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Dishonored Critique (Daud DLC) - Two Steps Forward, One Step Back
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- Опубліковано 7 сер 2024
- The second video in my series critiquing the Dishonored franchise - focused on the Daud DLCs for the first game.
Link to my first video for this series: • Dishonored Critique - ...
Deeper chapter markers can be found as the pinned comment.
Thumbnail art by Couple of Kooks
/ kooks000
Intro: (0:00)
Part 1 - No Tears for Daud: (11:00)
Part 2 - Billie Lurk and the Half-Blood Princess: (1:42:43)
Part 3 - Doctor Sleeper Hold: (1:52:40)
Intro: (0:00)
Part 1 - No Tears for Daud: (11:00)
Part 1.1 - A Captain of Industry: (14:39)
Part 1.2 - Eminent Domain: (27:55)
Part 1.3 - The Surge: (45:39)
Part 1.4 - A Stay of Execution for Lizzy: (56:44)
Part 1.5 - The Dead Eels: (1:12:27)
Patt 1.6 - Delilah's Masterwork: (1:22:41)
Part 2 - Billie Lurk and the Half-Blood Princess: (1:42:43)
Part 3 - Doctor Sleeper Hold: (1:52:40)
My biggest complaint about the DLC's is that Daud's assassins feel like they don't have any part in the story, it's kinda just Daud doing everything himself when I feel like it could've been more so assassins vs witches and their quest to give Daud the opportunity to confront Delilah 1 on 1 in the void or something along those lines
Interesting. I agree, this likely would've made them feel more like characters as well as would've helped the narrative. Thanks for the thoughts.
especially because the very first enemy you see is the whalers. idk about anybody else but when i first saw these gas mask toting, teleporting assassins run along the roof, i instantly fell in love with them, i mean the whaler sword is my favorite sword in the series. but we really only interact with them a lot in one mission. the fact that they’re just another npc that u press one button on is disappointing. if they were stronger, it would not only make the gameplay involving them better, but it would also add to dauds reputation. in the game lore, daud technically should be stronger, he’s more experienced with the mark, about equal in sword combat, and daud likely had more experience. but in the game daud, while the best fight in the game, left me wanting more. great idea on paper, but it could have been executed better
I think it makes sense that the rest of the whalers do not help Daud much. You can see how much the whalers distrust Daud in the first mission of Brigmore Witches. They don’t why they are chasing Delilah and can tell Daud is losing his edge. Also the assassination of Jessamine probably doesn’t weigh as heavy on their conscious. Though I agree, it would be cool if you could interact more with the Whalers
@pearse2371 I suppose that they are growing more distant with Daud but they do still follow his command and still stay after the whole betrayal thing with Billie and the Overseer attack so I don't see why if their leader said we're going to this mansion then why at least a few wouldn't be with him, plus what makes Daud different from Corvo game play wise, not really anything other than a few different powers that still function relatively the same, Corvo is alone through his missions Daud isn't suppose to be but practically he is, it makes sense to me and would've been nice to see, but it is true that Jessamines death they could probably care little about and this mission they could see as Dauds mission not their's but I mean it is their leader after all
Billie Lurk and Thomas do assist Daud in the field along with the many assassins you can summon with the aptly named Summon Assassin power. But I do feel it makes sense for Daud to do these missions mainly by himself due to how personal it is to him.
Regarding the Delilah decision, if I am not mistaken, there is dialogue by Delilah where she says that Daud "left some marks on her" with his knife, implying that the canonical ending is the one where he stabs her with his knife. I also think that makes more sense narratively: we know that the canonical ending to the second game is where Emily tricks Delilah into trapping herself in her painting, so if Daud tricks her in the first game and then she comes back, who says she won't come back a second time, after being trapped in a similar manner? It makes more sense narratively that Daud stabs her with his sword, she spends some time in the Void, as that is where the people marked by the Outsider go when they die, and then comes back, summoned by the ritual, and in order to defeat her, Emily tricks her into trapping herself in the painting. That, in a way, gives even more weight to Emily's non-lethal approach, where it turns out even more foolproof than the lethal approach.
Interesting interpretation, especially your last bit about killing her in this giving more weight to the non-lethal in D2. I like it, thanks for sharing.
She supposedly won't come back cause she doesn't know she's trapped in a world of her making, with everything as she envisioned
But Delilah isnt marked by the outsider tho, to my knowledge. She entered the void by herself, the outsider didnt bring her there.
The sequel proves that Daud *did* stab Delilah, instead of the trapping her in a painting. Why does everyone miss that line from the heart? “Her flesh is still scarred from Knife of Dunwall. Cursed Daud who lives still!”
While Daud definitely spared Billie and was spared in return, he’s still a killer, as we see in the base game and he handled Delilah like one.
Sorry, I just don't buy that. Without hearing the line myself I wouldn't call that proof - especially because if it's phrased like you wrote it could be from a fight versus a stab.
Everything about Dishonored 2 (and the expansions) imply that Daud trapped her in the painting. Even his own personal story arch in the game.
Edit: couldn't find the heart voicelines about Delilah you spoke of but others do imply (imo) that she was trapped in the void versus killed.
dishonored.fandom.com/wiki/The_Heart/Quotes_(Dishonored_2)
@@kaldiniWhat do others say that imply she was trapped?
@@kaldinialso I looked up the Delilah heart quotes, it’s a minute and a half in on the dot, “There are marks on our flesh, made by Knife of Dunwall. Cursed Daud who hides in the world and breathes still.”
@@JXEditor Would appreciate a link so I can take a listen :)
@@JXEditor
"Delilah. How is it she lives? She wandered in the void. I can see it. But then..."
"Her powers are greater now. She found something in the Void. Something ancient."
While not outright saying it, these seem more consistent with being trapped in the void versus being killed.
Let's be fair here. 1:07:40 You just neutralized an entire squad of overseers, so any one of your fellow assassins coulda picked one up and said "Hey, let's use these outfits for later, just in case" so it really coulda been for free. The fact that it has ANY price on it at all is a wonder to me.
I agree that the outfits themselves were readily available, but specifically for that mission I always figured the cost had more to do with setting up the scenario from a logistics side - learning that Overseers had been requested after the witch interrogation, and then likely getting rid of the actual Overseers who are scheduled to appear.
There's no guarantee the outfit could even fit Daud, and that's not counting for any blood that may be on it.
@@twinzzlers So the money costs coulda gone to getting them custom-tailored and cleaned up I guess.
@@Boomblox5896 It would just be better to buy a brand new one, made for Daud. He's still going to have to move in it
i cannot count the sheer number of times i have fallen when playing regular dishonored after the dlc and expecting to be able to pause mid-blink. gems of dlcs, and i would've loved a full game of just daud
In theory that's what Death of the Outsider *should've* been in my opinion. Or at least had Daud more prominently in the story
@@kaldini yeah i agree, and im so sad they just killed daud off so fast T-T but i guess doto was kind of short on its own
What an opportune time to find these videos. This trilogy of games is probably my favorite ever. I would say that these games are most conducive to "self-imposed limitation" type of play. It doesn't matter if something becomes trivial or too easy, if you're lacking challenge give yourself a limitation and work with that. They were also good for role-playing; for example, I played Daud in a manner where he hates overseers and witches but won't kill anyone else, which lended thematic interest to my last playthrough.
Really enjoyed both of your Dishonored Critques, always thoguht the chaos system was lacking and you offer some interesting ideas for improving it. Would love to see a critique on Control and The Last of Us as I think there's a lot to dig into with those games. Look forward to your future vids.
Thanks for the watching and comment! I think at least one of the those two games is very likely the next bigger project, with maybe a smaller indie title sprinkled before or after depending on work flow.
As someone who likes the chaos systems pros a lot I can't help but somewhat agree with your critique on it, I do feel like Prey did the choices better being more than good/bad kill/no kill. Impact isn't amazing but I can't help but love how Arkane does their system
Totally understand what you mean. I actually like that the chaos system exists but want it to be better. I think its removal from DOTO is one of the parts I most dislike about that game.
But God damn is doto optimized :)
I really enjoy how thorough your videos are and I feel like you know how to critique without being a jerk. Some people should take notes
So a general rule I have for my channel is that I don't make videos for games that I'm not more positive than negative on. Because my videos typically take longer, I just don't want to spend 3 months on something I hated.
Those damn assassins kept popping up out of nowhere scaring the Hell out of me!🤣🤣
My man, it is a sin that you are not more popular. I love your content and your writing is good. Keep up the good work!
Thanks for watching and commenting, I appreciate it!
Another great video, I love how you go really in depth, more than some of the other critique channels I watch. Long videos are my preference as well because I watch/listen while working on my game every day. Keep it up dude!
So far your videos on Dishonored have really resonated with how I feel about it, and I get excited when I hear about your ideas for how the game could've been even better. This makes me look forward to when/if you do a video on Dishonored 2, which I think had numerous gameplay improvements (especially in terms of level design), but also falls quite short in other places in my opinion (like the main story as well as characters)
Hey thanks for watching and commenting! I think Dishonored 2 and DOTO will be my focus around August - I decided to branch into a couple other games for a bit. I agree with you on that the big improvement for the sequel was the level design, and I also think they made some positive steps in terms of toolkit restrictions, broader upgrades for powers, as well as the bonecharm crafting. It definitely seems like they patchworked a story together however.
I had a moment of unintentional plot twist with Billie Lurk. The first time I played through this game I was playing with sound off, because I usually like to listen to music or podcasts while I play. So throughout the game I always assumed "Billie" was a man. When she took off her mask I was genuinely surprised by that, even more than by her betrayal lol
Same here buddy!
Sorry, this is not related to any of the main points of your video, but I'm curious what you think about my take:
The thing that really bugs me about Dishonored and its sequels is Arcane's philosophy of cluttering their maps with mountains of insignificant, easy to find rewards. I understand that this is intended to encourage exploration, but in practice, it makes you compulsively check every drawer, cupboard and gutter like some sort of weirdo. I call it "the kleptomaniac problem", which I think plagues many immersive sims: you're playing as an elite assassin, but yes, you will take time off from your important mission to dive into a dumpster for... 5 coins. Maybe you'd consider this more of a "player problem" than a "design problem", but I believe that if developers put a reward somewhere, they are expecting / hoping that the player goes looking for it. So if Arcane, as early as the second level, fills random dumpsters with copper wire which nets 10 coins, they're teaching the player that they should open and search every dumpster they find, lest they miss out on early-game upgrades (because even though the rewards are insignificant, players know that they accumulate over time).
This also means that, if you've managed to kill or knock out every guard in the level, you can spend a good 10 minutes afterwards running around an empty map, looking for any money, notes or bone charms you might have missed. Things like the Heart or upgraded Dark Vision only slightly mitigate this, as even when you know where to look for the items, you still have to deal with the tedium of darting between them and picking them up.
I feel it'd be better to have far fewer, but bigger rewards which are in some way difficulty or risky to get. It would both make for more fun (rifling through drawers and dumpsters isn't exactly thrilling gameplay), and it would make sense narratively. Taking a few minutes to steal a large sum of money from a safe is a sensible tangent. Constantly pausing your main objective to search for pocket change between the sofa cushions is just ridiculous.
First off I like the name you've given it - it made me laugh but also fits the actions perfectly.
Now this doesn't personally bother me and I think it's because one of the things I enjoy most about Arkane games is just taking in the world and checking every nook and cranny. Having random loot everyone kind of helps build the immersion (imo) that makes the world feel lived in.
This isn't a perfect explanation for me though because Control absolutely does something similar with its weapon mods but those DO feel like a chore and don't feel worth it. This tells me that it is a case by case basis for me.
Damn dude! solid work! Makes me wanna pick up the game and try out the DLC!
Thanks for watching!
Amazing video. I can't wait for you to make videos on the sequel and its DLC. The previous video cropped up on my feed and I skipped it because it's 3 hours long. But I guess I have to watch it now.
I also had some minor disagreements on your comments regarding how Arkane treated the chaos system. But I'll write those after watching the previous video so I don't make any points you've already addressed.
Those comments aside, amazing work!
Hey man, great video, really. Been here since the dishonored review and very glad you reviewed the DLC, I’ve been into these kind of videos and the Dishonored series are one of my all time favorites, and your overview and focused stye of video really makes me want to revisit. Funny enough I just finished Control and still obsessing about it, so would be interesting to see your thoughts on it. Keep up the great work :3
Thank you for watching and for comment! I'm glad you're enjoying the videos. I'll confirm that Control is my next video - I have footage fully recorded and an extensive script outline done. I'm currently replaying Alan Wake to get additional context for the DLC as well as for Remedy's presentation/writing style. I don't like putting dates, but I would guess it'll be out sometime in May or early June.
banger video, im loving the dishonored critiques
its actually less rare than you think that dlcs are better than the main game since dlc have learned lessons from development of the main game while often adding new gameplay elements to it. the dark souls franchise is a prime example of how dlcs often contain the best parts of the games. witcher 3 is another excellent example.
It's actually exactly as rare as I think it is. Dark Souls and the witcher 3 are some of the exceptions, not the rule.
Even within some of my favorite games there are bad DLCs - dunwall city trials (Dishonored) and each of the mass effect 1 DLCs for example. Now magnify that across all games. For every GTA4 The Ballad of Gay Tony, there's a Moxxi's Underdome (Borderlands) right beside it.
While we were not shown firsthand that the Pendleton twins were evil, literally everyone you talked to about them said that the twins are cruel and deserve to die more than anyone else.
I like that you call them expansions, like they used to be called and in this case it makes sense, it's enough content to be called that.
I wish the industry differentiated the terms DLC and expansion a bit more because I think it could be a good way to signal the value expectations consumers should have for the additional content. Expansions should be reserved for larger and more substantial pieces of content - Blood and Wine, Shivering Isles, and Undead Nightmare for example. Then DLCs could be still be used for smaller sets - the Mass Effect 3 series of quests comes to mind. Just some food for thought.
I've watched both your videos on the Dishonored series today and found your videos both insightful and entertaining.
You're obviously very passionate about the series and want it to be the best it can be because of it. I love all the constructive criticism.
With Dishonored 3 being a likely possibility in the next few years, I hope Arkane takes well meant criticism like yours to heart and gives us another masterpiece.
❤🔥❤🔥❤🔥 one of my favourite games [its between dishonored and thief 2] but you make good points and lowkey make me wanna play it again [only 85 hours as of yet]
Just started Prey, which is tangentially related, and I can’t wait for your further critiques on Arkane’s endeavors! I hope the videos haven’t been scrapped :/
The video on the Plague Tale games should be out the end of this week/early next week. It ended up being a larger project than I had intended. The next big project will likely be Dishonored 2 (although I don't commit to this just yet as I firmly believe I do my best work when it's games I'm currently wanting to talk about). I also have a couple smaller videos planned on some indies I've been playing and want to spotlight.
The Arkane videos definitely aren't scrapped however. There's a series of games that I'll need to make videos on before I could consider this channel "finished" so to speak and D2, DOTO, Prey, and Deathloop are all on that list as well as Deus Ex HR, TLOU2, and the Horizon series.
Hope you enjoy Prey! I was so completely blown away by it and it's one of the few games I wish I could wipe my memory of in order to replay it fresh.
I’ve never seen that scene at 7:16 before whoa
i was shocked to see how little subs your channel actually has considering how well-made the video was, instant sub from me! keep up the great work my dude
You can take a screenshot of anything at any time, put it a frame and you will have unique and beautiful piece of art. Yup, it looks that good - whether it's a person, a corpse or a landscape Dishonored, and its sequels got you covered!
I love the DLCs so much I like the story and characters kind of more, and the whalers were probably the coolest part of the base game and I feel they explore it a little more maybe not enough. But all the books and notes you can read about Daud and his men are really interesting. The level design and gameplay is also really good like the base game. Also I like daud's powers a lot.
Loved the first part of the series and this video is no different!!! I know you're working on a video for Dishonored 2, but will you ever tackle a Deathloop critique in the future? Would love to hear your thoughts on that game too.
Thanks for watching! My intention is to now do a couple other games (Control or The Last of Us for example) and then return later this summer to do Dishonored 2 and DOTO back to back like how I did this and the original game. Sometime after I complete the Dishonored series, I'd like to do a block of Prey, Prey Mooncrash, and then Deathloop. Maybe Redfall as well if I get some way of playing it by then. The Arkane base projects take me awhile so that might be a ways away though.
@@kaldini Seems like an amazing slate ahead of you. Excited to see all of these eventually! Keep it up, some of the best video essays/critiques I have seen on youtube
I know I am late but there is a way to get the engine coil without helping the hatters. In the sewers you can find a key to the mechanic's safe. If you then go and open the safe you'll find the code to the room with the coil from the sewers. If you wanted to play a Dead Eel Loyalist I suppose
I loved watching this and I always thought that Daud's turn in behaviour could have been considered high chaos FOR HIM considering what he had already set in motion.
Thanks for watching! Could you expand a bit more on what you mean by your high chaos part?
@@kaldini not that guy obviously. I think what he’s referencing is that Daud was an assassin/gangster/thief before the game even starts.
While Corvo is given powers by the Outsider as a sort of experiment or personality test. We can assume the same is done for Daud and the rest.
Corvo being a butcher rather than a ghost leads to more chaos within Dunwall. I think NadaRoule is suggesting that Daud pulling a 180 degree change in characterization should have a chaotic effect on Dunwall. As the underground of the city becomes less stable and Billy betrays you.
Great video! Love these critiques, thanks for the content.
Thank you for watching! Do you have any thoughts on which of the games I should critique next? I mentioned a few at the end of the video such as Control, The Last of Us, Hogwarts Legacy, etc.
@kaldini of course! I would watch anything you made, I'd love to see your take on The Last of Us or AC New Horizons though. Haven't played Control but might get around to playing it sometime soon.
@@pchurch692 Awesome! Good to know ACNH is of some interest as I have a lot of thoughts on it. I'd be worried about being too harsh on it - I'm a long time fan of the series and found the new one to be lacking in almost every way. Thanks for the input!
@kaldini would be interesting to hear a more negative take, I haven't seen a ton of content on it but from family members and my wife playing it I've heard nothing but good things, I'm pretty sure none of them ever played earlier entries in the series though
Would like to hear your thoughts on Dishonored 2. To me it seems to have the superior gameplay and level design (with those 2 levels in particular of course) with a less good story.
i loved both of your critiques! i found myself agreeing with most of your points, especially the gameplay side.
i’m curious as to what your dishonored 2 critique will be, as that’s my personal least favorite game in the series. sure the core gameplay is nice, but the levels feel like they’re a step down and the story leaves much to be desired. especially the way the Outsider continually praises Delilah, like it gets to the point where im just so extremely frustrated by the insane amount of it. to me it just came off as someone on the dev team really loved Delilah and wanted the players to as well without the story to earn it.
You have to play Blood and Wine! Great video as always Kaldini.
Thanks for watching and commenting! At some point I intend to, maybe for a video eventually.
I think it's unfair to first say, that the chaos system is too suffocating regarding storytelling and gameplay freedom, and then complaining that it isn't present enough when they dial it back in the dlcs. It's a tall order to expect meaningful change based on your playstyle over the course of two missions in a tiny dlc anyway, especially since the changes in the main game were all logical consequences , while daud just doesn't have the same impact on the world in these missions, that would warrant the drastic change, as corvo has in his.
Sure, in hindsight IF the dlcs WHERE merged into one, all your suggestions could have been implemented, but I think that was impossible at the time, since no one knew, how successful the dlcs would be, especially after such a long time.
I just think they made the almost best of what they had and this critique kind of ignores, how niche this entire franchise, let alone these specific dlcs actually are, though admittedly that hardly takes away from the overall accuracy of the criticisms themselves.
Well, better a highly critical video about one of my favourite franchises then none at all, I guess... Great video anyway.
1:17 You can also stop the witch ambush by laying stun or kill mines in the hidden area past the train car where there are weepers your first time through the area. Two upgraded mines will take out all 4. I like leaving 2 to attack and letting the Eels take care of business. They have no chance against all four witches. 🙂
Interesting, that makes sense but for some reason I could only ever get the ambush witches to spawn if I left the scout alone. If I knocked her out the others wouldn't spawn, regardless of if I dealt with the weepers or not.
I concluded that it was a direct consequence: she informed on your whereabouts and they setup an ambush.
Edit: also thanks for watching!
I have found both your videos rather interesting points of view to the chaos system. Following this, it makes me wonder what your thought would be regarding the Nemesis system set in place during Shadow of Mordor, and especially the sequel Shadow of War, along with their dlcs. I would love to see your take and understanding on them!
I have a pretty horrid old video on Shadow of Mordor on this very channel. It was my second video ever so I'm warning ya that it's bad and awkward haha. General points were that it is an incredibly well built system and I wish more games could utilize but I believe WB copywrote it so no one can use the design concept.
I've never played Shadow of War, but it is on my list to one day do a proper deep dive into.
Thanks for checking out my vids and channel!
@@kaldini Oh wonderful!! I'll definitely give it a look!! As for your claim on the copyright you are correct. It's sad the WB limited the access of this system, but I found it enjoyable. The second game really expanded on it, and it felt much more fleshed out compared to the first, and I truly enjoyed how the second played out, and the openness to everything and how you go about stuff really made it fun
@@SilvertheFox15 i heard that the second game adds more distinct "class" types to the Orcs and their potential strengths and weaknesses, which sounds like exactly the tweaks it needed
@@kaldini Oh absolutely. No more are the simple orcs, heavy shield orcs, and then archers. You come into fights with many different classes of enemy, along with a new enemy type, the olog-hai, but also tribes that give more personality to the orcs, and their fighting style, giving you the opportunity to utilize many different playstyles of stealth, weaponry, environment, and abilities to overcome each opponent, and slowly fight through the dark army
@@SilvertheFox15 thanks for the info and recommendation! You've definitely moved it up higher on my list!
Love your take and i agree with the chaos system being restrictive (came here right after the dishnored video for moar video like this). I have a question tho, if the chaos system is bad and restrictive (like you said in this video and the dishonored) then what makes it different from MGS V's chaos system? (The devil snake horn thing)
I haven't actually played MGSV so I'm not familiar with that system. What is it?
Okay bro I have to ask for that thumbnail i really want to set it as my desktop wallpaper. It's not everyday you find people talking about your second favourite video game anti hero I can't emphasize enough how much I love Daud as a character
The thumbnail art/artist is linked in the video description :)
@@kaldini my dumb ass can't seem to find it would you be so kind as to post the actual link of the image here please , it would make my day
I wish the bone charms that spawned in missions would change based on low or high chaos. And I also wish that swift shadow is always the first one that spawns period lol
Would love to see one of these long form critiques on cyberpunk after the expansion drops! One of my favorite games of all time
That is definitely something I've been considering since like I mentioned I decided to wait on starting cyberpunk
@@kaldini hope to see it in the future, either way I’ll be checking out any new stuff u drop, really love ur long form critiques, great stuff
great work keep it up
Thanks for watching!
I am genuenly suprised anyone at this point belives Arkane's writers know what makes a story good. I know you know dh2 exists! I've seen you reference it in this video. Akane writes scenarios, not stories. They create setups for killstreak montages, and seemingly grow more and more frustrated each new title with the players who still want to 'skip' the enemies instead.
Apples to arseholes 💀💀
Please make a critique on Dishonored 2, im begging.
Thank you for your Critique! I found new ideas in this essay, that I never heard before. I'm glad you talked about story problems produced by Dishonored II. Personally, I would add a problem of correcting Lore for the first game about who Corvo and Daud kill and who they don't. For me it's like when a player replays the first game, he must abstract from the second Dishonored. It's like all of your decisions and your story doesn't matter because now there is a canonic version. It kind of destroys worldbuilding for a player who knows how the story continues in the second game. The second game could be about the children of Emily and her son who could have similar power as Crovo and etc. Although it's not a big problem, it feels like I must do additional effort to forget about the second game when I play or think about MY story that I went through in Dishonored I.
27:21 can you electrocute Bundry then choke him out AND then put him in the box?
You can! Lurk gives you the option the knock him out afterwards and then you can run him to the box.
5:28 ok don’t you shit talk my boi Thomas! He’s trying and that’s what matters
It’s better then one step forward 2 steps back (looking at you ea)
It'd be nice to see you do a video like this about the game prey
Planning on it eventually :) it's also one of my favorite games
I'll definitely be looking forward to that
nice men, hope you will do vid about Dishonored 2 too, keep up!
Thanks for watching and for commenting. I do plan on making videos for Dishonored 2 and DOTO in the future.
Someone needs to make a daud fanngame cause I need dauds assassins to actual stealth attack
A very great video overall with great thoughts and insights, but as you can imagine, I will be commenting some of it.
Your way of "dealing" with extensions is somewhat similar to mine. Even in games that I like very much I sometimes do not bother playing any additional content. Only games that I may consider replaying that I consider playing dlc, if I think it enhance the main game or the overall experience, but even that is not quite true. For example, I played Batman Arkham Knight more than 7 times, and at no point I felt compelled to buy the dlc, even if it seems that the dlc is entirely integrated with the main storyline of the game, I am pleased by what I got. So when dlc is separated, or apart, or is a little follow up, or a little prequel I have almost no motivation to play the dlc.
For the feeling that the DLC is better than the main game, I just want to emphasize that the DLC is built on the main game, which means all of the "magic", "flavour" and quality from the main game is transfered to the DLC. On top of that, since the DLC is built with already existing tools, and with the knowledge that the player played and knows the main game, there is a gain of efficiency for making a good game (teaching the game, introducing the world, providing "awe" moments is less complex, because how the main game "put lights" on the DLC or served as a steady rock).
And this goes for the character aswell, the way the game begins, and still be impactful is because of what we already know about Daud, what he has done and about is mysterious aura from the main game. So even though is treatment in the main game could have been better handle, it is sufficient enough to build on it, and make the beginning of the game the way it is. (And any good DLC from any game build (and should) on that leverage and advantage). And also, so does the first level.
Relating to the hub, and the way it was necessary to give secondary characters personalities and was a way to built trust and care for them, I also want to say that it is also not the only advantages of the hub. The hub in the main game doesn't remove freedom from the player, meaning there is no forced weapons holding, powers deactivations (there would be a fail menu screen appearing of course if some lines would be crossed), this create a sense that everything can happen at any moment in this hub, it is not completely safe. Just compare it with game that suppress some of the principal actions/abilities in this kind of place, and then reactivate those before anything happens, or maintain it when the player expect them to be deactivated, basically spoiling that something will happen...Not very elegant to me. In the DLC, the missing hub not only does disservice to Billie Lurk and the whalers, it also a disservice to maintaining the tension of being hidden in plain sight. But in the video, you said that the only advantage is that the player has home advantage against the invasion of the overseer, but we didn't get to play around the base (if I recall) therefore the only advantage that the player have comes from the main game, when playing Corvo... and so when you said then despite that the DLC handle the situation better than the main game, I disagree. The DLC handles enemy placement, layout (the layout of Daud's ruined base is easier to handle that the Hound Pits abandoned bar layout), etc... but the building-up of the "hub invasion" is better handle, narratively and emotionally, in the main game than the DLC. Narratively because the threat looming over the hub doesn't come from outside but from within. Emotionally because, we, the player spent time in it, may care for some of the hostages, and therefore wanna be able to save some (even if they mostly die even in low chaos if I remember, but not so sure), and we have real layout knowledge advantages over the guards. In the DLC, it is nowhere near like that, the layout coupling with the knowledge (from the main game) allow for better gameplay, but that is it.
Regarding your point around 55:00 that "Daud was going soft, and she was right with the low chaos ending, but, then instead of fighting she bend over". The thing is "going soft" or more accurately "You've been slipping" have ambiguous meaning. To me, "going soft" or "been slipping" in the context of a clan of assassins, means "lacking discipline", which means "becoming less precautious with things, becoming lazy" , and in turn means " killing unnecessary people, leaving witnesses behind, leaving evidence of our presence", in the context of silent assassins, it means the opposite of being a silent assassin, which correspond to paths that lead to high chaos. Therefore, I don't see any contradiction with her bending over, recognizing that Daud still have discipline, is still a strong thoughtful and deadly silent assassin. Nonetheless I like your proposal of improvement.
Regarding your point at 48:20, that "If we are being honest, and I think that we can be, both missions are their respectives worst missions", well, I disagree (seems lile I am not honest). The reason here, is for me the worst mission of the main game is the flooded district, and the worst of the DLCs is the Dead Eels mission. I'll leave the flooded district, and adress the Dead Eels mission, after all, you said at 1:13:13, that it is "the best designed mission of the entire series". I am even agreeing with the pros you brought up (locations, narrative setup, the handling of choices regarding the fate of the hatters), the best attempt to provide the reason why I don't like it, can be summarized by "It doesn't flow", and it is related to the backtracking, the empty space of the main map, plus the boring way of going easily on the rooftops make that whole part very dull, and narratively this mission seems to me like a succession of MacGuffin to follow, that I have zero interest to follow in the first place. Narratively, it makes sense, Daud aswell just want to do what needs to be done to go to Brigmore Manor, but again I have zero attachment to lizzy Stride, to the fate of Hatters, this compounds with the already stated dull main map. The sewer is great though, and the final showdown on the pier is also great, but that's it. And yes, I agree that the final level is indeed one the best in the series, gameplay-wise, the lighting, the pallette of colors, etc...
Appreciate you taking the time to watch the second video in the series.
I agree with your mention that the central canal map in the Dead Eels feeling a bit empty. It's clear they tried to add the blackmarket and tailor guy in order to make it feel more lived in. I think it would've benefitted from having about x2 or x3 the number of gang members, that way using the rooftops didn't feel like cheesing but rather a necessity.
good points
You views on DLC are quite peculiar to me. I never imagined anyone wouldn't want to jump on DLC as soon as it comes out if it's for a game they enjoy. I for one am foaming at the mouth for the Elden Ring DLC whenever that comes around in 200 years. What I like about DLC is how they allow a game company to expand the universe of their game without having to release another title.
Depends on the game right? I've played the DLC for many games and have enjoyed many. However not all of them are worth. For every Daud DLC or Blood and Wine quality, you get an assassin's creed one quality where it seems phoned in and only there to extract money
@@kaldini Yeah I mean it does really vary. And of course we get some real stinkers.
@@ungabunga9581 typically if it's a well received one I'll play it at some point. I mention blood and wine and I'll 100% play through that content next time I play the witcher 3, it'll just have to wait haha.
Thanks for watching and commenting!
That bone charm should be called John Cena
This would be the pinned comment if I didn't need to have the in-depth time stamps.
tbh i really disagree on the "daud had a better character than corvo" which lol im not saying cuz im obviously biased as you can see from my name, however i really do think otherwise, i dunno if its a prefrence thing, but i don't think characters that are mute in game don't show much character, cuz of you focus on corvo's story you'd notice some interesting interactions between him and the outsider/other-npc-characters that are more than enough for me to spectulate a character for corvo based on other characters' thoughts on him, throu that idea i was able to make a voice for him and *a will* that i think about while choosing major/linear things in the game.
**dang i sound like a nerd but i hope my point seems clear and if its not i wouldn't mind tryin to explain better with replies**
Yes,corvo was the most tragic character in the show he was betrayed twice but the reason i think Daud is a better character is because he is not taking revenge he is not fighting for survival and neither he is on redemption of his action he is just after the name "Delilah" to feel something his journey is more about personal journey and self discovery and those type of character are my favourite
fair point i guess,
daud is definitely unique.
@@TheWritter-qo9ty
@@corvo_.. Oops i accidentally said "the show instead of "the game" guess i am used to calling "Christopher moltisanti" the most tragic character in the show at this point
@@TheWritter-qo9ty
you're a "the sopranos" enthusiast, lol
can't say thats relatable.
@@corvo_.. I am a movie and shows admirer you can guess that by my name
23:32
30:54 knowing you, you bring it up later but the lack of a hub area is replaced by seeing Billie in game, its not like you see Pendleton or Havelock in mission in the based dishonored story (well aside from the end mission ofc) and personally I always loved Daud so I didn't need too much convincing and tbh and fair I played Dishonored 2 before the Dlc so I did already have a lot of interest in Lurks story. I just didn't feel connected to her cause hwt story wasn't expanded upon enough before the betrayal and yeah i suppose a hub area could have went a long ways to avoid that.
The chaos system is one of the single worst mechanics I have ever seen implemented into a game. It quite literally fails at every single goal it's trying to acconplish, and I would argue that in no way does the chaos system make the game better. Think about it; what is the choas system, at the fundamental level, attenpting to accomplish? I think a reasonable, median answer would be that the chaos system is overall attempting to improve the player's engagement with the story, increase replyability, give weight to player decision, and serve as a morality system. It fails in all of these aspects, although I will freely admit that one could reasonably believe that it succeeds in adding replyability, depending on your perspective. I don't have the time right at this second, on August 19 2023, to add the essay required to fully explore my claims, but I plan to come back in the future hopefully lol
Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.
Where is dishonored 2 video mate
Been enjoying making videos about other games.
@kaldini so you will not continue this series?
@@riccardopalma3362 oh I'll definitely be continuing! Sooner rather than later too
I almost never buy dlc anymore either. Games are so different it is difficult to get back into the timing, controls, remembering what was going on in the story, and it leaves a bad taste in my mouth about games I once loved.
I'm actually surprised you liked Control, this game was so bad to a point where it's unrealistic.
What did you dislike about Control?
@@kaldini Everything, the story was lame, the characters were bland, the gameplay was boring and empty, the maps were okay in the first few missions, the voice acting was a mistake and the side missions were uninteresting.
I feel, your position on letting Delilah live is a bit misplaced. If Daud kills her, Emily later would continue to be unaware of Duke Abele, Jindosh and Ashworth later on. She needed to live in order to bring out the individuals slowly draining Karnaca and the eventually Dunwall.
I'm not sure I understand what you mean? Many of those individuals likely wouldn't have been issues without their relationship to Delilah?
And the bigger point is that it didn't need to be Delilah at all in D2 - it could've been some other witch/force that organized the coup.
Please don't do Hogwarts legacy
Haha I ended up deciding to do Control next. If you don't mind me asking though: why no Hog Leg?
@@kaldini just the whole discourse surrounding the game. It really showed an ugly side to people. I wouldn't be able to watch without feeling uncomfortable. I know your videos take a while so having that in there would make the wait longer for me. I would rather watch a video a game I know nothing about instead
@@guntherstewart8941 Appreciate the response. I think after Control I'll probably try and do a smaller indie game, similar to my Bastion and Death's Door videos, but who know haha - that's still a little ways away
Ngl, you said you rarely play DLCs and I had to leave
Maybe next time.
kinda silly bluring the items on kratos back like Why even use the footage if ur worried about spoilers
Sorry you feel that way. It was chosen because I didn't have any other footage that contained endgame bosses (which was what I was talking about during that segment) and it was blurred because it would only take me 30 seconds and potentially not spoil something for someone, somewhere.
@@kaldini that's me, thank you for such a use case of spoiler warnings
Your stance on playing dlc is Just kinda baseless, i get what you are trying to say doesn't mean that there is any merit to it
Lol I wouldn't say it's baseless because I wasn't arguing other people shouldn't play DLC. Since it was me expressing my opinion on why I personally find it hard to play it absolutely has a base and has merit.
@@kaldini i feel like it's more emotional that logical reasoning, and that by nature is baseless. It has merit to you because it's your emotions, but i don't see any logic in it, even thought it looks like you found some for yourself, the reasons you named sound more like excuses then actual reasons. Maybe it's because i have a compeltly different view on time managment i was not trying to offend if it seemed like it, just never heard anyone look at it your way. Deffinatly see that i wrote my comment pretty agressivly tho.
Oh WOW the censoring of God of War was so good of you. You really do think of everything.
I feel like that alone would earn you a sub if I wasn’t subbed already 🫡
Just figured some people might not have played it yet and that particular thing I blurred is one of the cool reveals in the game