@@camera-4455 Exactly... The reason nobody else explored it is because everyone else is laughing at how ridiculous this was. SO bad I'm almost suspicious. Then again, most likely it was just Musk thinking he can style it out, even if it's a bit bad. But he forgot "dark maga" a couple days earlier... He looked embarrassed on stage, and rightly so...
I imagine that one of the first places we might see Robovan might be at an airport, serving as a parking and hotel shuttle. A fairly localized campus in other words.
American tesla fan boys must stop thinking it's futuristic. You can see this kind of electric minibus in China already in open street taking passenger for 2 years maybe
"Last mile logistics" is something the robovan could excel at, taking pallets of goods day and night to retailer's (from warehouses) would make a big difference
@@Nobody-Nowhere Ooooouuuu, SICK burn, I loved that! - You'll always get me on side by ridiculing the Americans for their moronic systems of measurement... Then again, if you can't count over 12 anyways, does it really matter? Just let them look at the pretty blinking colors... Also I think the measurement would be "roughly 35 ants high, but stacked lenghtways".
I semi agree with your reasoning on size differences, a third or second reason for smaller size is that they see transportation moving away from a hub and spokes model towards a peer to peer more direct model, much because of dramatically lower costs per mile
The Robovan is way too big to fit in a Boring Tunnel (current Tunnel Size). There are videos of the cybertruck driving through the tunnel and it barely cleared the edges. Hyperloop vacuum is to make sure there is no air in front of the vehicle to slow it down. Creating a vacuum underneath the vehicle not only increases resistance but does nothing to move the air out of the way. The super low ground clearance of the van was accomplished by an adjustable air suspension. Without it, it would never be able to drive normal, uneven, roads. This is not to say the Robovan is such a crazy idea. It just doesn't have the benefits you mention in this video. The tight turns in the Boring tunnels in Las Vegas might be on the map but the tunneling machine won't be able to dig tunnels with tight turns.
They can also just make a smaller Robovan to fit the tunnels. Given the fleet size for the LV Loop is going to be in the small hundreds of vehicles, it doesn't make too much sense to optimize a high production vehicle specifically for that use.
@@billweberx The tunnels are wide enough, if a bit tight, but because the road platform is at the widest point of the tunnel, it is only six feet in height. That's not enough. And since the tunnel is only one vehicle wide, you can only have traffic in one direction, which means you need two tunnels. Which costs twice as much.
stop being so hatefull against this perfect design, my city needs hundreds of these, they will perfectly fit onto our uneven roads with billion pot holes.
Stop being so hypersensitive. I literally described what it looks like. I never said it looked bad or good. Now in terms of "perfect design" ... a perfect design would be way more aerodynamic. It would need to be to give it the best possible range. So no... u are incorrect. It's not a perfect design. Ur just a fanboy. I'm glad Elon is doing what other aren't but to have 100% fully autonomous cars in every city means ur license will be taken away/given up because u won't need it anymore. No thanks to that future for me! I wanna drive calmly to clear my head, I wanna drive aggressively to get some thrills, etc... what I don't want is to be forced to take a robovan which is essentially public transit.
@@eltyper22 didnt u read at all how i used sarcasm for the other part of my comment ?? ,,they will perfectly fit onto our uneven roads with billion pot holes.,,
Robovans will be allowed on HOV lanes as buses are. Most busses are not loaded to capacity almost all the time. Robovans can be used in increments of 20 passengers and can be added where needed based on real time and statistical information. I have not run a model on this but I am pretty good with numbers and my expectation is that Robovans in aggregate will require less space than existing bus systems in cities.
Replacing 1 bus with 5 robovans allows for more routes and more a more frequent pick up schedule. They also don't have the noise and exhaust fumes of the buses. Finally, they will probably be safer.
The vast majority of the cost of transit is the driver and fossil fuels. If you have robovan tech, there's no reason you wouldn't just make it bus-sized. You get more capacity for when you need it, more comfort when you don't, and greater safety at parity of other factors out of being big and brawny.
This looks like a Transport Advertisement for a Smart City full of rich people , inventors and high skilled Dr's etc i cant imagine the average low income person taking up space in this .
Holy shit, I watched the entire reveal, have seen dozens of pictures, watched several reactions, and this is the first time I realized they're Gold! I thought they were silver or stainless steel in color.
The minibus is a solution to a problem that’s already been addressed in many parts of the world. One challenge we all face is that our view of things can be limited by our location. If you’ve traveled and experienced global mass transit, you’d see that electric minibuses are already on the roads. In fact, I just watched a ribbon-cutting ceremony for an autonomous, electric minibus route. What I’d really like to see from Tesla is a focus on adapting the Semi into essential commercial vehicles we need-like a 40-foot long-haul bus, cement mixer, flatbed truck, and other practical applications. It’s fine to experiment with ideas like this, but let’s prioritize the more critical projects first.
excellent, you made a lot of good points here. Also one bus could be replaced by three robovans which don't need to come all at the same time. Several robovans, means less waiting time. And robovans could communicate with each other, optimising the time interval between each, or calling extra robovans if the traffice is higher. Less waiting time, and lower cost than a personal robotaxi might even make the robovan more attractive than a cybercab. The robovan could have a less fixed route, and adapt it's route to the destination of each passenger. Imagine also a combination of robovan for the longer route, and a cybercab waiting for you at the regular stop for the last mile to get you at your final destination.
There are small busses. People don't travel by bus in the US because cities are designed to favor cars instead of public transport. Americans understand little else.
@@the11382That's why driverless busses are so attractive here, we don't have the density for cost effective transit and this can help solve that last mile problem. Of course we are trying to densify but that will take a long time and it's become a chicken and egg problem.
@@williamedstrom5681 Well, if you have the tech to do a low-density minibus, you also have the tech to do a normal bus with the exact same features. Transit is one of those cases where making it smaller doesn't really save any money. Besides, if most buses travel half empty so will minibuses, assuming total system/route capacity isn't cut down (in which case your savings don't come from efficiency, they just come from worse service).
@@Blaze6108 The main reason smaller busses don't save money is because of the driver. The secondary reason is that the smaller vehicles don't last as long. As long as the battery can be replaced and the upholstery refurbished electric busses should last a long time regardless of size. As for "they'll just be half empty as well", they would plan routes with bus sizes appropriate for the projected demand. You could cut it closer because if the next bus is in 3 minutes it's not a big deal to wait. Potentially, all routing could be dynamic and it would adjust in real time where possible.
@@williamedstrom5681 I think that is _technically_ true, but it feels like that if you are so efficient and cheap to begin with, there wouldn't be much of a point in saving by buying a smaller bus, and people do like comfortable transit that does NOT pack them like sardines if it's possible (right now it isn't, except for trams, which would you guess are quite popular). Besides, a notorious phenomenon with transit is that when it's good, the demand can go up a ridiculous amount, so you'd likely need to buy full-size buses eventually for the efficiency once you reach a reasonably short headway. Where I live we have a pseudo-autonomous (driver for door operation only) subway, it comes every 2 minutes, and it's STILL packed at rush hour despite using huge and long trains. IMO you'd be better off operating a fleet of primarily full-size buses.
I reserve my opinion about the idea of having smaller busses though. Reason being there are at times, a need for traditional, 40 feet long busses or even double-deckers in major cities. This can be a great model for areas that are less dense in America due to a bunch of historical reasons, but it's not like traditional busses are going to go away anytime soon even if the robovan starts selling tomorrow. I think the robovan would *complement* traditional busses, not replacing them at once. And remember railroads are still far superior in terms of cargo/passenger capacity and pollution. Keep in mind there's also a lot of other factors involved, like purchasing cost/long term cost, maintaince, and building another infrastructure to support charging the robovan (you can't expect all of them to charge in supercharging stations).
buses scale to the limit of routes, several routes merge. in south america there are ad-hoc busses that reprogram when people get on. they're weird as heck but fun
They can also hub-and-spoke where they bus in 40 people at a time with a dozen cybercabs ready to transport people to their final destination. As an integrated system the cabs would know to swarm the area just as the bus is pulling up, so there'd be little to no wait times and it could get pretty time-efficient for passengers.
Excellent video. Was wondering when a video dedicated to the cybervan would land in my queue. Unlike others in the comments, I'm not laughing. I'd be a non car owner in a heartbeat once both the cybervan and cyber cabs were being used. I used to love to drive when I was young but lately, not so much. Getting driven everywhere for less than the cost of car ownership would be excellent.
In my city we have a "rapibus", a rapid bus lane build separately from the regular car network. This system could use the fully automated robovan. The biggest problem we have is a shortage of bus drivers. FSD could solve this easily. Also, our bus service is limited to 6 am to 11pm while the FSD robovan could operate 24/7.
I’ve been looking forward to a Tesla van for years, hated the look of this when I first saw it, now it grew on me and I realize it’s kind of the perfect form factor… except for one thing: the back needs to open up. This is crucial for it to be useful for commercial applications, and it would also make it usable as the ultimate van life vehicle. You want to be able to open up the back and have a beautiful view. Please Tesla make a version where the back opens up!
20 people HOW? Like 7 people fit in a model Y? Nobody is amused when Tesla gets "aspirational", anymore. Just say it seats 14 and surprise us later. Also, I would have filmed a video of the Robovan going through the LasVegas loop. People would've LOVED that.
then get ready for an "ultra hardcore work culture" my friend, and don't forget that the number of accidents at Tesla is greater than that of other car companies 👍
I wouldn’t feel comfortable boarding a bus such as this with random strangers, without anyone supervising. I would definitely not like my kids to board.
it would require apps with ID verified to board, but still I would also feel uncomfortable. What if a random person just jumps in? How about 8 doors for each row and sides, all separated by walls, and 8 groups of 2-3 can have private spaces?
@@richardservatius5405 my idea would be - when you request the van ride, the Robovan App would tell you which door (numbered) you should be hopping in ahead of time. When you are at the moment of entering, you can hit 'ready to enter' button on the app. The van door will be opened and the fare will be charge at the same moment. any flaws do you see?
First, there such a thing as minibus and small city bus, not all buses 40+ seat ones. Second, we already have many projects of driverless buses in China, EU and elsethere, including EV and on demand. So nothing really new in Robovan.
I love how people always assume busses are 100% efficient, running at peek capacity, and that it's efficient to force everyone to take much longer trips than need, in order to facilitate trying to make the most of that capacity. Assuming the bus is 100% full, and that the bus isn't elongating travel for passengers, then yes, robotaxi takes up more space for the same number of seats. But having ridden on a lot of busses, it's unusual for busses to be at 100% capacity (especially if you're not in a major city), there are many times I was the only person on the bus or one of very few people on the bus. So that whole bus was moving around just to get me from one place to the other. Loads of times when taking the bus, instead of taking a direct route that will efficiently get me to my destination, and therefore off of the road as soon as possible, the bus winds around through town trying to fill itself up. How about the efficiency gains to be had by better mapping capacity to necessity, and the efficiency gains of reducing unneeded travel to try to compensate for a one size fits all solution? I think the future has a place both for the van AND the cybercab, and efficiently mapping vehicles to their use case will improve life for everyone.
Buses are big because then it can carry more people… meaning less cost per mile. You want as few buses as possible to reduce your cost. The robovan will need the same basic maintenance as a typical electrical bus… You assume that maintenance only means “engineering work” but in reality it’s mostly cleaning and small fixes like cracked windows
I want to point out that using giant fans to produce downforce against a closely-sealed bottom is hilariously inefficient. If you are pushing down, you're consuming extra energy, there ain't such a thing as a free lunch in physics. Also, taking corners that fast is impossible, for the same reason high-speed trains are often more limited by track geometry than power: if you take a corner fast, passengers will be flung around, feel sick, and generally hate it. Trains also tried to solve this by leaning into the curve, which helps only a little.
Your reasoning of why buses are bigger is way off. It is all about operating costs economics. I.e. The number of passengers (revenue) vs operating costs. Yes, maintenance is an operating cost, but its only one of. Drivers and fuel are the big costs. Having one driver for 50+ passengers is far better than one driver for 20 passengers. Bigger buses means less buses, which means less fuel consumption.
a smaller size vehicle is lower cost so a robovan is smaller therefore it will cost less to run it vs a giant bus it will cost more to drive that big bus vs the smaller robovan vehicle
@@markBalentine123567 thank you captain obvious. Maybe make something even smaller and call it a car, maybe we can go one step further and call it a motorcycle. A bus is used for mass transit, a 20 seater bus/car whatever it is just plain stupid.
You are over thinking the speed the Robovan vehicle is able to travel on a street space. There is no benefit to be aerodynamic traveling 40MPH which is practical on street space.
You forgot to mentionthat if the Robovan is big enough to obstruct air flow in the tunnels, then fans that blow air into the tunnels will exponentially enhance the efficiency of traffic flow in the tunnels.
It’s nice, but really needs more window space, and a big glass panoramic ceiling. Also I hope the suspension it way adjustable, so it can raise up and do some off roading
The best thing Musk could do is actually using The Boring Company to create affordable driverless metro networks using maglev or LIM powered trains since both technologies are in commercial operation now. Even London's deep tube trains could fit down the existing 12' TBC tunnels using existing 1435 mm gauge and third rail power but if you're going to do something as bold as this you might as well upgrade to Maglev or LIM to make the ride smoother and more efficient...
That ground clearance would ground the Robovan in every city. But of course it won't because the Robovan is just a concept prototype, not an actual product.
Any vehicle that low WILL have problems. We still have a good number of the "low rider" cars around. With out using the hydraulics, they cannot enter many driveways (public or private) without scraping. Many roads cannot handle that much water. The roadways can have 3 or more inches deep water near the curbs during the often daily summer rain!! Florida, where a half inch of rain in 20 minutes is not unusual. Just the drainage down the sides are low enough to cause problems turning a corner.
The other part of this that's overlooked is that a lot of buses because they're so big really can't go and do neighborhood routes, the robovan could potentially go to more places and increase the the adoption of mass transit.
Tesla's Robo Van is a futuristic vehicle with unique styling and functional design. It aims to revolutionize transportation by offering a versatile, efficient, and safe alternative to traditional buses and cars, potentially solving traffic congestion issues.
Good theories. So many people forget to look at Musk's other products when they're deciphering why he chose a certain approach. A couple of years before Musk mentioned it at a show, I theorized that the boring machine was actually created to bore holes into Mars and the Moon for living habitats and everyone thought I was crazy.
After Elon said , " Solar panels would only give 50 miles or so a week free energy !" On Joe Rogan i seen corporate motives . As Big as the Robotaxi is , it should be covered with Solar Panels instead of relying on a plug in or Induction plate Tech .. Ya think ? 😮
Solar panels on something that size wouldn't make a lot of sense. Why? Because for the best case extra 20 miles you may get in ideal conditions on something like that, and I mean ideal conditions, you would get way more money on the billboards that go on those buses and just the extra expense of those panels vs steel, etc
The real reason they came up with this is because the Taxi announcement was always going to be such a massive flop considering Waymo exists and are already years ahead of Tesla's autonomous capabilities.
You make some gteat points. Robocabs have the potential to entice people out of mass transit and make traffic worse. I believe this can be solved by adding a useage tax on robotaxis and private cars within commercial precints and using the revenue to fund mass transit options. The robovan can complement mass transit infrastructure by delivering people to an from rransit nodes to their preferred destinations. There will always be people who do not want to travel in a train, van or bus and pay for the privilege of not sitting next to someone with BO on a steamy hot day.
I'm pretty sure the TelsaRoboVan is specifically designed for operations in the underground smooth surface of the BoringCompany tunnels and I wouldn't be surprised to see them at and in use at CES in January, along with the TelsaRoboTaxi.
So with the van you need to either used it as a public transit bus, or you need 20 people all wanting to go to the same place. I don’t see it replacing individual cars or cabs.
I see it replacing many work vans if you need to transport stuff in a city or suburbs and you’re not going off road with it. It’s not meant to be a regular car lmao
I think vacuum in hyperloop makes travel more efficient by getting rid of the air molecules in the way, while something like the McMurtry is less efficient in return for more grip. even if it can do it without fans, if you increase grip, you typically decrease efficiency. in this case it would be like constant downforce
@@rogerfroud300 yeah it may not be feasible, but in theory, this is actually less efficient despite using vacuum. The vacuum, if real, would be for grip in this case, not removing air molecules out of its path
"negative pressure idea is stupid" i started saying, until you said the tunnel curves, which I didn't think about, i still am not bought as that would give stupid gforces to the people inside.
I enjoyed the bit about the McMurtry race car (hadn’t heard of it before) but I’m not sure how it’s ground-holding fans would apply to the Robovan. Speed around corners is limited to what is comfortable and safe for the passengers.
I did some back of the napkin math after the event, and concluded if nyc replaced its fleet of busses with 2 robovans per van. over a ten year period they would earn about 10 billion dollars rather then being negative 3 billion each year. This is with relevant costs etc assuming 120k per van. if anyones thinks regulators will never let it work, cities, municipalities cant afford NOT to allow this technology. more money for schools.
how would you put chains on the tires? fix a flat? go over speed bumps? adjust headlights for people all in the back or front? skip a stop because no one is getting off or on? It breaks down and sends out a help signal...how do you tow it?
consider the Van customization Economy (inside and out), new markets and other vehicle design concepts from a renewed Art Deco appreciation for vintage Retro Futurism
You are over thinking the speed the Robovan vehicle is able to travel on a street space. There is no benefit to be aerodynamic traveling 40MPH which is practical on street space. You are correct, vans not cabs is what cities can handle in quantity. Dedicated bus lanes aren’t always possible (older cities), but old rail lines can often be reused as isolated paths, but they aren’t always going in the ideal direction.
Just like Adam Conover said people in America have a car culture that says you’re abnormal if you’re taking a bus, problems like pervert on buses and the feeling of insecurity has grown into everyone’s mind, there will be no way people would go hop on to the robotvan if they are travelling in a small group, they might just call several cybercab instead, the market of robotvan would be so small if it won’t be used as a party van
EV mass transit buses are also a better solution for dense urban areas because diesel engine buses are built and tuned to run most efficiently at continuous highway speeds. Urban transit buses travel at much lower speeds and stop frequently. Basically, diesel buses are designed to run, yet dense urban transit buses crawl and stop during service. This means that efficiency is greatly reduced and emissions and maintenance are both increased when using diesel buses to serve dense urban areas. Electric buses have regenerative braking and motors that provide strong low end torque making them much better suited to the crawl and stop duty cycle of urban transit buses. Vehicle emissions are also a greater concern in densely populated areas.
Only way this works is with an active suspension that eats potholes and speed bumps and can lift this thing up at least a ft .. can’t wait to see what they come up with
ughhh, the only thing sucking the air out from underneath the car does is give more downforce without drag, it doesnt make you go faster... the only way your theory would work is if the robovan needed more downforce in the turns. has no effect on top speed!
I'm concerned about what riding in a RoboVan is going to be like when driven on actual roads in American cities. Because most of them are really bad, and having a really low clearance above the roadway is not an advantage. What does the suspension look like under that cover? How smooth a ride is it really going to be able to provide.
My city streets have lots of potholes and speed bumps bigger than 6 inches.
Pneumatic rise suspension.
Elon will create special types for your city, with magnetic levitation.....
Elon will create the equivalent of a paving "Roomba" that finds and patches roadway irregularities.
You in Detroit too?
@@JargonThD actually it sounds like you just created the next trillion dollar idea😂
Elon saw a bunch of sci-fi movies when he was young, and said, fuck it, i want that, and making his dream come true
Nobody else has explored your theory and you are spot on.
No.
Lol no.
@@camera-4455 Exactly... The reason nobody else explored it is because everyone else is laughing at how ridiculous this was. SO bad I'm almost suspicious. Then again, most likely it was just Musk thinking he can style it out, even if it's a bit bad. But he forgot "dark maga" a couple days earlier...
He looked embarrassed on stage, and rightly so...
The design cues of the Tesla Robovan are more like the 1920s Art Déco style than you might think.
... with some inspiration coming from the Spacing Guild navigator's vehicle from the 1984 Dune movie. But I agree with your Art Déco analogy!
Love it. 20’s and 80’s retro futurism merged.
yeah, non car guys don't understand. But he's trying, lol.
I just sold home that was art deco built in 1930s, had the "lines in motion" motif too, and this immediately came to mind 💪
Like the old breitspurbahn, a Nazi Train Concept. I can see the design resemblances.
I imagine that one of the first places we might see Robovan might be at an airport, serving as a parking and hotel shuttle. A fairly localized campus in other words.
Perfect place yes 🙌
With an Optimus attendant...
American tesla fan boys must stop thinking it's futuristic. You can see this kind of electric minibus in China already in open street taking passenger for 2 years maybe
They had that at Stansted airport literally 25+ years ago...
@@aroundtheglobe2592 These have been at airports around the world for DECADES... They won't know that, if they never leave the basement, though... 😀
"Last mile logistics" is something the robovan could excel at, taking pallets of goods day and night to retailer's (from warehouses) would make a big difference
Good thinking. reducing the need for 18 wheelers navigating in city limits.
as long as there are no 2cm high bumps on the road... or 2 medium sized stones high whatever you Americans say.
@@Nobody-Nowhere wheels are probably on a hydronic system so that the vehicular can increase ground clearance as needed
@@Nobody-Nowhere Please read other peoples comments before writing FUD that other people have written and been refuted.
@@Nobody-Nowhere Ooooouuuu, SICK burn, I loved that! - You'll always get me on side by ridiculing the Americans for their moronic systems of measurement... Then again, if you can't count over 12 anyways, does it really matter? Just let them look at the pretty blinking colors...
Also I think the measurement would be "roughly 35 ants high, but stacked lenghtways".
I semi agree with your reasoning on size differences, a third or second reason for smaller size is that they see transportation moving away from a hub and spokes model towards a peer to peer more direct model, much because of dramatically lower costs per mile
The Robovan is way too big to fit in a Boring Tunnel (current Tunnel Size). There are videos of the cybertruck driving through the tunnel and it barely cleared the edges. Hyperloop vacuum is to make sure there is no air in front of the vehicle to slow it down. Creating a vacuum underneath the vehicle not only increases resistance but does nothing to move the air out of the way. The super low ground clearance of the van was accomplished by an adjustable air suspension. Without it, it would never be able to drive normal, uneven, roads. This is not to say the Robovan is such a crazy idea. It just doesn't have the benefits you mention in this video. The tight turns in the Boring tunnels in Las Vegas might be on the map but the tunneling machine won't be able to dig tunnels with tight turns.
The Boring tunnels are 12 feet wide. It might fit. If not, the Boring Co is designing a new boring machine that is 21 feet wide. That should do it.
They can also just make a smaller Robovan to fit the tunnels. Given the fleet size for the LV Loop is going to be in the small hundreds of vehicles, it doesn't make too much sense to optimize a high production vehicle specifically for that use.
@@billweberx 2 Boring machines side by side
@@BongoWongoOG That's twice as expensive as one larger boring machine.
@@billweberx The tunnels are wide enough, if a bit tight, but because the road platform is at the widest point of the tunnel, it is only six feet in height. That's not enough. And since the tunnel is only one vehicle wide, you can only have traffic in one direction, which means you need two tunnels. Which costs twice as much.
Robovan looks like a hovering toaster
stop being so hatefull against this perfect design, my city needs hundreds of these, they will perfectly fit onto our uneven roads with billion pot holes.
Stop being so hypersensitive. I literally described what it looks like. I never said it looked bad or good. Now in terms of "perfect design" ... a perfect design would be way more aerodynamic. It would need to be to give it the best possible range. So no... u are incorrect. It's not a perfect design. Ur just a fanboy. I'm glad Elon is doing what other aren't but to have 100% fully autonomous cars in every city means ur license will be taken away/given up because u won't need it anymore. No thanks to that future for me! I wanna drive calmly to clear my head, I wanna drive aggressively to get some thrills, etc... what I don't want is to be forced to take a robovan which is essentially public transit.
@@eltyper22 didnt u read at all how i used sarcasm for the other part of my comment ?? ,,they will perfectly fit onto our uneven roads with billion pot holes.,,
get a tan while you commute...
It's cute, looking like an honest to God Art Deco toaster from the 1920s.
Just a little less ride height... 😀
A van driving in a city isn't a race car. It doesn't need aerodynamic downforce.
But how about some ground clearance? 😲
Robovans will be allowed on HOV lanes as buses are. Most busses are not loaded to capacity almost all the time. Robovans can be used in increments of 20 passengers and can be added where needed based on real time and statistical information. I have not run a model on this but I am pretty good with numbers and my expectation is that Robovans in aggregate will require less space than existing bus systems in cities.
Replacing 1 bus with 5 robovans allows for more routes and more a more frequent pick up schedule. They also don't have the noise and exhaust fumes of the buses. Finally, they will probably be safer.
The vast majority of the cost of transit is the driver and fossil fuels. If you have robovan tech, there's no reason you wouldn't just make it bus-sized. You get more capacity for when you need it, more comfort when you don't, and greater safety at parity of other factors out of being big and brawny.
with a online app to show arrivals at bus stops, a walker would be able to schedule slightly ahead.
I like the futuristic styling. Looks new and not like yesterday 🤔
This looks like a Transport Advertisement for a Smart City full of rich people , inventors and high skilled Dr's etc i cant imagine the average low income person taking up space in this .
I already love the Robovan!!!
Love your videos they really help me me keep up to date on everything Tesla and space x 💪💪💪
Holy shit, I watched the entire reveal, have seen dozens of pictures, watched several reactions, and this is the first time I realized they're Gold! I thought they were silver or stainless steel in color.
Are you a TSLA investor? 😀
The minibus is a solution to a problem that’s already been addressed in many parts of the world. One challenge we all face is that our view of things can be limited by our location. If you’ve traveled and experienced global mass transit, you’d see that electric minibuses are already on the roads. In fact, I just watched a ribbon-cutting ceremony for an autonomous, electric minibus route.
What I’d really like to see from Tesla is a focus on adapting the Semi into essential commercial vehicles we need-like a 40-foot long-haul bus, cement mixer, flatbed truck, and other practical applications. It’s fine to experiment with ideas like this, but let’s prioritize the more critical projects first.
Just when you thought there couldn't be any more bollocks following the Cybertruck....
excellent, you made a lot of good points here. Also one bus could be replaced by three robovans which don't need to come all at the same time. Several robovans, means less waiting time. And robovans could communicate with each other, optimising the time interval between each, or calling extra robovans if the traffice is higher. Less waiting time, and lower cost than a personal robotaxi might even make the robovan more attractive than a cybercab. The robovan could have a less fixed route, and adapt it's route to the destination of each passenger. Imagine also a combination of robovan for the longer route, and a cybercab waiting for you at the regular stop for the last mile to get you at your final destination.
This van holds 20. That's 2 for 1 and most busses travel half empty.
There are small busses. People don't travel by bus in the US because cities are designed to favor cars instead of public transport. Americans understand little else.
@@the11382That's why driverless busses are so attractive here, we don't have the density for cost effective transit and this can help solve that last mile problem. Of course we are trying to densify but that will take a long time and it's become a chicken and egg problem.
@@williamedstrom5681 Well, if you have the tech to do a low-density minibus, you also have the tech to do a normal bus with the exact same features. Transit is one of those cases where making it smaller doesn't really save any money.
Besides, if most buses travel half empty so will minibuses, assuming total system/route capacity isn't cut down (in which case your savings don't come from efficiency, they just come from worse service).
@@Blaze6108 The main reason smaller busses don't save money is because of the driver. The secondary reason is that the smaller vehicles don't last as long. As long as the battery can be replaced and the upholstery refurbished electric busses should last a long time regardless of size.
As for "they'll just be half empty as well", they would plan routes with bus sizes appropriate for the projected demand. You could cut it closer because if the next bus is in 3 minutes it's not a big deal to wait.
Potentially, all routing could be dynamic and it would adjust in real time where possible.
@@williamedstrom5681 I think that is _technically_ true, but it feels like that if you are so efficient and cheap to begin with, there wouldn't be much of a point in saving by buying a smaller bus, and people do like comfortable transit that does NOT pack them like sardines if it's possible (right now it isn't, except for trams, which would you guess are quite popular). Besides, a notorious phenomenon with transit is that when it's good, the demand can go up a ridiculous amount, so you'd likely need to buy full-size buses eventually for the efficiency once you reach a reasonably short headway.
Where I live we have a pseudo-autonomous (driver for door operation only) subway, it comes every 2 minutes, and it's STILL packed at rush hour despite using huge and long trains. IMO you'd be better off operating a fleet of primarily full-size buses.
I reserve my opinion about the idea of having smaller busses though. Reason being there are at times, a need for traditional, 40 feet long busses or even double-deckers in major cities. This can be a great model for areas that are less dense in America due to a bunch of historical reasons, but it's not like traditional busses are going to go away anytime soon even if the robovan starts selling tomorrow. I think the robovan would *complement* traditional busses, not replacing them at once. And remember railroads are still far superior in terms of cargo/passenger capacity and pollution.
Keep in mind there's also a lot of other factors involved, like purchasing cost/long term cost, maintaince, and building another infrastructure to support charging the robovan (you can't expect all of them to charge in supercharging stations).
buses scale to the limit of routes, several routes merge. in south america there are ad-hoc busses that reprogram when people get on. they're weird as heck but fun
That’s really a visual prove of the US education system. Do you guys know physics over there?
I think the robovan is also the best form factor for what goes in the boring company tunnels.
Very interseting!
Spot on, insightful analysis, well presented
Super interesting take on the Robovan! Great content.
They can also hub-and-spoke where they bus in 40 people at a time with a dozen cybercabs ready to transport people to their final destination. As an integrated system the cabs would know to swarm the area just as the bus is pulling up, so there'd be little to no wait times and it could get pretty time-efficient for passengers.
Excellent video. Was wondering when a video dedicated to the cybervan would land in my queue. Unlike others in the comments, I'm not laughing. I'd be a non car owner in a heartbeat once both the cybervan and cyber cabs were being used. I used to love to drive when I was young but lately, not so much. Getting driven everywhere for less than the cost of car ownership would be excellent.
I expect a lot of people would feel the same way
In my city we have a "rapibus", a rapid bus lane build separately from the regular car network. This system could use the fully automated robovan. The biggest problem we have is a shortage of bus drivers. FSD could solve this easily. Also, our bus service is limited to 6 am to 11pm while the FSD robovan could operate 24/7.
I’ve been looking forward to a Tesla van for years, hated the look of this when I first saw it, now it grew on me and I realize it’s kind of the perfect form factor… except for one thing: the back needs to open up. This is crucial for it to be useful for commercial applications, and it would also make it usable as the ultimate van life vehicle. You want to be able to open up the back and have a beautiful view. Please Tesla make a version where the back opens up!
Please use a description other than "exponentially"
really fast recommendation from youtube
20 people HOW? Like 7 people fit in a model Y? Nobody is amused when Tesla gets "aspirational", anymore. Just say it seats 14 and surprise us later. Also, I would have filmed a video of the Robovan going through the LasVegas loop. People would've LOVED that.
Its not a real product... Its a concept van that most likly will not comeout just like the roadster.
@@pse2020 I'd actually put money on it... Neither the van, nor the Taxi make ANY sense whatsoever...
I am an EE student my dream is to work in Tesla I love This Company 💞💞💞💞❣❣❤❤
Good luck 👍🏽 💓 ✨️
then get ready for an "ultra hardcore work culture" my friend, and don't forget that the number of accidents at Tesla is greater than that of other car companies 👍
@@lone1276 The company will be bankrupt before you graduate.
@@camera-4455 😅
@@camera-4455 or will bankrupt almost all other ICE mfg.?
1:16 wonder if gold for design for even trumps shere of his empire
Design over Function...revolutionary!
Hard high G turns will slam occupents to the side 😅 McMurtry Spreiling tech in robovin 😅
Exactly.
I wouldn’t feel comfortable boarding a bus such as this with random strangers, without anyone supervising. I would definitely not like my kids to board.
it would require apps with ID verified to board, but still I would also feel uncomfortable. What if a random person just jumps in? How about 8 doors for each row and sides, all separated by walls, and 8 groups of 2-3 can have private spaces?
@@abstracyellow1766 how would the van determine whether you have paid? close the door between each passenger and swipe a card to enter?
@@richardservatius5405 my idea would be - when you request the van ride, the Robovan App would tell you which door (numbered) you should be hopping in ahead of time. When you are at the moment of entering, you can hit 'ready to enter' button on the app. The van door will be opened and the fare will be charge at the same moment. any flaws do you see?
First, there such a thing as minibus and small city bus, not all buses 40+ seat ones. Second, we already have many projects of driverless buses in China, EU and elsethere, including EV and on demand. So nothing really new in Robovan.
They're not autonomous. The robovan is.
@billweberx Some of them are, and that more important, they are already on the line.
@@РоманГаврилов-з9р Name one.
I would upvote your comment but unfortunately you're r*ssian
Name one that is@@РоманГаврилов-з9р
I love how people always assume busses are 100% efficient, running at peek capacity, and that it's efficient to force everyone to take much longer trips than need, in order to facilitate trying to make the most of that capacity. Assuming the bus is 100% full, and that the bus isn't elongating travel for passengers, then yes, robotaxi takes up more space for the same number of seats. But having ridden on a lot of busses, it's unusual for busses to be at 100% capacity (especially if you're not in a major city), there are many times I was the only person on the bus or one of very few people on the bus. So that whole bus was moving around just to get me from one place to the other. Loads of times when taking the bus, instead of taking a direct route that will efficiently get me to my destination, and therefore off of the road as soon as possible, the bus winds around through town trying to fill itself up. How about the efficiency gains to be had by better mapping capacity to necessity, and the efficiency gains of reducing unneeded travel to try to compensate for a one size fits all solution?
I think the future has a place both for the van AND the cybercab, and efficiently mapping vehicles to their use case will improve life for everyone.
need to put some graffitti on this beeoch!!
Buses are big because then it can carry more people… meaning less cost per mile. You want as few buses as possible to reduce your cost. The robovan will need the same basic maintenance as a typical electrical bus… You assume that maintenance only means “engineering work” but in reality it’s mostly cleaning and small fixes like cracked windows
Wow that's amazing hero i love it well done Elon 💯❤❤❤❤it SA
I want to point out that using giant fans to produce downforce against a closely-sealed bottom is hilariously inefficient. If you are pushing down, you're consuming extra energy, there ain't such a thing as a free lunch in physics. Also, taking corners that fast is impossible, for the same reason high-speed trains are often more limited by track geometry than power: if you take a corner fast, passengers will be flung around, feel sick, and generally hate it. Trains also tried to solve this by leaning into the curve, which helps only a little.
I like your illustrations and animations.
Your reasoning of why buses are bigger is way off. It is all about operating costs economics. I.e. The number of passengers (revenue) vs operating costs. Yes, maintenance is an operating cost, but its only one of. Drivers and fuel are the big costs. Having one driver for 50+ passengers is far better than one driver for 20 passengers. Bigger buses means less buses, which means less fuel consumption.
This is a vehicle that’s been around for a long time. It’s called a bus.
Revolutionary?
You’re delusional.
a smaller size vehicle is lower cost so a robovan is smaller therefore it will cost less to run it vs a giant bus it will cost more to drive that big bus vs the smaller robovan vehicle
@@markBalentine123567 thank you captain obvious. Maybe make something even smaller and call it a car, maybe we can go one step further and call it a motorcycle. A bus is used for mass transit, a 20 seater bus/car whatever it is just plain stupid.
@markBalentine123567 🤦🏻♂
How does the Robovan handle different types of road conditions, especially with its low ground clearance?
Excellent points.
By solving the transportation problem with robovans you mean we should just be making buses electric and male them autonomous
What's the target price for Robovan?
You are over thinking the speed the Robovan vehicle is able to travel on a street space. There is no benefit to be aerodynamic traveling 40MPH which is practical on street space.
You forgot to mentionthat if the Robovan is big enough to obstruct air flow in the tunnels, then fans that blow air into the tunnels will exponentially enhance the efficiency of traffic flow in the tunnels.
Robovan as mobile house is my dream.
It’s nice, but really needs more window space, and a big glass panoramic ceiling. Also I hope the suspension it way adjustable, so it can raise up and do some off roading
The best thing Musk could do is actually using The Boring Company to create affordable driverless metro networks using maglev or LIM powered trains since both technologies are in commercial operation now. Even London's deep tube trains could fit down the existing 12' TBC tunnels using existing 1435 mm gauge and third rail power but if you're going to do something as bold as this you might as well upgrade to Maglev or LIM to make the ride smoother and more efficient...
No lie Khaos was such a good show. Needed another season. Thanks for the comparison. Totally subscribing. 😎
That ground clearance would ground the Robovan in every city. But of course it won't because the Robovan is just a concept prototype, not an actual product.
I predict we’ll see Robovans in Singapore very soon where there’s a huge penalty for vandalising anything.
Your theory seems well thought out.
I love the design choices of Tesla personally.
This take was brilliant. I’m sick and tired of the boring news reading and milk toast opinions this community was about wild and insightful theories
Any vehicle that low WILL have problems. We still have a good number of the "low rider" cars around. With out using the hydraulics, they cannot enter many driveways (public or private) without scraping.
Many roads cannot handle that much water. The roadways can have 3 or more inches deep water near the curbs during the often daily summer rain!! Florida, where a half inch of rain in 20 minutes is not unusual.
Just the drainage down the sides are low enough to cause problems turning a corner.
How do you change the tyres?
The other part of this that's overlooked is that a lot of buses because they're so big really can't go and do neighborhood routes, the robovan could potentially go to more places and increase the the adoption of mass transit.
Tesla's Robo Van is a futuristic vehicle with unique styling and functional design. It aims to revolutionize transportation by offering a versatile, efficient, and safe alternative to traditional buses and cars, potentially solving traffic congestion issues.
Good theories. So many people forget to look at Musk's other products when they're deciphering why he chose a certain approach. A couple of years before Musk mentioned it at a show, I theorized that the boring machine was actually created to bore holes into Mars and the Moon for living habitats and everyone thought I was crazy.
After Elon said , " Solar panels would only give 50 miles or so a week free energy !" On Joe Rogan i seen corporate motives .
As Big as the Robotaxi is , it should be covered with Solar Panels instead of relying on a plug in or Induction plate Tech .. Ya think ? 😮
Solar panels on something that size wouldn't make a lot of sense. Why? Because for the best case extra 20 miles you may get in ideal conditions on something like that, and I mean ideal conditions, you would get way more money on the billboards that go on those buses and just the extra expense of those panels vs steel, etc
The real reason they came up with this is because the Taxi announcement was always going to be such a massive flop considering Waymo exists and are already years ahead of Tesla's autonomous capabilities.
EXCELENT VIDEO💪❤
They should make all the seats face the same way. People don’t want to face each other in any seating environment
I'm also getting a motion sickness when I move backwards
It’s just a different looking bus. Public transportation pure and simple.
You make some gteat points. Robocabs have the potential to entice people out of mass transit and make traffic worse. I believe this can be solved by adding a useage tax on robotaxis and private cars within commercial precints and using the revenue to fund mass transit options. The robovan can complement mass transit infrastructure by delivering people to an from rransit nodes to their preferred destinations. There will always be people who do not want to travel in a train, van or bus and pay for the privilege of not sitting next to someone with BO on a steamy hot day.
I'm pretty sure the TelsaRoboVan is specifically designed for operations in the underground smooth surface of the BoringCompany tunnels and I wouldn't be surprised to see them at and in use at CES in January, along with the TelsaRoboTaxi.
Great video
So with the van you need to either used it as a public transit bus, or you need 20 people all wanting to go to the same place. I don’t see it replacing individual cars or cabs.
I see it replacing many work vans if you need to transport stuff in a city or suburbs and you’re not going off road with it. It’s not meant to be a regular car lmao
This is good to buy.🎉
I think vacuum in hyperloop makes travel more efficient by getting rid of the air molecules in the way, while something like the McMurtry is less efficient in return for more grip. even if it can do it without fans, if you increase grip, you typically decrease efficiency. in this case it would be like constant downforce
Yeah, they've had to admit that it's never going to work.
@@rogerfroud300 yeah it may not be feasible, but in theory, this is actually less efficient despite using vacuum. The vacuum, if real, would be for grip in this case, not removing air molecules out of its path
Tesla is my #1 fav company, hopefully optimus comes out soon, there is little detail about it
"negative pressure idea is stupid" i started saying, until you said the tunnel curves, which I didn't think about, i still am not bought as that would give stupid gforces to the people inside.
I enjoyed the bit about the McMurtry race car (hadn’t heard of it before) but I’m not sure how it’s ground-holding fans would apply to the Robovan. Speed around corners is limited to what is comfortable and safe for the passengers.
I did some back of the napkin math after the event, and concluded if nyc replaced its fleet of busses with 2 robovans per van. over a ten year period they would earn about 10 billion dollars rather then being negative 3 billion each year. This is with relevant costs etc assuming 120k per van. if anyones thinks regulators will never let it work, cities, municipalities cant afford NOT to allow this technology. more money for schools.
The skirt around the bottom will also stop people from throwing stuff (or themselves for a payday) under the van.
what do you mean 'exponentially larger footprint' You mean it will get bigger and bigger going to infinity? Or do you just mean 'bigger'?
Good luck turning that thing in snow when it's clogged the space between the wheels and the body.
how would you put chains on the tires? fix a flat? go over speed bumps? adjust headlights for people all in the back or front? skip a stop because no one is getting off or on?
It breaks down and sends out a help signal...how do you tow it?
I don't get the hype around "Robovan". We already have a similar concept on the streets, i.e. trams and buses
9:58 I think you missed this part.
@@valleyofiron125 to be fair, pretty much everyone is looking for eye candy to make themselves feel better. Different sources maybe but still…
consider the Van customization Economy (inside and out), new markets and other vehicle design concepts from a renewed Art Deco appreciation for vintage Retro Futurism
You are over thinking the speed the Robovan vehicle is able to travel on a street space. There is no benefit to be aerodynamic traveling 40MPH which is practical on street space.
You are correct, vans not cabs is what cities can handle in quantity. Dedicated bus lanes aren’t always possible (older cities), but old rail lines can often be reused as isolated paths, but they aren’t always going in the ideal direction.
It's so low to the ground that it would be too dangerous for UK and European roads where there are a lot of speed bumps.
Just like Adam Conover said people in America have a car culture that says you’re abnormal if you’re taking a bus, problems like pervert on buses and the feeling of insecurity has grown into everyone’s mind, there will be no way people would go hop on to the robotvan if they are travelling in a small group, they might just call several cybercab instead, the market of robotvan would be so small if it won’t be used as a party van
I wish they had done the cybertruck in this bold style. This feels way more polished
will those work in the bore tunnel. las vegas is ready for them.
EV mass transit buses are also a better solution for dense urban areas because diesel engine buses are built and tuned to run most efficiently at continuous highway speeds. Urban transit buses travel at much lower speeds and stop frequently. Basically, diesel buses are designed to run, yet dense urban transit buses crawl and stop during service. This means that efficiency is greatly reduced and emissions and maintenance are both increased when using diesel buses to serve dense urban areas. Electric buses have regenerative braking and motors that provide strong low end torque making them much better suited to the crawl and stop duty cycle of urban transit buses. Vehicle emissions are also a greater concern in densely populated areas.
60K VIEWS IS CRAZY THEY DONT KNOW
Convoying Robo-Van will look Exactly Like a Train On the Freeway, Headed to Los Angeles Beach Roads from Phoenix.
How do you change a flat tire??
Only way this works is with an active suspension that eats potholes and speed bumps and can lift this thing up at least a ft .. can’t wait to see what they come up with
ughhh, the only thing sucking the air out from underneath the car does is give more downforce without drag, it doesnt make you go faster... the only way your theory would work is if the robovan needed more downforce in the turns. has no effect on top speed!
I'm concerned about what riding in a RoboVan is going to be like when driven on actual roads in American cities. Because most of them are really bad, and having a really low clearance above the roadway is not an advantage. What does the suspension look like under that cover? How smooth a ride is it really going to be able to provide.