There is hope. Trump lost votes from 2020. Trump didn't win so much as Harris lost. That means we still outnumber conservatives, we just need a better candidate. Instead of catering to conservatives, we need someone like Bernie who will push for things the majority of us wants.
@@harpoonmcfierce9697 That's never going to happen. The American public opinion is so poisoned against everything that even reeks of socialism over decades that the word itself is a slur for many people. Most people, we have just learned. That's not changing in 4 years. You're also going from the, frankly naive, assumption that Trump having 4 years of the House, The Senate and the Supreme court will not irreversibly damage American institutions.
@@harpoonmcfierce9697 I genuinely thought we could have picked a rock and people would still have the sense to vote to keep Republicans out, but clearly half the country can't be bothered to protect their own interests or even their own safety. I agree that we need a better candidate, but the mistake leftist and liberal voters make is thinking the DNC are actually horrified by this outcome. Corrupt politicians thrive in this scenario, where both parties get to promise their voters the moon, but are able to not deliver with the excuse that they have to undo what the opposition did when they were in power. If non-voters actually went out and voted Democrat so we'd have the presidency, the house and the senate for a decade, corporate Democrats would be forced to actually vote for stuff that helps their voters or be primaried. This flip-flopping means they never have to do that, and can just sit there taking their sweet donation money year after year, while publically pretending to be shocked that the non-white, non-male vice president of the unpopular current president didn't manage to energize voters by promising to continue the unpopular status quo.
@@harpoonmcfierce9697 You're talking like you'll be getting another chance. Days before he was reelected he said "I should never have left" in reference to the White House to cheers from his crowd. If they have the Senate, the House and the Oval Office then they have all the levers of power. I really think Trump will at least try to get rid of the 22nd Amendment, whether the rest of the Republicans let him so they can take advantage of it is left to be seen.
Yeah, I think it is the beginning of s dictatorship ...or he us selling us to China.....or Russia. The Saudi dont seem to have an interest .,. But we are screwed
Why is it that WE are always expected to reach out, reach across the aisle, find common ground, compromise, accept the shortcomings of the Right…and they just get to be themselves no matter what? Why do we always have to set the table and consistently treat them as guests? Even when we are in their house we are expected to do so! Why? Because we’re the tolerant ones? Because we listen to our better angels? Because we are The Giving Tree? Eff that, I say! Democrats could benefit from having a little more self-righteousness and less “go along to get along.” We need to stop attending every meeting with a white flag in our hand. And stop allowing bad faith arguments to share the same merit as our own.
When they lose, we’re supposed to reach out and understand them, when they win, we’re supposed to reach out and understand them. It’s their world; we just live in it.
I think it's because of the (bullshit) assumption that Democrat voters are all Hollywood elites and Republican voters are the working class poor. "We" can afford to humor their positions because we'll be "fine either way".
"The paradox of tolerance is a philosophical concept suggesting that if a society extends tolerance to those who are intolerant, it risks enabling the eventual dominance of intolerance, thereby undermining the very principle of tolerance. This paradox was articulated by philosopher Karl Popper in The Open Society and Its Enemies (1945), where he argued that a truly tolerant society must not tolerate those who promote intolerance. Popper posited that if intolerant ideologies are allowed unchecked expression, they could exploit open society values to erode or destroy tolerance itself through authoritarian or oppressive practices." Leaving this here, no reason why, really.
I wish Karl Popper included instructions for what to do if you made the mistake of being tolerant of the intolerant for long enough that his prediction happens
@@alexharrison2743He actually did in the sequel to The Open Society and its Enemies that came out in 1946, it's called "Televised Fights to the Death of the 1% is Something You Can't Suggest in a UA-cam Comment". Crazy that he predicted how television became common, the term "1%", and UA-cam. But I think he had a point.
38:35 - why is it bad to be upset about things that dont directly affect you? There are plenty of things that dont affect me, but I want them addressed
You're missing the point. Trans women in sports shouldn't matter to voters because *it isn't a real problem*. There isn't this epidemic of trans women dominating in every sport (we'd have seen that by now) and no trans person is transitioning just to be better at the high school swim team.
“I was at a dinner with a former senator and we were getting calls from editors from national publications. Let me judge the rest of you from my tower for how closed your minds are”
My god where did you find this guy? Wherever it was send him back there. My eyes hurt from the amount of rolling they had to do every time he opened his mouth to spew his kumbaya politics.
Yacubian pumpkin pie head ass hokus pocus benchod pussyclot putosaurus has Elon musk body type aside from his words and his shoes and pants are horrible. This trans girl is hateraded out the window towards this foo
I had never heard of this Lucas guy before. He could stay in the dark from what I got from this episode. How could they not pick up on the bizarre statement that he thinks it would be different if they were opening for a serial rapist as he proceeds to talk about the value of sharing space with comics that support Trump…a serial rapist!?
his whole deal is being the quirky rich dude in comedy, but "don't worry, he's a kennedy liberal." the exact type of legacy democrat that needs to be pushed out of the party.
I hadn't seen him before either but take the opposite view: there's a difference between sharing a room with a person and identifying with or believing (being duped I think) that this person offers help. Also, not to be too wet but an interesting point to me is the obvious emotional trauma of trump which attracts traumatized supporters of all stripes. All of this relates to people having an equal vote whilst experiencing a grossly unequal society.
a lot less than you might think. remember, a nazi sympathizer is a nazi. so like everyone you see saying we just need to talk to them and compromise and understand them etc. all nazis themselves. the apathetic public in Germany were still nazis even if they never pulled a trigger.
Really tried to have fun and not think too much but dear lord. Lucas saying we should try sharing spaces with them, as if that's a new idea he thought of and not something marginalized people have to do constantly at work/school/etc. I get that you wanna hang out with rich shitty people but trying to frame it this way was a big mess.
He's got a point though; those of us who aren't marginalized can actually help by sharing those spaces and downplaying their talking points. The best way to do that is to be dismissive rather than combatative. They expect an argument, and they enjoy being the troll, but they're conservatives, so they hate feeling abnormal and get real uncomfortable when you dismiss their trans bullshit etc as weird. If every straight white guy they meet agrees with their views they'll continue to think any deviation from them is a feminine/gay/woke thing, but if other straight white guys roll their eyes at them they get unsure about it.
No shade. I clocked that the viewers were not going to like this episode when Lucas stated that his family was rubbing elbows with rich politicians. Idk, man. I'm just a regular person. I'm not kiking with Governor Newsom and Governor Cruz at The Ritz. Lmao
It's SO disingenuous to say the average person doesn't "care" about trans issues. The average person is not who voted, or is going to make or enact these policies. And the average person, working 40+ hours a week, scraping to get by, is not gonna have the energy to make sure 1% of the population gets treated fairly, which is why we are such a great wedge issue. If my lifesaving medication gets taken away, well, not many people are going to notice or care. That's why its dangerous to let these ideas take hold. And with a full conservative government, this is not some panicky hypothetical. It's about bodily autonomy and privacy, which was already being eroded before Roe was overturned. Come on
Oh I am sure HE has. He has them as friends, definitely family (as he said his sister) and as very convenient connections in his circle (see the story about the dinner). Because he doesn`t have to care. A Trump term doesn`t effect him. It`s really quite easy to get along with these people if their terrible views have no effect on your life.
@@anthill1510 His sister is mentally challenged, and seems to have said she'd vote for Trump as a way to protest her mom's behavior, so I hardly think that counts.
I agree with your sentiment, seriously considering moving out of my red state just because I cant deal with seeing all the MAGA everyday. But I still think the point Lucas was making makes sense. Democrats will never win an election again if they insult, scold, and belittle half the country. I took his point as less "lets all get along" and more "lets disagree while occupying the same space" I personally wouldn't be able to represent leftists on a stage/podcast with fascists, but I think its important others do. Trump, Vance, RFK, Ben Shapiro, Walsh go on every podcast they can. Lefties, for the most part, shoot themselves when they refuse to engage. I believe Gen Z got pushed to the right because the right was everywhere, all the time. Dems only went on like Colbert and John Stewart which reaches no one new
@@korganrocks3995You are right, I didn`t catch that his sister has special needs when I listened for the first time. But I think he is spot on in describing why a lot of people vote for Trump: The petty teenage reactionary behavior is why a lot of people voted for Trump. It`s a protest vote against these liberals telling them how to speak and behave. His sisters reaction is examplary, it doesn`t matter that the other people don`t have special needs, they have the emotional maturity of 13 year olds and take that out on all of us on election day. And also they have a bit of a point, because left-leaning politicians DO lie and pretend they are moral at the same time and they ARE condescending to the average voter. I understand people being sick of that, I just think it`s stupid to vote for Trump instead.
Commenting only 1min in to say that, actually, given how partisan all your news outlets are in the states, getting their news from the BBC is pretty smart of your friend
Fuck this guy, but that was obviously a joke that even goes way harder on Republicans, implying that having liberal tendencies and flipping Right = doing blackface and flipping Left.
If liberal politics isn't enough and has failed to stop fascism, maybe the answer also isn't liberal entertainment. I understand the sentiment but the 'let's just share a platform' approach feels like entertainment version of getting moderate republicans on your cabinet. Maybe left wing entertainment needs to be more materially different - like what would more grassroots entertainment look like? Feel like the question isn't how to be a guest on Joe Rogan or how do you copy Joe Rogan but on the left, but what is a different way of doing entertainment (neither fascist/populist nor establishment/liberal - instead grassroots and left). Got to be more creative, make something new. I remember Gianmarco mentioning previously how liberal comedians dropped the ball in Obama years (tho granted that was about not satirising democrats enough) but what would be the way for comics/entertainers to avoid dropping the ball now?
I've learned that we have to endure to make progress. The Civil Rights Act was passed only 60 years ago and despite Reagan and other republicans attempts to erase us, we survived and have progressed as a society. Turn the fear into action. Join a canvassing group like progressive victory or something local - or just a community in general - and work together to defend our rights.
I think the problem is not pushing people away when they revealed who they were voting for. Should shove those people away hard, they wanna vote for Trump they don't get to enjoy your company.
Blue state liberals live in their own world. Progressives in red states HAVE to get along with these people who are going to turn around and vote against them. Get out of your bubbles indeed.
“But this is how it gets fixed” This yt boy has only hangs out with other yt boys. I’d bet a nickel. But, I’m not looking to hear from an apologist rn. I’ll see y’all next episode
Great, another Lucas episode 🙄, everyone's most available spoiled unrelatable rich kid. Tell me you couldn't find another guest for the show this week without telling me you couldn't find another guest for the show this week..
the yt shorts checks must be bouncing bc aint no way they sat down to discuss american's latest descent into fascism with a guy who not only sees no problem with that, but uses a slur and then complains that ppl are too mean to the fascist sympathisers who are too stupid to understand how tariffs work. i know exactly who this guy voted for and it sure wasnt kamala lol
Most Americans have no idea what "the left" really is. Democrats aren't left wing, more like centric right. But everything has been shifting more and more to the right. Middle ground doesn't mean anything.
The guy that got in literally said "you'll never have to vote again" while campaigning, so it's almost naive to think there might even be future elections at this point
I think Lucas has made a good argument that is productive and helpful in the long run. If you want to have a population that votes differently without killing every single person who voted against you, you will have to change some minds. You can't do that if you force those people into the echo chambers that reinforce and fortify their believes every day. There needs to be a conversation and hiding away from opportunities to change minds and invite people to your side if you have the privilege to do so and do so with an added advantage of being someone they might already trust more because of who they were conditioned to value is not what you want from him. You don't want him to not fight for you. If he refuses a seat at the table and a right-wing person gets it instead, have you won? What I also think, however, is that the people in this comment section don't need slow strategy discussion right now, especially if they hinge on forgiveness they are not ready to hand out. They have just been hurt tremendously and aren't ready to go up to those who hurt them and shake their hands and be calm and understanding or even be okay at all. There is a stark contrast between Lucas' attitude and the bottomless terror people felt and feel because they don't know what's going to happen today or tomorrow or in a month where all their security in things as foundational as their democracy itself has been questioned and they still wait for the punches to keep coming. People are grieving and they are grieving differently. We can guess that Lucas probably hasn't lost his security because he knows he will personally be fine whatever happens. That doesn't mean that he doesn't have empathy or isn't deeply affected himself or worried about his friends and loved ones, but maybe it means that he got to wanting to find solutions more quickly when others need to feel their feelings and wrap their mind around what happened and what it means for a moment. There is nothing wrong with either.
I love lucas but lord sometimes he makes it so hard to justify sparing him in the imminent class war. the straight/white/maleness of his perspective- and the immense financial security that colors everything he says and does-- is so glaring its hard to listen to at times. sigh
I have never seen an episode with him. It was at the same time bonkers and fascinating to hear somebody like this directly after the election. Especially because the last videos I watched were from black women talking about the election fallout. Couldn`t be a starker contrast, this felt like a culture shock.
i was ready to revolt. and then i looked around and no one has my back. everyone is just burying their heads in the sand of their our volition because reality is upsetting. the country is not only doomed but its not worth saving.
Russell & Gianmarco, you often call out Hollywood for how they virtue signal when convenient, but still be pally and tight-lipped around their A-list friends & friends of Epstein. Hope you can see the irony & hypocrisy in this episode with this silver-spoon patroniser
Most people are socially conservative, but left leaning financially. Why even sacrifice left leaning social values, while not targeting the thing that EVERYONE who is not the 1% agree on? Start with what we agree on. Not compromise on things republicans are already strong on and try to outcompete them. They are racist, but they still voted for Obama because he offered them something they wanted. A little disheartening how out of touch this conversation is, honestly.
if this means what I think it means your other comments baffle me. maybe we are on the same page after all, apologies for the anger directed at you elsewhere if so.
I haven’t listened to this entire episode yet, but after reading the comments, my suspicions have been confirmed. Liberals are absolutely and detrimentally incapable of self reflection-and have pretty bad BS detectors when it comes to the Democratic Party. I know because I have been a liberal (now an *actual* leftist). We are arrogant, dismissive, and absolutely high on our own supply, and our utter disdain for poor, migrant, and rural folks is barely concealed. We talk a big game about being a party of inclusion, but that in-group has become infinitely smaller. While I believe run-of-the-mill liberals have good intentions, they alienate and reject anyone and any idea that challenges their worldview. Again, I know, because I was a liberal until very recently. The party is too insular, too arrogant, and frankly, too aligned with the right to be a credible progressive and populist party. Things need to change a lot and change fast, and we have to start by learning how to be wrong and getting comfortable with being uncomfortable.
I personally think you should still care about these issues even if It doesn't affect you. This "can't we all get along" mentality is terribly harmful; especially when half of the country just voted to endanger minorities of all races, gender and sex.
I get why people didn't like this one as much. Our country has been handed over to literal handmaids tale nahtzees who have promised to use the power of government to torture women, the poor, lgbtq+ people, immigrants, and anyone else they dont like, and guy is still giving us "why cant we just share space and listen to each other?" Not inherently a bad message given the right context, but yeah I get why no one wants to listen to this right now. The next couple years are going to get rough. People are scared and p*ssed off.
Hey, I get what you're saying, and I agree, but in case you don't know, I just want to point out (as someone who wrote a Master's thesis about the Handmaid's tale) : Everything that happens in the book to (white) women has happened in the past to women of color. The book makes it horrific because it targets white women. It is devoid of any character of color. The tv show, on the other hand, ignores completely that, in dictatorships, women of color have it worse and are definitely not no longer subjected to racism.
I have been thinking Trump & Tools might be the most efficient way of demonstrating the inadequacy of oligarchic capitalism. Love you guys; much needed.❤
Maybe if you can create comedy / entertainment that makes fascism seem stupid / ridiculous / uncool / weird and you craft the jokes so it would resonate even with people on the verge of becoming fascist - I can understand how that could be positive. Joe Rogan example - instead of satirising Joe Rogan / conspiracy theorists etc for an exclusively liberal audience who already think it's stupid, finding a way to satirise Joe Rogan where it would expose him as rich / establishment/ out of touch etc even to a more right leaning audience. Makes me think of how Hannibal Buress' joke helped reframe / restart media conversation around Bill Cosby - there are ways that jokes can reframe perception of certain people/points of view in the public eye - that would make ppl view them in a different way (not just laugh in agreement) In the Bill Cosby joke, Hannibal's making fun of Bill Cosby, not Bill Cosby fans - but the way he did it changes people's perspective on Bill Cosby, even if they were fans. Obvs comedy / entertainment/ one joke is only going to do so much, and can't expect comedy alone to do the actual political work of materially changing the country, but that's one thought I have from listening to this
they did that in Germany and as a result people did not take the threat seriously. something we already saw play out in 2016 when he was treated like a clown. and then he did nonstop evil
@wesleywyndam-pryce5305 I get this - and I think comedy isn't going to stop fascism - only organising. But I guess if you're trying to think of what kind of comedy to make in the context of rising fascism - I guess it's comedy that bolsters anti-fascists, and comedy that weakens the appeal of fascism to undecided people (and potentially calls ppl towards anti-fascism). (Those may be two v different kinds of comedy) I think comedy that reassures liberals that fascism isn't a threat is different to comedy that makes fascism appear more unattractive to the undecided person. I think it's partly a question of which audience you're speaking to & materially what context the comedy/entertainment is presented in - but yeah I don't think there was any way a stand up in Germany or any other rising fascist nation could write a comedy special so good it prevented it. But I understand as working comedians / entertainers how Gianmarco, Russell and Lucas would be trying to work out how to move forward in a different context.
Maybe it's left wing comics performing in support of mutual aid fundraisers and direct action, or just joining organising outside of the comedy context
I have never seen Lucas before, but I don't get the animosity towards him in the comments. I think the main point he made was trying to engage with people who have different views, if you have the energy and the opportunity, instead of completely rejecting them off the bat by talking about polarized issues that have been used as a distraction on both sides.
How old are you? Do you not remember 2016 through 2020? All the media was in collusion to tell everyone that they needed to understand these people. I am 50-year-old gay man who grew up in a red state. What more do I need to understand about these people?
I'm going to defend this guest's presence on the pod. Lucas Zelnick's entire message in this podcast is incredibly useful. To other well off white liberal men. Which is the voting demographic that was missing in this election. That's great for him and others like him to be encouraging that demographic to become more politically active, but that is only possible for that demographic because they are shielded from the struggles that every single other demographic faces. I think that's the difference in approach between Gianmarco & Russell and Lucas. The have an awareness of how much their privilege limits their relevance in speaking on issues that won't effect them. Lucas lacks that awareness. Lucas is rich to the point of ignorance in telling people with intersectional identities to "reach across the aisle". It is simply not safe for most of us regular people to do that. He should continue to try that approach though since he is one of the few who is born into a position in which it's safe to make that reach.
Protest votes and people who chose to sit out for Kamala should be blamed, actually. If you look at the numbers, Trump actually didnt have as big of a turnout as he did in 2020 but the sword to the heart was the democrats that simply didnt turn out compared to last time. 13 million less i believe.
@@GianmarcoSoresi I'm personally just completely against people who choose to not vote at all. Someone has to govern, regardless of how one may feel, and a non-vote is inevitably going to lead to these non-voters being subjected to policies they are against, yet they did nothing about it when they could have.
@@brinag8604good luck with that bullying strategy in 2028…maybe poor and oppressed people just dont like being preached to every 4 years, while nothing changes in between. If she did not get people to the booth, she deservingly lost the election. Matter of fact, people vote in the booth privately, so even if you got them there, you can’t bully them into a victory, people do not like being bullied.
2016 felt like a fluke. This feels like the beginning of the end.
There is hope. Trump lost votes from 2020. Trump didn't win so much as Harris lost.
That means we still outnumber conservatives, we just need a better candidate. Instead of catering to conservatives, we need someone like Bernie who will push for things the majority of us wants.
@@harpoonmcfierce9697 That's never going to happen. The American public opinion is so poisoned against everything that even reeks of socialism over decades that the word itself is a slur for many people. Most people, we have just learned. That's not changing in 4 years.
You're also going from the, frankly naive, assumption that Trump having 4 years of the House, The Senate and the Supreme court will not irreversibly damage American institutions.
@@harpoonmcfierce9697 I genuinely thought we could have picked a rock and people would still have the sense to vote to keep Republicans out, but clearly half the country can't be bothered to protect their own interests or even their own safety. I agree that we need a better candidate, but the mistake leftist and liberal voters make is thinking the DNC are actually horrified by this outcome. Corrupt politicians thrive in this scenario, where both parties get to promise their voters the moon, but are able to not deliver with the excuse that they have to undo what the opposition did when they were in power. If non-voters actually went out and voted Democrat so we'd have the presidency, the house and the senate for a decade, corporate Democrats would be forced to actually vote for stuff that helps their voters or be primaried. This flip-flopping means they never have to do that, and can just sit there taking their sweet donation money year after year, while publically pretending to be shocked that the non-white, non-male vice president of the unpopular current president didn't manage to energize voters by promising to continue the unpopular status quo.
@@harpoonmcfierce9697 You're talking like you'll be getting another chance. Days before he was reelected he said "I should never have left" in reference to the White House to cheers from his crowd. If they have the Senate, the House and the Oval Office then they have all the levers of power. I really think Trump will at least try to get rid of the 22nd Amendment, whether the rest of the Republicans let him so they can take advantage of it is left to be seen.
Yeah, I think it is the beginning of s dictatorship ...or he us selling us to China.....or Russia. The Saudi dont seem to have an interest .,.
But we are screwed
Why is it that WE are always expected to reach out, reach across the aisle, find common ground, compromise, accept the shortcomings of the Right…and they just get to be themselves no matter what? Why do we always have to set the table and consistently treat them as guests? Even when we are in their house we are expected to do so! Why? Because we’re the tolerant ones? Because we listen to our better angels? Because we are The Giving Tree?
Eff that, I say! Democrats could benefit from having a little more self-righteousness and less “go along to get along.” We need to stop attending every meeting with a white flag in our hand. And stop allowing bad faith arguments to share the same merit as our own.
When they lose, we’re supposed to reach out and understand them, when they win, we’re supposed to reach out and understand them. It’s their world; we just live in it.
I think it's because of the (bullshit) assumption that Democrat voters are all Hollywood elites and Republican voters are the working class poor. "We" can afford to humor their positions because we'll be "fine either way".
"The paradox of tolerance is a philosophical concept suggesting that if a society extends tolerance to those who are intolerant, it risks enabling the eventual dominance of intolerance, thereby undermining the very principle of tolerance. This paradox was articulated by philosopher Karl Popper in The Open Society and Its Enemies (1945), where he argued that a truly tolerant society must not tolerate those who promote intolerance. Popper posited that if intolerant ideologies are allowed unchecked expression, they could exploit open society values to erode or destroy tolerance itself through authoritarian or oppressive practices."
Leaving this here, no reason why, really.
I wish Karl Popper included instructions for what to do if you made the mistake of being tolerant of the intolerant for long enough that his prediction happens
@@alexharrison2743He actually did in the sequel to The Open Society and its Enemies that came out in 1946, it's called "Televised Fights to the Death of the 1% is Something You Can't Suggest in a UA-cam Comment". Crazy that he predicted how television became common, the term "1%", and UA-cam. But I think he had a point.
@@AichaKottmann man, he was better at capturing the zeitgeist than Bowie
(I got a much needed laugh from your comment, thank you bud)
@@alexharrison2743 glad I could help a little :)
47:29 It is soooo easy for him to "let them be themselves" because their actions/words don't harm him.
38:35 - why is it bad to be upset about things that dont directly affect you? There are plenty of things that dont affect me, but I want them addressed
You're missing the point. Trans women in sports shouldn't matter to voters because *it isn't a real problem*. There isn't this epidemic of trans women dominating in every sport (we'd have seen that by now) and no trans person is transitioning just to be better at the high school swim team.
I'm only nine minutes in and I can already tell you idiots shouldn't have brought the rich kid in this week.
I have a feeling this should have stayed on the patreon 💀
“I was at a dinner with a former senator and we were getting calls from editors from national publications. Let me judge the rest of you from my tower for how closed your minds are”
My god where did you find this guy? Wherever it was send him back there. My eyes hurt from the amount of rolling they had to do every time he opened his mouth to spew his kumbaya politics.
Yacubian pumpkin pie head ass hokus pocus benchod pussyclot putosaurus has Elon musk body type aside from his words and his shoes and pants are horrible. This trans girl is hateraded out the window towards this foo
“My views are incredibly left leaning”….are the left leaning views in the room with us…?
It’s because he thinks it goes N@zi, centrist, liberal and there’s no way further left to go
The Patrons can have this one back
I had never heard of this Lucas guy before. He could stay in the dark from what I got from this episode. How could they not pick up on the bizarre statement that he thinks it would be different if they were opening for a serial rapist as he proceeds to talk about the value of sharing space with comics that support Trump…a serial rapist!?
his whole deal is being the quirky rich dude in comedy, but "don't worry, he's a kennedy liberal."
the exact type of legacy democrat that needs to be pushed out of the party.
I hadn't seen him before either but take the opposite view: there's a difference between sharing a room with a person and identifying with or believing (being duped I think) that this person offers help. Also, not to be too wet but an interesting point to me is the obvious emotional trauma of trump which attracts traumatized supporters of all stripes. All of this relates to people having an equal vote whilst experiencing a grossly unequal society.
@@DrDanWeaver if 10 other people are at a party with a trump supporter and no one makes the trump supporter leave you have a party of 11 nazis.
@@DrDanWeaver but it's the direct contradiction of the values he just stated a moment earlier
There is plenty of space between Nazi and liberal, but you can actually make more space by going further left than liberal.
a lot less than you might think.
remember, a nazi sympathizer is a nazi.
so like everyone you see saying we just need to talk to them and compromise and understand them etc. all nazis themselves.
the apathetic public in Germany were still nazis even if they never pulled a trigger.
this was not the best guest to have on this particular episode, and you guys probably shoulda known that
Really tried to have fun and not think too much but dear lord. Lucas saying we should try sharing spaces with them, as if that's a new idea he thought of and not something marginalized people have to do constantly at work/school/etc. I get that you wanna hang out with rich shitty people but trying to frame it this way was a big mess.
He's got a point though; those of us who aren't marginalized can actually help by sharing those spaces and downplaying their talking points. The best way to do that is to be dismissive rather than combatative. They expect an argument, and they enjoy being the troll, but they're conservatives, so they hate feeling abnormal and get real uncomfortable when you dismiss their trans bullshit etc as weird. If every straight white guy they meet agrees with their views they'll continue to think any deviation from them is a feminine/gay/woke thing, but if other straight white guys roll their eyes at them they get unsure about it.
as a "marginalized" person that voted for trump, you should relax. lol
@@korganrocks3995 no you can help by picking up a weapon and defending us.
@@jay1jayf and you should be put under
@@jay1jayf You shouldn't.
No shade. I clocked that the viewers were not going to like this episode when Lucas stated that his family was rubbing elbows with rich politicians. Idk, man. I'm just a regular person. I'm not kiking with Governor Newsom and Governor Cruz at The Ritz. Lmao
It's SO disingenuous to say the average person doesn't "care" about trans issues. The average person is not who voted, or is going to make or enact these policies. And the average person, working 40+ hours a week, scraping to get by, is not gonna have the energy to make sure 1% of the population gets treated fairly, which is why we are such a great wedge issue. If my lifesaving medication gets taken away, well, not many people are going to notice or care. That's why its dangerous to let these ideas take hold. And with a full conservative government, this is not some panicky hypothetical. It's about bodily autonomy and privacy, which was already being eroded before Roe was overturned. Come on
I can't with Lucas' "let's all just get along" bullshit at 30:55...
No! You got a republican friend? ...no you don't. Not anymore at least.
right! im cringing. but he did start off letting us know how he spent his election night so idk what i was expecting
Oh I am sure HE has. He has them as friends, definitely family (as he said his sister) and as very convenient connections in his circle (see the story about the dinner). Because he doesn`t have to care. A Trump term doesn`t effect him. It`s really quite easy to get along with these people if their terrible views have no effect on your life.
@@anthill1510 His sister is mentally challenged, and seems to have said she'd vote for Trump as a way to protest her mom's behavior, so I hardly think that counts.
I agree with your sentiment, seriously considering moving out of my red state just because I cant deal with seeing all the MAGA everyday. But I still think the point Lucas was making makes sense.
Democrats will never win an election again if they insult, scold, and belittle half the country. I took his point as less "lets all get along" and more "lets disagree while occupying the same space"
I personally wouldn't be able to represent leftists on a stage/podcast with fascists, but I think its important others do.
Trump, Vance, RFK, Ben Shapiro, Walsh go on every podcast they can. Lefties, for the most part, shoot themselves when they refuse to engage.
I believe Gen Z got pushed to the right because the right was everywhere, all the time. Dems only went on like Colbert and John Stewart which reaches no one new
@@korganrocks3995You are right, I didn`t catch that his sister has special needs when I listened for the first time. But I think he is spot on in describing why a lot of people vote for Trump: The petty teenage reactionary behavior is why a lot of people voted for Trump. It`s a protest vote against these liberals telling them how to speak and behave. His sisters reaction is examplary, it doesn`t matter that the other people don`t have special needs, they
have the emotional maturity of 13 year olds and take that out on all of us on election day. And also they have a bit of a point, because left-leaning politicians DO lie and pretend they are moral at the same time and they ARE condescending to the average voter. I understand people being sick of that, I just think it`s stupid to vote for Trump instead.
Commenting only 1min in to say that, actually, given how partisan all your news outlets are in the states, getting their news from the BBC is pretty smart of your friend
"liberals need a guy who use to do blackface" excuse me??? 27:14
Fuck this guy, but that was obviously a joke that even goes way harder on Republicans, implying that having liberal tendencies and flipping Right = doing blackface and flipping Left.
If liberal politics isn't enough and has failed to stop fascism, maybe the answer also isn't liberal entertainment. I understand the sentiment but the 'let's just share a platform' approach feels like entertainment version of getting moderate republicans on your cabinet. Maybe left wing entertainment needs to be more materially different - like what would more grassroots entertainment look like? Feel like the question isn't how to be a guest on Joe Rogan or how do you copy Joe Rogan but on the left, but what is a different way of doing entertainment (neither fascist/populist nor establishment/liberal - instead grassroots and left). Got to be more creative, make something new.
I remember Gianmarco mentioning previously how liberal comedians dropped the ball in Obama years (tho granted that was about not satirising democrats enough) but what would be the way for comics/entertainers to avoid dropping the ball now?
yeah Lucas is opposition, make no mistake.
Redistribute your private jet level wealth or shut the hell up. Nobody needs lucas’s thoughts.
It's rich out-of-touch boy Lucas. Again. Okay.
I've learned that we have to endure to make progress.
The Civil Rights Act was passed only 60 years ago and despite Reagan and other republicans attempts to erase us, we survived and have progressed as a society. Turn the fear into action. Join a canvassing group like progressive victory or something local - or just a community in general - and work together to defend our rights.
no we don't have to endure. canvasing?? stop with the nonsense.
FIGHT.
electoralism failed in 2016, get your head out of the sand.
I think the problem is not pushing people away when they revealed who they were voting for. Should shove those people away hard, they wanna vote for Trump they don't get to enjoy your company.
when a fascist was elected in 2016 the correct thing to do was immediately take up arms against the state.
it is still the correct thing to do.
Your theatrical straightness just might get you in trouble now lol
You missed it... 2016 was shock: 2024 is horror.
Ys pal Lucas seems deluded
Blue state liberals live in their own world. Progressives in red states HAVE to get along with these people who are going to turn around and vote against them. Get out of your bubbles indeed.
“But this is how it gets fixed”
This yt boy has only hangs out with other yt boys. I’d bet a nickel.
But, I’m not looking to hear from an apologist rn. I’ll see y’all next episode
Great, another Lucas episode 🙄, everyone's most available spoiled unrelatable rich kid.
Tell me you couldn't find another guest for the show this week without telling me you couldn't find another guest for the show this week..
the yt shorts checks must be bouncing bc aint no way they sat down to discuss american's latest descent into fascism with a guy who not only sees no problem with that, but uses a slur and then complains that ppl are too mean to the fascist sympathisers who are too stupid to understand how tariffs work. i know exactly who this guy voted for and it sure wasnt kamala lol
ohhhhhh i think you guys are talking to a trump voter 😂😂 a in the closet one
34:14 this guy is delusional. I really think he considers himself to be middle ground. Buddy, you are not!
Most Americans have no idea what "the left" really is. Democrats aren't left wing, more like centric right. But everything has been shifting more and more to the right. Middle ground doesn't mean anything.
Russell & Gianmarco always brighten up my day
A lot of comments here already calling this out but for the love of god this loser was such a bad choice of guest for the moment.
Pretty naive to think they the next elections will still be fair.
The guy that got in literally said "you'll never have to vote again" while campaigning, so it's almost naive to think there might even be future elections at this point
@@stephe1506there's a vox article that explains how it's impossible to get rid of the 22nd amendment
what do you mean still? the Republicans haven't won fairly in decades, gerrymandering is the only way they held power.
@@shellsilvers its really easy to get rid of a scribble on a paper with tanks actually.
stop spreading your naivety
@@wesleywyndam-pryce5305 I'm sorry orry for that comment
I think Lucas has made a good argument that is productive and helpful in the long run. If you want to have a population that votes differently without killing every single person who voted against you, you will have to change some minds. You can't do that if you force those people into the echo chambers that reinforce and fortify their believes every day. There needs to be a conversation and hiding away from opportunities to change minds and invite people to your side if you have the privilege to do so and do so with an added advantage of being someone they might already trust more because of who they were conditioned to value is not what you want from him. You don't want him to not fight for you. If he refuses a seat at the table and a right-wing person gets it instead, have you won?
What I also think, however, is that the people in this comment section don't need slow strategy discussion right now, especially if they hinge on forgiveness they are not ready to hand out. They have just been hurt tremendously and aren't ready to go up to those who hurt them and shake their hands and be calm and understanding or even be okay at all. There is a stark contrast between Lucas' attitude and the bottomless terror people felt and feel because they don't know what's going to happen today or tomorrow or in a month where all their security in things as foundational as their democracy itself has been questioned and they still wait for the punches to keep coming.
People are grieving and they are grieving differently. We can guess that Lucas probably hasn't lost his security because he knows he will personally be fine whatever happens. That doesn't mean that he doesn't have empathy or isn't deeply affected himself or worried about his friends and loved ones, but maybe it means that he got to wanting to find solutions more quickly when others need to feel their feelings and wrap their mind around what happened and what it means for a moment. There is nothing wrong with either.
No more Lucas please
Not the r slur from the guest??
It’s very “I have a special needs sister so I can say the r word” much like “I have a black friend so I can say the n word”
time? I don't think I can stomach the whole episode
@ 18:07
I love lucas but lord sometimes he makes it so hard to justify sparing him in the imminent class war. the straight/white/maleness of his perspective- and the immense financial security that colors everything he says and does-- is so glaring its hard to listen to at times. sigh
I have never seen an episode with him. It was at the same time bonkers and fascinating to hear somebody like this directly after the election. Especially because the last videos I watched were from black women talking about the election fallout. Couldn`t be a starker contrast, this felt like a culture shock.
You forgot RICH, priviledged, well-connected.
Gianmarco over here saying: "Looking at this rich fucks... "
You mean your guest?
The way he differentiates between the white collar crimes was crazy to me hahahahahah
I used to like him, but he’s a Zionist. Watch the episode of his podcast he did with his mom and it will turn you off completely
You forgot RICH, priviledged, well-connected.
Gianmarco over here saying: "Looking at this rich f `s ... "
You mean your guest?
I think the main takeaway is the US is a lot more Trump leaning than anyone anticipated
*than the people who chose to be ignorant thought.
Tova is possessed homie ❤
i was ready to revolt. and then i looked around and no one has my back. everyone is just burying their heads in the sand of their our volition because reality is upsetting.
the country is not only doomed but its not worth saving.
Russell & Gianmarco, you often call out Hollywood for how they virtue signal when convenient, but still be pally and tight-lipped around their A-list friends & friends of Epstein. Hope you can see the irony & hypocrisy in this episode with this silver-spoon patroniser
Good example (from UK comic) of v clearly pushing back while still being funny: James Acaster and Lorraine Kelly on The Last Leg
You’re not an ally Lucas. Go share your space with Fuentes then. Get canceled. Boohoo.
Most people are socially conservative, but left leaning financially. Why even sacrifice left leaning social values, while not targeting the thing that EVERYONE who is not the 1% agree on? Start with what we agree on. Not compromise on things republicans are already strong on and try to outcompete them.
They are racist, but they still voted for Obama because he offered them something they wanted.
A little disheartening how out of touch this conversation is, honestly.
Wait, this comment is crazy to me. In my country, people are usually left leaning socially and financially conservative.
if most people are racist then most people need to be [redacted]
Worst guest ever, definitely wont cry over him getting the wall
if this means what I think it means your other comments baffle me. maybe we are on the same page after all, apologies for the anger directed at you elsewhere if so.
@wesleywyndam-pryce5305 it means exactly what you think it means
I haven’t listened to this entire episode yet, but after reading the comments, my suspicions have been confirmed. Liberals are absolutely and detrimentally incapable of self reflection-and have pretty bad BS detectors when it comes to the Democratic Party. I know because I have been a liberal (now an *actual* leftist). We are arrogant, dismissive, and absolutely high on our own supply, and our utter disdain for poor, migrant, and rural folks is barely concealed. We talk a big game about being a party of inclusion, but that in-group has become infinitely smaller.
While I believe run-of-the-mill liberals have good intentions, they alienate and reject anyone and any idea that challenges their worldview. Again, I know, because I was a liberal until very recently. The party is too insular, too arrogant, and frankly, too aligned with the right to be a credible progressive and populist party. Things need to change a lot and change fast, and we have to start by learning how to be wrong and getting comfortable with being uncomfortable.
I personally think you should still care about these issues even if It doesn't affect you. This "can't we all get along" mentality is terribly harmful; especially when half of the country just voted to endanger minorities of all races, gender and sex.
Gianmarco, YOU should become "the Liberal Joe Rogan" !!
I was thinking that!!! I think he's the only one that could be up to par
@@eveangelyne2478 Totally! Those intelligent astrophysicists who've gone on Joe Rogan before aren't going to be able to stomaching him now.
I get why people didn't like this one as much. Our country has been handed over to literal handmaids tale nahtzees who have promised to use the power of government to torture women, the poor, lgbtq+ people, immigrants, and anyone else they dont like, and guy is still giving us "why cant we just share space and listen to each other?"
Not inherently a bad message given the right context, but yeah I get why no one wants to listen to this right now. The next couple years are going to get rough. People are scared and p*ssed off.
Hey, I get what you're saying, and I agree, but in case you don't know, I just want to point out (as someone who wrote a Master's thesis about the Handmaid's tale) :
Everything that happens in the book to (white) women has happened in the past to women of color. The book makes it horrific because it targets white women. It is devoid of any character of color.
The tv show, on the other hand, ignores completely that, in dictatorships, women of color have it worse and are definitely not no longer subjected to racism.
The r word? In 2024? About his own family? Wow.
I did need something to listen to, thank you ❤
53:15 Lucas is a great example of the paradox of tolerance. Exact reason the Ratchet Effect exists.
This one was a miss guys. Lucas is completely out of touch.
I have been thinking Trump & Tools might be the most efficient way of demonstrating the inadequacy of oligarchic capitalism. Love you guys; much needed.❤
We’ve always been in a Bizarro World.
This it is horrible what had happened. We all gotta stick together.
Maybe if you can create comedy / entertainment that makes fascism seem stupid / ridiculous / uncool / weird and you craft the jokes so it would resonate even with people on the verge of becoming fascist - I can understand how that could be positive. Joe Rogan example - instead of satirising Joe Rogan / conspiracy theorists etc for an exclusively liberal audience who already think it's stupid, finding a way to satirise Joe Rogan where it would expose him as rich / establishment/ out of touch etc even to a more right leaning audience.
Makes me think of how Hannibal Buress' joke helped reframe / restart media conversation around Bill Cosby - there are ways that jokes can reframe perception of certain people/points of view in the public eye - that would make ppl view them in a different way (not just laugh in agreement)
In the Bill Cosby joke, Hannibal's making fun of Bill Cosby, not Bill Cosby fans - but the way he did it changes people's perspective on Bill Cosby, even if they were fans. Obvs comedy / entertainment/ one joke is only going to do so much, and can't expect comedy alone to do the actual political work of materially changing the country, but that's one thought I have from listening to this
they did that in Germany and as a result people did not take the threat seriously. something we already saw play out in 2016 when he was treated like a clown. and then he did nonstop evil
@wesleywyndam-pryce5305 I get this - and I think comedy isn't going to stop fascism - only organising. But I guess if you're trying to think of what kind of comedy to make in the context of rising fascism - I guess it's comedy that bolsters anti-fascists, and comedy that weakens the appeal of fascism to undecided people (and potentially calls ppl towards anti-fascism). (Those may be two v different kinds of comedy)
I think comedy that reassures liberals that fascism isn't a threat is different to comedy that makes fascism appear more unattractive to the undecided person. I think it's partly a question of which audience you're speaking to & materially what context the comedy/entertainment is presented in - but yeah I don't think there was any way a stand up in Germany or any other rising fascist nation could write a comedy special so good it prevented it. But I understand as working comedians / entertainers how Gianmarco, Russell and Lucas would be trying to work out how to move forward in a different context.
@@wesleywyndam-pryce5305 but yeah the primary remedy to fascism definitely isn't better entertainment
Maybe it's left wing comics performing in support of mutual aid fundraisers and direct action, or just joining organising outside of the comedy context
Enjoyed hearing from everyone on what informed their impressions
I have never seen Lucas before, but I don't get the animosity towards him in the comments. I think the main point he made was trying to engage with people who have different views, if you have the energy and the opportunity, instead of completely rejecting them off the bat by talking about polarized issues that have been used as a distraction on both sides.
How old are you? Do you not remember 2016 through 2020? All the media was in collusion to tell everyone that they needed to understand these people. I am 50-year-old gay man who grew up in a red state. What more do I need to understand about these people?
Thanks guys 😖💙
The down sids where good right now.
42:00 - there are trans and queer people that operate in conservative spaces. Its all about perspective
all of which are traitors and should be treated accordingly.
Statistically, the US presidency is the deadliest job in the world!
Pray for a % increase!
Why is this guy back AGAIN? And especially right now.
Gerrymandering, golly. Maybe you should just not talk about federal politics.
4:56 made me Joker laugh
59:14 this is why Gianmarco is amazing
I'm going to defend this guest's presence on the pod.
Lucas Zelnick's entire message in this podcast is incredibly useful. To other well off white liberal men. Which is the voting demographic that was missing in this election. That's great for him and others like him to be encouraging that demographic to become more politically active, but that is only possible for that demographic because they are shielded from the struggles that every single other demographic faces.
I think that's the difference in approach between Gianmarco & Russell and Lucas. The have an awareness of how much their privilege limits their relevance in speaking on issues that won't effect them. Lucas lacks that awareness. Lucas is rich to the point of ignorance in telling people with intersectional identities to "reach across the aisle". It is simply not safe for most of us regular people to do that. He should continue to try that approach though since he is one of the few who is born into a position in which it's safe to make that reach.
so then you're not an ally either. sit down and be quiet.
this guy sucks
Protest votes and people who chose to sit out for Kamala should be blamed, actually. If you look at the numbers, Trump actually didnt have as big of a turnout as he did in 2020 but the sword to the heart was the democrats that simply didnt turn out compared to last time. 13 million less i believe.
I would start with looking at the people that lost before looking for a scapegoat (whose votes would not have changed the final result anyway)
It's not the general public's fault that the Democrats would rather lose than tack left.
@@zed739Trump is going to be worse. Atleast they could've pressured the democrats.
@@GianmarcoSoresi I'm personally just completely against people who choose to not vote at all. Someone has to govern, regardless of how one may feel, and a non-vote is inevitably going to lead to these non-voters being subjected to policies they are against, yet they did nothing about it when they could have.
@@brinag8604good luck with that bullying strategy in 2028…maybe poor and oppressed people just dont like being preached to every 4 years, while nothing changes in between.
If she did not get people to the booth, she deservingly lost the election. Matter of fact, people vote in the booth privately, so even if you got them there, you can’t bully them into a victory, people do not like being bullied.
They wanted Brat at the polls...Gen Z and Yt women sure were bratty
Jon Stewart needs to run
horrible people's tears taste so sweet.
I agree with Lucas's optimistic approach
Lucas is actually very handsome
You're mistaking the nepo-sheen for good looks.
That was good. I needed that laugh. Thanks!😂😂😂😂😂😂@neonGawdzilla
Now what are the bad at New York comedy scene? Where is the tea? 🫣