Survivor 41: Why Erika Won
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- Опубліковано 18 гру 2021
- Erika did not get the winner’s edit we’re used to seeing and she has wondered if she will have to forevermore defend why she won Survivor. But by the time David and Jessica are done, she’ll be able to point people to this podcast. Erika didn’t come into the finale as the biggest threat or the person seemingly most likely to win, but she had set herself up well even if it didn’t all make it to TV. Meanwhile, several of the other players who did seem to be in good spots had their game prospects flipped either before or at the jury. It’s time to look back through everything we did and didn’t see on TV as we figure out Why Erika Won, and Deshawn, Xander, Heather, and Ricard Lost.
#Survivor #Survivor41 #RHAP - Розваги
I definitely agree with the thoughts on the edit. I think production was selling its own storylines rather than giving the actual story of the game, which really did players dirty this season. They undersold Erika’s game and played Xander up so much, so it’s not surprising people are shocked at the results. A lot of the things that helped this season make sense came from interviews and not the episodes themselves, so the average casual fan won’t fully grasp how things went and how the jury decided their votes.
You’re exactly right
I get that it is hard to give time to a tribe when they are never going to TC, but it sure didn’t stop them from giving screen time to Danny, DeShawn and Sydney, all of which had much bigger edits pre-merge. The editors could have done so much better.
Survivor is re-branding the show as the “New Era Survivor” . The show is growing on younger demographics. They needed to produce a new golden boy for young boys to idolize and young girls to have a crush on.. they’d rather show Xander feeling like a rock star like “Fiji! Are you ready to rock! 1,2,123! Yeeaahh!” , than to show Erica’s strategy. It’s a TV show and most importantly it’s a business! It sucks that they didn’t care to show more clips about how the winner won! Xander was not robbed! Erica was! With the edit.
Tbh the Shan/Liana split vote was a great move, regardless of if it had failed or not. If they don’t split and Shan uses her idol, Erika goes. If they do split but someone tips off Shan (let’s say Danny and Deshawn stick to their alliance), Erika probably goes anyway because that person would vote with Shan and she wouldn’t have to use the idol. If they don't split the vote and Danny and Deshawn stick with their alliance, Shan likely uses her idol to avoid going to rocks and Erika goes. They only scenario that Erika stays in the case Shan uses her idol is that Danny and Deshawn don’t flip on the minority alliance, they split the vote and Liana goes. Any other scenario Erika would go. If there was a move for her to make, this is the only one that would’ve worked out for her and had it failed, I think it was worth the shot regardless because the odds weren't stacked in her favor.
Malcolm made a comment a couple weeks ago about how CBS bragged about the diversity then threw in so many twists that viewers didn’t get to know the cast. That’s a great criticism. They did Ericka dirty by her purple edit premerge. I was rooting for her to win, but didn’t have much hope because of her edit. We have our first woman win since Sarah, and the show’s edit has the Uber vocal negative non critical thinking fans screaming that Xander was robbed because he’s a white male. I’m almost wondering if that was intentional. The show intentionally propped up winners like Tom Westman, Mike Holloway and Ben (through they were way less subtle about them). When Sandra won, the hype train had fans screaming that FairPlay and Russell were robbed. When Veceptia was, the hype train screamed that Pascal ( whose game was passive and non existent) and Kathy were robbed. When Earl won? Yauman was robbed. Shoot, when Adam and Jeremy won, it was only because of sympathy. Hype can be very harmful, but it’s marketable
To say that Jeremy and Adam won only through sympathy based on the edit seems to be an over simplification. Additionally, with winners like earl and veceptia the fallen angles of that season were voted out before the final tribal. It’s only natural for a view to wish for a sean or a yau to get the win because they were massive characters with more charisma than others (notably those in the final three). Does the edit help to pain that picture? Definitely, but I think it has less to do with racial lines and more with who the editors think are more entertaining or who the editors think fit this seasons theme/story better. The over saturation of twists was very annoying and did distract pre-merge from the interpersonal interactions. Yet, post merge I think the diverse cast really shined with bigger characters like Shan and deshawn unfortunately sidelining Erika. We needed to see more Erika that’s certain, but to blame that on the presence of Xander is foolish. There were many other character like Sydney and deshawn who were in a very similar pre-merge situation to Erika who got more screen time. I think this is where the issue lies and i think it’s directly connected with who played an advantage heavy game. Xander did get a large edit but he also had at least one episode with no confessionals. Again this was so big characters like Shan and ricard could have their (awesome) moments. I guess my point in all these ramblings is that there’s more to the edit than the more binary Xander got more screen time than Erika so if they game less screen time to Xander it would have benefited erikas edit. Not that I think that’s what you’re saying but it’s where it took my mind. Yet, you might be totally right. That’s the crazy thing about this show we love is there are so many permutations that could have happened, from within the game to the editing room. So yeah there’s my 17 cents!
So what you're saying is the show is over produced and largely staged. I agree ... it was staged to fall in line with a clear social justice agenda. All the edits and afterthoughts of production are there to justify the outcome and trick the simple minded into a further divide. From what I watched, Erica did nothing the entire season, until handed an advantage and win. Xander played the fake idol trick that flipped the game and outlasted Riccard. This was a clear social justice aimed season complete with staging and a propagandist outcome. We can agree to disagree on that, but the fact remains, it's staged and for that reason I'm out ....
so xander because he's white makes zero since
@@Ryzenberg78 mmmm actually it was kinda the opposite but pop off. Xander burned tons of bridges, played a weak social and strategic game, and was given sooooo much credit in the edit for things that other people did. It’s clear and the evidence points to Erika being vastly under edited and there’s a clear problem that’s been addressed with this situation bevause people believe that a female minority is not competent enough to make the moves that she did. Xander was edited the way he was because he was white and a male, I don’t think that was intentional but he was outplayed by almost everyone around him and still got the best edit. If it was a “social justice season” as you have so ignorantly proclaimed the POC winner wouldn’t have gotten a ghost edit for the first 5 episodes. And going back to the casting point, the fact that people relate a more diverse cast to a “social justice season” is just so openly ignorant. There are SERIOUS issues with only casting 2-3 minorities each season and casting more isn’t “social justice” it’s expanding the scope of experiences of the contestants to make for a more diverse season for a larger audience of people outside of your own views. But at the end of the day, I do agree with you that all of this is performative, because while survivor tries to claim it’s inclusive, it continues to paint minorities in women in the shadow of white men who played worse than they did.
@@cyrusbarati3667 It doesn't matter which side you're on; the point is its produced and edited to the point of being disingenuous. I would be totally on board with a season with no white men as long as it's an honest game. This didn't appear honest in any way, no matter the side you reside on.
When everyone wanted him to save Evie (when she didn’t need saving) while she and Tiffany had wanted him out since week 1
If you think Xander deserved to win after watching this, then you are just adamant on being in denial and ignoring the facts
and racist
I hope David's comment about Xander not being robbed goes viral. Any deep-rooted Survivor fan looking beyond the edit would have seen Xander's loss coming from a mile away. At the end of the day, to paraphrase Deshawn, Survivor is a social game at the end of the day, and Xander just did not excel at that aspect of the game - exemplifying his misunderstanding of social awareness through Liana's questioning and Shan's needing to throw him a bone there.
I think that the show actually fairly showed Erika, and that she had a consistent storyline from the pre-merge to the end, but what I take issue with the edit is not justifying Xander's loss enough. Because he was so present edit-wise, anyone not listening to anything beyond the show would have thought he was winning = leading to people thinking he lost because of a bitter, "racist" jury. If anything, they were more bitter at Deshawn at FTC, not Xander! But no, he just completely fumbled the bag by not only mismanaging, but also misreading the jury. I'm sure he's a great guy IRL, and his exit press seems like he's taking his loss with a lot of grace for sure, but strictly within the game, Xander. Was. Not. Robbed. If you're heading into FTC with a complete misunderstanding of your season's jury, then you do NOT deserve to win.
I’d counted Xander out weeks ago, it was so obvious he wasn’t winning, especially since he’s barely even shown in some of the most important votes of the season (Shan, Danny). But who was prominantly shown in those votes? Erika.
This podcast just read my mind about why Erika deserved the win.
I also don't understand the comments saying "It's not about who has the best game anymore, it's now about who has the best final jury presentation". Like bro, the final Jury IS part of the game whether u like it or not, and u have to do a great job at it, whether u like it or not. There has been some instances in past seasons where jury members come in with who to vote for in mind, but changed it because they felt like they did not get much from that person in the end, making them question their perception of the finalist in the game.
What do they mean anymore? It’s literally always been about the jury and FTC, I’d argue moreso in older seasons than in modern Survivor.
My opinion isn’t that Erika’s edit was lesser than other players, but that Erika didn’t have quite as much personality as other players so she wasn’t noticed as much by us until she won. This season was absolutely stacked with huge personalities that made Erika less noticeable.
That being said I wasn’t surprised when Erika won. I thought Deshawn would win but I wasn’t surprised that Erika won. I hadn’t thought Xander was a possible winner for about the final 5 episodes. He had been entirely defensive since the merge since he was an initial target which prevented him from being able to make any moves. He was never in control of the game so I didn’t think had a shot at winning. This was evident by the way he wasn’t the target of any of the later votes despite having an idol. This showed that no one saw him as an end game threat.
I also wasn’t surprised that Deshawn didn’t win. His game was too emotional and messy. I thought he had the best relationships with a lot of the people on the jury but even those he was close with didn’t really respect his game and his alliance members disagreed with a lot of his moves.
I didn’t think Erika would win, but I wasn’t surprised that she did. I went into final tribal thinking that any of the three could possibly win based on the edit which I enjoyed. And when Erika won I wasn’t surprised. I think that with all of the big personalities in this season she wasn’t the person most viewers were rooting for to win so everyone was surprised when she did. I thought the edit showed a lot of great Erika moves and strategy.
Jessica's favorite word this season has been "desirous," and I don't think I have ever heard it said outside of a Why X Lost podcast😂
Can't wait to hear these two again next season!
Thank you for the videos this season. Erika played a good game being able to bounce between the different players. I think Erika and Shan played similar games with the exception that Erika did not come across as intimidating or aggressive. Both tried to work with everyone but even when Erika got sideways with Heather or Deshawn she was able to calm it down. Xander absolutely misread the people on the jury. He also misunderstood that while his Idol certainly came up in conversations, he was not considered a threat by the others to win. He had no one committed to voting for him even Tiffney or Evvie from his own tribe. Xander was never getting their votes. Unfortunately, the production had the narrative that they were trying to present and like Jessica said because they were determined to show things the way they did it left Erika not appearing to be playing as well as she did. The players could have told the story much better than Jeff P and the Edit. She got to Turn Back Time and the final advantage as you both said was massive for her. You both pointed out that Production could not show Erika's subtle moves but obviously those on the jury had seen them because they all voted for her. Shan kept talking about how she needed to be seen making big moves, but Erika won without the obvious big move because the other players gave her credit.
I agree once Shan had her heart to heart with Ricard, he knew that Shan would not protect him, and he was no better than 5 for her. He did not have a choice but to react on the information.
In regard to Erika's strategy that others had wanted to play. Sometimes the individual's strategy is affected by elements beyond their control. Erika could play her strategy because she was in a tribe that had Danny and Deshawn and Naseer who got some much attention. Her tribe won and there was no pressure early. Xander could not play that way with his tribe because he was the young alpha male in a tribe that had a couple loses. Ricard could not play that way because his tribe struggled and with Shan he got a lot of attention trying to survive. It does not take away from Erika sticking to the plan.
I'm glad I listen to this to help me understand more what happened and why
The editors have their own job to do. They can't please everybody. I'm sure editing is a hard tedious job. I love survivor and think they do a great job.
6:58 had me DYING! This was such a great podcast!!!
It's so surprising to me that people were confused by the edit. I thought it seemed obvious Erika had a good shot at winning from early on, before the merge. But I'm also happy that Xander, Deshawn, Ricard and Shan all got a substantive focus too. It felt good to not have to read the writing constantly. Erika was the player I was following the most, though, so maybe I was just focusing on her more. I'm sad that people were writing her game off because it wasn't written as ultra dominant, just equally plausible. I think that plausibility made this season one of the best.
my belief on the edit is that they storyvoarded each episode after every tribal. they told stories that were most relevant to that 2 or 3 day stretch and cut out everything else. unfortunately for Erika, I think she was routinely the 3rd or 4th most relevant story of any couple day stretch. she was always relevant, but always missing the big spotlight.
Survivor could post hours and hours and hours of additional footage on youtube, if they wanted to.
I for one would love as much extra content as possible to gain a full understanding of the unique Dynamics of each season of the game.
Love this duo. So organic
This is how I read Xander's move to bring Erika. I think he did know that Erika was a threat but that with Heather, her game would be cannibalized. From the edit, he knew Erika struggled to make fire, DeShawn also struggled while Heather was pretty good at it. I thought that he counted on Heather to beat out DeShawn so that Heather could down play her game. Xander did say that he wanted to downplay Erika's game even if he knew she was a threat. I think he did say this but was not able to articulate it well to show, hey, he did have some social awareness to him. I wonder if he recognized that was good social awareness on his part to tell the jury and articulate that well. There were clues to this but from what we saw, he wasn't able to.
And the fact is nobody actually knows whether erika can make fire.
She just shows in front of ppl that she can't.
Imagine she actually cld and Xander put her in, and they wld be like what an idiot for putting her in to give her more resume.
Conclusion: fired making at F4 nids to go.
Ricard mentioned that he would probably vote for Heather if she was in ftc with Erika. That is how bad the edit was with their duo. From what we saw Erika and Heather are non threathening but in the island the cast viewed them as another Shan-Ricard. Heather was the brains while Erika moved the pieces with her social game.
People who are well-spoken definitely have an advantage in the final tribal council. Erika was very articulate and imo over-inflated her strategy and social game. Xander was impressive in so many ways from start to finish and played a very well-rounded game, but could not sell it. He fumbled over his words and somehow came off over-confident and regretful at the same time. However, the bias of the jurors and the questions they choose to ask is another huge imbalance in the game. I don’t think he got a good opportunity to really showcase how much he did in FTC. I think final 3 members should get some final words to make their case instead of only answering the jury’s questions.
yeesh why all the other titles have it as ____ (blank) and then this one just spoils it all
This is the first season of Survivor I watched & your analysis of the game and the players has been super interesting.
I do really feel for the players cuz I’m used to Big Brother where twists usually just flop and have no impact where here they were an active detriment to so much of the game and the show itself. I’m def gonna try and watch some older seasons where that’s less of an issue, I just really wish we could’ve seen more of Heather and Erika on the actual show (why they chose to not show 2 players who would win and the other be in final 4, knowing the results the whole time yet still not finding time to actually show them)
We see so little of the interactions on the show, about 20 minutes. That is the problem with Survivor. Why not supplement the TV show with a webcast so we can see more of the interactions and strategies? The webcast could run after the TV show each week or even after the season is over.
or, ykno, stop giving so much screentime to advantages, especially those that lead nowhere as was the case with every single advantage this season
@@californiadreaming567 Or a 90 minute show starting at 7:30.
Did you guys ever cover why Danny lost? You went from Liana's episode to the finale.
Talking about the relationship between Heather and Deshawn being left out reminded me of something I've noticed on this season and some others - at some point you started hear a lot of players calling Heather by her nickname "Mama H" at challenges and tribal but that nickname being created / the relationship around that nickname isn't shown at all. I can't think of the exact examples off the top of my head, but there's been a couple other instances in previous seasons where I remember being a bit confused that a player apparently has a nickname that was never really talked about
Interesting that David thinks Ricard had no other time to get Shan out while Deshawn did while I think it's the opposite...targeting Ricard made it so it forces Shan who is she really loyal with and I think the only problem Deshawn has is not making Erika and Heather trust him over Ricard and Xander following up after Shan.
Im okay with Fire Making, if we go back to Final 2, and Fire was at Final 3.
That there is also a special area in tribal that eliminate wind interference or rain.
I actually don't like winner edits. Especially when it feels completely obvious who the winner will be.
This is one reason Winners at War is one of my least favorite seasons. I like it when the winner is unpredictable to some degree and realizing in the end why that makes player makes sense to win.
Ask Voce how he feels about his shirt making it to people he never met on the show.
Desirous is cracking me up. Not used often in regular conversation but used a lot here lol
Can you please not put the spoiler in the title? I finally had time to start watching this season and follow along with the coverage and after watching your recap of episode one this title showed up on my recommended videos and completely spoiled it for me. So frustrating.
I think DeShawn believed erica couldn't beat Ricard figuratively and literally ss she wouldn't have won against ricard without that advantage. so it was idiotic for her to keep Ricard
Why wouldn’t cbs show deshawns behaviors more? That’s part of the entertainment. From the edit, he didn’t seem that emotional, throwing temper tantrums, etc.
Erika is the steve Moses of survivor played a responsible game and smart game but it wasn't flashy.
steve actually was strategical like shan while erika was like hannah
@@uknownlight hannah who?
Production went way too far this year, the twists took the game away from the cast and viewers, giving us an edit based on who had an idol, and not as much on relationships. It's unfortunate because it was a good cast. They robbed Erika of her due and made the Jury seem bitter.
Why can’t I stop staring at those very captivating, big beautiful eyes Jessica has?
I Love You Rob 😘
Cause game is fake , done watching it . It was a good ride but as the seasons went by just way too phony now.
7:28. Phrasing.
I think Tiff and Evvie was being unfair to Xander. He said it was something to use for the tribe pre merge, they have reach merge and during merge he has not promise 0laying the idol for them.
Also the 26 days probably harm him, I think when he gave them the cold shoulders that day, he was still processing the betrayal that he jst found out.
Tbf Xander shld get credit as well even if its not his plan.
Also I feel his age was also a disadvantage.
The jury is never wrong. They can judge however they want. Cry more
@@bigmass4792 I didn't said that voting erika as the winner is reported.
I only said tiff and Evvie was being unfair.
Also you being this mean with your comment will only make ppl hate Erika win more.
Bye forever!
@@bigmass4792 not true
C'mon Rob, you always do the why ___ lost titles, why spoil the season now for people (like me) who haven't had a chance to watch the finale yet?
Too much whining about the edit. Have a different show on why the edit sucks. This is Why Erika won!
Giving all the credit for the move is saying that everyone “knows” he didn’t think of tricking Liana. The anti-Xander sentiment among podcasters is really strong.
Still not a real season.
Wait why
@@jakobkleeman6705 Because it wasn't even real Survivor.
@@Stephen_Ieraci okay casual fan. Keep on hating on a game that keeps on evolving. 💅
@@Stephen_Ieraci you're dreaming
Too political of a season. The cast took jabs at different folks like you two for no reason. So disappointed. One of the worst seasons of survivor or as Russell says DISASTER of a season.
Russell never won btw
one of the best season!!🤣russell is the disaster!🤣🤣
She won because she is female and poc. Please try not to get angry but we all know this is true. If Erika played the same Xander did, and Xander played the game Erika did, they still would of gave their votes to Erika. Anyone who disagrees is delusional.
Wrong.
Xander lost because he played a very very passive game. He had no big moves at all. Erica made more moves than him.
If situations were switched, Cander would have won.
@@bashgita incorrect. I am also asian but refuse to be biased. An objective view shows his game is much more complete and earned while things fell in her lap.
@@realtalk7598 the object view shows your
talking with your head out of your ass. Why are you in denial that Xander played a piss poor game and Erika played a better one? Do you not have the nuance to read in between the lines or do you take what the shows gives you face value.
@@varick4969 I get it you are trolling. cant have that much brain damage. im not taking the bait. try on someone else. no one is that stupid to think erika played better. they can be happy, but know she didnt. bye now.
Erika made more moves and more impactful moves. Erika was behind all the endgame votes as well, while Xander was out of the loop
Because Game doesn't matter.
LAME. LAME. LAME.
Here's an ides, how about during the interview process you actually Ask the potential candidates upfront if they can vote without BS emotion and actually commit to voting on Actual gameplay? Obviously if you want to talk about a balance between social and physical gameplay, Xander should have won this game.
Im so sad at the direction the shoe hae floundered
Keep hating casual fans
@@supermedtek it's like they don't even want to try to understand. Which is insane because the viewers are working with the least amount of information.
Congratulations on being one of those naive fools who believes in the edit, while in reality Xander played a goat game and didn’t play anywhere as good as the show seemed, get over it.
balance between social and physical?? thats erika lol she won the same amount of challenges as him but had better social awareness and jury management + more impressive strategy.
Unfortunately i agree. Reading the interviews of some jury members they would never vote for Xander for reasons beyond the game. I understand that in some regard what someone considers to be a great player and a great game may not be the same as the jury. Maybe they really thought her game was the best, when for me being always the outcast and underdog is harder than playing with the biggest group and being benefit by 2 twists, but regardless in this case certain members had also other reasons and they made it clear during the game and afterwards.