Upgraded my Caterpillar for the C2. For myself the choice was due to the larger cargo bay. Not in capacity as we know the Cat actually has slightly more SCU due to being able to load freight in the front loading module, but due to the fact it’s one large open space, rather than 4 separate smaller spaces separated by bulkheads. As a fright driver I believe that could be useful as the game progresses and more mechanics come in. While we already know it will allow us to easily transport ground ships, and there has been mention of small aurora size ships fitting. IF cig decides to allow bigger shaped cargo than the one size universal boxes we currently have, owing a ship with a completely open cargo area, will allow that owner to transport large and bulky cargo and obviously an easier time loading and unloading. The Cat is more flexible due to its modular design, but for myself that’s not a ability I current need. Don’t get me wrong, I absolutely adore the Caterpillar and it was a tough choice to loose her from the fleet, I just feel this would be the more useful ship for a pure freight operation.
It they had combat zones in SC, and had some missions route NPC Infantry and Tanks into those zones, for significant risk and reward, I could see the M2 being viable as a grinding or combat dropship. But right now, with very little combat drops outside of communities putting together their own senerios.
STL is one of the few that had put out my same thought process re: comparison with the current price of the BMM. The Herc, while a beautiful ship, really is a niche craft and I see a lot of orgs getting the A2's and the M2's. I can see some independent operators going for the C2's (As they're a bit more rugged than say the Cat), but yeah, more of a org ship.
I think the C2's main use for the individual is the idea that it can carry something like a 350r long distances, and also as a heavy cargo hauler that isn't quite as vulnerable as say the hull series. But more so than anything it's the ability to carry fairly large small ships around. (the use as a racing team support ship implies this role. - and if you can carry a racing ship that would imply the 350r would have to fit, and if that fits, then so does pretty much every small ship in the game.) I think given where my interests lie, leaving aside constantly switching which ship I'm using, the C2 seems the best fit for the majority of non-combat roles I have in mind. As long as the crew requirements for operating one aren't too excessive of course. I mean, I feel like getting a 600i, which is a similarly sized ship, but overall quite a bit less useful...
I've already seen it, but the C2 does work as a makeshift light carrier, and I really want to see an actual light Carrier outfit, slap a bunch of Achemedies Snub fighters in a small Runway that runs the length of the ship. Now for the actual herc, the M2 doesn't really offer enough, maybe once they get armor in, and the M2 gets an armor package, while the C2 does not.
The C2 looks like the perfect kinda general purpose hauler to me... Especially if, as the description implies it can be used by racing teams to carry racing ships. Considering what that implies, that suggests you can cram at least one 350r in there, and if you can do that, you can cram nearly any of the small ships in there, which makes this one of the more useful larger ships going. That it can carry a decent chunk of cargo is also convenient. I can see myself flying one of these fairly regularly, since as far as medium sized ships (this is the same size as a 600i if the stats don't change wildly) go this has pretty high utility except as a combat vessel. (by which I mean the C2 specifically) I'm not buying any more ships these days though. But when it becomes available ingame? Yeah, definitely...
I think the C2 is a good upgrade from the Caterpillar if you intend to do alot of cargo planetside beause of thr VTOL capabilities. But the caterpillar would be good for space and wr havent seen any modules for it yet. Another option is buy a Retaliator Base, this ship is awsome and you can through 2 cargo modules on it and it has bottom fscinf turrets that in the future can be slaved. Also there is nothing stopping Aegis from releasing a bomb module for the Tali what pretty much gets my recommendation because you can start at $150 and earn the rest in game and thats alot better value than Freelancer MAX or a Conni Taurus. My 2 cents worth
I believe that in one of the interview shows a dev did say the C2 did have more height in the cargo area than the military variants. So that is why it has more cargo.
Dude you help me relax so much, just turning your video on the TV and listening to your theories and analytics help my mind calm down so much. Thanks for all the great videos.
Seems like a niche ship like the prowler. If it turns out to be needed fairly often, I think it might be worth earning in game (especially at its cost). When you start to factor in how many people will be required to crew the tanks, jeeps, and infantry this thing carries, it seems like it would rarely be used outside of an org vs. org war. This isn't a cap ship, therefore I think 15+ people working together should be able to earn this ship fairly quickly if the need arises. Also, I am pretty sure the Eclipse / Harbinger is going to hard-counter this thing, especially considering most of its guns face down.
The low crew requirement on the c2 is why i upgraded from the star g. The looks too really like this ship. A2 is just not worth it. M2 is not really my style. I will change again if a better 2 man cargo runner is concepted. Great vid yet again and the series is great too.
Yeah I was thinking about getting the M2 but the turret underneath the cockpit has a dedicated seat as you have to switch seats to control it So there was point getting the M2, I when a head and bought the C2 instead.
I’d like to see racing teams using c2 as stated in the description. And a luxury transport ship like constellation phoenix for the crew with few escorts
The term is "Daisy Cutter" as it refers to the flowerlike image the ordnance engraves into the ground. Daisy Chain refers to the making of a ring or wreath of daisy flowers by splicing the stems. There is also an alternative definition of Daisy Chain, but you can look that up yourselves.
There are so many better ships at the A2's price range, like the Polaris capital ship and Hammerhead. I agree with you on the M2, it's not worth the price. The C2 is the best of the bunch and most appealing due to it's low crew requirements. I like your point about the Gemini and the base Starfarer too and it has me contemplating me changing this back. Excellent video.
I'm looking at the bang for the buck. C2 vs Valk for dropship. More and larger cargo. More room for troops to stand vs seated troops and smaller cargo. Figure it could tank the incoming fire due to its size even though its not a dedicated M2 or A2. Thoughts.
6:09 except the Gemini also brings a handful of S3 Missiles, Bigger top-turret guns (2x S5s vs the base SF's 2x S4), the better armor, and its green instead of the weirdly shiny faux-chrome livery the base has. Imo the Gemini is all-around better
Yea the rate of ship building and planet tech for that matter is just horrible. No way will this game be done this decade. We have a lot of ships to be built yet and then the star system map is just enormous. We are in the Stanton system and the size of the 3D map is just overwhelming. I wonder how long it took them to build the Reclaimer and how long a planet takes to build and populate. This games size is just to much for our current pc tech and economy.
So far as i know the plan of CIG is to release the Game with 5 up to 10 Star Systems and take the focus more on the gameplay mechanics. Then the will add other star systems in to the game after launch. If that's right I think beta for 2020/2021 and full release for 2022/2023 would be possible.
@@rinzler289 once SQ42 is complete all those coders, mappers etc.. can work on SC, also the maps they built for SQ42 will hopefully be accessable in SC. That coil place they show in the trailer with a full planet.
The only thing that I am going to miss from the Caterpillar is the role diversity. I WILL enjoy the ability to carry around multiple racing ships and ground vehicles. With the C2, I'll be able to rent out space for transporting racing vehicles and even small enough non-racing ships across the verse for other players. For instance, it looks like maybe two to three Razors will fit? Maybe four? The origin 100 series looks like it will fit. This could be a decent money maker aside from just running cargo. The design is so amazingly cool looking. The amenities they are talking about putting into is also quite interesting and neat.
I've got the Merchantman but I upgraded my Connie to the C2 because I was going to use it for cargo running and the Connie just disappointed in it's capacity. I didn't want something too big as I wanted to have landing options. I now find that anything Constellation size or bigger, needs an escort or long legs. Apart from the M2 and its niche, to me, guns on a large non military purpose ship is just added weight. I have a Starfarer Gemini and I agree with what you said as I've stated above, arming them and loosing cargo space is illogical. I got the Gemini before I realised this. I guess most of the ships from early access have evolved in their role and/or size and the Verse's lore changes. It's a bit of a honey trap as (at least) you can upgrade to a higher in price ship but then, something like the Star Runner comes along, being what the Connie should have been and you end up with another ship you didn't count on. (First world white man problem). The main reason I still have the Merchantman is because of the lore that has grown with the size of the ship. As you stated, it has a larger cargo capacity than the C2 but the Merchantman is no longer just a freighter. It grew in size because as well as having great cargo space, it had it's own market style shops where citizens can come in and buy strange individual items that you found/stole or discovered as well as what you have in bulk, with private offices where dodgy deals are privately made. It also was said to have certain smuggling tricks up its sleeve. In short, it's a shady alien shopping mall that they strapped rockets on too and made interstellar. This was a totally different game play unavailable to any other ship. I cannot see it being flight ready till almost full release of the game as it requires 'everything' to be functional. I've waited for this ship since it wasn't much bigger than a Connie and if they can pull this off, I'll happily wait even if she is the last one completed. I just got the Carrack for which I waited almost as long and I was not disappointed, so I have plenty to keep me busy. I'm now just waiting on the Polaris and the Merch. Good news lately that they're back on the Polaris's case but I must confess to my fellow Torpedo Captains out there, that I wish it was the Merch.
Idea: Space combat Engage VTOL mode and fly "up" then circle a target at max speed. All weapons have an angle on the target and you're much harder to hit
love the vid. very good info. only thing i'd say for the M2 over the C2 is the armor. yes, the additional turret on the nose, like you said, isn't really worth it. i'd say though the armor may be worth it if you want to fly cargo in more dangerous areas, even in space. would allow you to take an extra hit until you can get away but that's just speculation.
i love this ship and totally will get it, but i will get it ingame by earning it i guess, got a connie taurus as my cargo ship so it should be big enough to help me do much cargo so i can afford the C2 at some point :)
At one point CIG stated that (with type, category, and quality being equal) the output of most components usually increases by a factor of between 3 to 4 per size. Edit: Also, remote turret mechanics were added to the 3.2 update a couple weeks ago. So soon the Starfarer's cheek turrets will no longer be glorified gimbals. :)
I wish the M2 had the turrets from the A2, but the same cargo capacity it has now. What would be cool tho, is if the Titan Armor gets ODST-like capabilities, or some attachable thrusters, so they could be dropped out from the A2's bomb doors. So instead of the A2 having bombs, it is fitted with racks for 4 titan armors for repair and rearm. (look at Halo ODST drop or Section 8 for referance)
It may not be specific to this video, but I've just reviewed the CitizenCon 2016 gameplay and there the pilot gets notified, that the atmotsphere is not safe to maneuver around the distress beacon. But by now the developers have stated, that most vessels will have enough thrust to withstand gravity of most rocky planets on their own. This may be vtols for larger ships or maneuvering thrusters that turn to face downwards. With that in mind I wonder how the atmosphere can be unsafe to travel!? Unless there are very acid clouds or something you should, according to the statement above, be able to fly anywhere. I like the idea of limiting flight in some spots because it creates an interesting spot in war (only wheel or gravlev based vehicles) for recess and natural defense against bombers. So what else could hinder a pilot in its atmospheric flight? Did one of the developers elaborate the situation and circumstances?
Cool niche ship, the Herc. I hear you STLYoungblood about the Starfarer dilemma since I have the same feeling. I suppose real gameplay may change that. I don't know about getting the C2 vs the Cat since the Cat will be much more capable in protecting itself in space. I opted for the M2 since it's really a planet-side delivery ship and more than running cargo, I see myself delivering Tonks, troops or Cyclones as added ground support.
5 Ursa... how do they get a uneven number in a symetric ship with a symetric cargo hold? -.- someone must have calculated them parking sideways or so. Fixed weapons on a ship this size... lol... >_> The Turret placements are weird AF... if you look at it from the front, the smaller turrets to each side of the one under the cockpit are blocked from firing forward by a inconviniently placed bit of hull. As for the Cat: The cat has notably better Turret coverage IMO... and AFAIK the Cat's cargo is now more than shown, because it can now store Cargo in the nose, too. Another Ship worth comparing might be the Carrack: it's listed with 1000 SCU and with the 20% Upscale, it doesn't seem unlikely for it to take in a Nova. As for the BMM: It only has 3 remote Turrets, so 3+Pilot would theoretically suffice... but I agree, my "little" Merchantman has grown quite a bit. That said, I'm pretty sure in a pure "Gunship Battle" all 3 would win against the C2 and M2, with the BMM and Carrack likely beating the A2, since I can't see it being THAT nimble as to avoid fire and facing the opponent with the underside. The prices are ridiculous, tough. MAYBE the C2 if people have the old BMM CCU (= 260$), but IMO it only makes sense for people that actually want to transport Novas.
Coming in late with this comment, but... C2 is looking like the go to cargo carrier now for planet side lift because of the VTOL thrusters. Now we know VTOL capability is so important to ensure thrust duration planet-side, where does this place the Caterpillar? The C2 is the clear choice, purely based on cargo capacity and VTOL. What role is the caterpillar going to play now? Medium lift on low gravity moons? Drop me a reply if you have any thoughts.
SC concept purchases are slap in the face con job. They sell you an picture of a ship that they haven't even began to create. The ship you bought may not even be the ship they eventually make. Then in the mean time they produce any number of OTHER ships that no one asked for or prepaid for. It's the dumbest the agreement anyone could ever sign up for.
The only thing I see for this ship is that it would make a really good portable hangar that carriers smaller ships and as for the actual money cost it is absolutely insane and to try and earn it in game is also insane
Way too expensive for the A2, M2 is just too expensive. Only one that comes close to being worth the price is the C2. There's no reason that the Retaliator couldn't fit a version of those bomb setups.
I wonder what scale planetary battles will be, hundreds of infantry, dozens of tanks and cyclones moving around a battlefield fighting each other while some fighters/bombers fly overhead? That would be pretty cool.
glad the prices are high for all these new ships, means not everyone and their grandmother will have one on release, should be that way, lots of small fighters, decent amount of medium ships and few large ones...
Jedi_Drifter that's not even necessary, it's already possible to hit targets on the surface of the moons with a torpedo from space with a Retaliator (and most likely a Gladiator as well).
Areanyusernamesleft I'm fairly sure gravity assisted bombs will be cheaper. Also they said they will release large cluster bombs that can drop 30 size 3 bombs. Now for attacking a base thats not even in the same league as a torp
Areanyusernamesleft the difference is that if you can get a lock on something on the ground, something on the ground can get a lock on you. Having the ability to drop cluster munitions by flying map of the earth has value.
Jeffrey Bleam good argument, but what about target painting? That should be a thing at some point, right? But yeah on the other hands it seems kinda wasteful to fire torps at ground bases. If you wanted to clear the area from the AA guns the torps themselves would probably be shot down themselves by any PDS. That's probably where the gravity assisted bombs come in.
I like the C2, but yeah, unless the Org I join needs to move tanks, I'm not trading my BMM in for one. And that's assuming the BMM won't be able to land or have a big ramp to the cargo space. Which it might not be able to land, seeing as how massive its become, but I'm almost certain it will be able to, albeit slowly and carefully
I am new to SC and I recently got the cutlass black ship package and I have about 30 hours of play time so forgive me is this is a stupid question. Do remote turrets auto target enemy ships or does it just mean that a player is the turret through a computer screen?
Interesting how flat the bottom worked out compared to concept. Also miss the dark interior tones. Crusader interiors are light blaring enough. Even without the light of god in the back. Whatever that is.
I still think the caterpillar is the better looking ship but this is more of a large drop ship and I can see these being used just for that purpose as I don't see many other drop ships in the game that can carry heavy vehicles in to battle and out.
Seems like a great upgrade from a Starfarer, to be honest. The Starfarer was a little steep for what it was IMO and unless you really love huffing space fumes I don't see a good reason to own one of those over the C2.
B4 a turret is usable on that ship, 100 other ship would have been built after, meaning they rather spend their time on making new stuff than having items useful on a previous ship
Um no thanks... I'm just proud to be a basic backer of one cutlass. I'm poor and in no way could I justify this purchase.. I mean I spend a lot on games but I get something back.. I also dont think this game will officially come out for atleast a few years.. If you look at the full map of star systems and see that they only have one star system and its not even close to being done there is just no way this game will be out before my hair turns grey. Its like their building a universe and at the rate its going I mean no way will we see this before the next decade. Perhaps a too ambitious game for our current technology.
FYI, the current star system you're in will be completed by the end of the year, not to mention once they're released everything will come a lot quicker. Lol.
Brad B I half agree. I agree its still several year's out until full release. I figure 2-3 years minimum til beta and a 2+ more years until full release. Where I disagree is that star systems isn't what's holding things back. Star systems are easy to create. Most systems will be relatively empty and made for players to populate. That's why getting procedurally generated tech for random worlds is important and they already have that down. The few explicitly designed locations (cities space stations etc) are not as time consuming as creating the proper physics for play. Making a new ship is harder than making a new star system unless some new fancy thing is in that system.
Gizmo the Gecko there really is no reason to believe that things will come out quicker after release... it's not like the release is magically going to increase their dev team size or their work pace...
Fraydizs I think you're wrong. How many MMOs take a long time to develop and then have an expansion every 2 years after (*cough* World of Warcraft *cough*). Once the physics and major mechanics are in the rest is design and story building and a few system tweeks. WOW was announced in 2001 and released in 2004 so Blizzard probably started developing it as soon as Everquest was out. So likely 5 years to develop and about a year and a half to make each expansion. Things move much quicker when you have a base game.
yet they keep adding new ship model, while most of the "old' model not released.. and i believe they will add more ship ...alot...to get "more" money, and "more" excuse to delay the game... LOL
You didn't talk about range really, And that's a major factor at this price point in my opinion. You're not going to be heading out deep into space without support and not just from escort. These ships from what I understand has two bunks for crew. No kitchen, or living quarters so you can't stray far. Let alone speed of these ships compared to others. It's a very planet focused ship.
This ship makes me hope the BMM will be able to land on ground and have a ramp. I like the idea and role of being able to drop off tanks and vehicles and such, but this ship is about $100 too expensive, IMO, if not more, and the A2 is like twice the price it should be...
that's what i think about it. C2, yes, nice for normal trading and vehicle transport in save and neutral zones M2, yes, nice for normal trading and vehicle transport in neutral or maybe dangerous zones. A2, No.... nice weapons, but the bombs and less cargo aren't good for my usage.
I mean I fully expect at some point there will be a way to to earn currency to buy these in game instead of only real money. When that happens and star citizen has a sizable playerbase these ships have their roles.
anybody else feel like those bomb modules would work on a starfarer? looks like they mount a a very similar rail system as the fuel pods on a starfarer
I've been waiting for a ship to be a mobile garage for my Dragonfly, Nox, 85X, ARGO-Cargo and possibly, P-52. I doubt My Avenger (1st gen) and Cutlass (2nd gen) would fit and of course, cargo. ;-)
I'm sure of the smaller craft would easily fit but it's doubtful if I tried to include the Avenger (1st gen) and/or Cutlass (not the 2nd gen Avenger). If I had a better idea of the cargo bays scale, maybe just having the Avenger (1st gen or 2nd) and my Cutlass may fit together that would be kewl. How's this; have a P-52 behind the closed forward ramp (nose fwd) and either an Avenger (1st or 2nd gen) or Cutlass facing backwards behind the aft ramp, Oh... the Possibilities? ;-D
the second computer is most likely for more AI blades for the turrets......not avionics lol. I just want to know if we can gimbal the pilots fixed guns
I sadly agree with you regarding the limited versatility of the A2 - and therefore it's limited usefulness. The pity of it is, it's a great looking ship.
When the video shows the cargo bay, on the right side, close to the door there is a panel that says: "Crusader Industries Starlifter," it almost appears to me, that just inside that panel are components that seem to be the inner portion of the bomb bay module that is displayed throughout the video. . . Thoughts?
The only thing that I find remotely attractive of this line is the C2. I need something to haul my Nova and Ursa in. No way would I sell my Starfarer for it though. I can make an exponential amount of credits more with the Starfarer than just straight Space Trucking with the C2. Also have a Merchantman, wouldn't want to downgrade to the Hercules. Now what you said about the A2, I agree. If you want an In Your Face Combat Dropship, or a great CAS, then i am down with it. Yet for that money, I will take the Hammerhead for a CAS role. Hammerhead should also be sort of alright in space for stuff. LOL
Imo, the ship is very "role" specific. For me, it's heavy support for smuggling & ground assaults. But it will look damn pretty parked in Arc Corp!! o7
The price tag of A2 is making me think "CIG...... maybe go home? You might be drunk." Though if the bomb racks are to have a counterpart in the Retaliatior......
The one thing that makes this ship worth the money is the fact that it has remote turrets, so you can a AI to run your turrets so you can run the ship solo. For me, earn it in game.
Ok question is the C2 good ship to use that a small 5 man org can get since you can also put small ships as well as cargo in. Ps Why isnt people talking about what other small ships can be put in it?
Upgraded my Caterpillar for the C2. For myself the choice was due to the larger cargo bay. Not in capacity as we know the Cat actually has slightly more SCU due to being able to load freight in the front loading module, but due to the fact it’s one large open space, rather than 4 separate smaller spaces separated by bulkheads.
As a fright driver I believe that could be useful as the game progresses and more mechanics come in. While we already know it will allow us to easily transport ground ships, and there has been mention of small aurora size ships fitting. IF cig decides to allow bigger shaped cargo than the one size universal boxes we currently have, owing a ship with a completely open cargo area, will allow that owner to transport large and bulky cargo and obviously an easier time loading and unloading.
The Cat is more flexible due to its modular design, but for myself that’s not a ability I current need.
Don’t get me wrong, I absolutely adore the Caterpillar and it was a tough choice to loose her from the fleet, I just feel this would be the more useful ship for a pure freight operation.
It looks good... its price doesn't.
Lichachron Could not agree more
That can be said of every ship in this pay to win Alpha.
Yes, the price is... ritonculous.
because there are a handful of people who will pay literally whatever price they put on it.
you don't need this ship to have fun in the game. This is for orgs. It doesnt even make sense to fly this beast alone.
"fulfill your ac-130 fantasies"
LOL
I mean, lets be real. we all have those fantasies.
All they need now is similar angel of death flare pattern.
AC-130=A2 Death from above oh someone is going to so much having a bad bad day. LOL
Base Herc seems okay for its price. Not so much for the others. It's definitely a niche ship.
It they had combat zones in SC, and had some missions route NPC Infantry and Tanks into those zones, for significant risk and reward, I could see the M2 being viable as a grinding or combat dropship.
But right now, with very little combat drops outside of communities putting together their own senerios.
STL is one of the few that had put out my same thought process re: comparison with the current price of the BMM. The Herc, while a beautiful ship, really is a niche craft and I see a lot of orgs getting the A2's and the M2's. I can see some independent operators going for the C2's (As they're a bit more rugged than say the Cat), but yeah, more of a org ship.
I think the C2's main use for the individual is the idea that it can carry something like a 350r long distances, and also as a heavy cargo hauler that isn't quite as vulnerable as say the hull series.
But more so than anything it's the ability to carry fairly large small ships around.
(the use as a racing team support ship implies this role. - and if you can carry a racing ship that would imply the 350r would have to fit, and if that fits, then so does pretty much every small ship in the game.)
I think given where my interests lie, leaving aside constantly switching which ship I'm using, the C2 seems the best fit for the majority of non-combat roles I have in mind.
As long as the crew requirements for operating one aren't too excessive of course.
I mean, I feel like getting a 600i, which is a similarly sized ship, but overall quite a bit less useful...
I've already seen it, but the C2 does work as a makeshift light carrier, and I really want to see an actual light Carrier outfit, slap a bunch of Achemedies Snub fighters in a small Runway that runs the length of the ship.
Now for the actual herc, the M2 doesn't really offer enough, maybe once they get armor in, and the M2 gets an armor package, while the C2 does not.
The C2 looks like the perfect kinda general purpose hauler to me...
Especially if, as the description implies it can be used by racing teams to carry racing ships.
Considering what that implies, that suggests you can cram at least one 350r in there, and if you can do that, you can cram nearly any of the small ships in there, which makes this one of the more useful larger ships going.
That it can carry a decent chunk of cargo is also convenient.
I can see myself flying one of these fairly regularly, since as far as medium sized ships (this is the same size as a 600i if the stats don't change wildly) go this has pretty high utility except as a combat vessel. (by which I mean the C2 specifically)
I'm not buying any more ships these days though.
But when it becomes available ingame? Yeah, definitely...
I think the C2 is a good upgrade from the Caterpillar if you intend to do alot of cargo planetside beause of thr VTOL capabilities. But the caterpillar would be good for space and wr havent seen any modules for it yet. Another option is buy a Retaliator Base, this ship is awsome and you can through 2 cargo modules on it and it has bottom fscinf turrets that in the future can be slaved. Also there is nothing stopping Aegis from releasing a bomb module for the Tali what pretty much gets my recommendation because you can start at $150 and earn the rest in game and thats alot better value than Freelancer MAX or a Conni Taurus. My 2 cents worth
I believe that in one of the interview shows a dev did say the C2 did have more height in the cargo area than the military variants. So that is why it has more cargo.
Dude you help me relax so much, just turning your video on the TV and listening to your theories and analytics help my mind calm down so much. Thanks for all the great videos.
C2 looks good for me as I want nearly solo ships that are large
I can't wait to see the will it fit videos for this when it comes out
Seems like a niche ship like the prowler. If it turns out to be needed fairly often, I think it might be worth earning in game (especially at its cost). When you start to factor in how many people will be required to crew the tanks, jeeps, and infantry this thing carries, it seems like it would rarely be used outside of an org vs. org war. This isn't a cap ship, therefore I think 15+ people working together should be able to earn this ship fairly quickly if the need arises.
Also, I am pretty sure the Eclipse / Harbinger is going to hard-counter this thing, especially considering most of its guns face down.
The low crew requirement on the c2 is why i upgraded from the star g.
The looks too really like this ship. A2 is just not worth it. M2 is not really my style.
I will change again if a better 2 man cargo runner is concepted. Great vid yet again and the series is great too.
Yeah I was thinking about getting the M2 but the turret underneath the cockpit has a dedicated seat as you have to switch seats to control it So there was point getting the M2, I when a head and bought the C2 instead.
It looks like a badass version of Thunderbird two
I’d like to see racing teams using c2 as stated in the description. And a luxury transport ship like constellation phoenix for the crew with few escorts
The term is "Daisy Cutter" as it refers to the flowerlike image the ordnance engraves into the ground. Daisy Chain refers to the making of a ring or wreath of daisy flowers by splicing the stems. There is also an alternative definition of Daisy Chain, but you can look that up yourselves.
Brand spanking new A2 is now part of my fleet
I couldn't decide.... so I got all 3
There are so many better ships at the A2's price range, like the Polaris capital ship and Hammerhead. I agree with you on the M2, it's not worth the price. The C2 is the best of the bunch and most appealing due to it's low crew requirements. I like your point about the Gemini and the base Starfarer too and it has me contemplating me changing this back. Excellent video.
I'm looking at the bang for the buck. C2 vs Valk for dropship. More and larger cargo. More room for troops to stand vs seated troops and smaller cargo. Figure it could tank the incoming fire due to its size even though its not a dedicated M2 or A2. Thoughts.
Reevaluating Hercules vs Cat vs Hull vs Merchantman during 2018 anniversary and this video is very helpful right now, thanks!
6:09 except the Gemini also brings a handful of S3 Missiles, Bigger top-turret guns (2x S5s vs the base SF's 2x S4), the better armor, and its green instead of the weirdly shiny faux-chrome livery the base has. Imo the Gemini is all-around better
I'm 2 years late but I love your presentation and logical thinking in these videos. Really help to make the decision
If I were to buy it I would use it as a armored car. Only transporting the best of the best material and in high quantity. Definitely interested
That the repaso i bought it.
I really hope they will post some news about the Polaris this year...
Yea the rate of ship building and planet tech for that matter is just horrible. No way will this game be done this decade. We have a lot of ships to be built yet and then the star system map is just enormous. We are in the Stanton system and the size of the 3D map is just overwhelming. I wonder how long it took them to build the Reclaimer and how long a planet takes to build and populate. This games size is just to much for our current pc tech and economy.
So far as i know the plan of CIG is to release the Game with 5 up to 10 Star Systems and take the focus more on the gameplay mechanics. Then the will add other star systems in to the game after launch. If that's right I think beta for 2020/2021 and full release for 2022/2023 would be possible.
@@rinzler289 once SQ42 is complete all those coders, mappers etc.. can work on SC, also the maps they built for SQ42 will hopefully be accessable in SC. That coil place they show in the trailer with a full planet.
....2yrs later, Polaris is still no where in sight :(
The only thing that I am going to miss from the Caterpillar is the role diversity. I WILL enjoy the ability to carry around multiple racing ships and ground vehicles. With the C2, I'll be able to rent out space for transporting racing vehicles and even small enough non-racing ships across the verse for other players. For instance, it looks like maybe two to three Razors will fit? Maybe four? The origin 100 series looks like it will fit. This could be a decent money maker aside from just running cargo.
The design is so amazingly cool looking. The amenities they are talking about putting into is also quite interesting and neat.
I've got the Merchantman but I upgraded my Connie to the C2 because I was going to use it for cargo running and the Connie just disappointed in it's capacity. I didn't want something too big as I wanted to have landing options. I now find that anything Constellation size or bigger, needs an escort or long legs. Apart from the M2 and its niche, to me, guns on a large non military purpose ship is just added weight. I have a Starfarer Gemini and I agree with what you said as I've stated above, arming them and loosing cargo space is illogical. I got the Gemini before I realised this. I guess most of the ships from early access have evolved in their role and/or size and the Verse's lore changes. It's a bit of a honey trap as (at least) you can upgrade to a higher in price ship but then, something like the Star Runner comes along, being what the Connie should have been and you end up with another ship you didn't count on. (First world white man problem). The main reason I still have the Merchantman is because of the lore that has grown with the size of the ship. As you stated, it has a larger cargo capacity than the C2 but the Merchantman is no longer just a freighter. It grew in size because as well as having great cargo space, it had it's own market style shops where citizens can come in and buy strange individual items that you found/stole or discovered as well as what you have in bulk, with private offices where dodgy deals are privately made. It also was said to have certain smuggling tricks up its sleeve. In short, it's a shady alien shopping mall that they strapped rockets on too and made interstellar. This was a totally different game play unavailable to any other ship. I cannot see it being flight ready till almost full release of the game as it requires 'everything' to be functional. I've waited for this ship since it wasn't much bigger than a Connie and if they can pull this off, I'll happily wait even if she is the last one completed. I just got the Carrack for which I waited almost as long and I was not disappointed, so I have plenty to keep me busy. I'm now just waiting on the Polaris and the Merch. Good news lately that they're back on the Polaris's case but I must confess to my fellow Torpedo Captains out there, that I wish it was the Merch.
Thanks for this vid, was a bit on the fence and it was useful to have another perspective!
Idea: Space combat
Engage VTOL mode and fly "up" then circle a target at max speed.
All weapons have an angle on the target and you're much harder to hit
I currently have the Hercules and the Merchantman. The BMM for city transport and the Hercules for planetary landing.
wow . and then?
dana tubos Make money. Being a Merchant of Death is my dream.
dude i have already 7 ships , i dont need to make money^^
but if u want i can defend ur transports, matey^^
should u buy? no at this price
love the vid. very good info. only thing i'd say for the M2 over the C2 is the armor. yes, the additional turret on the nose, like you said, isn't really worth it. i'd say though the armor may be worth it if you want to fly cargo in more dangerous areas, even in space. would allow you to take an extra hit until you can get away but that's just speculation.
i love this ship and totally will get it, but i will get it ingame by earning it i guess, got a connie taurus as my cargo ship so it should be big enough to help me do much cargo so i can afford the C2 at some point :)
Love the C-130 reference, youre the best youngblood.
At one point CIG stated that (with type, category, and quality being equal) the output of most components usually increases by a factor of between 3 to 4 per size.
Edit: Also, remote turret mechanics were added to the 3.2 update a couple weeks ago. So soon the Starfarer's cheek turrets will no longer be glorified gimbals. :)
the Tally's cargo modules add 40 SCU of cargo, that's less than a Cutlass.
It's so beautiful, i should sell the Carrack and buy it.
I wish the M2 had the turrets from the A2, but the same cargo capacity it has now.
What would be cool tho, is if the Titan Armor gets ODST-like capabilities, or some attachable thrusters, so they could be dropped out from the A2's bomb doors. So instead of the A2 having bombs, it is fitted with racks for 4 titan armors for repair and rearm.
(look at Halo ODST drop or Section 8 for referance)
It may not be specific to this video, but I've just reviewed the CitizenCon 2016 gameplay and there the pilot gets notified, that the atmotsphere is not safe to maneuver around the distress beacon. But by now the developers have stated, that most vessels will have enough thrust to withstand gravity of most rocky planets on their own. This may be vtols for larger ships or maneuvering thrusters that turn to face downwards.
With that in mind I wonder how the atmosphere can be unsafe to travel!? Unless there are very acid clouds or something you should, according to the statement above, be able to fly anywhere.
I like the idea of limiting flight in some spots because it creates an interesting spot in war (only wheel or gravlev based vehicles) for recess and natural defense against bombers. So what else could hinder a pilot in its atmospheric flight? Did one of the developers elaborate the situation and circumstances?
A2 it is.
"AC-130 ready for your mark, I repeat, AC-130 ready for your mark"
"Friendly AC-130 in the air!"
I like the ship but won't be getting one.
Cool niche ship, the Herc. I hear you STLYoungblood about the Starfarer dilemma since I have the same feeling. I suppose real gameplay may change that. I don't know about getting the C2 vs the Cat since the Cat will be much more capable in protecting itself in space. I opted for the M2 since it's really a planet-side delivery ship and more than running cargo, I see myself delivering Tonks, troops or Cyclones as added ground support.
5 Ursa... how do they get a uneven number in a symetric ship with a symetric cargo hold? -.- someone must have calculated them parking sideways or so.
Fixed weapons on a ship this size... lol... >_>
The Turret placements are weird AF... if you look at it from the front, the smaller turrets to each side of the one under the cockpit are blocked from firing forward by a inconviniently placed bit of hull.
As for the Cat: The cat has notably better Turret coverage IMO... and AFAIK the Cat's cargo is now more than shown, because it can now store Cargo in the nose, too.
Another Ship worth comparing might be the Carrack: it's listed with 1000 SCU and with the 20% Upscale, it doesn't seem unlikely for it to take in a Nova.
As for the BMM: It only has 3 remote Turrets, so 3+Pilot would theoretically suffice... but I agree, my "little" Merchantman has grown quite a bit.
That said, I'm pretty sure in a pure "Gunship Battle" all 3 would win against the C2 and M2, with the BMM and Carrack likely beating the A2, since I can't see it being THAT nimble as to avoid fire and facing the opponent with the underside.
The prices are ridiculous, tough. MAYBE the C2 if people have the old BMM CCU (= 260$), but IMO it only makes sense for people that actually want to transport Novas.
100% agree,!!!
A2 is military grade, so probably the second powerplant etc. perhaps helps...but are mainly redundant systems to keep it in combat longer.
Not to mention the C2 will be getting civilian or maybe industrial components, while the M2 will likely come stock with all military components.
It does look way cool when someone lands one of these at jump town and rolls a couple tanks out...
i hope they make a baby bear version $$$ id buy that
Coming in late with this comment, but... C2 is looking like the go to cargo carrier now for planet side lift because of the VTOL thrusters. Now we know VTOL capability is so important to ensure thrust duration planet-side, where does this place the Caterpillar? The C2 is the clear choice, purely based on cargo capacity and VTOL. What role is the caterpillar going to play now? Medium lift on low gravity moons? Drop me a reply if you have any thoughts.
why not simply adding wings on the tanks!
Can I please get my carrack and merchantman i bought 4 years ago?
It's been done iRL. It didn't work too well.
@Joseph Oxley I meant putting wings on tanks, as in this experiment: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonov_A-40
SC concept purchases are slap in the face con job. They sell you an picture of a ship that they haven't even began to create. The ship you bought may not even be the ship they eventually make. Then in the mean time they produce any number of OTHER ships that no one asked for or prepaid for. It's the dumbest the agreement anyone could ever sign up for.
The only thing I see for this ship is that it would make a really good portable hangar that carriers smaller ships and as for the actual money cost it is absolutely insane and to try and earn it in game is also insane
Way too expensive for the A2, M2 is just too expensive. Only one that comes close to being worth the price is the C2. There's no reason that the Retaliator couldn't fit a version of those bomb setups.
The Tali should get a front and back bay with 1 MOAB per bay or a cluster bomb setup
VideoNinjaJim and the gladiator and eclipse should be able to use the cluster bombs.
I agree, the bombers have very little use right now.
TheKingoftheriff the will release more bombers. And more AA guns to shoot down the bombers
If it was 200$ cheaper then yes. Right now? No
i agree. these prices are more than enough
I wonder what scale planetary battles will be, hundreds of infantry, dozens of tanks and cyclones moving around a battlefield fighting each other while some fighters/bombers fly overhead? That would be pretty cool.
glad the prices are high for all these new ships, means not everyone and their grandmother will have one on release, should be that way, lots of small fighters, decent amount of medium ships and few large ones...
The real question is can we pull a John and eva a morning star onto an enemy capital ship.
IMO I really think the forgotten Gladiator Bomber and the Retaliator Bomber, will be able to drop bombs .
Jedi_Drifter that's not even necessary, it's already possible to hit targets on the surface of the moons with a torpedo from space with a Retaliator (and most likely a Gladiator as well).
The flight model will change ... that is why they have introduced the Starlifter .
Areanyusernamesleft I'm fairly sure gravity assisted bombs will be cheaper. Also they said they will release large cluster bombs that can drop 30 size 3 bombs. Now for attacking a base thats not even in the same league as a torp
Areanyusernamesleft the difference is that if you can get a lock on something on the ground, something on the ground can get a lock on you. Having the ability to drop cluster munitions by flying map of the earth has value.
Jeffrey Bleam good argument, but what about target painting? That should be a thing at some point, right? But yeah on the other hands it seems kinda wasteful to fire torps at ground bases. If you wanted to clear the area from the AA guns the torps themselves would probably be shot down themselves by any PDS. That's probably where the gravity assisted bombs come in.
Unless you have a bunch of tanks you need to move I don't see any reason
@@fishy67chevelle there definitely will be at some point.
I like the C2, but yeah, unless the Org I join needs to move tanks, I'm not trading my BMM in for one. And that's assuming the BMM won't be able to land or have a big ramp to the cargo space.
Which it might not be able to land, seeing as how massive its become, but I'm almost certain it will be able to, albeit slowly and carefully
I am new to SC and I recently got the cutlass black ship package and I have about 30 hours of play time so forgive me is this is a stupid question. Do remote turrets auto target enemy ships or does it just mean that a player is the turret through a computer screen?
tab beene U still need a player/npc to kontroll the turret, but maybe it's easier to konvert them to automatic turrets.
okay thnx. I meant to type 3 hours play time. I don't know how that 0 got in there. 8-)
tab beene remote turrets can be set as auto turrets with a upgrade depending on amount of computers and size of them.
Interesting how flat the bottom worked out compared to concept. Also miss the dark interior tones. Crusader interiors are light blaring enough. Even without the light of god in the back. Whatever that is.
I still think the caterpillar is the better looking ship but this is more of a large drop ship and I can see these being used just for that purpose as I don't see many other drop ships in the game that can carry heavy vehicles in to battle and out.
Seems like a great upgrade from a Starfarer, to be honest. The Starfarer was a little steep for what it was IMO and unless you really love huffing space fumes I don't see a good reason to own one of those over the C2.
I'm not really interested in the bombing part, but I got both an A2 and an M2 to get personell on and off planet safely.
I want a ship about this size but not as fancy looking. Like Serenity.
I dont even play sc and Im excited for this ship. It just looks so fucking dope
B4 a turret is usable on that ship, 100 other ship would have been built after, meaning they rather spend their time on making new stuff than having items useful on a previous ship
I have 3 Tonk's so I can load up 2 on the M2 and the other on the IDRIS, and still have 2 fighter in the hanger.
Um no thanks... I'm just proud to be a basic backer of one cutlass. I'm poor and in no way could I justify this purchase.. I mean I spend a lot on games but I get something back.. I also dont think this game will officially come out for atleast a few years.. If you look at the full map of star systems and see that they only have one star system and its not even close to being done there is just no way this game will be out before my hair turns grey. Its like their building a universe and at the rate its going I mean no way will we see this before the next decade. Perhaps a too ambitious game for our current technology.
FYI, the current star system you're in will be completed by the end of the year, not to mention once they're released everything will come a lot quicker. Lol.
Brad B I half agree. I agree its still several year's out until full release. I figure 2-3 years minimum til beta and a 2+ more years until full release. Where I disagree is that star systems isn't what's holding things back. Star systems are easy to create. Most systems will be relatively empty and made for players to populate. That's why getting procedurally generated tech for random worlds is important and they already have that down. The few explicitly designed locations (cities space stations etc) are not as time consuming as creating the proper physics for play. Making a new ship is harder than making a new star system unless some new fancy thing is in that system.
Gizmo the Gecko there really is no reason to believe that things will come out quicker after release... it's not like the release is magically going to increase their dev team size or their work pace...
Fraydizs I think you're wrong. How many MMOs take a long time to develop and then have an expansion every 2 years after (*cough* World of Warcraft *cough*). Once the physics and major mechanics are in the rest is design and story building and a few system tweeks. WOW was announced in 2001 and released in 2004 so Blizzard probably started developing it as soon as Everquest was out. So likely 5 years to develop and about a year and a half to make each expansion. Things move much quicker when you have a base game.
yet they keep adding new ship model, while most of the "old' model not released.. and i believe they will add more ship ...alot...to get "more" money, and "more" excuse to delay the game... LOL
I am definitely going to upgrade to this, I think I accidentally got two freelancer Max's so I might jump one to one of these c2 ships.
I upgraded my Pirate Cat to the C2 pre purchase already and it was only another 60.00USD. In fact I just melted my Nomad and spent nothing.
Chuckled at the "AC 130 fantasy" ref :)
You didn't talk about range really, And that's a major factor at this price point in my opinion. You're not going to be heading out deep into space without support and not just from escort. These ships from what I understand has two bunks for crew. No kitchen, or living quarters so you can't stray far. Let alone speed of these ships compared to others. It's a very planet focused ship.
I wonder if the Retaliator will get the ability to drop bombs, or if it will remain a pure torpedo bomber.
For me it is too expensive honestly, but I like the looks and abilities of the ship!
This ship makes me hope the BMM will be able to land on ground and have a ramp. I like the idea and role of being able to drop off tanks and vehicles and such, but this ship is about $100 too expensive, IMO, if not more, and the A2 is like twice the price it should be...
that's what i think about it.
C2, yes, nice for normal trading and vehicle transport in save and neutral zones
M2, yes, nice for normal trading and vehicle transport in neutral or maybe dangerous zones.
A2, No.... nice weapons, but the bombs and less cargo aren't good for my usage.
I mean I fully expect at some point there will be a way to to earn currency to buy these in game instead of only real money. When that happens and star citizen has a sizable playerbase these ships have their roles.
anybody else feel like those bomb modules would work on a starfarer? looks like they mount a a very similar rail system as the fuel pods on a starfarer
I've been waiting for a ship to be a mobile garage for my Dragonfly, Nox, 85X, ARGO-Cargo and possibly, P-52. I doubt My Avenger (1st gen) and Cutlass (2nd gen) would fit and of course, cargo. ;-)
I'm sure of the smaller craft would easily fit but it's doubtful if I tried to include the Avenger (1st gen) and/or Cutlass (not the 2nd gen Avenger).
If I had a better idea of the cargo bays scale, maybe just having the Avenger (1st gen or 2nd) and my Cutlass may fit together that would be kewl.
How's this; have a P-52 behind the closed forward ramp (nose fwd) and either an Avenger (1st or 2nd gen) or Cutlass facing backwards behind the aft ramp, Oh... the Possibilities? ;-D
the second computer is most likely for more AI blades for the turrets......not avionics lol.
I just want to know if we can gimbal the pilots fixed guns
Thanks Youngblood!✌
I actually like this ship... With a gunship guarding it ... You drop a lot of troops on the ground.
I just hope my M2 can carry 2 tonks, because they have been really vague about it.
Looks like a B1, I’m in!
You think the M2 cost the 120$ for less cargo and more armor and just 1 turret more ? im thinking in wich i want the C2 or M2...
sadly i missed the concept sale. i want the C2 Hercules!
I sadly agree with you regarding the limited versatility of the A2 - and therefore it's limited usefulness. The pity of it is, it's a great looking ship.
When the video shows the cargo bay, on the right side, close to the door there is a panel that says: "Crusader Industries Starlifter," it almost appears to me, that just inside that panel are components that seem to be the inner portion of the bomb bay module that is displayed throughout the video. . . Thoughts?
Can you do a comparison with Hercules, Hammerhead and the Polaris.
CIG is making my in game purchasing more and more complicated. May have to be like Eve, and own one of everything I can fly ;)
where's the front landing gear?
The only thing that I find remotely attractive of this line is the C2. I need something to haul my Nova and Ursa in.
No way would I sell my Starfarer for it though. I can make an exponential amount of credits more with the Starfarer than just straight Space Trucking with the C2.
Also have a Merchantman, wouldn't want to downgrade to the Hercules. Now what you said about the A2, I agree. If you want an In Your Face Combat Dropship, or a great CAS, then i am down with it. Yet for that money, I will take the Hammerhead for a CAS role. Hammerhead should also be sort of alright in space for stuff. LOL
Imo, the ship is very "role" specific. For me, it's heavy support for smuggling & ground assaults. But it will look damn pretty parked in Arc Corp!! o7
Seems like we need the ultra scale USB type C x2 to charge these Hercules Starlifters😄
Daisy Chain? You Mean Daisy Cutters for cluster bombs
3rd! Org machine as far as I am concerned.
I like how STL is warning everyone that the ship is incredibly niche and over priced and people are like it's the best deal.. like wow..
What? People are saying the A2 is "the best deal"? Then those people have more money than sense and are complete idiots.
How are you landing this thing on Olisar lol
Is there any landing pas wide enough?
M2 will also have the same armor as the A2 apparently, while the C2 will not.
The price tag of A2 is making me think "CIG...... maybe go home? You might be drunk."
Though if the bomb racks are to have a counterpart in the Retaliatior......
The one thing that makes this ship worth the money is the fact that it has remote turrets, so you can a AI to run your turrets so you can run the ship solo. For me, earn it in game.
Anything about Stealth on any of these variants? Also, I’m really interested in the ability to move ships.
Great vid!
Ok question is the C2 good ship to use that a small 5 man org can get since you can also put small ships as well as cargo in.
Ps Why isnt people talking about what other small ships can be put in it?