympathy for him.
In a nutshell, people with faster cars look more heroics and get a better grades. That's honestly the public opinion in F1's fanbase. With few exceptions of course.
I’m glad you guys finally nailed the voice swap intro. You’ve gotta both say the whole thing on the same cadence as each other and edit it together. Wonderful!
Max Verstappen has a 78 lead to Lando Norris, and Max had 1 DNF, Norris didnt have any DNF. Thats still quite impressive because RB was not dominant anymore after Miami GP.
Quite frankly I dont think Sargeant's Season has been worse than Zhou's. I also feel like Perez hasan advantage over those two in these Rankings because his good Races look better than theirs
In my Opinion, Lando Norris has been very underwhelming this year, he has had the fastest car for the past 8 or so Races and he has only converted 1 win out of it. He has made many mistakes and you've got to consider that it is Piastri's 2nd Season in F1, whilst it is Lando's 6th Season in F1.
Having Piastri ahead of Norris is genuinely atrocious. Just shows that none of Piastri’s bad races were actually rated bad and McLaren strategy errors for Lando gave him poor rating…
You DO know that Carlos Sainz has had 5 podiums (only Norris, Verstappen and Leclerc have had more), has had just 1 DNF and not gone below 6th the entire season (which is harder than it looks. To do this, he has to focus for EVERY SINGLE race to not fall in the points.) I just think he should've been top 4, with his spectacular comeback from surgery in Australia, amazing consistency and podiums. I think you are overrating Russell (look at his stats for this year) and Piastri has recency bias (even though he IS performing well).
This channel has become so terrible. Imagine ranking Leclerc higher than Sainz so far this season. Apart from Monaco, what else has Leclerc done this season? You guys need to stop this biasness or else ...
I really do love the drivers ratings! You both always give a little something to think about that I’ve missed or my driver bias has blinded me to. Would love to know your biggest good surprise season to date!
@@bniceuk8207 Yes and Piastri should absolutely not be rated above Norris, his PR is out of this world... Russell suffered a DNF and DSQ, while in Hungary his team fucked his qualifying. It's obvious that his point deficit to Hamilton comes from these races, where he didn't make a single error.
Someone pls put Alonso in a competitive car 😢 Was just watching some old 2012 races and my word the way he can perform when given good machinery, it’s magical 😢
I really enjoyed seeing how this has played out ‘mid season’ with the ratings averaged out. As you guys say, it gives us a more realistic representation with less recentcy bias
I think Tommy's ratings for Piastri at P2 are the most accurate. If you look back over the season and remember who has had the best overtakes, who was best at the start of races and who has been best in wheel to wheel racing out of the two its easily piastri imo. Lets not forget that lando has been prioritised at pitt stops pretty much every single race and in miami oscar was the more deserved winner of that race if not for mclaren pitting him just before the safety car to once again prioritise norris. Combine that with norris receiving upgrades first, oscar being unlucky in qualifying due to a team errors of not informing him of a car behind, a dubious track limit infringement and some questionable Q3 team strategy by the team I feel oscar would be ahead on points and a genuine threat to beat max for the wdc. Especially with Redbull reportedly having an illegal car and the FIA asking them to bring it into line with the regulations. I think from memory oscar's bad races were japan, china and spain. Other than that oscar should have 3 wins on the board if not for his team and bad luck. I think mclaren have realised that piastri is their best chance to win a WDC and if they want to keep him they at least need to treat him fairly instead of prioritising lando over him. Unfortunately for Lando he has shown that just being fast doesn't win you championships, you need to be able to deliver when the pressure is at its greatest and norris repeatedly doesn't deliver like max, lewis and oscar does. The last 8 races is a good guide and max is on 116 points while oscar is on 114 with a lot of bad luck and team errors.
when mclaren pit norris before piastri in hungary: mClArEn PrIoRiTiSe NoRriS, pIaStRi UnlUcKy when mclaren pit piastri before norris in miami when they couldn’t have known there’d be a safety car right after: mClArEn PrIoRiTiSe NoRriS, pIaStRi UnlUcKy no matter what they do, if it doesn’t work out for piastri then it automatically means they were prioritising norris and mclaren don’t want piastri to beat norris cuz blah blah blah
Sometimes it's just Haas not being good enough which brings him down. I kept track of my ratings over the season, and while his outstanding results got the high rating they deserved, perhaps some of his performances when he didn't manage to score points were better than they were rated. Despite this, he was very much in the mix with the Ferrari and Mercedes drivers for me before the Belgian GP, and I think that was the same for Matt and Tommy. But his p18 got him a 4/10, which dropped him behind that group as they mostly had very strong performances at Spa. I have pointed out that Matt and Tommy have a top team bias on occasion, and while my ratings for Formula A drivers tend to be a few tenths lower than theirs, actually keeping track of my ratings has shown me that I am somewhat guilty of it myself, as Hulk is still 8th for me as well despite his unquestionably excellent season.
@@tolulopeoluleye5302 Is he a better driver? No. Has he had a better season? Not better than Verstappen, I'd say not better than Norris, but I think he's been on par with Piastri and slightly more impressive than Leclerc and Russell if I were ranking their season on vibes. But like I said, my ratings don't quite show this. What do you think?
@@thomasvrielink299 To reply your first comment,that's why I included "this season"...Hulk has definitely had amazing results, but I truly don't think he has had a better season than Russell, Piastri or Leclerc..his best result has been more impressive than theirs, surely..but overall,it is hard to say that over the duration of each of the 14 races, he's been better this season than any of those guys
Checo slander is real more points than Russel but you rate him 10 positions down? Russel, Lecler, hamlittle, bittas, ocon, gasket, Albin, drick, have all proven they would do as bad in the Red Bull as Checo but you only slander the one man. Good job. The merc could be the best car and we would never know because those two struggled so hard at the start.
I’m not convinced the chassis played any part in it. But I do think he should have received higher ratings in the last couple of races. We all know he had a terrible start to the season, but even when he does well there seems to be some bias against him.
@@lamsmiley1944 Ratings are really subjective so that’s a fair comment. I don’t think there is any “bias” against him though, at least not on this channel. As others have pointed out, it’s just harder for drivers in the midfield teams to get a good rating compared to those at the front. That applies to the likes of Nico and Yuki as well.
@@lamsmiley1944 I think everybody feels that way about their favorite driver. I think it is really tough for anybody to have a full understanding of what happened to all 20 drivers in a single race, whilst fans will typically follow and see what is going on about their favorite driver. Again, I don't think it is anything against Daniel specifically, though maybe there is a certain element of people just having higher expectations for him (but I think that is justified to a certain extent). Also as mentioned, I think drivers further down the grid just generally have a tough time getting higher scores.
It’s insane how much scrutiny Lando gets for his performances while Oscar gets nothing but praise. Lando despite getting absolutely boned in Canada (safety car), Austria (terrorism), UK (McLaren) and Hungary (McLaren again) is still 32 points ahead of Oscar and yet people act like Oscar’s had a better season.
Yea but take into account oscar got hit in China and miami and didn't have the upgrades before lando he probably missed out on about the same points as lando when he dnf'ed. Oscar also got hurt, in sliverstone, bahrain and somewhere else I can't remember and then top that with the fact he is only 1 and a half seasons in. I do think lando is getting too much hate and obviously he is the better driver. But not by much.
@@Ethan8181 That’s true. He was unlucky as well a couple of times. Both were robbed off a clear 1-2 by their own team in Silverstone. I’d say he’s not far off Lando and certainly performs much better than him in race starts. I do feel in his second season we can expect strong performances already (which he delivers). Similarly to what drivers like Lewis, Max and Charles achieved in great cars in their second season.
Why do people keep confusing the ocon situation. Nobody is saying he’s a bad driver, they are saying he’s not a great teammate. When it comes to driving into your own teammate, nobody drives better than ocon.
Ocon has only crashed into his teammates twice. I don’t know what imaginary BS you’re inventing. Lewis, Max, Perez, Gasly, Alonso have a similar record against their teammates.
@@paperplane-db8qf Ocon has crashed into his teammate 6 times, many of them in extremely poor fashion (not like turn 1 lap 1 inchindents). Has Max, Lewis, Perez, Alonso caused a global cringe crisis when they've come on the radio and said "You can say to Haas that I'm gonna go for it, so they better be ready"
@@95mushroom name those 6 times. Most of them weren’t even his fault, only 2 were. “Global cringe crisis” - there’s a global cringe crisis of the Ocon haters with negative IQ living in their own delusional worlds.
We will see how the second half of the season goes. I’m concerned about seeing the return of Crashstappen, now that he no longer has a runaway dominant car. I’m worrying too about intra-team friction in Maclaren and Mercedes, now that they have the interesting cars and are scoring most of the wins. Still, having five different drivers with both the chops and the car to deliver multiple wins is AMAZING and speaks well for the rest of the season.
Have you ever done the race ratings in a similar way by starting with who finished P20 up to P1? I think I would find that easier to follow. Just a thought, love you all and thanks for the summer content ❤
I came here to say the same thing. I think part of it is because VCARB played it off as "we did it just to make him happy" basically saying "there's nothing wrong with the car he's just delusional". Which was just picked up and the chasis change was written off.
@@tak8261 I mean I would say that his performance has markedly improved since the change is pretty strong evidence. And of course VCARB isn’t going to turn around and say “we were wrong it was a botched chassis”. That would admit they messed up the chassis and that they told Ric and the media that nothing was wrong when there was.
@@EliYis Or maybe he just started performing better? The team themselves have continuously denied the chassis has any impact, and so have many experts. Correlation and causation are entirely different. Your logic is the same as saying Sainz won because he removed his appendix.
@@tak8261 I’m not trying to say it’s for sure causation - don’t get me wrong. And I also fully believe that his performance has improved. Not all of his improvement can be down to a chassis. But what I am trying to say we also can’t rule it out just because the team said it wasn’t a factor, especially when their expertise or perception of it could be negatively impacted. That’s all.
Piastri could’ve challenged for his first win already in silverstone, mclaren strategy really screwed him over. I feel like he could go to the top soon
@@JohnnyChimpo69did you see the H2H gap in both the race and qualifying after Austria? George had 26 points on Lewis at the time. Then George got 3 weekends ruined in a row which turned the tables. I know George ain't popular and Lewis is but we gotta stop being blinded by opinions
And we all had 0 expectations and thought championship off after week 1… honestly props to f1 and the cost cap for making the grid actually competitive
it’s always unlucky with Oscar and bad driving from Lando when there is a mistake odd; the McLaren fumbles are only considered when they effect Oscar, they have literally cost Lando more points than his own mistakes; he is literally 13:4 against Oscar in Quali H2H yet Oscar is rated higher be so for real right now
exactly this ^ i’ve said this in another reply but it doesn’t matter when mclaren pit norris and piastri, it doesn’t matter who gets pit priority,if norris pits first,people instantly say mclaren prioritised lando with better strategy and undercut, if piastri pits first, people say mclaren gave norris better strategy and left piastri vulnerable to a safety car. anything that doesn’t work in piastris favour is instantly mclaren prioritising lando and whatever
No way your comparing the basic numbers of from the quli head to head. There average gap is like 0.030 seconds lmao. And not really. Oscar has been called out belgium he lost the win from over shooting is box, making his mistake in austria, Spain for being off the pace? And lando gets stick to, for his starts, like Hungary, belgium, China etc.
Hmmm, maybe McLarens are a bit high? I know they have had some bad luck, like McLaren's bad strategy in Silverstone, Verstappen taking out Norris in Austria, and Sainz taking out Piastri in Miami, but I think the Mercs and Ferraris have done a more even job based on their packages so far this season. Mercedes have more wins than McLaren this season - that has to say something. Maybe Leclerc, Norris, Hamilton, Sainz, Russell, Piastri?
Oscars is graded as a year 2 driver and Lando is graded as a championship contender. I think that's why Oscar might get 8/10 for a P5 when Lando would get a 6/10 for that same P5. Based on Oscar's recent results he needs to be graded at the same level of scrutiny that Lando is since he clearly has the skill.
yes exactly! when lando fumbles a win, he gets slandered for it even when he beats oscar cuz people expect him to win every race with the fastest car. when oscar fumbles a win (Belgium pit stop errror that cost him two secomds) people congratulate him for at least challenging for the win and beating norris so he feels no pressure at all and i’m sick of people saying that oscar is preforming “under pressure” like what pressure?! no one expects him to win every race and no one slanders him for not doing so like they do with lando. the expectations for both of them are totally different, if you wanna say that oscar is equal or better than lando then at least have similar expectations for them… the problem is no one rates lando fairly, he is either “the best driver ever” and gets DOTD from his fan girls or he is “washed Throwins and doesn’t deserve to be put in the class of top drivers”
plus you are right, in canada lando got 9/10 for 2nd and oscar got 8/10 for 5th but in belgium oscar got 9/10 for 2nd and lando only got 6/10 for 5th. i also think landos 5th place in belgium was better than oscar’s 5th place in canada cuz belgium was more competitive while in canada, both ferraris were no where and perez was washed so 5th place is the lowest piastri should be finishing. at least in belgium, sainz actually led the race at one point and perez was less washed then usual so… and before people bring up the russell DSQ, even if we look at the times, norris finished 6-7 seconds ahead of piastri in canada and piastri finished 8-9 seconds ahead of norris in belgium and keep in mind that canada had a SC while belgium did not. i don’t think a total time difference of two seconds equates to 6/10 instead of 8/10 like piastri got
Back in the day, Lando was always getting all the love from fans when he raced against guys like Ricciardo and Sainz. You didn't seem to mind him being praised so much, right? And wasn't it because he was newer and still managed to keep up with the more experienced guys? Now that the tables have turned, why do you propose Oscar being judged against the same standards as his much experienced teammate? Even though he's still learning? For example, there was even a track he visited for the first time this season. Drove with a broken rib. Lando's fever gets even more media attention before a race. The hypocrisy! Oscar also admitted to his mistake in Spa but do we see him sulking?
Honestly, if you look at the cars and their levels throughout the upgrade war, the performances, the crests and dips in form, qualifyings, podiums, wins and the standings... Its Max, then the next 6 are very much debatable when you consider their results, machinery, conditions, mechanical failures, etc. Credit to Verstappen for making it work even when hes had to fight, but clearly its getting much tougher! WHAT A SEASON!!! MAY IT CONTINUE🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
How about rating them on recent form eg, over the last five races? Would be an interesting comparison vs the overall first half to see who’s building momentum
I didn't even realise that Logan hadn't been officially announced as leaving by Williams... I wonder if that means they're still considering an in-season swap (cough Kimi Antonelli cough) and don't want to say "leaving at the end of the season" if they get the opportunity to give him the boot earlier...
Tommy’s argument of Lando under delivering compared to Oscar is literally nonsensical. Up 11-3 in qualy and 9-5 in races is Lando. Same number of wins. Lando 2 poles to Oscar’s zero. In every single statistical category he has out performed Oscar. If you’re making this statement based off the fact you think he should have delivered more with the car he’s had…that same argument should be applied to Oscar. Same car you know. Yes Lando’s wasted a few win chances but he’s more regularly in those positions than Oscar has been. Seems like they’re being judged against different standards which I didn’t think was the point here.
Caveman level of argument there going purely off the H2H without looking at any context, or the ACTUAL REASON why people are saying Lando is underdelivering what the car is capable of.
They ARE being judged against different standards. The simple truth is that more is expected of Lando as the more experienced driver. Still not convinced? Look at the rating given to Bearman. No way that would have been scored a 10 had it not been a last minute debut.
Of course they’re being judged by different standards Lando is in his 6th year, Oscar is in his 2nd. Of course more is expected of Lando, he should be performing better for his experience and how fast the car is.
@@jujuhu5567 Lando is current P2 in the standings with a reasonable advantage over P3 and has scored 8 podiums, just 1 less than Max. Sure he belongs in the top 3 at half season.
@@soundscape26With only 20 points adventage (in the fastest or close second fastest car in last 8 weekends) over leclerc who didn’t score points in 3 races this year and it currently driving a tractor
@@Wickey934 Up till Monaco the Ferrari was solid and Charles always finished in the top 4. Carlos did fine in that period as well, so they sure weren't driving tractors. That's why the difference is only 20 points. Not saying Lando is having an amazing season but sure, what's your top 3 so far?
@@soundscape26 Considering the car Lando is driving more than half of the season his results are just underwhelming. Same with Oscar, I don't think his results are that impressive looking at the car. My top 3 would be: Verstappen (obviously), Leclerc (3 bad weekends, but his consistency through the season is great), Russell (unlucky, amazing h2h stats against Lewis)
Pretty good average scoring boys!! I know some people like to hate race to race but these averages are legit! Cant wait for the second half of the season
I would actually have Oscar higher graded because apparently in the race he was given the win and the 2 afterwards he did all with a broken rib. Oscar came out with the info a few days ago. Edit: he apparently had the broken rib around the time of the Austrian GP
Agreed. Austria, he was in the fight for the win, Silverstone, data suggests he could have won if not for McLarens decision not to double stack, Hungary, we all know what happened there (Though he DID deserve the W, Landos behaviour tarnished the outcome) and He was a genuine contender at Spa as well. So the TLDR is, Oscar is coming along very nicely.
@@beaversquad2332 Except he hasn’t. George is leading both H2Hs. And if not for that disqualification he’d be the only driver other than Max to win more than one race.
@@beaversquad2332 He won in Austria by being the best of the rest. All the others had the chance to be there, but it was George who was there at the right time for it. And would’ve won at Belgium if not for the team under-weighing his car.
Oscar has a champions mentality. Like Leclerc, Sainz, Russell, Hamilton, Alonso and Verstappen. Hope McLaren can continue their form because that guy is just getting started. He must have been gutted during his first few races and it's good to see he picked well. Secondly, hoping Newey can work his magic before Alonso leaves.
Fair play to bearman for averaging a 10 so far this season
Yes, last season only Max could do that, so he is at least as good as Max!
being better than all multiple time world champions on the grid, must be thrilling
Combined Team Duo Points:
McLaren 8.23
Ferrari 7.6
Mercedes 7.53
Red Bull 6.83
Rac. Bulls 6.3
Haas 6.25
Alpine 6.1
Ast. Mart. 6.05
Williams 5.1
Sauber 5.1
RB having the 4th best average really goes to show how shocking Checo's performance is, and how enormous of a gap there is between him and Max. Good work summarizing it all!
@@aleximraypapineau Also shows how good Max is carrying them to 4th too
nice, thanks for this. It's very interesting to see, and I'm glad you did this quick maths as they did not.
Both mclarens way overrated. Lando has consistently made mistakes and bottled wins. Oscar had some stinker races where he was nowhere in terms of pace and tyre management. To rate them higher than george and charles and even carlos or lewis is purely absurd.
@@askeladden450 I agree that Oscars Performances up to Belgium were often overrated, But I think Lando is about right. He has made many mistakes, but He is the only driver other than max who can consistently take it to another level when needed. Maybe Hamilton too. He seems motivated again. So if he has a 9/10 pace over the weekend and 1 silly costly mistake, that's often an 8 in my books.
Belgium was Landos first rather bad race. But he has had a champions raw pace consistently, While all but max had major drop-offs in performance
Yall switching voices made me have to watch the intro like 3 times🤣
Cursed lol
The world is full of wonderful things
I'm so tired so I didn't notice LOL
The more I watched it, the more funny it got 😂
I only heard tommy so it confused me greatly at first
bearman in f1 : 10/10
bearman in f2 : 10➗10
That's the same thing
@@jeremy8696no, ones 10 and one is 1
@@chaycowdry7654 10/10 = 1, 10÷10 =1, 10/1 =10. 1/10= 0.1
10/10 is also 1 actually
Technically yes. But you know what he meant lol! Bloody grammar nazi's 😂😂😂@@malopthemapper
I expected Perez to be low down, but OH MY DAYS
His rating is his average qualifying position 😂
😂😂😂@@grillmeisterkush6396
Exactly why this entire show is trash
@@ThereMayBeLionsare u watching f1 or are u watching delusion
@@ThereMayBeLionschill out bro it's not that deep. But you can admit perez has been very very poor this year
38:58 Someone should remind Tommy that Austria-Hungary doesn't exist anymore for more than a century now
He’s talking about Austrian and the Hungarian GP I believe, not Austria-Hungary
@@lp2791 that was a joke brother
Haha my mistake
That intro was the best so far
They should get the Map Men in.
Tommy in bed is a close second.
In the landscape of youtube duos just falling apart left and right, the moments like the Teletubbies breakdown this episode just warms my heart to know that Matt and Tommy are at the very least still buds despite working professionally in the spotlight for so many years
Which others have fallen apart?
I feel like this is where the driver ratings are a bit flawed. Like if one of the drivers from the top 4 teams finishes 7th/8th which is the lowest they should be finishing, they still get a 6/7, whereas someone in the other teams finishing say 13th/14th is almost guaranteed a 4/5. Hulk should be top 5 minimum for me.
Agreed. Too often the car is not factored in as much as it ought to have been.
@@davidreichert9392 exactly. Feels like in these ratings that the top 8 would always be from the top 8 teams unless someone has had an absolute shocker (hello Sergio). Like their absolute baseline is always higher than that of the other teams.
@@davidreichert9392yes car should be factored in but you should also factor in that if you compete near the front end you're driving better drivers. Getting P5 in formula A means you have beaten 2 out of the 8 best drivers on the grid.
Maybe doing an adjusted score with constructors standings (or points, or something) taken into consideration would be good addition
@@daarom3472 Exactly what you said..they do not factor in that driving against /Ham/Ver/Norris/Lec/Piastri isnt the same as driving anyone from the bottom 4 teams, No matter how good you are
I'm well aligned with Tommy, Piastri has the same kind of "I don't care anybody's opinion, I just want to be the best", attitude as Max has, and therefore could well be Max's challenger.
Max was never dominated in the way Piastri has been dominated by Norris for 2 seasons. It is like Alonso vs Massa or Schumacher vs Barrichello.
@@As-qz5lrExcept that Max’s teammates were either rookies just like him or mediocre honeybadger, where as Piastri’s teammate, One Lap Lando as some use to call him, is in his sixth year in Formula 1 and has had the team cemented around him until very recently with upgrades delivered exclusively for him in some races until Piastri received them too
Piastri getting 2nd/3rd showing the unbelievable talent he is. And I really want to see him fight wheel to wheel with Max, unstoppable force vs immovable object
Piastri getting 2nd/3rd shows how overrated he currently is especially in Tommy’s rankings. He has had a good season but still not better than Lando Leclerc Hamilton and Russel. Same can be applied to Norris but still his season has been better and more consistent
Better than the merc drivers this year for sure.@errikos9968
@@errikos9968Imo piastri has been better than norris this year
@@errikos9968I agree. Piastri has been overrated due to the recent good performances. Where was he in china and Spain for example. And he is trailing Lando 12-2 in the quali head to head.
@@Zack_F1 it is 12-2 and 9-4 in qualy and race h2h how is he the better driver
I think Hulk should be in the Top 5. Many Top Drivers in the good Teams made to many Mistakes this year
It's average of all the races. Not new scoring
@@thecompanioncube4211they consistently underrated Hulkenberg this season though
@@inahole2678 sometimes maybe. But him being in top 5 in the crowd of Max, Norris, Piastri, George and Lewis? I think you're bit overrating him my man. He's an amazing driver, but haas did not have a good start of the season. Only in recent races he's been banging
@@thecompanioncube4211 And you sort of made the point right there without realising it - HAAS has been terrible at times, to the point even if you put Hamilton (etc) into that car you'd be stuck with much the same results, maybe the absolute best of the best or very lucky driver could have managed a little bit more, but when the car is hopeless... Same thing with Bottas, quiet all year in effect because the car is so darn awful massively outperforming the only guy in the same hardware overall doesn't count in these driver rankings....
@@foldionepapyrus3441 and? Do you think coming in at 11th on average should be worthy of 8,9,10's in rating just because it was the car's fault?
Piastri’s last 8 races makes him one of the best by default. Him being in his second season, already challengin Norris says everything.
The first driver you should beat is your team-mate. Oscar by losing to Lando by every metric is somehow one of the best by default?? The Oscar propaganda is crazy
@@As-qz5lrtalking about Propaganda while defending Lando is crazy
@@mmww1127 i would post here a screen of 2024 statisctics if i could, but for short, there these categories - Wins, poles, fastest laps, points, laps, dnf, average finish position, average grid position. Draw is in win category (1:1) and DNF (0:0 - Lando completed 90% of Austria so no DNF counted). Oscar wins number of laps (only one who finished every lap) and fastest laps (1:2). In every other cathegory Lando wins. Just pure statistics. Oscar is very good and talented driver and he is doing awesome work in his second year career but numbers dont lie. Happy we have two very talented drivers in one team.
Been waiting for this one.
Only 1 more week before Rawe Ceek
I so want Audi to be good, just for Hulk to have a real chance at a podium and race win.
Don't expect Audi to be coming in firing. It takes quite a lot of years to be competitive, except for something like Mercedes when they bought last years WCC car
Yay Matt and Tommy is back
I hope Saintz will show how good or bad Albon really is. I have a feeling that this Williams is even worse than most think and Albon is driving better than we think.
I think that Williams are easily 8th fastest and people think Albon is amazing as he's getting points when the car is quick. I do think Albon is very good but I think 2025 will show how much I guess
I believe the Williams will be much better if they do not have to fund new parts due to crashes every other race
Sargent wasn't washed until he got into that Williams. Alex was about as close as anyone to Max so....
albons overrated.
@@Tjescoothis might be because the handling of it is too unpredictable/edgy.
Hulk only in P8 is a disgrace
22 points with a haas. You cant give that enough credit.
Agreed. Top 5 this year. Him and bottas would be an great lineup next season
Well they give him a rating after every race and then average them out 🤷♂️
@F1dude. Great lineup but shit car still unfortunately=0 points for World constructors and drivers championship
IMO it's a flaw with every driver rating from every outlet, not picking on P1 here, but drivers in the back half of the grid nearly always get middling rankings because their results are middling driving the worst cars, and the drivers in the front half of the grid nearly always get boosted by the fact that they're driving better cars. The Haas has been a decent car this year but at the same time, unless the drivers in the bottom ~5 teams are putting in astonishing races they tend to just go under the radar and get low to mid ratings.
I mean thats how averages work. If he won a race, and got 25 points, but was last in everything else, even taking in the car, you cannot say he's done exceptionally. just because you have a bag of points does not mean you're as good as drivers who consistently score hauls as big as that
Regarding Zhou and Bottas, my personal opinion is that when Bottas realized that Audi was planning to sack both him and Zhou, he just went like "wait guys, actually I was just taking a vacation" and then remembered how he drove back at Merc.
I really love bottas. Really want him to stay in f1 even though im not sure where. Infact my f1 24 carrer is with him lmao
Bottas has still been awful he just happens to have a pay driver that dosent belong in the league on his team.
@@Gl-my8fwhe’s driving a shitbox, he hasn’t been bad
@Gl-my8fw Well you could say the same about albon but people rate him highly so
@@Zack_F1 The two cars are not in the same league though, the Williams has some redeeming qualities....
Lance stroll is underrated for how he performs lately. Sure he's more than 10 points behind but he is literally just after alonso in drivers standings.
Tommy turned into a South Park Canadian
Gasly above Ocon is not right. Ocon is ahead in qualifying and is ahead in laps in front AND finishing ahead, and If it wasnt for alpine in canada they would be level on points. Ocon was wiping the floor with gasly the first ten races. It took till race 5 for gasly to out qualify him..
How much can you really compare them when they don’t have the same chassis
@@Miguel-yf4yc they had the same chassis the first 5 races, then they gave it first to Ocon because he was the clear better driver and then they swapped around, for example the last 3 races Gasly had the better chassis
Ye agreed I dont think theres a huge amount in it but Ocon has been the better driver this season.
A note to the editor:
Have both Matt and Tommy say the full intro, whatever it is, rather than each one doing just a few words. It’ll make swapping between the two sound a bit more natural.
Yuki Tsunoda was doing very well until recently. Besides Max, the follow up driver has to be Oscar Piastri
We should get a “Best of the Memes: Midseason Edition” where yall collect the best memes from the first half of the season, both from the races and other moments
How can Lando be 2nd, he had the best car for 8 consecutive races, got 1 win with safety car help. Both Merc drivers doing better with what they had, Ferrari drivers doing wonders with 4th best car for 8 consecutive races. Crazy stuff guys
The max you can get from a win is a 10 so they don’t drastically improve your averages. It makes sense especially when you consider the fact that a second place performance would still probably net you a 9.
the british biasm will never be unmatched unfortunately
Oscar has the same car mate
Your opinion, in my opinion the mclaren hasnt been the outright best in all circumstances and certainly not 10 seconds up the road better, thoufh i agree that lando deserves less for messing up to much im quite sick of this but duhdur the mclaren is the best car, its extremely close between the 3 teams and even towards ferarri still close depending a damn lot on the track which is a bit better in the race
Nothing I love more than a driver ratings, my favourite content
AAA THE CURSED INTRO
Feel sorry for Lando. He has really gone from being “NoWins” to “ThroWins” in half a season. I never thought he was WDC material or as good as Lewis or Max or Charles or George. But I do feel sympathy for him.
Deservedly tbh
Bro they are drivers, it's not that deep
@@ottoッ "it's not that deep" - someone who likely uses the words 'yapping', 'grind', or 'sigma', and should be ignored.
I feel no sympathy for him, he's made various comments about lewis winning because of the car and look at Lando now that he has the car lmao
Lando, George and Charles are all in the same boat, they all make a lot of costly mistakes that you wouldn't expect from WDC material.
In a nutshell, people with faster cars look more heroics and get a better grades. That's honestly the public opinion in F1's fanbase. With few exceptions of course.
I’m glad you guys finally nailed the voice swap intro. You’ve gotta both say the whole thing on the same cadence as each other and edit it together. Wonderful!
Id like to see a running average graph after each race to help see the trend of each driver.
I'm surprised to see Matt in tennis t-shirt with Nadal's logo. It's like my two worlds of tennis and f1 collided in one place 😅
35:08 so 81 has an 8.1, nice
Max Verstappen has a 78 lead to Lando Norris, and Max had 1 DNF, Norris didnt have any DNF. Thats still quite impressive because RB was not dominant anymore after Miami GP.
austria gp lando dnf
Btw oscar had a broken rip from Silverstone-spa so...
Quite frankly I dont think Sargeant's Season has been worse than Zhou's. I also feel like Perez hasan advantage over those two in these Rankings because his good Races look better than theirs
In my Opinion, Lando Norris has been very underwhelming this year, he has had the fastest car for the past 8 or so Races and he has only converted 1 win out of it. He has made many mistakes and you've got to consider that it is Piastri's 2nd Season in F1, whilst it is Lando's 6th Season in F1.
it just feels so loooooooooooooong since last and till the next race
I happened to see one of the F1 related videos yesterday and low-key missed you guys. And here you are dropping the video! :D
Having Piastri ahead of Norris is genuinely atrocious. Just shows that none of Piastri’s bad races were actually rated bad and McLaren strategy errors for Lando gave him poor rating…
You gunna cry at the end of the season if Oscar is ahead in the points 😂😂😂
@@5150TJT not really mate… if Oscar finishes ahead of Norris and not due to luck then fair enough
now who’s the TRUE Charles Leclerc fanboy 🤔
Matt lost faith.
@@OnurP1Russel devant 😂
Lando just needs to change to a villains mindset.
You DO know that Carlos Sainz has had 5 podiums (only Norris, Verstappen and Leclerc have had more), has had just 1 DNF and not gone below 6th the entire season (which is harder than it looks. To do this, he has to focus for EVERY SINGLE race to not fall in the points.) I just think he should've been top 4, with his spectacular comeback from surgery in Australia, amazing consistency and podiums.
I think you are overrating Russell (look at his stats for this year) and Piastri has recency bias (even though he IS performing well).
I honestly just spent like 2 minutes trying to think of the show u guys where on before you went out on your own ... that says it all
This channel has become so terrible. Imagine ranking Leclerc higher than Sainz so far this season. Apart from Monaco, what else has Leclerc done this season?
You guys need to stop this biasness or else ...
And what did Sainz do? He is behind in every stat 😂 what are you on?
0:01 ok now we are reaching creepy levels of intro 😂
5:33 well he's cooked
22:45 nice
23:54 nice
29:37 o7 to the camera
I really do love the drivers ratings! You both always give a little something to think about that I’ve missed or my driver bias has blinded me to. Would love to know your biggest good surprise season to date!
George Russell is criminally underrated
For what ?
@@bniceuk8207 Yes and Piastri should absolutely not be rated above Norris, his PR is out of this world...
Russell suffered a DNF and DSQ, while in Hungary his team fucked his qualifying. It's obvious that his point deficit to Hamilton comes from these races, where he didn't make a single error.
i was just thinking about you guys this afternoon and you dropped an episode in the evening 🏎️💨
Someone pls put Alonso in a competitive car 😢
Was just watching some old 2012 races and my word the way he can perform when given good machinery, it’s magical 😢
Sadly, Alonso is gonna retire from that nepo team. He sold his soul to Stroll family.
I really enjoyed seeing how this has played out ‘mid season’ with the ratings averaged out. As you guys say, it gives us a more realistic representation with less recentcy bias
I think Tommy's ratings for Piastri at P2 are the most accurate. If you look back over the season and remember who has had the best overtakes, who was best at the start of races and who has been best in wheel to wheel racing out of the two its easily piastri imo. Lets not forget that lando has been prioritised at pitt stops pretty much every single race and in miami oscar was the more deserved winner of that race if not for mclaren pitting him just before the safety car to once again prioritise norris. Combine that with norris receiving upgrades first, oscar being unlucky in qualifying due to a team errors of not informing him of a car behind, a dubious track limit infringement and some questionable Q3 team strategy by the team I feel oscar would be ahead on points and a genuine threat to beat max for the wdc. Especially with Redbull reportedly having an illegal car and the FIA asking them to bring it into line with the regulations. I think from memory oscar's bad races were japan, china and spain. Other than that oscar should have 3 wins on the board if not for his team and bad luck. I think mclaren have realised that piastri is their best chance to win a WDC and if they want to keep him they at least need to treat him fairly instead of prioritising lando over him. Unfortunately for Lando he has shown that just being fast doesn't win you championships, you need to be able to deliver when the pressure is at its greatest and norris repeatedly doesn't deliver like max, lewis and oscar does. The last 8 races is a good guide and max is on 116 points while oscar is on 114 with a lot of bad luck and team errors.
when mclaren pit norris before piastri in hungary: mClArEn PrIoRiTiSe NoRriS, pIaStRi UnlUcKy
when mclaren pit piastri before norris in miami when they couldn’t have known there’d be a safety car right after: mClArEn PrIoRiTiSe NoRriS, pIaStRi UnlUcKy
no matter what they do, if it doesn’t work out for piastri then it automatically means they were prioritising norris and mclaren don’t want piastri to beat norris cuz blah blah blah
@@dido5317 it would take less words for you to say you're a Lando fanboy and that you feel threatened by Oscar
@@dido5317 wow you couldn't even make a mature argument without being a twat
Well done on the intro guys, I thought I was hallucinating
Hulk being in 8th is crazy! For me he's top 2, but at least he has to be top 5!
Sometimes it's just Haas not being good enough which brings him down. I kept track of my ratings over the season, and while his outstanding results got the high rating they deserved, perhaps some of his performances when he didn't manage to score points were better than they were rated. Despite this, he was very much in the mix with the Ferrari and Mercedes drivers for me before the Belgian GP, and I think that was the same for Matt and Tommy. But his p18 got him a 4/10, which dropped him behind that group as they mostly had very strong performances at Spa.
I have pointed out that Matt and Tommy have a top team bias on occasion, and while my ratings for Formula A drivers tend to be a few tenths lower than theirs, actually keeping track of my ratings has shown me that I am somewhat guilty of it myself, as Hulk is still 8th for me as well despite his unquestionably excellent season.
I doubt you'll reply this,but I'll ask..would you say Hulk has been a better driver this season than Verstappen, Norris, Paistri, Leclerc and Russell?
@@tolulopeoluleye5302 Is he a better driver? No. Has he had a better season? Not better than Verstappen, I'd say not better than Norris, but I think he's been on par with Piastri and slightly more impressive than Leclerc and Russell if I were ranking their season on vibes. But like I said, my ratings don't quite show this.
What do you think?
@@thomasvrielink299 To reply your first comment,that's why I included "this season"...Hulk has definitely had amazing results, but I truly don't think he has had a better season than Russell, Piastri or Leclerc..his best result has been more impressive than theirs, surely..but overall,it is hard to say that over the duration of each of the 14 races, he's been better this season than any of those guys
@@thomasvrielink299 to repeat this, I really just realised it.. Hulk's P6 b2b was better than those 3 guy's wins
Checo slander is real more points than Russel but you rate him 10 positions down? Russel, Lecler, hamlittle, bittas, ocon, gasket, Albin, drick, have all proven they would do as bad in the Red Bull as Checo but you only slander the one man. Good job. The merc could be the best car and we would never know because those two struggled so hard at the start.
Ric's ratings rose considerably after the new chassis.
lol
I’m not convinced the chassis played any part in it. But I do think he should have received higher ratings in the last couple of races. We all know he had a terrible start to the season, but even when he does well there seems to be some bias against him.
@@lamsmiley1944 Ratings are really subjective so that’s a fair comment. I don’t think there is any “bias” against him though, at least not on this channel. As others have pointed out, it’s just harder for drivers in the midfield teams to get a good rating compared to those at the front. That applies to the likes of Nico and Yuki as well.
@@tak8261 I don’t think it’s a conscious bias, but they have given him some questionable ratings.
@@lamsmiley1944 I think everybody feels that way about their favorite driver. I think it is really tough for anybody to have a full understanding of what happened to all 20 drivers in a single race, whilst fans will typically follow and see what is going on about their favorite driver.
Again, I don't think it is anything against Daniel specifically, though maybe there is a certain element of people just having higher expectations for him (but I think that is justified to a certain extent). Also as mentioned, I think drivers further down the grid just generally have a tough time getting higher scores.
It’s insane how much scrutiny Lando gets for his performances while Oscar gets nothing but praise. Lando despite getting absolutely boned in Canada (safety car), Austria (terrorism), UK (McLaren) and Hungary (McLaren again) is still 32 points ahead of Oscar and yet people act like Oscar’s had a better season.
Yea but take into account oscar got hit in China and miami and didn't have the upgrades before lando he probably missed out on about the same points as lando when he dnf'ed. Oscar also got hurt, in sliverstone, bahrain and somewhere else I can't remember and then top that with the fact he is only 1 and a half seasons in. I do think lando is getting too much hate and obviously he is the better driver. But not by much.
@@Ethan8181 That’s true. He was unlucky as well a couple of times. Both were robbed off a clear 1-2 by their own team in Silverstone. I’d say he’s not far off Lando and certainly performs much better than him in race starts. I do feel in his second season we can expect strong performances already (which he delivers). Similarly to what drivers like Lewis, Max and Charles achieved in great cars in their second season.
Why do people keep confusing the ocon situation. Nobody is saying he’s a bad driver, they are saying he’s not a great teammate. When it comes to driving into your own teammate, nobody drives better than ocon.
Ocon has only crashed into his teammates twice.
I don’t know what imaginary BS you’re inventing.
Lewis, Max, Perez, Gasly, Alonso have a similar record against their teammates.
@@paperplane-db8qf Ocon has crashed into his teammate 6 times, many of them in extremely poor fashion (not like turn 1 lap 1 inchindents).
Has Max, Lewis, Perez, Alonso caused a global cringe crisis when they've come on the radio and said "You can say to Haas that I'm gonna go for it, so they better be ready"
@@95mushroom name those 6 times.
Most of them weren’t even his fault, only 2 were.
“Global cringe crisis” - there’s a global cringe crisis of the Ocon haters with negative IQ living in their own delusional worlds.
Wish you would have used our drivers ratings along side both of yours. That would be interesting
Would be interesting to know the order the fans have placed them in like you mention each driver ratings video.
Stroll might not be scoring so well in the championship but his race craft and mentorship to other drivers is second to none
Williams turned their back on him way earlier than now. that happened in Australia.
We will see how the second half of the season goes. I’m concerned about seeing the return of Crashstappen, now that he no longer has a runaway dominant car. I’m worrying too about intra-team friction in Maclaren and Mercedes, now that they have the interesting cars and are scoring most of the wins. Still, having five different drivers with both the chops and the car to deliver multiple wins is AMAZING and speaks well for the rest of the season.
Have you ever done the race ratings in a similar way by starting with who finished P20 up to P1? I think I would find that easier to follow. Just a thought, love you all and thanks for the summer content ❤
Fun fact: Williams is the only team this year to have not brought upgrades to their car. Watch them cook in the rest of the year
nah that starting segment messed with my brain in every single way 😭😭
Piastri has easily had a better season than Lando. I'm almost positive every bad result he has had this season was no fault of his own.
That intro is absolutely cursed. I was so caught off guard by it that i had to watch it three times 😂
A this point my highlight of the week is always the intro in these videos!
Huge Danny Ricc fan here.... How comes everyone always forgets his form improved dramatically after the chasis change?
I came here to say the same thing. I think part of it is because VCARB played it off as "we did it just to make him happy" basically saying "there's nothing wrong with the car he's just delusional". Which was just picked up and the chasis change was written off.
lol Except there is absolute no evidence or even suggestion by the team that the chassis had anything to do with the performance.
@@tak8261 I mean I would say that his performance has markedly improved since the change is pretty strong evidence. And of course VCARB isn’t going to turn around and say “we were wrong it was a botched chassis”.
That would admit they messed up the chassis and that they told Ric and the media that nothing was wrong when there was.
@@EliYis Or maybe he just started performing better? The team themselves have continuously denied the chassis has any impact, and so have many experts.
Correlation and causation are entirely different. Your logic is the same as saying Sainz won because he removed his appendix.
@@tak8261 I’m not trying to say it’s for sure causation - don’t get me wrong. And I also fully believe that his performance has improved. Not all of his improvement can be down to a chassis.
But what I am trying to say we also can’t rule it out just because the team said it wasn’t a factor, especially when their expertise or perception of it could be negatively impacted. That’s all.
Carlos not being at least top five in either list is kinda crazy…. 😅
Piastri could’ve challenged for his first win already in silverstone, mclaren strategy really screwed him over. I feel like he could go to the top soon
38:59 Austria-Hungary? I didn’t know Tommy is that old 😳
What were Fan Driver Ratings, out of curiosity?
Russell behind Hamilton is atrocious from Tommy, was trouncing him until 3 races ago.
@@OK-fi4yq And each one of them, something happened that wasn’t his fault.
You're talking about 0.1 here
Luck
No it’s not dummy. Lewis has more wins, podiums and points..all while George is the favorited driver
@@JohnnyChimpo69did you see the H2H gap in both the race and qualifying after Austria? George had 26 points on Lewis at the time. Then George got 3 weekends ruined in a row which turned the tables. I know George ain't popular and Lewis is but we gotta stop being blinded by opinions
Having Logan at 20 and not Zhou is criminal, Zhou has been dreadful every race this year
And we all had 0 expectations and thought championship off after week 1… honestly props to f1 and the cost cap for making the grid actually competitive
I love your podcast!
Very interesting video as always. It would've been cool to know the peoples averages too
About time this came
it’s always unlucky with Oscar and bad driving from Lando when there is a mistake odd; the McLaren fumbles are only considered when they effect Oscar, they have literally cost Lando more points than his own mistakes; he is literally 13:4 against Oscar in Quali H2H yet Oscar is rated higher be so for real right now
exactly this ^ i’ve said this in another reply but it doesn’t matter when mclaren pit norris and piastri, it doesn’t matter who gets pit priority,if norris pits first,people instantly say mclaren prioritised lando with better strategy and undercut, if piastri pits first, people say mclaren gave norris better strategy and left piastri vulnerable to a safety car. anything that doesn’t work in piastris favour is instantly mclaren prioritising lando and whatever
people also use the narrative that oscar is a young prodigy.. sure he is new to f1 but he's 1 year younger??
No way your comparing the basic numbers of from the quli head to head. There average gap is like 0.030 seconds lmao. And not really. Oscar has been called out belgium he lost the win from over shooting is box, making his mistake in austria, Spain for being off the pace? And lando gets stick to, for his starts, like Hungary, belgium, China etc.
Hmmm, maybe McLarens are a bit high? I know they have had some bad luck, like McLaren's bad strategy in Silverstone, Verstappen taking out Norris in Austria, and Sainz taking out Piastri in Miami, but I think the Mercs and Ferraris have done a more even job based on their packages so far this season. Mercedes have more wins than McLaren this season - that has to say something. Maybe Leclerc, Norris, Hamilton, Sainz, Russell, Piastri?
Oscars is graded as a year 2 driver and Lando is graded as a championship contender.
I think that's why Oscar might get 8/10 for a P5 when Lando would get a 6/10 for that same P5.
Based on Oscar's recent results he needs to be graded at the same level of scrutiny that Lando is since he clearly has the skill.
Yeh but that shouldn’t be how it’s graded… it should be graded based on how their drives were regardless of how new they are to the sport
@@TomC8042 that's what I was trying to convey. Maybe I failed haha
yes exactly! when lando fumbles a win, he gets slandered for it even when he beats oscar cuz people expect him to win every race with the fastest car. when oscar fumbles a win (Belgium pit stop errror that cost him two secomds) people congratulate him for at least challenging for the win and beating norris so he feels no pressure at all and i’m sick of people saying that oscar is preforming “under pressure” like what pressure?! no one expects him to win every race and no one slanders him for not doing so like they do with lando. the expectations for both of them are totally different, if you wanna say that oscar is equal or better than lando then at least have similar expectations for them… the problem is no one rates lando fairly, he is either “the best driver ever” and gets DOTD from his fan girls or he is “washed Throwins and doesn’t deserve to be put in the class of top drivers”
plus you are right, in canada lando got 9/10 for 2nd and oscar got 8/10 for 5th but in belgium oscar got 9/10 for 2nd and lando only got 6/10 for 5th. i also think landos 5th place in belgium was better than oscar’s 5th place in canada cuz belgium was more competitive while in canada, both ferraris were no where and perez was washed so 5th place is the lowest piastri should be finishing. at least in belgium, sainz actually led the race at one point and perez was less washed then usual so… and before people bring up the russell DSQ, even if we look at the times, norris finished 6-7 seconds ahead of piastri in canada and piastri finished 8-9 seconds ahead of norris in belgium and keep in mind that canada had a SC while belgium did not. i don’t think a total time difference of two seconds equates to 6/10 instead of 8/10 like piastri got
Back in the day, Lando was always getting all the love from fans when he raced against guys like Ricciardo and Sainz. You didn't seem to mind him being praised so much, right? And wasn't it because he was newer and still managed to keep up with the more experienced guys? Now that the tables have turned, why do you propose Oscar being judged against the same standards as his much experienced teammate? Even though he's still learning? For example, there was even a track he visited for the first time this season. Drove with a broken rib. Lando's fever gets even more media attention before a race. The hypocrisy! Oscar also admitted to his mistake in Spa but do we see him sulking?
Honestly, if you look at the cars and their levels throughout the upgrade war, the performances, the crests and dips in form, qualifyings, podiums, wins and the standings... Its Max, then the next 6 are very much debatable when you consider their results, machinery, conditions, mechanical failures, etc. Credit to Verstappen for making it work even when hes had to fight, but clearly its getting much tougher!
WHAT A SEASON!!! MAY IT CONTINUE🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
Props to the editor - you almost can’t spot it when Tommy’s camera brakes 😂
How about rating them on recent form eg, over the last five races? Would be an interesting comparison vs the overall first half to see who’s building momentum
I didn't even realise that Logan hadn't been officially announced as leaving by Williams... I wonder if that means they're still considering an in-season swap (cough Kimi Antonelli cough) and don't want to say "leaving at the end of the season" if they get the opportunity to give him the boot earlier...
Tommy’s argument of Lando under delivering compared to Oscar is literally nonsensical. Up 11-3 in qualy and 9-5 in races is Lando. Same number of wins. Lando 2 poles to Oscar’s zero. In every single statistical category he has out performed Oscar. If you’re making this statement based off the fact you think he should have delivered more with the car he’s had…that same argument should be applied to Oscar. Same car you know. Yes Lando’s wasted a few win chances but he’s more regularly in those positions than Oscar has been. Seems like they’re being judged against different standards which I didn’t think was the point here.
Caveman level of argument there going purely off the H2H without looking at any context, or the ACTUAL REASON why people are saying Lando is underdelivering what the car is capable of.
They ARE being judged against different standards. The simple truth is that more is expected of Lando as the more experienced driver. Still not convinced? Look at the rating given to Bearman. No way that would have been scored a 10 had it not been a last minute debut.
Of course they’re being judged by different standards Lando is in his 6th year, Oscar is in his 2nd. Of course more is expected of Lando, he should be performing better for his experience and how fast the car is.
Zhou should've been p20
My top 10:
1. VER
2. LEC
3. NOR
4. RUS
5. PIA
6. SAI
7. HAM
8. HUL
9. ALO
10.TSU
I think you gave Lando a bit too much credit and Hulk deserved a top 5 at the very least
@@jujuhu5567 Lando is current P2 in the standings with a reasonable advantage over P3 and has scored 8 podiums, just 1 less than Max. Sure he belongs in the top 3 at half season.
@@soundscape26With only 20 points adventage (in the fastest or close second fastest car in last 8 weekends) over leclerc who didn’t score points in 3 races this year and it currently driving a tractor
@@Wickey934 Up till Monaco the Ferrari was solid and Charles always finished in the top 4. Carlos did fine in that period as well, so they sure weren't driving tractors. That's why the difference is only 20 points.
Not saying Lando is having an amazing season but sure, what's your top 3 so far?
@@soundscape26 Considering the car Lando is driving more than half of the season his results are just underwhelming. Same with Oscar, I don't think his results are that impressive looking at the car.
My top 3 would be: Verstappen (obviously), Leclerc (3 bad weekends, but his consistency through the season is great), Russell (unlucky, amazing h2h stats against Lewis)
@@Wickey934 Fair list though many would give you some flak for the absence of any McLaren driver.
Pretty good average scoring boys!! I know some people like to hate race to race but these averages are legit! Cant wait for the second half of the season
Zhou has been worst than Logan this year. Too much sympathy for him for some reason.
I like how for P6 Tommy became Canadian.
The fact that you have to disclaimer for team LH…😂😂😂
I would actually have Oscar higher graded because apparently in the race he was given the win and the 2 afterwards he did all with a broken rib.
Oscar came out with the info a few days ago.
Edit: he apparently had the broken rib around the time of the Austrian GP
Agreed. Austria, he was in the fight for the win, Silverstone, data suggests he could have won if not for McLarens decision not to double stack, Hungary, we all know what happened there (Though he DID deserve the W, Landos behaviour tarnished the outcome) and He was a genuine contender at Spa as well. So the TLDR is, Oscar is coming along very nicely.
@@peterjmgamer1998 Piastri is the most overrated driver om the grid currently...
Would be interesting to know what the fans rankings are..😢
My top 5 would be
1st verstappen
2nd norris
3rd hamilton
4th piastri
5th leclerc
Completely ignoring George. Him and Lewis have been both been in the top three this season.
@@gameofender4463 yeah but hamilton has out perform him alot this season and there are 7 different winners to choose from
@@beaversquad2332 Except he hasn’t. George is leading both H2Hs. And if not for that disqualification he’d be the only driver other than Max to win more than one race.
@@gameofender4463 but George hasn't won and deserved it at all this season while the others have
@@beaversquad2332 He won in Austria by being the best of the rest. All the others had the chance to be there, but it was George who was there at the right time for it. And would’ve won at Belgium if not for the team under-weighing his car.
Oscar has a champions mentality. Like Leclerc, Sainz, Russell, Hamilton, Alonso and Verstappen. Hope McLaren can continue their form because that guy is just getting started. He must have been gutted during his first few races and it's good to see he picked well.
Secondly, hoping Newey can work his magic before Alonso leaves.