As someone who was the child in parental alienation, I want to always remind people that the children are victims, not villains. If you are a targeted parent, don't villainize your child, don't put the blame on them for having rejected you, and don't expect them to have "known better". When considering your own pain, don't forget to consider theirs. As I moved into adulthood, that's when I could see the situation clearly. I look back now and say, "I wouldn't have been able to fully grasp what was going on above my head. I was just a little kid living in survival mode."
This is so important, I agree 100%! I never blame my daughter- I have such compassion, sadness and guilt/regret that this happened to her. It’s not her fault. I stay strong knowing she will need me to be strong for her. I would never blame her… she is a child. Innocent. And put in a horrific situation. My heart breaks that she was forced to participate in this crazy, toxic dynamic for the needs of grown man. Where I struggle is keeping my opinions- more my facial expressions- to myself. I know she is in such a tough position. I hated when my mom talked poorly about my dad as a kid and an adult( I’m NOT the one! I wanted to tell “find a friend to talk to!!”) and I refuse to do it. I hope you’re well. I’m so sorry you were put in the middle of that. So unfair…🙏🏻
I will go a step further, I am starting to realize that it really is not (completely) the alienators fault either. It is generational, if you look closely at the parents and grandparents of the alienator you will see a pattern of this behavior. Unfortunately, it is difficult to see the warning flags before you choose a spouse😢
@@bwalsberg I believe there is a law in place (or was) that if an adult initiated a minor into criminal behavior there be recourse but I don't know how that has played out in court and how it would play out in this dynamic. It would have to be proven criminal behavior.
I never thought I’d ever hear anyone else say this. I was told years ago I was wrong to use this analogy by a friend who actually did lose her child. But, I’ve even dreamed my daughter was passed and have grieved her for years as if she passed. It’s a grief you can’t even rightfully have as ppl will just say you should just make up with her or it’s your fault. I say it’s actually harder then a death. At least my friend can look forward to seeing her daughter again in eternity and hold to some happy memories of her. My daughter literally tortures me and enjoys it, so I can’t long to be with her. She’s become actually dangerous for my health. So sorry that we share such pain. Prayers for God to reach our children with Truth.
@@TruthsHandmaid4444 stay strong I know EXACTLY how you feel. We must rise and turn that love that was there into ourselves fully. It’s so hard but overtime the strength will get us through. Godspeed
@@TruthsHandmaid4444 I thought I was the only one. It really is like your children have died, yet you know they are out there somewhere living life like you never existed. All you have are pictures and memories. It's so sad that family relationships mean so little in the world now. Absolutely there are things I'd change, things I'd do differently. But you cant go back, and you can't change other people no matter what their relationship is to you. I'm slowly realizing that as long as I know my own truth and if God knows my truth, that's what matters now. Our kids will hopefully one day see how much we love them. Sometimes it happens and sometimes it doesn't. Either way, do what is in your power to fix things and realize your feelings are important too. Take care a nd God bless...
In 2002 I began raising my 3 & 5 year old stepdaughters 24/7 as he had chased their bio mom out of their life. I didn’t know what I was involved in. In 2015 when the girls were 16 & 18. My older one hasn’t spoke to me since. My younger one and I had stopped talking for about 18 months until graduation. We have been rebuilding our relationship the last seven years. After a nasty divorce of him dragging property division and divorce on seven plus years, we were finally divorced October 2022. I’ve never talked to my daughter about our divorce. Recently my flying monkey cousin passed away and my narc brother stepped into that role. Needless to say, my ex has weaselled his way back in with another smear campaign and as of last week my younger daughter has stopped talking to me again. It’s so absolutely heartbreaking! I don’t know how to heal and how to help my now adult daughters. My oldest is an addict like her dad. My youngest is in a 5 year future faking narc relationship herself. What a mess…they were my whole world and 7 1/2 years later I still don’t know how to move forward. 💔
@@gypsysoul4994 I hate this for you and I have realized this is more common than we believe. We hurt everyday and I don’t know how to help mine either. Worries me daily too. I hope and pray your children find their way back to you. My daughter and I talked for just a little bit. Her dad figured out how to ruin that and caused another divide. Every time she starts to come around this happens. It’s a pattern that mine refuses to see. Yes heartbreaking. I’ve learned I can only control me and I just try to make my life better so when she does figure out what her father is I can be there for her without causing any more damage hopefully. That could be years, tomorrow or never and I have to accept that.
I get this. Also “Parental abduction”, where they move far away and try to totally erase or replace the other parent…decimating the “bad parent” in court… the lies…scary stuff. Good work here, please keep educating. ❤
Thats me, the erased parent. My daughter said "you are an embarrassment, move on mom, we all have". Yup, me loving them and contacting them on holidays/birthdays and wanting to have a relationship makes me appear as something totally negative (not good/loving/motherly) and this is and I am embarrassing to them... What kinda F%*KTARD teaches his children that their mothers unconditional love and and her wanting/trying to be their mother is bad and should be condemend and needs to stop and this is something to be embarrased about or embarrased for her for being or doing... I think there is a special place in Hell for these parents and the bullshit the dole out is going to come back and they will experience 1K X what we are experiencing in our lives... So sick and sad about this, just so sick and sad about this whole shitty thing
This is what I'm going through. She's moved states twice. Over 15000 in lawyer fees. Haven't seen or heard from our 3yr old daughter in almost 7 months. Took my car and furniture. I need some help please
Parents don't have to be separated or divorced. Some do the alienation of affection and authority while they are under same roof. Many confusing and sad memories. A lot of parental gaslighting.
That's what we experienced. Mom was extremely emotionally abusive, and often physically abusive; and Dad and we kids were caught in the trap. I'm not a psychologist, but I tolerated her antics for 46 years, and early on I'd pinned her behavior on pathological envy: she was constantly comparing herself/her life to others, and always seeing herself as inadequate, then blaming it on -- or taking it out on -- someone else. I believe Mom's problems started very early in life, as Oppositional Defiance Disorder enhanced by physical and emotional beatings she received for perceived misbehavior, which sinuously developed into pathological envy and, eventually, narcissism.
This is what I’m going through right now. Two of my three kids got totally brainwashed by their father to hate me and it’s been three years that our communication has been cut off. Being a foreigner living in a foreign country who is not familiar with the laws here, my narcissistic ex took advantage of this and turn everything against me including my kids. The pain is indescribable, it’s like they’re gone forever. It’s so hard mentally and emotionally. I’m scared that my youngest kid will be like them. Thank you very much for this video. 🙏🏼🙌🏼
I am in the same boat. My children haven't lived with me since they were pre teens. They are in their mid 30's, and still will not communicate. I still ache to hug them, and tell them I love them. And, I still can't believe they still believe his lies. I found out my daughter got married in 2020. My son...I have no idea where he is. I am downsizing to move. I have huge plastic boxes of their stuff. Things they would love to have. What do I do with them? I texted my ex narcissist. He never answered.
I’m right there with you. It is and has been absolutely detrimental to my health. My doctor said my stress and grief were a huge contributing factor to the small stroke I had. A year and a half of zero contact and nobody telling me how she’s doing. It is just so wrong. It’s absolutely cruel. They do not realize the long term affects. This is having on their parents that truly love them. It means we will not be around as long as we should have been because of the impact it takes on our health. God help us all. ❤️
Think of how bad things were, how bad things will continue to be if your child comes back to you without getting the help they need. You can’t save anyone other than yourself.
I am just seeing this, but yes it is the same as mourning death of a child. While I was in the throws(and still am) my oldest was tragically murdered. So, I deal with both and I don't really wanna live many days
I am a recovering SLD. Your work has helped me so much. I am counter parenting with a covert narcissist, my 2 boys are 3 and 5. I lay awake at night when I don’t have them and worry that they will pick up all these narcissistic tendencies and suffer all the things related to having a narcissist parent… Basically I wonder how to prevent them from becoming narcissistic later in life with their core personalities being moulded right now. But I think you already answered the question in this video. When I have them to demonstrate healthy relations and empathy etc. I can’t help by wonder, what else I can do…. But later in life it will make sense to them. It’s just hard when they are so young. If I wanted more custody I’d be up for a huge legal battle. There is no winning.
I have a young adult at 20. I miss her sooooo much. She is unhealthy to my recovery ❤️🩹 I went no contact so I can work on me. She gas lights me and uses me. I choose me. I left the husband my parents and daughter. Thanks for the encouragement
They often call it a personality disorder, but it goes deeper. They have no consciousness. It can be compared to an incurable deep dissociative state that makes them spiritually static. In addition, they are masters of feigning mental health and 100% convinced of their own integrity. They are not approachable, they always say they have the best intentions that you still has a pain spot that needs to heal or they gaslight something that is not true like 'don't be so aggressive, you are fierce or, feisty' or 'you always look for conflict, I am cheerful and for harmony'. And that they grew up traumatically is not always necessary or has many hidden forms. For example, my ex-mother-in-law projected her fear of losing him via suffocation to such an excess that he became boundless. He really was allowed everything. Misbehaviors were then tucked away with the cloak of love. And this took the most extreme forms. During the marriage I was also subject to her manipulation, knowing about her trauma (a pre-born child who was sacrificed to Satan after a few weeks (yes really) that she didn't know what had happened to it, where it had gone and she was not allowed to mourn by her father. And for example my grandmother was 8 months pregnant with my mother when grandfather was shot during WOII. My mother developed narcissistic, had no self esteem or self worth with all kinds of demoralizing consequences. We empathic people often think that absolute terms are not realistic, but with this kind of psychopathy it is. They will NEVER change and they will ALWAYS abuse you. I am from the Netherlands and send all of you love and strength to heal ❤
Thank to both of you for keeping up the awareness of this madness of PA As I have been true it, I been Alienated from my children for years while I was in the family home, l worked and my wife was a stay at home mum ,her choice. I am gon from the family home know 3.5 years with no contact with my kids even though I tried everything everything
Amazing collaboration. I am a huge fan of Dr. Carter. He is such a great teacher. Been following him since 2020 Spring. Calm firmness and just staying a good role model are my main mantras.
My ex did parental alienation but I didn’t know it. When my son turned 18, he started telling my son that my husband was stalking and harassing him. It turned into a high profile case in my area where he bomb threatened 41 schools pretending to be my husband. My son is 23 and won’t speak to me. His father is in jail on no bail and my adult son still thinks I was terrorizing his dad. My ex is so evil and sick that there aren’t even words to describe. 23 years he’s been terrorizing me. He hates women. He hated me. He cheated on me, used drugs while I was pregnant. Wouldn’t work. I finally got a job and then he accused me of cheating and tried to have me jumped on my birthday. He left the next day on 3/30/2001 after I narrowly escaped with my life and he was caught, and then he used the courts and every way to torment me for 23 years. Now my adult son hates me. Not even the arrest and seeing his fathers face plastered all over the news for bomb threats, stalking and terrorization has convinced my son that it’s been his dad the entire time! I’m devastated with grief. I’ve always thought the truth would prevail but here we are.
I have one, a quarter of a century later 🙄 this needs to be addressed better, for society in a whole. Much less the ongoing personal nature of destruction this does
Thank you. I love you both. I needed this soooo much. I am breaking the cycle. I am a recovered SLD and am no contact with the intrusive covert narc mum and an ex narc that I am paralel parenting with. ❤❤❤
It is nice to see my two favorites on the topic of narcissism together in one video. Would you please consider making content for children in this situation? I would love to have some books or videos to share with my children to help enlighten them about what is happening. My daughter’s counselor says I can never talk to her about these things, but I love how you presented this to say, “in our home I won’t ask you to keep secrets from your father because I believe that puts you in an uncomfortable situation, and might negatively affect your relationship with your dad.” It presents another option without being negative about the other parent. It’s neglectful for me to not say anything because knowledge is power, and I need to find a way to teach them about narcissism without pointing a finger at their father. Otherwise, they could waste 5 years of their life, like I did, or 35 years, like many do, trying to figure out what the problem is. Dr. Carter’s video titled 18 ways a covert narcissist can perpetuate frustration began my road to recovering myself and my mental health.
In 2002 I began raising my 3 & 5 year old stepdaughters 24/7 as he had chased their bio mom out of their life. I didn’t know what I was involved in. In 2015 when the girls were 16 & 18. My older one hasn’t spoke to me since. My younger one and I had stopped talking for about 18 months until graduation. We have been rebuilding our relationship the last seven years. After a nasty divorce of him dragging property division and divorce on seven plus years, we were finally divorced October 2022. I’ve never talked to my daughter about our divorce. Recently my flying monkey cousin passed away and my narc brother stepped into that role. Needless to say, my ex has weaselled his way back in with another smear campaign and as of last week my younger daughter has stopped talking to me again. It’s so absolutely heartbreaking! I don’t know how to heal and how to help my now adult daughters. My oldest is an addict like her dad. My youngest is in a 5 year future faking narc relationship herself. What a mess…they were my whole world and 7 1/2 years later I still don’t know how to move forward. 💔
I took care of my 15 year younger brother when he was a child and mum struggled with addiction and mental illness. I had a parental role which became more apparent when I finished school and got a job. I was his safe space. When I had enough of doing my mothers role and sat boundaries with her, she threw me out and I lost all contact with both of them for years. I tried to reconnect with her, so I took her to therapy when I had done my own therapy. I was about 23 by then. After a couple of months I realized she wasent going to do the work in therapy, and she wasent going to accept I had another point of view on things. When I said this, that it wasn't going to work, she almost ran out of the therapist's office and home to my brother to tell him lies about me and block me. At that time I didnt understand why she did that. But as an adult now 40 years old with a lifetime of experiences I understand that she felt threatened. She knew my brother and I had a close relationship so she made me the bad guy to make him stay with her. I have tried to contact my brother but he refuses. His other sister tells me he says awful things about me and is very hateful. He is now in his 20ths and an adult so I feel I cant do much. Its like grieving people who are still alive. Anyway, I feel like the alinated dad. Even though Iam the older sister. Because the same process happened to me.
In 2002 I began raising my 3 & 5 year old stepdaughters 24/7 as he had chased their bio mom out of their life. I didn’t know what I was involved in. In 2015 when the girls were 16 & 18 I left their dad. My older one hasn’t spoke to me since. My younger one and I had stopped talking for about 18 months until graduation. We have been rebuilding our relationship the last seven years. After a nasty divorce of him dragging property division and divorce on seven plus years, we were finally divorced October 2022. I’ve never talked to my daughter about our divorce. Recently my flying monkey cousin passed away and my narc brother stepped into that role. Needless to say, my ex has weaselled his way back in with another smear campaign and as of last week my younger daughter has stopped talking to me again. It’s so absolutely heartbreaking! I don’t know how to heal and how to help my now adult daughters. My oldest is an addict like her dad. My youngest is in a 5 year future faking narc relationship herself. What a mess…they were my whole world and 7 1/2 years later I still don’t know how to move forward. 💔
I have never ever heard this spoken about the way both of you have shared. I watched part one and had to watch this video as well. Together, you are both extremely powerful in your individual way of teaching about having a narcissistic parent who alienates the other parent and the resulting effects it has on the children. I am absolutely blown away. I could watch both videos 10 times and I still would be hearing things I missed the first time I saw your videos. Thank you so much. I hope you keep making videos together.
Healthy parent to the children: "There are things where mum/dad don't see eye to eye, that's why we split up. But with me, we want to listen to each other and focus on that." In this way, you show your children your healthy, cooperative values. - Les Carter
This can happen with adult children also regarding their parent talking bad about the other parent and telling lies so the adult child will get mad at the parent that actually is a good parent and loves them. I’m going through that right now with my daughter and I see every time we go through this, she text me some random questions out of the blue about her father and then when I answer, she tells me that’s not what he says and I know she’s talking to him and then the next thing I know she tells me she needs space from me this is happened several times so this does happen to younger kids and adult kids also😰 it’s sad. It breaks my heart.
I saw my ex covert put her kids against their dad. I was still surprised when I figured out the same thing happened with my child. I mourned the loss. My mom did the same thing to me and my siblings, putting us against dad. It wasn't until well after their deaths I figured it out. My 6 siblings still live in a false world where covert mom was the "best of them." My father was my protector the entire time and I was set against him.
I had 5 kids with a covert narc. I haven’t seen them in two years. As the alienated parent, I’m not sure how this video really addresses my situation. Alas, it’s good to know I am not alone.
I think if you got a legal expert in on the conversation it would be helpful. I was blindsided by the dirty ruthless tricks my narcissistic ex was able to do legally and emotionally.
The courts, lawyers, gals, therapists are inept and usually make it worse. Very very very few lawyers are even aware of how this works and how to identify it never mind successfully defend against it.
For our dad it was "cheaper to keep her" despite the horrible abuse she doled out on all of us. And it would have been much worse for us kids, because we would have been stuck living with our mother, who was easily the most difficult person I've ever known. Watch the movies "Mommy Dearest" and "The Great Santini" to get an idea.
In my opinion and experience, it absolutely is, and I wish it was easier to talk about parental alienation and support its victims without giving ammunition to the even greater number of abusive parents who claim to be victims of this, and to add guilt and doubt onto the shoulders of kids who know their parent is abusive and of healthy parents trying to do the right thing.
I am a sole survivor in my family ..awful gene pool ..brother died last year if kidney cancer aged 43. I lived with his widow and two year old. Who I love no less than if he were my own. Fast forward a year..and she met someone through friends. Fast forward 8 mths. And this guy's OCD about everything has removed me from my nephew. I'm not part of his world in anyway..every little bit of time I had left..i.e..Saturday mornings once per MTH..removed. Once per month pick him up from nursery..take home..tea together..bedtime story..all gone. Apparently he misbehaves to He day after...I will see him with her occasionally. He goes crazy when he sees me..cries when I have to go. To say it's destroyed me is an understatement. If she was alone..I'd see them both every week. I've spoken with her about it..she knows it has made me Ill but nothing changes..it's got worse. I have no choice but to accept his loss too. Hope the bond we share will always be there. .life is very cruel. I'm completely alone. Some awesome friends. But no family.
Because I don't suffer from sld I can confidently tell you that I managed to do exactly what you suggested is the best defense to parental alienation. It's so refreshing to hear professionals advise people to do what I had to figure out on my own. I sorta feel like a super hero when I hear professionals give the advice that I had come to on my own, in order to raise my kids correctly. Even with the largest or barriers in front of me. I soooooooooo wish I could talk to one or both of you about my parental arc. But this is satisfying nonetheless so thank you sooooooo much for the content. Knowledge is something else
Hi! Thanks to you both for addressing this. Much needed! Les, I can remember coming across your videos back in 2018-19, and finding them refreshingly informative. Ross, I agree wholeheartedly about the value in the SLD doing the work to heal. I’m a target mom of alienation, myself. I suffered for years as a result of thinking that it was the alienating parent’s job to change. That perspective consumed me - ended up causing me to lose focus on my cause (which, of course, is my child). After doing a complete 180, I now coach other parents like me to heal their lives. 👉🏼You touched on some ways that SLD can actively parent their child, but many of us do not have the luxury of playing a consistent or active role in our children’s lives. I think it would be helpful to hear y’all’s take on parenting from afar. Thanks again to you both.
So glad you two speak and I can see more than professionals but people who are passionate about recovering the wounded and making good, solid souls in the world. As for topic ideas, I'd like to see something on both your ideas of recovery ie self love, self confidence, team healthy things. Another topic may be the gaslighting/ brainwashing/ coercive control that modifies behavior in respect to these interactions. I have tons of gratitude to both of you helping me become a better person, especially Ross. How you both have this love of joining with people on their journey and being the surgeon for those who are so close to living a fulfilled life is so inspiring to anyone who wants to work in psychology. Thank you and lots of love.
Yes, one of my therapists said that my husband was committing Emotional Incest with our oldest son who was 12 and 13 at the time. Then my husband died suddenly from a heart attack at age 44. So that all through these following 44 years the grief is still raw. So I keep going back for therapy to keep my head on straight. My son still ignores his sister, brother and me. Yes, alienation is insidious.
I love your advice, Ross, about doing the thing you know is going to anger the kid now, but in 20 years they'll look back and acknowledge the benefits of your example or guidance. That's excellent help. Thank you.
Literally, everything that (for the child) has emotional personal values attached to (healthy parent), will cause an inner conflict in the self-destructive parent that will be immediately taken out on the child.
I educated myself when my child was 3 as I quickly realised what was going on. We've had all the help and support I could find to keep a light on the separated family and my child's belief system and wellbeing. I have worked hard to mitigate what I knew was going on continually for 6 years. At times things were going well and I fell into a false sense of security that the insidious emotional and mental poison had stopped or reduced in it's administration. Then things would blow up with a huge resurgence. My child has been a pawn and hugely impacted throughout. He showed all the telltale signs of at first mild alienation, through moderate and now severe despite all I knew you and the careful line I trod to prevent the spread. 10 months now he has been estranged from me and is only 9 years old. It's soul destroying 😢 I love my son so much and will never give up. ❤
You are lucky because he is a minor and you can go back to court to get share custody. Find an aggressive attorney and please fight back in court while he still a minor. Don’t give up! Mine are adults and nothing I can do anymore. Good luck 🍀👍
I’m currently going through this. I can’t wait to see your next video. I’m struggling to figure out the dynamics in parental alienation. It’s hard to self regulate when you are abandoned by your spouse and simultaneously your children. When you live with a narcissistic type person, you learn extreme self regulation because if you don’t, you are always afraid of an explosion. Like if you keep gasoline away from a fire pit. The fire is always burning, so just keep the gas away. What has become difficult is when you lose “everyone”, it becomes harder to regulate because the pain is so great. I went from telling my feelings what to do, to my feelings lead me wherever they want to go. I would love to hear about how to regulate in times of extreme stress such as in a divorce with a narcissist. When you are threatened with not just a death of the family, but that you will begin WW3, the ok corral, being bled dry of money, and buried in court…your amygdala is on constant fire mode. Being the mature adult is difficult because your brain is in constant fight or flight. When your kids join in WW3 with the narcissist, it’s almost impossible to tell your body that your kids are not the threat, even though they say and do the same words and actions they see from their parent. I have found that I am so afraid of loss of relationship with my kids that being a good parent and using appropriate boundaries is a daily choice I have to make. I never lived in fear of boundaries with my kids until this divorce. Having “no” as the answer despite being told they won’t come to your house or be in relationship with you if you don’t do what they want is terrifying. Every part of this is disregulating. Being the mature adult is a lot of effort. Is there a way to slow your amygdala once it has fired? What do healthy boundaries look like with children who say they don’t have to have relationship with you if you don’t do what they say.
If they are minor go to court to get share custody doesn’t matter if they like you or not. Bring them to your side while you can before they become adults. Don’t give up, buy a punching bag put it in your garage and burn that energy. Get a dog for your kids something that you can share with them. It doesn’t get better, you must to recoup your terrain and remember it’s a long standing war with the Narc. Good luck 🍀👍
You need to adopt a self-preservation attitude immediately. Join the YMCA, work out at least 3 times per week. If you are a man don’t bother with the courts…..they will bleed you dry and you will be in a worse spot than you started financially and your custody will be the same as if you didn’t do anything. If you are woman, use the courts they are very effective. You are of no use to your kids if you are not mentally and emotionally fit. You need to SHOW them that you make positive decisions and you can move forward (not fall apart). Good luck!
The latest thing now in courts is the parent accused of abusing the children is claiming to be a victim of parental alienation, and the claims of this abusive parent is been given priority over the rights and safety of the children.
A grandparent can also alienate a child from their parent/s. So damaging to the child to deprive them of their loving parental support, while everyone thinks they are "close" to the diabolical grandparent. It's a lifelong sorrow for the alienated parent/s. I did not know what my mother was doing behind my back.
Grandparent is babysitter, but I thought I was coping with her hatred and lies of me, I find out more and more, I’m 82. I thought narcissism was a statue. One year ago I learned this nightmare has a name. I realize now how small and isolated my family was. Mother was a physically handicapped, unkept, emotional wreck. She sat for 83 years. My father was a foster child, early 1900s. They work for food. At almost 30, homeless, drinking too much, The needy perfect husband for an angry snake. A roof and sex. He learned machine shop, never drank, when she wasn’t emasculating him, he stayed outside. Her caregiver zombie. She did absolutely nothing. Didn’t even read. 3 or 4th grade my sister and I did the Laundry/iron. No dryer, no perm. Press. My children became more fiercely angry, disrespectful, screaming insults, too many people pointing out why do you put up to that. They lived in beautiful homes, which my Mother, I am told at her funeral, where do you live, she wouldn’t tell anyone where you live. Two houses were in sight, walking distance, she was trash ugliest house all she could. 50 years, one small church, the minister, began his sermon, with people asking him one question. Who I was, I was their daughter, I was her sister. My children are very adult now, they know nothing, don’t want to know, they feel her hatred and demeaning. And they don’t know why. They can’t say What abuse has ever happened, just the hatefulness of her. Three children, all alienated, hate me, won’t say why, know I have health issues, never ever have offered a glass Of water. Punish me constantly. So ingrained, don’t help her. She shouldn’t live there. Sorry, I just don’t know what to do with this. This maybe ten days, it’s been 82 years. Narcissism should be included in schools teaching bullying, menacing, gaslighting. If only I had known.
@@fayewilliams5840 so sorry. I only started learning about it in my 50s and also wish it had been sooner. But the past can't be changed. We can find freedom from the bullies now. I found the book Mothers who Can't Love by Susan Forward helpful, and Dr Carter's UA-cam channel. I have stopped hoping the bullies will change or see that they were wrong about me. I accept that they are who they have chosen to be, and that is their right. I have given up my false hope, accepted the way it is, moved away from them and detached emotionally. I realised that I was desperate for them to love me because I loved them, and I loved and cared too much, even when they kept harming me. So I've let them go. And I realise that I stayed too long where I wasn't wanted, and I feel free and peaceful away from them. I'm not afraid of them any more because they are not in my life now. I am spending my life with other people who are kind. Now I know that we don't have to stay with family at any cost. I am grateful that Jesus loves me and all people, and He cares about us. He is the best Friend who can rescue us from all our fears. Peace and courage to you.
❤ A big thank you for sharing all theses nice ideas on how to conter a narcissist abusing kids mentally. It can be a long ball game, but every little steps taken with love and kindness aligned with a toolbox of knowledgge and awareness is the mindset I deeply needed to win the ball game. So grateful you did this video Because i was missing deeply this knowledge 🎉
My ex was a narcissistic sociopath. My children were grown or almost grown, the youngest was sixteen when the divorce started and eighteen when it was final. When I started the divorce he went crazy, he terrorized me at my job and at one point he tried to kill me with his truck. When a restraining order was put on him (for that), he called my adult children and told them I was crazy and he said I was lying about what he did to me. My oldest daughter took his side and helped him 'troll me' on facebook and called my work to try to get me fired. After the divorce, I got breast cancer. I think he told the other two daughters I was 'faking it' for ATTENTION because during the divorce I got alopecia areata and thats what he and my daughter told everyone then. I almost died with neutropenia (from chemo) and laid in ICU thinking my children didn't care about me. I don't know for sure if he lied to them or maybe they just didn't care. Its been 15 years since I have talked to my other two daughters. He gets cancer and dies. They forgot how he was mean and abusive to all of us and now he is in 'sainthood' because that is what my oldest daughter posts on facebook. Her own friends have asked me wtf because they remember him as a creep and how he would throw tempertantrums. They even remember. I did survive cancer and now its been 15 years since the divorce. I have been writing my middle daughter letters...no response. I wrote about everything because I was 'gagged for so long' and noone (not once) asked me anything of what he did to me or what they were doing to me. I am thinking maybe that he really made them hate me. My heart is broken, I love all my daughters (even the one like him) but she has been abusive, borrowing money and screaming at me if I ask her to pay me back. So, I don't talk to her anymore. All this time she pretended to be neutral and I have learned she was in the 'thick of it' backstabbing me the whole time during the divorce and even afterwords. I was considered a good mom to all of them until the divorce. They forgot me, they forgot how active I was raising them. He went and told my friends how 'he' raised them. My friends laughed in his face and told him to leave them alone with his lies. My heart has three holes in it where my daughters used to be and the pain is unbearable at times. I am also mad at my other two daughter's husbands, because they sided with my ex and helped him alienate them from me too. My oldest daughter's husband got smart and divorced her. He is still kind to me, but I can tell he is hesitant to not get involved or talk to me much, which I understand, their youngest isn't 18 yet, so he has to deal with her still, even though he got full custody of his sons. What a mess. 😞
My ex gets away with everything - parental alienation, abuse, not paying child support, kidnapping. I was given full custody of three of my kids, and he told them to run away from me at a gas station or at the airport the day we were leaving the country. He sent my two older sons inside, and they all ran away together. I couldn’t be imprisoned by his and their control anymore. I flew back to the US with only one of my kids. My ex brainwashed my kids. They don’t care that I need a job because he doesn’t pay child support. They don’t care that I need family and friends around for help. All they see is that I left, therefore I’m bad…because that’s what my ex has lead them to believe. They won’t let me talk to my 9 yr. old son. I’m so broken over all the turmoil of the last five years. I have eight kids that are messed up and hurting, yet they don’t see that he’s the one that really doesn’t care about them. He just needs the for narc supply. It’s a never ending hell.
I would love to hear your thoughts on dealing with narcissists in the work place that you can't get away from, whether a coworker or boss, and how to set boundaries with them without appearing "insubordinate". ❤
Very important topic that is a human rights issue. Thanks for sharing. --- What do you think of including a DVD of the documentary, Erasing Family (2020) - Parental Alienation Documentary, as an Offer of Proof or Exhibit with a court document of either objection or a motion? This would be in the context of the issues of Parental Alienation not being seriously addressed by the court. Do you have any other references that may be good to remind a court, or court of appeals about this major problem?
I would love to hear of ways for us to show our children how the same patterns are taking root in them. My daughter on some days has major revelations about her past then other days it’s full shame and she just lashes out
What do you do if the other parent refuses to cooperate, no matter how you try to approach them? Or in best case scenario, they will emphatically agree on an issue, and conclude agreed upon changes need to be implemented, but then will hang up the phone and do *nothing* that was discussed?
Ive been through this also. Th8s was by far the most painful.form of abuse and it screwed up my Grand daughter as well. I never understood what, exactly, i had done wrong, and i continued to offer monetary support as i was being snubbed. I was the Scapegoat in my immeadiate family, and this Grandparent Alienation i never saw coming..its okay though. It took about 14 years to get over. My son had everything to do with this. Im still helping him out also.
I see I’m not alone as a woman in this. My ex, I feel like he couldn’t get over that I left him and thought the next best thing to me was to steal our daughter and his new wife at the time helped him. She wanted me out of the picture. I’ll always live rent free in her head and that’s my consolation. I’ve forgiven them and I pray that I get to see my daughter again.
I became an alienated parent when I left my narcissistic ex of 16 years. He was my 2 son’s step father after I was widowed at age 35. During the relationship he put down my loving gentle parenting style. When he moved out after I told him I was done, he told my oldest son that his biological father may not be his real father, which is complete lie. He told my son I stole his college savings. I felt a complete shift in the way my son treated me. He sided with his narcissistic step father. My son is 28 and I have not seen him in 3 years. I have good days and have had some really dark days. He has cut out our extended family as well and has been very cruel and disrespectful to me. I just can’t wrap my head around it.
Over time, the pain becomes to much for a parent to endure and there are no solutions. There is only the loss of the mind, health and we are gone in a state of loneliness and despair!
I've done 20 years and this year was cut off by her from her new baby (she's been brainwashed from a young age and all he has to do is wear her down a bit and click his fingers). I know how much it hurts but you do get stronger and you get wiser to their tactics ☺️ They are pathetic individuals and when/if my daughter realises what her father is actually like and what he's done, god help him, the girl can be vicious.
My ex started the parental alienation during the marriage and that was the reason why I divorced him. He scapegoated me and trained the children to do the same. Of course, it continued on after also - even worse.
So timely, important and helpful. Would like to see some discussion re suggested do’s and don’ts for the new partner of the healthy divorced parent in a 50-50 custody arrangement in regard to supporting an 8 yo child who’s mother, as an extreme narcissist is already damaging the child and additionally determined to turn the child against the new step-parent. 17:03
My oldest son turned as toxic as the dad over a matter of months. Became violent and ran to dad's and has refused to come back. He is almost 14 and is stronger than me and his younger brothers so when he punched one of his brothers and shoved me he was out of control. I told him if he doesn't stop I will have to call the police. He stopped his behaviour but the next day he went back to his dads even though I have court orders for 50/50 custody 😢 I have been mourning the son I had a wonderful relationship with.
My husband and I are separated, but still live in the same house with our two children. I don't want a divorce, as I still love my husband and my two children. Now what happens when the father has already secretly alienated me so much from our children and brainwashed them to side with him in everything, that the children refuse to me?
Ross & Dr. Carter, thank you! You requested SUGGESTIONS FOR A TOPIC: What to do when the Professionals involved (GAL, PC, Custody Evaluators, Judges, Magistrates, attorneys, etc.) observably enable, embolden, and thus assist The Alienating Parent, often out of fear, not having the courage to shut down "the forums" the alienator uses to continue their destructive narratives, to implement structures that restore a tangible "balance" to begin to improve from, etc. (For example, the Magistrate was observably heard, "We know this is Parental Alienation, but I have over 2,000 cases sitting on my desk, and I'll be damned if I am going to take on the ire of that lady" (meaning the Alienating Parent)). This same attitude has been observed in GALs, Custody Evaluators, Parent Coordinators, etc. And, what has been observed in their defense, is when they do offer a different opinion, recommendation, or ruling against The Alienator, they are attacked by The Alienator (and their flying monkey supporters, and their own attorneys) through actions that are meant to degrade, demean, and discredit (often done publicly
I love the content which is very helpful as I have just separated from the narcissist father of my two small kids (2 and 4 years old). How do I protect them from his drama? He is trying to manipulate them to get to me, saying he loves mama and asks them if they wouldn’t want him to stay over at the house or spend more time with them. What do I say then to stop him and also protect my children from these type of discussions which I feel put pressure on them, or are an attempt to guilt trip them into having to proof their love for him by saying to mum that dad should stay over.
I was alienated from my father and my kids were (and still are, as adults) alienated from me. There is no magic bullet. Not from judges, not from therapists. But the best advice he gave up there I think, in my experience, is to repair the person you are who got married to a narcissist in the first place. He had many other good suggestions but I could not have carried them out because my hair was on fire, I was too emotionally reactive to be that empathetic parent my kids needed
Oh boy....he was on to the "Listen to your mother" idea. He would constantly say "Your Mother is Insane...never listen to anything she has to say. Everybody hates your mother....She has to do what I want, or I will GET RID OF HER, and get you a new mother". The kids grew up with the idea, Mother means a Personal Slave, with no rights. She has no rights to speak, or think for herself, or do anything that is outside of HIS OWNERSHIP over her life. I was miserable living under his abuse rules. Divoring a Covert...makes them become more abusive and use teenagers or young adult kids to be a person that Abuses by Proxy. Daughter is his Golden child....she finds out what I'm doing. Runs to tell her Dad, they make a plan together where she plays a huge part in it to harm my life, over and over and over. Asking her to stop does not work. Explaining how doing damage to my property, stealing my things, trying to harm my life...is being evil. Nope. She gets attention from her Dad by being evil to me.
After listening three times to this session, I know I need to hear it again because I keep having epiphanies. We all had our parts to play as children but we had no props for this episode nor tools to deal with the dynamics going on between our parents. And it carries on to the next generation. Desperate feelings as I now see that the hurtful narcissists were damaged and hurt while they were children as well.
Wow, i am starting to see this after 10 yrs! The problem is very generational, the flags are there but difficult to see when you are in love. One really rolls the dice when they pick a mate. My ex’s family is the poster family for alienation.
I went no contact, I went stable while my ex-wife continued on the enmeshment/parentification route. My kids chose stability even though it affected their choice in women.
I saw this happen in my immeadiate family..they ally up. Its never really about love. Its about gaining an ally. The child learns this as a way to get what they want. Children learn early on how to manipulate three people to attain what they want from The Mom, the Dad or the Grandma. When you really think.about it, how a child's brain works at such a young age, it is just incredible. A successful manipulator will control.things to the point that all.three parties will never come together to learn the truth until the death of the child. Thats when the truth comes out. Its way too late then. Id like to get all of four of us together, but I doubt that will ever happen. The adult child will.make sure that never happens as long as they are alive. No one is ever prepared for something like this. No one really has the right answer. It's Avery tough thing to live with. The best way to work through this is to be totally honest. Very, very tough. My son is 36 now and I'm 64. I've been dealing with this half my life.
The narcissist makes it his central task to incite the children against the father/mother from whom they have separated or to install in them the hatred that they themselves carry within them.
What do you do when he discards you after 46 years and you find out that he has already alienated them from you many years ago. My grown adult kids won't speak to me for over a year now. They refuse to hear my side and hold him up on a pedestal. 😢 I had no idea that he is a psychopathic narcissist and that he had been poisoning them against me for many years.
Sorry you are going through this. Sadly there is no amount of "making your case" if they won't talk or listen. The Adult kids will have to come around. And that may never happen.😢 You will not be able to force the issue. I speak from over 3 years of not hearing from 2 of 3 of my adult kids. From a 40 year marriage. Get some good couseling is my advise.
Such evil. Write off the ex and any kids that turned against you. Sorry, ouch, and the worst part is they now live to see you suffer. Dont. Go find joy in your life, and friends who enjoy your company. Maybe the kids will come around, but can you trust them to not use your feelings against you? I dont have the answer, because I come from a messed up family that never solved conflicts but with abuse and violence. But you sure want to hear and see some genuine remorse before you let them too close. You might only be a target for robbery of your valuables. Once they show disrespect to you, it gives them permission to trash their own morals.
You fell susceptible because of deception. I was not able to recognize the gaslighting, love bombing, etc etc.. early on. I spent more effort trying to change the tone, explaining 40 diffierent ways, beimg mute, never react, blah blah blah. When I realized the truth, omgosh, my mind was blown and I was so angry I allowed this abuse. Took me a while to even call it abuse. I idolized that man. But he is evil amd a liar and did some really cruel things to me. Together and married 29 years but now divorced.
From someone that is 14 years into alienation with my children, I have a question. Is there anyone on UA-cam giving advice that isn't trying sell something? It's a disgrace that so many people are capitalising on such a horrific form of abuse just to make money for themselves
Рік тому
My ex-wife has narcissism and alienates me from my children. What needs to be done?
The mother of my 3 girls will not let talk to them unless she's listening in on the conversation. If they tell me the want to live with me their mother immediately hangs the phone up. This is the most difficult thing I've ever dealt with mentally.
Any cards or gifts given, my children had to destroy them in front of the Abuser. The only thing the Abuser kept was Cash, Money orders or Cheques. Ten years no contact I had to bury them as mentally it was causing me problems.
Dad started maligning Mom after she divorced him, he triangulated me against her, my siblings and her family, to take his side; he's still doing this 50 years later. Now he is complaining about his former and late in-laws. He emotionally alienates me from them; it isn't happening; that annoys him: good! He doesn't say why he is irritated. I wish he would grow up and shut up! He's out of line all along! I am 60 and don't live with him; Dad is a tyrant. he's taking it out on me, for Mom divorcing him. I look just like her, think like her and act like her; he forces me to take his side: that hasn't and won't work. It alienates me from him. I have nothing to do with him. He is immature and insecure. He won't grow up! I resent him pitting me against my grandparents, I was close to them(lived with them). Dad is cruel!
Dr. C. A. Childress explains parental alienation with much greater clarity than this. His model of how to recognise it and what actually happens make a lot more sense
My 2 children are among 30 today, i still hope some way they Can wake up and understand. Sadly it dosent look good yet, im in no contact , since they are not nice towards me and the littel contact we have had since they were teens , have not been from theyr heart. I once tryed to get free process to go against the Danish State. And the rejektion for not beeing alowed to do that was that my case was to Big.and the system also once recommanded me to sue the father. But i did not want to go that way, because it has always been the system who have had the highest decision power, so i dont blame the fathers behavior highest, but i blame the system for the way they have run our childrens childcases with blind eyes, ohr what i have a suspision about, is that they could se it and took advantage of it to make a good buisness out of it. I have now become grandmother 4 times, in a family that was suppose to be my lifes happynes, that has ended to be a grandmother all alone in the World. This family devorse case agenda is the most sick and human damaging in the New World Order agenda ,they have forced all of humanity into accept.
The worst part is when they take the kid ghost on you and you are broke, then tell the court that it was wilful abandonment. The smirking and gloating in court is stomach churning
One-sided relationships. What to do when your spouse/co parent constantly disrespects you and never shows any sort of empathy or sympathy. They put all kinds of effort into being hurtful and hateful. When it comes to being kind, respectful, or understanding they just walk away or disregard what is being said. What to do when you are crying and explaining how much heartache they are causing in hopes of them showing some sort of empathy. And they are just mean and walk away, leaving you crying. They make you feel like it was wrong to say anything or that i shouldn't feel a certain way and to just get over it. They always have an excuse when trying to talk.
I'm dealing with my sons wife being the one that has alienated me from my sons life. They still talk to my ex husband but I'm the one that has been deleted by the wife and encouraged by my ex husband. I got no explanation from my son, I was blocked on phone, email, chat, messaging etc. My ex husband is still in good contact with them.
suggestions for a victim of parental alienation who is not able to have any contact with their children as the proven child abuser whose stolen the kids by lying and abuse by proxy continues to abuse the kids in literally every way possible. And the alienated parent is forced to pay for the ongoing child abuse. ??¿
Was it court sanctioned parental alienation, where the judge awarded the abuser with sole custody? That's the only way alienation actually occurs when children are forced to live in the sole custody of the abusive parent and are cut off, by court order, from the parent they felt safe and secure with. Otherwise kids figure out who their parents are and an abusive parent reaps what they sow. Which is how it should be without court interference.
@tannislintz1124 yes. I have no contact. No visits. No phone calls. No texts. No letters. I'm just forced to pay him to abuse them in every way known to man including SA. The kids even talked a little about the SA in front of a counselor but the counselor just ignored subpoenas for court initially and later came to court and committed what the kids said about the SA going on in the shower with my youngest. My ex is a sociopath and simply lied a lot.
@tannislintz1124 my ex is also a proven pedo BTW. There are numerous police reports of him doing it to other kids including a report over 200 pages long.
@@Truthistrash why did the court not allow you visitation or any sort of correspondence? what did u do? the judge had no opinion on the what the counselor report said? maybe child support court dont care but wouildnt CPA be interested in the details of report
@@Truthistrash what kind of situation does the other parent have to be in to have sole custody granted to 'proven pedo' and has the childrens admission
The repeating, little, disparagng comments cause huge damage. My father tolerated the crazymaking as if nothing was wrong... or if painful, still it was not to be discussed. Challenging Mom resulted in too huge a price to pay for the whole family. She would always win; if she was unhappy we all suffered for it. Dad knew not firm boundaries. People in our community admired her and many told me how lucky I was to have her as my mother. Only 1 of 5 siblngs (over six decades later) has had a happy, lasting adult relationship.
Talking to children is easier said then done. My kids were in their early teens when my ex and I separated. My ex-wife had already started to turn the kids against me before we split. When the kids witness the verbal and emotional abuse that is inflicted on you, you’re already not in good standing with kids, despite all of my efforts to be involved in their lives and be a good father. That is the most frustrating part in my opinion. One phrase/response that I said often to my ex-wife was “you never give me credit for all that I’ve done with and for the kids”. Typical Narcissist trait, “What have you done for me lately?” There is a video that’s about a parent that was sent to jail for Parent Alienation. That would be wonderful, but would most likely to sever your ties to your children forever.
As someone who was the child in parental alienation, I want to always remind people that the children are victims, not villains. If you are a targeted parent, don't villainize your child, don't put the blame on them for having rejected you, and don't expect them to have "known better". When considering your own pain, don't forget to consider theirs. As I moved into adulthood, that's when I could see the situation clearly. I look back now and say, "I wouldn't have been able to fully grasp what was going on above my head. I was just a little kid living in survival mode."
This is so important, I agree 100%! I never blame my daughter- I have such compassion, sadness and guilt/regret that this happened to her. It’s not her fault. I stay strong knowing she will need me to be strong for her. I would never blame her… she is a child. Innocent. And put in a horrific situation. My heart breaks that she was forced to participate in this crazy, toxic dynamic for the needs of grown man. Where I struggle is keeping my opinions- more my facial expressions- to myself. I know she is in such a tough position. I hated when my mom talked poorly about my dad as a kid and an adult( I’m NOT the one! I wanted to tell “find a friend to talk to!!”) and I refuse to do it.
I hope you’re well. I’m so sorry you were put in the middle of that. So unfair…🙏🏻
I will go a step further, I am starting to realize that it really is not (completely) the alienators fault either. It is generational, if you look closely at the parents and grandparents of the alienator you will see a pattern of this behavior. Unfortunately, it is difficult to see the warning flags before you choose a spouse😢
They are as long as they are working to your demise.
@@well_weathered ……exactly correct. No matter how they learned the behavior, at the end of the day they have perpetrated this behavior/crime.
@@bwalsberg I believe there is a law in place (or was) that if an adult initiated a minor into criminal behavior there be recourse but I don't know how that has played out in court and how it would play out in this dynamic. It would have to be proven criminal behavior.
It’s horrible to experience. It’s like mourning the death of a child who is still alive.
I never thought I’d ever hear anyone else say this. I was told years ago I was wrong to use this analogy by a friend who actually did lose her child. But, I’ve even dreamed my daughter was passed and have grieved her for years as if she passed. It’s a grief you can’t even rightfully have as ppl will just say you should just make up with her or it’s your fault. I say it’s actually harder then a death. At least my friend can look forward to seeing her daughter again in eternity and hold to some happy memories of her. My daughter literally tortures me and enjoys it, so I can’t long to be with her. She’s become actually dangerous for my health. So sorry that we share such pain. Prayers for God to reach our children with Truth.
@@TruthsHandmaid4444 stay strong I know EXACTLY how you feel. We must rise and turn that love that was there into ourselves fully. It’s so hard but overtime the strength will get us through. Godspeed
@@TruthsHandmaid4444 I thought I was the only one. It really is like your children have died, yet you know they are out there somewhere living life like you never existed. All you have are pictures and memories. It's so sad that family relationships mean so little in the world now. Absolutely there are things I'd change, things I'd do differently. But you cant go back, and you can't change other people no matter what their relationship is to you. I'm slowly realizing that as long as I know my own truth and if God knows my truth, that's what matters now. Our kids will hopefully one day see how much we love them. Sometimes it happens and sometimes it doesn't. Either way, do what is in your power to fix things and realize your feelings are important too. Take care a nd God bless...
In 2002 I began raising my 3 & 5 year old stepdaughters 24/7 as he had chased their bio mom out of their life. I didn’t know what I was involved in. In 2015 when the girls were 16 & 18. My older one hasn’t spoke to me since. My younger one and I had stopped talking for about 18 months until graduation. We have been rebuilding our relationship the last seven years. After a nasty divorce of him dragging property division and divorce on seven plus years, we were finally divorced October 2022. I’ve never talked to my daughter about our divorce. Recently my flying monkey cousin passed away and my narc brother stepped into that role. Needless to say, my ex has weaselled his way back in with another smear campaign and as of last week my younger daughter has stopped talking to me again. It’s so absolutely heartbreaking! I don’t know how to heal and how to help my now adult daughters. My oldest is an addict like her dad. My youngest is in a 5 year future faking narc relationship herself. What a mess…they were my whole world and 7 1/2 years later I still don’t know how to move forward. 💔
@@gypsysoul4994 I hate this for you and I have realized this is more common than we believe. We hurt everyday and I don’t know how to help mine either. Worries me daily too. I hope and pray your children find their way back to you. My daughter and I talked for just a little bit. Her dad figured out how to ruin that and caused another divide. Every time she starts to come around this happens. It’s a pattern that mine refuses to see. Yes heartbreaking. I’ve learned I can only control me and I just try to make my life better so when she does figure out what her father is I can be there for her without causing any more damage hopefully. That could be years, tomorrow or never and I have to accept that.
I get this. Also “Parental abduction”, where they move far away and try to totally erase or replace the other parent…decimating the “bad parent” in court… the lies…scary stuff. Good work here, please keep educating. ❤
My ex is in the same zip code and I haven’t seen my child for six years now. He won’t talk to me anymore.
Parental abduction.. so true , when all they have left to control you with and punish you is the child ….
Pure evil
@@marianatequiero28 Then it continues with the grandchildren
Thats me, the erased parent. My daughter said "you are an embarrassment, move on mom, we all have". Yup, me loving them and contacting them on holidays/birthdays and wanting to have a relationship makes me appear as something totally negative (not good/loving/motherly) and this is and I am embarrassing to them... What kinda F%*KTARD teaches his children that their mothers unconditional love and and her wanting/trying to be their mother is bad and should be condemend and needs to stop and this is something to be embarrased about or embarrased for her for being or doing... I think there is a special place in Hell for these parents and the bullshit the dole out is going to come back and they will experience 1K X what we are experiencing in our lives... So sick and sad about this, just so sick and sad about this whole shitty thing
This is what I'm going through. She's moved states twice. Over 15000 in lawyer fees. Haven't seen or heard from our 3yr old daughter in almost 7 months. Took my car and furniture. I need some help please
Parents don't have to be separated or divorced. Some do the alienation of affection and authority while they are under same roof. Many confusing and sad memories. A lot of parental gaslighting.
Especially than.
so true
I'm so sorry. This is so sad. People who get married who shouldn't be married to begine with.
That's what we experienced. Mom was extremely emotionally abusive, and often physically abusive; and Dad and we kids were caught in the trap. I'm not a psychologist, but I tolerated her antics for 46 years, and early on I'd pinned her behavior on pathological envy: she was constantly comparing herself/her life to others, and always seeing herself as inadequate, then blaming it on -- or taking it out on -- someone else.
I believe Mom's problems started very early in life, as Oppositional Defiance Disorder enhanced by physical and emotional beatings she received for perceived misbehavior, which sinuously developed into pathological envy and, eventually, narcissism.
Yup
This is what I’m going through right now. Two of my three kids got totally brainwashed by their father to hate me and it’s been three years that our communication has been cut off. Being a foreigner living in a foreign country who is not familiar with the laws here, my narcissistic ex took advantage of this and turn everything against me including my kids. The pain is indescribable, it’s like they’re gone forever. It’s so hard mentally and emotionally. I’m scared that my youngest kid will be like them. Thank you very much for this video. 🙏🏼🙌🏼
Hello, I'm in a similar situation to you.
I am in the same boat. My children haven't lived with me since they were pre teens. They are in their mid 30's, and still will not communicate. I still ache to hug them, and tell them I love them.
And, I still can't believe they still believe his lies. I found out my daughter got married in 2020. My son...I have no idea where he is. I am downsizing to move. I have huge plastic boxes of their stuff. Things they would love to have. What do I do with them? I texted my ex narcissist. He never answered.
I’ve never experienced anything so painful in my life than being alienated from my children. Dad made sure of it. Pain never gets better
Cruelty is the point and it’s so evil.😢
@@TiMarie13 ❤️
I’m right there with you. It is and has been absolutely detrimental to my health. My doctor said my stress and grief were a huge contributing factor to the small stroke I had. A year and a half of zero contact and nobody telling me how she’s doing. It is just so wrong. It’s absolutely cruel. They do not realize the long term affects. This is having on their parents that truly love them. It means we will not be around as long as we should have been because of the impact it takes on our health. God help us all. ❤️
Think of how bad things were, how bad things will continue to be if your child comes back to you without getting the help they need. You can’t save anyone other than yourself.
I am just seeing this, but yes it is the same as mourning death of a child. While I was in the throws(and still am) my oldest was tragically murdered. So, I deal with both and I don't really wanna live many days
I am a recovering SLD. Your work has helped me so much. I am counter parenting with a covert narcissist, my 2 boys are 3 and 5.
I lay awake at night when I don’t have them and worry that they will pick up all these narcissistic tendencies and suffer all the things related to having a narcissist parent…
Basically I wonder how to prevent them from becoming narcissistic later in life with their core personalities being moulded right now. But I think you already answered the question in this video. When I have them to demonstrate healthy relations and empathy etc.
I can’t help by wonder, what else I can do…. But later in life it will make sense to them. It’s just hard when they are so young.
If I wanted more custody I’d be up for a huge legal battle. There is no winning.
I have a young adult at 20. I miss her sooooo much. She is unhealthy to my recovery ❤️🩹 I went no contact so I can work on me. She gas lights me and uses me. I choose me. I left the husband my parents and daughter. Thanks for the encouragement
What is SLD? Geezuz!
I went through this many years ago. I'm still rebuilding my relationship with my adult children.
How did you get them back? How many years passed? What ages did you lose them?
Still waiting over 10 years now,,,
They often call it a personality disorder, but it goes deeper. They have no consciousness. It can be compared to an incurable deep dissociative state that makes them spiritually static. In addition, they are masters of feigning mental health and 100% convinced of their own integrity. They are not approachable, they always say they have the best intentions that you still has a pain spot that needs to heal or they gaslight something that is not true like 'don't be so aggressive, you are fierce or, feisty' or 'you always look for conflict, I am cheerful and for harmony'. And that they grew up traumatically is not always necessary or has many hidden forms.
For example, my ex-mother-in-law projected her fear of losing him via suffocation to such an excess that he became boundless. He really was allowed everything. Misbehaviors were then tucked away with the cloak of love. And this took the most extreme forms.
During the marriage I was also subject to her manipulation, knowing about her trauma (a pre-born child who was sacrificed to Satan after a few weeks (yes really) that she didn't know what had happened to it, where it had gone and she was not allowed to mourn by her father.
And for example my grandmother was 8 months pregnant with my mother when grandfather was shot during WOII. My mother developed narcissistic, had no self esteem or self worth with all kinds of demoralizing consequences.
We empathic people often think that absolute terms are not realistic, but with this kind of psychopathy it is. They will NEVER change and they will ALWAYS abuse you.
I am from the Netherlands and send all of you love and strength to heal ❤
Thank to both of you for keeping up the awareness of this madness of PA
As I have been true it, I been Alienated from my children for years while I was in the family home, l worked and my wife was a stay at home mum ,her choice. I am gon from the family home know 3.5 years with no contact with my kids even though I tried everything everything
I had a spiritual awakening through surviving my narcissist. I’m still trying to learn from what happened. The two of you are Godsends ❤
“My narcissist “ stop saying that your clinging yourself to that person through your wording
Amazing collaboration. I am a huge fan of Dr. Carter. He is such a great teacher. Been following him since 2020 Spring. Calm firmness and just staying a good role model are my main mantras.
My ex did parental alienation but I didn’t know it. When my son turned 18, he started telling my son that my husband was stalking and harassing him. It turned into a high profile case in my area where he bomb threatened 41 schools pretending to be my husband. My son is 23 and won’t speak to me. His father is in jail on no bail and my adult son still thinks I was terrorizing his dad. My ex is so evil and sick that there aren’t even words to describe. 23 years he’s been terrorizing me. He hates women. He hated me. He cheated on me, used drugs while I was pregnant. Wouldn’t work. I finally got a job and then he accused me of cheating and tried to have me jumped on my birthday. He left the next day on 3/30/2001 after I narrowly escaped with my life and he was caught, and then he used the courts and every way to torment me for 23 years. Now my adult son hates me. Not even the arrest and seeing his fathers face plastered all over the news for bomb threats, stalking and terrorization has convinced my son that it’s been his dad the entire time! I’m devastated with grief. I’ve always thought the truth would prevail but here we are.
I have one, a quarter of a century later 🙄 this needs to be addressed better, for society in a whole. Much less the ongoing personal nature of destruction this does
Thank you. I love you both. I needed this soooo much. I am breaking the cycle. I am a recovered SLD and am no contact with the intrusive covert narc mum and an ex narc that I am paralel parenting with. ❤❤❤
It is nice to see my two favorites on the topic of narcissism together in one video. Would you please consider making content for children in this situation? I would love to have some books or videos to share with my children to help enlighten them about what is happening. My daughter’s counselor says I can never talk to her about these things, but I love how you presented this to say, “in our home I won’t ask you to keep secrets from your father because I believe that puts you in an uncomfortable situation, and might negatively affect your relationship with your dad.” It presents another option without being negative about the other parent. It’s neglectful for me to not say anything because knowledge is power, and I need to find a way to teach them about narcissism without pointing a finger at their father. Otherwise, they could waste 5 years of their life, like I did, or 35 years, like many do, trying to figure out what the problem is. Dr. Carter’s video titled 18 ways a covert narcissist can perpetuate frustration began my road to recovering myself and my mental health.
In 2002 I began raising my 3 & 5 year old stepdaughters 24/7 as he had chased their bio mom out of their life. I didn’t know what I was involved in. In 2015 when the girls were 16 & 18. My older one hasn’t spoke to me since. My younger one and I had stopped talking for about 18 months until graduation. We have been rebuilding our relationship the last seven years. After a nasty divorce of him dragging property division and divorce on seven plus years, we were finally divorced October 2022. I’ve never talked to my daughter about our divorce. Recently my flying monkey cousin passed away and my narc brother stepped into that role. Needless to say, my ex has weaselled his way back in with another smear campaign and as of last week my younger daughter has stopped talking to me again. It’s so absolutely heartbreaking! I don’t know how to heal and how to help my now adult daughters. My oldest is an addict like her dad. My youngest is in a 5 year future faking narc relationship herself. What a mess…they were my whole world and 7 1/2 years later I still don’t know how to move forward. 💔
I took care of my 15 year younger brother when he was a child and mum struggled with addiction and mental illness. I had a parental role which became more apparent when I finished school and got a job. I was his safe space. When I had enough of doing my mothers role and sat boundaries with her, she threw me out and I lost all contact with both of them for years. I tried to reconnect with her, so I took her to therapy when I had done my own therapy. I was about 23 by then. After a couple of months I realized she wasent going to do the work in therapy, and she wasent going to accept I had another point of view on things. When I said this, that it wasn't going to work, she almost ran out of the therapist's office and home to my brother to tell him lies about me and block me. At that time I didnt understand why she did that. But as an adult now 40 years old with a lifetime of experiences I understand that she felt threatened. She knew my brother and I had a close relationship so she made me the bad guy to make him stay with her. I have tried to contact my brother but he refuses. His other sister tells me he says awful things about me and is very hateful. He is now in his 20ths and an adult so I feel I cant do much. Its like grieving people who are still alive. Anyway, I feel like the alinated dad. Even though Iam the older sister. Because the same process happened to me.
Also how to interact with the child that is showing narcissistic tendencies, without getting triggered by them.
In 2002 I began raising my 3 & 5 year old stepdaughters 24/7 as he had chased their bio mom out of their life. I didn’t know what I was involved in. In 2015 when the girls were 16 & 18 I left their dad. My older one hasn’t spoke to me since. My younger one and I had stopped talking for about 18 months until graduation. We have been rebuilding our relationship the last seven years. After a nasty divorce of him dragging property division and divorce on seven plus years, we were finally divorced October 2022. I’ve never talked to my daughter about our divorce. Recently my flying monkey cousin passed away and my narc brother stepped into that role. Needless to say, my ex has weaselled his way back in with another smear campaign and as of last week my younger daughter has stopped talking to me again. It’s so absolutely heartbreaking! I don’t know how to heal and how to help my now adult daughters. My oldest is an addict like her dad. My youngest is in a 5 year future faking narc relationship herself. What a mess…they were my whole world and 7 1/2 years later I still don’t know how to move forward. 💔
I have never ever heard this spoken about the way both of you have shared. I watched part one and had to watch this video as well. Together, you are both extremely powerful in your individual way of teaching about having a narcissistic parent who alienates the other parent and the resulting effects it has on the children. I am absolutely blown away. I could watch both videos 10 times and I still would be hearing things I missed the first time I saw your videos. Thank you so much. I hope you keep making videos together.
Healthy parent to the children: "There are things where mum/dad don't see eye to eye, that's why we split up. But with me, we want to listen to each other and focus on that."
In this way, you show your children your healthy, cooperative values.
- Les Carter
This can happen with adult children also regarding their parent talking bad about the other parent and telling lies so the adult child will get mad at the parent that actually is a good parent and loves them. I’m going through that right now with my daughter and I see every time we go through this, she text me some random questions out of the blue about her father and then when I answer, she tells me that’s not what he says and I know she’s talking to him and then the next thing I know she tells me she needs space from me this is happened several times so this does happen to younger kids and adult kids also😰 it’s sad. It breaks my heart.
I saw my ex covert put her kids against their dad. I was still surprised when I figured out the same thing happened with my child. I mourned the loss. My mom did the same thing to me and my siblings, putting us against dad. It wasn't until well after their deaths I figured it out. My 6 siblings still live in a false world where covert mom was the "best of them." My father was my protector the entire time and I was set against him.
I had 5 kids with a covert narc. I haven’t seen them in two years. As the alienated parent, I’m not sure how this video really addresses my situation. Alas, it’s good to know I am not alone.
Thank you to both of you♥️🙏🔥Powerful stuff!!
Wish you two and all here a great day and more healing to those who need it!!
💪🙂👍
I think if you got a legal expert in on the conversation it would be helpful. I was blindsided by the dirty ruthless tricks my narcissistic ex was able to do legally and emotionally.
The courts, lawyers, gals, therapists are inept and usually make it worse. Very very very few lawyers are even aware of how this works and how to identify it never mind successfully defend against it.
I’ve always wondered if toxic controlling parents “trying to make it work”is worse for the kids than separation.
Appreciate this series.
For our dad it was "cheaper to keep her" despite the horrible abuse she doled out on all of us. And it would have been much worse for us kids, because we would have been stuck living with our mother, who was easily the most difficult person I've ever known. Watch the movies "Mommy Dearest" and "The Great Santini" to get an idea.
I’m not wondering anymore
In my opinion and experience, it absolutely is, and I wish it was easier to talk about parental alienation and support its victims without giving ammunition to the even greater number of abusive parents who claim to be victims of this, and to add guilt and doubt onto the shoulders of kids who know their parent is abusive and of healthy parents trying to do the right thing.
I am a sole survivor in my family ..awful gene pool ..brother died last year if kidney cancer aged 43. I lived with his widow and two year old. Who I love no less than if he were my own. Fast forward a year..and she met someone through friends. Fast forward 8 mths. And this guy's OCD about everything has removed me from my nephew. I'm not part of his world in anyway..every little bit of time I had left..i.e..Saturday mornings once per MTH..removed. Once per month pick him up from nursery..take home..tea together..bedtime story..all gone. Apparently he misbehaves to
He day after...I will see him with her occasionally. He goes crazy when he sees me..cries when I have to go. To say it's destroyed me is an understatement. If she was alone..I'd see them both every week. I've spoken with her about it..she knows it has made me Ill but nothing changes..it's got worse. I have no choice but to accept his loss too. Hope the bond we share will always be there. .life is very cruel. I'm completely alone. Some awesome friends. But no family.
Because I don't suffer from sld I can confidently tell you that I managed to do exactly what you suggested is the best defense to parental alienation. It's so refreshing to hear professionals advise people to do what I had to figure out on my own. I sorta feel like a super hero when I hear professionals give the advice that I had come to on my own, in order to raise my kids correctly. Even with the largest or barriers in front of me. I soooooooooo wish I could talk to one or both of you about my parental arc. But this is satisfying nonetheless so thank you sooooooo much for the content. Knowledge is something else
Hi! Thanks to you both for addressing this. Much needed! Les, I can remember coming across your videos back in 2018-19, and finding them refreshingly informative.
Ross, I agree wholeheartedly about the value in the SLD doing the work to heal.
I’m a target mom of alienation, myself. I suffered for years as a result of thinking that it was the alienating parent’s job to change. That perspective consumed me - ended up causing me to lose focus on my cause (which, of course, is my child).
After doing a complete 180, I now coach other parents like me to heal their lives.
👉🏼You touched on some ways that SLD can actively parent their child, but many of us do not have the luxury of playing a consistent or active role in our children’s lives. I think it would be helpful to hear y’all’s take on parenting from afar. Thanks again to you both.
Thank you for this extremely supportive and validating conversation. You have helped me a lot Gentlemen.
So glad you two speak and I can see more than professionals but people who are passionate about recovering the wounded and making good, solid souls in the world.
As for topic ideas, I'd like to see something on both your ideas of recovery ie self love, self confidence, team healthy things. Another topic may be the gaslighting/ brainwashing/ coercive control that modifies behavior in respect to these interactions.
I have tons of gratitude to both of you helping me become a better person, especially Ross. How you both have this love of joining with people on their journey and being the surgeon for those who are so close to living a fulfilled life is so inspiring to anyone who wants to work in psychology. Thank you and lots of love.
Yes, one of my therapists said that my husband was committing Emotional Incest with our oldest son who was 12 and 13 at the time. Then my husband died suddenly from a heart attack at age 44. So that all through these following 44 years the grief is still raw. So I keep going back for therapy to keep my head on straight. My son still ignores his sister, brother and me. Yes, alienation is insidious.
I love your advice, Ross, about doing the thing you know is going to anger the kid now, but in 20 years they'll look back and acknowledge the benefits of your example or guidance. That's excellent help. Thank you.
Literally, everything that (for the child) has emotional personal values attached to (healthy parent),
will cause an inner conflict in the self-destructive parent that will be immediately taken out on the child.
I educated myself when my child was 3 as I quickly realised what was going on. We've had all the help and support I could find to keep a light on the separated family and my child's belief system and wellbeing. I have worked hard to mitigate what I knew was going on continually for 6 years. At times things were going well and I fell into a false sense of security that the insidious emotional and mental poison had stopped or reduced in it's administration. Then things would blow up with a huge resurgence. My child has been a pawn and hugely impacted throughout. He showed all the telltale signs of at first mild alienation, through moderate and now severe despite all I knew you and the careful line I trod to prevent the spread. 10 months now he has been estranged from me and is only 9 years old. It's soul destroying 😢 I love my son so much and will never give up. ❤
You are lucky because he is a minor and you can go back to court to get share custody. Find an aggressive attorney and please fight back in court while he still a minor. Don’t give up! Mine are adults and nothing I can do anymore. Good luck 🍀👍
I’m currently going through this. I can’t wait to see your next video. I’m struggling to figure out the dynamics in parental alienation. It’s hard to self regulate when you are abandoned by your spouse and simultaneously your children. When you live with a narcissistic type person, you learn extreme self regulation because if you don’t, you are always afraid of an explosion. Like if you keep gasoline away from a fire pit. The fire is always burning, so just keep the gas away. What has become difficult is when you lose “everyone”, it becomes harder to regulate because the pain is so great. I went from telling my feelings what to do, to my feelings lead me wherever they want to go. I would love to hear about how to regulate in times of extreme stress such as in a divorce with a narcissist. When you are threatened with not just a death of the family, but that you will begin WW3, the ok corral, being bled dry of money, and buried in court…your amygdala is on constant fire mode. Being the mature adult is difficult because your brain is in constant fight or flight. When your kids join in WW3 with the narcissist, it’s almost impossible to tell your body that your kids are not the threat, even though they say and do the same words and actions they see from their parent. I have found that I am so afraid of loss of relationship with my kids that being a good parent and using appropriate boundaries is a daily choice I have to make. I never lived in fear of boundaries with my kids until this divorce. Having “no” as the answer despite being told they won’t come to your house or be in relationship with you if you don’t do what they want is terrifying. Every part of this is disregulating. Being the mature adult is a lot of effort. Is there a way to slow your amygdala once it has fired? What do healthy boundaries look like with children who say they don’t have to have relationship with you if you don’t do what they say.
If they are minor go to court to get share custody doesn’t matter if they like you or not. Bring them to your side while you can before they become adults. Don’t give up, buy a punching bag put it in your garage and burn that energy. Get a dog for your kids something that you can share with them. It doesn’t get better, you must to recoup your terrain and remember it’s a long standing war with the Narc. Good luck 🍀👍
You need to adopt a self-preservation attitude immediately. Join the YMCA, work out at least 3 times per week. If you are a man don’t bother with the courts…..they will bleed you dry and you will be in a worse spot than you started financially and your custody will be the same as if you didn’t do anything. If you are woman, use the courts they are very effective. You are of no use to your kids if you are not mentally and emotionally fit. You need to SHOW them that you make positive decisions and you can move forward (not fall apart). Good luck!
The latest thing now in courts is the parent accused of abusing the children is claiming to be a victim of parental alienation, and the claims of this abusive parent is been given priority over the rights and safety of the children.
Yup
You guys are doing a lot of good.
How bout both of y'all keep on helping others. I applaud you both for your work
A grandparent can also alienate a child from their parent/s. So damaging to the child to deprive them of their loving parental support, while everyone thinks they are "close" to the diabolical grandparent.
It's a lifelong sorrow for the alienated parent/s.
I did not know what my mother was doing behind my back.
Grandparent is babysitter, but I thought I was coping with her hatred and lies of me, I find out more and more, I’m 82. I thought narcissism was a statue. One year ago I learned this nightmare has a name. I realize now how small and isolated my family was. Mother was a physically handicapped, unkept, emotional wreck. She sat for 83 years. My father was a foster child, early 1900s. They work for food. At almost 30, homeless, drinking too much,
The needy perfect husband for an angry snake. A roof and sex. He learned machine shop, never drank, when she wasn’t emasculating him, he stayed outside. Her caregiver zombie. She did absolutely nothing. Didn’t even read. 3 or 4th grade my sister and I did the
Laundry/iron. No dryer, no perm. Press. My children became more fiercely angry, disrespectful, screaming insults, too many people pointing out why do you put up to that. They lived in beautiful homes, which my
Mother, I am told at her funeral, where do you live, she wouldn’t tell anyone where you live. Two houses were in sight, walking distance, she was trash ugliest house all she could. 50 years, one small church, the minister, began his sermon, with people asking him one question. Who I was, I was their daughter, I was her sister. My children are very adult now, they know nothing, don’t want to know, they feel her hatred and demeaning. And they don’t know why. They can’t say What abuse has ever happened, just the hatefulness of her. Three children, all alienated, hate me, won’t say why, know I have health issues, never ever have offered a glass
Of water. Punish me constantly. So ingrained, don’t help her. She shouldn’t live there. Sorry, I just don’t know what to do with this. This maybe ten days, it’s been 82 years. Narcissism should be included in schools teaching bullying, menacing, gaslighting.
If only I had known.
@@fayewilliams5840 so sorry. I only started learning about it in my 50s and also wish it had been sooner. But the past can't be changed. We can find freedom from the bullies now. I found the book Mothers who Can't Love by Susan Forward helpful, and Dr Carter's UA-cam channel. I have stopped hoping the bullies will change or see that they were wrong about me. I accept that they are who they have chosen to be, and that is their right. I have given up my false hope, accepted the way it is, moved away from them and detached emotionally. I realised that I was desperate for them to love me because I loved them, and I loved and cared too much, even when they kept harming me. So I've let them go. And I realise that I stayed too long where I wasn't wanted, and I feel free and peaceful away from them. I'm not afraid of them any more because they are not in my life now. I am spending my life with other people who are kind. Now I know that we don't have to stay with family at any cost.
I am grateful that Jesus loves me and all people, and He cares about us. He is the best Friend who can rescue us from all our fears. Peace and courage to you.
Thank you. That is perfect. Thank you.
❤ A big thank you for sharing all theses nice ideas on how to conter a narcissist abusing kids mentally. It can be a long ball game, but every little steps taken with love and kindness aligned with a toolbox of knowledgge and awareness is the mindset I deeply needed to win the ball game. So grateful you did this video
Because i was missing deeply this knowledge 🎉
What about when its a narcissistic grandmother/ grandpa trying to alienate the parents and take the child from the parents?
If there were a pill for a narcissist to take to give them empathy, they would not take it.
😢
Exactly. They would fear it as if it were poison.
My ex was a narcissistic sociopath. My children were grown or almost grown, the youngest was sixteen when the divorce started and eighteen when it was final. When I started the divorce he went crazy, he terrorized me at my job and at one point he tried to kill me with his truck. When a restraining order was put on him (for that), he called my adult children and told them I was crazy and he said I was lying about what he did to me. My oldest daughter took his side and helped him 'troll me' on facebook and called my work to try to get me fired. After the divorce, I got breast cancer. I think he told the other two daughters I was 'faking it' for ATTENTION because during the divorce I got alopecia areata and thats what he and my daughter told everyone then. I almost died with neutropenia (from chemo) and laid in ICU thinking my children didn't care about me. I don't know for sure if he lied to them or maybe they just didn't care. Its been 15 years since I have talked to my other two daughters. He gets cancer and dies. They forgot how he was mean and abusive to all of us and now he is in 'sainthood' because that is what my oldest daughter posts on facebook. Her own friends have asked me wtf because they remember him as a creep and how he would throw tempertantrums. They even remember. I did survive cancer and now its been 15 years since the divorce. I have been writing my middle daughter letters...no response. I wrote about everything because I was 'gagged for so long' and noone (not once) asked me anything of what he did to me or what they were doing to me. I am thinking maybe that he really made them hate me. My heart is broken, I love all my daughters (even the one like him) but she has been abusive, borrowing money and screaming at me if I ask her to pay me back. So, I don't talk to her anymore. All this time she pretended to be neutral and I have learned she was in the 'thick of it' backstabbing me the whole time during the divorce and even afterwords. I was considered a good mom to all of them until the divorce. They forgot me, they forgot how active I was raising them. He went and told my friends how 'he' raised them. My friends laughed in his face and told him to leave them alone with his lies. My heart has three holes in it where my daughters used to be and the pain is unbearable at times. I am also mad at my other two daughter's husbands, because they sided with my ex and helped him alienate them from me too. My oldest daughter's husband got smart and divorced her. He is still kind to me, but I can tell he is hesitant to not get involved or talk to me much, which I understand, their youngest isn't 18 yet, so he has to deal with her still, even though he got full custody of his sons. What a mess. 😞
Thank you for this. Very helpful information.
My ex gets away with everything - parental alienation, abuse, not paying child support, kidnapping. I was given full custody of three of my kids, and he told them to run away from me at a gas station or at the airport the day we were leaving the country. He sent my two older sons inside, and they all ran away together. I couldn’t be imprisoned by his and their control anymore. I flew back to the US with only one of my kids. My ex brainwashed my kids. They don’t care that I need a job because he doesn’t pay child support. They don’t care that I need family and friends around for help. All they see is that I left, therefore I’m bad…because that’s what my ex has lead them to believe. They won’t let me talk to my 9 yr. old son. I’m so broken over all the turmoil of the last five years. I have eight kids that are messed up and hurting, yet they don’t see that he’s the one that really doesn’t care about them. He just needs the for narc supply. It’s a never ending hell.
I’m so sorry for your loss- sending healing thoughts to you.
I would love to hear your thoughts on dealing with narcissists in the work place that you can't get away from, whether a coworker or boss, and how to set boundaries with them without appearing "insubordinate". ❤
Pray for me. I’m currently going through this. It’s been 8 months since I’ve seen my two girls. 2 and 7. Everyday a a struggle to want to live
I love you both. I have learned so much from you. Thank you.
Very important topic that is a human rights issue. Thanks for sharing. --- What do you think of including a DVD of the documentary, Erasing Family (2020) - Parental Alienation Documentary, as an Offer of Proof or Exhibit with a court document of either objection or a motion? This would be in the context of the issues of Parental Alienation not being seriously addressed by the court. Do you have any other references that may be good to remind a court, or court of appeals about this major problem?
I would love to hear of ways for us to show our children how the same patterns are taking root in them. My daughter on some days has major revelations about her past then other days it’s full shame and she just lashes out
What do you do if the other parent refuses to cooperate, no matter how you try to approach them? Or in best case scenario, they will emphatically agree on an issue, and conclude agreed upon changes need to be implemented, but then will hang up the phone and do *nothing* that was discussed?
Forgiveness is a decision, not an emotion.breaking with generation patterns is a decision also.
Ive been through this also. Th8s was by far the most painful.form of abuse and it screwed up my Grand daughter as well. I never understood what, exactly, i had done wrong, and i continued to offer monetary support as i was being snubbed. I was the Scapegoat in my immeadiate family, and this Grandparent Alienation i never saw coming..its okay though. It took about 14 years to get over. My son had everything to do with this. Im still helping him out also.
I see I’m not alone as a woman in this. My ex, I feel like he couldn’t get over that I left him and thought the next best thing to me was to steal our daughter and his new wife at the time helped him. She wanted me out of the picture. I’ll always live rent free in her head and that’s my consolation. I’ve forgiven them and I pray that I get to see my daughter again.
I became an alienated parent when I left my narcissistic ex of 16 years. He was my 2 son’s step father after I was widowed at age 35. During the relationship he put down my loving gentle parenting style. When he moved out after I told him I was done, he told my oldest son that his biological father may not be his real father, which is complete lie. He told my son I stole his college savings. I felt a complete shift in the way my son treated me. He sided with his narcissistic step father. My son is 28 and I have not seen him in 3 years. I have good days and have had some really dark days. He has cut out our extended family as well and has been very cruel and disrespectful to me. I just can’t wrap my head around it.
Over time, the pain becomes to much for a parent to endure and there are no solutions. There is only the loss of the mind, health and we are gone in a state of loneliness and despair!
I've done 20 years and this year was cut off by her from her new baby (she's been brainwashed from a young age and all he has to do is wear her down a bit and click his fingers). I know how much it hurts but you do get stronger and you get wiser to their tactics ☺️ They are pathetic individuals and when/if my daughter realises what her father is actually like and what he's done, god help him, the girl can be vicious.
My ex started the parental alienation during the marriage and that was the reason why I divorced him. He scapegoated me and trained the children to do the same. Of course, it continued on after also - even worse.
So timely, important and helpful. Would like to see some discussion re suggested do’s and don’ts for the new partner of the healthy divorced parent in a 50-50 custody arrangement in regard to supporting an 8 yo child who’s mother, as an extreme narcissist is already damaging the child and additionally determined to turn the child against the new step-parent. 17:03
My oldest son turned as toxic as the dad over a matter of months. Became violent and ran to dad's and has refused to come back. He is almost 14 and is stronger than me and his younger brothers so when he punched one of his brothers and shoved me he was out of control. I told him if he doesn't stop I will have to call the police. He stopped his behaviour but the next day he went back to his dads even though I have court orders for 50/50 custody 😢 I have been mourning the son I had a wonderful relationship with.
I can't cope no more. Been 14 years since I last seen two of my son's. I gave birth to them, he abused me then took them made them hate me
❤❤TWO AMAZING MEN, SPREADING AWARENESS❤❤
My husband and I are separated, but still live in the same house with our two children. I don't want a divorce, as I still love my husband and my two children. Now what happens when the father has already secretly alienated me so much from our children and brainwashed them to side with him in everything, that the children refuse to me?
Hello from Florida...
Ross & Dr. Carter, thank you! You requested SUGGESTIONS FOR A TOPIC: What to do when the Professionals involved (GAL, PC, Custody Evaluators, Judges, Magistrates, attorneys, etc.) observably enable, embolden, and thus assist The Alienating Parent, often out of fear, not having the courage to shut down "the forums" the alienator uses to continue their destructive narratives, to implement structures that restore a tangible "balance" to begin to improve from, etc. (For example, the Magistrate was observably heard, "We know this is Parental Alienation, but I have over 2,000 cases sitting on my desk, and I'll be damned if I am going to take on the ire of that lady" (meaning the Alienating Parent)). This same attitude has been observed in GALs, Custody Evaluators, Parent Coordinators, etc. And, what has been observed in their defense, is when they do offer a different opinion, recommendation, or ruling against The Alienator, they are attacked by The Alienator (and their flying monkey supporters, and their own attorneys) through actions that are meant to degrade, demean, and discredit (often done publicly
I love the content which is very helpful as I have just separated from the narcissist father of my two small kids (2 and 4 years old). How do I protect them from his drama? He is trying to manipulate them to get to me, saying he loves mama and asks them if they wouldn’t want him to stay over at the house or spend more time with them. What do I say then to stop him and also protect my children from these type of discussions which I feel put pressure on them, or are an attempt to guilt trip them into having to proof their love for him by saying to mum that dad should stay over.
I was alienated from my father and my kids were (and still are, as adults) alienated from me. There is no magic bullet. Not from judges, not from therapists. But the best advice he gave up there I think, in my experience, is to repair the person you are who got married to a narcissist in the first place. He had many other good suggestions but I could not have carried them out because my hair was on fire, I was too emotionally reactive to be that empathetic parent my kids needed
Is there any bill or law that exists or can be passed to prevent this from happening? (question from an outsider/ not from the US)
Oh boy....he was on to the "Listen to your mother" idea. He would constantly say "Your Mother is Insane...never listen to anything she has to say. Everybody hates your mother....She has to do what I want, or I will GET RID OF HER, and get you a new mother". The kids grew up with the idea, Mother means a Personal Slave, with no rights. She has no rights to speak, or think for herself, or do anything that is outside of HIS OWNERSHIP over her life. I was miserable living under his abuse rules. Divoring a Covert...makes them become more abusive and use teenagers or young adult kids to be a person that Abuses by Proxy. Daughter is his Golden child....she finds out what I'm doing. Runs to tell her Dad, they make a plan together where she plays a huge part in it to harm my life, over and over and over. Asking her to stop does not work. Explaining how doing damage to my property, stealing my things, trying to harm my life...is being evil. Nope. She gets attention from her Dad by being evil to me.
After listening three times to this session, I know I need to hear it again because I keep having epiphanies. We all had our parts to play as children but we had no props for this episode nor tools to deal with the dynamics going on between our parents. And it carries on to the next generation. Desperate feelings as I now see that the hurtful narcissists were damaged and hurt while they were children as well.
Wow, i am starting to see this after 10 yrs! The problem is very generational, the flags are there but difficult to see when you are in love. One really rolls the dice when they pick a mate. My ex’s family is the poster family for alienation.
Thank you ❤
I went no contact, I went stable while my ex-wife continued on the enmeshment/parentification route. My kids chose stability even though it affected their choice in women.
I just posted a video about a counselor who's claiming parental alienation DOESN'T EXIST! Insanity..
I saw this happen in my immeadiate family..they ally up.
Its never really about love. Its about gaining an ally. The child learns this as a way to get what they want. Children learn early on how to manipulate three people to attain what they want from
The Mom, the Dad or the Grandma. When you really think.about it, how a child's brain works at such a young age, it is just incredible. A successful manipulator will control.things to the point that all.three parties will never come together to learn the truth until the death of the child. Thats when the truth comes out. Its way too late then. Id like to get all of four of us together, but I doubt that will ever happen. The adult child will.make sure that never happens as long as they are alive. No one is ever prepared for something like this. No one really has the right answer. It's Avery tough thing to live with. The best way to work through this is to be totally honest. Very, very tough. My son is 36 now and I'm 64. I've been dealing with this half my life.
The narcissist makes it his central task to incite the children against the father/mother from whom they have separated or to install in them the hatred that they themselves carry within them.
The healthy parent should sit down with the children and talk to them about the differences between themselves and the other parent.
- Les Carter
What do you do when he discards you after 46 years and you find out that he has already alienated them from you many years ago. My grown adult kids won't speak to me for over a year now. They refuse to hear my side and hold him up on a pedestal. 😢
I had no idea that he is a psychopathic narcissist and that he had been poisoning them against me for many years.
Sorry you are going through this. Sadly there is no amount of "making your case" if they won't talk or listen. The Adult kids will have to come around. And that may never happen.😢 You will not be able to force the issue. I speak from over 3 years of not hearing from 2 of 3 of my adult kids. From a 40 year marriage. Get some good couseling is my advise.
Such evil. Write off the ex and any kids that turned against you. Sorry, ouch, and the worst part is they now live to see you suffer. Dont. Go find joy in your life, and friends who enjoy your company.
Maybe the kids will come around, but can you trust them to not use your feelings against you? I dont have the answer, because I come from a messed up family that never solved conflicts but with abuse and violence. But you sure want to hear and see some genuine remorse before you let them too close. You might only be a target for robbery of your valuables. Once they show disrespect to you, it gives them permission to trash their own morals.
Met my alienated father age 21 and he died 3 years later, such a tragedy. Only met in person 2 times then and once age 4
I'm sorry 😞 😢
Heartbreaking 😢 Unfortunately, my son may feel like that one day😢
You fell susceptible because of deception. I was not able to recognize the gaslighting, love bombing, etc etc.. early on. I spent more effort trying to change the tone, explaining 40 diffierent ways, beimg mute, never react, blah blah blah. When I realized the truth, omgosh, my mind was blown and I was so angry I allowed this abuse. Took me a while to even call it abuse. I idolized that man. But he is evil amd a liar and did some really cruel things to me. Together and married 29 years but now divorced.
From someone that is 14 years into alienation with my children, I have a question. Is there anyone on UA-cam giving advice that isn't trying sell something? It's a disgrace that so many people are capitalising on such a horrific form of abuse just to make money for themselves
My ex-wife has narcissism and alienates me from my children. What needs to be done?
My story, thanks!
The mother of my 3 girls will not let talk to them unless she's listening in on the conversation. If they tell me the want to live with me their mother immediately hangs the phone up. This is the most difficult thing I've ever dealt with mentally.
My children's father took the children for a photo, had the photo framed, and had it hung in my house.
Or what about when the narcissist parent trains the unwitting enabling parent, to hate the scapegoated child?
Any cards or gifts given, my children had to destroy them in front of the Abuser. The only thing the Abuser kept was Cash, Money orders or Cheques. Ten years no contact I had to bury them as mentally it was causing me problems.
Dad started maligning Mom after she divorced him, he triangulated me against her, my siblings and her family, to take his side; he's still doing this 50 years later. Now he is complaining about his former and late in-laws. He emotionally alienates me from them; it isn't happening; that annoys him: good! He doesn't say why he is irritated. I wish he would grow up and shut up! He's out of line all along! I am 60 and don't live with him; Dad is a tyrant. he's taking it out on me, for Mom divorcing him. I look just like her, think like her and act like her; he forces me to take his side: that hasn't and won't work. It alienates me from him. I have nothing to do with him. He is immature and insecure. He won't grow up! I resent him pitting me against my grandparents, I was close to them(lived with them). Dad is cruel!
Just hoping my dna🧬 comes out at some point and my kid realizes she needs her dad😢
Dr. C. A. Childress explains parental alienation with much greater clarity than this. His model of how to recognise it and what actually happens make a lot more sense
Covert narcissist are always subtle
This is literal hell
My 2 children are among 30 today, i still hope some way they Can wake up and understand.
Sadly it dosent look good yet, im in no contact , since they are not nice towards me and the littel contact we have had since they were teens , have not been from theyr heart.
I once tryed to get free process to go against the Danish State. And the rejektion for not beeing alowed to do that was that my case was to Big.and the system also once recommanded me to sue the father. But i did not want to go that way, because it has always been the system who have had the highest decision power, so i dont blame the fathers behavior highest, but i blame the system for the way they have run our childrens childcases with blind eyes, ohr what i have a suspision about, is that they could se it and took advantage of it to make a good buisness out of it.
I have now become grandmother 4 times, in a family that was suppose to be my lifes happynes, that has ended to be a grandmother all alone in the World.
This family devorse case agenda is the most sick and human damaging in the New World Order agenda ,they have forced all of humanity into accept.
The worst part is when they take the kid ghost on you and you are broke, then tell the court that it was wilful abandonment. The smirking and gloating in court is stomach churning
For 7 years i had a court order enforced to see my daughter then cook county went lawless left and no crimes are enforced
One-sided relationships. What to do when your spouse/co parent constantly disrespects you and never shows any sort of empathy or sympathy. They put all kinds of effort into being hurtful and hateful. When it comes to being kind, respectful, or understanding they just walk away or disregard what is being said. What to do when you are crying and explaining how much heartache they are causing in hopes of them showing some sort of empathy. And they are just mean and walk away, leaving you crying. They make you feel like it was wrong to say anything or that i shouldn't feel a certain way and to just get over it. They always have an excuse when trying to talk.
I'm dealing with my sons wife being the one that has alienated me from my sons life. They still talk to my ex husband but I'm the one that has been deleted by the wife and encouraged by my ex husband. I got no explanation from my son, I was blocked on phone, email, chat, messaging etc. My ex husband is still in good contact with them.
What about when its the spouse of the grown up child who has turned them against you
suggestions for a victim of parental alienation who is not able to have any contact with their children as the proven child abuser whose stolen the kids by lying and abuse by proxy continues to abuse the kids in literally every way possible. And the alienated parent is forced to pay for the ongoing child abuse. ??¿
Was it court sanctioned parental alienation, where the judge awarded the abuser with sole custody? That's the only way alienation actually occurs when children are forced to live in the sole custody of the abusive parent and are cut off, by court order, from the parent they felt safe and secure with. Otherwise kids figure out who their parents are and an abusive parent reaps what they sow. Which is how it should be without court interference.
@tannislintz1124 yes. I have no contact. No visits. No phone calls. No texts. No letters. I'm just forced to pay him to abuse them in every way known to man including SA. The kids even talked a little about the SA in front of a counselor but the counselor just ignored subpoenas for court initially and later came to court and committed what the kids said about the SA going on in the shower with my youngest. My ex is a sociopath and simply lied a lot.
@tannislintz1124 my ex is also a proven pedo BTW. There are numerous police reports of him doing it to other kids including a report over 200 pages long.
@@Truthistrash why did the court not allow you visitation or any sort of correspondence?
what did u do?
the judge had no opinion on the what the counselor report said?
maybe child support court dont care but wouildnt CPA be interested in the details of report
@@Truthistrash what kind of situation does the other parent have to be in to have sole custody granted to 'proven pedo' and has the childrens admission
"I will not be influenced by a narcissistic person".
- Les
The repeating, little, disparagng comments cause huge damage. My father tolerated the crazymaking as if nothing was wrong... or if painful, still it was not to be discussed. Challenging Mom resulted in too huge a price to pay for the whole family. She would always win; if she was unhappy we all suffered for it. Dad knew not firm boundaries. People in our community admired her and many told me how lucky I was to have her as my mother. Only 1 of 5 siblngs (over six decades later) has had a happy, lasting adult relationship.
Talking to children is easier said then done. My kids were in their early teens when my ex and I separated. My ex-wife had already started to turn the kids against me before we split.
When the kids witness the verbal and emotional abuse that is inflicted on you, you’re already not in good standing with kids, despite all of my efforts to be involved in their lives and be a good father.
That is the most frustrating part in my opinion. One phrase/response that I said often to my ex-wife was “you never give me credit for all that I’ve done with and for the kids”. Typical Narcissist trait, “What have you done for me lately?”
There is a video that’s about a parent that was sent to jail for Parent Alienation.
That would be wonderful, but would most likely to sever your ties to your children forever.