DENMARK'S TROUBLED HIGHSPEED TRAINS / DSB IC4 DMU REVIEW / DANISH TRAIN TRIP REPORT
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- Опубліковано 21 жов 2021
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Hello and welcome to my first Danish train trip report!
Today we will be travelling with Denmark's national operator, DSB, aboard one of their long-delayed and problematic IC4 DMUs. It's just an hour long trip from Hvalsø into Copenhagen city centre on this Intercity turned regional set, enjoy the ride!
*PLEASE NOTE* At the time of filming all travel was permitted and has been carried out in full compliance with the local restrictions.
Date of Filming: 27/9/21
Camera: GoPro Hero 7 Black
Operator: DSB
Departure: Hvalsø, Denmark
Arrival: Copenhagen, Denmark
Cost: 100DKK (£11.40, €13.44) Adult, Single
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Nice to see a review from my neck of the woods. But yeah the IC4 trains are a huge national scandal here. I mean you already mentioned a lot of its trouble but there's even more than that! Like how its little brother, the 2 car long IC2 was only in service for 3 years and now has several units rusting away on sidings throughout Western Denmark, waiting for a buyer. Or how one unit suddenly disappeared while down in Italy for modifications, only to be found over a year later in Libya under the ownership of Gadaffi! Pure insanity. We would've retired them already if it wasn't for the fact we have nothing to replace them with. We prematurely retired our old 70's commuter coaches and scrapped them, and sold a massive portion of the old 70's Intercity coach and regional coach fleet to Iran in the late 90's ahead of this train order!
But yeah.
The first class is not at all different from 2nd class and the same will be true on the new Coradia Streams DSB are ordering. DSB focuses a ton on flexibility and their First class product is almost entirely a soft product like on the airlines.
The big area by that weird door on the low floor coach seems to have been intended as like a Kiosk section, but it's never been used. In fact catering on DSB services nowadays is non existant apart from a trial with a Dutch style guy walking through some Lyntog services with a coffee backpack and a tray of snacks. You have no guarantee that it'll show up though and if not then I hope you got some snacks before boarding because your only other choice for the 4 hour trip is maybe a bottled water machine if you're lucky.
And yeah DSB's trains are super dirty but they also have a rolling stock shortage combined with a shoe string budget. They can't afford to take them out of service to do any kind of regular cleaning even if they wanted to.
Also I hope you enjoy Hvalsø station because this is more or less the standard for new DSB stations or station rennovations. Even stations that previously had stuff like platform canopies, indoor waiting rooms, and kiosks, like in Vordingborg sadly. Though again that's BaneDanmark's department. They only care about stuff like finances and how vandal proof their infrastructure is.
And heck even on this section of railway there has been issues lately. The other day there was a whole issue of a group of teenagers being stopped onboard the train by a ticket inspector, not having a ticket and then using an emergency hammer to break one of the windows and hurry out in Lejre. We have way too much S H I T to deal with.
Very interesting, thank you! 🙏🏻
Some of your 2 unit DMU-s are now in Romania. They are used by Astra Trans Carpatic Company. They were repainted in a green-yellow scheme.
@@robertstaicu206 Yup. So far the only buyers of these disaster machines
During that debacle, NS (Dutch railways) was like, yeah we must totally buy HS trains from the same manufacturer. And after THAT debacle, the UK was like: wow totally awesome we should also get our HS trains from there!
@@drdewott9154 and probably the last :)
According to Wikipedia, the transmission in this trains is mechanical, so they have an actual gearbox like a truck. That probably explains the peculiar sound when accelerating.
Mechanical transmission on a train seems pretty stupid. Are there any advantages opposed to diesel-electric trains?
@@alfredsaalo1441 I don’t think so, other than -maybe- fuel consumption. Usually, in Spain, DMUs use hydraulic transmissions. We had some mechanical transmission DMUs of Italian origin in the past, but they never provided good reliability. The last ones survive as single car trains but are soon to be retired.
It's continuous though! 🤷🏻♂️
@@NonstopEurotrip Because it’s probably a modern automatic gearbox, likely to be derived from (or the same as) Iveco uses on their trucks nowadays. By the sound of it, I counted at least 8 gears if I’m not wrong. It wouldn’t make sense having the driver to go through so many gears on a train.
@@alfredsaalo1441 I mean the IC3's, the workhorse of DSB's fleet is also made with a mechanical transmission. In fact most of its motor equipment is standardised from the truck industry. One of the big things they touted in the 80's was that this design choice would allow for the motors to be replaced over time with more and more environmentally friendly ones with relative ease.
Another oddity in Danmark now is that many intermediate stations across the country there is no access to wait inside . Wonderful well maintained station buildings but you have to wait in a bus shelter , rain , sleet and shine all seasons . On pictures it still looks good but not in reality .
Yeah that is strange! 🤷🏻♂️
Beautiful video!
As an Italian is sad knowing that a train built in my country, encountered so many technical problems.
Is a shame seeing a once to be flagship relegated to a regional service.
Although considering it's history of technical problems, and the constant noise of the train (that could be annoying in a long travel), I understand the choice
It's a shame, it could have been a great train! 😭
If it's any consolation, all the trains on the Copenhagen Metro are also Italian, and as far as I know they're pretty reliable.
@@papaquonis now that I think of that, I saw those in a video, and in fact they appeared to me pretty similar to the train used in the Metro of the Italian city of Brescia 🤔.
I guess I was right: probably they are the same model, or at least the base model is the same for the two trains
I prefer the old Danish IC3 Trains ("rubber noses") with their more spacious seats. Those are the most comfortable trains I ever rode anyway. But apparently even the Danish IC4 is clearly more spacious than a German IC or ICE 4.
Totally agree. I went on an IC3 from Copenhagen to Hamburg last year and it was great, no performance issues either.
Video coming up soon 👍🏻😁
The seats in IC4 are more comfortable than IC3, imo. I don't need a big seat but a less firm one which I think IC4 offers. I actually almost prefer Arrivas' over IC3's for some reason, so I might be bias somehow.
Both are great trains, but the lack of quality control on the IC4 sadly meant that the racket (noise) can be very bad.
I always use noise canceling headphones when travelling, but the difference is still very noticeable.
IC3 can also make some unwanted noise, but that is more acceptable, imo, due to their age.
@@fastertove What! The seats in the IC4 are crap. Took a trip from Aalborg to Aarhus and my back was hurting. Heard that from others too. The IC3 seats are some of the most comfy seats in Europe except mayby the higher class seats (the actual class product name escapes me) on Italian High speed trains.
@@martinjuulandersen9694 Then we don't agree.
Cant speak for rest of Europe, but since I don't own a car I do use domestic trains periodically - and I have always found IC3 seats to be lacking in comfort.
When travelling between Aalborg-Struer I always prefer the combination of X-bus/Arriva over DSB(IC3)/Arriva. Not alone is the travel faster, but also more comfortable - This is even taking less legroom and the extra noise into account.
- Annoyingly people still smoke on platforms and bring the smell inside the trains and busses - being allergic sucks - but that is another issue... :)
6:10 Should mention that those are Danish sockets. They work with both ungrounded and grounded European plugs but only provide an ungrounded connection with them. No problem, really, as most laptop chargers are ungrounded these days anyway.
Thank you 🙏🏻
They look very happy.
In my country (Singapore) mosf of our sockets are UK-style, except for some higher-power applications (my old house's washing machine socket was European (continental) style (grounded) supposedly as it was at 15A instead of 13A as with most sockets here). Many appliances sold here use European (continental) style ungrounded plugs instead though, which require an adapter although the plugs' pins are physically smaller than the sockets' holes, as inside the holes there's a flap that blocks the pins unless the earth pin is plugged into too
Love these regional trains... keep them coming. Thanks!
Oh I will, dont worry! 🙏🏻
funnily enough, AnsaldoBreda made the Fyra V250, some HSR trainsets that were destined to Netherlands, but were retired just one month after their launch in service, because of serious problems.
and Trenitalia some years ago bought them and uses them as Frecciargento (High speed train at 250km/h, one tier below Frecciarossa).
Yeah, but HITACHI Rail S.p.a. overhauled most of the V250 "Fyra" trainsets to be actually reliable according to Trenitalia requirements. About 2-3 trainsets will never run again, kept in storage for spare parts...
I've filmed a video on those too 😁👍🏻
Great video as always and enjoyed watching today's trip report and it's disappointing to see such a great train being used as a regional train, nevertheless, it's a win-win for regional commuters. And 3:33 yes, that pleasing sound 😍and I too think that, train is struggling to gain speed after hearing that sound.
Thank you Rahill! It really is sad they couldn't use them for the intended purpose, even though they had their problems 🤷🏻♂️
Another great video !!
Cheers 🥂
The train looks nice and comfy, but the engine noises are quite annoying. It sounds like the train is in a constant wheel slip, especially when departing. I consider the IC3 as Denmark's true flagship, even though they're quite aged.
Very true, yes! 😎
...and the racket (noise) from some of the internal panels. Quality control on IC4 was really poor.
IC3 is a workhorse indeed - and still a looker after all these years.
It sounds a little bit like the German class 612
Correct and IC3 has the German PZB LZB Sifa installed because it needs to operate Copenhagen Padborg Hamburg route
Very good!
Thank you 😌
First Danish train trip for me. Thanks for taking us.
You're welcome Lynne! 👍🏻
Great video! I didn't know these units before I watch your video, they looks amazing. I only remember Deutsche Bahn's ICE-TD operated between Hamburg and Copenhagen. Btw. the sound is very similar to the sound on the bus :-D
They are equipped with IVECO engines and ZF transmissions.
@@routes4you Nice, so that's why the sound is familiar to me :-)
Glad to show you something new Pete 😜☺️
Very enjoyable video!
Thank you 🙏🏻
Nice coverage. From the small town, nice calm station and super train entering platform. Your video is nice and enjoyed it. You took care to cover entire interiors. Seems you are a lone passenger. Deserted train. Suitable during covid. By the way you have artistic figures. Keep going. Looking fw to ur next video.
Check out my 100+ other videos 😊
I enjoyed video and commentary.
Thank you ☺️
The IC4 trains (class MG) are nice and comfortable inside, but terribly noisy in some spots, especially towards the end of each unit. I always try to sit as close as possible to the middle.
Meanwhile, the older IC3 trains (class MF) are much quieter, have even better comfort, a smoother ride, and are way more reliable - they also have fancy walk-through gangways similar to those on the later Øresundstog (class ET, or X31K in Sweden). The IC3 trains have no accessible entry, though, but they remain extremely popular due to their comfort. As an interesting note, the IC3's also exist in an electric version known as IR4 (class ER) - and they're able to work in coupled sets with both diesel units and electrical units working together. The IR4's were intended for regional service, though, so they have worse seats - even though they're being operated on intercity routes alongside the IC3.
Very interesting, thanks! 🙂
IC3 is a far better train with proper 2+1 seating in First Class and goes very well generally. The Fyra units were replaced by hauled stock top and tailed by Bombardier Traxx locos (Class 186). Roskilde is a former Capital of Denmark. Nice video.
Video coming up soon ☺️
nice to see another country, cheers. I only went to the airport in Copenhagen then caught a bus to the ferry terminal to catch the Hydroplane to Malmo, and then the reverse. I found Denmark to be exceptionally clean.
You're welcome 😁 Ooh I'd love to do a hydroplane! Sounds fun! Does it still run?
@@NonstopEurotrip The hydroplane ended 21 years ago when they opened the Øresund bridge. The boats couldn't compete with the trains.
@@wasmic5z And it was a catamaran, but hydrofoils did run on the route in the 1970s and early 1980s.
Awesome 😎😎
Talking about the train situation in Denmark. The goverment tries to make us believe, that train travel in Denmark is green, but in fact the use very very old diesel locomotives. A train ride from Aarhus to Copenhagen airport is about 4 hours~ And you sit together with a wide of different people you don't know for about 4 hours, in a stinky and very dirty old machine. There are no chance to get something to eat or drink, while you are crawling your way through the Danish landscape. If I take the plane from Tirstrup with SAS on their newer ATR72-600, it burns about 320 kg. JET A1 fuel, from engine start to engine shutdown, and can carry up to 76 passengers, that's a about 4,2 Kg fuel per passenger or 3,3~ liter for 25 min flight, going 520-580 km/h in a almost brand new machine, while served coffee or water. I don't get the talk about green energy, when they don't tell the truth, I support it ofcourse and I think the new technologies are very cool and all. But people really need to think on there own, and start to ask question about the reality of how the things really works.
Yeah if 'green' train travel is the future, investment in fast electric lines is the only option...
They seem like a soulless 21st century interior you come to expect from multiple units today coupled with a 1950's diesel engine - all mechanical gearbox and noise.. They do look sleek and cool from the outside..
Yeah I agree Mark. A bit overkill for regional services but hey, that's where they fell!
May I suggest that You look up the DSB IC4. I found good information on Wikipedia.
Excellent 👍👍👍
Thanks 👍🏻
Thank you to you for this video, but an empty train, what a pity !!!
The front unit was actually very full! 😂
The train seems to be exclusive for Nonstop Eurotrip report ... thanks for the ride.
Well I did tell them I was coming 😉
Great video! The IC4 has a troubled past eventhough they are currently pretty reliable in service as is. They are not planned to be equipped with the new signalling system so there's a timelimit on them.
When making a video on the IC3, you will probably hear the praise on these trains. Don't forget that their birth and first years we're a scandal in itself. The trains were not running stable, the designers and producers of the train were cocky and didn't think a prototype was needed (Resulting in years and years of fixing problems and doing damagecontrol) and especially the electric version IR4 was a catastrophe. The trains were out of service for a long time beacuse their noise current were causing other electric trains nearby to fail. Now 30 years on the IC3 and IR4 are beloved trains but their history is much compared to the IC4, which people tend to forget.
Personally, I think the IC4 is a great and comfortable train and I've worked on them as trained staff as well.
I will definitely do my research, thank you 🙏🏻
Very nice Train💛
😁
i think the acceleration is quite good after a few seconds of movement the train really picks up speed!
Hmm debatable lol 😂
@@NonstopEurotrip not debatable, for a diesel, its quite good.
I remember living in Copenhagen and never having to buy a car. Trains and buses are actually cheap as heck and will get you anywhere in Denmark. This video mentions £11 from Hvalsø to KBH as expensive… same distance from Kent to Central London is £25. Denmark er et dejligt land!
Fair enough 😜
The IC4 sounds like Amtrak's ill-fated Acela Express which has had mega problems starting since Day 1...but the cool livery and sleek lines are eye candy for this old train lover.
Yeah. Although at least the Acela worked eventually
I kinda liked the diesel's thrum! When the train left Hvalso it sounded like it was changing gears!
I think it is 😂
Nice video, Another example of a disaster would be the Dutch Fyra Highspeed Train. They we're supposed to travel between brussels and amsterdam but the train had alot of problems. To this day its in service in Italy yet not all problems are fixed.
In Italy they don't have problems at the moment, they are regularly in service.
The AnsaldoBreda Fyra trains started losing body parts when there were just a few flakes of snow. Furthermore they often lost connection with the ERTMS system (European Rail Traffic Management System) and hence blocking off entire sections of track because they had to be towed away. Also the electric wiring of every train was different, as if designed on the spot by amateurs. That making it very hard for maintenance to keep up for a high frequency service … The AnsaldoBreda deal was a total cock-up and I’m sure the Danish will agree!
As ETR700s, they are MUCH better though!
The trainsets weren't even the main issue with that project: there are a lot of commuters, students and day tourists making use of the train between Amsterdam and Brussels. A train with expensive, inflexible tickets with mandatory reservation is not suitable for that. I am therefore very happy that this project failed. (Although the current intercity Amsterdam-Brussels is now making use of the line and the tickets have gotten too expensive anyway, but at least there is no mandatory reservation. Prices were far better when the train was still routed via Dordrecht-Roosendaal-Essen though.)
Excellent insight (for me) of Denmark, Danish trains and rail travel. Pity the mainteance people don't invest more in vacuum cleaners (!). Class Vlog. .
Thanks so much Norman 😎👍🏻
Denmarq has become a $hish-hole, they used to make great things before the storm, viking spirit long gone it seems..
@@theempyreacracy720 Danish products are worldclass! We are talking about Italian trains that are overpriced and does not work. A company, Alsaldo Breda that did not deliver on time nor budget and as mentioned elsewhere made a whole train disappear while at the factory in Italy and later was found in Libya after being sold to them by...Ansaldo Breda! Personally I would not agree that Danish trains are dirty.
Used to like the retro "Silver Streamliner" DSB MA 466, which ran from København to Struer, Esbjerg, Sønderborg, splitting around Kolding. IIRC called Limfjorden og Nordjyden. Noisy, clunky, but lots of space, and very comfortable.
Wow that's sounds cool 😎
@@NonstopEurotrip Yup. The trains were based upon the TEE DMU's used in Germany but like halfsets so they could go on the ferries and split to serve different branches when in Jutland. In the early 80's they were renovated with the silver livery. They were known as the "Silver arrow" but some also called them the "Tin foil express". Either way in 1990 they all got retired. Most got sent as a gift to Poland where they for a very short while operated on incredibly rural lines before being taken out of service there (They're not very fuel efficient at low speed). Still the national railway museum does still own 1 half set which they sometimes run on heritage services.
Que bellezaaa cuanta ingenieria dedicacion seriedad ademas Dinamarca es hermosaa graciaas me encanta viajar en tren Sonia Guerrero desde Argentina💝💝💝🙋🙋🙋🙋
Me encantaría visitar Argentina algún día, ¿cómo son los trenes?
@@NonstopEurotrip hola aca hace tiempo se retiraron los trenes en casi todo el pais solo hay trenes en Capital Federal o sea en provincia de Buenos Aires lamentable pero ocurrio manejos politicos del subdesarrollo graciaspor sus videos💝💝💝🙋🙋🙋🙋
@@NonstopEurotrip hola aca hace tiempo se retiraron los trenes en casi todo el pais solo hay trenes en Capital Federal o sea en provincia de Buenos Aires lamentable pero ocurrio manejos politicos del subdesarrollo graciaspor sus videos💝💝💝🙋🙋🙋🙋
@@NonstopEurotrip me alegra poder comunicarme con hermanos daneses graciaaas💝💝💝💝🙋🙋🙋🙋
Sounds like the train has a manual transmission and a bad clutch :). Also, bonus points for use of the word "dodgy".
Haha thanks, dodgy is a good word lol, yeah the have 12 gears 👍🏻
We rode one of these once! It was New Year’s Day and the lady next to us chundered everywhere and then had to sit in it the whole trip
Ewwwwww 🤢
@@NonstopEurotrip ha, yeah it wasn’t a great start
Was there anybody else on that train!? I quite liked the seats but yeh not much difference between the first and standard class. Also, I think the colour scheme lends itself to feeling really cold in the winter. Maybe that’s just me! Having also taken the train into and out of Copenhagen, I must say the station itself is fantastic and I hope the model Railway is still there 😊.
Well it is Denmark mate 😂 And yes there were other people, you need to clean your glasses 🤓🥧
Neat catenary
😂
I think it’s a voith engine as they use it on some of the trains here in the uk
That double decker with huge diesel reminds me of commuter trains in USA. I expected something more petite in little Denmark.🤓
Just need some gallery cars now 😉
That's the first time I've seen a toilet brush on a train! The toilet bowls also seem to be bog-standard ceramic units.
I actually thought the same 😂
This was an interesting and informative video. I have taken trains in Denmark, but not this one. I agree the seats looked comfortable, and the ride appeared very smooth - no gentle rocking that I could see. However, I am not sure I'd like it. It sounded more like a truck in stop and go traffic than a train, and I think I would miss the familiar gentle rocking.
Thank you 🙏🏻 the sound was crappy but the ride was good 🙂
@@NonstopEurotrip yes, it looked very smooth!
Wow, that is one scary sounding train !
😂😂😂
Holy fuck man! I just noticed you were departing from my home town! The station is like 5 minutes walk from my old house. So nice to see my old town still looking great!
And a very nice peaceful town it is too 🙂
@@NonstopEurotrip Thank you. I am already excited to see your ME video
@@mrtookyourgirl69 😎😎😎
The engine sounda are worse than the 90's regional train of Trenord 😅 great trip. And to be honest, the weather of this trip is perfect to make a good picture/video with this train
Quite bad isn't it 😂
After the new Coradia stream EMUs roll out to DSB in the mid-2020s, the IC4s may get acquired by different railways elsewhere.
That will be good!!
Remind me a little bit on the german ICE TD train.
The ICE TD is now Advanced TrainLab
Indeed yes!
This was Ansaldo/Breda work. This manufacturer would have orders because they offered at unbelievably low prices. The quality though was beyond abominable. But what if orders are not assessed by engineers? A similar order was issued by the Dutch national railways, for a series of 9-coach 250 km/h EMU's. Eventually, the order was cancelled after the first units ran trials and began to fall apart... Now if you see local services on the Dutch high-speed lines, consisting of 40 y/o coaches sandwiched between leased Bombardier-Traxx engines, being limited to 160 km/h on 300 km/h tracks, then you know how that came to be.
Nowadays, Ansaldo/Breda railway stock building is taken over by Hitachi.. They built the GWR (UK) class 802 in Italy. I quote a comment about it's quality.. Oh well, it seems not to fall apart this time. Though parts seem to come from all over the world, the bogies are still made in Italy...
/I really wanted to like this train. It looked great and I had a chance to travel from Swansea to Paddington when they were first brought into service. I stumped up for a first class ticket (the only time I've ever done this) to savour the trip. I went with an open mind and really looked forward to my journey. Sadly it was a shocker. The first class interior was nothing fancy and the seat was rock hard and just plain uncomfortable (poor ergonomics). However, what really unnerved me was the ride quality. I love travelling by train but frankly this train at speed is bouncing everywhere. The old HST mk3 coaches hid the speed and age of our track, these Hitachi trains magnify it. Say what you like about BR, they nailed it with the mk3 coach and we all took it for granted. There is absolutely no way on earth these trains are giving 40 years of service. I haven't been on one since. Its like a very fast pacer !/
The Fyras are sorted now, kind of. I've filmed a review on them in Italy, and I was very impressed tbh. The GWR 80x's are the worst of the bunch, the TPE and LNER one much better in my experience. But yes I'm with you, I miss HSTs on mainline services 😭
@@NonstopEurotrip We Dutch called the Fyras Fyascos.
The Fyra name became for ever tainted and completly removed.
They litteraly fell apart during service.
I have a copy of the official railway inspectors report of the "quality" workmanship of Ansaldo Breda of The V250 Fyra
Reading it makes you laugh out loud at first because it looks if you are reading a fictional comedy report written by an engineer.
Sadly its not and it became a big European scandal.
The DSB warned in forhand because they already had experienced the "high quality" already.
The DSB had to make improvements themselves out of pure necesity (stockshortage)
They will not be refurbished/updated and retired from service after JUST 15 years!
It was cheaper to buy a model of new trains that have a good trackrecord by other railway companies then keep them in service.
Ansaldo Breda was sold by defence companny Finmechanicca to Hitachi as a result of this debacle.
Good comment, much appreciated...
Great video. Theystill have Tuborg there???)))))
They sure do! 🍻
An "unknown buyer" is getting these trains as they're phased out. Some of the 2 car versions went to Romania and a regional operation, Astra Trans Carpathia or something.
More than a few likely to scrap.
See if anyone gets 2 IC4 sets and totally rebuild em to form a longer consist with all axles powered on the cab coaches with the Iveco motors and transmissions. Makes me think of Budd RDCs with their 2 motors, 3 speed torque converters and 2 powered axles per car.
Thanks for the information, I hope to try the Romanian ones soon!
Super. May be norway trains later? )
Yes, but not this trip!
Are you showing Central Station? I have been on S-Tog and Oresund Trains to Malmo and Helsingor, and the services from Helsingor to Gillilege eyc. Ticketing makes sense, and the link with buses is goid.
Yes, check out my other Danish video 🙏🏻
Carrying a bicycle on the train is a real luxury, I envy
It's really great, I agree 🙏🏻
What a creepy sound these trains make. It sounds if they have a onboard gearbox..............
But a very nice Danish vlog. Ansaldo Breda, well we all know de Fyra-disaster in the Netherlands!!
Haha yes me too. They do have 12 gears
almost sounds like a truck.thought i heard it downshift!lol!
I know right 😂
Nice trains seem quite modern they seem comfortable as well the trains run on the right like they do in Germany.
Pretty good yeah! 👍🏻
@@NonstopEurotrip Right so what has happened to the old “rubber nose” trains are they in service ?.
Nice review of this troubled model. Those engine sounds are normal for this type of train. They aren't struggling to accelerate, the sound changes so much because they have transmissions (gearboxes) like trucks do. So the engines are moving up and down through their full effective RPM range. That's different to a diesel-electric locomotive, where RPM is constant, driving a generator, which makes electricity to power electric motors that provide the actual turning power. With hindsight, it might have been better to just electrify the whole rail network in Denmark and use EMUs instead of DMUs. Considering how small the country is, it might have been a challenge, but achievable.
They've seen the light now...... ⚡
The best train kawan
🤣🤣
The engine sounds very similar to a TPE Class 185, which essentially a regional train
Quite a lot louder irl 😂
@@NonstopEurotrip ikr they are my local trains tbh the IC3 is much nicer its also a lot more quieter
The problem in Danmark goes way back to 1985 . I asked as a kid , why would they choose an electric system not used by neighboring Germany and Sweden ? They did have an answer that made no sense . Today it's all falling apart but the systems keep propping it up .
True true 🤷🏻♂️
very nice video, i think the problem is not in the train sets, with some other things
No, it's the train sets 😂
J'ai utilisé ce train lors de ma visite au Danemark sur le trajet Copenhague-Roskilde. Le bruit et les irrégularités dans l'accélération m'avaient surpris, surtout que la ligne est électrifiée. J'ai rapidement compris que c'était du diésel... dommage. Ça m'a un peu déçu du réseau ferroviaire Danois qui finalement, pour un petit pays nordique, est assez en retard sur ce point, dans sa zone la plus densément peuplée (île de Sélande). Au minimum, il pourraient utiliser du matériel roulant bi-mode qui profite de la partie électrifiée.
Je suis d'accord ! Mais ils vont bientôt corriger cela, avec des trains à deux étages tractés par Vectron et bientôt de nouvelles unités multiples électriques !
I don't think that was wheelslip, sounds like the train has gears like in a car.
Yes exactly 😃
Em português: Parece um caminhão trocando as marchas! Eh eh eh!
6:39 "Did you just play some light jazz?"
Hardly 🤣
Strange sound of acceleration ! Like a bus! Different!
Haha I know 😂
I just watched a review of the ill-fated IC4 on another channel, so I'm rewatching yours to compare comments.
My friend Superalbs? 😊
Hvalsø station is very peaceful and quiet. As well with regional and high speed services. Are there like suburban trains running suburban services around Copenhagen.
Yes we have a S-Bahn type of system around Copenhagen called S-tog.
As seen in the video...
Interesting. ☺️
It seems that Breda not only screwed up the San Francisco Muni streetcars, but also screwed up these DSB trains too. The Breda Muni fleet is being replaced 20 years before their intended lifespan as they were not suited for purpose and caused more problems. They're being replaced with Siemens equipment.
They screwed up everything 😂
Ansaldo-Breda also made Trams / Streetcars for the cities of Gothenburg (Sweden) and Oslo (Norway). Those have been a painful experience for the local governments involved.
I was so confused when you said that ‘Breda’ screwed up streetcars in SAN Fransisco. Because I thought that you meant the Dutch city where I live Breda! (It has a gorgeous station btw) looks like they als screwed up the naming!
I´m from Denmark but from the nothern part - we don´t see IC4 that much, but i´ve tried them - and i dont like them that much!
Fair enough lol
Interesting video. But there were very few people on the train!
The front unit was actually very busy 😂
4:59 the reason why the acceleration of the train seemed a bit off is most likely because of a faulty motor or like you said, a wheelslip. A commuter rail network in Massachusetts USA got new locomotives a couple years ago and I’m guessing they had the same problem with the IC4 with the struggling motors and stuff
This is the worst I've ever heard 🤣
Nah as someone who has had quite a few rides onboard these trains, that acceleration is perfectly normal for an IC4, along with the sluggishness that jolts you back and forth as it tries to get moving.
@@drdewott9154 I didn’t know that but I can guarantee you that the IC4 doesn’t light up in flames compared to the commuter rail company’s new locomotives
@@MrStark-up6fi Eh, doubt that again, these trains had massive issues with poor cooling and overheating in its early days and to a certain extent still do
Don't complain about the train company when toilets are dirty - it is other passengers who are responsible. Trains often don't stay in one place long enough for a cleaning team to do the job when trains are in service.
These were 'haven't been cleaned for days' dirty 🤷🏻♂️
Sounds a bit like a bus lol… interesting train
Yep 😅😅😅
Unbelievable in the green Denmark there is in service diesel intercity train, it does not make sense
I agree that it is taking longer than ideal. This is a political issue - not granting the necessary funds!
Even with the funds, I don't think the politicians could (or can) agree on the best mode of transport for the future.
IC4 was meant for less populated areas where electrification might never make sense. The upgrade to IC4 over the old IC3 didn't really come to pass because of major production and quality issues, making most of them practically unusable. IC3 remains the better train.
Cars/car-trains/busses might be better alternatives in many places where diesel trains roam now, mainly due to trains costs, lacking expandability and in the outskirts with relatively low population.
The train-backbone in Denmark is to become electrified soon'ish. They have upgraded a lot the last years, including; fixing rails, new signals, removing platforms/stops and improving platforms/stops.
They are making steps forward now with it!
I mean the original plan in the 90's was to electrify the mainline network, but that was until the political nation attacked and argued that the rapid development of more environmentally friendly diesel motors offset the greenness compared to getting electricity from power plants and the at the time still rather small percentage of wind in the grid. And so the electrification scheme was put on hold, having more or less only gotten to make the border to border line from Copenhagen and the Øresund bridge to Padborg where it met the German rail system. And its only starting to be picked up again in recent years. But some of the secondary routes are now in jeopardy again due to guess what? Battery trains. So lines like Vejle-Struer, and Aalborg-Frederikshavn and Hirtshals may never get electrified, even if the EU is pressuring Denmark year after year to electrify the latter as its part of a major EU-wide freight network known as the TEN-T.
It doesn't help that in terms of other green initiatives like Urban and transit planning that Denmark is a black sheep compared to the rest of Europe with increased car ownership and 50 billion DKK allocated to building new highways over the next 14 years. All while the politicians tout stuff like Power to X in the form of Methanol as the future of fuel. Heck Public transit here is underfunded as heck and way WAY overpriced to compensate which just worsens the cycle. I mean public transit ridership has halved over the course of the pandemic and is still way below pre covid levels while sales of both Old and new cars are rising super high and congestion appearing more and more.
Like with the grand stuff like wind power plans and such we're doing great but its all the little things we get so completely wrong!
Even their trains are anonymous.
😂
Those motors really sounded like they were struggling to me...
Absolutely!
When I went to Denmark 3 years ago I was shocked that the train from Aarhus (2nd largest city) to Copenhagen is diesel... then once we got to Copenhagen the central station was full of pollution from all the diesel trains, I could barely see or breathe for that matter.
This, in part, has to do with the fact that it is far more difficult to put electric trainsets onto ferries, which was necessary before the opening of the Great Belt Fixed Link in 1998. That situation has now changed, but it takes time to catch up.
Yeah, they are catching up though!
@@NonstopEurotrip Yup. Again electrification has been built to Holbæk but won't be operational until 2024 due to electromagnetic noise and the ERTMS rollout. Still we're trying and the plan is to have all diesel trains in the country phased out by 2030 afaik
I love Denmark, being 1/2 Danish, but a Brit nevertheless, but I have to say that, in all my years of travelling by plane, ship, train or car, Copenhagens Hovedbanhof? is the only place where I have had my pocket picked. To be fair, there were warnings over the loudspeaker about pickpockets on the station concourse, but we were busy trying to help a group of foreigners to purchase a ticket from a machine when they only had small change. Naturely, it was these guys that DID me, and I never felt a thing...We couldn't report to the Police as their on station office had been closed, and we were on the way home so we reported to the police at the airport, pretty unsympathetically it seemed. However, a couple of months later, my wallet and cards, but minus about £100 in cash arrived in the post at home, with a covering letter explaining that the wallet had been found and handed in to the police. so restored my warm feelings to Denmark (not that they ever went away).
That's not very nice! Can't say I experienced anything like that in Denmark myself 🤷🏻♂️
Yeah we have a lot of cases of foreigners using that trick. Especially people from Slavic countries are infamous here for during stuff like this or other theft. Like trying to get their hands on other people's cheaply offered old stoves and what not via DBA only to resell them at like twice what they offered. Or what about the times they've stolen clothes from containers belonging to non profits who were sending it to Africa, and these people just... stealing the clothes to sell on the black markets back in Poland and Romania.
You had a good ride on a good train, but your summary didn't mention your earlier observation that it wasn't clean.
Whoops 😬
It is not a sound of a wheelslip, but of a transmission ZF gearbox. Very archaic and strange…
Absolutely 🤗
@@NonstopEurotrip btw, your channel is top 👍
Um, the sounds as the train takes off, sounds so much like a bus (coach) changing gears!
That's exactly what it is 😂
@@NonstopEurotrip why are you keep making 😂 faces, first of all the train is supposed to start like this the acceleration is slow because the train doesn’t want you to fall
👍👍👍👍
🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻
That does sound like wheelslip, but it really shouldn't be happening in the dry. Modern trains generally have traction control systems that help prevent it in all conditions, but I'm guessing a diesel hydraulic transmission on a jacobs bogie doesn't lend itself well to that. That has to be bad for engine and transmission.
If you've ever been in a Siemens Desiro HC, those have stacks of power, and on wet and slippery tracks you can really notice the traction control working, regulating power to individual axles. Even then they certainly accelerate much faster than the IC4.
Also, what a dreadful noise these trains produce!
Haha yeah agree. It certainly was unique experience! The desiros fly off the line dont they!
It is not even diesel-hydraulical. It is diesel-mechanical. Iveco V8 and an automatic transmission from a truck/bus. That is why it sounds weird and is a slow snail off the line.
That was 🚍 or a 🚆? That sound during acceleration is weird for a train.
Honestly not sure 😂😂😂
It was 83 set from the beginning, but Mr. Bunga-bunga aka Berlusconi gave one to his friend Gadaffi 🤣
Crazy right 😅
Interesting. I probably would cancel the contract after 5 years delay. Another interesting thing is the Danish clearance gauge. Every train has a weird trapezoid shape. I used to see flat side trains at home.
Yes I know 😂
Probably no coincidence DSBs logo is also trapezoid shaped lol
@@stevenmontoya9950 Hm. Good insight. :)
Surprised they allow diesel trains at your final underground station. Wonder how they deal with fumes/ventilation. Their sound is more akin to a manual transmission car than that of a diesel train.
Update: reading comments, confirmed they have mechanical transmission. In Canada, we have/had the Budd RDCs DMUs (each car was autonomous but could be coupled together). They had mechanical transmission. But their sound was less like a manual transmission Volkswagen and more like a train.
I know I was quite surprised too!!! 😏
The tunnel was built for steam trains. It still has the ventilation for steam trains.
I have been in an open wagon after a steam engine, waiting for signal in the tunnel, that was interesting as the smoke began to build up.
But yes the air quality is horrible
@@Jakob_DK I saw a tourist steam train pass through during my stay, do you have any idea what it would have been?
Yes, it sounds "expensive" but if you are on a Danish salary it is reasonable. I often wonder what is the most expensive network for walk-up (non-discounted fares) when compared to the national minimum wage/average wage etc. I suspect the UK but Spain must be a contender. Cheapest. Maybe Italy? Opinions welcome
Very true yes! I believe Spain and Italy along with the UK must be the most expensive walk-ups from my experience 👍🏻
The single ticket is pretty expensive. However, using a Rejsekort smartcard is about 25 % cheaper, and it only costs 50 DKK to have the card made, which means that it pays itself back very quickly.
Even though our salaries are pretty high, the Swiss ticket prices certainly would rank among the most expensive, particularly if you don't own a half price card.
Had AnsaldoBreda now Hitachi Rail Italy made a UK Loading gauge sized IC4 it's going to operate like 1950s Class 101 Daisy DMU mechanical transmission but coupling it to a modern DMU like a Class 195 Turbostar 168,170,171,172 would have disastrous consequences going to catch on fire like the class 127 DMU when coupled to mechanical transmission multiple-unit. DSB IC4 has a mechanical transmission unit therefore it shouldn't be coupled to IC3 hydraulic transmission or diesel-electric because DSB would have copied 🇬🇧 British Class 127 fires. Learnt the manual transmission trains from playing Train Sim World Huddersfield Line Northern transpennine
Interesting lol 😆
We should have bought some French TGVs and gone electric decades ago. I was on holiday in France and tried for the first time to travel with 250 km / h. In was in 1987. I will suggest that we should let the Chinese build our high speed train system. They can manage to built 5 km of high speed tracks per day.
I agree, but not about the Chinese. It's a very different situation when you can bully your way wherever you want to go and have unlimited cheap labour...
@@NonstopEurotrip sorry that's hypocrisy. Do you really think that consumers or companies from west Europe ever have worried about cheap labour when they bought their new TV, computer, cellphone etc.. or produced cheap so they had a bigger profit. There are 500. 000 Chinese workers working on danish plants in China. Do you think let got paid like a Dane?
@Torben Larsen he means regulation and cheap labor. If you're house it's in the way the will just build anyway, so obviously it tak3s less. Also zero regard for the environment can also speed things up. Having too many regulations can be a problem, but having none also.
As for labour it was cheap when they built it but nowadays its not the same.
And last and most important thing, when chinese contractors build something, they use their own workforce brought from China with no benefit for the local economy. Like they dis and are doing in Africa a part some exceptions like Egypt.
@tarik lyacoubi In Denmark, we don't even have the workforce for such a project or the know-how.
If you call for a Danish electrician for some work in your house, he will charge you at least 100$ for one hour.
Right now, an Italian company is building a new railway bridge. They have also brought their own workforce.
You want stations with a full suite? Then come to Copenhagen!
I can recommend trying the S-train service, and our Metro.
Would love to see videos on that.
😊
The train engine sounds like a bus
It does 🤣
Sun blinds on a Danish train seem a bit like indicators on a BMW.
😂😂😂😂😂
Not wheelspin but changing gears due the mechanical transmission.
Sounds terrible eh 😂
That poor train sounded sick in the traditional sense and not the 21st century use of the word. Nevertheless, great video
I know right!! Thanks Em 😊
Great insight but I don’t think danish railway’s will make my bucket list
Fair enough John, maybe I can tempt you with Sweden next week 😎🇸🇪
It seems to be such a waste to use a diesel train on a route where it looks like there is a catenary everywhere. Especially a high-speed one, those are far from efficient.
I agree yes, but they've got to work with what they've got!
Nonstop Eurotrip Probably, yes… The sad thing is that replacing these diesels with EMU’s is probably a totally profitable undertaking, but it requires quite some capital to make a new order. Hopefully the government sees this as well.