Fixing Your Branch Line: Mascouche Line
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- Опубліковано 11 жов 2024
- We'll be reviewing our first Canadian commuter agency in this series by moving to the next closest city from Boston: Montreal. Despite the preview in the intro, further review resulted in shifting my focus to a newer branch line that has a much more unusual history and routing, and was recently jeopardized by the construction of a popular metro system. This route was undoubtedly the hardest episode to make, since every solution I could think of was blocked by one factor or another, but I still share these ideas in order to discuss and contribute to larger ideas to improve public transit usage as a whole.
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Credit for all photos used go to their original photographers
All music used in this video is from the UA-cam Audio Library.
Copyright Disclaimer under Section 107 of the copyright act 1976: allowance is made for fair use for purposes such as criticism, comment, news reporting, scholarship, and research. Fair use is a use permitted by copyright statute that might otherwise be infringing. Non-profit, educational or personal use tips the balance in favor of fair use.
Video Credit: @cardozogermangustavo @ExcellentChalsTransit
Special thanks to @cowlunitproductions2004 for guest appearing in this episode.
Music Used in Order:
Late Night Train - Vans in Japan
Redwood - Quincas Moreira
Six Seasons - Unicorn Heads
Rubber Dubs - Freedom Trail Studio
Big Al's - Josh Lippi & The Overtimers
Realism - Text Me Records
Three Wise People - E's Jammy Jams
Royal - Slenderbeats
You said you would massacre the names but holy crap, you didn't hold back ! hahahahahah
"Doo Montajiz Line"
The classic Québec saga between different organizations fighting to grab more attention and power. STM, REM, EXO & ARTM are all independent agencies with little connection nor cooperation between each other. While in Toronto, Metrolinx, Go Transit & TTC have a clear authority power separation as well as legal status protection.
the ARTM is currently improving the connection of all the transit agencies by having them all use the zone based ticket system instead of how it used to be. before stm tickets and exo tickets were separate so you couldnt get a free transfer going from the metro to an exp train but now you can. btw REM is just the name of the rail system, the agency in charge of the REM is the CDPQ infra.
@@EvilFryingPanCompared to their Torontonian counterparts, Metrolinx, ARTM has a really hard time coordinating all the local transit agencies. The only successful case is the reorganization of the fare zone, but that's a long time due. Now ARTM is pushing for transit planning and no agencies listen to them.
This was a great watch overall! Glad I was able to contribute and make a guest appearance in this video!
Loved your rolling line model gets a big fat montrealer's seal of approval.
once again 10/10 if you dont wanna scroll through the chat
Really solid and well documented perspective for an outsider.
As a user of the Mascouche line, there’s a couple of reasons why I think the post-REM situation might not be such a big deal.
* In terms of transfers, the Côte-de-Liesse station appears pretty low effort. It’s not cross-platform (the “crème de la crème” of interchange configurations), but having seen the plans it looks like it’s going to be the easiest commuter-rail-to-metro transfer in Montreal (even better than some metro-to-metro transfers honestly).
* Travel time should remain fairly the same for trips to Gare Centrale-Bonaventure, and they should dramatically improve for other major downtown stations like McGill, Griffintown, and major stations outside of downtown such as Édouard-Montpetit and YUL Airport.
* Personally, fare integration and ticketing modernization has made me use the line more often than pre-COVID, and I’m confident that as this improves, the line will only get more interesting for residents.
I do believe that fixing the exo Mascouche line comes down to moving away from the model of express shuttle between downtown and outer suburbs, and embracing a future where the service could be retooled as an orbital line.
Recent origin-destination studies revealed that the traditional commuter rush hour travel pattern to downtown has been severely affected by structural changes post-COVID. Direct pendular heavy rail downtown connections likely has the least potential for growth.
The Mascouche line does parallel some of the busiest bus lines in the city, but sees more use in low density off-island suburbs because it doesn’t really offer stops in that corridor and the frequency is too low to be interesting for people in inner city neighbourhoods. It did not help that it was a lot more expensive compared to buses before the last fare integration.
Post-REM, there’s an opportunity to rethink the line, and by doing so adding much needed capacity and relief to buses running on Sauvé, which is a priority corridor for the regional transit planning authority.
Improvements really only need to be concentrated between Côte-de-Liesse station and Anjou station. This upgrade project on that 10 km segment would require;
* a little bit double tracking or sidings,
* increased frequency, aiming for a train every 10-15 minutes in both directions,
* expanded service with trains running off-peak and weekends,
* a handful of new stations, spaced on average a little over 1 km
* shorter train sets, maybe 2 to 4 config
* possibly an additional maintenance centre specifically for this local high frequency segment.
The rest of the line could continue to L’Assomption like you’ve suggested. As for the Quebec-Gatineau tracks (or is it CPCK?), I would really leave that corridor free for the maybe-high-speed-rail project and Saint-Jerome line improvements, and just extend the Pie-IX BRT to Mascouche.
Thank you for the in depth explanation.
Excellent suggestions. The stretch from Anjou to the REM is quite densely populated, so with frequent service, stations every km, upgraded stations with escalators and good connections to the Orange line and the REM, a lot of traffic should be generated. I think an underground tunnel with a moving carpet (like they have in airports) should be built to connect the two Sauvé stations. The tunnel could be connected directly into the metro station, and there would be escalators up to the Exo station.
I'll say, I would love if the line continued to L'Assomption and Joliette, and if the Repentigny Terrebonne Mascouche segment was inter-suburb and frequent outside of regular commute hours. I had to buy a car to go see a doctor in Terrebonne regularily. It's a real pain to move between those towns outside of a car. The bus system is just not providing the service too.
We're about to get a big influx of people in L'Assomption because we're opening a whole new industrial zone in a giant empty lot. These people who will work there will also be greeted with new developments across the street. The workers who decide to live there will no doubt bring families who will still need to commute to Montreal, and our sub-par bus service will never manage that load.
Actually, your solution is partially what was proposed from the start. The Mascouche line was doomed from the start because they choose somehow the worst proposal they had and that needed the construction of a whole new line between the two direction of the 640 highway. The proposal made in 2003 that was the préfères solution until march 2006 was actually two lines. The first one was starting in l’assomption follow the CN line into repentigny, then pointe-aux-trembles then more or less follow notre-dame street until it reaches gare centrale. Back then there was an existing track complete with bypass track for when a freight train would be in the way that followed that route but it was later removed. The second line was to start in Mascouche, stop in northern terrebonne, get to laval and branch off with the metro system.
Everybody knew back then that the actual project was bad. A huge portion of why the project costed a lot more than expected is because the original project didn’t included any protection from the ammunition plant, which by the way have a freight line and a lot of houses closer than the train de l’est from the plant that are totally unprotected, so really how necessary was that protection ?
Would love to see one of these for the Metrolink 91/Perris Valley line
Great video , good french , you did great .I wish the REM de Est project could be built that would bring some solutions to the public transportation in Montreal . I live right beside where this branch of the REM was planed to pass , over Sherbrooke est street . It was cancel , but i dream one day it wil be built . Thank you again to both
I feel like a Masouche Line being turned into being a REM style service could work when there’s some proposals to have the REM be extended from Panama Terminus to Saint Jean-Sur-Richelieu. Candiac line extension to Saint Jean is cancelled due to trip length for riders, and the REM has sprouted good Transit Oriented Development. (Realized you said this in the video). Maybe connecting to a hopefully proposed REM de L’Est, to connect Masouche. Montreal Est seems to be relegated to redevelopment on former industrial sites, could be more reliable and usable than almost peak only commuter train.
Also, concrete guideways than at grade level tracks to fix some sharp turns and long routings like on the Deux-Montages rebuild.
The Alstom Metropolis trains can hit 100km/h or 63mph. Though would be interesting if they got the metro train to run on 25kV 60 Hz AC like the trains in Mumbai (though on 50Hz) , meaning it could possibly use the Mont Royal Tunnel maybe like some Japanese trains. With Metro and Commuter trains running on the same track on some segments.
Thank you for covering my nearest Exo line!
At this rate ARTM is gonna do it's spoinoff called: UNDOING OUR BRANCHLINES!
Mascouche is actually my favorite Exo line, its very calm and the section north of Pointe-aux-Trembles is beautiful
You know it’s a good day when cowl and 19 do a video together
Quick french lesson if you're interested:
ch makes the "sh" sound
eau makes the "oh" sound
gn makes a sound similar to the spanish ñ (so think of how you would pronounce the n in pinata)
eu and eux make the eugh sound (sorta like the sound you make when you're disgusted by something)
ou makes the "oo" sound (as in moose)
the e, es, s, or x at the end of a word is almost always silent (basically unless the next word starts with a vowel)
~~~
As a side note, the ARTM announced today that they're considering canning the Candiac, Mont St Hillaire, and (relevant to this video) Mascouche Lines completely. Hopefully they reverse on this decision but as it stands right now its a distinct possibility.
Love the collaboration with CUP
Regarding the rubber wheels on Montreal's metro cars: they still qualify as trains and *wouldn't* qualify as busses, because between the rubber wheels the cars still have a regular train bogie that rides on a set of standard-gauge tracks. The train wheels are what actually guide the train and enable it to navigate switches. The rubber wheels I think are mainly for braking and acceleration and a smoother ride.
The standard-gauge tracks also allow maintenance and work trains to roll through at night when the metro isn't running.
Good to know. I initially included that comment as a joke, but your explanation of the specifics is greatly appreciated.
They need to extend the Mascouche line to Joliette!
16:40 The roundabout route could also be used for supplementing services for local riders along the route!
Another solution to fix this line might be to get new rolling stock compatible with the REM signaling and loading gauge, Interlining the service and Terminating at Gare Central. Sort of like the Elizabeth line in London.
"instead of going to L'Assomption"
yes. And as someone who lives there, I am very sad about that.
Other detail to clear up, the CN Deux Montagnes line had an average 23,000 riders per day, and ran with old CN EMUs and 1916 vintage boxcabs right up until 1993, when the line was upgraded and a year or so later the MR-90 EMUs took over
The last run of ancient equipment was June 2 in 1995. But they closed the line for 3 summers. First two was simply for replacing and upgrading the trackage, the summer of 1995 is where they replaced both the ancient catenary and the ancient signaling system. In fact, parts of this line, before the 1995 renovation, were among the last places to still have extensive use of telegraph machines, and "hooping" up orders! Also required there to be a flagman present for the tunnel.
I feel like if you extend to Farnham it should go all the way to Sherbrooke; Mont-Saint-Hilaire could also end up there, but that cuts off the possibility of Drummondville without branching.
The saddest thing about the mascouche line is that it’s the only rail link in much of eastern Montreal, and it will be like that for the foreseeable future. Exo should really be at the forefront trying to find a solution, but their lazy asses won’t even try to make service better😢
Already guessing the next episodes. Next will be GO transit, then Metra, then finally Metrolink since those are the only commuter railroads left in north america with more than three lines. Maybe possibly RDT in Denver too even though that uses a mix of both commuter rail and light rail, technically there are already 4 commuter rail lines
If I was in charge of the rem project I would expand the Mount Royal tunnel to 4 tracks three at the minimum to get the mascouche line into gare centrale and rebuild it to make it look more pleasant
If you need any help with the Go Transit Episode let me know. I live right next to the branch witch I think will be featured in the Go Transit episode. Great job on this episode.
Great video, as a Montrealer it's hard to pronounce some of the French names.
Nice + we need an exo iceberg
This is the first episode of _Fixing_ _Your _Branch_ _Line_ that I watched, and I find this quite informative! I was thinking that the Mascouche Line was quite strange, especially after REM "did a PATCO" on the Deux-Montagnes Line. I'm not even Canadian, but now that you provided the antidote, I'm hoping that EXO keeps the Central Station connection for two of the Mascouche trains.
Thanks for making this video!
Also, I might check out Cowl Unit Productions later!
There's no cheap solution to fix Mascouche Line. The only real and long term solution would be to rebuild the whole CN line to accommodate 2 tracks dedicated for urban rail (as a new REM branch/line or a new frequent rail line). The right of way is wide enough to accommodate 4 tracks if they're supported by walls. It's not a sexy nor easy solution but it should've been done in the 2000s if politicians had a long term vision.
nice video!
Btw, the only pronunciation that was painful to hear was Deux-Montagnes
It’s more so pronounced: “der mon-tang”
Nice try, but EXO 50 minutes VS 10 minutes will never convince people other than rail fans to ride. Already no one takes the long detour when they can ride the Metro to the Mascouche line from Bonaventure to Sauve in about 15 minutes and save over a half hour travel time
4:25 also most of the houses in Montreal-Nord at the time were about a mile and a half away at the time. The Metro kind of killed it in 1968.
It was fun seeing Cowl Unit Productions on here.
BTW, you should be aware that since this is in Canada, the ADA -- *_Americans_* with Disabilities Act -- does not apply here.
Unfortunately, there is no national or even provincial law (or set of laws) that even comes close to what the ADA requires for accessibility. As a person with mobility issues, I am frequently faced with challenges. (An example, I would have liked to attend a show at a small, local theatre. While the building is wheelchair accessible, the bathrooms are not.)
While I applaud your brave attempts at pronouncing French names, there are many free translation apps that would have at least given you an idea of how to pronounce the names properly. Google Translate is one that comes to mind.
I didn't catch the ADA goof until after I uploaded it, and I did mean to say wheelchair accessible. The two words are used interchangeably in the U.S. I do hope that someone pushes some sort of effort to make more public transit stations wheelchair accessible in Canada, especially in large metro regions.
Official CNW comment: fixing your branch line Metra heritage corridor next?
When is the REM part of Mascouche going to be ready?
Wikipedia says the transfer station will be open sometime in Q4 of 2024, likely whenever the next phase of REM opens
Late 2024
Sometime in 2025. REM won't give a definitive date.
great video 🚅🚃🚃
"dew montages" lol
Provolone cheese
Cant wait!
HIIII IMMM FANNN HIIII
quality of the video 10/10 quality of the french name prononciation 4/10 🥲 love that you tried haha
This line is probably useless and it’s better off eaten by REM branches it is a failure
That was one of the possibilities that I considered for improving the branch, but building a REM line directly on the existing line would sever several freight rail spurs and a yard owned by CN, as it would also sever a direct connection on their Joliette Subdivision between their Montreal yard and Quebec City via Shawinigian. Speaking of Via, such a move would also isolate Via Rail passenger services from Montreal to Seneterre and Jonquirre, likely killing them due to no one seat ride to the center of Montreal.
Couldn't you just have the solution be "cancel REM"?
Also, which Go Transit line are you doing next? My money's on Richmond Hill.
Negative. That metro is already built and expanding further. I don't want it to be killed for the sake of a single commuter rail line, since it does have many benefits.
In regards to GO Transit, I cannot confirm or deny that Richmond Hill will be covered.
@@Pensyfan19 So the Mascouche line is doomed?
@@brendanu1680 Watch the video for further explanations...