Off-Grid Network Cabinet Power Supply. This was not my day...
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- Опубліковано 4 тра 2024
- I was maybe a bit too excited about having all the components ready to be mounted inside the new network cabinet. A bit more planning would have helped me in the end and saved me some time.
But mounting all these exciting devices to bring power to my network cabinet was far more fun than screwing a simple aluminium backplate in place, right?! I really should have started with the back panel...😅
Yes, this is all still solar and battery related. You will see soon...
Boost converters I have used, 12V to 19-48V:
off-grid-garage.com/dc-dc-con...
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Back home in the mountains 50 years ago, when things aren't going right for you a hillbilly would say you're not holding your mouth right. :)
and the tongue... 🤪
Thanks for showing a tiny of the bloopers, ×*@× ups, and telling us a bit of how long you take on these videos, your hard work is appreciated.
I appreciate that!
Andy, as much as I love your videos, this cabinet design is a disaster.
You shouldn't need to put panels on the side, just get standard 19in shelves and attach your components to that.
Also, FYI, you can get PoE+ to 19V adapter so you can skip the converter if you have a good PoE switch.
Then power the PoE+ switch straight from the batteries with a Buck-Boost converter.
Hahaha, great. Viewers said the same about the battery shelf when I started building it.
It all will work out eventually. Trust uncle Andy😉
Beer goggles woulda beeen 😄
All those components will produce heat, don't you need any ventilation in the cabinet?
What? In sunny, hot Australia? Surely not!
That's free energy. That's what he boils water with.
I have similar setup and yes, there will be quite a lot of heat inside. I added 12V low rpm fan to cool it down.
I guess he wants to keep out the Ausie wildlife. Like a salties and Kangaroos.
By having a 120 degree network compartment.
That might work.
They are cold actually. I have oversized the boosters and they are not even getting warm after running the cabinet for two days.
bombenfest! I don't know why I wanted to say it like that lol
Because it makes sense and is a great international word. Like Kindergarten...
Why not glue some fine pitch metal mesh behind the perforated sections, rather than blocking them up completely?
Keep the airflow for improved heat dissipation while keeping the cabinet critter-free.
Yeah, I have something better now...
i wish 2 times "Gesundheit" in this Video 🤣
Thanks 🤧
So nice Andy, thank you for the video. Good luck with the sequel. Rob from a sunny Netherlands 😉
Thanks, Rob!
Hi Andy,
I recommend you have a hole in the back plate inline with the brush plate - you will thank me next time you need to run an additional cable with the rack mounted on the wall, and your hand is shoved up the back/behind to wiggle a cable through the brush plate.
Rob from Vic.
It all works fine as it is. Sure, it is tight behind that cabinet, but I have only a few cables going through the brush plate anyway.
Hi Andy. Heroes also have a bad day. Aber Hauptsache bombenfest. 😅
Everything is bombenfest down here😆
Bless you Sir...Twice 😇
Thank you.
We have all had those projects where we have had to redo them three, four or five times. I am surprised to see their were no “frog” in this video. 🤪
No frogs in winter down here. They are all sleeping somewhere.
Thanks for your great videos. Keep up the great work.
Greetings from the Netherlands
Thank you.
Like# 1 - Woot - Gesundheit!
🥇🥇🥇
Thanks for the wonderful video! Love from US
Thanks a lot Michael!
If you mount your access point in the data cab, the wifi signal will penetrate through the glass front. But it'll really struggle to get past the aluminium plates and metal enclosure. The cab is similar to a faraday cage.
Looking forward to seeing your new stackable DiY battery build.
Tschuss
I have the Wifi access point inside the garage which acts like a metal box too. 50m away of that garage, I still have Wifi access.
@@OffGridGarageAustralia Sounds like you've got a great access point.
I ran some tests a few years ago and could still connect to an access point that was mounted outside (albeit at a reduced speed) from over 300m away. There were no obstructions, a clean line of sight and no competing radio waves. When I tried this with the access point mounted inside a metal portacabin, the signal rapidly dropped off after 30m. The portacabin had double skinned metal walls.
@@mikeKirwin Yes, I have the same experience. The Wifi signal can reach a lot further than one would think but also the opposite and be very disappointing.
I have now closed the cabinet with the door and side panel and still have Wifi signal outside in the yard. For sure, the quality is not as strong any more but I haven't done any specific testing in that direction.
Andy, do you weld? I'm sure you could. Cheap flux core or stick welder maybe. Make your own boxes, brackets, mounts all that stuff. You basically make a box inside the box anyway. You're a handy guy and could do it. I'm sure you have a neighbor that could help (if needed). No unwanted holes to fill, exact size you want. Just curious. I learned to weld to make a telescope dolly, and it is a handy skill to have. I find your videos and mind so very interesting even when it doesn't apply to me. I really like the way you show yourself working to figure out the project. Also, I wondered how long it would take you to mention that the northern hemisphere was getting better for solar. :) Have a good one and keep the videos coming.
Maybe you could consider mounting the wifi antennae on the outside of the cabinet via some SMA cables.
I don't think it is necessary. You will see in the next video.
You can get mesh filters you can cut to shape. I use them to make diy dust filters for my pc to go over the fans that suck air into the pc. They're fairly fine mesh so should keep out insects etc but allow air flow for cooling
Thank you, I've got something and show it in the next video.
Thanks!
Buy more beer… the sun will return ….or you will feel better about it not showing back up..Jim.
Thanks a lot, Jim!
Wouldn't it have been easier for you to build your own cabinet?
🍻🍻
Why?
@@OffGridGarageAustralia because you could build it your size, no holes to fill in, and we could've come along on the journey with you 🍻🍻
That NUC needs 12-20 volts. If you set the victron DC/DC to output 13 volt you don't need the buck converter.
Thanks Andy
Thank you Wayne
Un saluto caloroso saluto da Italy❤
Hello! 🙋♂️
Your box with the holes? self adhesive foam strip? might even get breathable if you do want some air flow. sound deadening mats might be an option if air flow not important.
Andy if you don't want silicone to stick to something you can cover it with Glad Wrap. André in Sydney
I used gap filler now. Worked a treat!
Hi Andy, I noticed that you were intending to get rid of your collection of vertical battery cases. I currently have 5 of the Seplos vertical cases and would happily take the one you have (for mates rates). Luckily I live in the same corner of the world as you (Sunny hot Australia/Brisbane).
why don't you simply put very fine mesh in front of all the holes?
How do you 'put mesh on all the holes'? Glue? Screws? Some other techniques?
A true MacGyver from, not really, down under 😆. Thank you for the inspiration!
Thank you!
With those cheap things, if they undervolt, then heat and current go up. Not usually great as most electronics aren't immune to fire. Also, depending on if your switch is a $100 consumer throw away or a $5K+ cisco/aruba/ruckus/etc... you REALLY don't want to have the flash corrupted by, oh, undervoltage. If you do, well, you either have a long weekend with a very expensive JTAG programmer and soldering rig or you pony up for a new switch. And generally speaking, no, wifi APs in metal boxes usually perform poorly. Sliding rails.
I’ve noticed you are going up 100 every post nice work. You are doing great work also with your posts. And you are at 85.9k Moving up.
Thanks for the reminder. I need to print a '6'...
Ah... The POE+ network switch needs more around 54V, not 48V. 48V will .... mmm... barely work as long as the POE+ cables aren't too long, but it isn't ideal. The POE+ spec theoretically allows down to 42.5V after all the voltage drops but I've seen equipment get unhappy with a 48.0V power supply input. Remember that POE+ CAT cabling is very thin even though 4 wires are ganged for plus and four four minus, so the voltage drop can be considerable. You can squeak by if the POE+ ethernet cabling is short... even so, 48.0V on the DC input is too low.
Generally speaking if you have a 48V LiFepO4 battery system to work from, you can just route the battery voltage straight to the POE+ DC input (this is what I do). No conversions needed at all == near 100% efficiency. The battery voltage range of roughly 48.0V to 56.8V is within the POE+ specification. As long as the system voltage doesn't exceed 57V, the equipment will be fine with it.
Also, boost converters are not very efficient, particularly going from 12V to 48V. You always want to buck-down from a higher voltage. Never boost up unless you have no other alternatives.
--
One other thing to consider as the system sophistication increases is to have satellite "buffer" (aka UPS) batteries on critical equipment. The network is critical equipment... it sucks when something breaks and you don't have the convenience of your network through which to diagnose the problem quickly.
This is dead simple going from a higher voltage to a lower voltage, one can just use a Victron 75/15 with a fuse on the "solar" side to "buck down" to the lower-voltage buffer battery. Another method I use is to simply buy a POE+ splitter with a USB-C output then run a 19V USB-C-to-DC cable over to the Victron 75/15. The USB-C output is already current-limited and short-protected so no additional fusing is required. Usually good for 2A @ 12.8V (< 30W) trickle charging of the 12.8V satellite battery.
For same-voltage buffers, such as 48V-to-48V, A DC-to-DC charger such as Victron's Orion series is typically the solution. Usually a low amperage. 48V satellite battery as a UPS? Yes! Something like a 25Ah Lithova is perfect for that sort of thing.
In anycase, satellite battery buffering is an issue you need to strongly consider now for system robustness.
-Matt
It possibly would have been easier, to build a new cabinet from scratch from aluminum plates 😂
By the way: Gesundheit!
That's for sure not easier. This one works fine... you will see.
Andy, without air flow your cabinet will build up heat, especially in sunny hot Australia. Cool air comes in the bottom and exits out the top. Those holes you plan to plug up would be great for this purpose. Wink Wink.
I think there's just too many dangerous little snakes and spiders and other assorted horrors in Oz 😮
I have a solution.
Heya, lol I have a lot of those days that notthing is going like I want to
I hate these days!😅
Andy, 2x 19" vented shelves would have worked better, been easier, and solved all your mounting issues. You're thinking like a machine cabinet designer, not a network cabinet designer ;-)
Nope. You will see when it comes together 😉
Hello Andy,
why sealing all holes?
I think you will need some ventilation to get the heat out of the rack.
To keep out all the critters, I guess!
As others said some.fine mesh would solve the issue and still allow ventilation.
Thankfully our critters aren't poisonous.
Flywire!
There is no heat. Got it running for two days now and boosters are still metal-cold. I have oversized them, so they run at 20% only.
Don't mount the Wi-Fi AP inside the cabinet. You'll have RF bouncing around inside, even if there is an RF transparent front plate. It will degrade the performance, and the nearby metal will couple to and detune the antennas.
The Wifi is already in the garage! That is nothing else than a large metal box. I'll explain in the next video.
Get rid of your tesla and get a V8, it's amazing how quick those nozzles fully charge them up
Consider network gear designed for offgrid like Mikrotik that has a 11 to 57 Volt input. You can use a POE downconverter for ckeaper 8-30V gear
Build your own box
I do!
Any time you start thinking the solution to a task is gaffa tape and silicone, it's time to rethink the plan and find an actual tested solution.
Those last two screws was extras. No worries.
I have a large box of such 'extra' items. I keep them all for when I find out what they are needed for😆
A good high quality fan will cool that cabinet no prob… moving air is your friend.
Yes.
Hi Andy, Thank you for sharing these videos, do you think it is possible to make a video on your “Tesla” electric car charging system?
thanks again
Thank you. Yes, that is possible. I've made many in the past on my other channel 'unpluggedEV' about that topic and measured the heck out of the vehicle via a OBDII Bluetooth adapter and app.
You are building an OVEN for your electronics. See those big heatsinks on your buck converters, they are there to get rid of heat and with no ventilation all your electronics will fry, not a good thing. The cabinet is vented for a very good reason.
Testing the boost converters for two days and they are actually cold. I picked them oversized so temperature stays low. They use the same cases for most of their boosters, all the same size.
The cabinet is designed for network equipment with gets far hotter than the devices I will put in.
I would get a 3d scanner, scan the case with its holes, get a negative image of it in CAD and 3D print a perfect orifice plug. Yeah its a lot of work but it would make great content. Even better would be to get the cambriam max printer that prints TPR, a ruber filament, its the only printer i know of that prints rubber, perfect material for a satisfying well sealed orifice plug. Not like TPU which is flexble but slippery, this stuff is like real rubber and grippy. I was going to get it as my first printer but there wasnt any really good reviews on it. That atomstack cambrian its called. Anyway thats my solution, 3d printed rubber orifice plug. Perfect opportunity for 3d scanner company to advertise, maybe even atomstack with their wierd printer if they even make it anymore.
Hi Andy, why not using fly nets to cover the ventilation openings?
Or use velcro to stick some filter matt there, which you normaly use in the Exhausthood above your coocking stove?
I have a solution for that, thank you.
👍👍👍
As mentioned by others already, wouldn't heat of all those components cause a problem when you plug all the holes? Especially in your climate, the (heat-sinked) buck-convertors, the NUC and network-switch.
You can place your access-point inside but will need to pig-tail all the antennas to outside of this cabinet, otherwise you may encounter a level of faraday shielding if not careful.
It is personal preferences of course but in this instance and what you are trying to achieve (I think), I would have opted to mount everything in the horizontal plane instead. Make trays with the various components. a 19 inch rack is not really that ideally suited for using the sidewalls for mounting that much components, as you have discovered already during this video....
No heat... you will see in the next video.
I stick with Ubiquiti gear, a good 8 port managed Ubiquiti Tough switch is a good starting base
Never heard of this brand...
Be careful with those power supplies as they are not isolated the negative is 48v battery negative if you get some bit of equipment that has positive as it common you may get a short.
All the power comes from an isolated power supply.
The fuse block has all negatives connected anyway, so it would make no difference.
I'm not aware of any devices which use common positives. Ah, I had a solar charge controller once with that 'feature'. Certainly won't happen with the 3 devices I will have installed in this cabinet.
now you knowhow and why manufactures make things and you scratch your head in bewilderment .... do you have an online Master's Degree program and with that I can go anywhere.. 🙂 I worked on cars for 50 years (maybe) and have often wondered. The consumer customers don't have a clue why things costs so much and then claim people are cheating them... Andy, in addition to "solar panels" ... I just thought of something we can invent "Starlight panels". Very expensive but it will improve we get more time to research, develop and mine natural resources and build them. ... the would could make power day and night ... 🙂
Der kasten sieht aus wie ne microwelle
Das dachte ich auch schon. Is fuer Bier aufwaermen😅
🐸🐸🐸
Berlin in da house!🙋♂️
And how will the heat from the components escape the cabinet if you close all vent holes? ^^
There is no heat.
Does anyone know if I can fit a 200a bms to a SOK 48V battery , just so it can cope with start up loads
Hey andy, i have the same Fuse holders for my Campervan build.
Just today i found out even there is no Fuse in the Fuse Slot, there ist still Voltage on the Terminal.
From my 13.8Volt input to the Fuse holder there ist some 12.2 Volts on the Terminal.
I think it has something to do with the LED wich lights up when the fuse is blown.
Anyhow it seems strange to me.
Maybe you can check it on yours or someone can explain the cause.
Thanks for your Work!
I can only measure a voltage if there is no load connected. As soon as something is connected, voltage is gone.
Thank you for checking. After some more research its almost definetly the LED and its Resistor wich is parralel to the Fuse so this should be normal!
I read Weihenstephan is closing down! After literally thousands of years of brewing beer! Did you rate it or do you still prefer Oettinger, I found Weihenstephan a bit fruity!
Don't know, I'm not much of a beer professional. Some taste better than others but that is very subjective.
Put the back plate on the outside?
Outside you mean outside of the garage? NOOOOOO.
Why you trying to stop the ventilation in the box
Dust and insects!
Why do you want to block the holes, you need all the air possible for all these components, specially the power supply the nuc also wifi hotspot don't work inside metal box 😅
Dust and insects.
@@OffGridGarageAustralia you need a filter for that 😉
is this another video that's private just for subs?
Yes!
Selfmaking Adapters for Computers, i Think is not a good idea.. 12v car suplies are to buy..ore better you take the Power from grid.
There is no grid in this cabinet.
Don't understand why you're blocking all the ventilation in that. I'd mount the power supplies to the underside and toss your switch, NUC, and whatever else inside it, except for the AP--keep that outside.
Mean insects! 🐜 🕷️ 🇦🇺
your audio is clipping often
Wind reduction feature was on and causing that.
@@OffGridGarageAustralia gotcha, just letting you know. I like your content a lot. Couldn't watch this one because I don't want to damage speakers with a clipped signal
Ah... The POE+ network switch needs more around 54V, not 48V. 48V will .... mmm... barely work as long as the POE+ cables aren't too long, but it isn't ideal. The POE+ spec theoretically allows down to 42.5V after all the voltage drops but I've seen equipment get unhappy with a 48.0V power supply input. Remember that POE+ CAT cabling is very thin even though 4 wires are ganged for plus and four four minus, so the voltage drop can be considerable. You can squeak by if the POE+ ethernet cabling is short... even so, 48.0V on the DC input is too low.
Generally speaking if you have a 48V LiFepO4 battery system to work from, you can just route the battery voltage straight to the POE+ DC input (this is what I do). No conversions needed at all == near 100% efficiency. The battery voltage range of roughly 48.0V to 56.8V is within the POE+ specification. As long as the system voltage doesn't exceed 57V, the equipment will be fine with it.
Also, boost converters are not very efficient, particularly going from 12V to 48V. You always want to buck-down from a higher voltage. Never boost up unless you have no other alternatives.
--
One other thing to consider as the system sophistication increases is to have satellite "buffer" (aka UPS) batteries on critical equipment. The network is critical equipment... it sucks when something breaks and you don't have the convenience of your network through which to diagnose the problem quickly.
This is dead simple going from a higher voltage to a lower voltage, one can just use a Victron 75/15 with a fuse on the "solar" side to "buck down" to the lower-voltage buffer battery. Another method I use is to simply buy a POE+ splitter with a USB-C output then run a 19V USB-C-to-DC cable over to the Victron 75/15. The USB-C output is already current-limited and short-protected so no additional fusing is required. Usually good for 2A @ 12.8V (< 30W) trickle charging of the 12.8V satellite battery.
For same-voltage buffers, such as 48V-to-48V, A DC-to-DC charger such as Victron's Orion series is typically the solution. Usually a low amperage. 48V satellite battery as a UPS? Yes! Something like a 25Ah Lithova is perfect for that sort of thing.
In anycase, satellite battery buffering is an issue you need to strongly consider now for system robustness.
-Matt
Very useful info. Thanks Matt
48V works perfectly. Got it running for two days now.😉