Regardless of the Rally Era you prefer, just let this sink in for a moment: These are guys, going sideways...at average 180km/h...mostly in dirt...with short-geared horsepower monsters...in a road between woods. Personally, unlike some other motorsports, rallying is the only one I can always be sure drivers are 100% driving with skill and guts through those courses. These guys here have little to no guardrails/gravelpits, just trees. I often get carried away thinking at Gr.B or Gr.4, but then again, rallying as it is, is brutal, beastly.
Group A > Group B > modern WRC I love seeing a super tuned version of a car you can go buy, but not boring little hatch backs like the Fiesta and Polo nowadays.
scruffy cars nowadays are getting to big and fat that's why they use small hatchbacks now and even then the wheel base of a fiesta is longer than a group a Scooby I miss the old stuff though wrc and f1 was far more exiting today it's just boring even the drivers their all to polite no drama
Wrong order Scruffy - should be (in order of timeline) Group B (which in turn got banned after 1986) > which forced Group A to be created > modern WRC 2.0T > current WRC 1.6T regs. Agree however Group A/90's brought lovely road going version that had to be sold to the public to meet then rally regulations.
Think also the Current Toyota Yaris rally campaign is a case in point all that effort to gain PR for the brand/Yaris but apart from the short lived GRMN rocket no fast Yaris available for the public to buy (a go faster looking one but not even the power of my Polo BlueGT 150ps 1.4T or what my next choice likely to be the New Suzuki Swift Sport 1.4T 138bhp car).....so sort of can't get my head round the point of it? At least Hyundai have the i30N monster for fans to choose (can't afford that one!).
@@markturner-smith5309 "Wrong" my balls; he thinks that's the right order for him. And, by the way, he also thinks that current cars are boring, such an opinion that I respect, but they're neither boring nor exciting: it all depends on the subjective view of each person. I think they're amazing machines, and them being tiny hatchbacks is specially good for me. So here you have, my subjective view: WRC > Group B > Group A.
Everyone seems to ignore the sound. I'm not convinced that WRC cars are faster than the older Group A cars from 1993 and 1994 when there was a 38mm restrictor. The modern cars sound awful with their high pitched buzzy bee exhaust noise restricted to a pathetic 100db noise level. The older cars sounded far superior with their deep growling, exhaust exploding noise and this adds to the impression of speed. The current cars have a pathetic 'pop' - the older cars had gut wrenching explosions. Rallying died with the 100db noise restriction.
I also think WRC have gone down the drain nowadays. The appeal of rally was that it was mostly just regular cars competing wich would make you able to relate to the cars they are driving, today there´s only the steel skeleton wich a WRC car have in common with a production car, and even the steel skeleton get slightly modificated. Did the Group A also have an H-pattern shifter and clutch?
10110 01001 I agree - WRC cars always sounded pathetic. It's not happened in the last few years. Like i said, you have to go back to 1994 with the larger 38mm restrictor to hear loud, barking, flame throwing, anti lag exploding rally cars. But Malcolm Wilson loves all this WRC shit.
The only people who think WRC cars sound any good are those who never heard the unrestricted sound of the Audi quattro or the Toyota Celica ST185 and ST205 from 1993 and 1994. The shitty farty noise that the cars make now does nothing to add to the impression of speed. The modern cars just don't look as fast because they don't sound loud and powerful.
HannuMikkola your right what you say,they all sound the same nowadays. with wrc,group A and group B you could tell one car from the other by noise. Which made the sport more interesting and the main one,especially group B,group A you could actually buy a car which was very similar to what you seen on the tv.
1. Don’t fucking say that, the Subaru 555 WRC car sounds amazing, though the Audi Quattros and the other two were also amazing. 2. Does the sound matter? No, it’s a damn race, sound means jack shit when the car is better than the competition. 3. Again, a car’s illusion of speed means jack in a real race. I like all rally car’s noises.
You said that 5 years ago. I don't think you'll say the same with the new cars we have since 2017. If yes, it doesn't matters anyway: it's all about subjectivity. For example, there's people that thinks the Lancia 037 was the best looking car ever, but I think it's utter crap. It's all about tastes, my friend.
Somebody commented that "nothing is faster on a corner than group b" you are wrong the point was grp b cars didn't corner well at all grp a ended up being much faster
Probably due to electronic aids and mostly evolution of rubber. But if you check times from 1986 and 2017 there isn't much difference on similar distance special stages.
5 років тому
fetuso fetuso FINALLY someone who actually checks the facts. The ONLY reason modern cars are faster than group b cars through the corners is because of modern tires, the allowed use of a handbrake and downforce (which shouldn't even be on a fucking rally car, but that's another argument). But that doesn't matter, as group b cars are superior in every single other way, including homologation, spectator enjoyment and driver difficulty. Speed isn't everything, not by a long shot...
@ Sorry but with all the due respect, your statement is completely wrong. Group Bs were true monsters, there is no question about it. However, their powerband was very hard to use, they might have been on par with some of the more modern cars on very fast stages where cornering was not as important but when it comes to chassis, tires, suspension geometry/technology, engine (not raw power but when the peak power is reached), transmission, brakes, basically EVERYTHING except peak power, modern cars beat Group B any day. And I am not just referring to the current 2020 WRC cars, even current R5 cars would beat group B cars in a normal rally. The only place you MIGHT see a group B car beating a modern rally car is the drag strip or, as I mentioned earlier, a stage where there are a lot of straights with little cornering or deceleration. If you are looking at difference in stage times on the same stage but different years, keep in mind that stages change VERY often, perhaps the lenght is kept similar but stages might be moved 1-2-300 meters up or down a road and they are not exacly the same one year after the other. They can be shortened or Chicanes might have been added in certain areas. With that being said, time gaps of 1 second per km of special stage is a HUGE gap in rally.
Everyone needs to not argue about which cars are better! Group b, group a, wrc, it doesn't matter, they're all awesome! Rallying is the coolest Motorsport in the world so let's just appreciate it in all its forms
I went off rallying when the corolla came into play. That's when I realised these cars weren't no longer based on production models. The hole homologation was my biggest attraction. That you could actually buy a road going version was appealing. Now they look like spaceship that have nothing in common with their road going counterparts.
If less technology is what you want, then you'd want to stick with the current WRC cars. As the FIA's regulations state: "Any driving aid system is prohibited (ABS / ASR / Traction Control / ESP...). Any such system must be rendered inoperative." [1]. On the other hand, Group A cars were getting increasingly more and more assisted by electronic aids [2]. [1] www.fia.com/file/82330/download/20694 [2] tech-racingcars.wikidot.com/subaru-impreza-gc8-555, ua-cam.com/video/gAkk1w6GEcE/v-deo.html, etc.
@RallyBySte Despite the fatal crashes, I´m still in love with the 80's rallying... Nothing sounds and will never sound better than a Group B car. Dear God...
Love the video, it's just a shame that the further into the video I go. The cars get less and less like the models you could buy. Until the rally cars end up being just a shell of their original self. Bring back homologation rules!
+eatthisvr6 In a nutshell group A had to have a road car equivalent when it comes to engine, drivetrain, measurements of the body and axles. The base car (road car) was developed to be quicker, sturdier, louder but it appeared like a normal road car. If you wanted to compete in group A (A8 class) you had to build a rally car based on 4WD, 2ltr, 4 cylinder, ca. 300bhp road car. That's why we were blessed with production legends such as Lancia Delta Integrale, Subaru Impreza, Mitsubishi Evo, Toyota Celica etc. All these cars were produced so that the group A rally car could be built from one of them. Homologation rules changed for the introduction of WRC cars. Manufacturers no longer had to use a road car equivalent in terms of drivetrain, engine etc. For WRC build, they could choose a car with 1.6l engine, 110bhp and FWD as a homologation base. Citroen C4 for example. As a road car it was never 4WD, 2.0 turbo, 300bhp+ etc, yet they built a C4 WRC. Now if Citroen wanted to build a C4 group A in the 90s (up until 1997) they would've had to produce a road going C4 with 4WD, 2ltr turbo engine, around 300bhp, wider body for wider track, etc. These were major rule differences, but performance wise the early WRCs were comparable to late group A. For instance Mitsubishi used a group A Evo until 2001 even though their rivals had WRC cars since 97! To make matters worse for WRC users, Tommi Makinen beat them for 3 consecutive years (97,98,99) in a group A Evo:) This was a one off combination though. Of course WRC was being constantly developed (especially diff electronics) and in 1999 you could see these cars were quicker than the group A Evos. In essence group A was louder and more raw and aggressive and more spectacular to watch as diff management electronics & hydraulics were not as advanced. That meant the cars didn't have as much traction so they would flick the cars into corners and slide a lot:) My favourite time in rallying was '90s up until mid 2000s. I could go on and on:)
+wisniorek thanks for the info, i used to watch group a but wrc has gone the same way as f1 imo ie too much tech making them boring to watch and actually hides the skill needed to drive them. f1 is particularly bad atm because teh current crop of drivers are among the best ever imo (theres 4 or 5 who would fit right in to any era) but its just garbage to watch
eatthisvr6 With regards to F1, I still enjoy it, mainly because of the drivers. Some people say they aren't colourful enough, but I disagree. The sound of the cars is a big issue for a purist like myself, but I try to take out as much as I can out of every other aspect of F1. The races are as good and entertaining as in the past, we have entertaining drivers who refuse to go along with the PR bullsh (Vettel and Hamilton), they still race on legendary tracks, there's always controversy about something... That's what I'm focussing on and that's why I still enjoy watching it. Now, in rally in mid 90's we had it all - charismatic drivers in awesome machines! But hey, nothing lasts forever;)
+wisniorek monaco is a shit track and was always about nothing but money, the other legendary tracks have been seriously neutered by safety measures too. i like the current drivers and hamilton reminds me alot of mansell
+eatthisvr6 Marcus Grönholm saida exactly the very same that Monaco is just a piece of shit as a rally. Not these words but said this is so useless, stupid and doesn't make sense to drive rally so extreme circumstances from ice to mud and gravel and wet and dry tarmac. There isn't one tyres for all of that. Money is the only reason to make a show to those filthy rich assholes. Marcus said that this isn't real rally at all.
70s rally was very cool, 80s was insanely cool and crazy, 90s were very cool, today is still cool but not close to back then. I agree 80s rally was the best of the best.
1982-> group B? The Peugeot 205T16? 0-100 in 3 seconds... on gravel... my point is that group B was legendary, 90 were cool and fun, espicially the Lancia, nowdays boring as hell... i say bring the good old days back!
Why have you panned the audio from left - right or right - left for every clip, defeats the point of saying "pure audio" And it's pretty wrong seeing a car drive off straight ahead into the distance as the sound is moving to the left
The early WRC cars of the late 90s, we're awesome as the grA. Now its are yes powerful and similar to the old grB. But too much electronics and ...moderns.
In fact, those early WRC and even some Group A cars had plenty of electronic devices to aid on the driving, while today's WRC cars have NOTHING. As the FIA's regulations states: "Any driving aid system is prohibited (ABS / ASR / Traction Control / ESP...). Any such system must be rendered inoperative." - www.fia.com/file/82330/download/20694
Yesss! HB, Rothmans, Camel, Marlboro, 555 and Mocne are the right for men :) 80's had power, sound and incredibly fast development, but late 90's (last A8's and first WRC's) had nicest driving style. BTW., what car is it in 1:33? Looks and sounds like Stratos!?
with in a few years group A cars were quicker than gpB cars. so you can imagine how much quicker modern wrc cars are. wrc have far more torque and much better transmission and technology
Sin duda la mejor época de los rallies, los Grupo B están muy sobrevalorados, desde finales de los 80 a principios de los 2000, es la era de oro de los rallies, por pilotos (Sainz, Mcrae, Kankkunen, Makinen, Auriol, Burns, Gronholm...), por coches (Toyota Celica y Corolla, Subaru Impreza, Mitsubishi Lancer, Peugeot 206, Citroen Xasara, primero kit car y luego WRC, los Ford Escort primero y luego el Focus, Seat Córdoba...) y todavía los rallies eran de verdad, no como ahora, por km contra el crono, número de tramos diferentes, sin mierdas de power stage y esas historias. Una época en la que tomaban la salida 6 o 7 campeones del mundo a la vez, junto con grandes secundarios, muchas veces especialistas en esa superficie (Delecour, Panizzi, Ericsson, Erikson, Radstrom...). Qué luchas en asfalto de los kit car contra los WRC. Rallies en los que todavía participaban las leyendas de los 80 (Salonen, Biasion, Vatanen, etc.). Desde mediados de los 2000 se jodió y aunque desde el 2013 han mejorado, ya nunca serán lo mismo me temo.
how come is it that all the other motor sports on tv are shown more or less live or there seems to b more of on tv but when its rally u never see it live on tv its always highlights pissis me off when are they gona start showing it live and more of it on tv
i want somebody to tell me how group A in now adays can be faster from group B ..Group b was 600hp and as s1 was 4x4 how now the 300hp cars can be faster and don`t forget that the old cars was more heavy.
modern wrc and the group A cars are faster because technology progresses.gpB cars handled terrible and the brakes were nothing compared to modern cars.its not all about hp.power is nothing without control. the gpB cars may look and sound impressive,but people get caught up in the romance of them.its like the stupid myth of the s4 at estoril.
marky mark New cars with their anti-lag turbo systems, more advanced AWD, better areodynamics, lower centers of gravity, and general strength mean more speed. A car moving all over the place may look cool, and seem awesome, (well I mean, they are) but control is a bit more important. Also to note how the 1980's f1 cars with their 1100hp and less weight are slower than modern F1 cars with half the power and more weight. All comes down to technology.
Group A cars like Impreza will not slow down much on a corner, they carry a lot more speed, they will slow down from 110mph to 90mph whereas that Audi from Group B would do 110mph and then drop down to 50mph to take that corner . Group B are a hell of a lot more efficient. Group B wasted a lot of energy.
Fact:in 1985 or 86 (don't remember) Lancia was testing the Delta s4 in Portugal (Estoril race track) and Henri toivonen lapped the track with a Time good for 6th on the grid if he entered a f1 race (qualification) with the Delta s4 any group a or WRC car would do that. ( Not to mention f1 in the 80's made 1000hp with qualification engine)
Mid 70s-mid or possibly late 80s was the golden age of Rally, Its even known for being that. Then 90s rally was also very interresting but not as much as it was about 10 years earlier. Then today i think its still fun but not even close to the old days of rally.
In che senso puoi andare? già con rollbar montato non puoi poi tutto il resto. Pensi di andare al supermercato a fare la spesa con un delta gruppo A? Mah
@@maurizioburatti213 Nel senso che la carrozzeria del gruppo A è identica alle auto di serie. Anche la cavalleria non si differenzia di tanto. Bastava poco e avevi 300cv. Roll bar No! Non è questo il senso del mio ragionamento. Una WRC non puoi comprarla dal concessionario. E la differenza a livello economico é davvero tanto tra WRC e GruppoA...anche a livello prestazionale ovviamente.
![WRC Rally "Group A" Cars on Tarmac (Speed & Pure Engine Sound) [HD]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/-bTEAHdBK3A/mqdefault.jpg)
Regardless of the Rally Era you prefer, just let this sink in for a moment:
These are guys, going sideways...at average 180km/h...mostly in dirt...with short-geared horsepower monsters...in a road between woods.
Personally, unlike some other motorsports, rallying is the only one I can always be sure drivers are 100% driving with skill and guts through those courses. These guys here have little to no guardrails/gravelpits, just trees.
I often get carried away thinking at Gr.B or Gr.4, but then again, rallying as it is, is brutal, beastly.
TheCobra21 for me in modern rally thé car dors so much
Rallying is prime time driving.
Those were the days! Impreza, Evo, Delta, Escort Cossie, Celica GT4 etc!! The cars that replace them now are nothing in comparison!
Group A > Group B > modern WRC
I love seeing a super tuned version of a car you can go buy, but not boring little hatch backs like the Fiesta and Polo nowadays.
scruffy cars nowadays are getting to big and fat that's why they use small hatchbacks now and even then the wheel base of a fiesta is longer than a group a Scooby I miss the old stuff though wrc and f1 was far more exiting today it's just boring even the drivers their all to polite no drama
Wrong order Scruffy - should be (in order of timeline) Group B (which in turn got banned after 1986) > which forced Group A to be created > modern WRC 2.0T > current WRC 1.6T regs. Agree however Group A/90's brought lovely road going version that had to be sold to the public to meet then rally regulations.
Think also the Current Toyota Yaris rally campaign is a case in point all that effort to gain PR for the brand/Yaris but apart from the short lived GRMN rocket no fast Yaris available for the public to buy (a go faster looking one but not even the power of my Polo BlueGT 150ps 1.4T or what my next choice likely to be the New Suzuki Swift Sport 1.4T 138bhp car).....so sort of can't get my head round the point of it? At least Hyundai have the i30N monster for fans to choose (can't afford that one!).
Group B>WRC>Group A
@@markturner-smith5309 "Wrong" my balls; he thinks that's the right order for him. And, by the way, he also thinks that current cars are boring, such an opinion that I respect, but they're neither boring nor exciting: it all depends on the subjective view of each person. I think they're amazing machines, and them being tiny hatchbacks is specially good for me. So here you have, my subjective view: WRC > Group B > Group A.
Today's cars are quicker and that shows in comparative stage times,but for pure sight and sound you can't beat the old group A and B.
Everyone seems to ignore the sound. I'm not convinced that WRC cars are faster than the older Group A cars from 1993 and 1994 when there was a 38mm restrictor. The modern cars sound awful with their high pitched buzzy bee exhaust noise restricted to a pathetic 100db noise level. The older cars sounded far superior with their deep growling, exhaust exploding noise and this adds to the impression of speed. The current cars have a pathetic 'pop' - the older cars had gut wrenching explosions. Rallying died with the 100db noise restriction.
I also think WRC have gone down the drain nowadays. The appeal of rally was that it was mostly just regular cars competing wich would make you able to relate to the cars they are driving, today there´s only the steel skeleton wich a WRC car have in common with a production car, and even the steel skeleton get slightly modificated. Did the Group A also have an H-pattern shifter and clutch?
Hymer300 Yes, they did. None of this massive rod type thing to change gear and handbrake next to the wheel!
HannuMikkola You mean sequential gearbox?..
that's the point! wrc cars, even from the early days (1997-8), all make the same high pitch buzz
10110 01001 I agree - WRC cars always sounded pathetic. It's not happened in the last few years. Like i said, you have to go back to 1994 with the larger 38mm restrictor to hear loud, barking, flame throwing, anti lag exploding rally cars. But Malcolm Wilson loves all this WRC shit.
2:43 me playing Gran Turismo
chipsnever957 legend
Me too
That was Colin McRae
Lmao always crashing in the curves 😂
The only people who think WRC cars sound any good are those who never heard the unrestricted sound of the Audi quattro or the Toyota Celica ST185 and ST205 from 1993 and 1994. The shitty farty noise that the cars make now does nothing to add to the impression of speed. The modern cars just don't look as fast because they don't sound loud and powerful.
HannuMikkola your right what you say,they all sound the same nowadays. with wrc,group A and group B you could tell one car from the other by noise. Which made the sport more interesting and the main one,especially group B,group A you could actually buy a car which was very similar to what you seen on the tv.
1. Don’t fucking say that, the Subaru 555 WRC car sounds amazing, though the Audi Quattros and the other two were also amazing.
2. Does the sound matter? No, it’s a damn race, sound means jack shit when the car is better than the competition.
3. Again, a car’s illusion of speed means jack in a real race.
I like all rally car’s noises.
You said that 5 years ago. I don't think you'll say the same with the new cars we have since 2017. If yes, it doesn't matters anyway: it's all about subjectivity. For example, there's people that thinks the Lancia 037 was the best looking car ever, but I think it's utter crap. It's all about tastes, my friend.
90's, the best rally years !!!
i love '90's rally! great video!
and i love ur channel man!
those early subaru's were tough as nails havent seen anything like it, toyota corolla's had some serious competition back then
I agree. Never had luck to watch WRC live but i ve seen few WRC cars in action in Euro champs in 97 - 02 and Corolla WRC is my favorite..
Somebody commented that "nothing is faster on a corner than group b" you are wrong the point was grp b cars didn't corner well at all grp a ended up being much faster
and that is a fact. On tarmac, Group B cars are much slower than Group A cars when it comes to hairpin.
Probably due to electronic aids and mostly evolution of rubber. But if you check times from 1986 and 2017 there isn't much difference on similar distance special stages.
fetuso fetuso FINALLY someone who actually checks the facts. The ONLY reason modern cars are faster than group b cars through the corners is because of modern tires, the allowed use of a handbrake and downforce (which shouldn't even be on a fucking rally car, but that's another argument). But that doesn't matter, as group b cars are superior in every single other way, including homologation, spectator enjoyment and driver difficulty. Speed isn't everything, not by a long shot...
@ Sorry but with all the due respect, your statement is completely wrong.
Group Bs were true monsters, there is no question about it. However, their powerband was very hard to use, they might have been on par with some of the more modern cars on very fast stages where cornering was not as important but when it comes to chassis, tires, suspension geometry/technology, engine (not raw power but when the peak power is reached), transmission, brakes, basically EVERYTHING except peak power, modern cars beat Group B any day. And I am not just referring to the current 2020 WRC cars, even current R5 cars would beat group B cars in a normal rally. The only place you MIGHT see a group B car beating a modern rally car is the drag strip or, as I mentioned earlier, a stage where there are a lot of straights with little cornering or deceleration.
If you are looking at difference in stage times on the same stage but different years, keep in mind that stages change VERY often, perhaps the lenght is kept similar but stages might be moved 1-2-300 meters up or down a road and they are not exacly the same one year after the other. They can be shortened or Chicanes might have been added in certain areas. With that being said, time gaps of 1 second per km of special stage is a HUGE gap in rally.
Hot take! Group A was the best era of rally
The decade when we had no sponsors like Rockstar, Redbull of Monster Energy!
yeah but you had cigarette companies instead
Zulous and alcohol companies.
When rally was amazing
omg just found your channel and im in love, thanks for the uploads
Everyone needs to not argue about which cars are better! Group b, group a, wrc, it doesn't matter, they're all awesome! Rallying is the coolest Motorsport in the world so let's just appreciate it in all its forms
Pure sound and driving skills!
Love it
Thanks for this great video
Simply PERFECT video, Really Thanks...
Thank you, for this video!
This is the TRUE WRC..
Actually, Ari Vatanen Was doing rallys on a works Ford Escort Cosworth with red bull sponsorship around 94 on the wrc
I went off rallying when the corolla came into play. That's when I realised these cars weren't no longer based on production models. The hole homologation was my biggest attraction. That you could actually buy a road going version was appealing.
Now they look like spaceship that have nothing in common with their road going counterparts.
With nr 2 is Toyota Celica IV generation (st165). With nr 6 is Lancia Delta Integrale.
we need to get the 90's Group A rallying back!!! there is way to much technology in the cars today
If less technology is what you want, then you'd want to stick with the current WRC cars. As the FIA's regulations state: "Any driving aid system is prohibited (ABS / ASR / Traction Control / ESP...). Any such system must be rendered inoperative." [1]. On the other hand, Group A cars were getting increasingly more and more assisted by electronic aids [2].
[1] www.fia.com/file/82330/download/20694
[2] tech-racingcars.wikidot.com/subaru-impreza-gc8-555, ua-cam.com/video/gAkk1w6GEcE/v-deo.html, etc.
@RallyBySte Despite the fatal crashes, I´m still in love with the 80's rallying... Nothing sounds and will never sound better than a Group B car. Dear God...
Love the video, it's just a shame that the further into the video I go. The cars get less and less like the models you could buy. Until the rally cars end up being just a shell of their original self.
Bring back homologation rules!
ギャランVR-4は出てなかった？
Great video! Todays WRC´s are toys compared to the group A and B monsters
Extreme 90' Rrally...magic👍
do you know the place of the stage at 00.49?
No matter what period of time. Rallying is still awesome.
These guys were just damn crazy! oh those old rally days...
Great upload thanks..
whats the diofference between group a and wrc?
+eatthisvr6 In a nutshell group A had to have a road car equivalent when it comes to engine, drivetrain, measurements of the body and axles. The base car (road car) was developed to be quicker, sturdier, louder but it appeared like a normal road car. If you wanted to compete in group A (A8 class) you had to build a rally car based on 4WD, 2ltr, 4 cylinder, ca. 300bhp road car. That's why we were blessed with production legends such as Lancia Delta Integrale, Subaru Impreza, Mitsubishi Evo, Toyota Celica etc. All these cars were produced so that the group A rally car could be built from one of them.
Homologation rules changed for the introduction of WRC cars. Manufacturers no longer had to use a road car equivalent in terms of drivetrain, engine etc. For WRC build, they could choose a car with 1.6l engine, 110bhp and FWD as a homologation base. Citroen C4 for example. As a road car it was never 4WD, 2.0 turbo, 300bhp+ etc, yet they built a C4 WRC. Now if Citroen wanted to build a C4 group A in the 90s (up until 1997) they would've had to produce a road going C4 with 4WD, 2ltr turbo engine, around 300bhp, wider body for wider track, etc. These were major rule differences, but performance wise the early WRCs were comparable to late group A. For instance Mitsubishi used a group A Evo until 2001 even though their rivals had WRC cars since 97! To make matters worse for WRC users, Tommi Makinen beat them for 3 consecutive years (97,98,99) in a group A Evo:) This was a one off combination though. Of course WRC was being constantly developed (especially diff electronics) and in 1999 you could see these cars were quicker than the group A Evos.
In essence group A was louder and more raw and aggressive and more spectacular to watch as diff management electronics & hydraulics were not as advanced. That meant the cars didn't have as much traction so they would flick the cars into corners and slide a lot:) My favourite time in rallying was '90s up until mid 2000s.
I could go on and on:)
+wisniorek thanks for the info, i used to watch group a but wrc has gone the same way as f1 imo ie too much tech making them boring to watch and actually hides the skill needed to drive them.
f1 is particularly bad atm because teh current crop of drivers are among the best ever imo (theres 4 or 5 who would fit right in to any era) but its just garbage to watch
eatthisvr6 With regards to F1, I still enjoy it, mainly because of the drivers. Some people say they aren't colourful enough, but I disagree. The sound of the cars is a big issue for a purist like myself, but I try to take out as much as I can out of every other aspect of F1. The races are as good and entertaining as in the past, we have entertaining drivers who refuse to go along with the PR bullsh (Vettel and Hamilton), they still race on legendary tracks, there's always controversy about something... That's what I'm focussing on and that's why I still enjoy watching it.
Now, in rally in mid 90's we had it all - charismatic drivers in awesome machines! But hey, nothing lasts forever;)
+wisniorek monaco is a shit track and was always about nothing but money, the other legendary tracks have been seriously neutered by safety measures too.
i like the current drivers and hamilton reminds me alot of mansell
+eatthisvr6 Marcus Grönholm saida exactly the very same that Monaco is just a piece of shit as a rally. Not these words but said this is so useless, stupid and doesn't make sense to drive rally so extreme circumstances from ice to mud and gravel and wet and dry tarmac. There isn't one tyres for all of that. Money is the only reason to make a show to those filthy rich assholes. Marcus said that this isn't real rally at all.
3:41 amazing clip
Rally Portugal, providing some of the worlds best rally footage since..........who cares!
Why does Escort Group A sound so different from Escort WRC?
Same power, same engine 🤷♂️
I've always asked myself this
@@canespastico Thanks God I'm not the only one
Maybe not same engine or exhaust
does anyone know about the source of this video...??
What a vid... awesome 👍
Golden old days!
It's AWESOME! I think, it's a very good movie, from a very good era!
And I'm watching this in 2021, february 24 th
On the limit all the time with one hand on the steering wheel & the other on a gearstick properly changing gear epic
Is that celica RWD?
70s rally was very cool, 80s was insanely cool and crazy, 90s were very cool, today is still cool but not close to back then. I agree 80s rally was the best of the best.
the filter is pretty cool on the video makes it look like 70s-80s rally footage
What filter?
Feature car not featured.. negative vote
2:02 I don't need to see the name on the read side windows to know it's C.McRae :D
My favourite era. "Real" road going cars, not silhouette ones...
Same
My fav group a car is the lan evo 4 and gc8
which machines, which sounds, great drivers, 90 were much
probably said it before,anyway,best channel!!
ooo come on people....this video is about Group A and WRC...no one talks about Group B
Love it...!
1982-> group B? The Peugeot 205T16? 0-100 in 3 seconds... on gravel... my point is that group B was legendary, 90 were cool and fun, espicially the Lancia, nowdays boring as hell... i say bring the good old days back!
Why have you panned the audio from left - right or right - left for every clip, defeats the point of saying "pure audio" And it's pretty wrong seeing a car drive off straight ahead into the distance as the sound is moving to the left
+Skopey Dude! I TOTALLY agree! That shit is super annoying and defeats the purpose!
The early WRC cars of the late 90s, we're awesome as the grA. Now its are yes powerful and similar to the old grB. But too much electronics and ...moderns.
In fact, those early WRC and even some Group A cars had plenty of electronic devices to aid on the driving, while today's WRC cars have NOTHING. As the FIA's regulations states: "Any driving aid system is prohibited (ABS / ASR / Traction Control / ESP...). Any such system must be rendered inoperative." - www.fia.com/file/82330/download/20694
Yes ,that was Kankkunen for sure.
World rally car gruppe was when everything started to go the wrong way🥺. Great cars in gr. A
Yesss! HB, Rothmans, Camel, Marlboro, 555 and Mocne are the right for men :)
80's had power, sound and incredibly fast development, but late 90's (last A8's and first WRC's) had nicest driving style.
BTW., what car is it in 1:33? Looks and sounds like Stratos!?
I believe the car shown during 1:33 is either the Lancia Delta or the Subaru Legacy?
Looks and sounds nothing like a Stratos. What have you been smoking?!
Toyota Celica
ST165 TC to be precise.
Bring back homologation. People want cars they can relate to and children 'future fans' want to see cars they can aspire to own.
with in a few years group A cars were quicker than gpB cars.
so you can imagine how much quicker modern wrc cars are.
wrc have far more torque and much better transmission and technology
Sin duda la mejor época de los rallies, los Grupo B están muy sobrevalorados, desde finales de los 80 a principios de los 2000, es la era de oro de los rallies, por pilotos (Sainz, Mcrae, Kankkunen, Makinen, Auriol, Burns, Gronholm...), por coches (Toyota Celica y Corolla, Subaru Impreza, Mitsubishi Lancer, Peugeot 206, Citroen Xasara, primero kit car y luego WRC, los Ford Escort primero y luego el Focus, Seat Córdoba...) y todavía los rallies eran de verdad, no como ahora, por km contra el crono, número de tramos diferentes, sin mierdas de power stage y esas historias. Una época en la que tomaban la salida 6 o 7 campeones del mundo a la vez, junto con grandes secundarios, muchas veces especialistas en esa superficie (Delecour, Panizzi, Ericsson, Erikson, Radstrom...). Qué luchas en asfalto de los kit car contra los WRC. Rallies en los que todavía participaban las leyendas de los 80 (Salonen, Biasion, Vatanen, etc.). Desde mediados de los 2000 se jodió y aunque desde el 2013 han mejorado, ya nunca serán lo mismo me temo.
3:00 so precise !! Whos driving ?
Heard st185 gt4 couple of seconds in and immediately liked
how come is it that all the other motor sports on tv are shown more or less live or there seems to b more of on tv but when its rally u never see it live on tv its always highlights pissis me off when are they gona start showing it live and more of it on tv
Ben Conway quite hard when you have 30+ cars going over 10 ish stages a day around average 200km long total to get that, that's my understanding.
Dammm the speed, wow
@jfab2525 ...Pero estuvieron muy cerca de hacerlo y la FIA no dejó...
Me on way to Costco 20 mins before closing usually.
So what? The cars you see in this video were faster than them over a standard rally stage...
I like group a
lol you make me realize that there were no energy drinks back then...its a kinda recent thing
4:25
@SennaHamilton4ever you have reason, but the I've seen the 90's in live
i want somebody to tell me how group A in now adays can be faster from group B ..Group b was 600hp and as s1 was 4x4 how now the 300hp cars can be faster and don`t forget that the old cars was more heavy.
modern wrc and the group A cars are faster because technology progresses.gpB cars handled terrible and the brakes were nothing compared to modern cars.its not all about hp.power is nothing without control.
the gpB cars may look and sound impressive,but people get caught up in the romance of them.its like the stupid myth of the s4 at estoril.
marky mark New cars with their anti-lag turbo systems, more advanced AWD, better areodynamics, lower centers of gravity, and general strength mean more speed. A car moving all over the place may look cool, and seem awesome, (well I mean, they are) but control is a bit more important. Also to note how the 1980's f1 cars with their 1100hp and less weight are slower than modern F1 cars with half the power and more weight. All comes down to technology.
Vivos71 And don't forget tires technology too, which has moved A LOT from the 80s and 90s.
Group A cars like Impreza will not slow down much on a corner, they carry a lot more speed, they will slow down from 110mph to 90mph whereas that Audi from Group B would do 110mph and then drop down to 50mph to take that corner . Group B are a hell of a lot more efficient. Group B wasted a lot of energy.
Fact:in 1985 or 86 (don't remember) Lancia was testing the Delta s4 in Portugal (Estoril race track) and Henri toivonen lapped the track with a Time good for 6th on the grid if he entered a f1 race (qualification) with the Delta s4 any group a or WRC car would do that. ( Not to mention f1 in the 80's made 1000hp with qualification engine)
You don`t see Nordic turns eny more. That a shame.
fantastico
increibleeeeeeeeeee!!!!!!!!
that sideways jump tho..
"Don't worry folks, he's alrighhtttttt"
@SilverSurfer102 it's Sainz
na i'd say the 70s and 80s were the best years
RIP Colin McRea
No shit Sherlock. Todays Group B cars would be faster than 30 year old WRC cars.
nice !
who has more balls? the driver? or the people standing right next to him when he lands his car from a 4 foot jump lol...
80's Grup B rules
90s - The year Subaru made the *I*M*P*R*E*Z*A*
THE FUCKING LEGEND CALLED COLLIN MCRAE DROVE IT
GOD DAMN....
Faz falta os sedãns no rally, só tem Hatch.
4:27 great!!!!
Group A cars were a huge cold shower after Group B
group A were quicker than gpB with in a couple of years.modern wrc are far quicker.
Yes, in couple of years the were, but 1987 was bad .
SRAMEK they did need a bit more character i will admit.lol
@@SRAMEK Considering that manufacturers only had seven months to develope and homologate 500 cars, I think they did pretty well.
Mid 70s-mid or possibly late 80s was the golden age of Rally, Its even known for being that. Then 90s rally was also very interresting but not as much as it was about 10 years earlier. Then today i think its still fun but not even close to the old days of rally.
lol, they are both different era's, drivers don't get a choice of what to drive.
6:10 nice!!!
@RallyBySte 80's where the bet years for rally. group B!!!!
fantástic
Growers as of today's screamers.pure grunt.
Brrr brrr brrr followed by barp barpbarp
Lancia delta hf evo!!!!
Il bello di un gruppo A é che potevi possedere con 40.000 Euro. Una WRC costa 300.000 Euro è non puoi andare su normali strade. Una Lancia Delta Si!
In che senso puoi andare? già con rollbar montato non puoi poi tutto il resto. Pensi di andare al supermercato a fare la spesa con un delta gruppo A? Mah
@@maurizioburatti213 Nel senso che la carrozzeria del gruppo A è identica alle auto di serie. Anche la cavalleria non si differenzia di tanto. Bastava poco e avevi 300cv. Roll bar No! Non è questo il senso del mio ragionamento. Una WRC non puoi comprarla dal concessionario. E la differenza a livello economico é davvero tanto tra WRC e GruppoA...anche a livello prestazionale ovviamente.
Ah ok spiega5o così sono d accordo ma come avevi scritto te sembra che con una delta gruppo A potevi andare su normali strade