Why Can't Women Be Ordained in the Catholic Church?
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- Опубліковано 24 тра 2020
- Women can be ordained in many Protestant denominations, but not in the Catholic or Orthodox Churches. Why is this, and will it ever change?
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Mother Theresa said to this topic: "Mary was the most holy person on earth and no one would have been more worthy of being a priest than her. But nevertheless Jesus didn't make her a priest because she had another assignment: Being the mother of the church." God has another assignment for women which does not mean, that this is any less important! Holy Edith Stein said:"If you manage to become a bride of Jesus you don't have the wish to become a priest any longer" which refers to the mystical way of becoming a bride of the Lord which is a way for women. God has great plans for women as well which are equally important as the tasks for men.
Mary was not holy.
Kiwi Ananas that’s beautiful!
Mathew Renner she never sinned and was saved from sin. Why do you speak Ill of your spiritual mother?
@@TheRennDawg But the angel Gabriel said she was "full of grace".
Jess I. Most people don’t understand that statement
Interesting thing a Priest once told me. Back in the day, when there were a lot of nuns, most church's not only had a Father (Priest), but also a Mother (the leader of a group of nuns). The Mother was not only in charge of a group of nuns, but she helped the Father with a number of duties and helped run the church. Unfortunately, there aren't many nuns nowadays, so we don't see the influences of a Mother in most churches.
(Interesting how the church was set up as the House of God and has Fathers, Mothers, Brothers, and Sisters.)
I've actually heard of that! I think the exact position is called "Mother Superior". Pretty powerful title.
@@TheSaraManal It is a modern misconception that the lack of Nuns is because of the lack of respect for them as there is also a 'shortage' of Priests in the West as well. (Which I can only imagine reflects our culture). The Church has always held them in high regard and so have we. They are not consecrated Priests, they are special Lay people who have taken an Oath to God and the Church, and they do not need to serve every function of a Priest to be respected.
Because respect and power is not the goal of becoming a Nun, nor a Priest. It is Humility, Chastity, and Servitude for Christ, and his One True Church.
@@f9054 I don't know where you got that. But while I'm sure such a thing has happened, it is definitely not scandal after scandal. And a Priest alone does not have that type of Authority over Nuns. Second of all, you are correct. Nuns do not recieve Salaries. This is because of a Vow of Poverty they PERSONALLY take. If they did not feel comfortable not recieving a Salary, they have more than enough opportunities to back out. Years infact. First they take Temporary vows, and then they decide if they want a permanent vow. That is their decision to make. Priests have that too. 8 years to decide if they want to take a vow of Chasity. So, that has nothing to do with respect. There are some Priestly fraternities with the Vow of Poverty as well.
And finally, most Priests are Misogynists? Really? I think you have the picture of Priests demanding Nuns around like maids, but that is not reality. They answer to their own respective leaders who are Women, not men.
@@f9054 Scandal after scandal? I think not, but the church certainly has them. Plenty of them. The church is made up of people, do you really expect them to be so perfect that there are no scandals or bad decisions? Scandals are everywhere and every profession has them. Teachers, doctors, priests, managers. Just because there are scandals, doesn't mean there isn't any respect, it means there's humans. Believe it or not, priests go to confession too, so yes they sin, yes they make mistakes, and yes, there are scandals.
FATHER is GOD only! mother/father anyway you chose.
I'm from Indonesian and I was converted to Catholic Church in 2009. I Proud to being a Catholic.
Welcome to the family of God!
I joined in 2013 my brother.
Amen, God bless Indonesia 🇮🇩🇻🇦
De Gea's Official: Now that you are Roman Catholic, how do you plan on
serving?
God open His arms to you! In blessings from your brother Catholic in far away California.
Keep your back straight, Roman Catholics. Blessings from an Orthodox brother
Thank you 🥰
As with you my brother
Salve Brother. May Rome and Byzantium rise again.
Females wanting to become Roman Catholic and Orthodox Christian priests are just female supremacists that want us males to be second-class citizens, especially straight males.
@@DavidBustamanteda-bu-sa You nailed it my brother!
Priesthood is not a gift which God will give me. He has given me the gift of being a woman, and I could not ask for more. Without women, we would not have priests in the first place.
What a great gift it is......
Succinct, and perfectly worded.
Men don't have the gift of being a mother ..... Why don't people understand this
So woman's greatness always comes from who they relate with? I dislike today's feminist movement a lot, but this is a sexist mindset.
@@JohnDoe19991 not all women have that gift and a lot of men have the gift of being a father.
Edit: spelling
No woman can be a father just as no man can be a mother.
No statue of Mary can be worshipped but yet roman catholics pray to Mary, statues, saints, dead popes etc
Timothy 2:5
For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
@@Ashey1690 I don't know how to get you to understand but Catholics and Orthodox worship God alone. The Saints, including the Most Holy Theotokos and Ever Virgin Mary are in Heaven praying for the whole world.
@@Ashey1690 you ask your friends on Earth to pray for you, why not ask our friends in Heaven?
@@Garbanzo884
Yes I do, to pray to God for me. The power of prayer it's called. Praying to The Only One who can actually answer. How hard is it just to pray to God through the one and ONLY mediator, Jesus. Praying to anyone/anything else is idolatry
@@Garbanzo884
Popes over the centuries have taken books from the Holy Bible and even manipulated the Ten Commandments. God wants our prayers directed at Him through the One and ONLY mediator Christ Jesus, Mary or anyone else can not mediate on our behalf.
I understand that one of the reasons for excluding women from the priesthood is due to the biblical example set by Jesus in choosing only male apostles. But didn’t he also only choose middle-eastern apostles? It’s easy to argue that this wasn’t by way of excluding, say, blond men or Caucasian men from ordination, and was more due to the circumstances of the time - that the world was less easily travelled so the available men would naturally be from that geographical area. However, the same could be said of the choice of men over women. In that period, women had less freedom, were taken less seriously and were less likely to be available to take on evangelistic or discipleship work. Perhaps the choice of men as apostles was as non-prescriptive as where they came from.
How do we know that when those middle-eastern men were made apostles, Jesus meant to indicate that their gender was definitive, but not their heritage? Or even their colouring (since it’s likely they all had, say, dark hair)?
I’m genuinely curious here. Why was the line drawn at their gender, rather than any of their other characteristics?
Very well said..That's what running through my thoughts too..
Except that both the books of 1st and 2nd Timothy make it clear that women may not serve in the Presbytery or Episcopate. It specifically says that [in the context of the church] women are not permitted to have the authority of teaching over a man.
@@buedro143 Yes its True, it is because of the context of that time.
@@nellielamcis7545 If it was at the context of the time, it would also render the rest of the book meaningless. I understand that books such as Leviticus and other laws of the old testament were meant for specific people at specific times, but the epistles of Paul are instructions to the Church. Those instructions were not simply for the time but as a foundation of how the Church of Christ would be run forever. We can not take the rest of the book as an eternal and inspired principle but pick out the ones we don't like and proclaim they they are not right for our generation.
@@buedro143 Wow..maybe you can help me out also trying to find out the truth about women deacons in the early Christians. It was said that it has biblical accounts but I have no time to see. Thanks
Being equal to men does not mean being exactly like men or to become men. The feminine spirit is special and has infinite value in our lives. Different does not mean better or worse!
Finally someone gets it.
Doesn't equality to men mean equality of opportunities (dignity) though?
@@ranitafeliz2987 As a man I don’t have the equality of opportunity to be a nun. That does nothing to my dignity.
@@ranitafeliz2987 people are treated according to gods law and the circumstances of reality. Before god we are all the same, that is crucial
@@DoctorLazertron There are roles equal in power as a nun, not in the other way though
Pray for me my friends today , so I can spread god words among my family, my name is suhail =su+hail and I live in dubai ( U.A.E) blessings 🌷🌷🌷
Be careful.
I'm muslim myself and I have nothing against converting to another religion but don't forget the laws of the land.
There are some countries that forbid proselytism as the state religion is different (like my own country and also UAE) and the rulers want to keep it the only powerful one. If you're foreigner, you might also risk extradition to your home country.
Keep your faith, learn more about it and avoid talking about it in a public space. That's a sincere recommendation from me. I personally have a bible in my home despite the fact that I'm muslim and I'm not against christianity.
Good luck.
Suhail, read THE BIBLE ! Following or reading it in someone’s presence makes a difference! 🙏
Israel is not Christian.
Do not be afraid and become a martyr if you must, spread the word of Jesus Christ!
We have a so called "catholic women`s rights movement" here in Germany.
They call themself "Maria 2.0" (second version of Mary) and they are on average very old ladies.
Of course they want female priests.
You know, what they don´t want at their 'catholic' gatherings?
Holy Mass with the eucharist. They prefer a 'word service' ("Wortgottesdienst") without the eucharist.
And there is a counter-movent too, called "Maria 1.0" (first version of Mary) and ironically they are wayyyy younger and they want a stable catholic church.
They have Holy Masses at their gatherings.
Guess who is attacking these fine young women and call them "medieval"?
This Maria 2.0 are just protestant boomers
Wow. I pray for the Church in Germany.
I think it is possible to have a discussion on the role of women in the Church, without starting a group, breaking away, and protesting, no?
Wortgottesdienst is just a service held when no priest is available I thought? In principle "pre-consecrated" communion can be received during this, assuming that a priest has consecrated the bread beforehand. I don't mind this so much, since where I am from we only have 3 priests for 11 churches. I do not like when it turns into a form of secular activism like what you are describing in Germany. It is nice that our generation is trying to make the mass more reverent.
Löwen Welle why can’t they just go anglican or lutheran. I doubt they care for theology
Very insightful. I'm not a Catholic but I find much of what you teach, preach and practice to be very sound, even if I don't always agree with it.
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Thanks! But a better contribution, honestly, is watching the whole video. UA-cam will promote my videos more if people watch them for longer.
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Based on my understanding of this video, it seems as if priests must be men largely because of the apostles’ gender. I have a few questions about that. I ask this not to argue against the point of the video, but to further my own understanding. First of all, if priests must be men in order to remain obedient to Christ’s decision for the apostles, why don’t they have to be like the apostles in other ways as well? The apostles were of a different race, age, marital status, social class, and lifestyle than many priests today. Why is it that we copy their gender but not other important things about them? Also, how do we know that Christ specifically chose them because they were men? According to the information in the video, women are equally capable of doing the spiritual job of a priest. So couldn’t it be possible that all the apostles happened to be men because of the way women were treated back in Jesus’s day? Would it have been realistic for a woman to safely travel, preach, and have the same social influence that the male apostles did? Again, I’m not trying to argue. I’m sure there are reasonable Catholic answers to my misunderstandings, and I would really appreciate help finding them. Thanks and God bless!
The thing is that I also thought there were reasonable explanations about this. But i've been asking them for years, and still haven't found them. Not even from bishops.
The most important point why woman can not be ordained to Priest they can not act in " Persona Christo" during consecration of Eucharist.
@David Ohlhaut Thank you so much! Though I am a Catholic, I still have so many things to learn. Your explanation has definitely helped me understand better.
Phoebe in Revelations was a Deacon, ordained by Christ.
"Would it have been realistic for a woman to safely travel, preach, and have the same social influence that the male apostles did?"
Yes. The Bible specifically mentions that women traveled with Jesus. Had Jesus wanted only women to become apostles, he could've done so. You also said it yourself about the apostles having different ethnic and marital backgrounds compared to modern day bishops and priests, but also amongst themselves, and that is because they were chosen as jewish men to behold the fulfilment of the Davidic prophecy. The issue with race was resolved once it was revealed that gentiles could partake in the plan of salvation of the Gospel, so naturally they needn't follow rules about only middle eastern jewish males being allowed to be ordained, though the very clearly implicit rule of all ordained being men persisted.
Keep in mind jews back in the day weren't "ethnically pure" so there is some chance the apostles varied somewhat in hue. From there it's only logical to accept that gentiles of more contrasting skin tones could also be ordained.
Fr. Casey, I am a woman and I believe in tradition. Tradition is the cornerstone of why Catholicism is true and strong. Why would we want to change that? I was hoping you would've also explained and emphasized the importance of women's roles in the church. Our mother Mary, is the queen of the church...if anything, that is by far one of the most important roles ever existed! And her example is enough to represent what a woman's role in this world should be and what an honor it is to be able to even become an inkling of what our mother is. Why don't we just focus and emphasize the importance of the roles of women in our church now? There are so many, and one of them being a mother. Why change that? When it is the most beautiful role ever!
Mary Magdallen was accepted by Jesus Christ as an equal to the other disciples . Why do we discrimate now.
Stoning, polygamy, and slavery were also traditions. Tradition is not synonymous with righteousness, as was evidenced by the Pharisees. Traditions change over time. Life is change. The only condition in which nothing changes is death.
gregory brian heresy.
@@gregorybrian You are committing the sin of Modernism. Please, I hope you realise this before you go to Mass and partake in the Eucharist in the future.
@@kimthetruthofit6965 I anxiously await your scriptural evidence of Mary Magdalene administering the sacraments.
Hi Fr. Casey, I'm Catholic but no theologian. Yet this confuses me. Christ appeared to Mary Magdalene first. She was at his Crucifixion and tended his tomb. The apostles were in hiding. Mary told the Apostles Jesus was resurrected. For me that says women can be priests. Jesus didn't seek out his disciples. He appeared originally to Mary Magdalene. She told them Christ has risen.
Mary Magdalene wasn’t an apostle, she was a disciple
An Apostle is one who is called AND sent - Jesus commisioned 12 men to spread the gospel. Mary Magdalene was called and did follow Jesus, but she was not sent as the Apostles were.
Greetings from an Orthodox to our Catholic brethren ! I love it when I see the catholics stand firm against all these worldly whims and trends in priesthood but would love it more if they had done the same with the heresies and trends of the past and would love it the best if they return to the origins so that we can become one again !!!
Greetings brother, we pray for the day when we are reunited but I think you need to take the beam out of your own eyes first 😉
@@jaqian it is not my own eyes !!! We all know the faith of the first millennium, lets go back to the first millennium!! All isuues can be settled then one by one !!! We check : was there a filioque or wasn’t in the first million etc etc etc
I pray we can reunite one day. I think that compromises can be made maybe, like getting rid of filoque but keeping the catechism
@@Milkman12345 we need unity
We can and should work this out as followers of Jesus, putting His thoughts above our thoughts
I'm disappointed.
You warned that this video will be disappointing, but I was disappointed to not be disappointed.
Hahaha
Oy vey 😂
It's a pretty standard defence. Expedient rationalising to justify holding on to old ways.
@@roryocallaghan8395 Catholism is based on Scripture and Tradition
Tammy Osborne how is tradition made if not taking into consideration the theologizing of the present?
The parish secretary runs everything
LMAO it's true
As a Protestant minister I can say we also have that experience! What a blessing. Great channel this.
I wonder who the parish secretary is at St. Peter's in Rome?
@@sassulusmagnus HIS name is Fr. Gonzalo Aemilius from Uruguay. (personal secretary of his holiness Pope Francis)
That's right. And sometimes to the point of hurting fellow women due to jealousy of the priests they serve. It's a slippery slope and priests need to be careful who they hire....
Iam a woman am very happy being one a d I don’t to compete with men am made by God he knows best
His will not mine 🙏🏽
And I wish you the very best of the world, sister. I always feel sad and in revolt when good women like you get mistreated by irresponsible men who forget their duties towards women.
May the Lord always guide and bless you!
God bless.
Priesthood is not a competition.
Sad weak and subservient doormat to probably a violent husband
Except it's not his will. In book of revelation, it's the only time priest, an equivalent to the word, is mentioned in the new testament and it says almost the first resurrection people will be priests. Do you really only believe men are a part of the first resurrection?
A great discussion about the Deacons. Thankyou for taking the time to explain the churches position
JPII does sound definitive, no matter how liberal theologians want to slice it.
If he had used the very same language but decided that women COULD be priests, liberal theologians would want you excommunicated even for asking a question about it. The culture war in the larger society exists in exactly the same way within the Church.
You are correct Andres and it might be why he wrote it. He knew the " winds of change" for the worse was rising and had bee percolating for several decades prior.
Very true. The language used by St. John Paul II in Ordinatio Sacerdotalis (1994) is unmistakably infallible, but for reasons we can only guess, he used the vehicle of an Apostolic Letter to convey this teaching. Normally, such a definitive statement would come in the form of an Apostolic Constitution. For example, Ineffabilis Deus (1854) and Munificentissimus Deus (1950) are both infallible papal teachings. Respectively, they promote the dogmatic teachings of the Immaculate Conception of Mary and her Assumption into Heaven. Both of them are in the form of Apostolic Constitutions, lending weight to the papal pronouncement in each. Because of this, many have opposed the infallibility of Ordinatio Sacerdotalis.
However, a year later, the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith (the Vatican's chief theological authority), then led by Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, who would later become Pope Benedict XVI, declared that Ordinatio Sacerdotalis, irrespective of the form of the letter, contained teaching that was "ordinary to the universal magisterium", that is, infallible due to its universal adherence by the Church. It further added that this teaching was intrinsic to the Deposit of Faith. In other words, they were saying that John Paul II's teaching was not his own idea, but a reflection of the teaching of the Holy Spirit throughout the life of the Church. In practical terms, that essentially makes it infallible, even if Pope John Paul II didn't explicitly say so.
@@deaconbilcarter5210 thanks for that extra info!
@@deaconbilcarter5210 perhaps it is because infallibility only applies to matters of faith and morals. the ban on women priests falls under the category of church discipline and therefore cannot be declared infallible,
Mother Superiors are respected. I saw one at my daughters school explaining her annoyance about the standard of workmanship to some contractors. I think they had the fear of God put into them.
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Long ago Mary of Magdelene was considered an apostle by early Christian communities.
Exactly... what a terribly self justifying rationale from this well meaning priest for continuing the inequities of the early church, not of Jesus who on his return to the earth chose two women to appear to. How were women's roles written out of the Gospels? Who got to choose what Gospels were considered to be part of our bible? Sorry but Jesus had no hand in any of that...
@@bettyh.3280 did he chose to ordan them, or apper to them. Women play a huge role in the Bible, like Mary, Queen of Heaven and earth, this is no low praise. But God did not intend for women to be preists. Sacred Tradition proves this. We cannot destroy Sacred Tradition in the name of equality, for as st. Thomas Moore said when the devil comes knocking, what can we hide behind. Women and Men are equal in dignity, but not in responsibility. The role women play in the Church is huge, for with out a yes from One woman, there would be no Church. God chose a woman to be the Mother of God, so that we could become his children again. Now every mother is called to be the mother of a child of God. St. Augustins mother prayed for his conversion for over 30 years, now he is one of the best know theologians, this is the power of a mother. There are countless times in history when a man married a catholic woman, and she converts him. With out women. There would be no Church.
@Conner L
Jesus didn't appoint anyone!!!! Men appointed themselves.
@@nicholaspresberg3269
I call BS, the patriarchal, sexist male dominated church established in 335 AD took away the priesthood of women that had been practiced for 300 years. In various sects of Christianity. The lies of Catholicism are too great to go over here. There was a COUP I'm 325 n the men won. MARY, Jesus's 1st n greatest disciple.
@@misty4937 oh please cut the crap. Priesthood was never taken from woman what are you talking about ? Sexist male dominated. Seems you are a sola scruptura "christian" am I right ?
Several problems indicated here. I would love it if these could somehow be answered in a future video.
1. While Jesus chose his apostles from men, he never made any explicit statement that his choice was in any way based on gender, or exclusionary towards women.
2. In fact, the idea that we, as God's imperfect creations, are somehow placing that inequity and inferiority onto God's female children based entirely on guesswork seems to me to be tantamount to "putting words into God's mouth", so to speak, which I find thoroughly repugnant in every way.
2. Jesus was not ordaining his apostles as "priests" and it seems to me like priesthood itself is a concept entirely fabricated by the Catholic church itself, separate entirely from scripture. As do the titles of bishop, deacon, and so on. How does the church justify its creation of hierarchical roles within the church with no Biblical direction, and then have the audacity to exclude half of God's children from it?
First
Jesus only called upon men to be apostles, as the father only called men to be prophets. He could have called women, but he didn't. He chose not to, because he had a different mission for women. Mary was the holyest person in this world, she never sinned, and jesus praised his mother, but didn't made her an apostle, neither did to Mary Magdalene. It wasn't his plan. And also, when a woman has the divine call, she becomes a nun, which is no less than a priest, but with a different mission
2
This is a no question, cannot answer something that doesn't make sense
3
Priests are the continuation of the apostles, period.
About the hierarchy, it's simple. It exists to keep unity and to administrate the fisical aspect of the Church, as priests must be paid, fed, new churches must be built, old ones be mantained, etc. A bishop or a cardinal aren't more important than a priest, it's just that they were chose, due to their capabilities, to administrate a diocese
Hello Father Casey!
I don't believe Women were called to be Priests, Bishops, or even Deacons.
In my Women of Grace class at Church, I've learned that Women are called by God to be Mothers (in all shapes and forms) so that we can aid society and humankind from falling. Only Women have the ability to bring forth life from our Bodies...something Men will never be able to do. And let us not forget that there is a someone who holds far more Grace, Mercy, and Divine Love than any Apostle, and serves as an Intercessor for us to Christ. She is our Blessed Virgin Mother. A Woman.
I respect your perspective but wonder what you think of women specifically named as deacons in the early Church? Romans 16:1 Phoebe was the only person specifically named as a Deacon in the original Greek New Testament. I'd recommend Phyllis Zengano books. She's serving on the group reviewing female deacons in the Church's history appointed by Pope Francis.
Exactly! They also say "If God want to make some heroic thing He chose Man, if He want to make impossible then He chose Woman" :)
It is possible that they can be called to the priesthood.
@@archangelmichael5908 Fr. Casey just presented why women cannot. be priest.
@@emilierose9402 deacons of back then played a completely different role than that of modern day
Women do have a role and a MISSION in the Catholic Church. Just think of all the wonderful mysteries the world have come to know, almost exclusively through various saintly women. St. Faustina, St. Teresa of Avila, St. Clare of Assisi, St. Teresa de Lisieux, St. Bernadette, Sister Lucía of Fatima, Mary Magdalene and so on and so forth.
Walter, have you ever read The Story of a Soul by St. Therese of Lisieux? She says she felt a call to priesthood from a young age. Because girls were not allowed to be priests, she decided her vocation would be to pray for priests. But she seriously felt God calling her to be a priest and the Church standing in her way.
@@adinameyer6716
She may have "FELT it", that doesn't mean that was God calling her to Priesthood. She was a little girl when she felt that calling to a RELIGIOUS life that she may have confused with the priesthood.
@@walterhigo7658 She was literally one of the greatest saints who ever lived. She is revered as a Doctor of the Church. And you're saying she may not have known what God was saying to her? That she was "confused?" Or that you know better than she did?
@@adinameyer6716
GOD would not call you to do something that goes against Church Doctrine. Only men can be "IN PERSONA CRISTI" because Jesus Christ was a MAN. GOD in his infinite wisdom decided from all eternity that the second person of the Holy Trinity would come to this earth as a MAN, and that for all eternity He would be a MAN. Women are equally important in the Church, but they play other SACRED & IMPORTANT ROLES. Think of the VIRGIN MARY, the pinnacle of GOD's creation (including the Angels). As spiritually elevated as St Therese was, she was still a human being affected by original sin, so it is completely possible that she may have made a mistake. Even Abraham "mis interpreted" God's will for him at one point.
@@walterhigo7658 actually that was the old argument from Inter Insegnores that was overturned by the church. The most recent argument is from Ordinatio Sacerdotalis- where JP II wrote that the reason women can’t be priests is not because they can’t stand in persona christi but because Jesus only appointed men as His apostles. Therefore the Church can’t go against that.
In the secular world, I'm 100% on board for woman to take on any role. But one thing I'm attracted to the Catholic church is the hierarchy and different roles men and women play.
Perhaps having grown up with a father... I like seeing a "father" as head of his household/church.
Brilliant! Inspiriing! Very educational! It all make sense to me now.. Thank you.
I really don't know too much about other types of ordination, but I see this fight to want to do everything men can do as actually anti-women because it presupposes that a woman's purpose/role is only valid when is taking up the role of a traditionally male role. It's placing the male roles over female roles which I would believe to be sexist??
Agree but at the same time there shouldn't be a limit, It should be based on who's better at the task.
@@TuberoseKisser I think the point is, the Church's reasoning is not that men are better at the task.
I'm not talking about the priesthood and I get where you are coming from-- but lot of roles that are considered male or female can and have changed. Women didn't insist on the right to vote, or go to university, or become doctors, so they could be like men. Not allowing women to do those things really limited them and perpetuated the inequality of women in society. Not being able to work made it hard for single women to support themselves. Not having the right to vote meant women's voices were not considered in law making and government decisions.
I agree in part. I do not think it is anti-woman, but it does presupose that male roles are better than female roles, which is of course nonesense. For example society often times view doctors (a male dominated profession) as more important than nurses (a female dominated profession). I have seen people get upset about artists who draw a female nurse + a male doctor because it instills negative gender stereotypes. The implication of this sentiment is that doctors are better than nurses. I don't think it is true that one is better than the other since the whole system fails if one of the two stopped coming into work.
Society, including many feminists seem to value male dominated professions more than female dominated professions. It is an easy trap to fall into. After all male dominated professions do offer higher pay and often yield a higher degree of power (trad masculine values btw, which become damaging if they become the goal).
@@flyingdutchman3860 We also have to wonder... do women just pick lower paying jobs, or are they lower paying because they are female dominated? Part of the reason why we have so many female teachers was because schools decided it would be cheaper to hire women-- back then you could pay them less-- and it became one of the few acceptable jobs for women.
Computing in its early days used to be a much more female profession- once men started entering it more, wages went up.
By the same token, neither can men become nuns.
Nuns and priests are not equivalent. Nuns and monks and friars are.
Why would a man want to become a nun ??? He is supposed to marry one...
@@TheLT704 No. Nuns don't marry.
@@emmaduerstock3794 it's an old joke... nun last week..nun this week.. perhaps next week...???
See my new comment...
Thank you for this, that was what I was looking for and it actually calmed me down about the issue. Keep it up!
Isn't it just obvious that women wouldn't have been apostles/disciples at that time (being a very patriarchal society)? So of course they wouldn't have been included. But why be bound to the wrongs of the past?
What about Mary Magdalene and Martha?
Christ was not limited to the preferences of His time, brother. He chose men because this is the will of God, not because society was patriarchal.
@@patricksoares6253 Not sure how you could possibly know that, but accept that it is your opinion. (I only accept the bible as a historical source but not an accurate or infallible one, so I'm ruling that out).
@@anthonyhollands8004 It's quite obvious in fact.
Christ was a perfect man, and entirely God. His will is infallible.
If He was God, it is impossible that men and societies could in any approach constrain His will. Christ nor his apostles (that carried the church after the ressurection) did not act by convenience, they acted by faith and conviction (remember martyrdom).
@@patricksoares6253 I suppose this story has to begin from Adam. Because God created a woman from Adam. Maybe it's due to the order of creation or that it was considered to be a bad world for women during Jesus' time. I disagree that women should be given the priesthood because it has been the doctrine since many years to have males as priests. Women have a greater role to build society either by working jobs, being mothers, activists etc. Somethings are inexplicable. In our churches mostly women conduct liturgy and they take part in church a lot like the leaders of associations, organising events ,etc.
Thank you for the facts. As a woman, mother, cantor and OFS, I beg for MEN to step up and fill these roles. We can’t expect men to lead well if not given the opportunity. I am grateful to priests who have inspired their churches to be led by MEN so my son has role models to inspire him.
We also need priests and religious people to dress the part. They cannot inspire if they are not seen.
xDD
@SlimeKetchup14 quit wallowing in self pity
What about your daughters?
@@afiaakos6937 I don’t have daughters - but my friends do and they thrive even more when the boys are getting to grow as real men without having all the girls take their roles. The girls are amazing and resourceful and leaders in their own right - they build up the boys and support their brothers. We have many - not several but many girls who are discerning roles as sisters and cloistered. Obviously what our parish is doing is working - I know of 3 boys and 2 girls that submitted requests to join seminary or a convent. Good fruit comes from this❤️.
when the Roman pontiff speaks EX CATHEDRA,
that is, when,
in the exercise of his office as shepherd and teacher of all Christians,
in virtue of his supreme apostolic authority,
he defines a doctrine concerning faith or morals to be held by the whole church.
Look again at JPII definitive statement. It fits in the Ex Cathedra category. Joseph Ratzinger (who became Pope Benedict XVI) was the Prefect of the CDF and issued a clarification saying that JPII exercised the charism of infallibility.
Ordinatio sacerdotalis is an Apostolic Letter which is of lesser authority than an Apostolic Constitution like Munificentissimus Deus - so a good case can be made that JP2 wasn't interested in declaring an infallible doctrine, and in his role as head of the CDF, Cardinal Ratzinger wasn't infallible either.
Who died and left the Bishop in Rome in charge? Certainly not Jesus. The "pope" is nothing more than an instrument of Satan.
@@stockscalper Sounds like a good solid Catholic - NOT!!!!!!!!
@@mcmemmo Well, Church explains itself. You have no authority.
I’m sorry Father, you can spin it any way you like, it’s still anti-woman. Doesn’t St. Paul say that there is no longer woman or man for we are all one in Christ?
@Al Strider Thank you. I’ll pray for you, please pray for me.
Ooooh, that's a tough one. Amazingly, Suprisingly well handled. Your humility on the issue was the key.
Man I'd like to sit down and have a nice conversation with you about many things.
I'm only 17, and I have many questions that I don't to just ask anyone. My parents try to explain along with showing me another priest but many things still don't make sense, and I know there are many things that take faith because its not always going to make sense, but I still want a solid explanation. A lot of the times I feel like I don't get one about any of my questions, like its not the full explanation that's there's more to everything.
@@ruairi_d it would.
@@cheeseymanish I don't even know where to begin. I have my own Bible my parents gifted it to me and I enjoy studying it. I love reading it I really want to understand why I'm catholic, why there are certain traditions, I can't speak to my local priest at the moment New York city doesn't seem like it wants to open its churchs at all.
Jason Valerio I am glad you have questions at such a young age. Apologetics is the route you should take. Patrick Madrid has some great books as well as Scott Hahn. Although, if you ever have any questions? You could post them here, I know anyone on here would be glad to help you with them😃
@@Jay_v.7 Perhaps you may like to find out from Catholic Answers?
I was surprised that you didn't mention "in persona Christi"
@Felipe Parra While we use male pronouns for God, God is not male. He doesn't not have a sex since he does not have a body other than in the person of Jesus Christ. Some passages in the Bible refer to God in a feminine sense like as a mother or as wisdom personified 'sophia' (which is female).
@Ian Jesus is male, because Jesus is both human and God. Do not fall into heresy of monophysitism. Strictly speaking, God the Son is not male since God does not have a sex or gender. Remember, "God the Son" is used because it is relational to the Father; that is, Jesus compares his relationship to the Father like a human father and son.
@ian
From the Catholic and Orthodox perspective, Christ fundamentally maintains two distinct natures. He is both entirely man and entirely God. What this means is that Christ was subject to the entirety of the human condition, meaning he had to work, hunger, face temptation, and yes, have a physical and gendered body. Christ’s nature is quite complicated when you delve into the deep theological components of the classical understanding of who he was, but it can be said that Christ reserved special roles for both men and women and the priesthood and all orders of ordination are reserved for men.
@@davinciandiversity8823 By what you say, women cannot even be saved through God's divine grace, because they are female. Salvation, then, is only for men in Catholicism? All women are designated for hell? Or perhaps we are nothing but beasts who have no sentience and go down to the dust when we die? We know the medieval Catholic theologists held that women have only 1/3 of a soul. Is this your view? This seems more inherited from the Greek pagans, who named women as nothing more than "walking wombs".
@Ian That still does not change the fact that Jesus is Christ. Jesus was not just a 'guy who lived on one planet' but he is also God. Christ either refers to Jesus, as a person or the title of 'Christ' which just means messiah or anointed one, which is used almost exclusively as Jesus's title. I can not understand how you can reasonably separate the two.
Men and women compliment each others not competing
Perfect
Not always. Even the difference in what priests can do and how sisters/nuns were set up, wasn't fair. They have more freedom, money and power. Nuns have to ask permission for things, many orders had poor health care and elderly services and they worked their tails off for the priests and schools and public while they priests had much more given to him and freedom to travel and make some rules for his parish. I never saw it complimentary, I saw a hierarchy that wasn't always fair.
If women’s ordination is closed even into the future, doesn’t this mean that the Church isn’t open to the promptings of the Holy Spirit who might surprise us?
If Christ wanted women priests he would’ve made it so. No pope has the authority to allow it, as it is a sacrament. JP II’s Ordinatio sacerdotalis explains it pretty well. The genius of men and women are different and they are complimentary. Women and men have different callings and roles, I would question more the motives of one who wants to be placed in such role simply because they are roles of men. Do you believe that women can have genuine calls to the priesthood?
Well said!
The Pope could change it.
@@cecectconnecticut344 The Pope is not God.
Well said.
Bergoglio is a False Prophet.
Considering the many female priests across Anglicanism and Protestantism, along with the evidence to suggest there was a female pope in the 13th century... The short answer is yes.
Thanks for the video! I am an Episcopalian (in seminary for ordination), so I would obviously have a different view of this but I did not grow up Catholic so it is nice to have a better understanding of the Catholic perspective and learn about the important roles women can and should have in the Catholic Church. Love your channel!
Well you know, 100 years ago episcopals would say the same.
@@prkp7248 Protestants don't flip-flop on theology challenge (impossible)
I grew up Catholic and left age 19, no regrets. I'll give him credit for explaining in depth, but I've long believed in opening clergy to women. Now Episcopalian and recently attended a memorable consecration of a female Bishop.
Father, I ask for prayer for the conversion of my family.
Congratulations on the video. You are very wise.
God bless.
(sorry for the english, I am using google translate)
I'm sorry, but 2000-something years ago, Jesus also did not have a UA-cam channel. Why accepting changing times only it suits the Church?
Your statement does not make sense.
@@patricksoares6253 i think it does. It asks the question of why some things can and others can not be changed. The "we always did it that way" does not apply because as he pointed out other things did change. Calling it out to be just something that is convenient to the church that changes, makes clear that it needs an answer that is based not on what the church likes and don't likes and that the reasoning for something not to change it needs a batter answer than tradition.
I would think that it does change tho, Today the Pope did give women more rights in the conducting of mass.
@@SirThyrm The pope did not change nothing in this aspect.
This fact concerning the Catholic Church has to be very clear: She is not driven by the ideas of the current time and by people's opinion. She is the body of Christ and mantains her 2000 years teaching despite of what the world wants.
Tradition is one pillar of the Church, so "we always did it that way" is indeed important. What may be changed is what CAN be changed. The central aspects of the faith are not into question, and this is one.
"Jesus Christ did not call any women to become part of the Twelve. If he acted in this way, it was not in order to conform to the customs of his time, for his attitude towards women was quite different from that of his milieu, and he deliberately and courageously broke with it."
- Declaration on the question of admission of women to the ministerial priesthood
@@patricksoares6253 Jesus also didn’t call any, say, Americans to the Twelve. And yet we have American priests.
@@gillianc8106 But it is explicitly stated in the Scriptures to evangelize the gentiles and spread the gospel to them. In the writings of Saint Paul that is notorious.
And at the same time, there's no evidence (not in the Scriptures nor in the early, medieval and modern Church) that women could be priests.
The Church is Catholic, universal to the human genre, and it would be irracional to deny other races the sacrament of order. And it would be irracional to lift the Church, Scripture and Tradition teachings because of man made tendencies.
There is SO much more being left out of this about this. The theology of ordination is far more than the 3 reasons presented as though standing alone. not all men can be priests! the body of christ transforms into a perverted deformed figure when an arm tries to be a leg. this should have nothing to do with the 'anything you can do i can do better'. its the wrong starting off point.
But why is sex singled out as a defining characteristic? Men can be members of the Bride of Christ (the Church). Why cannot a female be Alter Christus.
Most of the time his post are very controversial and causes divisions, even to the point of people sinning by saying bad stuff against each other or the Church etc... he knows it and I think he likes it, he should spend more time doing videos of him presiding at Mass, or leading the rosary or even teaching the catechism of the Catholic Church, witch would unite the faithful not divide them, we all know who divides. 😈
Thomasrice07 christ wasn’t female. So females cannot by definition be another Christ. I would recommend reading JPII’s encyclical and on ordination and the sacrament itself. It’s quite eye opening.
You are talking of some thing that was brought about by the Church not Christ. How where the disciples ordinated ?
@@kimthetruthofit6965 The apostles were all men, chosen by Jesus and ordained at the Last Supper- Holy Thursday-just before His death.
My understanding is that the priest acts in persona Christi when celebrating the sacraments. Since Christ IS a man a woman cannot act in persona Christi.
Mary serves as the penultimate role of women in the Church and should always be followed as that example. She is the Queen of Heaven.
God is Father, Son and Holy Spirit. Two of the persons in the Trinity are explicitly male.
This issue is not about equality. It's about power. I remember this same temptation played out in Genesis.
Actually, all three are presented as explicitly masculine. The Holy Spirit is also exclusively referred to as “He”
@@danielz4192 He is symbolic not literal
This is also why concelebration is considered by some to be a liturgical abuse because Christ was one man not many.
You are exactly right about in persona Christi…I’m pretty disappointed that Father forgot to mention this in his video.
I'm a Lutheran priest from Finland and yes, a woman. And yes, it still raises some form of dispute still in my country and church. I only ask, why the Holy Spirit gives women the vocatio interna if it should be for nothing? Of course, every woman feeling the call could be wrong and selfish or something and understand the message from God in a wrong way, but I think that as a brother in ministry you know that it is a very cruel thing to say to anyone.
I found your channel just recently and I enjoy it very much. May God bless you and your work!
That doesn't make it untrue. Though I think a more compassionate way of revealing this to the young girl courting this feeling is highly required.
I don’t know why I didn’t think of this the first time in watched, but where’d you get this picture? In other words, what church is this from that has the “bread” and women priests
This is a very shallow explanation of why women cannot be priests, even if the reasons Fr. Casey gave are correct. I recommend everyone to search up Ven. Archbishop Fulton Sheen’s explanation.
His young and liberal and surrounded by student he probably does not want to trigger. We all know what triggered liberal students can do.
Please send the link of Fr. Sheen
Potato ....But he loves God and teaches us to love God.
@Potato and a liberal priest is.....? be careful. His holiness Pope Francis is considered to be liberal. :)
inb4 it turns out Fr Casey is a secret Rad Trad. I am kidding.
I say, whenever one involves a top-down approach towards religion the fallacies are spiraling out of control. If on the other hand, one applies a bottom-up approach, every piece falls safely and logically into place.
Hello. I'm an Ordained Minister of the Universal Life Church. Question, can one wear their old High School Graduation Gown in place of a Clergy Cassock or Clergy Robe? just temporarily though. you know low budget stuff lol. Also, a Temporary Homemade White and Black Tab. Yes, I'm working on getting the proper Clergy Tab, possibly the Cassock as well. Yet atm I'm unable to.
you're not a priest so wear whatever you want
My grandma, who part of the Oakland Parish actually was very involved with her Parish, she was an Usher and several other positions. My father said that it was said around her parish that "that she would have became a deacon if it was allowed"
Women can play an important part in parish life, but they cannot be priests or deacons.
@@alhilford2345 The Church doesn’t currently allow women deacons, but the justification isn’t as strong. There were women deacons (deaconesses) in the early Church (but never women priests). By the Middle Ages, deacon was just a stepping stone to becoming a priest, but again, that was not the case in the early Church. Like Father Casey says, there’s reasons to believe the Church may decide to allow deaconesses while continuing to disallow women priests.
@@ModernEphemera They were not sacramentally. They were used to help women get baptized.
@@ModernEphemera the permanent diaconate was still around in the Middle Ages and even past the counsel of Trent. But I think it died out by Vatican 1. That’s why Vatican 2 again called for a renewal of the permanent diaconate.
No matter the many explanations, many girls grow up believing they are second-rate humans, and they are not made in the image of God because the church and heaven are so male-centric. Also, many boys grow up believing girls are lesser because of the paradigm. Even as an adult, the devil whispers "See? He loves your brothers more because they are made in His image. The men will make decisions and you will make cookies." I wish to believe that the God I love, whom I believe loves me, would not want me to have this deep seated pain in my soul and yet no apologetics lessen it.
Also Jesus said that in the Kingdom of God we will there will no longer be male and female, like the angels (when they asked him about marriage and resurrection).
I was waiting for you to reference Saint JP II “Theology of the Body” where he explains it so beautifully, and sensibility. Now days the younger generations won’t give in to “because that’s how it’s always been done” sort of answer. They need a deeply rooted explanation... “Theology of the Body” has it.
Thanks Wayne. I'm researching Catholicism and I keep running into the tradition fallacy, which does nothing for me. I'll check out Theology of the Body
@@MegaGraceiscool How is a fallacy? If your town eats goldfish for centuries that's not a fallacy, that's a tradition.
One of the points of the Church is also tradition
@@nothanks6549 I do know about the fallacy, but this one is not as the Catholic Faith is also based on Tradition, so it must keep being that way because one of the pillars of the Catholic Faith is Tradition
This Tradition is only regarding to Faith and not other types of values which may change or not, and go on or not according to Catholic belief
In this topic must be understand that something may be that something because it keeps being in one way or having those characteristics. We cannot say Sumerians must have different characteristics today (hypothetical case they were alive) and differ totally as how they were before because they wouldn't be Sumerians
Some things may be allowed to change and others not depending on what that group is. If it were not, they wouldn't be themselves.
This is antrophology. If Catholic Faith can't be based also in Tradition, then it is not Catholic Faith
Proud to be your brother and thankful for your wisdom Father. May Christ be with your spirit and the Holy Spirit guide you so that you may guide us to him and for him Amen. Keep up the amazing work for the kingdom!!!
You have no right to call a priest a father. He is ordained as a priest and so to be called
I like my cousin’s approach to this. She feels that if men want to run the church….great! Let them. She refuses to help in any way when asked to :teach RCIA, lector, cook for a festival, clean pews, or anything else. When someone calls to ask, she tells them to talk to her husband to see if he has time to do it. She also gives no money from her own account. Her husband can give from the household account.
Seems bitter
I think that women already have so much to do. And I do think that women should take up greater leadership roles for sure. What is the priesthood necessary for women?
Women already do so much for society, and I think that father Casey was right by saying that the church is not an equal opportunity employer.
@@leekshikapinnamneni4835 whereas men sit around and have nothing to do.😅
@@dylanstuckey3824 just logical.
@Mthf not ridiculous at all. I don’t know what birth era would have to do with it.
Ridiculous excuse. Do you think God cares? Human beings care but God doesn't care. I am from the Anglican Church of Canada. We hired our first female priest two years ago. She is doing just fine. A few months later, a woman was selected to be Bishop of our Diocese. Nothing changed other than the leader had a different style. Why do you think God cares about such petty things?
You say "she is doing fine". But as the sacraments are "visible signs of an invisible reality", how can you know that? Can you see the ontological change from bread and wine to the Body and Blood of Christ? Of course not. I don't dispute that Christians of all varieties truly love Christ, but we are not free to make up the rules on our own. Scripture gives us all we need to establish the liturgical norms of the Church. Only a baptized man can accept ordination.
I am not priest, but as a deacon who serves in Mass almost every day and who preaches a few times a week, I certainly know all the words the priest says, I know how to use the Missal, I know all the gestures, and I know where he hangs his vestments. I could certainly put on a priest's vestments, process to the altar and simulate a Mass that would convince anybody I was the real deal. But I'm not. It would be a charade and nothing would be sacramentally consecrated if I said the Eucharistic prayer over it. People might leave Mass thinking I was just wonderful, but all I would have managed to do was lie to them and incur sin upon my own soul. They might think they received the Body and Blood of Christ, but it would just be a cracker and some wine.
My point is this. Just because it looks good doesn't make it authentic.
And we got a few converts from Anglicans
Thank you for this channel brother. It is a blessing to many of us at this time. On this matter I respectfully disagree. But then I am ordained in a branch of the Church that has ordained women to the eldership since the late 1960's and to the ministry of word and sacrament since the early 70's. I have experienced great blessing from these sisters in Christ. I trust that the Holy Spirit was involved. An Anglican sister taught me how to preside at an Anglican altar. I respect those who remain loyal to the Churches teaching on this. And I respect those who remain within the Church who are eager for change. Blessings to you all from Simon's Town, South Africa.
Thank you for the video, and I appreciate your views concerning the rights of women.
"All things have their back to the female
and stand facing the male.
When male and female combine,
all things achieve harmony"
~ Lao Tzu
Some may also add that whenever male and female work together, power is doubled :)
This is one of my major sticking points when it comes to the church. I was baptized in 1969 into the Catholic Church and I feel that I belong to the church but I don't go to church and I don't do confession and I feel in many ways left out. I also watched a great movie about the changes that Vatican too brought about regarding nuns. Cutting out the nuns role is a death blow to the church. Women also want to serve and I think having nuns at every Church and having a mother and a father is the way forward for the church.
If you aren't going to confession and mass you are leaving yourself out. Being Christian is about being part of a community. Nuns are still active in the church we have nuns in our parish and they are very involved.
@@jaqian 1000%
Nobody has cut nuns out. There's tons of them. Sounds like you are leaving yourself out by intentionally not going to Mass or Confession. Women serve numerous functions in the Church.
You should go to Mass and confession, you'll help shape the Church how you see fit. If you're unmarried become a nun. If you're married encourage your daughters to become nuns.
Lukewarm catholics😢
Well Fr. Casey, Canon 1024 clearly states "A baptized male alone receives sacred ordination validly." I guess this is one thing left out from the video. Therefore, under the current canon law deaconate ordination of women is not allowed.
Correct, but canon law can be changed.
@@skimilym This is why I said, "under current canon law." The Canon law can be changed only by the Pope if he sees that the law is a human law and not divine law. If it is of divine law then even the Pope cannot change it and this is why St. John Paul II said that with regard to priestly ordination. When St. Paul Vi did the change, he abolished the minor orders from being a part of the clergy. So if the Pope does that even the diaconate will no longer be a part of clergy and therefore would not need ordination. Now if you want to read more on the canon law perspective of this do check out this link as it is brilliant and helped me to understand this topic more clearly: canonlawmadeeasy.com/2014/02/06/could-women-ever-be-ordained-deaconesses/
Pope Francis recently noted that there is not evidence in the early Church of the women deaconesses ever receiving the sacrament of holy orders. Hence, deaconesses were not ordained.
Why complicate? The answer is simple. The person of a priest serves IN PERSONA CHRISTI. And Christ, the Second Divine person incarnated, is a MAN. End of story. This does not by any means discriminate women. The most powerful human- only person ever is a Woman, the Queen of heaven and earth to whom all priest serve. Peace be with you.
I accept the Church's teaching but I do struggle to explain it. How would you respond to the fact that not only was he a man, but he was also a Jew, yet we don't restrict the priesthood to Jews only?
@@dansedevie123 The book of Hebrews attributes His priestly lineage to Melchizedek from Genesis, quoting Psalms: "you are a priest forever in the order of Melchizedek". Jesus isn't a Levite, he is of the tribe of Judah. So He wasn't a priest in the Aaronic Priesthood initiated by Moses, but of a higher priestly order which predates the Law.
Amen 👍🏻
@@drewloewen6079 Thanks for explaining. I understand that, but I don't see the connection between Jesus being a priest in the order of Melchizedek, and a male only priesthood?
What superpowers did Mary have, exactly?
I'm not aware of her having more intrinsic power than the next chump across the street.
Her only real power is having Jesus do what he did not want to do (wedding of Caanan), which in theory Joseph would have had as well (he raised Jesus and taught him). So I get what you want to say but it is inaccurate and only lends credence to the smear against us of worshipping Mary...
Im part of the church of jesus christ of latter day saints. I found your channel and thought it was interesting to learn about catholics.
Great video, Father. Having lived in a rural area and having seen a gradual reduction in the number of priests available, it wouldn't surprise me if one day we do see female priests for that reason among others.
A different question now: can you please tell me why Exorcist is listed as the second from the bottom of the list? Is there some far more tame thing an Exorcist can do at mass that's nowhere near as well known as dealing with demonic possessions?
We will never see women priests
No, Even in the case of rural areas is not a women's ordination acceptable option.
Brother Casey! In July is my diserniment experience in Mexico. Thanks for all your videos and books!
Good luck, God bless!!!
May God bless and enlighten you in His will. You'll be in my prayers.
I will for you now that God will enlighten you. Amen.
@@fadaoluoma96Hello people, please know that this is a fake account and this imposter is not the Fr. Oluoma whose picture you see on this account. Fr. Oluoma is a popular Catholic priest and has his personal Facebook and UA-cam accounts. You can contact him if you need to confirm. I am surprised that UA-cam will allow such fraud. The wording of this fraudulent request reveals the fact that no Catholic Priest will ask for money or any support in this way. Please do not fall for this fraud and scam. Thanks.
So first the Church says we have a church in the first place to remain flexible and to be able to make decisions based partly on circumstances. Then the Church tells us, well, we have all these years of tradition, so we can’t change now. Then Pope Francis says he wants to look into having female deacons. How long has he been “studying” this issue? As a life long Catholic, I’ve concluded it’s an old boys club and it’s not going to change. If the sex abuse scandal that has wracked it from one end to the other didn’t tell church leaders that the old boys club wasn’t working, will anything?
Another thing, I’ve heard all my life, and I see it in these comments here, too. It goes like this: why should a woman want to be anything but a mother, the highest calling there is? So let me ask you, why should a man want to be anything but a father, also a very high calling?
J D Grow up.
Thank you for clearing this up, Fr. Casey. I'd been wondering about this (in part so I could answer the questions of my many non-Catholic friends if they asked about it) but I couldn't get a straight answer until this video. Seems New Advent was not to be trusted in this case. Nor were the few priests claiming that all other roles in the Church are lesser than the priesthood. This was helpful!
Are you serious you couldn't answer ? Amazes me how little you Catholics know.
I think it also boils down in the end to acceptance
This is why my grandmother walked away from the Church, and taught her children and grandchildren never to go back. I remember her telling us: “The Roman Catholic Church is Roman first, and look how the Romans treated their women.” She was convinced that the Catholic Church barred women from priesthood because its men want sole right of access to God, because women will always be considered lesser and in need to an intermediary because they are not worthy to approach God directly.
Three generations of atheists because one nineteen year old girl looked up one day and felt angry that there was a door forever closed to her, that she would forever have to obey without ever having any chance of shaping the rules she was expected to live by.
I am a Hispanic Traditional Catholic woman who does not approved the Priesthood of women. The only thing in our historic church that I think women stay away from is Priesthood. Anything else is okay with me. We must continue preserving and respecting our 2,020 years of tradition. God is always good. I pray to God to allow me to die before witnessing our traditional Catholic Church being ignore by wickedness. God loves. God bless you. 🙏🙏💪💪👼😇🤓😎❤️❤️💙💙
@J Sheeba LGBT have rights. Being married in a church isn't a right.
God bless you Marjorie
says the woman that 99% sure only attends novus ordo masses. tradition only dies when it meets effortlessness and making things easier it seems! so mysterious!
I am woman but I don't think we should be priests ... if we were supposed to be priests jesus would have done it while he was on the earth and showed as by picking one woman among the 12 th... so Jesus want us to be a supporter to those who face any difficulty in the church ... to be priest and on the leadership position is not easy as it seems .... Look how some ppl treat our priests ... it hurt. So we women...are easy to be hurted we are emotional in nature so I personaly think jesus had his own reason to keep us be save and help our brothers ,priests in prayer.... as mary did while she was with the apostels ... they see true love and get strength in their ministry ... 🙏🏾❤so my sisters stop feeling and comparing your self as inferior no .. we are blessed to be choosed to be a supporter to human kind with true Love.
Thank you, as always, for the clear and cogent manner in which you define and describe so many things about the faith and the religion of Catholicism. I'm often struck by the number of individuals who thumb down these videos. Clearly, they don't understand or wish not to grow in understanding.
The explanation is basically jesus said so, its an explanation but not a great one and as for a non believer its a terrible one
@@informationyes Sadly Daniel, I believe that you think that matters of faith need to subscribe to a greater logic and in short they can't simply be taken at face value. You will thus have an issue with any of the world religions from Judaism's Mysticism to practices of Muslims.
@@josephpilkus1127 Basicly yes because im not a beleiver and so to convince me atleast im gonna need some logic otherwise christianity is just as much as shot in the dark as any other religion
Thank you for this very clear and well thought out explanation. It doesnt concern me but I was looking for a good Catholic answer....and this is an excellent answer
I'm a Catholic from the Philippines, Viva Iglesia Katolika Apostolika Romana!
The issue is salvific. One who truly doesn't believe the Gospel will look elsewhere for their foundational identity. If the ultimate worth offered at the Cross of Christ is rejected, the default position turns to the culture for a definition of human value. It should be obvious that the whimsical nature of culture provides no solid footing.
Wow YES!! Couldn't have said it better.
In the Bible, Jesus is called the Bridegroom and His Church is the Bride. If priests are 'in persona Christi' it makes perfect sense that only men are called to the priesthood, as women can't fulfill the role of Bridegroom. It's also been my experience that women are over represented in the average parish. They're lectors, altar servers, cantors and EMHC's. They teach catechism, are principals, teachers, run the choir, run the finances, head ministries, keep the calendar, are on the parish council, etc, etc. Take a look at the staff on any parish website and it's pretty much all women. As a woman, I'd actually prefer to see more men take on some of these roles. We're literally overrun with females!
AMEN!
Your videos (often/sometimes) are complicated. 😅 They are packed so full of facts, I do often have to look up words/terms. Especially since I'm not a native speaker. 😄
I love your work & theologically high quality content! ☆ Go on, Fr. Casey. God bless you and all you do. ♡
As Catholic women, we could support the church in so many ways. We have an important role in our family as a praying pole. A Catholic family can stay faithful in their faith because of our constant prayers for our husband and children. In this world situation where the fast development of another religion and their teaching is so overwhelming, our prayers for our families for the sake of our Catholic church's future take a very important role. And I am privileged to take up that responsibility. I don't need female priests.
The apostle Paul says that women shouldn't teach because Eve sinned first, which implies that women are more easily deceived or naieve.
As a woman, would you agree or disagree with that statement? Would you entrust justice and recognition of good and evil, and authority, with a woman? And moreover, do you think many of these ultra liberal denominations such as Methodism are perhaps being governed by women with rose tinted glasses?
I'm not saying this to the detriment of women. Of course, men are more violent and make more abuses of power, and are impulsive, from my experience. And for this reason God said, it is not good for man to be alone.
Of course for drawing these distinctions, in the modern age, this is considered a sexist position. Do you think this is a sexist position?
I think the issue comes from the clericalism in the Church. One of my mentors as a kid was a Sister and she was honestly such a leader of our church. As I grew older, I learned that nuns and sisters do not hold very much organizational power in the Vatican and are still considered laypeople (which I’ve read people now distinguish them as leading “religious lives”, but still).
Upon doing my own research, there’s cases for women clergy and there’s cases against it. One of the reasons I found that the early Church fathers didn’t want women priests was because they thought that having a woman priest was a denial of the literal nature of the Eucharist. In their context, and in the context of many ancient societies, blood rituals were always performed by men and was a parallel to pregnancy in women. Blood rituals were also used to establish lineages and we see this in the apostolic succession. Blood rituals were used to establish male lineages, which is interesting when you consider that the requirements of being seen as Jewish was to have a Jewish mother. Women didn’t need a ritual to pass down lineages because they could give birth.
There’s a lot of things to consider when it comes to the tradition of the priesthood. Some argue that the blood ritual nature of the Eucharist means it has to be done by men.
But we do live in a different societal context. Our society is not generally familiar with the gender-norms surrounding these rituals and that needs to be considered. Are we following tradition for tradition’s sake or are we looking at something more here? Would our society today think that the Eucharist isn’t the literal Body and Blood of Christ if the ritual was performed by a woman? These are all things to consider.
Regardless, I think that women need to have more power in the Vatican, whether that come from the priesthood or elsewhere. I really hope that the office of women deacons are restored.
After 5 years leading a construction mission in Central America for my US parish, I have seen the importance of women in keeping the Church alive there. In my area two priests were responsible for 75 small villages surrounding a central church. Each village had a chapel that was administered by a church delegate. About 75% of the delegates were women who handled baptisms, funerals, the liturgy of the word, and distributing communion.
Perhaps...
But none of those women were ordained Catholic priests...
Women run my parish in Ireland too but still cannot be priests
The question that should be asked is, why would anyone want to be allowed to do X, Y, or Z? is it for their own glory or the glory of God? In our society, some women want to be fathers, not for the children's good but in defiance of the norms.
Phoebe may have been called a deacon (diakonos) in Romans, but the same Greek word was used to describe Emperor Nero. It's unlikely that it had the same connotations then as it does today. We have to remain faithful to the Traditions, one of those being a male Diaconate. I'm not a fan of the tendency to (usually baselessly) claim "well the early Church did X" and ignore the other 2000 years of Church history/tradition. People need stability in the rapidly changing modern world, that's one of the reasons people cling to the Church, let's not marry Her to the age, lest She die in the next
Agreed! One complicating factor is that the word "deacon" is not just an ecclesial title, but in Greek it is also a generic word meaning "servant". The early Church had many people, men and women, who were servants in ministry. But as Acts of the Apostles demonstrates, only men were sacramentally ordained to clerical status.
Well yes we must realize that the whole hierarchy of the Church wasn't completely established perfectly in the early church but developed as time went on , also canon 1024 clearly states "A baptized male alone receives sacred ordination validly." I guess this is one thing left out from the video. Therefore, under the current canon law deaconate ordination of women is not allowed.
Woman deaconesses existed and their role is almost entirely different from that of make deacons.
The order of deaconesses existed for a period of time until it became obsolete, and only a way to boost women's pride over other women, as to become a deaconess, the woman had to be over 40 years old, a virgin, and with a high level of faith and morality.
@@pintoloyce The hierarchy was there from the earliest days. We define hierarchy as the authority of the clergy, and the clergy consist of bishops, priests and deacons. bishops were established by Christ in the naming of the Apostles. Likewise, Christ established the modern priesthood at the Last Supper when he washed the feet of the Apostles. This was a sign of preparation for priestly ministry. Finally, those very bishops (apostles) ordained the first deacons. That structure hasn't changed.
Incidentally, the very word "hierarchy" literally means "a structure of priests". "Hiero-" is a Greek prefix meaning priests or priestly (hieroglyphics - the picture writing of the Egyptian priests) and "-archy" means "structure", as in "architecture". Therefore, a leadership model is implied in the very establishment of the clerical order.
The BIBLE states DO NOT FOLLOW TRADITION. Every Catholic follows 99% tradition and 1% BIBLE.
as a catholic i am thankful because i am being enlighten to some issues being thrown by other religion that now i can simply answer them with certainry in defense of my faith again thank you
1 Timothy 2:12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.[1]
What if she will not be silent? Then what?
5:19 The priest and deacon both move diagonally towards the bishop.
that's a fork
Gen. 3:15; Luke 1:26-55; John 19:26; Rev. 12:1- Mary is God’s greatest creation, was the closest person to Jesus, and yet Jesus did not choose her to become a priest. God chose only men to be priests to reflect the complimentarity of the sexes. Just as the man (the royal priest) gives natural life to the woman in the marital covenant, the ministerial priest gives supernatural life in the New Covenant sacraments.
Judges 17:10; 18:19 - fatherhood and priesthood are synonymous terms. Micah says, “Stay with me, and be to me a father and a priest.” Fathers/priests give life, and mothers receive and nurture life. This reflects God our Father who gives the life of grace through the Priesthood of His Divine Son, and Mother Church who receives the life of grace and nourishes her children. In summary, women cannot be priests because women cannot be fathers.
Mark 16:9; Luke 7: 37-50; John 8:3-11 - Jesus allowed women to uniquely join in His mission, exalting them above cultural norms. His decision not to ordain women had nothing to do with culture. The Gospel writers are also clear that women participated in Jesus’ ministry and, unlike men, never betrayed Jesus. Women have always been held with the highest regard in the Church (e.g., the Church’s greatest saint and model of faith is a woman; the Church’s constant teaching on the dignity of motherhood; the Church’s understanding of humanity as being the Bride united to Christ, etc.).
Mark 14:17,20; Luke 22:14 - the language “the twelve” and “apostles” shows Jesus commissioned the Eucharistic priesthood by giving holy orders only to men.
Gen. 14:10; Heb. 5:6,10; 6:20; 7:15,17 - Jesus, the Son of God, is both priest and King after the priest-king Melchizedek. Jesus’ priesthood embodies both Kingship and Sonship.
Gen. 22:9-13 - as foreshadowed, God chose our redemption to be secured by the sacrificial love that the Son gives to the Father.
Matt. 26:26; Mark 14:22; Luke 22:19 - because the priest acts in persona Christi in the offering to the Father, the priest cannot be a woman.
Mark 3:13 - Jesus selected the apostles “as He desired,” according to His will, and not according to the demands of His culture. Because Jesus acted according to His will which was perfectly united to that of the Father, one cannot criticize Jesus’ selection of men to be His priests without criticizing God.
John 20:22 - Jesus only breathed on the male apostles, the first bishops, giving them the authority to forgive and retain sins. In fact, the male priesthood of Christianity was a distinction from the priestesses of paganism that existed during these times. A female priesthood would be a reversion to non-Christian practices. The sacred tradition of a male priesthood has existed uncompromised in the Church for 2,000 years.
1 Cor. 14:34-35 - Paul says a woman is not permitted to preach the word of God in the Church. It has always been the tradition of the Church for the priest or deacon alone (an ordained male) to read and preach the Gospel.
1 Tim. 2:12 - Paul also says that a woman is not permitted to hold teaching authority in the Church. Can you imagine how much Mary, the Mother of God, would have been able to teach Christians about Jesus her Son in the Church? Yet, she was not permitted to hold such teaching authority in the Church.
Rom. 16:1-2 - while many Protestants point to this verse denounce the Church’s tradition of a male priesthood, deaconesses, like Phoebe, were helpers to the priests (for example, preparing women for naked baptism so as to prevent scandal). But these helpers were never ordained.
Luke 2:36-37 - prophetesses, like Anna, were women who consecrated themselves to religious life, but were not ordained.
Isaiah 3:12 - Isaiah complains that the priests of ancient Israel were having their authority usurped by women, and this was at the height of Israel’s covenant apostasy.
*(Scripture Catholic Apologetics)*
As lucid as it could be!
Excellent. Thanks much with what must have been a very time consuming upload.
In my youthful days, I was an Altar boy. It was a position of privilege. We boys knew it and were proud of it. The girls could only look on in envy. At least, I presume they were envious. Consideration of their feelings would have been the furthest thing from our minds at that stage. We had more important things to worry about, like, whose turn was it to serve at the next wedding or funeral. Both days guaranteed a big pay-out, and we looked forward to both with similar eagerness.Eventually, my friends and I outgrew the surplice and soutane, and passed on our trade to the next generation of young men. On it went, this grand old tradition, until one fine day, there came a shock to the system ; girls appeared behind the Altar rails !First, there were one or two, but very soon, they practically took over the show. I guess they were making up for lost time. The boys, their 'special' status now a thing of the past, seemed to lose heart and almost disappeared from the scene.Indeed, it took a long time for things to balance out, and longer still for old warriors like myself and my childhood companions to accept the new scenario.However, while those memories will always be precious to us, we learned to live with the new reality, and if any of us have a daughter today, we would surely shed a tear of joy, to see her dressed in her surplice and soutane, serving Mass, behind the Altar rails.
What you describe is the very clericalism we are called to avoid. Just because a group of boys are lording their position over girls doesn't mean the girls deserve the position, too. it means those boys DON'T deserve it. They see it as an avenue to make money and to be held in esteem.
Your altar boys got paid to serve at weddings or funerals?? In my church, it was all voluntary service. And honestly, from what I saw in my generation of altar servers, the priests started inviting girls to become servers because there weren't enough boys to do the job.
@@felisd Not really getting paid as such. More like a tip really, but it became a tradition. Nobody was going to get rich out of it, but it was one of the perks of the job.
@@deaconbilcarter5210 exactly right. The Church allows girls to be altar servers but it doesn’t mean it’s good or it’s fitting. Being an altar server is preparation for holy orders. It seems to me like it would just confuse the young girls that become altar servers.
@ Joseph Ryan. Isn’t this how progress happens. The horrors of recent church history are because old habits and male privilege is clung on to by a frightened powerful group. Look what is happening with Bp Olsen in Fort Worth Texas. Please open your hearts and see how unfair the Church is to over 50% of the population.
But Jesus also chose women. The early church just edited this out.
This is why I am an Episcopalian, scripture, tradition and reason guiding us towards God’s will. Women make fine priests.
Let’s also not forget that in Exodus, God chose Aaron (a man) and his sons (also men) to be ordained priests to serve Him.
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Arent you talking about an incredibly, breathtakingly misogynist culture here?
@@daviddavenport9350 Catholicism is not tied to any culture. Never was, never will.
The fact that some theologians "believe" a teaching to be infallible doesn't make it so. The fact that the Pope and the College of Cardinals held back, quite correctly, from declaring this teaching infallible is very telling. To take another example, the rule of mandatory celibacy for priests, now considered traditional in the Church, was not formally adopted until the 12th century, and not broadly accepted in the Church until centuries after that. The nonessential tradition of priestly celibacy was intended to address a problem in the Church at that time. Some nonessential traditions may have expiry dates. Catholic Christianity is a beautiful expression of the Faith, but there is a tendency in the Catholic Church to veer in the direction of idolizing its own institutions. The time may or may not be right for female ordination, but that doesn't mean the Holy Spirit won't prompt the Church in that direction. If that were to happen, would the Church respond, or would she cling to her own nonessential traditions instead?
"nonessential"...who defines that, you? Freaking liberals, you are more poisonous than atheists.
Re: celibacy. I don't know why people are wilfully ignorant of the Eastern Catholic Church. We have at least 250million Eastern Catholics who are in full communion with Rome, their priests are allowed to be married.
Priests from the Western Catholic Church imitate Christ, He was not married and He was celibate. Jesus also said in Matthew 19:12 that "there are those who choose to live like eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. The one who can accept this should accept it."
I learn a lot about my faith in your channel. Thank you!
As an Episcopalian (the predominant American Anglican church, for those unfamiliar) with a mother who's a priest, I've always questioned the Catholic stance. This video helps me understand that, but I still wonder: is the history of women in the church, a precedent cited by the church for continuing with male-only ordination, not distorted by a misogynistic past? Not particularly by the church, but by broader society in general. The precedent is established in eras of gender-based power disparities, so it seems to me that considering it as a precedent that ought not be altered doesn't take into account the social context of that precedent.
I went to a Protestant college and I really miss the female pastors and priests. I still call them up sometimes for counseling, as well as a female rabbi who is an old friend of mine from my younger days. Male priests are useless in many situations.
Social context is not relevant at all. Jesus, if anything, bent 99% of social paradigms of His era, as naturally He was beyond such things. Jesus was, is, and will be forever. The Church has no authority to bend the Will of Jesus, Our God, and it's absurd to even consider God's morality to be subject to things such as time, place or social context.
Pope John Paul ll has declared once and for all, that "he was not authorized by Christ
to ordain women".
Couldn't Mary Magdelene be considered an apostle and therefore legitimize women being priests?
Some argue this, yes.
@@BreakingInTheHabit Couldn’t a woman deliver a homily at least? Mary Magdalene was the first person to proclaim the resurrection
So glad you said this as I was fixing to .
@@BreakingInTheHabit They were Legit the first with the Good News (of the resurrection)
No
Thanks for this video. Always love your work. Could you point towards some sources (or create a video) on these three follow-up questions?
1) How does the Church determine the boundaries of its living teaching authority? I think of that authority as primarily being derived from Peter being granted the power to bind and loose, but I can't think of scriptural examples that set limits on that binding and loosing that would put women's ordination on one side of the line and the many other changes over the last two thousand years on the other. Certainly there is a long tradition of decisions made by councils, bishops, and popes in which we might discern a pattern, but given that sacraments like auricular reconciliation don't show up until after the church had existed for many hundreds of years (much less being limited to a priest) I'm not sure how to draw the line so that women's priestly ordination is on one side but not the other nor am I aware of a document that examines the question from this angle.
2) Is there a requirement that the College of Electors be made up of cardinals? What is the authority for this requirement (doctrine or discipline)? What are the best arguments for limiting the College of Electors to cardinals (including the full history of papal elections)?
3) How should Catholics think about Canons? As a rule are they part of doctrine or simply a discipline? Is there a doctrinal reason that governance authority should be limited to priests (whether bishops or presbyters).
If you not a priest you are not a Christian. This is why Catholics go to see what they perceive to be a priest in a building.
I know this is an old comment, but I feel the need to reply as best I'm able anyway.
Let me anticipate so as to not give false hope and quote Pope Francis on the matter: "with reference to the ordination of women, the Church has spoken and says, 'No.' John Paul II said it, but with a definitive formulation. That is closed, that door."
What he refers is this part of Ordinatio Sacerdotalis: "I declare that the Church has no authority whatsoever to confer priestly ordination on women and that this judgment is to be definitively held by all the Church's faithful."
Note the wording: *definitively* i.e. Always
In the original latin: hancque sententiam ab omnibus Ecclesiae fidelibus esse *definitive tenendam*
Now to the questions.
1) The Church has teaching authority on many things, such as Church matters, and theological matters. Ordination of women concerns these both. It's valid.
2) A Cardinal is just a fancy word for elector or voter. This is like saying, "Is there a way to exclude all voters from the voting booth?" If they weren't at the voting booth, they wouldn't be voters by definition. The proper name for the college is College of Cardinals. Current doctrine stipulates the requirement to be a Cardinal (AKA a voter) is to be a bishop, and if a non-bishop is to be appointed, then he must be ordained bishop before becoming Cardinal.
3) As Doctrine, but sometimes discipline. Two types of canons exist, Canons of Faith vs. Canons of Discipline. Canons are universal and are often ridiculously difficult, or sometimes quite literally impossible to change.
But none of this is relevant here. The Church confirmed that that part of Ordinatio Sacerdotalis as part of the deposit of faith. Infallible. Literally impossible to change. No turning back. It's Catholic Revealed Truth that the Church has *no authority whatsoever to ordain women* no matter what Popes come next, this is it.
In my opinion i really find priests as men more spiritually nurturing as representations of a/the father, and women mostly unable to take on the symbol of the father to be inadequate in some regards to, at least my, spiritual needs. Women also have their role and important positions in one's life, but priesthood is not one of them. At least that's how i feel about the matter
You’re objectively right
and nuns have the roles as mothers of the church. Men take the role of Jesus (at the altar) and woman take the role of the church. I think a lot of people dont have sisters at their parish and if they did they might be able to see clearer the different roles men and women have in the church and how its a beautiful thing to be apart of what God created you for.
It has been a men's club for far too long and this is why we have fostered pedophila and sexual assault in our church. More woman are essential we are just as worthy Priests.
@@kimthetruthofit6965 that's the theological lesbianism I despise from Liberal Catholics
@@kimthetruthofit6965 The Anglican will take you. There you can do all that you want and have your own religion. The new trend now in the Anglican Church is to have people dressed as trees. Give it a go
One of the greatest downfalls of the Episcopal Church was ordaining women as priests.
It was already heretical before they played church with women acting as phoney priests.
@@Charliechorizo well, I am speaking from personal experience. Belonged to a church where the gay deacon killed his lover, he was put into the state prison. Years later a priest came to be pastor of the 3 local churches (small towns) his wife left him for a church member, female, priest left and his wife became the new priest. I had quit the church after the deacon episode began.
I agree with you.
Hannah Awbrey from above says this "in the video, women are equally capable of doing the spiritual job of a priest." That may be true but it does not account for the true nature of men. Men, will not generally accept the spiritual leadership of a woman, capable or not, and especially not in personal matters. We are great apes and driven by evolution and hundreds of thousands of years of cultural norms. Men have accepted women political leaders as Queens, etc., in history but usually only to avoid war and only when backed by the fierce might of men at arms. On the whole, men will not be politically led by women long term either. The Episcopal Church and every other Church that has accepted women priests are all in decline because of this reason that no one talks about. It may be a sad truth but it is the truth. Should the Catholic Church accept women priests and leadership it will decline even faster than the protestant denominations. You can cite exceptions to what I said all you want and there are some but in the end, if you lose the male membership and the male leadership in any large societal group, it will eventually die out.
@@denicesanders4586 nothing compared to the friars raping kids for years around here.
In English (maybe it is not so in US variant of English) the plural of Diocese is Diocese; when singular it is pronounced 'dio-ses' (or 'dio-sis') and when plural it is pronounced as 'dio-sees'.
The plural of 'diocese' is 'dioceses' in all forms of English. Notwithstanding this spelling, in British English, it is most often pronounced "dio-seez" as you stated as we have no hesitation in pronouncing words differently from the way they are spelt!
I find it interesting that our Blessed Mother was specifically said to have been in the room with the apostles at Pentecost. Afterwards she is never mentioned again. I wonder what she did with her second dose of the Holy Spirit (the first being at the Annunciation).
The first Marian Apparition happened while she was still alive. My guess is she spent a lot of time in prayer- being there for those who needed her.
The celebration of the Assumption/ Dormition talks about her passing, so I believe tradition states she simply lived peacefully in Judea until her end.
Nurichiri, have you seen the movie Full of Grace? It's about Mary's life right before her Assumption. I think it's based on some writings from 1st century Christianity.
She taught saint Luke what he later wrote about the annunciation and Jesus`s infancy and probably many other things. And maybe ( probably too ) she also taught saint John because remember that she was living with him...
Not sure how much of this is conspiracy theory but I had read many years ago from religious history enthusiasts that early Christians were led by many women however there was a conflict amongst the Apostles about this in particular between Peter and James, with Peter winning the argument and thus women leaders were eventually marginalized within the church.
One interesting argument was many of the early converts specially from pagans were women because early Christianity apparently treat women more equally than what we now have in the church.
Take it with a grain of salt but I always wonder how different the church was in the first 200-300 years.
I kinda accept that Jesus' apostles were all men, and that our tradition comes from the patriarchy. I just have a big doubt; one of the reasons you mentioned was because the Church doesn't feel it has the authority to decide this. But the apostles in the first Council of Jerusalem decided something transcendental and of upmost importance: decided that circumcision was no longer necessary for the salvation of gentile men. I don't know if the apostles thought about this temporarily, but it hasn't changed since, and circumcision is something very important. I'm not gonna start a fight for this issue, but I just feel openminded about women's priesthood, and I feel I need a deeper reason to deny women's priesthood, and I don't understand either why women can't have other ordinations like deaconate right now... I don't want it to be because of sexism (let's not deny that there is sexism in the church)... 🤔 Bear in mind that, at least in my country, priests use to have the help of a woman or some women in the parish for some works on the church too.
I think you should read 1 Corinthians chap 24 verse 34
@@allyinherit7872 Sorry I can't find the passage. Could you send me a link to the passage of the Bible? 🙏
@@claraartnow6645 I'm sorry dear I meant chapter 14:34
@@allyinherit7872 Thanks!
I disagree with Paul in this particular letter, and here's my reasoning. I understand from the context that we can't apply this nowadays. I think Paul (as well as other Apostles) had a certain mentality, very rooted from the jewish traditions that we don't have now. This kind of mentality of the time, for example, put christians from gentile origins below judeo-christians. You can see an example also in the episode of Saint Peter and Cornelius (a christian from pagan origins) in acts chapter 10 and 11. Back then jews weren't allowed to eat with non-jews or stay at their homes. Women had also an unequal treatment, for example in the Resurrection the Apostles didn't believe Mary Magdalene (Mark 16:9-20) or that servant who announced Peter's freedom (Acts 12:6-19). But we know that the firsts witnesses of Christ's Resurrection were women, and that the Holy Spirit came to Cornelius: God doesn't make distinction with persons. That's why I believe we can't apply what Paul says to nowadays.
Aside from that, I don't mind that Priesthood is only assigned to man. It just bothers me, how can we women serve the Church from the hierarchy, like others? What's our responsibility?
@Collins Anosike well, no. But you don't see the names of Sts. Joaquim and Anna, nor the formation of monastic orders, nor the use of the cross as an identity symbol and you know, a long et cetera. We Catholics recognize tradition and the magisterium of the Church as valid sources of faith. So women not being priests in the Bible doesn't mean that it is automatically forbidden, the reasoning behind that has to be found somewhere else
Ever since the 1994 document, I've been praying for God to explicitly tell the Pope that he should allow ordination of women, by whatever method is necessary to prove to whichever pope it is that it's not just some bad tuna-induced dream but a real message from God that needs to be taken seriously. Refusing to allow women in the priesthood, in this day and age, is unjust and when you then take into consideration the crisis in vocations, nonsensical.
The reasons as stated here can be paraphrased as "We don't ordain women because we never have"; not a very convincing argument for never doing it
Actually it is. You forget that it is their choice and you have to argue your case, and not vice versa.. A little bit humbleness of ego will help you a long way.