Lead wiping was used on a lot of cars,including the Ford Pinto. I worked part time on the Ford assembly line in NJ, and remember seeing an old timer working on the joint between the roof and quarter panel. He used a gas torch, a wire brush, a lead bar, and a big file to clean, heat, fill, and file the joint smooth. It took skill and a good eye. I don’t recall any PPE to protect from toxic exposure.
What year was that? If it was a before the dangers of lead poisoning were widely known, then no corporate would give a damn about ppe. If it was after laws or whatever then that's ground to sue them.
I painted a few shadows and very common to find 1/2 inch of lead on the scuttle panels what makes it worse is the as the body flexes at these high stress points it cracks the lead letting in moisture causing corrosion under the lead which swells the lead too.
Wow, I never knew this about Rolls-Royce cars. Very good explanation. I know a guy who has a Corniche and talked with him at a classic car show in Maryland in October. I would have asked him about his car if I had known. Thanks for sharing!
Nice video and explanation. American cars also used lead for many years in the same manner, typically around the cowl and rear window as shown here. Some factory films for American car companies show the use of lead in body making. It was apparently easy to place and shape on a car in a soft, hot state and then to file it to blend panels after it hardened.
Rare to have such an interesting video as this. Beautiful collection bytheway. Regards from England (West Sussex - Rolls Royces are built here today, in Chichester)
Lead loading was common up to about the ‘70’s when body fillers evolved to be come more flexible Very common on Jag’s too, usually used to fill a panel join seam as opposed to correct panel alignment
@@46spanner yes and no. On Rolls-Royce it was used as a filler. The best example is as shown in the video of the Walnut T2 where, aft of the C pillar, it is up to 1/2” thick.
It's always good to learn more about the construction of fine automobiles. I've always been an admirer of Rolls-Royce cars but have had Packards instead, and only one at a time.
In the 1980s the Indian Ambassador was still being made with worn-out press tools. The cars were famously much heavier than earlier versions as massive amounts of lead were used to cover the mismatched joints.
Thank you for this information. Many first-time buyers would have passed the Rolls Royce they were interested in thinking it was a stress crack in the body or a imperfections.
Very nice to hear from you about technical issues, since you have such a deep knowledge of SY, having spent many years caring for them. Who else better than you!!
Thank you Rodd! This video was quite informative. As you well know, Rolls-Royce is very reserved on disclosing its specs. and technicalities. This was definitely an education to us soon to be Rolls-Royce or Bentley owners. Please by all means share more technical information about these fine motor cars. Thank you!
I had a 77 RR SS that I loved! Still love them! This ws Such a treat to see so many in the same room that were SO pristine! Have to pick one? THAT would be a tough assignment for sure~!
Excellent "upfront" advisory. I have a classic Rolls on my "bucket list" but the more I learn about the maintenance and care of a Rolls...the more I appreciate my Jaguar Vanden Plas - which to me - is 90% of the enjoyment of a Rolls at 10% of the cost and aggravation.
Thanks Rod. I had no idea. I always had this view that lead wiping was one of those arcane über craftsmanship skills that we don't use now - due to it being too hard to do. Those fatigue cracks are awful. I suppose lead was better than nothing at the time. What is the most stable and best way to joint panels BTW?
Interesting video. I first became aware of lead-wiping when watching an old video of " Morris Oxfords " being assembled in India showing assembly works applying liberal amounts of lead to the various joints on the body. I certainly never imagined RR using the same trickery on their " august " vehicles!
Approx 30 years ago I saw a Rolls Royce that was inside a garage during a fire. Part of my job. I was surprised to see the lead joints all over the place- especially where the roof joined the rear trunk area
Hello Rodd ! I own a Silver Spirit you once sold ( SZ #4810 ). I always wondered about those cracks and what caused them. I am relieved to know what they are and also know what they are not. I hope I can visit your showroom sometime, your cars are so beautiful , Thank you.
Very fascinating! Having owned 6 Cloud IIIs this explains a lot. It's strange that they would try to reduce body weight with aluminum doors, bonnet and boot and yet slather on, probably, hundreds of pounds of lead. BTW do you have any idea where James Young's wood bucks and records wound up?
Not hundreds of pounds. That half an inch section is horrendous but coachworks would normally use only a few sticks around the joins. For instance, we grit blasted a Karmann Ghia, one of the swoopiest, most lozengey shapes imaginable to find butt-welded joints and scarcely any filler as the panels were so well aligned.
@@victorseastrom3455 Excellent question. I don't know the process for anything but steel but am quite keen on acquiring the 'new' aluminium bodied Alpine A110 so may yet find out!
@@garethmcrae668 Possibly Birmabright , a British car aluminum that my Rover's boot and bonnet - hood and trunk were made of. P4 Rover's had a reversal with Birmabright doors. I like the Grumman LLV. Make the whole coach body out of aluminum.
I learned elementary body-work at night class. Built a few veteran motorcycle petrol tanks using soft soldering. Then restored a Riley body with lead loading. The timber framed body on a steel chassis causes flexing BUT it is more the paint not the lead, moving. I saw a Bentley have over 10kg of lead removed during restoration.
Well, the use of lead to conceal the joining of panels on cars isn't unique to Roll Royce. It is the way it was with every automobile manufacturer up until the 1980's. It is the origin of the hot-rod/custom car description "lead-sled" which was used for cars that had the suspension lowered (sled) and extensive custom bodywork (lead).
I think there was a Rolls-Royce approved body repairer in Sydney somewhere in Five Dock that was allowed to do lead wiping repairs. Tony Root repaired his car at Eastwood using lead after going to TAFE to learn the process!!!!
The complex shapes around the headlights of the Jaguar XJ6 and XJ12 up to and including the Series III were achieved by a process called lead loading. I'm not aware of of similar problems with them.
Lead loading and lead wiping is the same. Simply nomenclature. The lead wiping used in Jaguar is the same process but it was much thinner. That said, you can agent and do see hairline fracturing on jaguars in these areas as well
@@mblaber2000 you will find some. Some cars will have more and others less. In any event, it’s not a bad thing. Just a gentle reminder of a beautiful hand built motor car.
It's actually called lead-loading. That's probably why you couldn't find many references. Done correctly it won't crack. That said, 'correct' isn't 1/2in thick. 2-3mm is ideal. Many of the problems come from not rinsing the flux (based on boric acid) correctly, or from leading over spot welded / lapped joints where the acid gets trapped in vis capillary action. Best way to mitigate against this is to run a tiny weld over the bare edge to seal it to the substrate. Then you can tin up with solder paste, then thoroughly rinse and only then apply the stick of lead. Very satisfying, but frankly now although I'm happy to offer it (having leaded for nearly 30 years) the issue now is the painters, quite rightly, don't want to risk sanding lead in with the primer, so now I tend to just use it to finesse door-shuts where the strength and stickability of lead is still ideal.
Not only Rolls used lead. I knew a painter at Ford in Canada who learned to use lead at the factory. The same fellow did body work as a sideline and began using lead in some of his work.
Dear Mr. Sala, may i ask you a question. So, when you are asserting (very rarely) that a Shadow is like if you are buying a perfect car in the showroom in the 70’s, there are some of these small fractures. Or, otherwise, it has been repainted at some time. Is it right?
@@Luca-de3xu pretty much right, yes. Sometimes, you can get an all paint original Shadow that does not show these fracture lines and that is because the lead wiping turned out faultless on that car. But, that is rare as I would say 8 or 9 out of 10 of all Silver Shadows show some sign of fracturing.
@@roddsala4626 Thank you. Then, I take advantage of your knowledge. All of the old bodies, let's say even to Corniche III and IV, are they built in the same way and share the same issues? And I had a Continental T, some years ago. and it developed the same issue on pillar C, maybe due to the cut and subsequent welding for shortening the body. Same reason ? Thank you for sharing your knowledge, Rodd.
Budd Co . used to mig -brazed some panels like that on the Lincoln , much better than lead . A better utectic bond ,,, ! Also hugely stronger , seen many a test strip that was pulled apart , and the steel gave up first .
4:38 is fascinating and very "Rolls-Royce" - in mass-market manufacturing the lead wiping around the seam between the roof pillar and rear fender stampings would simply not be done on cars equipped with factory vinyl tops, instead the chrome molding would be designed to cover that seam.
I am surprised that, after these lead problems showed up earlier, that another compound wasn’t used. These cars are supposed to be almost perfect, that’s why you pay the big bucks for them.
A priceless piece of information and filming on such a British legacy. I take great interest in all I find on the Crewe Family. Thank you so much Sir for your efforts. Charles DeVere. Ribble Valley.
Lead wiping was used on a lot of cars,including the Ford Pinto. I worked part time on the Ford assembly line in NJ, and remember seeing an old timer working on the joint between the roof and quarter panel. He used a gas torch, a wire brush, a lead bar, and a big file to clean, heat, fill, and file the joint smooth. It took skill and a good eye. I don’t recall any PPE to protect from toxic exposure.
What year was that? If it was a before the dangers of lead poisoning were widely known, then no corporate would give a damn about ppe. If it was after laws or whatever then that's ground to sue them.
@ 1970
I painted a few shadows and very common to find 1/2 inch of lead on the scuttle panels what makes it worse is the as the body flexes at these high stress points it cracks the lead letting in moisture causing corrosion under the lead which swells the lead too.
Wow, I never knew this about Rolls-Royce cars. Very good explanation. I know a guy who has a Corniche and talked with him at a classic car show in Maryland in October. I would have asked him about his car if I had known. Thanks for sharing!
That car collection! Beautiful!
Very interesting. Never knew about this process. Thanks for the video!
Nice video and explanation. American cars also used lead for many years in the same manner, typically around the cowl and rear window as shown here. Some factory films for American car companies show the use of lead in body making. It was apparently easy to place and shape on a car in a soft, hot state and then to file it to blend panels after it hardened.
@@franktatom1837 100% correct.
Fascinating video Rodd! It'd definitely be interesting to see more videos like this - you definitely do learn something new every day!
Glad you enjoyed it!
ua-cam.com/video/svsbOR0XwCY/v-deo.htmlsi=-wZfp15FzTP2Bf-k
Rare to have such an interesting video as this. Beautiful collection bytheway. Regards from England (West Sussex - Rolls Royces are built here today, in Chichester)
I especially liked the nose of that Rolls-Royce Z28 at 4:35.
Thank you Rodd, always enjoy your videos!!!
Lead loading was common up to about the ‘70’s when body fillers evolved to be come more flexible
Very common on Jag’s too, usually used to fill a panel join seam as opposed to correct panel alignment
@@46spanner yes and no. On Rolls-Royce it was used as a filler. The best example is as shown in the video of the Walnut T2 where, aft of the C pillar, it is up to 1/2” thick.
The old customisers from the 50’s used lead for bodywork. That’s why the cars were called ‘lead sleds’.
Gene Winfield has a how-to video somewhere. Most people just call it "leading".
Thanks to the UA-cam algorithm, I've learned something today.
It's always good to learn more about the construction of fine automobiles. I've always been an admirer of Rolls-Royce cars but have had Packards instead, and only one at a time.
IT's not at all unique to "fine automobiles", leading has been a standard process for 60-70 years, even in the lowest-end consumer cars.
In the 1980s the Indian Ambassador was still being made with worn-out press tools. The cars were famously much heavier than earlier versions as massive amounts of lead were used to cover the mismatched joints.
Thank you for this information. Many first-time buyers would have passed the Rolls Royce they were interested in thinking it was a stress crack in the body or a imperfections.
Very nice to hear from you about technical issues, since you have such a deep knowledge of SY, having spent many years caring for them. Who else better than you!!
Fascinating! Never knew. I like these technical videos.
Thank you Rodd! This video was quite informative. As you well know, Rolls-Royce is very reserved on disclosing its specs. and technicalities. This was definitely an education to us soon to be Rolls-Royce or Bentley owners. Please by all means share more technical information about these fine motor cars. Thank you!
Great to see profound knowledge married with true love of these storied motorcars.
Thanks for that info. I feel alot more at ease with my Bentley T2 now, which also shows these same cracks.
Still beautiful motor cars though, the red one in the video is simply stunning, thank you for sharing!👍👏👏♥️
very interesting to learn! And YES I would love to learn more. Thank you Mr. Sala!
I had a 77 RR SS that I loved! Still love them! This ws Such a treat to see so many in the same room that were SO pristine! Have to pick one? THAT would be a tough assignment for sure~!
Excellent "upfront" advisory. I have a classic Rolls on my "bucket list" but the more I learn about the maintenance and care of a Rolls...the more I appreciate my Jaguar Vanden Plas - which to me - is 90% of the enjoyment of a Rolls at 10% of the cost and aggravation.
Not quite true. I also love Jaguars and I would say Maintenance and care is about the same for both of them when you start with good examples of each.
No. Rolls aren't all that expensive if you garage them and take good care of them. Some Jags are wicked expensive after they went metric.
Rodd your workplace is my idea of heaven, I'd happily live in it lol Really informative video thank you.
Thanks Rod. I had no idea. I always had this view that lead wiping was one of those arcane über craftsmanship skills that we don't use now - due to it being too hard to do. Those fatigue cracks are awful. I suppose lead was better than nothing at the time. What is the most stable and best way to joint panels BTW?
Interesting video. I first became aware of lead-wiping when watching an old video of " Morris Oxfords " being assembled in India showing assembly works applying liberal amounts of lead to the various joints on the body. I certainly never imagined RR using the same trickery on their " august " vehicles!
Interesting video! And btw, that two tone silver over blue Silver Shadow is absolutely stunning.
the main car you were showing, the gray and blue, was awesome.. couldn't tell if that was a wraith or a shadow? i didn't see it on your inventory.
I met an old body man back in the 1970’s who was an expert at lead wiping. It’s definitely an art.
@@jeffschueler1182 without question! It’s hard to get completely perfect and as much as we’d love to claim Crewe craftsmanship was perfect, it wasn’t.
I had Jensen interceptor and Bristol 407 with exactly the same issue. Good explanation though 👍🏻
Very informative video, Rodd. My Corniche now wears its fine cracks below the windshield and around the convertible top as a badge of authenticity.
@@aquariumdvd and quite seriously, this is exactly how it should be viewed.
Always wondered why RR looked so good. NO panel joints; I never noticed that before. Thanks.
Approx 30 years ago I saw a Rolls Royce that was inside a garage during a fire. Part of my job. I was surprised to see the lead joints all over the place- especially where the roof joined the rear trunk area
Hello Rodd ! I own a Silver Spirit you once sold ( SZ #4810 ). I always wondered about those cracks and what caused them. I am relieved to know what they are and also know what they are not. I hope I can visit your showroom sometime, your cars are so beautiful , Thank you.
Very interesting! Thank you very much!
Very interesting. Thank You, And what a beautiful collection!
This is a very interesting and uniquely informative post. Thank you very much.
Very interesting. I never knew about this. Great video.😊
Interesting video thank you, please make more... 👍🏼
Very fascinating! Having owned 6 Cloud IIIs this explains a lot. It's strange that they would try to reduce body weight with aluminum doors, bonnet and boot and yet slather on, probably, hundreds of pounds of lead. BTW do you have any idea where James Young's wood bucks and records wound up?
Not hundreds of pounds. That half an inch section is horrendous but coachworks would normally use only a few sticks around the joins. For instance, we grit blasted a Karmann Ghia, one of the swoopiest, most lozengey shapes imaginable to find butt-welded joints and scarcely any filler as the panels were so well aligned.
@@garethmcrae668 Thanks. I wonder what they did with the Aluminum bodied cars like the Phantom Vs
@@victorseastrom3455 Excellent question. I don't know the process for anything but steel but am quite keen on acquiring the 'new' aluminium bodied Alpine A110 so may yet find out!
@@garethmcrae668 Possibly Birmabright , a British car aluminum that my Rover's boot and bonnet - hood and trunk were made of. P4 Rover's had a reversal with Birmabright doors. I like the Grumman LLV. Make the whole coach body out of aluminum.
Very good explanation , Many thanks Rodd . More vids please .
I learned elementary body-work at night class. Built a few veteran motorcycle petrol tanks using soft soldering. Then restored a Riley body with lead loading. The timber framed body on a steel chassis causes flexing BUT it is more the paint not the lead, moving. I saw a Bentley have over 10kg of lead removed during restoration.
I've been obsessed with Rolls-Royce and Bentley since I was about 4 yrs. old
Very informative video! In what year did they completely switch over to the newer method of Manufacturing??
Great video, very informative and nostalgic I had to subscribe.
That did it for me…..i won’t be buying one now…..couldn’t anyway! Great video
@@tommooe4524 why? It’s actually part of the charm and idiosyncrasies of a classic hand built Rolls-Royce motor car.
@ the note was a compliment not a criticism
Well, the use of lead to conceal the joining of panels on cars isn't unique to Roll Royce. It is the way it was with every automobile manufacturer up until the 1980's. It is the origin of the hot-rod/custom car description "lead-sled" which was used for cars that had the suspension lowered (sled) and extensive custom bodywork (lead).
Exactly. Been done forever.
Years ago i was working on an old Chrysler i was installing a switch for the truck lid. And was stunned it had lead and more so with how thick.
Thank you for sharing. My 1977 SS II has no cracks, courtesy of a restoration. Here's hoping for the longer term. From Australia
very interesting information! Well appreciated!
I think there was a Rolls-Royce approved body repairer in Sydney somewhere in Five Dock that was allowed to do lead wiping repairs. Tony Root repaired his car at Eastwood using lead after going to TAFE to learn the process!!!!
Always enjoy your videos technical or not. Thank you Rodd.
Thank you, Rodd! Very interesting! Please share your substantial knowledge in more technical videos :-)
The complex shapes around the headlights of the Jaguar XJ6 and XJ12 up to and including the Series III were achieved by a process called lead loading. I'm not aware of of similar problems with them.
Lead loading and lead wiping is the same. Simply nomenclature. The lead wiping used in Jaguar is the same process but it was much thinner. That said, you can agent and do see hairline fracturing on jaguars in these areas as well
Great video Rodd please do more.
Very interesting, Rod. Who would have thought about this. Most would think it was bondo letting loose.
Thanks for making this interesting and informative video
Thankyou, Rodd very interesting, and what a collection!
Beautiful looking understated elegance before the two pimpmobile outfits got their grubby hands on two wonderful marques.
General motors was srill using lead where the roof met the rear quarter panel at least until 1977, maybe longer.
Used to do that on the Hillman Avenger in 73 when I worked there.
Rodd, great video! Would like one on wood care and repair.
Very interesting video. Thank you.
As an apprentice late 70s I would watch the guys applying the lead at the Cowley PSF plant. Lead workers had to decontanate in lead booths.
Looks paradise fantastique
Great cars & video 😊
Excellent information.
Very interesting episode 👌 👍
The 1961 Rolls-Royce....Boss of all time!!!
Awesome information, thank you
Now I’m motivated to check my Silver Cloud and Cornice for stress fractures…
@@mblaber2000 you will find some. Some cars will have more and others less. In any event, it’s not a bad thing. Just a gentle reminder of a beautiful hand built motor car.
Never knew this. Thanks for the heads up.
It's actually called lead-loading. That's probably why you couldn't find many references.
Done correctly it won't crack. That said, 'correct' isn't 1/2in thick. 2-3mm is ideal.
Many of the problems come from not rinsing the flux (based on boric acid) correctly, or from leading over spot welded / lapped joints where the acid gets trapped in vis capillary action. Best way to mitigate against this is to run a tiny weld over the bare edge to seal it to the substrate. Then you can tin up with solder paste, then thoroughly rinse and only then apply the stick of lead.
Very satisfying, but frankly now although I'm happy to offer it (having leaded for nearly 30 years) the issue now is the painters, quite rightly, don't want to risk sanding lead in with the primer, so now I tend to just use it to finesse door-shuts where the strength and stickability of lead is still ideal.
Not only Rolls used lead. I knew a painter at Ford in Canada who learned to use lead at the factory. The same fellow did body work as a sideline and began using lead in some of his work.
Finally someone explains the intracies of lead wiping! Now, about that bonnet strip …
Customer's car. Wasn't authorised to rectify!
@@roddsala4626 I figured as much because otherwise you’d have dealt with it in an instant! I just had to give you a hard time 😉
Dear Mr. Sala, may i ask you a question. So, when you are asserting (very rarely) that a Shadow is like if you are buying a perfect car in the showroom in the 70’s, there are some of these small fractures. Or, otherwise, it has been repainted at some time. Is it right?
@@Luca-de3xu pretty much right, yes. Sometimes, you can get an all paint original Shadow that does not show these fracture lines and that is because the lead wiping turned out faultless on that car. But, that is rare as I would say 8 or 9 out of 10 of all Silver Shadows show some sign of fracturing.
@@roddsala4626 Thank you. Then, I take advantage of your knowledge. All of the old bodies, let's say even to Corniche III and IV, are they built in the same way and share the same issues? And I had a Continental T, some years ago. and it developed the same issue on pillar C, maybe due to the cut and subsequent welding for shortening the body. Same reason ? Thank you for sharing your knowledge, Rodd.
I never knew that about the lead Rodd, I thought the cracking was due to thick paint expanding and contracting.
My MK1 ford Cortina had lead wiping on some of its panel joints.
@@andrewallen9993 yes….. many cars from the 50s, 60s, 70s and 80s were built using this technique.
Budd Co . used to mig -brazed some panels like that on the Lincoln , much better than lead . A better utectic bond ,,, ! Also hugely stronger , seen many a test strip that was pulled apart , and the steel gave up first .
Yes but you cant get the thickness as they did with lead. Around 1/2 " in some areas.
Vauxhall did the same with their cars in the 1960s and 70s. Very interesting video.
GM was doing lead wiping on full-sized Chevy Impals as late as 1996.
Lincoln Leaded the Body Joints as well.
Still beautiful cars. I would love to take a pick of one 😀
Your cars are beautiful.
4:38 is fascinating and very "Rolls-Royce" - in mass-market manufacturing the lead wiping around the seam between the roof pillar and rear fender stampings would simply not be done on cars equipped with factory vinyl tops, instead the chrome molding would be designed to cover that seam.
My sunbeam and most other car manufacturers of that era used lead as body filler.
interessant, lehrreich und ehrlich dem Kunden gegenüber .
Nice vid!!
What about rust? Does the cracking allow rust to form on the sheet metal underneath?
I love that copper brown color. Many beautiful cars.
Wonder if chassis flex contributes.
Thank you for this information
Very interesting, many thanks
Very interesting!
Did Bentley' have that issue ? I once saw an old one with seams like that .
Bentley and Rolls-Royce were basically the same car, so yes
I am surprised that, after these lead problems showed up earlier, that another compound wasn’t used. These cars are supposed to be almost perfect, that’s why you pay the big bucks for them.
Lots go wrong on these, designed is over complicated
So these cracks don’t lead to rust due to the lead underneath?
@@petergresham8913 no because the fractures in the lead only go down a mm or so and not down to the steel.
I would be obsessed with putting clear coat on those cracks. I don't care if you're not supposed to.
A priceless piece of information and filming on such a British legacy. I take great interest in all I find on the Crewe Family. Thank you so much Sir for your efforts. Charles DeVere. Ribble Valley.
Industry norm back in the day !
very interesting! I had no idea!