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Please Stop Making U Notch Sights
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- Опубліковано 24 бер 2023
- Mossberg MC2C vid
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Today on things that dont work we are going to be covering why manufacturers should stop making U notch sights. A set of concealed carry sights needs to be fast and accurate. U notch sights do neither well.
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This video was Demonetized. If you dislike U notch sights as much as I do, please consider giving it a share
Of course
Maybe YT is a fan of U-notch sights?
I think maybe the word you were looking for was radiused as apposed to chamfered. I do agree with your whole line of thinking though.
@@ConstitutionalPatriot I was having a pretty low IQ day
UA-cam secretly loves U-notch sights?
U notch sights are really called 1/2 rings or 1/2 peeps. Also known as open top peeps. You are right. It is a matter of preference by the shooter and these sights have been around since the 1800s and are wonderful. STOP being that person that tells the gun industry your personal preferences to change a gun makers vision for the weapon they designed. If you do not like that sight picture buy something you do like. That is what is great about personal preferences. This is how forward eject charging handles and other dumb things get put on guns. By people who put personal preferences over the designers idea for the weapon. U notch sights work pretty well and are fast acquisition sights that also work well for carry weapons because it eliminates sharp edges that in some carry situations can hurt the guy wearing the gun. So they are on guns today because they are more comfortable to carry in a waistband and with practice they work extremely well with training like any other sights. They eliminate torquing of the wrist on trigger pull and are designed to be much more precise than square to post sights. While in truth they do cover the target and it takes a lot of knowledge to know how to use them so you are not blocking your target with the sights instead of aiming with them. I think if you talked to someone who is good with these sights they could teach you how to use them so you like them better. The biggest trouble with people is they get used to one way of doing things and change is hard for them. When in truth we should get good with all types of weapon sights so if we ever get into a situation where we are scavenging weapons we can be proficient in all types of sights and shooting implements.
bull poopy sir! I love the "U" notch rear sight, humans are different and not all things work the same for each of us. The story is, train with what you have, then train again and again. Rinse and repeat! You can learn to shoot anything well. "Beware the man that owns only one gun, he can probably shoot it very well" Peace and Grace.
I personally shoot better with them. My eyes pick up the U faster and that’s the most important thing when it comes to self-defense. If you can’t hit what your arming at your screwed. I prefer a dot over both but if I’m running irons I would prefer a U over a circle for my rear
I’ve used a bunch of different styles of sights. Though this explanation sounds scientific, I haven’t experienced any issues with U-notch sights.
I love U notch sights on the Hellcat and XD's.
I have several Hellcat's, all have the U sights. I consider them excellent. Very easy and fast to sight on target.
I actually like the U notch sights. I understand they aren't precise, but man they are easy to find. To each their own I suppose
Coming from someone who shoots 100yd A-zone with iron sights, the U-notch isn't any worse for accuracy and is faster for acquisition. I prefer square notch but there's nothing wrong with U-notch or ghost ring rear sights. V-notch sights like XS Big Dots suck though.
Evolution, see a circle look for the nipple
Makes sense
I love U dot sights
Best sights made are trijicon HD with the U notch
Salmon 🍣
@@VSO_Gun_Channel not sure what fish have to do with it
@@bama2579 Salmon 🍣
@@Ranstone 🥩
I like the u notch sights on my 43x they work well for me I will say they aren’t for “precision shooting” which we should all know this already they are defensive sights for close range
That’s a very interesting take on sights. For some reason I shoot my Hellcat surprisingly well. So much so that I’m trying to find the exact same rear sight for a few of my other handguns. Prior to the Hellcat, I preferred a blacked out rear sight with a high viz front sight. It would be great to have a side by side with the same gun with different sight set ups to truly see what works best for you. Great Video!
I agree. I shot my friends hellcat, and ever since I've been trying to find u sights for my g48, I would for my p365xl, but it has tritium. I really don't want to loose that
@@jasonr8916 The perfect set-up for me would be my 365 XL with the Hellcat sights. I love them, and my eye picks them up so much faster and easier...
I had a set of u notch night fision sights on my glock 34. Ended up going back to the glock factory sights. The front sight from night fision was nice but I hated the u notch
Sights* btw
I really like good unotched sights better than most other sights
I have the u notch sights on my Springfield XDM Elite, and they are fantastic. I can get a good sight picture without wearing my glasses. With my CZ75 that has 3 dot sights, I can't. I am going to replace the CZ 75 sights with a u notch set.
I changed the stock garbage sights on my G34 to some GL Hackathorns. They're obviously much higher quality and the tritium is nice, but my groups have gotten much bigger and I'm not hitting as close to the bullseye anymore. Seems like U notch sights work really well for me, I might buy after market U notch's in the future.
I appreciate the scientific explanation. I have trouble with my Hellcat sights, especially with bifocals.
I only like the blacked out U notch
49 yo with an astigmatism and i wear mono-vision contacts and glasses for my everyday needs and I wear distance lenses when shooting EZ V archery sights. The mono vision lenses allow me to still pickup my front sight but also remain target focused. I carry a P10C and I have tested big dots and Dawson precision in both square and U notch. I am much faster and more accurate with irons with the U notch sights out to 25 yards.
I also personally cannot stand U notch sights. But I'm glad the option exists for those who (for some reason) like them.
As you pointed out, the human eye/brain naturally centers/aligns things in its environment. Traditional “square notch” sights use the vertical and horizontal lines of the front blade and rear buckhorns to achieve this. A “U-notch” done well would simply deepen and round out the bottom of the rear buckhorn keeping the straight side walls and flat tops in tact to allow for quicker acquisition of the front sight post.
“Big Dot” sights are fast but also imprecise. If all you’re going for is the fastest possible center of mass hits at 7 yards or less, “big dots” are probably just fine. However, if you need to make precise hits (hostage situation, ranges beyond 25 yards, etc.), I think you’ll find traditional “square notch” sights offer the best results.
I love U notch sights with practice you can become very accurate at 20 yards.I put a hole dead center in a Pepsi can at a bit over 35 yards with a 2nd gen G17 first shot.U notch will always be my favorite.
I love stock glock rear sights. Fiber optic front sight stock glock rear sight is the best for me. I also like blacked out rear high vis front. Maybe I'm weird, but the drop in the bucket method with the glock rear sight works for me best, lol thanks DWAI.
I have that same set up on some of my GLOCK's which I like.
I've never heard this explanation before, good stuff. I have a set of u notch sights. It may just be my perception or preference, but it seems like when I line the front dot up with the bottom of the u, the top of the front and rear sights also seem to be lined up. Could this just be attributed to the individual pistol model and my arm length, etc?
I think you meant fillet instead of chamfer. Fillets are round and chamfers are flat angled faces. You seem like the type of person who might care. Love your videos. Keep up the great work.
I use an optic.
🤙
This is the way
The udot sight is wonderful for us who need reading glasses. I wish I could buy them for all my pistols.
Some notes, as I think out loud.
-Sights having the rear air match the front sight has nothing to do with quality. If they match, there will always be air due to perspective. If you want minimal air, the front sight needs to be _larger_ the longer your slide.
-There is no geometric correlation to a half circle, and it being larger than the front sight walls. Just make it smaller.
-If you're naturally seeking the center of the rear sight's half circle, just make the sights so the front sight is supposed to line up there.
Still, really good food for thought, Imma probably catch my self mulling over this while daydreaming for the next few weeks. Thanks man!
P.S. I run a stock Walther PPQM2 in .45. You've never seen excessive air till you run those OEM sights. X'D
I actually naturally focus on the target and both sights virtually simultaneously. Obviously, my eyes can't focus on three different points at the exact same time, but they switch back and forth quickly enough that I can't tell. I do quite like the U-notch sights I've checked out, specifically the Hellcat sights. I found them exceptionally easy to align and, though I'm not a fan of that particular gun after having shot it, I would love to have a set of them on other guns. Your point about automatically aligning the circle on the front sight with the rounded part of the rear notch is only a valid concern if the circle was placed wrong on the front sight. If it was put in the right spot, the top of the sights should be level when the circle is in the bottom of the notch. One benefit that I see to U-notch sights over square notch sights is that your horizontal alignment is less likely to be off with them. The two radii naturally line up as you bring them together. It is very easy to skew a rectangular post to one side of a rectangular notch. Then you have to fish back and forth to get it even.
I think the problem is there are a lot of different U notch sights out there, some are designed poorly, I think the ones Curtis are using are designed poorly; the notch is too deep so when the front dot is aligned with the u notch the tops of the front and rear aren't aligned.
@fattigla Idk...he showed a set of Hellcat sights and in the text called them a "POS", yet I think the Springfield XDS and Hellcat u-notch sights are some of the best examples of u-notch sights out there. The way he described it amost sounds like he might prefer a deeper u-notch. I personally LOVE u-notch sights regulated for a center hold. My first experience with them was on the Springfield XDS mod.2 and I've replicated them on other guns. I prefer a blacked out serrated rear with a tritium front. I always try to maintain target focus and my eye is drawn to the light coming over the top of the front sight naturally, which creates the right vertical alignment for a center hold and the u-notch then tends to naturally line up horizontally faster than other sights for me. Sight picture preference is SO subjective.
U dot sights are actually really good 😂
I've only ever fired one pistol with u-notch sites (buddy's g19) and didn't like it. At the time I figured I just wasn't used to it.
Interesting point on the express style sights. I own a old Charles Daily High Power clone equipped with them. I wish my j frames and my snubby K frames were so equipped.
I can use them but I don't hard rear sight focus
When I Practice Sight Alignment; I Look Through The Middle Of The Rear Sight And Focus On The Front Sight.
2 Of My Handguns Have Blacked Rear Sights And Tritium Front Sights.
1 Of The 2 Pistols Have An Ameriglo Notch Serrated Rear Sight (GL-414) And A Truglo Front Tritium Sight; It Originally Had A Rear Truglo Tritium Sight But It Didn't Allow Me To Rack The Slide Off My Belt.
The Other Pistol Has An Ameriglo UC Sight Set (GL-353).
Just like you said "I have a problem with U notch sights" as it is like you said a personal preference. Im am LEO and I happen to choose Hellcats sight system over any and all other iron type sights unfortunately you cant find alot of those for other guns. In my experences i can qualify expert every time with with my hellcat, I guess its what you get use to as i have trained with glock standard sights forever and its notch square sight is similar to the U sight.
Trijicon says their HD line with U notch rear is one of their best selling sights for hand guns.
I like them than the square knotch ones especially with a painted edge like the Glock ones, I can't shoot accurately with those. They just dont naturaly line up with the front dot for me. U notch with painted U does do the "find the center of the circle" thing even with only half a circle. But I use red dots when I can. With irons if accuracy is more important than speed I like 3 dots but with smaller and subdue rear dots. Like with just the tritium inserts and nothing else. I've only used squre knotch ones, I don't notice or focus on the edge of the notch with 3 dots, since I'm just lining up the dots, and I don't know if a U notch would make it better or worse.
I have a problem with eye dominance created by my lasik surgery in 2002. My left eye is stronger on distance. This site puts be back on plane and my left I doesn’t pick it up.
I’m switching all my concealed carry arms to this sight.
I see absolutely no difference when shooting U, V, or □ notch sights. But then I shoot with the front sight with 15 yards, and they all line up the same beyond that.
Strangely the Soviet shooters liked to use a U notch blade on their free pistol rear sight. Couldn’t tell you why. There isn’t any shooting harder than Men’s 50 Meter Pistol. It is nothing but humbling at every turn. On the other hand everyone has their favorite flavor!
I have a Hellcat RDP I carry with a U notch which I really liked until I saw this video. It shoots accurately for me so I'm not going to mess with it at this point.
I have been shooting XS Sights back when they were Ashley Express Sights and have tried the U Notch and like them pretty well but that’s the great thing about America it’s freedom and having plenty of choices.
I'm not a fan of U notch rear sights because they quite often have no illumination, or if they do have some tritium vials they're oddly small and are often not visible unless somewhere so dark you can't even see what it is you're shooting at. I think serious defense use iron sights should have some kind of easy to see illumination not just on the front but also on the rear sight.
When you said chasm, it made me think of Beavis and Butthead.
So i switched out my stock sights on my RIA 1911 for truglo tritium pro sights and i hit a massive learning curve with those because of the U notch rear sight. Like within 7 yards i can punch a fist size hole but the second i hit yard 10 or more things start to get weird. But i am noticing myself getting better with them. From what i can see U notch sites are combat sites that try to imitate competition sights but are still at the end of the day combat sights. Like theyre great for close to mid range but than get more difficult to use at longer distance.
Old shit works better, that is ok to say. The Ma Deuce and M16, and M1911 would agree, as well as the old M203. fuck the M320, its heavy, its awkward, give me a 203 any day.
Shouldn't your position be that It's better to have a front sight post that fills most of gap in rear sight, ie 3 dot night sight, than to have a bunch of extra space on each side of front post, ie Fiber Optic target sights?
I only ask because it doesn't seem to matter if gap is square or u-notch as long as gap is same width?
U notch rear....Center front post, line up tops..... Pull twigga
I wish I was good enough to even judge how well different sights work. If I can line something up with something and the target is on the other side, I feel pretty satisfied.
I do appreciate your explanation though. Did YT state why it was demonetized?
I’ve tried a bunch of different sight types and pretty much settled on blacked out rear sight with a fiber optic front - fastest, most precise, and the most visible.
I don't have a problem with them. I have a Hellcat. I liked the sights. Now I put a Red Dot on it because I am older than dirt. My only gripe with it. The Tritium on the front is so bright it is distracting shooting with my PVS14. The first time I was aware of that type of sight was on The Larry Vickers Glock 19. When I was young with 20/20 vision I believe I could have performed well with said sights. I have a buddy that is out in Vegas taking a Carbine Pistol class. He gave me a report last night. 15 students in the class, 13 of them running red dots on their pistols. So, I think that is becoming the standard. What are your thoughts on that? Do you carry a pistol with a dot as your EDC?
I tend to shoot similarly with all of these sights even though I prefer a standard 3 dot setup. Seem to be a bit slower with U notch types though.
I actually love these sights. My EDC is a Hellcat Pro. It's the most accurate 9mm I've shot to date.
I have the XS big dot sights on my woods pistol for the reason you mentioned. Nevertheless, my favorite sights are either a blacked out U notch rear and tritium front (10-8 makes a good set), or the trijicon XD sights (but not the XRs that have too thin of a front blade for me).
I hate anything with white on the rear, especially the stock glock goalposts.
Then again, I tend to target-focus with iron sights unless I remember to shift to a clear front sight, so I guess that's what my thoughts are worth on this topic.
your reasoning for your dislike regarding the width of the rear site is counter intuitive when compared to your preference for the XS Big Dot which has an infinite width. I prefer a wider blacked out rear sight window with an easy to find but narrow front sight post.
What about the trapezoid sights on the steyr pistols?
I appreciate you for making this video. I agree with you. I’m a new gun owner and my first gun, a G45. Came with ameriglo night sights Hs3 installed.
I didn’t realize, until after l looked at the receipt and paid for it.
But l thought hey cool, upgraded sights. The G 45 that l qualified with for my CC certification had stock sights.
I finally start training with my gun, and shots are going everywhere but where l want them to go.
Mostly low and to the left. But no bullseyes.
Obviously shooter error is at play right, I’m jerking the gun down etc….. anticipating recoil….poor trigger discipline….not pulling until l hit the wall, then break the shot……etc.
But my OCD just looking at the sights, one feel like they don’t don’t appear to be exactly straight. looking down at the channel from the top of the slide just eyeballing.
One side appears, slightly larger than the other. Has more metal on right side than the left.
I’ve tried to measure this with calipers. To confirm but the ones l have are similar to yours and seem to big to get the tips inside.
And not long enough to touch the outside of the slide, to get accurate readings.
The ameriglo night sights also have three dots. The rear dots are smaller than the large front sight. And l also wondered if this was throwing me off to get a level sight picture.
So l put black masking tape over them to black out the rear to soley focus on the front sight.
My shots are getting closer to being on target now, but still not consistent tighter groupings.
But suffice it to say l really hate U notch sights. I rented a stock G43x with the plastic stock sights.
And other than it bring smaller and a bit snappier, l got on target consistently.
I’ve heard and read of all of the supposed advantages of U notch sights to get on target quicker.
I think it’s BS.
For all of the reasons you mentioned and with my own personal experience.
I’m going to change out these sights as soon as possible, withe square notch sights or something different.
As you’re the first person that l randomly found to articulate a valid point as to why they’re terrible.
Some may be able to make them work. I’ve shot them on a Hellcat with no issues.
But on my Glock they do not work well at all for me.
I do believe they could be misaligned slightly from from the factory. As you can always have sights the might be slightly crooked which l think might be my issue, and the rear sight my need to come over to the right a hair or two.
But being 700 rounds in, on this gun, l do not like U notch sights, or chunky front sights.
Great explanation. Thank you.
You answered your question at the end of the video with your statement at the beginning. They make U notch sights because some folks like them better. Period.
Great explanation on why you don't though. Great quality video! Keep doing the damn thing!
I think I got what you're saying. I was impressed with the U-notch the first time I used it but I gravitated back to a traditional. It's easy to track (speed) but it lacks the a consistent marksmanship value for me per your explanation. If its speed, that's what I have red dot and proper presentation for.
The sights I have the most issues with is the express style which is what the xs big dot is. My brain tries to put the front sight higher than it needs to be, have a similar issue with Buckhorn sights.
best pistol iron is the Steyr triangle sight on the M9. takes a hot minute to get used to but at this point those are the fastest sight i have compared to my other pistol. Been shooting glock/m&p for years before getting the Steyr
Lol, thank you very much. I also hate U-Notch sights. It’s one of the main reasons I went with the P365 lineup instead of the Springfield Hellcats.
Funny enough, I do like “dot the i” sights a great deal and full on ghost ring sights too.
I have limited experience using irons, bc I bought a red dot before I even got my first firearm. ...I do kinda like fiber optics though!
I suppose the video can be boiled down to this; U-notch sights are a good concept that is, for reasons unknown, astoundingly difficult to execute well.
There is a specific place that the radius cut needs to be in order to work, that placement is critical in where the reference for the front sight should be for proper sight alignment, and the height of the straight walls of the sights need to make it a U-notch instead of just a semicircle.
If you don't want your u Notch sights let me have them
In depth explanation…. Not my experience at all.
I had a 1911 with the bid dot front sight and it was awkward if not slower after years of sight alignment practice. U notch sight might very well cause you to aim a bit lower, made total sense, but at handgun or defensive distances does that matter in the slightest??
U notch sights seem to have a wider field of view or I’ve been custom ordering rears with wider notches for “defensive” pistols. Hunting or target I like them (rears) on the narrow side.
Love my XS Big Dots, in fact I've got some of the original Ashley Outdoor express sights before they became XS Sights. Have the factory U notch on the Hellcat, doesn't seem to bother me, but I do prefer the Big Dot. Also use the Big Dot front with the older Rob Pincus I.C.E. rear claw sight with wide notch on a couple of Glocks and seems to work fine.
Vso gun channel has just turned into this guy complaining about things that don’t matter 😂.
Either U like them, or U don't.
Excellent video👍
"besides the obligatory skepticism of anything that comes out of the competitive circuit..." Saying this proves that you dont care for innovation and actual performance of shooting, as competition breeds innovation, not blatant skeptics on the internet, especially with shooting, if you suck, you suck.
Science is skepticism. Some good things have come out of the CS discipline. A great deal of the things the gun games come up with are cancer though.
I agree the big dot style of sights are better. I disagree that all U notch sights are garbage though. I think its a matter of quality. Poorly made triple dot sights don't work well either.
I personally don’t like u notch sights despite the controversy in the comments. Right angles lineup better for me
Me too
I don’t like them for my Glock, l think my eyes prefers the square sights, l’ve shot a hellcat without issues.
But my Glock, I’m horrible with them at the moment.
I use X/S night tritium optic height sights on my M&P 2.0 4.625 inch 10mm no safety lever semi-auto pistol. No better sight for my needs.
I had XS big dot sights on a glock shooting for my ccw qualifications. I was shooting from indoors to an outdoor target on a sunny day. I saw a v for the rear and a rounded off silhouette of the front sight. It was the worst front sight picture I've ever had.
Your hoodie has lots of fuzzies … 👍🏼🥃🇺🇸
Can someone recommend just a rear tritium sight for the Hellcat? I like the front, but hate the U rear.
U-notch sights can be done in a way that isn't terrible. I've got a Hellcat Pro, and I've rented a Hellcat. In both of those models, when the tritium dot on the front sight is centered in the cup of the U as you described, the top of the front sight is also aligned with the top of the rear sight.
That said - I still hate it, and would rather have a set of traditional squared off 3 dot night sights. I don't have a *reason* for hating it. Other than perhaps the simple fact that it is different from literally every other pistol that I own. But I suppose that's reason enough.
I'm old. Peep sights are natural and even if a tiny bit fuzzy with my eyesight my brain finds the middle of the circle very easily. I wish there was a snag-free version for pistols. I carry a Glock and other guns with U sights, but I usually shoot low a bit unless I think about lining up the front sight -- time I don't want to spend in a defensive situation. So I swapped out the couple guns I use for EDC with tritium three dot and I'm faster and closer to where I want to shoot with that system. I admit I've never seen that "Big Dangerous Game" rear sight before on a pistol. Interesting and I may have to buy it to try it out. I appreciate the thoughtful content on aspects of the shooting sports few other youtube creators cover.
Having shot all manner of funky and traditional sights I've always shot best with trijicon HDs.
There is no way to improve a white front dot and a blacked out rear square notch. Maybe a tritium or a fiber optic front, but there is no better sight system. You have to go to a red dot sight, but that introduces positives and negatives
Even out to 25 yards, you barely have to do more than make sure the dot is centered from side to side, at most level the top. I don't understand why 3 dots or rear white half circles and half rectangles exist. Even in darker conditions I only have to pick up the front sight and I should be using a light anyway .
THANK YOU!! U notch is stupid.
The only U notch sights I have seen that I like is from Night Fision and that's it.
Thank you.
Don't confuse banging 8" or 10" steel plates at 3-7 yards with putting bullets through the same hole on paper at 10 - 25+ yards. You lose all your pinpoint precision with a U notch rear sight but they are faster at close range on large targets. It's funny listening to guys shooting those 8" or 10" steel plates or B27 silhouette targets chiming in their .2 cents on the matter. Until you are shooting golf balls and nailing them at 15+ yards OFFHAND you aren't good enough to be able to notice any difference. That's the problem with this new wave of shooters who infiltrated us within the last 3 to 10 years. They know everything about everything.....even more than those of us doing this 40 -50+ years.
I can't stand u notch sights. 3 dot night sights for the win
Confirming my opinion about the “safari” sights… and just checked my hellcat… yeah I get it now
Thank you, sorry you went traitor pistol
@@VSO_Gun_Channel I forgot about that… 😬
All my guns get u notch sights after I got my hellcat pro and echelon I will never use anything else I shoot better with them I like them far better.
Spot on.
I shoot way better with the "U" rear sight-both with pistols like Glock and SA and also rifles like Mosins and AKs. I absolutely hate the peep sights-can't use them as well as open U sights. Also, with the gift of astigmatism, I can't use most red dots-just the Holosun Holographic.. If only the gun manufacturers offered sight options like the auto manufacturers offering engine choices!
This is a aesthetic opinion, backed up by invented ergonomic and human factors.
U notch rear sights? Square notch rear sights? How about star shaped rear sights? I say, how about no sights, learn your natural point of aim down the top of the slide and let the lead fly! Just kidding! Try them both and see which you like better and go with it. I’ve shot both and I find myself doing fine with either because I pretty much ignore the bottom of the notch anyway and just look at “equal light” on the sides compared with the front sight and making sure the top of the sights are lined up when shooting for fine accuracy. Basically I just look through the rear sight anyway and use the front sight. YMMV. Now, let!s talk about narrow front sights vs wider front sights. I’m sure they’re are a multitude of opinions on those too. Honestly, I think we sometimes overthink things.
This is shockingly wrong on many levels. Any sight can have larger light bars on either side of the front sight through the notch, it's irrelevant whether it's a u notch or square notch. it's generally accepted more "air" is faster, less air is more accurate.
The actual benefit of u notch sights is that the eyes are attracted to right angles, but eliminated right angles on the bottom of the notch, the eyes will be quicker to align the tops of the sights. PS nobody uses u notches in competition, but i can smell somebody who's bad at shooting by whether they compete or not.
I like the Big Dots.
Thanks for making this, I was looking at irons for my 1911 and was considering these till now
Yeah your opinion doesn't really matter
Yes
#vsonotificationsquad
*Inb4 Springfield gets triggered*