DDR4 4000 VS 4400 What ram manufacturer DON'T want you to know...
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- Опубліковано 2 жов 2024
- 90$ Ram vs 140$ Ram, Today I show you a trick to save 50$ and why overspending on ram is pointless with a little knowledge
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The best B-die bin imho is 3200 14-14-14-14-34 @1.35. The reason being the TRCD timing doesn’t really scale with voltage, and sometimes won’t even tighten if you lower transfer speed. being able to do 14 is indicative of good and consistent ICs. But these and then see how many volts your exact kit will take (vDimm) before general instability. The kits will almost always take 1.45v at least. And when you put them at 1.45v they’ll tend to beat out the 3600mts 14-14-15-15-36 @1.45v (I think? I don’t remember the exact values, but it’s 2 14s and an odd 15 or two in the timings and it’s validated at 1.45v).
I got mine to 1.51v and Do 3666 14-13-13-13-27. Which is wild. If you get lucky you can actually get your Middle timings under your CL. Also got TRFC down to 240 and 1T.
Don’t expect this from all of these bins though. But basically they’re the best bins for whatever voltage they can tolerate. When you get a high frequency high voltage b die bin, usually it just means you’re paying more for a guarantee that the ICs handle more voltage and not the actual quality of the ICs. These kits are designed to advertise higher MTs on the box and not actually get the best performance.
There are some actually good b die bins at ridiculously high mts validations that don’t just spew voltage and loosen timings, but they cost more than double what rolling the (relatively low-risk) dice on a dual-rank 3200c14 kit. Just make sure the revision and serial number is newer so you know you’re getting a more modern PCB
S8B is the only IC DDR4 that has tRCD scaling with voltage.
The higher you go in Frequency, more loosened will be the tRCD, unless you are shoving a good 1.5V
Currently running daily 14-8-14-14-21 3800MT/s Patriot top bin 4400
I rather say the gamble is bigger with lower binned kits for the IC quality
3200 CL14 flat 14s is maybe the cheapest guaranteed B-die
3200 CL 16 kits are a lottery, old standard 3600 17-18-18 too
Try tRCD 14 or 15 and push the frequency higher
Best kits are cheap 4000+mhz samsung
@@Tpecep Patriots?
I’m a noob on ram it hurts my brain sometimes. I have bad Corsair ram ima replace. Frame Chasers says 4000mhz b die is better than most ddr5 and saves money what b die should I get for that? Or should I just buy 4000 cl 15 or 16?
@@kodakblack531 Get Patriot Vipers 4400MHz CL19 you can lower the frequency for better timings.
The biggest complaint I have about ram modules is I can't find the single rank or dual rank listing on anybody's website. It seems nobody really cares about it very much.
as far as the viper steels go, anything 4000MHz or above is a guaranteed b-die bin for them, I've had multiple kits of the 4000 CL16, 4000 CL19, 4133 CL19 and the 4400 CL19 and they've all been b-die, have two kits of the 4000 flat 16, 2 kits of the 4000 Cl19, 6 kits of the 4133 CL19 and 4 kits of the 4400 CL19, all b-die, the 4000 CL19 kits are decent, the 4400 are definitely binned higher but not by much really, all of them handled 4600 CL16 easy enough for me though it was definitely more work on the 4000 CL19 and 4133 kits, as far as I can tell from clocking, the 4000 CL16 and the 4400 CL19 kits are the same bin
hey, im new to overclocking and i am wanting to get the 4400mhz 2x8 sticks but im getting 2 pairs so that i can have 32 gigs on my system, is there anyway i could communicate with you for help in changing its speeds and timings?
I picked up Trident Royals 4000 16-16-16-36 @1.4v. Sure enough, clocks right up to 4400. Currently I’ve got it at 4200 16-16-16-32 @1.46v and pretty happy with that.
Do you know the best volts/latency when you let it at 4000 MHz?
@@aditesto7918 At 4000mhz I was able to get down to 33.8ns latency in AIDA, with 14-14-14-28 primaries and tight secondaries. I believe I was at 1.55v for stability. Every kit is different though.
@@Shane-fk2gz damn you have a Nice one, i Tried the same, but after 15 Minutes Warzone crashed, now im on 15 15 15 30 1.5v and Thank you
@@aditesto7918 Are you doing actual memory stability testing? Your memory overclocks should pass Testmem5 with anta777 configurations, without 1 single memory error, before starting to game. You have to run testmem5, with absolutely zero memory errors.
@@Shane-fk2gz i did Not, should i ? For Now, i diddnt had any error and the temps are Good, Luke 35 degrees
I bought the 4400mhz off amazon and both xmp profiles run at way looser timings than advertised, even when i manually put in the advertised timings warzone keeps crashing
which ram sticks?
Flat timings doesn't always mean that it's B-die, some B-die can also have not even primaries, higher end flat timings are all B-die though, also there's absolute garbage B-die bins. XMP spec is not everything, most 4000 cl19 Patriots can do 4400cl19, but many kits will struggle with 3800cl14, while higher number of 4400cl19 can do 3800cl14. So there's a point in buying higher bin kits if you know how to OC it, but there's hard diminishing returns in price higher up you go, you're basically paying more for higher chance of winning silicon lottery, for people that use XMP I agree with that paying more for higher bin is kinda pointless.
That Patriot Viper steel 4133MHz kit is actually B-die. It has one XPM profile of 4000 CL19-19-39 and another of 4133 CL19-21-21-41 yet for some reason, Patriot advertises that looser XMP profile.
I have a patriot Viper Blackout 4000MHz with advertised timings of 19-21-21-41, but those timings are simply wrong. It has one XMP of 4000 CL19-19-19-39 and another of 3866 CL18-22-22-40. Thaiphoon burner also confirms that it's B-die.
Currently, all Patriot Viper 16GB kits that are rated at 4000MHz and above are guaranteed B-dies. The 3866MHz kit should be avoided, cause Patriot uses both Samsung B-dies and Hynix ICs on that kit.
This one also? PVE2416G400C0
@@OwlyEagle No. that kit came out a year after posting that comment. That kit uses Hynix ICs. You can tell by those very loose tRCD timings and that relatively high voltage. It's trash.
@@WrexBF what about the PVB416G413C8K, looks like b die to me and are just 100 euro where i live - only dilemma I have is im running 13600k on the gigabyte B660MDS3H AX and running 4 dimms of 8gb for 32gb will probably give me headache
@@OwlyEagle That's indeed a Samsung B-die kit.
@@WrexBF cheers
Patriot Steel 4000+ uses bottom tier b-die from samsung which are considered REJECT binning status, Patriot then goes through the process of binning themselves one at a time which is why you get them for so cheap. they use ASS heatspreaders which dont cover the IC's fully, and have Very Little headroom to overclock.
on top of that, B-DIE scales past 1.6v if you can keep the temperature under 35C and will not affect reliability/longevity. get yourself an aftermarket heatspreader.
4000mhz 15-16-16-36 from G-SKILL is TOP TIER status.
i have my kit GSKILL kit running 4600mhz 14-14-14-28 320 trfc and maxed TREFI... 10 hours of stability testing no problem at 1.62v for 6 months now. no problems.
your opinions on "this is how ram companies make money" is by far flawed. "the cheapest kit of b die that is 1.35v" is SERIOUSLY wrong. if you think youre at some god-tier status for memory opinionated claims then i suggest you go watch some BUILDZOID and learn you something. Cheers mate. based on the way you talk it seems as though you have 1 or two kits that you tried and think that you can make fact-based claims.
Can u send me your timings from asrock timing configurator and volages
I managed to up my 3600 16-18-18-38 @1.35V to 3800 16-18-18-38 @1.35V with no stability issues. Can't complain over free performance.
very useful info to know. wish i saw this before ordering some 2x16 3600 c16 hynix chips (gskill ripjaws v) that I now have to return to newegg, and wait to take delivery of the 2x16 3200 c14 bdie chips (gskill flare x) I ordered from there. its a price difference of $220 vs $179, so I hope it will be worth it on my 5900x build whenever I can find a graphics card to finish my system!
Concisely explained, delivered in an entertaining manner as always. Glad to see your subs increasing also...
you can overvolt the cheaper ram but the 4400cl19s will do magical stuff like 3800cl14 or 4066cl15.
so the 4000cl19 kit wont do the 3800cl14 or 4066cl15? I just ordered 4400cl19 from amazon with a $15 coupon off.
@@jmv8775 you will see.
I just ordered the 4000cl15 it's coming in tomorrow... What xmp values for you get with the 4400
@@jahmezis45 xmp doesn't matter doesn't run 1:1 anyway.
@@philipp594 ahhh cuz after 1900 it goes crazy right.. so do you have to underclock it
Only a bunch of months ago I would have overspent on the board, cpu, and ram (in fact I did, but got a partially defective board + loads of other issues, returned that garbage immediately).
Now I've gone for cheap b-die rated for 3600CL16, easily overclocked to 4100CL16, 10850K, Z490 Aorus Elite (only 200 bucks lol). Not even done tuning everything yet, but it's already getting higher fps than I expected.
thats the power of knowledge
Very good stuff, useful to know!
Very nice info as always, good job. i have follow your advice on lowering latency to cl14 on ryzen over increasing fclk, now i get much higher low fps on 3733 cl14 with 1.480 volts than 3866 cl 16.
g skill flare x 3200 cl14 4x8 sticks
How can I get your timings? I have the flare x also. Been doing 3800 16-16-16-32 at 1.42v for the longest time. Super happy with it but lower timings would be great.
@@Shane-fk2gz
Try 14-15-15-35 at 1.5V.
i managed to oc two 64gig kits on two 5800x3d did i notice an improvement . from cl24 to cl16 and all sub timeings tuned 2 months one kit was made of two 32gig 4000 one kit made from two kits of 32 gig 4400. scl was diffrent both on high end mobos the mem controller was the only diffrence! the chips were dif one hynex one micron for 3800mhz no whea errors that way
i got a 13700k and Z mobo , are these good Acer Predator Pallas 32GB 16GBx2 3600Mhz DDR4 Memory BL.9BWWR.346 ? vs G.SKILL Ripjaws V Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) DDR4 4400 Desktop Memory F4-4400C19D-32GVK ?
What’s the best G Skill Trident Z Ram for warzone? I was running into issues on Pcpartpicker for the 1.45-1.5v being too much for comet lake. So I’m assuming what you said at the end of the video that the 3200mhz cl14 would be better than the 4400mhz cl16. If money isn’t an issue here which is the route to go for Max FPS?? I know the first world latency scale that the 4400 is better but it needs 1.5v to do that speed so wondering what the route is because I’m new to all of this and am learning new stuff everyday.
Just buy the 4000 Vipers
@@RBK_3 I’m making a specific build aesthetic wise so I’m going with the G Skill Trident Z RGB’s and there’s B die of them in the 3200mhz, 4000mhz, and 4400mhz. Believe the 4000’s are CL15’s
Well im trying to upgrade from 3200 to 4000 good luck to me to find b die (im trying to get 64gb because I edit and game both)
What is the best ram's (wich frequency and latency) kit to pick to pair with a 5800x3d and a 4090 gpu in order to get the best fps?
Thanks! You convinced me to buy a B-die RAM set. I have always used some semi-cheap RAM: 3200 CL16 etc and then tried to OC it a bit. After watching some of your videos I finally started looking for explicit B-die kits. Found one used kit 4x16GB kit for a very decent price that I can either put all to my 5950X or use on two different computers.
what are you talking about? Patriot manufactures their chips in TSMC in Tiwan not Hynix.
Great information.
Hee man
I am using this kit 4x8gb G.Skill Ripjaws V F4-4000C14D-16GVK running XMP 2
Been saying the same for years, just no way to broadcast it.
i appreciate your work alot man thank you. am i able to better results from CL16 or CL18? i know the timings can be sensitive with games.
I really enjoy Jufes older educational content.
You wanted to hit 200 subscribers now we are at 5k well done! Keep going bro
Thanks learned something ❤
Sk Hynix is the worst RAM you can buy.
I agree i cannot OC SK Hynix. I have a Trident 3600 cl6 (16GB x2) on a 12900K. I am always thinking of getting new DDr4 sticks but I do not know if I should what to gain.
I have seen crucial ram that goes to 16-16-16-36. So you're wrong to say micron can't have a b-die.
B-Die integrated circuits are manufactured by Samsung, Micron make their own Integrated circuits. B-Die is Samsung only.
Nowadays as regards gaming, Micron produces Micron Rev B (8Gb modules) and Micron Rev E (16Gb modules)
i buy Gskill F4-4000C18D-16GTZR i was got the 3200.are this good for warzone?
Love your videos brotha I learn so much and you don't talk to much, for people like me I enjoy it
Dont listen to then :)) You do talk as much as its needed xd dont go silent man
Is the 4400 worth getting if its just $10 difference
I want to do 4x16 so a total of 64gigs, but I can't find any B die at 4000.
Am I able to overclock my 4400 kit to 4800? If so can you link me a video that you have to do that? Thank
So I got a 5800x3d for free what ram should I put in with it. I’m not tech savvy so fine running is out of the question but I can set up the xmp profile any is greatly appreciated thanks in advance to you geniuses
which one did you choose
What if base cl are same and not tested cl
What is a B-die?
My question is how will this apply to DDR5 once it evolves further?
Time will tell.
But until then, wait till DDR6 gaming PCs are announced in about 5 ~ 8 years
Thank you for this. This is super valuable information
Patriot as new kit 3600 cl14 at 1.45v
you're the man
What is bday
Hi Diego from the past, I think you meant bdie, samsung bdie is a specific type of memory which samsung manufactures, and it is the best ddr4 ram for overclocking. Go with samsung bdie!
Good content and advise.
Yessir
Good info as always. Thank you
Subscribed.
What's the cheapest ram I could get that can hit 4000mhz?
In me experience, memory OC can often seem very stable, but then certain games will crash randomly and you don't know why, until you revert to stock settings. Had ny 2400 memory running at 2900mhz for years, until i started playing Ghost Recon breakpoint, and it would just crash every 30 minutes, until i reverted back to stock clocks. No other thing i tried would fix the crashes. Honestly, for 99.9% of gamers, its much more worth it to OC the GPU. If you are so CPU-bound that you need that extra memory bandwidth for the 1-5fps gain, you are in need of a CPU upgrade in general.
I was a noob before had off timings and got lucky with samsung. Bless.