Save your milk jugs and read Dr Ashby's data. You can't argue with it. It is as real as it gets. It is not what you think it is. Penetration is a function and in some circumstances is predictable, others not so much.
@@JoshandTim I would trust a jig that holds water soaked lauan squares covered with leather more than anything else artificial. 8" squares shot dead center so they flex a little.
The Ashby reports are misleading and biased. And I'm sure these fellas know exactly what those reports are, and this test is probably for all those people that say "if you shoot less than 650 grains you'll never kill anything" but have also never killed anything because their arrow flight is so bad. I went down that road, all you end up with is an expensive, heavy arrow, that doesn't kill any better, but takes a lot longer to reach the target
Have you guys looked into using carpet at a hide medium, done a bit of carpet work in my house and it dulls blades just like hides on pigs. Plus you can buy a roll and have hundreds of test pieces. Love this channel I’ve binged an ungodly amount over the last month.
Came across Tim’s channel like a month ago and then I’ve binged these podcasts while detailing boats here in ga. And throughly enjoy these. Keep them going 💪🏻 and y’all have an open invitation to come seek one some deer just north of Atlanta but still extremely urban lol.
I would be interested in seeing an FOC penetration test at a given arrow weight. Maybe 10, 15, 20%, if there's variation potentially even above that. Great videos, thanks guys
Hey Tim, have Josh or someone set up a course with obstacles, similar to tac, that requires different arrow trajectories based on the arrow weights you used in the penetration test. It would be like picking the right club to make a golf shot. Also, put some lighted nocks on those different weighted arrows and shoot at the moose at dusk. It would be entertaining to see the arch of the arrows. Thanks for making the podcast guys! I'm learning some new stuff even after 30 years of shooting and hunting with archery equipment.
Lots of truths here! Thx guys The HBS is the best cold weather option hands down. Hunt extreme cold up here in Canada and couldn’t do my all day sits without it. Plus the ability to shoot without being bulky is key. First time I used it I was like “why did I hunt all these years without this”!
Toy haulers rule. I have a 26' Stealth Nomad which can hold a 4 door jeep but for what you're doing, I recommend a smaller 14' Nomad or a Forest River Work N Play... Bring your quad, sleep 3-4 with Happy Jack beds and wall mounted futons... Heat, A/C, water, shower, onboard generator, solar panels... Whatever you can imagine.
Pad your rifle rest with memory foam and you won’t need to worry about it going out of sight. Concerning body suit is it packable as far as not having to leave something else behind?
Use a lab radar and get the speed degradation then drop poundage on the bow to replicate that speed at impact for the longer ranges. Simulate a 60 yard shot at 20
Monolithic targets (foam, gel, water) are KE measuring devices. Bows impart (for the purposes of this conversation) the same KE into light and heavy arrows. A light arrow carries KE in the form of velocity. A heavy arrow carries KE in the form of momentum. But, as the KE is the same, both will penetrate into a monolithic target equally. Animals are not monolithic. As the Ashby report demonstrates momentum is more important than velocity as it pertains to penetration on animals. However the Ashby report was done with traditional equipment. Modern compound equipment has rendered the weight thresholds outlined in the Ashby report largely moot. On the North American continent, at adult draw lengths, adult draw weights, with a good broad head, and a well tuned bow 425-475 grains is fully adequate. IMHO there is no need to make the sacrifices in speed and trajectory required to shoot above this weight threshold.
heavy arrows go through animals better period its not even a question anymore unless you have an issue up stairs 500-550 is what I like for deer and 546 grains out of my v3x 29 at 29 inches 78-79 pounds is 291 fps plenty fast
I don’t disagree with you. The only issue is when you can’t pull back 70+ pounds or even 60. Heavy arrows then are drastically slower. I think a balance is best. Get as high foc you can without jeopardizing too much speed and arrow stability. I think over 250 fps is fast enough for deer
Save your milk jugs and read Dr Ashby's data. You can't argue with it. It is as real as it gets. It is not what you think it is. Penetration is a function and in some circumstances is predictable, others not so much.
No we need this test for when we go hunt milk jugs
@@JoshandTim LOL, I love the show. Great response!
@@JoshandTim I would trust a jig that holds water soaked lauan squares covered with leather more than anything else artificial. 8" squares shot dead center so they flex a little.
🫵🤣
The Ashby reports are misleading and biased. And I'm sure these fellas know exactly what those reports are, and this test is probably for all those people that say "if you shoot less than 650 grains you'll never kill anything" but have also never killed anything because their arrow flight is so bad.
I went down that road, all you end up with is an expensive, heavy arrow, that doesn't kill any better, but takes a lot longer to reach the target
Another great show, guys! Thank you for MAKING the time to do them! Lots of great insight!
Have you guys looked into using carpet at a hide medium, done a bit of carpet work in my house and it dulls blades just like hides on pigs. Plus you can buy a roll and have hundreds of test pieces. Love this channel I’ve binged an ungodly amount over the last month.
Came across Tim’s channel like a month ago and then I’ve binged these podcasts while detailing boats here in ga. And throughly enjoy these. Keep them going 💪🏻 and y’all have an open invitation to come seek one some deer just north of Atlanta but still extremely urban lol.
Sounds like a good time ✊
@@JoshandTim yeah until a target buck picks a fight with a car and loses one side of his rack and limping.
The. Best. Podcast.
So much great conversation!! So many great topics😅and now I am searching heated body suits..
I would recommend putting play sand along with water in the jugs. That way you have a cheap substance in the jugs and can give you some resistance
Good show. May want to tune down the paper crinkling and log splitting at the beginning. A little sensory overload coming thru the air waves🤣🤣
They are called hand muff. I’m surprised that Tim didn’t know that he love innuendos😂
I would be interested in seeing an FOC penetration test at a given arrow weight. Maybe 10, 15, 20%, if there's variation potentially even above that.
Great videos, thanks guys
Hey Tim, have Josh or someone set up a course with obstacles, similar to tac, that requires different arrow trajectories based on the arrow weights you used in the penetration test. It would be like picking the right club to make a golf shot. Also, put some lighted nocks on those different weighted arrows and shoot at the moose at dusk. It would be entertaining to see the arch of the arrows. Thanks for making the podcast guys! I'm learning some new stuff even after 30 years of shooting and hunting with archery equipment.
Lots of truths here! Thx guys
The HBS is the best cold weather option hands down. Hunt extreme cold up here in Canada and couldn’t do my all day sits without it. Plus the ability to shoot without being bulky is key. First time I used it I was like “why did I hunt all these years without this”!
Toy haulers rule. I have a 26' Stealth Nomad which can hold a 4 door jeep but for what you're doing, I recommend a smaller 14' Nomad or a Forest River Work N Play... Bring your quad, sleep 3-4 with Happy Jack beds and wall mounted futons... Heat, A/C, water, shower, onboard generator, solar panels... Whatever you can imagine.
You should look at the jumping jack trailers, ,,, hush uses them ,,,
You should look at the little campers that they pull behind a motorcycle
You guys need to look into down pants! They’re light and super packable.
I love solo hunting, I enjoy going to my buddies hunt camps and drinking beer as well, but when I'm hunting, I'm focused on hunting
Pad your rifle rest with memory foam and you won’t need to worry about it going out of sight.
Concerning body suit is it packable as far as not having to leave something else behind?
Not super packable but you get to wear less because of it
Use a lab radar and get the speed degradation then drop poundage on the bow to replicate that speed at impact for the longer ranges. Simulate a 60 yard shot at 20
Going on a moose hunt what would be a good arrow broad head to use? Would you worry about the total weight or FOC.
Monolithic targets (foam, gel, water) are KE measuring devices. Bows impart (for the purposes of this conversation) the same KE into light and heavy arrows. A light arrow carries KE in the form of velocity. A heavy arrow carries KE in the form of momentum. But, as the KE is the same, both will penetrate into a monolithic target equally.
Animals are not monolithic. As the Ashby report demonstrates momentum is more important than velocity as it pertains to penetration on animals. However the Ashby report was done with traditional equipment. Modern compound equipment has rendered the weight thresholds outlined in the Ashby report largely moot.
On the North American continent, at adult draw lengths, adult draw weights, with a good broad head, and a well tuned bow 425-475 grains is fully adequate. IMHO there is no need to make the sacrifices in speed and trajectory required to shoot above this weight threshold.
What heater body suit do you use
Just my experience, but i noticed my broadheads will blow through a worn out target that stops my field points. Slick trick standards and montecs.
8:53 cohesion allows water to resist impact. I’m shocked you’d say the water isn’t affecting the test 😐
I agree (tc)
Pretty sure those little hand sleeves are called a muff.
The only downside of 12's is they fold down a little going back into the harness. Everything else is positives.
I wonder if mfjj is taking an ss34 for the midwest hunt? 😂 mathews would love that
heavy arrows go through animals better period its not even a question anymore unless you have an issue up stairs 500-550 is what I like for deer and 546 grains out of my v3x 29 at 29 inches 78-79 pounds is 291 fps plenty fast
I don’t disagree with you. The only issue is when you can’t pull back 70+ pounds or even 60. Heavy arrows then are drastically slower. I think a balance is best. Get as high foc you can without jeopardizing too much speed and arrow stability. I think over 250 fps is fast enough for deer
Your right but if a 440 grain arrow goes through just as well into the dirt on the other side but is 20 fps faster then that’s better! Period!
I find it hard to believe your getting 291 out of a 550 gr arrow
To me your senses are on a higher alert when hunting solo, you get too relaxed and reliant upon your partner when hunting in a group