I am third generation mix-Indonesian. After Indonesian independence, my grandparents had to move from Bandung (Java) to Manokwari (Dutch Papua New Guinea). When they arrived in Papua there was nothing, the Dutch government still had to build houses for the Dutch-Indonesian community. My grandmother told a story about when Papuans with spears were watching in the bushes. My father then still a child quickly ran inside with his brothers and sisters. My grandmother was not afraid and ran outside and walked to the papuas in the bushes. The first thing my grandmother asked, teach me to find food in the jungle because there are no shops here. The Papuans led my grandmother and other mothers through the jungle and pointed out what was and what was not to eat. So my grandmother cooked with ingredients from the jungle, in return my grandmother made clothes for them and they became good friends. My father told me how he had to leave New Guinea for the Netherlands. They had just boarded the ship, and not a moment later dozens of boats with Javanese moored on the coast. The Papaus waved goodbye to my family and went back to the jungle.
Its not like there are no conflict among Papuans and migrating Indo, some right winger like dutch catholic party wanted to create an 'indo homeland' in New Guinea as if there were no inhabitants there and did not want them in the 'european homeland'. I pity Indo community who left, they were just pawns of colonial governments, Im grateful some who managed to get success outside like in USA despite of the racism there. Sizeable indo population still live in Indonesia maybe millions esp descendant of people who didnt have money, but as Sutan Sjahrir said they ceased to be a separate identity and more identified with other ethnicities. Bandung is one the place where many indo descendants live. 'Indo' now is also colloquial term for all indonesians living abroad.
Javanen, na lange tijd van onderdrukking, hebben hun land terug geclaimed en betaald met hun eigen bloed voor hunzelf en voor de rest van Nusantara. Iets wat niemand anders in de wereld is gelukt en zonder hun vrijheidstrijd zou indonesie, en ook meerdere landen in de wereld, net als usa of australie zijn. Jammer he 😘😘 @@facta-non-verba
@@Godzillafan78 Very, very few people know about that, and the fact that at one point in time, the island that West Papua is in, was once ruled by the Dutch, Germans and the British, until the end of the first World War, when the German part was given to the British, who then gave it all up to we Australian's as a Protectorate, which we (Australia) gave independence to in 1975, or 1976. Not sure now.
Fun facts: After the Dutch administration ended, the region changed its name to West Irian. Irian stands for Ikut Republik Indonesia Anti-Netherland (in bahasa) or Join the Republic of Indonesia Anti-Netherland. - Frans Kaisepo (Papuan politician & Indonesian nationalist)
Yeah pretty important fact that Kaisiepo (just from biak, he mentioned) proclaim this in Malino Conference..and Papuan promptly silenced in Denpasar Conference. Not to mention Dutch wanted to send Silas Papare but he was involved in a rebellion by Sugoro hence he was exiled to Serui only to form PKII with GS Ratulangi which is exiled there too. He pick and choose and said papuan as primitive lol. No educated papuan figures involved in here is mentioned by him.
Nah, that just propaganda. That actually a backronym, which means that acronym was created after the word exists. The origin was from Biak language that means hot. Three is also many means from native tribes for same word.
@@BayuAH Well the one that popularised the acronym is also the one that think of the name in the first place. So it is not really a backronym. This name is first thought of in a meeting in Tobati in 1945 between students of Sugoro Atmoprasojo in the bestuur school, his assistant Corinus Krey, and the meeting leader Frans Kaisiepo to explore alternative name for papua.
The Dutch is white after all, theyre the pros when it comes to things like that, even to this day. Just see how they so quickly switched from invading and razing the middle east to ground into condemning Russia for the SMO.
West Papuans deserved the right to self-determination, Indonesia's claim on it was no less imperialist and unjustified, in fact even more so because unlike the Dutch they practised settler colonialism and exploit Papua far more than the Dutch did
@@Threezi04 the dutch made us pay the debt of the entire east indies, as such we have the rightful claim to all of it including west papua. The papuans have no rights of self determination.
@@Threezi04 Do people of scotland and north ireland are given the right of self determination? Eastern ukraine? Catalonia? Palestine? Hawaii? Westerners should take a loooongg look in the mirror before they judge others.
Since your piece documentary is on cold war, between US vs. USSR. You have missed the important part of the event. Who won and benefited from it? On your closing, you summarized that Indonesia was the winner and later on became the villain. Indonesia was just another victim of the cold war. It’s clear that the US won the stand off and had the most gained from the situation. They managed to run off the communist influence and had placed Freeport to suck out all the Gold and Copper in the following 50 years after. Not to mentioned in that 50 years, they turn blind eye on the mistreatments and failed to educate and improve the lives of the locals. Despite the immense wealth they have taken from their land/earth.
Soekarno is that really ambitious guy who switched from one side to another just to get what he wanted. First he sided with the Japanese during pre-independence, then the US during the independence war, then USSR during Papua, and lastly China during Konfrontasi. In the end though, he couldn't get Malaya and also lost everything to Soeharto, but still, he had amassed a lot of territories which would later became what it is now of the Republic. I may be the minority here but i have a high respect for him for having high ambitions along with the skills and charisma to back them.
You don't understand what you are talking about. First. Soekarno never sided with japan. He and other indonesian founding fathers is actually contra japanese government. They only play along with japanese plan without willing to cooperate. During 1945-1949 era, US even against indonesian independence, and USSR is too busy with their internal post ww2 strugle After indonesia gaining independence, Soekarno decided that indonesia will stay as a neutral country, not sided to any block. Soekarno want to create a balance relationship between Indonesia-US and Indonesia-USSR. But US don't want indonesia to get close to USSR and sending lots of assassin to erase soekarno. If you are soekarno, will you sided with usa that time? If i'm soekarno, i won't do that. On the other side, USSR very supportive to indonesia. It is not soekarno who's oportunist, but it's all about US and USSR strugle to make indonesia sided with them
For konfrontasi indonesia hasn't payed it's debt back to the soviets in time so they weren't willing to help us plus soviet union was in a different tactic, this channel already explained why soviets didn't help indo in konfrontasi conflict just check it out
@@thegrandlord2914 I think sukarno actually sided with the japanese but after nishimura told to Sukarno and Hatta that Tokyo didn't allow Indoesian proclamation of Independence they eventually decided to make the proclamation for the next day...
@@mysticonthehill all the mining revenue back to Papuan 30% + the Central Government inject 8 billion to all Papua provinces each year. No colony!! there are only 2 main cities in papua that has Mixed Native Papuan and all Indonesian the rest are 95% Papuan. Papua also got billions of infrastructure projects.
@@bryansmulez4672 0. Papua are the p00rest province in country. 0.A PNG capital are way biggr & rich then West P. 1. Majority of papuan are pe4ceful but separtist. You forg0t all the studnts pr0test? 2. OPM in jungle are crimn4l. Not p4rt of papua v0ices but their share same dream. 3. Malay race are col0nizer on n4tive papua.
As a young engineer in the US Merchant Marine, I first set foot in Indonesia in 1975. It was easy to see the country was under the rule of a dictator and I needed to watch my step.
1960 the communist party managed to become the largest party in Indonesia. with the campaign against European capitalist imperialism. made them win the election to become the largest party in Indonesia. 1965-1966 the military rebelled against the government. killed 1.5 million communists and imprisoned 3 million of their family members and dethroned the president. and became a dictator with the help of the United States
Again a complicated topic delivered with enough context and nuances for the general audiences. Kudos Just a couple of notes: 5:03 it wasn't that straightforward. Hatta, for example, didn't agree with Soekarno and others on the matter of Papua. To paraphrase, 'Papua has the right for self-determination and its own independence. If we continue this, why not Solomon or even the whole pacific islands'. There were also other objections from different parties with different narratives. 6:12 the neighbouring Biak Island (and Serui) was and still considered by Papuan themselves or other Indonesian to be part of the Papuan-sphere. A rather curious trivia: historically, it was some educated individuals from this island who supported the republic then also the 'transfer' of Papua, but then also the 1st organize freedom movement. It was in the port of this island the Biak massacre happened.
As much as I respect Hatta, I think it was absolutely a clown moment from him to fall for Dutch narrative of racial difference as to why he thinks Papua shouldn't be part of Indonesia. It's almost like he forgot about the Maluku islands and East Nusa Tenggara, or that there was also a significant presence of Austronesians in the coast of Papua that are racially similar to people in Central Indonesia than the Melanesian highlanders. And with Biak it's also very interesting because there was also a Peristiwa Merah Putih there where pro Indonesian rebels actually fought against the Dutch.
@@cek0792 tell that to Australian Aborigens, Tibet, Uighur, and people of Jammu and Kashmir. Jeez if we ask every single separatist movement in the world we will have like 5000 countries.
Its clear his bias why no mention of Frans Kaisiepo at all is it because he has to mention what he did: proclaiming IRIAN? Its not just him before this he had coordinated with Corinus Krey, Elly Uyo and Sugoro in prison. Not to mention Kaisiepo was a replacement, original delegate was supposed to be amberi(indonesian)-hating Silas Papare, which at this time was exiled in Serui where he met Ratulangi and form PKII. He was exiled because he was part of Sugoro rebellions lol. The Dutch (Van Mook) punished papuans by not having delegates at all in Denpasar, this was protested by Nicolaas Jouwe, Corinus Krey, and Marthen Indey. Ofc westoid did not mention this.
@@stoneruler Well, right now realistically they would be another East Timor if Papua separate itself from Indonesia. The integration was brutal but the current status quo is better to be maintained.
@@rizkyadiyanto7922 The classic imperialist and colonialist argument: "We improved their lives so that justifies us conquering them." Ironic how Indonesians hate Westerners for being "colonizers", yet did the exact same thing themselves.
the copper has been discovered since 1939 by dutch geologist, this is the main fuel of the dispute. One of the largest copper and gold deposit on earth with abundance of water for mining activity.
Papua, also known as Irian back then, was a headache. At one side, they wanted to unify with Java, Sumatra, Borneo, Celebes, Nusa Tenggara, and Maluku as Indonesia, hence it's name, IRIAN which stood for "Ikut Republik Indonesia Anti Nederland" if I weren't miss the spelling, propelled by the Japanese occupation from 1942 up until 1945. But, at the another side, some of our national builders especially Mr. Moh. Hatta were against the Papuans become a part of Indonesia despite the IRIAN word stoods. This was, an argument which Mr. Moh. Hatta said that there will be a chance for racism because the skin color and the behaviour differences (because Papuans back then are known for a resemblance of Africa) And so, when the Netherlands acknowledge our sovereignity in December 1949, which had an exception of West Irian being the part of Indonesia as late as maybe 1955 or something if I remember the history book I think, IRIAN is one of the main thing that Sukarno wants to take from Netherland despite the economy is still in the bottom of the ravine at that time. When the day that Netherland promises give the West Irian to Indonesia, they said, "We won't do that. The people of West Irian is with us. They support us as hell." Then, Sukarno come to USA but failed and then come to SSSR which Mr. Nikita Segeyevich Krushchev agreed to help we gained West Irian from Netherland. After that, Netherland didn't want to give the West Irian to us despite our attack and threat to them, and then, the USA under John F. Kennedy force Netherland to give it to us or the Marshall Plan would be cut of. So, symbolically, Netherland finally give West Irian to Indonesia. But, Western Powers are Western Powers. They factually didn't want a nation that independence by itself (when I types, "itself" means there is a promise but failed to be done, in this case by Japanese, so we have to erect our nation by ourself) go rapidly against Western domination in the so-called heavens mini garden, the South East Asia. And the rest is history... CMIIW
Indonesian first goal isn't an economic one, Papua was instead important because they attend the youth pledge(basically a unity pledge for an independent Indonesia) so it must be incorporated for it simbolysm + Papuans integration would be a win for the secularist because Papuans as you know are not Muslims and at that time when political islam we're a significant enough force(with US help ofc) that no new constitution can be approved without it being a sharia compliant one... Every support count
@@tarno_bejo_ I think it is because it's hard for many historians to understand its legitimacy. We're talking about nations yet a simple youth pledge participated by some young people who totally do not fully represent their respective region's views as they are not elected democratically is to be treated as if it fully represents their region. It's like having someone make important decisions for you as if they "know" what's best for you. I don't think the youth pledge hold any real value other than a meeting of Indonesian youth from different parts of Indonesia informally discussing a united Indonesian state.
@@cek0792 Cuz, they are learned people. They were not just simple some young people. They knew their culture, they knew of their tribe's laws, they knew their people. And more importantly, they were already organized like party and communicated each others, all around the country. So, ofcourse, its a formal forum. Well, unless you re a dutch colonized, then you might think of it as informal X-P And no senate truly knows whats the best for you anyway. Do you really think those people in the parliament know their people's interest? I dont think so. Cuz, they got elected by money.
Yeah lets just not forget the name: Poreu Abner Ohee (Ondoafi Asei Besar) and his wife, Pouw Orpa Pallo Yochu Aitai Baitawi Karubaba fron Ambai Islands All members of Papuan students in Ambon...Jong Ambon, do not just containe ambonese but also many papuan student in ambon, also another person Johannes Abraham Dimara.
In my opinion, Indonesia wanted West New Guinea to become their part because the president at that time feared that if the Netherlands stayed there for too long, it could be perfect bases for American presence to patrol the Indonesian waters, since at that time Indonesia tended to side with communist countries. Americans had been trying to depose the president for various occasions because of his bold stances against imperialism, so letting American and Dutch forces in West New Guinea threatened Indonesia's position since UK was also present in Malaya, Singapore and Borneo.
No such thing, there has always been intregationist connection between figures in Papua to join Indonesia (or even RIS). Like Machmud Rumagesan even chastised Sukarno why after 1949 RTC Indonesia did not push more for Irian.
My answer is based on gepolitical strategy, since at that time Indonesia was surrounded by belligerent forces that were trying to threatened the stability in Indonesia. If West New Guinea became independent, look at how easy Dutch and American troops used Raja Ampat to infiltrate to Seram and Halmahera, or at least supply arms to the potential rebels there. Americans eventually gave it to Indonesia so that Indonesia didn't fall to communism, which they almost did.
@@yosuasiregar341 You did not give the exact time for your assumption when is this geopolitical thinking because the situation changed pretty quickly during the decades after ww2. In BPUPKI Meeting Hatta expressed concern about Indonesia claim of Western New Guinea because Japanese forces did not hold Most New Guinea, he also asked whether it would extend to PNG because of geopolitcal reasoning like you said (aftaid of being attacked). But Yamin denied it is purely because of Indonesia tied with Western Papua and of only Dutch East Indies. Hatta himself welcome if Japanese troops give WNG to Indonesia. As far as we know there are no geopolitical consideration for this. UK was not the enemy yet as konfrontasi would only happen later on, they did not want to get involved after Surabaya and Allied forces tried to be neutral. At least since 1928 and beforehand there is already grassroot movement for western new guinea to be part of Indonesia. As it is just after Boven Digoel exiled, not to mention Tidore support of Jong Ambon members from Papua, of Asei Besar (Sentani) and Ambai islands (Yapen). Many allied forces veteran then lead Indonesian organization there such as Marthen Indey, Lukas Rumkorem, and Silas Papare. Though yes generally Indonesian figures is of Japanese Kempeitai (Johanes Dimara, Kaisiepo, Singgirei, Jouwe). If there is geopolitical consideration it is the forming of UPI or PSP-45 in Bv Digoel and South Papua regions because they work against RMS operatives which are present in South Papua. But even this is later ofc after RMS was formed. So then when is it maybe you are confusing the timeline with konfrontasi. Actually the opposite was true Raja Ampat was forces used by Trikora troops to infiltrate Western New Guinea, the local islanders sometime joined the infiltration troops. The Moi of sorong even supported Indonesian forces there, because OPI was already formed.
Indonesia and UK had bitter relationship in 1957 after the independence of Malaya, which Soekarno wanted to integrate it to Indonesia proper. Things only get heated after the formation of Federation of Malaysia in 1963 which led to Konfrotasi, so technically at that time Indo and UK were already in different sides. UK and US intelligence were trying to assasinate Soekarno few times, so you said that they were not enemies? You kept bringing the support and ideas of some Papua figures to this comment, while I didn't talk about it because I already knew that. There were some support for the integration from well-known Papuan figures regarding to the integration, that's why I didn't talk about it. And I did not say Raja Ampat WAS USED as a base there, I said it COULD BE USED as a base for Dutch and Americans cause the islands are located just few kilometres from Seram and Halmahera. And you must see Indonesian politics from 1959 to 1965. Indonesia was leaning towards communism, but the entire country was surrounded by UK-backed Malaysia, Australia to the south, Philippines who back then joined US-formed SEATO. If West New Guinea became independent, could you imagine how strategic they are to the US and Australia? They can become training site for separatist movements in eastern Indonesia, which at that time already demanded greater autonomy.
From the memoires of Prince Bernhard and Erik Hazelhoff Roelfzema, it becomes pretty evident the Netherlands did at least have some involvement in the uprising on the Maluku islands.
That explain why there are not even a sign of anti republican in the molluccas after RMS rebellion, it was never a grassroot rebellion, just a bunch of ex elite dutch collaborators who are salty because they lost a lot of their privileges
@@briantarigan7685 It is more a bit of both really. Keep in mind the population of the moluku islands is not Indonesian, not even related. Also, the RMS essentially gave up on violence over 40 years ago, but that is decades after Indonesian independence and decades after Dutch involvement there.
@@c128stuff huh? What do you mean not Indonesian? Indonesia is not an ethnicity or religion, being an Indonesian is just like being an American, i am a Christian and a Bataknese, does that make me not Indonesian in your eyes ? Indonesia is not a muslim state, our constitution is based on secular values rather than the values of one particular religion and all Citizen of Indonesia, regardless of their ethnicity or religions are equal in the eyes of the law Also you definitely don't knkw about indonesian history , Mollucans are active in Indonesian independence movement, particularly in Jong Ambon Movement, our longest serving Government ministers is an Ambonese Christian named Dr Johannese Leimenna RMS let go of violent struggle because they lost terribly, those spoiled elites are either dead or escape, all that's left of them is their saltiness in Netherlands, just like all those Confederate supporters, you go to Mollucas nowadays, talk to the peoples in the busy streets of Ambon, the largest city there, and no one would know anyone from or support RMS, except from history lesson they get in their Junior High school
@@briantarigan7685 Maybe start with investigating where the current population of the Moluku islands comes from, and how they got there. Its not a pleasant story btw, but it will show why part of the people there still do not feel they are Indonesian and should not be part of Indonesia. That number has been declining, and many of them have migrated, so sure, in Ambon today you will find few if any people supporting RMS, especially publicly. And beyond that, I don't think 'Indonesian' is an ethnicity or religion, I never said anything like that, and you'd do well to not try to put words into someone elses mouth so you can make an argument, that is a fallacy, and a dishonest way of having a discussion. Indonesian is however a nationality, and there is a national identity linked to that.
@@briantarigan7685 well, i got news you. Theres more ambon or mollucas living in Dutch than in Indonesia.. because in 1950' dutch come and take thm all, its free to enter on big ship. Only after that, its more easy for Indonesia army to w0n the battle.
Papuan rebels have killed many priests, teachers, health workers, road construction workers, and kidnapped other civilians. They also robbed the property of the Papuan people. But the world community and the human rights organization (Komnas HAM) have not investigated this war crime. In 2022, Komnas HAM also failed to reconcile conflicting factions in Papua. Because it doesn't invite all factions. At the end, the Indonesian people do not sympathize with the Papuan rebels and the double standard of handling human rights in Papua.
Yeah those western funded human right groups, silent when the victims is other islanders except Papuans. Their silent is deafening when the indonesian troops or health/construction workers or civilans killed are in fact papuans.
Who cares if the Indonesian people don't sympathise with the Papuan rebels? Do the Israelis sympathise with the Palestinians? Did the Yankees sympathise with the Native Americans?
You didn't really tell me much about the Papuan perspective. This is told almost exclusively from the great powers perspective of Indonesia and The Netherlands
There is an insurgency movement there to this day, West Papuans are forced off their ancestral lands and away from their sacred sites for the purpose of massive mining projects. Oh and they also face lots of racism from Indonesian settlers.
@@Threezi04 let's be honest your so called insurgency actually just hollow word of bandit, your people actually could come out the town do trade without any danger get hunted by soldiers in fact many normal people in papua as long you didn't bring gun we never try to remember your face. As matter fact we never know your leader name or face it prove that we never bother to make it bigger problem and just keep passive approach.
The then Dutch minister of Foreign Affairs Joseph Luns was FURIOUS with the Kennedy administration, Especially with Robert Kennedy. As a sort of reconcilliation, for what Washington also knew fine well to be a grave misjustice, Luns was later appointed secretary general of NATO.
Something that you apparently forgot to mention that the freeport concession, alongside the 1969 referendum, was made under Soeharto regime which one of many reason some Indonesian negatively viewed Soeharto since he perceived as the president who sold Indonesia's potential resource to the west (eventhough freeport is currently managed by Indonesian fortunately). Anyway, under current president Joko Widodo, Papua is experiencing relatively greater development than the previous president despite there are several attacks by west papua movement. So hopefully Papua will be in the better situation in the future.
@@epg96 its not only civil wars of political difference, but also religion and racial as well. Eastern part is compromised at least more muslims (maybe not majority still) than the one in the western part and western part is much more homogenously christian than the east. With addition of political view (eastern part is pro Indonesia since the start), it will be a civil with many dimensions.
Tentang pengembangan Papua, bapakku terlibat dalam pengembangan pasar perbatasan RI-PNG di Jayapura. Dan dari situ saya belajar bahwa pengembangan papua sudah direncanakan semenjak jaman Orde Baru. Mulai dari pemetaan, survey, zonasi dan penentuan kebijakan. Dilanjutkan oleh presiden-presiden setelahnya. Pos perbatasan RI-PNG di jayapura itu cukup megah dan canggih, dan itu direncanakan semasa presiden Habibie, dibangun semasa presiden SBY, dan diresmikan Jokowi. Serta proyek jalan Trans Papua, itu sekali lagi sudah ada semenjak jaman Soeharto, dilanjutkan pelan-pelan oleh penerusnya. Tapi dihebohkan dimasa Jokowi. Seruan jokowi dengan kabinet 'kerja' itu bisa kerja karena mereka teknisnya hanya perlu kerja. Hanya perlu me-nyata-kan perencanaan pendahulunya. Tentu pembangunan ini ada harganya, dan lihat kondisi sosial dan ekonomi nasional saat ini, hal yang dijauhi oleh pemerintahan sebelumnya, kini membengkak. Semoga penerus Jokowi mampu menangani hal ini.
@@muhammadriskyramadhan1725 ya mending jokowi sih. Prabowo cuman bs koar" jokowi antek cina. Plg gak jokowi ada rncn kerja lah drpd fokus ke ngejelekin saingan. Semoga Prabowo lebih pinter pilih strategi timses kedepanny. Slander (merusak nama baik) musuh politik tu strategi yg gak boleh dibiarin berhasil.
@@muhammadriskyramadhan1725 bkn prabowo. Tp setiap suporter prabowo yg tak tanya apa kebijakannya prabowo, jwbn mereka selalu sama: JOKOWI ANTEK CINA! Apa cb kebijakanny prabowo yg pengen diterapin klo dia terpilih? Plg gak jokowi jelas bilang memperbaiki infrastruktur.
Coup, coup, more coup, Student Activism which lead to a massacre which led to another coup, Communism Scare, probably a lot more but would be an exciting episode
Maybe I understand what Indonesian think. What they want is freedom. Free from their oppressors. But it's still there. Theirs enemies still there. In the land they think belong to them. And they think anyone who support their enemies. Is their enemy too. Then story of oppressed become oppressor begin once again.
@@Game_Hero Indonesia doesn't want a Dutch-controlled country right at its doorstep, especially when the Dutch at the time still can't let go of the colonial mindset. It is logical for Indonesia to integrate West Papua at any cost, albeit it's brutal.
@@lil_jong-un6668 Dutch controlled? Kim-Jong, the Dutch are a shell of their former empire, they barely can keep their Carribean conquests chained to them, how on Earth are they going to get to the other side of the world for a piece of land that has no value to them, that they were incapable of holding at their former larger strength, and will join its Papuan neighbour anyway? Why not the Swedish while we're at it. Indonesia must let go of its colonial mindset. You don't fight colonialism with colonialism. At least you're honest enough to recognize it is brutal.
They were not as "stone age" as you ve represented. That is insult to refer them as such. They already had learned people there. I havent see any of you guys mentioned "sumpah pemuda" (the oath/pledge of youth) in 1928. The representatives the real people from papua have expressed themselves of the willing to be united as one free nation Indonesia with the rest of us, free from the dutch colonizer. Why all of the so-called historian from the west have not ever mentioned that. That is a redflag there. Not to mention, papua had been part of tidore kingdom before the arrival of the dutch. Also really? Trtre, masscrs, public exection of pregnant women, and rpe?? You dont even mention any eyewitness/evidence there. What a bad story telling. However it did happen in jawa island. During the dutch military invasion. We have so many veterans eyewitness how the dutch soldiers have done the warcrimes.
Many Sugoro Atmoprasojo rebellions there, as Benarda Merteray writes there are three major Papuan rebellions to join Indonesia, during the period of 1945 to 1949. Many think they would join State of East Indonesia. No Komite Indonesi Merdeka, No PKII, basically no prespective of Indonesia or Papuan. At this time in western 'historian'.
Pretty sad they did not cover local Indonesian movement in New Guinea. Why just mention 'from Biak', Frans Kaisiepo is pretty influential member from there. Silas Papare from the neighboring Serui also prominent. Theres a reason at this time the islanders were pretty educated well travelled and have education connection with rest of Indonesian islands. He is present in Malino Conference before Denpasar Conference. Papuan delegates also protested no delegations in Denpasar. Nicolaas Jouwe, Marthen Indey, and Corinus Krey wanted to join State of East Indonesia. Nicolaas Jouwe himself is pretty influential from being part of pro Indonesian group, to Netherlanda and independence, before back again to Indonesia in 2010. No Soegoro Atmoprasojo, No Singgirei Rumagesan, No Abraham Dimara, No Silas Papare and PKII, No Marthen Indey and Komite Indonesia Merdeka. Ie: basically no Indonesian (and local 'West' Papuan) prespective at all.
Because most of the local Indonesian movement in Papua was miniscule or made up of puppets that were paid by Indonesia. The overwhelming majority of Papuans wanted independence. There were also pro-Dutch Indonesians that weren't covered either.
@@jokerofmorocco Papuan rebels are miniscule, minority of Papuans, minority of inhabitants. They are just puppets that were paid by foreigners (NGO and the likes), obsessed with racial superiority. The overwhelming majority of papuans just wanted peace have better lives and tired of the constant fighting.
@@jokerofmorocco source: trust me bro All those movements took place in the independence war when Indonesia had virtually no money at all, the fact that you say they are paid actors is laughable. Fact is that pro Indonesia sentiments existed within Papuans and was enough to even wage small scale skirmishes against the Dutch as part of a broader Indonesian rebellion against them, but yea keep being in denial about it I guess.
Wow, thats trully brutal act by our Indonesia Government back then. Sometimes we Indonesians also think like our colonial brethren, where we always thought that we save Irians or Papuan from Dutch. But probably they are just fine when we left them just like thousand years before. Just because they didnt yet accept what we call as standard of better wellbeing, that didnt mean they cant handle it themselves because its already proven by time that they able to survive in that condition since probably thousand of years ago. Yet, as Indonesian, we are still considered papua as part of Indonesia, we hope our recent treatment since 98 reform towards Papua will make them better as time goes by, its not easy to win Papuans heart after all atrocities weve done during military operation of Trikora and during New Order. But we still considered papuan as our brother in Nation, so we hope we can unite under one banner although we all have different skin colour, language and culture . Peace from Bali...
Indonesia acted like the Soviet Union, not only in Irian but also in Portugese Timor with concentration camps, torture and mass murder. There has to be something in the culture of the Indonesian people for it to get repeated multiple times, exactly like the Russians, from the 9 million killed in the Civil war, through the Holodomor, the Purges, to today's invasion of Ukraine. The people of the 2 countries willingly supported and actively participated in the crimes.
I appreciate you're willing to acknowledge this it isn't easy to hear ones nations mistake the world needs people like you. It is always important to see with the eyes of the people rather than nationalistic lenses and be open to Papuas piloting their own course.
@@titisuteu Why did the Dutch invest in the development of the Papuan before? They could have worked with the Australian and unified West Papua with Eastern Papua.
Little known fact, there was no mass arrest before the PEPERA 1969 as very few Indonesian soldier was garrisoned there (due to internal conflict during 1965-1966), but there were struggle between Indonesia and Holland, where Holland try to buy the people of Papua by giving the gifts like alcohol, food, clothes etc. So that the Papuans rather chose Holland than Indonesia. And the Mcroran Freeport was given the go to exploit Papua after America installed a pro-American dictator (Suharto, 1966-1998). And oppression started from there where America and Australia heavily support Indonesia even at the Invasion of East Timor. OV-10 Bronco, Skyhawks, LSTs and many more west hardware were pouring to Indonesia and the part where they shoot the Papuan is I think in the late 70s to eraly 80s where there was an attack at the Freeport mine killing some workers and the ABRI reacted harshly deploying the OV-10 to drop napalm to nearby areas and suspected camping area
"racially different", just what is that supposed to mean? And where does it leave Papua New Guinea and the colonial-imposed island splitting straight line in all this?
@@gangbelakang49 Yes, I'm from the Illuminati and I do evil comments as part of a conspiracy to change the world order with logical consistancy, muhahaha!
This shows the true face of democratic governments all around the world as an Indian. In Odissa and seven sister states, we have similar situations where natives are suppressed and exploited by the government by labeling them, terrorists and militants. Similarly, we can look at the US as well here native populations were exterminated oppressed and their lands seized all the while the US itself went around the world promoting freedom, liberty, and equality.
As a dutch person there's a beautiful irony in freeing a country and it immediately saying "we can do worst". on the up side. relationship between indo's and Nederland are pretty good. we weren't "that bad" i guess haha.
Yeah, some of my reaaaly distant relatives migrated to Dutch, either as a free workforce, and later on some moved during the polizing act done by the dutch colonial effort. But still, that is 4-5 generations ago. I really like how we as a nation can establish quite a friendly relation with our former colonizer, such as japan and dutch. I hope this would continue on in the far future...😊
do have to admire the audacity of encircling the New Guinean elders with mounted arms and telling them to put their hands up, then taking a picture and presenting it as the "Act of Free Choice"
From political point of view the if we lose Papua we might lose the "unity in diversity" thus weakening our foundation. That's why no president want to lose it
Dutch as well as Brits like many other colonialists tried their asses-out to hold their colonies as long as they can. Indonesians limited in resources and friends almost joined the global communist bloc just to drive the colonialists out as stated in Indonesia’s constitution. Until this present day Indonesians still value Russia as friend no matter what. These things fails to be presented in this western perspective lack truth vlog.
The USSR backed Indonesia for ideological reasons / own interests. That 'friendship' ended rather abruptly in the 60s for obvious reasons. The present regime of Russia has no particular love for Indonesia, but of course happy to get any support it can get from anyone anywhere blinkered by anti western sentiment.
Dutch prepared Papua for independence but were sabotaged by Sukarno and USA. West Papua should be free like PNG. If it wasn't for US Freeport arrangements wt Jakarta they would have been free now.
What you said about Indonesian troops treachery may right, but you may check that what rebel group did nowadays. Killing some innocence like doctors and make people human shield. They're not saints thou. I do some business on transporting some goods including to the Papua, they shot my goods anw
I feel so sorry for Papuans. I call the western half of the island, Indonesian New Guinea, because people can't tell Indonesia is oppressing Papuans otherwise.
@@dutchskyrimgamer.youtube2748It's not a republic, but maybe it will be one day. Your people wanted to give Dutch New Guinea its freedom, but Indonesia with help from the U.S. sadly conquered it.
@@royhay5741 the organization West Papua Merdeka has declared it to be independent and is officially calling itself the Federal Republic of West-Papua (FRWP) and is participating in the organization for unrepresented peoples
*Freeport sulphur at first, then freeport mcmoran, then after transfer of half ownership to indonesian and papuan government it becomes freeport indonesia
it is obvious that you are positioning yourself as a pro-western historian.....you are very detailed in explaining the massacre of the Papuan people by the Indonesian army...although the truth needs to be proven.....but you have not at all explained the story of how the soldiers the Dutch killed hundreds of thousands of civilians during the Indonesian war of independence....I am concerned about your way of thinking.....maybe because your lessons in western schools.....did not teach about the cruelty of your nation's colonialism against Asian peoples..
@@wazzup233 why would we be shamed from it? we already acknowledged it, learn from it & move on, we don't have white man guilt mentality, we accepted history as it is while also tried not repeat the worst of it in the near future
@Garren well it's not wrong tho, basically it's just different perspective with the same result, the problems is when the Western hemisphere tried to judge us meanwhile they done much much worst than Indonesia ever been in the last 4 centuries, we refuse those criticism because they just want to feel superior than us
Welp fun fact most atrocities here are being led by our soon to be dictator soeharto. The attack, the referendum, and the oppression was done mostly by him alone.
Thank you for this episode! Papua is a fascinating place from what little I know about the island. I would very much like to learn more about it. Does anybody have any good videos or books to recommend on the topic? God be with you out there everybody! ✝️ :)
after joining Indonesia, the name of the island was changed from NEW GUINEA to become IRIAN IRIAN is an abbreviation, in Indonesian language IRIAN means: I = Ikut (Follow) R = Republic I = Indonesia A = Anti N = Netherlands
Dutch backed Free West Papua mentioned but Pro Indonesia movement is not, same as what they did to natives. The Dutch played their naratives well to make Indonesia sounds like just snatched it.
When Māori attain equal political power to settlers in NZ we will officially support the reunification and self determination of west and east Papua along with their protectorates Serui and Biak. Papua merdeka!
Maori and the European settlers are proudly calling themselves New Zeelanders and Pacific Islanders or Polynesians ,so stop your fucked up instigating disunity in Civilized Societies.
The ARP is called a 'far-right' party, which is not the right term to be used. It was a christian-democratic party, though led by protestants the most conservative of influential Christian party's in Dutch politics, of which there were multiple. Especially with the modern interpretation of far-right, I just do not think it is fitting to be used in a video describing cold-war politics. The Dutch have never once had a far-right government, and such party's did not excist or held little to no sway in Dutch politics of the decolonisation-period. Dutch governments were consistently made up of either christian-democrats or social-democrats in coalition with the liberal party. This would be the case until the rise of Pim Fortuyn in Dutch politics after the 9/11 attacks. Even when looking at opposition-party's from before 2000 there is almost no right-wing, only the Centrum Partij could be considered as modern right and that would be long after the independence of both Indonesia and West-Papua.
Indonesia: Hey America why dont you back my illegal invasion of your allies territory and ill allow you to set up monopolies and enslave and or deport the natives? USA: Yes my dude!
@@Game_Hero are you seriously saying that? Bro, you're just a buzzer. U really dont believe all the bullshit the white people says right?😂 we all know white people are hypocrites
And the separatist killing some woman who's stand in the wrong place at the wrong time and left their corpse laying on the side of a road to lure police officer. When the police come to secure the corpse, the rebels that hide behind bushes then shooting at the police, killing one The rebels act causing alot of anger because it is unethical. Killing their own intentionaly to lure police
This vids sum things happened to West Papua and the impact it gives us today, Nice....... Dutch rules in Papua will hurt the soo called Decolonialization campaign push By US for further Opening global market. Decolonialization act is based on the conclusion from both World Wars, Colonialization will eventually make developed countries struggle for hegemony. (Even so there are countries that still make a leeway of it by creating puppets and effort of neo-colonialism) We all know what happened to African Countries after the Decolonization right, so are the West Papuan if leave by themselves. There was no right or wrong method but the least Indonesian Government can do is slowly to integrate people of Papua into one (like everybody else). Indonesia on it terms it self is a nation of different race and cultures united in one single banner, its simply just a bunch of Human tryin to live their live peacefully, so Papua was no different. IF some of you think they (papuans) are different, then my question is from what perspective that made them different ? They are Human too.....
No terrible no papuan mentioned at all, they were not just passive actors but part of indonesian independence movements there were many groups. He just mentioned 'from Biak' which is almost certainly Frans Kaisiepo. Even during the later period there were other groups too trying to link with Indonesian troops. Who do you think supported Indonesian troops in the jungle.
@@nylon1458 it just change from europeans to Indonesian. Funny right? I remember when their first president asked my country (USSR) to help them take papua but end up taken over by USA and Indonesian
west media never blow up this problem seriously, indonesia brutal action in the past backed by western goverment, but its just past time story, now papuan get better education, better opportunity to build their region
To this day many Dutch people yearn to live in the Dutch East Indies and West Papua (Indonesia), but Indonesians have completely forgotten the dutch colonialists, because if we remember the colonial period it will be very painful for most Indonesian people. But the Dutch people miss the Dutch East Indies so much because they live here very easily like in heaven, they white dutch are treated like a king here, they occupy the top caste became landlords of hundreds of hectares as well as owners of vast farms with very cheaply paid workers also had many slaves and concubines. The problem of Papua is very classic, Indonesia also got Papua from the help of the American west, Soekarno and Suharto had strong reasons why Papua had to be annexed because of the domino effect of the remnants of the second world war and the cold war, meanwhile the nature of Papua which has been exploited by Indonesia is just a bonus. Moreover, it is not only Indonesia that has enjoyed it, but also other western capitalist countries, especially America. Today Indonesia wants to improve itself and apologize to the people of Papua by building many facilities and special autonomy even though many Papuans want to ask for more, independence namely the new country. But there is no single country in the world that voluntarily releases and freedom some area to become a new country that has been integrated with it, this also happens to Indonesia and its Papua because Indonesia without Papua is not Indonesia, besides Indonesia has learned from its stupidity to release Timor Leste voluntarily due to western coercion and the end result is that an independent Timor Leste is far behind the regions in Indonesia for example with a small town in East Nusa Tenggara which is next door to Timor Leste itself even after Timor Leste became independent they always asked for help from Indonesia and this was very funny, the west was only good at provoking the people of Timor Leste to let them go but when they became independent they didn't care about Timor Leste.
@@ikWillem-Alexander Not in Indonesia now but in Dutch East Indiest or Indonesia in the past or Nusantara, you will easily find pages on social media many Dutch people nowadays have not been able to move on from the past and still talk about many things and their beautiful memories about the Dutch East Indies or Hindia Belanda, this is different from all Indonesians even though the Dutch colonized Indonesia for a very long time, around 350 years buy however there are currently NO significant traces of Dutch flavors in Indonesia besides the culture of corruption, Dutch colonialism was very painful as was Japanese colonialism for Indonesians. Spanish and Portuguese colonization gave birth to beautiful Latin culture in the Philippines. British colonialism gave birth to modern culture in Singapore and Malaysia. But the Dutch colonialism in Indonesia did not produce anything positive except for the corrupt culture inherited from the colonialists.
@@ikWillem-Alexander Obviously, before they got expelled out of Indonesia. Imagine thinking our archipelagic land belongs to them. Nice thing that is for they got expelled.
@@ikWillem-Alexander yea because today's Indonesia is not the Dutch colony it was before and the average Dutch person here will be treated like a normal "bule" foreigner not like kings.
Not a single Dutch person nowadays wants to live in Indonesia. Even if it was still the East Indies. The fact is that we really don't care about Indonesia anymore. Haven't done so for almost 70 years.
This kind of history never taught in our schools. We only know that a plebiscite happened, and the people chose to be part of Indonesia. I heard that even Hatta didn't strongly support West Papua integration, though he didn't oppose it outright either.
He may thought about the image it will have to Indonesia, and it happened as many ignorant Western nation view Indonesia as a tyrant because of "occupying" Papua
Me as indonesian myself never being taught about our military treatment during the era,only knew it after this, but Australia and New Zealand are way worst than what we have done in the past, while papua still consist of native of papua mostly, sadly their brother, the native aborigins, only left a few... So for Aussies and Kiwis, better look at your history before start to teach us, Indonesians, about human right.
@@Game_Hero papua new guinean sadly didnt fare better. In the border, they mostly get daily needs from their Indonesian side of papua. Their infrastructure are not as spread as in the indonesian side. I got this story from my co worker that assigned in Papua before.
@@bpcgos they’ll never learn from their own dark and bloody history. that's too hard for them, the white-ass monkeys in Oceania, North America and Europe.
@@bpcgos Brother don’t compare don’t compare West Papua and Australia at the end of the day bad is bad, 500,000 Papuans still got murdered by Indonesian army. The facts is, it ended in Australia but it still happening in Papuas highlands. oppression is always rife in Wamena Papuans always being killed😢.
@@rave.201 ofc any country suck resources for development of their people. The result papuan in Indonesia have better standard of living than across the border.
@@rave.201 Some stopped in west papua, (im talking about rebels from just after this video time period, not modern ones after Suharto), they actually formed kodam kasuari members (indonesia military district of west papua) after pepera. Since old opm forces is called cassowary batallion from PVK. The last governor of west papua was descendant of these early group leaderships. As a result now West Papua is generally more safer and developed than Papua. Nowadays rebels are most active clustered in Central Highlands. Which is in Central and Highland Papua. These rebels are new groups formed after suharto collapse which activate many rebel groups such as in Aceh east timor and Papua. They are more rooted in highland culture of war. One warband groups is in practice rival with anothers, taking over rich valuable lands such as freeport tailing areas for gold etc, such as Sabinus Waker groups. Even in the past they are split to Pemka and Marvic factions. Nowadays these splits still exists, but with TRWP under damianus magai yogi and TPNPB-OPM under Goliath Tabuni (he is rumored to be retired as pig farmers sometimes mentioned surredered to indo gov) more active was Lekagak Telenggen his 'deputy'. TRWP and TPNPB are accusing each other of being Indonesian false flag ops.
Pasti Indonesia siapkan TU 16 ,,bisa nenggunjangkan as,,juga Inggris ..KLO kerajaan Belanda cukup itung jam bom nuklir tu 16 ,,juga kapal perang KRI,kapal selam kelas Cakra bisa meleburkan markas besar pelabuhan d Sorong dan biak!.. Imperialisme d Papua d hapuskan ...fakta sejarah
your statement without a clear basis, I, as a native citizen of INDONESIA, really love the land of Papua because during the time of the MAJAPAHIT kingdom, Papua was already its territory.
@@Threezi04 thats how asian empire is, dont judge us with european empiricism, we dont colonize out of sense of pride but sense practically and communal.
@Garren who said that it wasn’t conquest, only u that said i want to be a good guy…but Majapahit conquests adheres to custom that not in line with European’s definition of empire. If i want to be “good guys” i would licking Western definitions of humanity to the boots,…so easy for you to vilified people opinions.
At 4:47 you critically claim that the Dutch used the “white man’s burden” narrative when they claimed that the Papuans needed a period of Dutch guidance before they would be ready to exercise self determination. Then you end the video and prove how the Papuans were incapable of exercising their self determination and suffered numerous abuses and massacres from the Indonesians as a result.
That's absolutely not what they said, did you really just say it was the victims fault for being massacred and abused by Indonesia, what the heck is wrong with you?
@@Game_Hero Did I say it was their fault? No I didn’t and you know clearly well I didn’t. You’re just trying to be manipulative. I said they were incapable (which translates to “did not have the ability”) to exercise their self determination. I’m not sure if you know this, but a country with little education, low economic development, and a weak military isn’t very good at defending its sovereignty.
@@Game_Hero It appears to be in line with the Dutch Ethical Policy. Knowing what I know, if I was a Papuan, that’s exactly what I would have wanted the Dutch to do.
for a newly independent country, Indonesia was very powerful and powerful. took Papua from the Netherlands England, America. Because they are allies and Indonesia is fighting with diplomacy and military. It is not easy to take Papua because it is against these 3 countries
Not USA as a whole as JFK, Sukarno, and Nicolaas Jouwe were involved in secret negotiations and planned ti be announced in 1964. This is from Nicolaas Jouwe's book, "Kembali ke Indonesia". Though many other motives, such as PKI, Konfrontasi and Freeport, JFK was killed, Sukarno was couped. Greg Poulgrain in his book "JFK Vs. Allen Dulles: Battleground Indonesia" said its CIA.
I am third generation mix-Indonesian. After Indonesian independence, my grandparents had to move from Bandung (Java) to Manokwari (Dutch Papua New Guinea). When they arrived in Papua there was nothing, the Dutch government still had to build houses for the Dutch-Indonesian community. My grandmother told a story about when Papuans with spears were watching in the bushes. My father then still a child quickly ran inside with his brothers and sisters.
My grandmother was not afraid and ran outside and walked to the papuas in the bushes. The first thing my grandmother asked, teach me to find food in the jungle because there are no shops here. The Papuans led my grandmother and other mothers through the jungle and pointed out what was and what was not to eat. So my grandmother cooked with ingredients from the jungle, in return my grandmother made clothes for them and they became good friends.
My father told me how he had to leave New Guinea for the Netherlands. They had just boarded the ship, and not a moment later dozens of boats with Javanese moored on the coast. The Papaus waved goodbye to my family and went back to the jungle.
Do you know where in Bandung your grandparents were stay at? Just curious if their home is still exist today 😊
Its not like there are no conflict among Papuans and migrating Indo, some right winger like dutch catholic party wanted to create an 'indo homeland' in New Guinea as if there were no inhabitants there and did not want them in the 'european homeland'.
I pity Indo community who left, they were just pawns of colonial governments, Im grateful some who managed to get success outside like in USA despite of the racism there.
Sizeable indo population still live in Indonesia maybe millions esp descendant of people who didnt have money, but as Sutan Sjahrir said they ceased to be a separate identity and more identified with other ethnicities. Bandung is one the place where many indo descendants live. 'Indo' now is also colloquial term for all indonesians living abroad.
Things could be much better today without extremism if politicians acted the way your grandmother did. You have a great family!
Javanen, na lange tijd van onderdrukking, hebben hun land terug geclaimed en betaald met hun eigen bloed voor hunzelf en voor de rest van Nusantara. Iets wat niemand anders in de wereld is gelukt en zonder hun vrijheidstrijd zou indonesie, en ook meerdere landen in de wereld, net als usa of australie zijn. Jammer he 😘😘 @@facta-non-verba
@@youxkio exactly if only all the colonial Malay-Mongols acted like the grandmother in the past..
Nice of you to cover this relatively obscure subject. New Guinea is usually only known for the brutal, grinding and malaria infested campaign of WW2.
Your telling me it’s known for the ww1 campaign
@@Godzillafan78 Very, very few people know about that, and the fact that at one point in time, the island that West Papua is in, was once ruled by the Dutch, Germans and the British, until the end of the first World War, when the German part was given to the British, who then gave it all up to we Australian's as a Protectorate, which we (Australia) gave independence to in 1975, or 1976. Not sure now.
The animals it shares with Australia come up a lot too
Only fron Dutch prespective no local Indonesians are mentioned it seems. You think they did not protest when the Dutch exclude them from Denpasar.
@@Godzillafan78 you're telling ..not.. Your telling.. Du.mb
Fun facts: After the Dutch administration ended, the region changed its name to West Irian. Irian stands for Ikut Republik Indonesia Anti-Netherland (in bahasa) or Join the Republic of Indonesia Anti-Netherland. - Frans Kaisepo (Papuan politician & Indonesian nationalist)
Yeah pretty important fact that Kaisiepo (just from biak, he mentioned) proclaim this in Malino Conference..and Papuan promptly silenced in Denpasar Conference.
Not to mention Dutch wanted to send Silas Papare but he was involved in a rebellion by Sugoro hence he was exiled to Serui only to form PKII with GS Ratulangi which is exiled there too.
He pick and choose and said papuan as primitive lol. No educated papuan figures involved in here is mentioned by him.
Gua malah bru tau kepanjangannya Irian 😅
Nah, that just propaganda. That actually a backronym, which means that acronym was created after the word exists. The origin was from Biak language that means hot. Three is also many means from native tribes for same word.
@@BayuAH Well the one that popularised the acronym is also the one that think of the name in the first place. So it is not really a backronym.
This name is first thought of in a meeting in Tobati in 1945 between students of Sugoro Atmoprasojo in the bestuur school, his assistant Corinus Krey, and the meeting leader Frans Kaisiepo to explore alternative name for papua.
In bahasa ? Bahasa is language, so in bahasa = in Language .. what this meaning ? LoL
The Indonesians learned well from the Dutch...
not without help from the americans
And the Dutch learned well from the Spanish
@Maurits van Oranje and the Dutch are only still a country because of the US 😂, think I know who owes the other one more
@@sage6211 and soviets
Dutch be like: sniff…they grow up so fast 🥺
You want West Papua to be separated from Indonesia, after that you will exploit its natural wealth. then left it like Timor Leste, Iraq, Afghanistan
Just am disgusted with Islamic exploitation and hypocrisy !
Most insightful coverage of an issue that isn't spoken about very much.
I like how the dutch swithed from "this colony land belong to us and us only" to play moral highground of free choice in few years.
The Dutch is white after all, theyre the pros when it comes to things like that, even to this day. Just see how they so quickly switched from invading and razing the middle east to ground into condemning Russia for the SMO.
Typical imperial playbook
West Papuans deserved the right to self-determination, Indonesia's claim on it was no less imperialist and unjustified, in fact even more so because unlike the Dutch they practised settler colonialism and exploit Papua far more than the Dutch did
@@Threezi04 the dutch made us pay the debt of the entire east indies, as such we have the rightful claim to all of it including west papua. The papuans have no rights of self determination.
@@Threezi04 Do people of scotland and north ireland are given the right of self determination? Eastern ukraine? Catalonia? Palestine? Hawaii? Westerners should take a loooongg look in the mirror before they judge others.
Since your piece documentary is on cold war, between US vs. USSR. You have missed the important part of the event. Who won and benefited from it? On your closing, you summarized that Indonesia was the winner and later on became the villain. Indonesia was just another victim of the cold war. It’s clear that the US won the stand off and had the most gained from the situation. They managed to run off the communist influence and had placed Freeport to suck out all the Gold and Copper in the following 50 years after. Not to mentioned in that 50 years, they turn blind eye on the mistreatments and failed to educate and improve the lives of the locals. Despite the immense wealth they have taken from their land/earth.
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This should be pinned
Australia on the other side
Soekarno is that really ambitious guy who switched from one side to another just to get what he wanted. First he sided with the Japanese during pre-independence, then the US during the independence war, then USSR during Papua, and lastly China during Konfrontasi. In the end though, he couldn't get Malaya and also lost everything to Soeharto, but still, he had amassed a lot of territories which would later became what it is now of the Republic.
I may be the minority here but i have a high respect for him for having high ambitions along with the skills and charisma to back them.
You don't understand what you are talking about.
First. Soekarno never sided with japan. He and other indonesian founding fathers is actually contra japanese government. They only play along with japanese plan without willing to cooperate.
During 1945-1949 era, US even against indonesian independence, and USSR is too busy with their internal post ww2 strugle
After indonesia gaining independence, Soekarno decided that indonesia will stay as a neutral country, not sided to any block. Soekarno want to create a balance relationship between Indonesia-US and Indonesia-USSR.
But US don't want indonesia to get close to USSR and sending lots of assassin to erase soekarno. If you are soekarno, will you sided with usa that time? If i'm soekarno, i won't do that. On the other side, USSR very supportive to indonesia.
It is not soekarno who's oportunist, but it's all about US and USSR strugle to make indonesia sided with them
For konfrontasi indonesia hasn't payed it's debt back to the soviets in time so they weren't willing to help us plus soviet union was in a different tactic, this channel already explained why soviets didn't help indo in konfrontasi conflict just check it out
@@thegrandlord2914 I think sukarno actually sided with the japanese but after nishimura told to Sukarno and Hatta that Tokyo didn't allow Indoesian proclamation of Independence they eventually decided to make the proclamation for the next day...
Today's PAPUA Indonesia has 5x bigger its GDP than New Guinea.
And? Doesn't justify anything.
And who does that wealth go to? Papua is an internal colony
@@mysticonthehill all the mining revenue back to Papuan 30% + the Central Government inject 8 billion to all Papua provinces each year. No colony!! there are only 2 main cities in papua that has Mixed Native Papuan and all Indonesian the rest are 95% Papuan.
Papua also got billions of infrastructure projects.
@@bryansmulez4672
0. Papua are the p00rest province in country.
0.A PNG capital are way biggr & rich then West P.
1. Majority of papuan are pe4ceful but separtist. You forg0t all the studnts pr0test?
2. OPM in jungle are crimn4l. Not p4rt of papua v0ices but their share same dream.
3. Malay race are col0nizer on n4tive papua.
@@mysticonthehill It goes to the Papuans. There's a reason why West Papuan's quality of life is significantly better than PNG's.
As a young engineer in the US Merchant Marine, I first set foot in Indonesia in 1975. It was easy to see the country was under the rule of a dictator and I needed to watch my step.
US pro ditactor
1960 the communist party managed to become the largest party in Indonesia. with the campaign against European capitalist imperialism. made them win the election to become the largest party in Indonesia. 1965-1966 the military rebelled against the government. killed 1.5 million communists and imprisoned 3 million of their family members and dethroned the president. and became a dictator with the help of the United States
US backed one
Backed by your country btw
Lmao moment
Again a complicated topic delivered with enough context and nuances for the general audiences. Kudos
Just a couple of notes:
5:03 it wasn't that straightforward. Hatta, for example, didn't agree with Soekarno and others on the matter of Papua. To paraphrase, 'Papua has the right for self-determination and its own independence. If we continue this, why not Solomon or even the whole pacific islands'. There were also other objections from different parties with different narratives.
6:12 the neighbouring Biak Island (and Serui) was and still considered by Papuan themselves or other Indonesian to be part of the Papuan-sphere. A rather curious trivia: historically, it was some educated individuals from this island who supported the republic then also the 'transfer' of Papua, but then also the 1st organize freedom movement. It was in the port of this island the Biak massacre happened.
As much as I respect Hatta, I think it was absolutely a clown moment from him to fall for Dutch narrative of racial difference as to why he thinks Papua shouldn't be part of Indonesia. It's almost like he forgot about the Maluku islands and East Nusa Tenggara, or that there was also a significant presence of Austronesians in the coast of Papua that are racially similar to people in Central Indonesia than the Melanesian highlanders.
And with Biak it's also very interesting because there was also a Peristiwa Merah Putih there where pro Indonesian rebels actually fought against the Dutch.
@@mapk1516 How about the self-determination argument? It's not our business to be deciding the future for papuans and their children.
@@cek0792 tell that to Australian Aborigens, Tibet, Uighur, and people of Jammu and Kashmir. Jeez if we ask every single separatist movement in the world we will have like 5000 countries.
@@anggitaputri3123 And that's why you're imperialists. You're no different from the Dutch or the British or the Portuguese. Hypocrites.
Its clear his bias why no mention of Frans Kaisiepo at all is it because he has to mention what he did: proclaiming IRIAN? Its not just him before this he had coordinated with Corinus Krey, Elly Uyo and Sugoro in prison.
Not to mention Kaisiepo was a replacement, original delegate was supposed to be amberi(indonesian)-hating Silas Papare, which at this time was exiled in Serui where he met Ratulangi and form PKII. He was exiled because he was part of Sugoro rebellions lol.
The Dutch (Van Mook) punished papuans by not having delegates at all in Denpasar, this was protested by Nicolaas Jouwe, Corinus Krey, and Marthen Indey. Ofc westoid did not mention this.
A classic case of international bullying winning the day.
The same thing has repeated quite a few times since.
Exactly. The oppressed has now become the oppressor.
A tale as old as time.......
@@stoneruler Well, right now realistically they would be another East Timor if Papua separate itself from Indonesia. The integration was brutal but the current status quo is better to be maintained.
@@lil_jong-un6668 no need to look too far. just look at Papua New Guinea.
@@rizkyadiyanto7922 The classic imperialist and colonialist argument: "We improved their lives so that justifies us conquering them."
Ironic how Indonesians hate Westerners for being "colonizers", yet did the exact same thing themselves.
the copper has been discovered since 1939 by dutch geologist, this is the main fuel of the dispute. One of the largest copper and gold deposit on earth with abundance of water for mining activity.
No longer profitable
Papua, also known as Irian back then, was a headache.
At one side, they wanted to unify with Java, Sumatra, Borneo, Celebes, Nusa Tenggara, and Maluku as Indonesia, hence it's name, IRIAN which stood for "Ikut Republik Indonesia Anti Nederland" if I weren't miss the spelling, propelled by the Japanese occupation from 1942 up until 1945.
But, at the another side, some of our national builders especially Mr. Moh. Hatta were against the Papuans become a part of Indonesia despite the IRIAN word stoods. This was, an argument which Mr. Moh. Hatta said that there will be a chance for racism because the skin color and the behaviour differences (because Papuans back then are known for a resemblance of Africa)
And so, when the Netherlands acknowledge our sovereignity in December 1949, which had an exception of West Irian being the part of Indonesia as late as maybe 1955 or something if I remember the history book I think, IRIAN is one of the main thing that Sukarno wants to take from Netherland despite the economy is still in the bottom of the ravine at that time.
When the day that Netherland promises give the West Irian to Indonesia, they said, "We won't do that. The people of West Irian is with us. They support us as hell." Then, Sukarno come to USA but failed and then come to SSSR which Mr. Nikita Segeyevich Krushchev agreed to help we gained West Irian from Netherland. After that, Netherland didn't want to give the West Irian to us despite our attack and threat to them, and then, the USA under John F. Kennedy force Netherland to give it to us or the Marshall Plan would be cut of. So, symbolically, Netherland finally give West Irian to Indonesia.
But, Western Powers are Western Powers. They factually didn't want a nation that independence by itself (when I types, "itself" means there is a promise but failed to be done, in this case by Japanese, so we have to erect our nation by ourself) go rapidly against Western domination in the so-called heavens mini garden, the South East Asia.
And the rest is history...
CMIIW
Indonesian first goal isn't an economic one, Papua was instead important because they attend the youth pledge(basically a unity pledge for an independent Indonesia) so it must be incorporated for it simbolysm + Papuans integration would be a win for the secularist
because Papuans as you know are not Muslims and at that time when political islam we're a significant enough force(with US help ofc) that no new constitution can be approved without it being a sharia compliant one... Every support count
Political islam with US help??? Huh.... why US always get blamed?
Yep, none of these so-called historian ever mentioned the youth pledge when they talk about papua so far.
@@tarno_bejo_ I think it is because it's hard for many historians to understand its legitimacy. We're talking about nations yet a simple youth pledge participated by some young people who totally do not fully represent their respective region's views as they are not elected democratically is to be treated as if it fully represents their region. It's like having someone make important decisions for you as if they "know" what's best for you. I don't think the youth pledge hold any real value other than a meeting of Indonesian youth from different parts of Indonesia informally discussing a united Indonesian state.
@@cek0792 Cuz, they are learned people. They were not just simple some young people. They knew their culture, they knew of their tribe's laws, they knew their people. And more importantly, they were already organized like party and communicated each others, all around the country.
So, ofcourse, its a formal forum.
Well, unless you re a dutch colonized, then you might think of it as informal X-P
And no senate truly knows whats the best for you anyway.
Do you really think those people in the parliament know their people's interest? I dont think so.
Cuz, they got elected by money.
Yeah lets just not forget the name:
Poreu Abner Ohee (Ondoafi Asei Besar) and his wife, Pouw Orpa Pallo Yochu
Aitai Baitawi Karubaba fron Ambai Islands
All members of Papuan students in Ambon...Jong Ambon, do not just containe ambonese but also many papuan student in ambon, also another person Johannes Abraham Dimara.
I'm glad you put Pasundan on there, you really know everything
The rank of Denmark...lol
In my opinion, Indonesia wanted West New Guinea to become their part because the president at that time feared that if the Netherlands stayed there for too long, it could be perfect bases for American presence to patrol the Indonesian waters, since at that time Indonesia tended to side with communist countries. Americans had been trying to depose the president for various occasions because of his bold stances against imperialism, so letting American and Dutch forces in West New Guinea threatened Indonesia's position since UK was also present in Malaya, Singapore and Borneo.
No such thing, there has always been intregationist connection between figures in Papua to join Indonesia (or even RIS). Like Machmud Rumagesan even chastised Sukarno why after 1949 RTC Indonesia did not push more for Irian.
My answer is based on gepolitical strategy, since at that time Indonesia was surrounded by belligerent forces that were trying to threatened the stability in Indonesia. If West New Guinea became independent, look at how easy Dutch and American troops used Raja Ampat to infiltrate to Seram and Halmahera, or at least supply arms to the potential rebels there. Americans eventually gave it to Indonesia so that Indonesia didn't fall to communism, which they almost did.
@@yosuasiregar341 You did not give the exact time for your assumption when is this geopolitical thinking because the situation changed pretty quickly during the decades after ww2.
In BPUPKI Meeting Hatta expressed concern about Indonesia claim of Western New Guinea because Japanese forces did not hold Most New Guinea, he also asked whether it would extend to PNG because of geopolitcal reasoning like you said (aftaid of being attacked). But Yamin denied it is purely because of Indonesia tied with Western Papua and of only Dutch East Indies. Hatta himself welcome if Japanese troops give WNG to Indonesia.
As far as we know there are no geopolitical consideration for this. UK was not the enemy yet as konfrontasi would only happen later on, they did not want to get involved after Surabaya and Allied forces tried to be neutral. At least since 1928 and beforehand there is already grassroot movement for western new guinea to be part of Indonesia. As it is just after Boven Digoel exiled, not to mention Tidore support of Jong Ambon members from Papua, of Asei Besar (Sentani) and Ambai islands (Yapen).
Many allied forces veteran then lead Indonesian organization there such as Marthen Indey, Lukas Rumkorem, and Silas Papare. Though yes generally Indonesian figures is of Japanese Kempeitai (Johanes Dimara, Kaisiepo, Singgirei, Jouwe).
If there is geopolitical consideration it is the forming of UPI or PSP-45 in Bv Digoel and South Papua regions because they work against RMS operatives which are present in South Papua. But even this is later ofc after RMS was formed.
So then when is it maybe you are confusing the timeline with konfrontasi. Actually the opposite was true Raja Ampat was forces used by Trikora troops to infiltrate Western New Guinea, the local islanders sometime joined the infiltration troops. The Moi of sorong even supported Indonesian forces there, because OPI was already formed.
Indonesia and UK had bitter relationship in 1957 after the independence of Malaya, which Soekarno wanted to integrate it to Indonesia proper. Things only get heated after the formation of Federation of Malaysia in 1963 which led to Konfrotasi, so technically at that time Indo and UK were already in different sides. UK and US intelligence were trying to assasinate Soekarno few times, so you said that they were not enemies?
You kept bringing the support and ideas of some Papua figures to this comment, while I didn't talk about it because I already knew that. There were some support for the integration from well-known Papuan figures regarding to the integration, that's why I didn't talk about it.
And I did not say Raja Ampat WAS USED as a base there, I said it COULD BE USED as a base for Dutch and Americans cause the islands are located just few kilometres from Seram and Halmahera.
And you must see Indonesian politics from 1959 to 1965. Indonesia was leaning towards communism, but the entire country was surrounded by UK-backed Malaysia, Australia to the south, Philippines who back then joined US-formed SEATO. If West New Guinea became independent, could you imagine how strategic they are to the US and Australia? They can become training site for separatist movements in eastern Indonesia, which at that time already demanded greater autonomy.
@@yosuasiregar341 You do know there even volunteers from Singapore and Malaya for Trikora operation right? You can read from '25 tahun trikora'.
thank you, very enlightening!
From the memoires of Prince Bernhard and Erik Hazelhoff Roelfzema, it becomes pretty evident the Netherlands did at least have some involvement in the uprising on the Maluku islands.
That explain why there are not even a sign of anti republican in the molluccas after RMS rebellion, it was never a grassroot rebellion, just a bunch of ex elite dutch collaborators who are salty because they lost a lot of their privileges
@@briantarigan7685 It is more a bit of both really. Keep in mind the population of the moluku islands is not Indonesian, not even related.
Also, the RMS essentially gave up on violence over 40 years ago, but that is decades after Indonesian independence and decades after Dutch involvement there.
@@c128stuff huh? What do you mean not Indonesian? Indonesia is not an ethnicity or religion, being an Indonesian is just like being an American, i am a Christian and a Bataknese, does that make me not Indonesian in your eyes ? Indonesia is not a muslim state, our constitution is based on secular values rather than the values of one particular religion and all Citizen of Indonesia, regardless of their ethnicity or religions are equal in the eyes of the law
Also you definitely don't knkw about indonesian history , Mollucans are active in Indonesian independence movement, particularly in Jong Ambon Movement, our longest serving Government ministers is an Ambonese Christian named Dr Johannese Leimenna
RMS let go of violent struggle because they lost terribly, those spoiled elites are either dead or escape, all that's left of them is their saltiness in Netherlands, just like all those Confederate supporters, you go to Mollucas nowadays, talk to the peoples in the busy streets of Ambon, the largest city there, and no one would know anyone from or support RMS, except from history lesson they get in their Junior High school
@@briantarigan7685 Maybe start with investigating where the current population of the Moluku islands comes from, and how they got there. Its not a pleasant story btw, but it will show why part of the people there still do not feel they are Indonesian and should not be part of Indonesia. That number has been declining, and many of them have migrated, so sure, in Ambon today you will find few if any people supporting RMS, especially publicly.
And beyond that, I don't think 'Indonesian' is an ethnicity or religion, I never said anything like that, and you'd do well to not try to put words into someone elses mouth so you can make an argument, that is a fallacy, and a dishonest way of having a discussion.
Indonesian is however a nationality, and there is a national identity linked to that.
@@briantarigan7685 well, i got news you. Theres more ambon or mollucas living in Dutch than in Indonesia.. because in 1950' dutch come and take thm all, its free to enter on big ship. Only after that, its more easy for Indonesia army to w0n the battle.
Papuan rebels have killed many priests, teachers, health workers, road construction workers, and kidnapped other civilians. They also robbed the property of the Papuan people. But the world community and the human rights organization (Komnas HAM) have not investigated this war crime.
In 2022, Komnas HAM also failed to reconcile conflicting factions in Papua. Because it doesn't invite all factions.
At the end, the Indonesian people do not sympathize with the Papuan rebels and the double standard of handling human rights in Papua.
Yeah those western funded human right groups, silent when the victims is other islanders except Papuans. Their silent is deafening when the indonesian troops or health/construction workers or civilans killed are in fact papuans.
Who cares if the Indonesian people don't sympathise with the Papuan rebels? Do the Israelis sympathise with the Palestinians? Did the Yankees sympathise with the Native Americans?
@@Threezi04 you should because papuans are Indonesians 🤣
@@nylon1458 sure doesnt seem like they want to bo
@@Kekian0 they do, you don't know anything
You didn't really tell me much about the Papuan perspective. This is told almost exclusively from the great powers perspective of Indonesia and The Netherlands
There is an insurgency movement there to this day, West Papuans are forced off their ancestral lands and away from their sacred sites for the purpose of massive mining projects. Oh and they also face lots of racism from Indonesian settlers.
@@Threezi04 none of the things you said are true
@@Threezi04 It happened in most of the country, not just papua.
@@Threezi04 let's be honest your so called insurgency actually just hollow word of bandit, your people actually could come out the town do trade without any danger get hunted by soldiers in fact many normal people in papua as long you didn't bring gun we never try to remember your face. As matter fact we never know your leader name or face it prove that we never bother to make it bigger problem and just keep passive approach.
@@Threezi04 yeah ok
The Republic of Indonesia from Sabang to Merauke remains united and unbreakable
The then Dutch minister of Foreign Affairs Joseph Luns was FURIOUS with the Kennedy administration, Especially with Robert Kennedy. As a sort of reconcilliation, for what Washington also knew fine well to be a grave misjustice, Luns was later appointed secretary general of NATO.
Nicolaas Jouwe was furious of Joseph Luns too, lol.
Something that you apparently forgot to mention that the freeport concession, alongside the 1969 referendum, was made under Soeharto regime which one of many reason some Indonesian negatively viewed Soeharto since he perceived as the president who sold Indonesia's potential resource to the west (eventhough freeport is currently managed by Indonesian fortunately).
Anyway, under current president Joko Widodo, Papua is experiencing relatively greater development than the previous president despite there are several attacks by west papua movement. So hopefully Papua will be in the better situation in the future.
@@epg96 its not only civil wars of political difference, but also religion and racial as well. Eastern part is compromised at least more muslims (maybe not majority still) than the one in the western part and western part is much more homogenously christian than the east. With addition of political view (eastern part is pro Indonesia since the start), it will be a civil with many dimensions.
Tentang pengembangan Papua, bapakku terlibat dalam pengembangan pasar perbatasan RI-PNG di Jayapura. Dan dari situ saya belajar bahwa pengembangan papua sudah direncanakan semenjak jaman Orde Baru. Mulai dari pemetaan, survey, zonasi dan penentuan kebijakan. Dilanjutkan oleh presiden-presiden setelahnya.
Pos perbatasan RI-PNG di jayapura itu cukup megah dan canggih, dan itu direncanakan semasa presiden Habibie, dibangun semasa presiden SBY, dan diresmikan Jokowi.
Serta proyek jalan Trans Papua, itu sekali lagi sudah ada semenjak jaman Soeharto, dilanjutkan pelan-pelan oleh penerusnya. Tapi dihebohkan dimasa Jokowi. Seruan jokowi dengan kabinet 'kerja' itu bisa kerja karena mereka teknisnya hanya perlu kerja. Hanya perlu me-nyata-kan perencanaan pendahulunya.
Tentu pembangunan ini ada harganya, dan lihat kondisi sosial dan ekonomi nasional saat ini, hal yang dijauhi oleh pemerintahan sebelumnya, kini membengkak. Semoga penerus Jokowi mampu menangani hal ini.
@@muhammadriskyramadhan1725 ya mending jokowi sih. Prabowo cuman bs koar" jokowi antek cina. Plg gak jokowi ada rncn kerja lah drpd fokus ke ngejelekin saingan. Semoga Prabowo lebih pinter pilih strategi timses kedepanny. Slander (merusak nama baik) musuh politik tu strategi yg gak boleh dibiarin berhasil.
@@alifkazeryu8228 sepertinya saya cukup awam soal pemilu kemarin, tapi ejekan apa yang pernah di sampaikan Prabowo ke Jokowi?
@@muhammadriskyramadhan1725 bkn prabowo. Tp setiap suporter prabowo yg tak tanya apa kebijakannya prabowo, jwbn mereka selalu sama: JOKOWI ANTEK CINA! Apa cb kebijakanny prabowo yg pengen diterapin klo dia terpilih? Plg gak jokowi jelas bilang memperbaiki infrastruktur.
The word Tidore should have been pronounced somewhat like 'tee-dough-ray'.
nyimeng
Tidoré
In the context of the video even mentioning pronunciation errors is like asking JFK's wife... other than that Mrs Kennedy, how was Texas ?
Bro's research is from dutch book lol
If Papua become independent from Indonesia then the aborigin will be independent from Australia
Cie ngaku jadi penjajah 😂
@@aldimrmr4108 apanya yang ngaku jadi penjajah?? gajelas 🗿
The Cold War, can you please make a video on the history of Thailand during the Cold War. Please accept my request.
That would be great ngl
Coup, coup, more coup, Student Activism which lead to a massacre which led to another coup, Communism Scare, probably a lot more but would be an exciting episode
@@sisophon1982 forgot coup that arrests over insults
Maybe I understand what Indonesian think. What they want is freedom. Free from their oppressors. But it's still there. Theirs enemies still there. In the land they think belong to them.
And they think anyone who support their enemies. Is their enemy too. Then story of oppressed become oppressor begin once again.
You don't get freedom taking it from others after all.
@@Game_Hero Indonesia doesn't want a Dutch-controlled country right at its doorstep, especially when the Dutch at the time still can't let go of the colonial mindset. It is logical for Indonesia to integrate West Papua at any cost, albeit it's brutal.
@@lil_jong-un6668 Dutch controlled? Kim-Jong, the Dutch are a shell of their former empire, they barely can keep their Carribean conquests chained to them, how on Earth are they going to get to the other side of the world for a piece of land that has no value to them, that they were incapable of holding at their former larger strength, and will join its Papuan neighbour anyway? Why not the Swedish while we're at it. Indonesia must let go of its colonial mindset. You don't fight colonialism with colonialism. At least you're honest enough to recognize it is brutal.
They were not as "stone age" as you ve represented. That is insult to refer them as such. They already had learned people there.
I havent see any of you guys mentioned "sumpah pemuda" (the oath/pledge of youth) in 1928.
The representatives the real people from papua have expressed themselves of the willing to be united as one free nation Indonesia with the rest of us, free from the dutch colonizer.
Why all of the so-called historian from the west have not ever mentioned that. That is a redflag there.
Not to mention, papua had been part of tidore kingdom before the arrival of the dutch.
Also really? Trtre, masscrs, public exection of pregnant women, and rpe??
You dont even mention any eyewitness/evidence there.
What a bad story telling.
However it did happen in jawa island. During the dutch military invasion.
We have so many veterans eyewitness how the dutch soldiers have done the warcrimes.
Many Sugoro Atmoprasojo rebellions there, as Benarda Merteray writes there are three major Papuan rebellions to join Indonesia, during the period of 1945 to 1949. Many think they would join State of East Indonesia. No Komite Indonesi Merdeka, No PKII, basically no prespective of Indonesia or Papuan. At this time in western 'historian'.
Nice video
Papua in Indonesian hands is richer than Papua New Guinea and Vanuatu
Are they or just javenese
@@aldimrmr4108lu pikir jawir pada kaya?
@@aldimrmr4108 Just the Indonesians not the Papuans.
Same New Guinea Island. No difference. Only terrorist Indonesian Government sees differences.
Pretty sad they did not cover local Indonesian movement in New Guinea. Why just mention 'from Biak', Frans Kaisiepo is pretty influential member from there. Silas Papare from the neighboring Serui also prominent. Theres a reason at this time the islanders were pretty educated well travelled and have education connection with rest of Indonesian islands. He is present in Malino Conference before Denpasar Conference. Papuan delegates also protested no delegations in Denpasar. Nicolaas Jouwe, Marthen Indey, and Corinus Krey wanted to join State of East Indonesia. Nicolaas Jouwe himself is pretty influential from being part of pro Indonesian group, to Netherlanda and independence, before back again to Indonesia in 2010.
No Soegoro Atmoprasojo, No Singgirei Rumagesan, No Abraham Dimara, No Silas Papare and PKII, No Marthen Indey and Komite Indonesia Merdeka.
Ie: basically no Indonesian (and local 'West' Papuan) prespective at all.
Because most of the local Indonesian movement in Papua was miniscule or made up of puppets that were paid by Indonesia. The overwhelming majority of Papuans wanted independence. There were also pro-Dutch Indonesians that weren't covered either.
@@jokerofmorocco Papuan rebels are miniscule, minority of Papuans, minority of inhabitants. They are just puppets that were paid by foreigners (NGO and the likes), obsessed with racial superiority. The overwhelming majority of papuans just wanted peace have better lives and tired of the constant fighting.
@@jokerofmorocco source: trust me bro
All those movements took place in the independence war when Indonesia had virtually no money at all, the fact that you say they are paid actors is laughable. Fact is that pro Indonesia sentiments existed within Papuans and was enough to even wage small scale skirmishes against the Dutch as part of a broader Indonesian rebellion against them, but yea keep being in denial about it I guess.
@@jokerofmoroccolmao this guy
@@jokerofmorocco"paid actor" does this guy talk about himself?
Wow, thats trully brutal act by our Indonesia Government back then. Sometimes we Indonesians also think like our colonial brethren, where we always thought that we save Irians or Papuan from Dutch. But probably they are just fine when we left them just like thousand years before. Just because they didnt yet accept what we call as standard of better wellbeing, that didnt mean they cant handle it themselves because its already proven by time that they able to survive in that condition since probably thousand of years ago. Yet, as Indonesian, we are still considered papua as part of Indonesia, we hope our recent treatment since 98 reform towards Papua will make them better as time goes by, its not easy to win Papuans heart after all atrocities weve done during military operation of Trikora and during New Order. But we still considered papuan as our brother in Nation, so we hope we can unite under one banner although we all have different skin colour, language and culture . Peace from Bali...
Indonesia acted like the Soviet Union, not only in Irian but also in Portugese Timor with concentration camps, torture and mass murder. There has to be something in the culture of the Indonesian people for it to get repeated multiple times, exactly like the Russians, from the 9 million killed in the Civil war, through the Holodomor, the Purges, to today's invasion of Ukraine. The people of the 2 countries willingly supported and actively participated in the crimes.
A smart and insightful comment! I guess to many Papuans they were first oppressed by The Hague and now by Jakarta
@@semkoops Sort of. Holland did not engage in Soviet style mass murder. Their oppression had a lighter touch.
I appreciate you're willing to acknowledge this it isn't easy to hear ones nations mistake the world needs people like you. It is always important to see with the eyes of the people rather than nationalistic lenses and be open to Papuas piloting their own course.
@@titisuteu Why did the Dutch invest in the development of the Papuan before? They could have worked with the Australian and unified West Papua with Eastern Papua.
Little known fact, there was no mass arrest before the PEPERA 1969 as very few Indonesian soldier was garrisoned there (due to internal conflict during 1965-1966), but there were struggle between Indonesia and Holland, where Holland try to buy the people of Papua by giving the gifts like alcohol, food, clothes etc. So that the Papuans rather chose Holland than Indonesia. And the Mcroran Freeport was given the go to exploit Papua after America installed a pro-American dictator (Suharto, 1966-1998). And oppression started from there where America and Australia heavily support Indonesia even at the Invasion of East Timor. OV-10 Bronco, Skyhawks, LSTs and many more west hardware were pouring to Indonesia and the part where they shoot the Papuan is I think in the late 70s to eraly 80s where there was an attack at the Freeport mine killing some workers and the ABRI reacted harshly deploying the OV-10 to drop napalm to nearby areas and suspected camping area
Nice Dutch prononciation, not bad at all!!
"Boven Digoel" anyways, "Hubertus van Mook" was a bit less, "oo" is pronounced "o" as in "go".
IRIAN (Ikut Republik Indonesia Anti Netherlands) Join the Republic of Indonesia Anti Netherlands
Just because we are racially and culturally different doesn't mean that we can't be together.
Agreed, brother.
"racially different", just what is that supposed to mean? And where does it leave Papua New Guinea and the colonial-imposed island splitting straight line in all this?
But they don't want to be together, there's a Papua guerilla movement
@@Game_Hero muncul lagi si intel asing 😂😂😂
@@gangbelakang49 Yes, I'm from the Illuminati and I do evil comments as part of a conspiracy to change the world order with logical consistancy, muhahaha!
This shows the true face of democratic governments all around the world as an Indian. In Odissa and seven sister states, we have similar situations where natives are suppressed and exploited by the government by labeling them, terrorists and militants. Similarly, we can look at the US as well here native populations were exterminated oppressed and their lands seized all the while the US itself went around the world promoting freedom, liberty, and equality.
Yes Modi tolerated massacre of minorities in Manipur and Gujerat😢
As a dutch person there's a beautiful irony in freeing a country and it immediately saying "we can do worst".
on the up side. relationship between indo's and Nederland are pretty good. we weren't "that bad" i guess haha.
As an Indonesian, I guess we're close now for a reason. Lol~
(It's a joke, in case there's any snowflake reading this)
Actually, you’re the actual worst hahaha
Yeah, some of my reaaaly distant relatives migrated to Dutch, either as a free workforce, and later on some moved during the polizing act done by the dutch colonial effort.
But still, that is 4-5 generations ago. I really like how we as a nation can establish quite a friendly relation with our former colonizer, such as japan and dutch. I hope this would continue on in the far future...😊
@@muhammadriskyramadhan1725 hope so too, way more constructive
you stole our height
do have to admire the audacity of encircling the New Guinean elders with mounted arms and telling them to put their hands up, then taking a picture and presenting it as the "Act of Free Choice"
From political point of view the if we lose Papua we might lose the "unity in diversity" thus weakening our foundation. That's why no president want to lose it
Dutch as well as Brits like many other colonialists tried their asses-out to hold their colonies as long as they can. Indonesians limited in resources and friends almost joined the global communist bloc just to drive the colonialists out as stated in Indonesia’s constitution. Until this present day Indonesians still value Russia as friend no matter what. These things fails to be presented in this western perspective lack truth vlog.
The USSR backed Indonesia for ideological reasons / own interests. That 'friendship' ended rather abruptly in the 60s for obvious reasons. The present regime of Russia has no particular love for Indonesia, but of course happy to get any support it can get from anyone anywhere blinkered by anti western sentiment.
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Dutch prepared Papua for independence but were sabotaged by Sukarno and USA. West Papua should be free like PNG. If it wasn't for US Freeport arrangements wt Jakarta they would have been free now.
free Aborigin in Australia
What you said about Indonesian troops treachery may right, but you may check that what rebel group did nowadays. Killing some innocence like doctors and make people human shield. They're not saints thou. I do some business on transporting some goods including to the Papua, they shot my goods anw
14:21 Is this the same as the New York agreement? I don't see it being called the Bunker Plan in other sources.
Ikr
It showed whose sources he used....its called bunker from Ellsworth Bunker....Dutch didn't like it and blame American (Bunker).
I feel so sorry for Papuans. I call the western half of the island, Indonesian New Guinea, because people can't tell Indonesia is oppressing Papuans otherwise.
I call it the Republic of West-Papua
@@dutchskyrimgamer.youtube2748It's not a republic, but maybe it will be one day. Your people wanted to give Dutch New Guinea its freedom, but Indonesia with help from the U.S. sadly conquered it.
@@royhay5741 the organization West Papua Merdeka has declared it to be independent and is officially calling itself the Federal Republic of West-Papua (FRWP) and is participating in the organization for unrepresented peoples
@@dutchskyrimgamer.youtube2748 illegitimate republic
*Freeport sulphur at first, then freeport mcmoran, then after transfer of half ownership to indonesian and papuan government it becomes freeport indonesia
it is obvious that you are positioning yourself as a pro-western historian.....you are very detailed in explaining the massacre of the Papuan people by the Indonesian army...although the truth needs to be proven.....but you have not at all explained the story of how the soldiers the Dutch killed hundreds of thousands of civilians during the Indonesian war of independence....I am concerned about your way of thinking.....maybe because your lessons in western schools.....did not teach about the cruelty of your nation's colonialism against Asian peoples..
As an Indonesian, I approve this video.
Wait till there'll be a sequel for this video about the invasion of East Timor in 1975 and you'll be shame for it. 😅
@@wazzup233 hey man most of us know our country are not so innocent
@@wazzup233 why would we be shamed from it? we already acknowledged it, learn from it & move on, we don't have white man guilt mentality, we accepted history as it is while also tried not repeat the worst of it in the near future
@Garren well it's not wrong tho, basically it's just different perspective with the same result, the problems is when the Western hemisphere tried to judge us meanwhile they done much much worst than Indonesia ever been in the last 4 centuries, we refuse those criticism because they just want to feel superior than us
jeez Indonesia was brutal during the cold war
Welp fun fact most atrocities here are being led by our soon to be dictator soeharto. The attack, the referendum, and the oppression was done mostly by him alone.
Thanks white boy
Speak for yourself, Yanqui
Thanks to MI6 and CIA
Lol who wasn't brutal?
We peoples of west Papua not part of colonial Indonesia.
Stop buying our products then 😊
@@MGharriyagree
@@MGharriy don't sell it in papua, simple😊
@@aldimrmr4108 oh, then how do they survive then?? I doubt countries outside Indonesia would aid them 🤭
Thank you for this episode! Papua is a fascinating place from what little I know about the island. I would very much like to learn more about it. Does anybody have any good videos or books to recommend on the topic?
God be with you out there everybody! ✝️ :)
ua-cam.com/video/Acz8JxYMB8k/v-deo.html
after joining Indonesia, the name of the island was changed from NEW GUINEA to become IRIAN
IRIAN is an abbreviation, in Indonesian language IRIAN means:
I = Ikut (Follow)
R = Republic
I = Indonesia
A = Anti
N = Netherlands
And "Jaya" in Irian Jaya means victory
nah bro, that's just "cocoklogi" the word IRIAN already there. The origin was from Biak language that means hot.
bullshit
Dutch backed Free West Papua mentioned but Pro Indonesia movement is not, same as what they did to natives. The Dutch played their naratives well to make Indonesia sounds like just snatched it.
Kinda obvious too he didnt mentioned Frans Kaisiepo he just mentioned a guy from Biak. What about the secret deal of JFK, Nicolaas Jouwe, and Sukarno?
When Māori attain equal political power to settlers in NZ we will officially support the reunification and self determination of west and east Papua along with their protectorates Serui and Biak. Papua merdeka!
Maori and the European settlers are proudly calling themselves New Zeelanders and Pacific Islanders or Polynesians ,so stop your fucked up instigating disunity in Civilized Societies.
Such great information. I'm subscribed!
The ARP is called a 'far-right' party, which is not the right term to be used. It was a christian-democratic party, though led by protestants the most conservative of influential Christian party's in Dutch politics, of which there were multiple. Especially with the modern interpretation of far-right, I just do not think it is fitting to be used in a video describing cold-war politics. The Dutch have never once had a far-right government, and such party's did not excist or held little to no sway in Dutch politics of the decolonisation-period. Dutch governments were consistently made up of either christian-democrats or social-democrats in coalition with the liberal party. This would be the case until the rise of Pim Fortuyn in Dutch politics after the 9/11 attacks. Even when looking at opposition-party's from before 2000 there is almost no right-wing, only the Centrum Partij could be considered as modern right and that would be long after the independence of both Indonesia and West-Papua.
Banyak intel asing dan manusia asing yang merasa paling tahu situasi dan kondisi Bangsa Indonesia. Terlihat komen asing
mangkanya belajar bahasa inggris
Freeport mines
West Papua and its natives are as close as it gets to Avatar's Planet Pandora and its Navii tribe 😂
Indonesia: Hey America why dont you back my illegal invasion of your allies territory and ill allow you to set up monopolies and enslave and or deport the natives?
USA: Yes my dude!
Netherlands was once again bullied by the USA to compromise with Indonesians lmao
😂😂😂😂
@1:10 emperor tigerstar lol
Semua narasinya kebanyakan berlebihan ya sebab ini versi barat😂
I had no idea before that Indonesia colonized other lands. I learned something new.
All on the skin of the Papuans.
Just recently, a New Zealand pilot was taken hostage by Separatist Fighters in Papua New guinea.
*independentist
Taken at West Papua, not PNG. PNG is another sovereign country.
@@Game_Hero are you seriously saying that? Bro, you're just a buzzer. U really dont believe all the bullshit the white people says right?😂 we all know white people are hypocrites
*terrorist
And the separatist killing some woman who's stand in the wrong place at the wrong time and left their corpse laying on the side of a road to lure police officer.
When the police come to secure the corpse, the rebels that hide behind bushes then shooting at the police, killing one
The rebels act causing alot of anger because it is unethical. Killing their own intentionaly to lure police
Cover more events from the Indian Subcontinent please
Bvfagmin quota people brutalities.
an act of free choice has taken place in accordance with Indonesian practice
yeah, vote yes or get shot, lol.
I don't know why the Netherlands put so much importance on New Guinea? If I remember right, there's no oil fields, no precious medals, etc there.
preserving the empire
@@arima272 yea, I guess that's it!
@@McIntyreBible i am pretty sure they already explained it
@@arima272 did they? Where? Show me where!
around 3:35
This vids sum things happened to West Papua and the impact it gives us today, Nice.......
Dutch rules in Papua will hurt the soo called Decolonialization campaign push By US for further Opening global market.
Decolonialization act is based on the conclusion from both World Wars, Colonialization will eventually make developed countries struggle for hegemony. (Even so there are countries that still make a leeway of it by creating puppets and effort of neo-colonialism)
We all know what happened to African Countries after the Decolonization right, so are the West Papuan if leave by themselves. There was no right or wrong method but the least Indonesian Government can do is slowly to integrate people of Papua into one (like everybody else). Indonesia on it terms it self is a nation of different race and cultures united in one single banner, its simply just a bunch of Human tryin to live their live peacefully, so Papua was no different.
IF some of you think they (papuans) are different, then my question is from what perspective that made them different ? They are Human too.....
Excellent video 📹
A wonderful & truthful coverage
No terrible no papuan mentioned at all, they were not just passive actors but part of indonesian independence movements there were many groups. He just mentioned 'from Biak' which is almost certainly Frans Kaisiepo. Even during the later period there were other groups too trying to link with Indonesian troops. Who do you think supported Indonesian troops in the jungle.
@@abcddef2112stop lying and declare west papua freedom
@@user-yo9jo2fy5e They're already been freed in 1963, from the Europeans
@@nylon1458 it just change from europeans to Indonesian. Funny right? I remember when their first president asked my country (USSR) to help them take papua but end up taken over by USA and Indonesian
@@user-yo9jo2fy5e the USSR supported Indonesia on their claim of papua
Another forgotten war....... 😶
Papua actually is part of Indonesia since kingdom era before Dutch arrived in there.
Its was clear that you are pro western historian
Maybe next time make video about US war crimes in vietnam
i think you read too much netherland and australian sources
Long time ago is Nederland New Guinea then now is West Papua star from city sorong until merauke.
Sounds great ,Sorong to Merauke ,North to South Papua my favored People may God Bless you and protect you !
west media never blow up this problem seriously, indonesia brutal action in the past backed by western goverment, but its just past time story, now papuan get better education, better opportunity to build their region
great thata true
To this day many Dutch people yearn to live in the Dutch East Indies and West Papua (Indonesia), but Indonesians have completely forgotten the dutch colonialists, because if we remember the colonial period it will be very painful for most Indonesian people.
But the Dutch people miss the Dutch East Indies so much because they live here very easily like in heaven, they white dutch are treated like a king here, they occupy the top caste became landlords of hundreds of hectares as well as owners of vast farms with very cheaply paid workers also had many slaves and concubines.
The problem of Papua is very classic, Indonesia also got Papua from the help of the American west, Soekarno and Suharto had strong reasons why Papua had to be annexed because of the domino effect of the remnants of the second world war and the cold war, meanwhile the nature of Papua which has been exploited by Indonesia is just a bonus. Moreover, it is not only Indonesia that has enjoyed it, but also other western capitalist countries, especially America.
Today Indonesia wants to improve itself and apologize to the people of Papua by building many facilities and special autonomy even though many Papuans want to ask for more, independence namely the new country.
But there is no single country in the world that voluntarily releases and freedom some area to become a new country that has been integrated with it, this also happens to Indonesia and its Papua because Indonesia without Papua is not Indonesia, besides Indonesia has learned from its stupidity to release Timor Leste voluntarily due to western coercion and the end result is that an independent Timor Leste is far behind the regions in Indonesia for example with a small town in East Nusa Tenggara which is next door to Timor Leste itself even after Timor Leste became independent they always asked for help from Indonesia and this was very funny, the west was only good at provoking the people of Timor Leste to let them go but when they became independent they didn't care about Timor Leste.
Not once in my life have I heard of a Dutch person who wants to live in Indonesia.
@@ikWillem-Alexander Not in Indonesia now but in Dutch East Indiest or Indonesia in the past or Nusantara, you will easily find pages on social media many Dutch people nowadays have not been able to move on from the past and still talk about many things and their beautiful memories about the Dutch East Indies or Hindia Belanda, this is different from all Indonesians even though the Dutch colonized Indonesia for a very long time, around 350 years buy however there are currently NO significant traces of Dutch flavors in Indonesia besides the culture of corruption, Dutch colonialism was very painful as was Japanese colonialism for Indonesians.
Spanish and Portuguese colonization gave birth to beautiful Latin culture in the Philippines.
British colonialism gave birth to modern culture in Singapore and Malaysia.
But the Dutch colonialism in Indonesia did not produce anything positive except for the corrupt culture inherited from the colonialists.
@@ikWillem-Alexander Obviously, before they got expelled out of Indonesia. Imagine thinking our archipelagic land belongs to them. Nice thing that is for they got expelled.
@@ikWillem-Alexander yea because today's Indonesia is not the Dutch colony it was before and the average Dutch person here will be treated like a normal "bule" foreigner not like kings.
Not a single Dutch person nowadays wants to live in Indonesia.
Even if it was still the East Indies.
The fact is that we really don't care about Indonesia anymore. Haven't done so for almost 70 years.
This kind of history never taught in our schools. We only know that a plebiscite happened, and the people chose to be part of Indonesia. I heard that even Hatta didn't strongly support West Papua integration, though he didn't oppose it outright either.
He may thought about the image it will have to Indonesia, and it happened as many ignorant Western nation view Indonesia as a tyrant because of "occupying" Papua
We know he doesnt want it fron BPUPKI is because Japanese troops did not occupy the whole area of Papua only parts.
Indonesia is basically successor of The Dutch East Indies, with the Javanese people as the 'Majority'
1st time to hear someone relate what happened ini papua was white man burden.
Because it is the Dutch were pretty much this, source: Nicolaas Jouwe's book
Please note this.. All the Dutch occupations in Asia belong to Indonesia that's the basis of the country Indonesia formed.
"Free choice" in Indonesian practice seem to have very different meaning than in the rest of the world.
@@epg96 Its the brown mans burden to civilize those backwards papuans
As Indonesian, it is true 😅
Australia and New Zealand will love this
And Papua New Guinea
Me as indonesian myself never being taught about our military treatment during the era,only knew it after this, but Australia and New Zealand are way worst than what we have done in the past, while papua still consist of native of papua mostly, sadly their brother, the native aborigins, only left a few... So for Aussies and Kiwis, better look at your history before start to teach us, Indonesians, about human right.
@@Game_Hero papua new guinean sadly didnt fare better. In the border, they mostly get daily needs from their Indonesian side of papua. Their infrastructure are not as spread as in the indonesian side. I got this story from my co worker that assigned in Papua before.
@@bpcgos they’ll never learn from their own dark and bloody history. that's too hard for them, the white-ass monkeys in Oceania, North America and Europe.
@@bpcgos Brother don’t compare don’t compare West Papua and Australia at the end of the day bad is bad, 500,000 Papuans still got murdered by Indonesian army. The facts is, it ended in Australia but it still happening in Papuas highlands. oppression is always rife in Wamena Papuans always being killed😢.
Papua New Guinea people looks like aeta in the philippines.
Basically,
"indonesia ends in waters between Bali and Java what say you?"
"agreed"
"Good, we're making progress-"
"No, wait"
Papua akan selalu bersama republik Indonesia kami sudah merdeka sejak lama Jayapura ❤ Indonesia
Terima kasih saudaraku
Dari bekasi♥️
Study the history of kingdoms in Indonesia, uncle, before you make a podcast
bruh, u guys just sucking their resources atm
@@rave.201 ofc any country suck resources for development of their people. The result papuan in Indonesia have better standard of living than across the border.
@@abcddef2112 meh, coping so much
@@abcddef2112 then why the keep rebelling against the government? don't be naive
@@rave.201 Some stopped in west papua, (im talking about rebels from just after this video time period, not modern ones after Suharto), they actually formed kodam kasuari members (indonesia military district of west papua) after pepera. Since old opm forces is called cassowary batallion from PVK. The last governor of west papua was descendant of these early group leaderships.
As a result now West Papua is generally more safer and developed than Papua. Nowadays rebels are most active clustered in Central Highlands. Which is in Central and Highland Papua.
These rebels are new groups formed after suharto collapse which activate many rebel groups such as in Aceh east timor and Papua. They are more rooted in highland culture of war. One warband groups is in practice rival with anothers, taking over rich valuable lands such as freeport tailing areas for gold etc, such as Sabinus Waker groups.
Even in the past they are split to Pemka and Marvic factions. Nowadays these splits still exists, but with TRWP under damianus magai yogi and TPNPB-OPM under Goliath Tabuni (he is rumored to be retired as pig farmers sometimes mentioned surredered to indo gov) more active was Lekagak Telenggen his 'deputy'. TRWP and TPNPB are accusing each other of being Indonesian false flag ops.
the 2nd Shell vs Standard oil war the rest is bs
Pasti Indonesia siapkan TU 16 ,,bisa nenggunjangkan as,,juga Inggris ..KLO kerajaan Belanda cukup itung jam bom nuklir tu 16 ,,juga kapal perang KRI,kapal selam kelas Cakra bisa meleburkan markas besar pelabuhan d Sorong dan biak!..
Imperialisme d Papua d hapuskan ...fakta sejarah
your statement without a clear basis, I, as a native citizen of INDONESIA, really love the land of Papua because during the time of the MAJAPAHIT kingdom, Papua was already its territory.
Majapahit thereby was to find black salves not to control the land.
Majapahit wasn't even a territorial empire, it's empire was hardly any more than a sphere of influence
@@Threezi04 thats how asian empire is, dont judge us with european empiricism, we dont colonize out of sense of pride but sense practically and communal.
I love how people can just easily use the Majapahit card to justify territorial limits 😂😂😂...
@Garren who said that it wasn’t conquest, only u that said i want to be a good guy…but Majapahit conquests adheres to custom that not in line with European’s definition of empire. If i want to be “good guys” i would licking Western definitions of humanity to the boots,…so easy for you to vilified people opinions.
At 4:47 you critically claim that the Dutch used the “white man’s burden” narrative when they claimed that the Papuans needed a period of Dutch guidance before they would be ready to exercise self determination.
Then you end the video and prove how the Papuans were incapable of exercising their self determination and suffered numerous abuses and massacres from the Indonesians as a result.
That's absolutely not what they said, did you really just say it was the victims fault for being massacred and abused by Indonesia, what the heck is wrong with you?
@@Game_Hero Did I say it was their fault? No I didn’t and you know clearly well I didn’t. You’re just trying to be manipulative. I said they were incapable (which translates to “did not have the ability”) to exercise their self determination. I’m not sure if you know this, but a country with little education, low economic development, and a weak military isn’t very good at defending its sovereignty.
@@reddixiecrat And? Does this justify keeping sovereignty from others? Justify a golden cage?
@@Game_Hero It appears to be in line with the Dutch Ethical Policy. Knowing what I know, if I was a Papuan, that’s exactly what I would have wanted the Dutch to do.
@@reddixiecrat but you're not. And most likely, you can't really imagine being one.
for a newly independent country, Indonesia was very powerful and powerful. took Papua from the Netherlands England, America. Because they are allies and Indonesia is fighting with diplomacy and military. It is not easy to take Papua because it is against these 3 countries
But now your soldiers still struggle to fight with papua🤣
Suharto made concessions to USA company Freeport, after USA helped Suharto to coup Soekarno
Not USA as a whole as JFK, Sukarno, and Nicolaas Jouwe were involved in secret negotiations and planned ti be announced in 1964. This is from Nicolaas Jouwe's book, "Kembali ke Indonesia".
Though many other motives, such as PKI, Konfrontasi and Freeport, JFK was killed, Sukarno was couped. Greg Poulgrain in his book "JFK Vs. Allen Dulles: Battleground Indonesia" said its CIA.