The Goeben & The Breslau - Two German Ships Under Ottoman Flag I THE GREAT WAR On The Road
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- Опубліковано 10 чер 2018
- How SMS Goeben and SMS Breslau, two German battleships in 1914 sailed under Ottoman flag and helped Enver Pasha to get the Ottoman Empire into World War 1.
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» WHAT ARE YOUR SOURCES?
Videos: British Pathé
Pictures: Mostly Picture Alliance
Background Map: d-maps.com/carte.php?num_car=6...
Literature (excerpt):
Gilbert, Martin. The First World War. A Complete History, Holt Paperbacks, 2004.
Hart, Peter. The Great War. A Combat History of the First World War, Oxford University Press, 2013.
Hart, Peter. The Great War. 1914-1918, Profile Books, 2013.
Stone, Norman. World War One. A Short History, Penguin, 2008.
Keegan, John. The First World War, Vintage, 2000.
Hastings, Max. Catastrophe 1914. Europe Goes To War, Knopf, 2013.
Hirschfeld, Gerhard. Enzyklopädie Erster Weltkrieg, Schöningh Paderborn, 2004
Michalka, Wolfgang. Der Erste Weltkrieg. Wirkung, Wahrnehmung, Analyse, Seehamer Verlag GmbH, 2000
Leonhard, Jörn. Die Büchse der Pandora: Geschichte des Ersten Weltkrieges, C.H. Beck, 2014
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"Are you a German sailor?"
"Nein, I am Ottoman."
"It seems like you just put on a different hat."
"Nein, I am Ottoman."
"What's your name?"
"Fritz Hoffenmeyer...oglu."
"Right, that checks out."
Meirstein best comment ever
As a Turk I approve
@bm3racer Hoffenmeyer is no german name. Believe me. I'm german.
hahahah nice saying someone as a Turk ;)))
@@wonderfalg Hmmm that changes the whole joke then :D
@@ottoman_reenactor_ct exactly, I admit as well
I do like the "literally just add fez" to the Germans. Now that's a nice and simply solution.
Philip Balfour add fez, go bomb allies, turkey is now in war.
(Puts on fez) We Turks now bois, er kamerads! Hahaha, I love it!
Everything is better with a Fez!
Most people use regular razors to shave their beards. I use an ex german battleship to shave mine.
The Black Prince hahahhaaahhahaha well if you don’t have war to worry about and your economy is potato, you would do the same l guess :D
You should trade personal grooming ideas with US Admiral Ernest King. According to FDR, "He shaves every morning with a blowtorch.”
Battleships ! the best an Ottoman can geeeet !
A few years ago we had a advertising campaign here in Germany in which a DIY market made hammers from scrapped tanks.
The Black Prince Derby razor blades that are made in Turkey?
I have always been impressed with the move to sell the German ships to Turkey to both elude the British ship trying to sink them and to ingratiate themselves to the Turks, who were stiffed of the ships the British were building for them; the cleverest diplomatic move in the 20th Century.
It was not Germany's idea to sell them, the Ottomans proposed it and actually published the purchase and the price of 80 million marks in the papers before Berlin approved the move. From Eugene Rogan's The Fall of the Ottomans
One of the officers on board Breslau was a young lieutenant named Karl Dönitz. After a spell in the Turkish Navy, he returned to Germany to train for the submarine service. He subsequently served on a U-boat out of the Adriatic. In the final months of the war he was captain of a U-boat and was captured by the Royal Navy and imprisoned on Malta. Now, if Breslau had not joined the Turkish fleet... If... If.. If...
Wasn’t he the Admiral if the German Submarine fleet in WW2?
He also grand admiral of the kriegsmarine
@@lukecox2782 Yes, he was initially Commander of the Submarines, but became Supreme Commander of the German Navy about halfway through the war (succeeding Raeder). He also was - very briefly - Hitler's successor.
0:25 if you were there during WW1 you certainly weren't lucky.
As a Turk i need to mention that Midilli is also the name of Aegean island of Lesvos. It does also mean pony but i think ship's name coming from the name of island not the animal.
TurkishHedgehog True
There was a continuous war scare since 1913 between Greece and the Ottoman Empire, as the Ottomans were refusing to recognize the loss of the western Aegean Islands to Greece during the Balkan Wars . If WW1 had not happened a Greek-Ottoman War would probably would had erupted in 1914. It led to a dreadnought race with the Ottomans buying Agincourt (Sultan Osman I) and Erin(Resadiye), and the Greeks ordering Salamis (initially a BC but then upgraded to BB) and prepare to order a french dreadnought (Vasilefs Constantinos) . Terrified that the Ottoman dreadnoughts would arrive before a Greek one, they then bought as a stop gag the two Mississippi class US pre-dreadnoughts (Kilkis and Lemnos). The war scare also led to Metaxas doing his seminal study for an invasion of the Dardanelles were he concluded that absent surprise and a de-mobilized Ottoman Empire, no attempt to break the Straits would succeed. There was a fear the Goeben would be used in a Greek-Ottoman war rather than in the world war (indeed to be frank that would had been the smarter Ottoman policy- a local war in alliance with Bulgarian in 1914 against Greece, and then figure it out)
Two great studies on this Mustafa Aksakal "The Ottoman Road to War, 1914", and Zisis Fortakis "Greek Naval Strategy and Policy 1910-1923"
Konstantinos Travlos Κύδος!
also should be noted that the public subscription for the Ottoman dreadnoughts was partly used as a tool against the Ottoman Greek community, with part of it being forced to fund the public subscription as part of the CUP(IFC) economic war against Ottoman Greeks (the other part being the forced expulsion of Ottoman Greeks from Thrace and the Aydin/Aydinion region). For more see Fuat Dundar "Moderniye Turkiye Sifresi" (O mystikos kodikas tis neoteris Tourkias). Later Turkish Republic president Celal Bayar was an instrumental person in this.
also the islands in question were overwhelmingly Greek populated (89-90%) even according to Ottoman population estimates (see Karpat's book on Ottoman Population). They were claimed on strategic , not demographic reasons.
This is just an amazing channel. You're very informative and a great host, Indy.
Midilli indeed means pony but ship's name comes from the Turkish name for the Island of Lesvos
The Goeben is my favorite war story. Indy and Can told it really well. For a longer version and more details, read the chapter "The Flight of the Goeben" in Barbara Tuchman's The Guns of August.
i just read that book a few weeks ago and i endorse this comment highly
Great chapter! Funny fact is that she was on the italian steamer which witnessed the action among breslau and goeben against the gloucester commanded by capitain kelly! She was one of the grandchilds of Mr Morgenthau the american ambassador in the otoman empire.
When the ships reached Greek waters, the German Ambassador in Athens bought every fuel he could and asked permission to refuel the ships on the shores of an islet. PM Venizelos asked the British embassy. Since the ships were not sold to the Ottomans yet, and Greece was neutral, the ambassador said he had no objections. If they had been sold to the Ottomans, it is highly possible that they could be blocked before the Straits...
P.S. The name _"Midilli"_ is the turkish name for the island of Lesbos, it was named so to make a territorial claim (Cemal Pasha, one of the Three Pashas, was born there)
You are an endless source of valuable informations
Metaxas really hammered on this in his 1934-1935 article exchanges with Venizelos on the causes and history of the National Schism.
I wonder if he said anything about the surrender of eastern Macedonia in 1916 and his role in the paramilitary organization 'σύνδεσμος επιστρατων'
Konstantinos Travlos Βέβαια, προς το τέλος της ζωής του μετάνιωσε, γράφοντας στο ημερολόγιο του το "φταίμε όλοι"
Στο αρχειακο υλικο της η Π.Δελτα αναφερει πως ο Μεταξας εγραψε ''ας με συγχωρεσει ο θεος για το 19 σβησμενο(μαλλον 1915 η 1916 λεει η Δελτα)
Flo is the key to all of this.
It's like poetry.
They rhyme
Because he's a funnier German than we ever had before
Actually, this wasn't the first time these ships(especially SMS Goeben) were in Ottoman land. Goeben was in the German Mediterranean Divison and in fact had visited quite a lot of Ottoman Ports before the war(İskenderun, aka Little Alexandria and Constantinople). In 1913,(during Balkan Wars) Goeben had visited Constantinople. Ottoman Grand Vizier(prime minister) Mahmud Şevket Pasha asked the German Ambassador Wangenheim to purchase the ship to win the war at sea with Greece. The ambassador contacted the foreign ministry and told the Grand Vizier that it's impossible to sell Goeben to Ottoman Empire because Germany had declared it's neutrality in the Balkan Wars and added "Even if we sell this ship to you, you don't have any adequate crew to use it". So the ship stayed in the German Navy. When Goeben and Breslau joined the Ottoman Navy in 1914, the Ottoman crew
broke the ship(Breslau) in just 15 days by inserting the wrong kind of ammo into the turrets. So the German Ambassador and the Foreign Ministry was unfortunately right:) You can read "The Ship That Changed The World: The Escape of Goeben to the Dardanelles" by Dan Van der Vat for more information. It has some interesting records of radio messages of Goeben.
iki dakkada anasini sikmişiz yani makinenin.
@@dirensare hahah ulan :D
@@dirensare ondan almanlar Balkan Savaşları sırasında gemiyi vermek istemedi ya. "Gemileri size satarsak sizin gemileri kullanacak mürettebatınız yok." dediler. Biz de "E o zaman gemileri mürettebatıyla satın." dedik. Ve sattılar, daha sonrada artık sanırım bir şekilde bazı Osmanlı askerleri Midilli mürettebatına katıldı ve geminin nasıl kullanıldığını bilmedikleri için zaten Midilli'nin fazla olmayan toplarından birine yanlış mermiyi yerleştirerek bozdular. :d
The historian once again is terrific and so knowledgeable. He was a great addition to your trip to Turkey. I hope you can use him in the future especially when you do WWII .
FLO is still the best though. We can't upset him. Right FLO .
Im Turkish, and so happy to see you in Turkey. Thanks for the effort
I just love this entire Gallipoli special series, engaging co-host!
loved the wrap up shot! you guys have great chemistry and make an awesome team!!!!
Another wonderful episode. Keep 'em coming, fellas!
A great episode. Danke, Indy!
allways nice to watch you guys. Made my evening!
Always fascinating to see the places where history happened... :O
Yet another fantastic and informative episode indeed !!!
I have been aboard the famous Royal Hellenic Navy - Greek Navy Flagship , Battle Cruiser Georgios Averof with her 9.2 inch guns !
She is moored at Palaio Faliro , Athens , Hellas , Greece . She is of The same" Vintage" of the famous Breslau named after The Eastern German City.
Georgios Averof was fighting in The Great War , The Greco Turkish War or 1919 -1922 and WW2 . She was known as (Nickname) " Uncle George " by the Greeks and "Seitan Papor by the Turks.
A must see Museum Ship if you ever Visit Athens , along with The Acropolis to Athena!
Fun fact, the cruiser squadron under Troubridge's command contained the ships Warrior, Black Prince, Duke of Edinburgh and Defense. Only the Duke of Edinburgh would survive the war, the rest were all sunk at the Battle of Jutland, of which two, the Black Prince and Defense, were lost with all hands.
Interesting and informative video. Great job.
Very informative keep it up
Your guest Can is great !
Britain will definitely take the Dardanelles before Christmas, screencap this.
R4d3K98 TFW ANZAC forces left gallipoli in December 20th 1915
cemo1999 DON'T SPOIL IT
R4d3K98 ANZACS ended up just taking Jerusalem, Damascus, Aleppo, and Gaza, while destroying the Armies of the Ottoman Empire at the battle of Meddigo. No biggie.
Brooke Whittle True but this is gallipoli we are talking about ;) Plus I am glad they got Us Turks out of those cursed lands
As a turkish loosing arab land is blessing.. The only loss was mosul province of Iraq...No need for deserts.
thx for uploading
Great Episode !
The thumbnail made me think that it would be a tour of the actual ships. Cool video as always though! Well done.
In hindsight the Turks probably needed a large navy more so then the Germans.
Ottoman empire nose dived as soon as they lost the naval power in the Mediterranean.
براہمداغ .....wich they did in the Balkan wars
They lost naval power long before that I'm afraid.
Nothing turned a warship quicker into scrap than the service in the Ottoman Navy. They have maintained their ships poorly.
The Ships at 5:15 look AWESOME! A thousand stories in that one scene. Looks like old (it is 1914, and these look like they were 20-30 yrs old?)
One on the end looks to be converted into construction/repair sortaship? just... wow.
and a submersible launch/construction platform? We have these NOW and people think they are modern tech...
The battle of lake Tanganyika was the craziest battle ever.
Such a great story, Can is one of the best historian in Turkey.
‘Cruisin by as battle cruisers do’. I always wondered why they call them cruisers. Thanks Indy!
Love you guys
fascinating to learn more after reading Tuchman's chapter in Guns of August on this ships
TGW on the road, 3 awesome episodes in a row
At 7:33, the gentleman on the left look eerily like Sir Anthony Hopkins.
He does!
Can't stop watching
You can tell how into this story Indy is by how much he waves his arms around.
A very exciting story very well told. This was the first of a number of disappointing actions for the Royal Navy in the Great War, the naval action at Gallipoli in March 1915, Jutland and Zeebrugge among others. Troubridge was court=martialled for not showing the Nelsonian spirit of " engage the enemy more closely ", but was acquitted.
There are so many great Great War stories such as this, at a time when military and naval tradition collided with modern technology. I fervently wish this channel would continue to tell of some of the lesser know incidents and characters of the war.
Yeah royal navy suffered some embarrassments at coronel a horrible preformance in the start and end of Jutland and every single elsecond of gallipoli
Intriguing stories and this part in history.
Amazing episode. I really miss Lindy
Indy seemed even more enthusiastic than usual
Can is awesome!
There he was posing again, praise Flo ;-)!
There's a very detailed account of that story in "Guns of August" IIRC. Very interesting game between the captains.
Lots of hand gestures.
Is the Italy trip still fresh in the mind?
Long live the German-Ottoman Friendship.
If Turks helped Germans with Soviet in Caucas and in Middle-east then through Suez Canal and North Africa, Axis would won......
@Redsand why not?
@Redsand we are talkin about WW1 man, c'mon lol
6:40, Agincourt aka Rio de Janeiro aka Sultan Osman l, that some twisted story of ownership.
You can tell Can has just been chilling reading his history books in the Canakkale sun, smoking hash and smashing through some kadayif and cay.
You two do well on screen together
@9:40 That is an airplane fuselage on the deck. Did the Goeben (or Yavuz) carry spotter planes? Or was it transporting the plane for another reason?
I really like his wisdom and vest :D
Midilli also is the Turkish name of Lesvos (greek: mitilini)
Crazy how it the ship got turned into razor blades lmao.
Not really. There's a fair bit of materiel in any ship that is reusable/recyclable. There is a place in Pakistan(I think) where they drive ships up on the beach and start breaking them up.
Can you do a video about the Harlem Hellfighters?
Indy summed up the first few chapters of Massie’s “Dreadnought” in a much more animated and entertaining manner.
Also, Can the Man!
that outro was badass
How sad that such a stunning ship ended up that way (razor blades)!
I'm currently reading "No End Save Victory", an anthology of WWII memoirs and one of them gives some background to Italian underwater exploits in mentioning a WWI Italian naval special ops unit that on Oct 31, 1918, penetrated the protective nets of the Austrian battle fleet harbored in Pola, north Adriatic, and sank the Austrian dreadnought Viribus Unitis. Could you flesh out this small unit penetration from the Chair of Wisdom or perhaps devote an episode to such elite, small unit operations of the various armies and navies during WWI? Thanks for an entertaining and educational show. My best to you and your hard working crew.
Walter Alter
poet ex cathedra
I can't believe that you guys are here! Is there any possibilty of preparing a get together with fans, a panel or something? I would love to attend if I can
We were in Turkey 2 months ago and had two fan meetings. Announced that on the channel in multiple videos.
Indy having a blast in Turkey, nice !
Love the pronunciation of Gloucester!
Can you guys visit the HMS M33. It would fit well with your Gallipoli series.
E11 could also use a video
und es gibt einen schönen Roman darüber, called "Risiko" by Steffen Kopetzky, very nice...
What a feeling it must be to shave with a piece of the Great War history
Where did you get your vest?
Indy, get some SUNSCREEN!!!
Hi Indy! You look like you were high on extasy while shooting this. :D
Incredible discipline to sail past the enemy just because the ultimatum had not technically expired. Not all navies of 1914 were so easy to control from thousands of miles away by cable.
hey i just want to ask can you make a special episode about ottoman empire and montenegro in ww1. and just wanna say love your work so far
We are going to start a new series inspired by TGW on the "Ottomans in WW1" so keep following the channel.
Breslau was my grandfather's hometown.
Do you mean Vratislav? Wróclaw? That Silesian city?
It is now. When he was born it was part of Prussia, but it's also been part of Silesia, Poland, and a few other states. That's Europe for you.
Silesia is even called Prussia in czech silesian dialect.
I've never been to the city or even eastern Europe. Someday I hope to see it.
*Central Europe
For a more detailed study of the Goeben and Breslau adventure, read Barbara Tuchman's Guns of August. She believes this episode was very important in the study of WWI and ties together many other events (e.g., these two ships embargoed more than 90% of Russian imports and exports). It was the reason she wrote the book. One lesson to be learned: governments lie all the time. Lesson two: governments break their promises all the time. Lesson three: admirals disobey orders all the time. And they all get away with it... sort of.
The WAR must grind on and on and on and on boyz!!! ~gotta do it with the fez on~ =D
Really? Yavuz is really a german ship? Thats really cool to know
plz make an episode about hellenic navy during ww1 or visit the greek flagship Averof wich is the last of its kind
Just how many razor blades does a battleship make?
Do more videos on battleships!!!!!
Well, what else would you do with a ship that had experienced so many close shaves?
I don't get ads on The Great War anymore, did the channel get demonitized?
from 5:00 the story look like today's F35 case between Turkey and USA
0:25 if you were there in the first world war you certainly weren't lucky
I have a book that claims that the Goeben lasted until the early 70's before it was sadly scrapped. The book says the only crew remaining were an elderly caretaker and his cat.
after the turkish navy decommisioned the Goeben the turkish government offered West Germany to buy it back as sort of a museum ship. But the germans thought that it was too expensive. So the world's last battlecruiser still afloat was scrapped. What a shame.
Observing his waistline....is Can a euchnic from the Sultan's Court? Just curious.
It's shame their initial flagship was not turned into a floating museum.
Is Indy a bit High?😕
The great War Mr Andy i wanted to thank you for saying the truth about Croatian part in the great war.for reasons known to us comments are disabled in that video.the main reason why archduke Franz Ferdinand was assasinated was his intension to correct the historical injustice toward Croatia because as you have mentioned the empire should be named as Austro-Hungarian-Croatian!and if that happened Serbian theft would be in vane.it would made them imposible to settle the serbians across the balkans and proclaim that territories as their own.what has happend in decades after it is known!like war(not civil!!!!as it is being presented to general public) in the 90s.you have done your homework very well in that episode!every word you have said is true!I KNOW HISTORY AND I AM RESARCHING THE HISTORY OF CROATIA AND CROATIANS FOR 10Y NOW....so thank you very much!now the whole world knows what kind of politicians does Serbia have!thex are willing to make a world war just to see their plans come threw.....Greetings from beautiful Croatia!
p.s. ig anyone wishes to know more about us....there is a page on facebook....White Croatia-Bijela Velika Hrvatska.History of Croatian people and russian,ukranian,polish,czech,slovak,...etc....all the lands we have inhabited in the past!and the documents,maps,writings from any of them upon their own history and conection with Croatians.
What happened to the crew of the ship after WW1? did they continue to crew the Goeben/Yavuz or did they return to Germany and a new Turkish crew take over?
Damn.
Suggestion, special on the US Navy?
The Goeben was the longest serving Dreadnought in any navy!
Very interesting Russian warship at 9:10. No Black Sea Fleet ship this, but an obsolete pre-dreadnought. Suggest Ekaterina II class of the 1880s; Sinope or Georgii Pobedonosets employed as port guard ship at Sevastopol with 12" guns removed. Originally armed with 6 x 12" guns in 3 x twin barbette mounts without armoured gun houses.
Now I am wondering if my spoons used to part of a mighty battleship.
From a BADASS battleship to .......
Rasor blades you must be bro, kidding me.
Take care.
Few old Harley Davidson cruisers cruzin.
just thought you'd like to know, the 'oe' in Goeben, written in German as Göben, is pronounced like the 'o' in 'word' or the second 'o' in 'motor'