Skeptic PRESSES Johnathan Pageau on Christianity & Instantly REGRETS It
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- Опубліковано 16 жов 2024
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I don’t think your reflections on miracles line up with what Pageau said about miracles.
They think it's about "Knowing" the truth, but that's not even how reality works, it's about faith and trust, in you, in your family, in the community, almost everything in life it's about trust/faith, almost everything in life it's uncertain, they want us to be certain about God when it's not even possible to be certain about life itself, and neither over mundane simple things. Their premise is wrong, of course God is about faith, faith it's the ultimate mode of being.
I've made almost the exact same point to a friend of mine and he still tried to take the high ground saying "Well, at least I admit I'm illogical". I find that it happens a lot with the New Atheist/Hyper Skeptic mindset. People will try to put a standard on Christianity that no belief system can actually meet, but when you call them out on it they just try to say no one can know any answers. It's like they start losing at chess so they just flip the board over so nobody can play anymore.
Yeah you make a good point, a lot of people tend to devolve into solipsism when they're losing, especially if they stand on their position for superficial reasons.
See my immediate thought would be to ask why no one can know any answers. How did they come to that conclusion? How can they TRUST this belief is indeed true?
That’s when you go for the finishing move. Tell them about who Jesus is and how he came to save them. He will save them from themselves and the sin full nature
@@Hmfirestormz Finishing move makes me think of wrestling. Can you imagine if Jesus showed up with a Rock Bottom then finished off with the People's Elbow and that's how people get saved? 🤭
It’s like trying to play chess with a pigeon.
You move Bishop to e5 and in response they knock all the pieces off the table, poop on the board and then strut about over the carnage as if they’ve won the game 😂
If he actually seeks truth with all his heart, he will certainly find Jesus.
this conversation went on for sometime and it didn't take on any nasty tone by the participants - by Internet social media standards - that's a positive
Or not.
@mark0bravo
Right. Just ask God already.
It’s not about finding Jesus..according to the story Jesus finds us..worrying about the book whether it’s right,true or important is useless. Books we humans create help eachother but they will always change according to the culture and time frame you live in on planet earth
happened to me, so it does happen
"You base your existence on trust not on facts", That statement is etched in my head forever.
so all trust is equal? why would we value calling something a fact unless its gone through rigorous testing and verification so that we now have better understanding of it's reliability?
@@brianbridges8124 no I don't think that is the point but a bias can influence a fact no matter how many times you test it so it still requires us to trust.
@@bh5317 yes, but the chances of our bias affecting outcomes in scientific research become reduced significantly the the more rigorous, precise and reliable we make the testing conditions.
facts that have gone through tedious double blind studies to remove bias are far more trustworthy than religious claims about Gods, that can never be investigated, because one can be demonstrated physically and the other cannot..
@brianbridges8124 no there not the double blinded test still have high amounts of bises in them to say otherwise is like saying scientists are the only one's without bises thats a joke
@@brianbridges8124 I would disagree, If the premise is false then the testing can be manipulated to match the premise. However, I do agree that the ability to recreate results when testing yields a more trustworthy result.
It is also good to understand that there are billions of scientific results reproduced every day, but they aren't necessarily studied in a lab but still prove to be the most effective "experiments". Too often scientists produce something that in testing works but in reality, fails.
This interaction was absolute GOLD. Pray for Jake, fam!
They profess themselves to be wise but whallow in their folly... Always learning but never able to come to the knowledge of the Truth.
Preach it man.
the guy is going out and engaging, though - if he keeps that up, keeps up the attitude that compels him to do that, I think in time he'll find his way to Truth
Yes, Romans 1:22 comes to mind, definitely!
My question is how did this man get Jonathan The Legend Pageau on his channel. . . Please Jonathan come on mine and talk with me about this stuff!
This was amazing.
Yes, I thought that, this guy has less than 300 subs and Jonathan doesn't normally go for debate style. Enjoying it tho
I would be happy to answer this question -- and I hope I get to tell the FULL story in a conversation with @RuslanKD
@@jakenewfield Hahah you're good
@@jakenewfield LOL gotta respect the hustle.
I was wondering the same thing.
“Every scientific discovery has an expiration date. You don’t know when it is, but its there. All scientific/arch discoveries are there until something else comes up. That is not the type of foundation that you base your life on” -Jonathan Pageau
Unlike religions who dogmas NEVER change even in the face of contrary scientific evidence, it's what makes apologists feel safe and secure.
@@kingsman428 As Pageau said, positions in science always changes. Science doesn’t say anything, scientists do. So today you might think there is scientific evidence against christianity, but tomorrow you might see it supports christianity when you look deeper.
@@kingsman428 take the Universe breakers for example. Mayority of scientists thought the Earth is 4.5 billion years old. They thought, that there was scientific evidence that proved this. But with the James Webb telescope, there is scientific evidence of Universe breakers which suggests the Earth is some hundred million years younger. So you can see, when scientists think they have it one way, it could actually be the other, no matter how smart and advanced they are. Perhaps through more research they will find Earth is even younger!
@@marcocortes9968 *"...Scientist thought the Earth was 4.5 billion years old..."*
They still do
*"...they thought there was scientific evidence that proved this..."*
There is and lots of it.
*"...James Webb Telescope..."*
Except the James Webb doesn't analyse Earth.
*"...suggests the Earth is 100,000,000 years younger..."*
The approximate age is 4.5 billion years +/- 1%.
If you do the maths that's an error span of 90,000,000 years.
*"...when scientists think it's one way it could be the other..."*
Yeah that's what the +/- error percentage means.
*"...more research...find the Earth is younger..."*
That's every young Earth creationist's wet dream but that will never happen because there is too much reliable evidence that puts Earth's age at 4.5 billion years.
.
*"...Scientist thought the Earth was 4.5 billion years old..."*
They still do
*"...they thought there was scientific evidence that proved this..."*
There is and lots of it.
*"...James Webb Telescope..."*
Except the James Webb doesn't analyse Earth.
*"...suggests the Earth is 100,000,000 years younger..."*
The approximate age is 4.5 billion years +/- 1%.
If you do the maths that's an error span of 90,000,000 years.
*"...when scientists think it's one way it could be the other..."*
Yeah that's what the +/- error percentage means.
*"...more research...find the Earth is younger..."*
That's every young Earth creationist's wet dream but that will never happen because there is too much reliable evidence that puts Earth's age at 4.5 billion years.
.
I have gone back and forth struggling in belief before, but I kept seeking; Jesus revealed himself to me in amazing ways once I got desperate enough for His love and guidance. Some call this getting to the end of yourself and some call it hitting rock bottom. Jesus is real and He loves us all.
Through the prayers of our holy fathers, Lord Jesus Christ our God, have mercy on us, and save us.
Mr. Pageau has that Patristics Symbolic apologetics, and I'm here for it. 😂
If anyone didn’t know Johnathan is an Eastern Orthodox Christian. This gives context to his responses.
Based
are you pretending that he is drawing from a wisdom that is unavailable to non-orthodox Christian?
@@silveriorebelo2920Not pretending. Orthodoxy is a way of life and also influences your thought process. If you come form the more legalistic, Western background I understand why this would be a reply you might leave. Not saying it’s good or bad. But yes, he would have a different view than what a Westerner may have because he is following an Eastern thought process that was given to us from the Eastern Fathers. Western Christians, in particular Protestants,have no frame of reference to the Church Fathers because most of their denominations were founded in modernity. So no, Protestants do not have an ancient wisdom that the Orthodox have as part of their history.
@@attkdriver Well, that depends. The Protestants who forget their roots have that issue, but we all go back to the same origins, so Protestants shouldn't think there was a gap from the last Apostle to Martin Luther. I think there is a tendency to do just that because of the unfortunate anti-Catholic bias, but it shouldn't be that way.
@@attkdriver how about the fact that he doesn't stem from denomination rather understanding of Christianity
Jonathan isn’t just 10 steps ahead of this kid, he’s lapping him… and the kid thinks he’s winning 😂
@@mark0bravo some people are so far behind in the race they think they’re ahead
@@mark0bravo Jonathan seems like a fideist
Now faith is the substance of things hoped for and the evidence of things unseen.
As a baby Christian I never understood why in the gospels Jesus said “those who have ears let them hear” until very recently it finally clicked for me.
There’s definitely a time and a place for apologetics and debate but at a certain point it’s all vapor in the wind. Some will never get it.
This was fire. We all need more Ruslan reaction videos of Pageau content!
In 2024, I have no clue how we still have people who blindly “trust the science”. I always tell my son, “wait a few years and their truth will change”
Exactly. In a span of 5 years, we had “scientists” caving in to the political pressure of certain communities and are now declaring that women can have male organs and vice versa.
Whole lot of people didn't trust the science and they couldn't be happier now that it has changed. 💉💉💉
Anyone who says "the science" is either trying to deceive or is ignorant about science.
Unlike religion which is stagnating since the bronze age.
@@Alien1375 decent morals don’t stagnate
Praying for Jake he comes to Christ. There's something that is humble about him. E.g. You can't tell me many people would accept concede to debates. That's very commendable. He just needs to humble himself before God.
I agree. His questioning is a normal process. He is searching for truth and he is accepting and open to having his understanding challenged. God love him. He is speaking to his honesty about why he is seeking out a Jonathan as he wants what he believes to be expert knowledge.
Love seeing Jonathan Pageau feisty
IDK who Jonathan Pageau is, but I love his laugh & respond posture 😅
He’s an Orthodox Christian writer and theologian. I strongly suggest his content.
He shows up a lot with Jordan Peterson
He is an iconographer and orthodox christian
@@spikestoyou Thank You!
@@spikestoyou Sweet 😎
Jonathan is Quebec's pride !
Pride comes before the fall. Honor however is blessed by God. Jonathan honors Quebec.
Christianity’s pride
@@PatronSaintSpyridon there's a few definition of pride, give me a break
I thought that was French
@@FernandoGarcia-zs9cp He speaks French too! :)
I’m new to this channel, but you guys as commentators fit so well with the perspective they show. The grasp on the subject, and being able to articulate it back to the viewer to ensure understanding is very helpful!
Leftist/Athiest: "Why would you follow a Bronze Age book?
ALSO: "Save our Democracy"
ME: "The Republic" by Plato was written around 380 BCE, 430 years before Jesus started preaching.
This is the first federalist constitutional republic and is not based on a book.
@@psyience3213 Its even older than you think "Athenian democracy developed around the 6th century BC " Also lots of Greak Citys States were Repulbics. Plato just wrote about politics providing written proof. Your constitution is words written on paper LOL. Yes no books used Ha Ha Ha.
@@psyience3213the founders were incredibly learned men, and while they had created something sui generis, it was informed by the prevailing liberal political philosophy of the era; books like the Leviathan were incredibly influential on them. It was a collaborative effort by the aristocracy to create an aristicratic system
Yeah I don't think Plato even liked democracy
@@NoName-xc6cg Doesn't matter, it's still that old.
Jonathan Pageau, on fire as always 🔥
I need more of Pageau.
Yes, the Bible was written by humans whose hands were led by God✨
Moses and Paul by direct revelation from God?
Exodus 33:11
"11Thus the LORD used to speak to Moses face to face, as a man speaks to his friend. When Moses turned again into the camp, his assistant Joshua the son of Nun, a young man, would not depart from the tent."
Did Joshua write down all the revelation from Moses? The first five books.
Paul Called by God Galatians 1:11-24
For I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it, but I received it through a revelation of Jesus Christ.
11For I would have you know, brothers, that the gospel that was preached by me is not man’s gospel. 12For I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it, but I received it through a revelation of Jesus Christ. 13For you have heard of my former life in Judaism, how I persecuted the church of God violently and tried to destroy it. 14And I was advancing in Judaism beyond many of my own age among my people, so extremely zealous was I for the traditions of my fathers. 15But when he who had set me apart before I was born, and who called me by his grace, 16was pleased to reveal his Son toe me, in order that I might preach him among the Gentiles, I did not immediately consult with anyone; 17nor did I go up to Jerusalem to those who were apostles before me, but I went away into Arabia, and returned again to Damascus.
18Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to visit Cephas and remained with him fifteen days. 19But I saw none of the other apostles except James the Lord’s brother. 20(In what I am writing to you, before God, I do not lie!) 21Then I went into the regions of Syria and Cilicia. 22And I was still unknown in person to the churches of Judea that are in Christ. 23They only were hearing it said, “He who used to persecute us is now preaching the faith he once tried to destroy.” 24And they glorified God because of me.
Said the humans.....
@@porschajohnson1890 According to who?
Thanks for your content, sir. Your testimony is powerful, and never forget the reason you do this.
Why use the scientific method for history. Plus, the scientific method REQUIRES observation and for it to be repeatable.
It seems that the questions were in good faith…. These are exactly the questions that i used to have.
@@rduse4125 you mean to tell me that George Washington didn’t chop down a cherry tree??!! /s
2:45 "Huh." Wholesome moment 😊God bless this guy for his interest in Christianity, even if he's not there yet 🙏
I'm praying for Jake.
“ …science is not certainlty, every scientific discovery has an expiration date on it…”
Unlike religious dogma which has been stagnating for centuries.
@@Alien1375 You are comparing chemestry and pyshics to Law and self improvement LOL. How is knowing a better chemical process going to solve my nieghbour stealing stuff?
@@BeachandHills-hb2pq why are you concerned with it?
@@BeachandHills-hb2pq Read the first comment before you react.
@@Alien1375 idly egnough I read yours and commented. You can’t solve a biology problem using history. As an example. You want a stable marriage complaing thing don’t change and is a dogma dose not stop you still wanting a stable marriage. Marriage councilers don’t use partial acceleration to fix a relationship.
The nonbeliever has to work so hard to uphold their disbelief in God rather than to just let go and allow their faith to do the work, even though their faith is constantly at work anyway, and upholds all of their worldly understanding anyway. It must be exhausting to them, and sadly they will struggle constantly in life and their eternity will be infinitely more difficult. All of this is driven out of their refusal to submit to God.
Let go of what?
Pride. Playing God instead of trusting Him.
@@Hello-bi1pm let go of the need for scientific proof in order to have faith in God.
Apparently it is pridefull not to believe in zombies.
To paraphrase Jordan Peterson, there are no atheists, just people who are angry at God. I've found that to be very true.
Great episode. I had a very good end of my night.
Thank you guys. Excellent attitude. Lot of fun.
Christ changing lives today is evidence He is risen indeed ❤
@RuslanKD thank you for reviewing my discussion with Jonathan! I'd love to speak with you; how can I get in touch?
I'd love to tell you what I told Jonathan AFTER our call. I think you'd be surprised.
I love this interviewer- so sincere and open.
You live your life everyday by faith trusting the people around you. It's the same way how we are saved by Jesus Christ by believing on him alone. He asks us for at least a mustard seed of faith and he'll hold us in his hand forever and ever
Jake can't prove to me that he exists, using his own standards.
Give it another 20 years and we won't be able to tell if it's a human or deepfake AI hosting a podcast.
Pageau is too civil, every few years he pops up and absolutely cooks someone. RIP to that guy.
I think he is the best at cooking people in debates like this but just hates doing it
Jake is so overwhelmed with, what Jonathan is saying his mind is blown and spinning. This is a pivotal moment for Jake. I hope he leans into it and sees Jesus there.
There are an incredible amount of things we “know” about George Washington, Columbus, and the Mayans that we were forced to be taught in school and they are straight up lies.
@@lucio989 Just like creationism but luckily, that's no longer taught.
@@kingsman428 what part of creationism is a lie? I think telling kids the universe magically exploded from nothing and life somehow came from that nothing is a lie.
@@lucio989 Read that back to yourself and replace the word nothing with God.
@@kingsman428 if God made everything that makes perfect sense. If you look around and wonder where everything came from, Occam’s razor says God created everything. That’s the simplest explanation. It would be beyond a stretch to say nothing created everything. That sounds stupid. Everyone knows if God exists he obviously could create everything. We know all about nothing and can’t get nothing to create anything.
@@lucio989 *"...Occam's razor says..."*
The simplest explanation is the most likely.
So you want me to believe that a supernatural being who is eternal and exists beyond space and time created absolutely everything out of nothing as being the most simple explanation?
Nothwithstanding being the most fantastic and complex idea known to man that's what you're going with after quoting Occam's razor 😂
*"...we know all about nothing..."*
That's the problem, we don't know. Perhaps you ought to read about field theory and nothingness.
*"...nothing to create anything..."*
Quantum mechanics observes particles popping into existence from nothing. See above comment about the problem of nothingness and field theory.
Truth is science is humble enough to say _"we don't know the origins of the universe"_
On the other hand, apologists are so arrogant and full of false confidence they are foolish enough to claim to know what is unknown and try to pass it off as truth.
Delusion is a wonderful thing because it allows you to believe what ever you want.
This dude just walked in for his first day in the boxing gym and got thrown in with the heavyweight.😅
Poor guy
If you look into Eucharist Miracles- it shows supernatural and has so much scientific evidence. ❤
Jake! The fact that you got this debate with only 300 subs is a miracle in itself! ❤ Brother, I cannot wait to witness your testimony of your salvation! You’re going to be a warrior for the Lord in your circle! I’m here for it!
Family, please pray for Jake because the Lord most certainly has a plan for him!❤❤✝️✝️
I'm reminded of the Enlightenment vs. Romantics of the 18th-19th century. Kudos to this guy for speaking to Pageau. He just wants to know and understand. Good on him! These conversations are necessary.
the kid is very confused but to his credit he did a great job in American Pie. 😂
😂😂😂
The key statement he made came under the umbrella statement that "you trust in more than you think " when he said "the world that you live in is based on trust. It's not based on facts." I have heard a preacher say the following in a sermon: it is not your belief in the laws of gravity(read science) that affords you the faith(read trust) necessary to sit in this chair. You just go on and sit in the chair without thinking about it,never doubting whether or not it can support you. Now we are talking about something that you can see, touch and for all purposes,quantify through your senses yet you trust it and the laws of gravity without a second thought. Now if the just walk by faith and not by sight, then that must mean that there are some things that can be known about the God of the Bible evidenced by His track record that allow anyone (read afford everyone) to trust Him, believe in Him and take Him at His Word that He doesn't fail,that He is truth, that He is omniscient,etc...". To make it painfully obvious, we trust that each breath we take isn't poisonous and will allow us to live to take another breath or do anything else. We trust in EVERYTHING we don't think about from moment to moment because God affords such a luxury by virtue of the fact the He upholds the whole of reality including every scientific law we do and don't know.
Love (non-physical) dictates how you (physical) act.
You literally have the supernatural and natural working together in your everyday life.
Yes. We start with values, and values dictate how we use and understand facts.
This dude is on a case for Christ journey
It's metaphorically and actually true that Jesus rose from the dead. It just is. All the naturalistic explanations for it fall short. Jesus didn't just appear to the 12 and poof. He stuck around for a while and appeared to at least 500 men. He ate with people and let them touch his wounds.
@@johndoh795 And the witnesses who told the story were all martyred for it. Someone might die for an illusion but not for a lie. And Charles Colson (of the Nixon administration) pointed out that the Watergate conspiracy broke down in a few days. The Christian “conspiracy” lasted though the lives of the conspirators and another 2000+ years.
It takes FAITH to be saved, To follow Jesus:). Jesus is the Good News.
Peace
Atheism is over 😂 JP is killing it
Jake has a ruler and is trying to measure intangible things that are real....
That ruler’s name? Satan
Ask him to use a weighing machine to find out how much or less his loved ones love him.
People who think that history is established using the scientific method need a hug.
And a patronising pat on the head.
God bless Jake
It's amazing to me how hard someone will argue to be wrong and close minded because they believe in themselves so much more than the obvious truth that God exists and the creator of all things.
Great video and commentary. Pageau was on his A-game here
10:21 "The world that you live in is based off trust, it's not based on facts "
If God exists then miracles are possible.
Exactly
1 Corinthians 12:3
3 Therefore I make known to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God calls Jesus accursed, and no one can say that Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit.
This sparring is why Orthodox theology will win
Win over what?
@@sweatt4237 Over all philosophy and thinking
@@hrossaman Oh ok. Can someone be saved outside of the Orthodox church?
@@sweatt4237 I'm not personally Orthodox, I'm a recovering evangelical. But I believe the Orthodox answer is "yes". They say they know where the true church is, not where it isn't.
@@hrossaman Just checking. Seems to me there is no reason to join the orthodox or catholic church then. Jesus is enough. God Bless.
"I'm just not going to win this argument"
You know they're just childish and insincere about seeking truth, when their goal is just to win the argument, not learning what the other side thinks and actually find the truth.
Interestingly, CosmicSkeptic talking to Peterson feels like he's grown a lot from this frame of mindset, and seems to have mellowed out.
Jake: I don’t want to answer for you.
*proceeds to assume his answer*
Just discovered this channel! Subscribed!
Watched it twice. Thank you.
Interviewer: "Why didn't God inspire the bible to say 'In the beginning there was nothing except me, and then I did this and then over a billion years this happened, and over another billion years this happened...' Why did he make it seem so fantastical?"
Dr. Guy: "That description would have seemed fantastical to anyone up to 50 years ago, and that description would seem primitive in a thousand years. There is no description other than poetry that could possibly be timeless."
UA-cam Interview with The Pope's Astronomer.
It’s quite telling when someone says they are offbeat inclined to disbelieve something yet lose all their objections as well we just can’t know for sure
In my opinion at 20:53, the whole argument was finished, he said you cannot prove LOVE...so he has said that you cannot prove God...because God is LOVE! And at 24:10, you cannot prove Love and Truth (Christ is Truth)...That is why you cannot prove God! (1 John 4:8, John 14:6).
We all walk by faith. Whether we acknowledge it or not. It's a fact.
You should react to more Pageau stuff, i enjoyed this
I witnessed God speaking to me and I trust God way more than any human saying God doesnt exist.
I’m always amazed at people faith in “scientific methods”. Forgetting it was a bunch of humans that articulated them
and even then it fails much: e. g. the Shroud of Turin wasn't tested properly so the Carbon dating was dictating a different year. Turned out they took a mended piece to sample 🤦
I have faith in scientific methods, but I also realize they are a set of tools in a whole tool shop. Many scientists assert that everything falls in the domain of science and must be proven scientifically, but they rarely use those tools in their own lives. They trust their spouses, have political opinions, and believe or disbelieve court verdicts. Every single basic scientific principle is axiomatic (taken for granted). For example, we assume constants don't change with distance and time (and some are now questioning that).
@@LepantoLemonade Yes this is so crazy
I thank you lord Jesus christ
I love people who say, “there is no truth “
thats basically like seeing a dictionary and then saying theres no evidence anyone compiled that information.
17:03 was a good point in my opinion (I’m a Christian myself). If there is a claim that is less probable, given what we know, there must be greater evidence to support the claim.
If we want to convince people of a supernatural world which has less evidence then a natural world, we must provide the evidence. Of course, by definition, you might not provide equal amounts of evidence. In the sense, that of course there will be less witnesses of tornadoes than cloudy weather because it happens less often. But, I won’t take one witness to believe a tornado (supposing I’ve never seen one) happened in my neighborhood in comparison to believing in cloudy weather happening in my neighborhood.
That asides there is a good amount of evidence. But, to put where credit is due, it was a good point.
Hey Zach, it would be really cool if y’all put a link to the videos that you’re talking about each episode. That way we can go here hear for ourselves Just by clicking on a link through your page .
Jake is tagged in the video and it’s on the screen
@@RuslanKDahh. I see it now. Sorry I’m old. And didn’t know what tagged meant. It’s the first thing that comes up when I click on it. Thanks y’all 😂
RIP Jake, Lord have mercy on
I do think there should be a balance between the apologetic(reasons) side and the meaning side. Yo do not need to believe in God because of logic and reason,but your believe should be rational (make sense)
But Jonathan is right,most of what we consider knowledge we "get" through trusting people and generally people we consider "experts". Especially History, because we can't use the scientific method to prove historical events.
I basically agree, but I've always been suspicious of the touchy-feely arguments. I know a lot of devout Hindus who believe Hinduism is real for the same reasons we think Christianity is real. However, I think Hinduism fails when rationally tested.
We love it!!
This reminds me of the episode of its always sunny - when Mac sits the gang down to get them off the “science fence” . I love it
One thing that helps me whenever it comes to these kinds of discussions is to limit the ability for scientific reasoning to produce any kind of truth period there's no such thing as truth that can be derived via the scientific method, there are hypotheses supported by evidence that is all you get. Any suggestion that truth can be figured out by evidence, is ignorant of the capacity of the person asking the question.And it's tantamount to treating science as a religion
Hats off to everyone involved in this debate. Zach and Ruslan did very well with the commentary (probably the best material that I've heard from Zach). Hats off to Mr. Pageau as well, not sure how the interview was arranged, but a lot of well-known people would not have bothered speaking to someone without hundreds of thousands of followers. I think that it took Jake some courage to interview Mr. Pageau as well and I respect that he was willing to admit some faults in his logic. Very well done by everyone, directly and indirectly involved.
I love Ruslan's definition of miracle. I'm going to write that down - because (praise God) I've noticed a multitude of miracles in my own life. It would be proper for us to count them, be thankful for them, and even grow in faith to anticipate the next one.
I like how this video basically affirms that even McDowell and Craig are answering the wrong questions and playing the wrong game. Don't concede the premise, and the conclusion can't follow.
It's this new kind of Christian apologetics that I'm struggling to wrap my head around. Like, they sidestep the "real" aspect of the faith and I don't get how that's possible
This guy would be a difficult juror. "12 witnesses but no physical evidence from the crime? Definately didn't happen."
“…He has put Eternity on the Hearts of Men…” Ecclesiastes 3:11 It’s literally in the Bible He denies, but it’s practically what came out of His mouth
I never heard of this Jake guy but he seems like he isn’t ready for this kind of debate.
Trying to figure out when the debate got HEATED 🤔
You must not know Jonathan lol. This was heated for him. Btw, Jake titled the video that.
I really dont get into these conversations with people. All I do is bring you the good news. After that, it's between you and God. I will try. Im not callus about it. But once I realize it's not going anywhere, I back off. Hopefully, i planted a seed.
I read in a new age magazine (new dawn?) in the early 90’s, it was trying to say that the stories and descriptions were written in a language of the time and so they didn’t have words to describe spaceships and alien beings and such, so they can only describe it in mythical descriptions. I’m Christian, it was the first time I read such things so it was intriguing.
Their concept of heavens and eternity was that our memories are downloaded and uploaded into new bodies that are like god, you can actually interact and fight like in computer games and respawn new bodies when you die, there was no such concept as fear.
My best friend was in this weird religion called Raelien at the time, early teens, weed 90’s. We used to talk about far out concepts that are actually real today or even worth debating about. Jesus is God.❤
ev1l is not "worth debating about."
This is similar to a debate John Lennox and Richard Dawkins had. Lennox humorously used the example to highlight an issue with Dawkins’ argumentation. The audience thought it was quite funny but at the same time it wasn’t a harsh gotcha moment. It was funny and reasonable attempt to bridge understanding of faith or belief in something where supplying evidence is difficult or not possible
I’m pretty sure this guy just called into Jay Dyer’s latest call in.
He mentioned pressing Jonathan P as a skeptic and he used a similar line of questioning
Even the presence and location of Mars are a matter of trust for him, not science...he didn't do the science, he simply believes and trusts the stories he has been told about it.
Ah yes, the tried and true materialist argument: Why won't you put God in this box?
Jonathan: You can't put God in a box.
Jake: But you have to put God in this box though.
Jonathan: You can't put God in a box.
Jake: Ok, let's try it a different way. Put God in the box.
Jonathan: 🤦♂🤦♂
Thank You!
Cognitive dissonance at its finest
To be fair, we're all full of cognitive dissonance, but it's just easier to see it in others.
The creation story has stood against the science of whatever time and the more we learn about reality from science, the more we see how the creation story holds up scientifically, if man wants to accept it or not. Man may or may not want to accept that they are subject to God but we are.
I wonder how J Warner Wallace from Cold Case Christianity would feel about the sentiment of forensic evaluation towards Christianity?