You registered both of them in New York , I'm interested in getting one and riding trail in Lewis County requires it. Deff want to get TSE now. Thank you for being GPX pioneer in NY.
The guy on the TSE looks pretty big. Did he change his rear spring? I weight 208 with no gear and my 2021 TSE rear spring seems pretty good to me. I would like to soften the front end a little, but not sure how the adjustments work on the new forks.
Lol poor Bob. Yeah Bob did have his suspension done, not sure what exactly. I weight 180 ish and I think that’s good for the what comes with the bikes. I would totally recommend taking your bike to a suspension guy and have him adjust your clickers, it makes a huge difference! It’s all voodoo to me and having someone know what they are doing really helped
IMO, electronics and fuel injection can be a bonus, especially if you ride includes a lot of elevation changes. When my brother and I traveled the country for our race team, we almost always had to re-jet (this was before fuel injection). Again, good video and thanks. PS: notice how your friends back tire was often slipping / losing traction? Another "side effect" of a 2-stroke. You will almost always have more traction on a 4 - stroke.
Overheating question: I still cannot decide between these two models, especially after riding my friends 2020 KTM 250 tpi. I liked that powerband feel but thought his bike had too much power for my skill level. I rode his old honda 250 4 stroke and we had to stop several times to let it cool down. He has a radiator fan on his KTM and never worried about overheating. Here is the question: Does the TSE need a fan? I know the FSE comes with a fan, which is great. I will be riding all over the mountains of colorado, Western Colorado, and eastern Utah (where it can get really warm) and think that this factor may sway me in a direction to finally choose.
250tpi is a sweet ride for sure. If you watch some of my other vids I took my tse out to Utah with me in 95-100 degree heat all day I some tight technical stuff and it did fine. Obviously peace of mind comes with a fan and for $100 you can add a tusk one. But no, no over heating. The fse runs way hotter if you ask me.
Yeah a couple of guys in the fb group have tried the lectron etc. those things really improve mpg for sure and do the elevation change. I’ve heard the low end suffers a little though. Maybe I’ll throw one on the tse eventually
Which one is happier to rev higher and is a better Hill climber. I'm trying to decide which one will be better at technical trails and steeper Hill climbs. Thanks
Hello-Dirt S I think the tse would be better at technical because it’s a 2 stroke and feels and rides lighter. As for hill climb that’s a tough one, I’ve never had issues with the tse on hill climbs, you just have to be on the pipe and use your clutch if your rpm drops, but the fse is a typical 4 stroke chugged and has good off the start throttle. Hill climb edge to fse and technical riding edge to tse
Do you think either could be set up out of the box to be decent on an MX track? I like to trail ride but my nearest riding areas are a couple of pretty tame MX tracks
If make some sprocket change and modify the suspension for MX, they will do fine on a MX track. You could have lots of fun. Could you race competitively, no. But it’s probably 70% rider/30% bike.
Hey great video man! Where are you and everyone else buying your GPX bikes? I emailed a dealer out in Utah and they won't get back to me about ordering one :/
@@LCARSADV thats the thing, I did call. Talked to a guy there and he gave me an email address. I emailed and no response. I'll have to just go straight to the website and see what I can figure out.
I wonder how much the emissions compliance forces the Japanese manufacturers hands in the way the power is on the dual sports. I do think honda should have converted the crf250l to a 300L like they did with the cbr250-300 beings it uses the same basic engine. Wondering if maybe that is why this is the last year of 250L and maybe they bring something that makes sense to the U.S. market. I bet since GPX isn't selling them as dual sports they probably don't near have to face the same scrutiny as honda. Also being a small manufacturer lets you get by with some of that just read about the Beta dual sports.
Exactly, that’s how beta and ktm get around it. But these bikes I think are mapped lean just like every other bike. I honestly don’t think making the 250l a 300 would help. It’s just not a great engine. Plus it’s still heavy with crappy suspension.
This engine is a Yamaha dt230 which was a dual sport. I have looked at both the manual and the service manual and it doesn’t list rebuild times. This is not an engine you need to rebuild often or even think about.
How come every GPX bike review there is no good review of the power of these bikes? I want one but if my modded pit bike has more power than thats a deal breaker for me can someone for the love of god please tell me if either the FSE or the TSE have comparable performance the bikes in its class? Like is a TSE250 faster than a cr125? Can someone please answer me this question because I want to purchase one.
because you can only compare them to the bikes you've ridden. Both bikes are less powerful than their KTM/Beta counterparts, but way more powerful than a crf250l. The 300 is less powerful than the drz400 (obviously) but not crazy less as it still has lots of torque. These bikes are low maintenance performance engines so they are somewhere in the middle. It's hard to describe engine power, but if you'll notice, everyone consistently states that the engines are very linear.
@@LCARSADV Thank you for trying. I don't care if they are less powerful but I do care if they are twice as slow as their counterpart. Like a Chinese 250cc enduro is horribly slow and I was hoping it wasn't in a similar category. Another reason I am concerned about performance is when I am on trails I like to lift the front wheel in the air when going over puddles and obstacles and I need a bike that can do that.
Micscience it is possible to do that but not easy, and you’ll probably need the clutch to do that. Maybe the tse and fse300r aren’t the bikes you’re looking for. If you want that you’re gonna need a solid performance bike like a ktm or beta
@@LCARSADV Thanks bro that is something I definitely needed to know. I had two conflicting comments about the TSE putting the front wheel in the air before. I wasn't so sure about the FSE300. My pit bike power wheelies with ease which makes trail riding pretty easy in certain circustances.
I know you don't have one but I'm Thinking about getting the fse 450 but I want to race it and I'm afraid to pull the trigger on it because idk if it can keep up with me and if the suspension is good enough I believe they all use the same suspension do you think it is good enough for a intermediate rider doing hair scrambles in the 450 class?
The suspension on these are not junk. It’s actually really good when setup properly. are they wp good? No. But they are good. I’ve had a couple of really good riders get off my 300 and they are really surprised at how good the suspension is. And honestly for the price of these bikes you could buy all new wp suspension and still be on top.
Did anyone else notice that the names of these bikes seem to directly correlate to their engine types (FSE = Four Stroke Engine and TSE = Two Stroke Engine)? In a Yoda voice, hmm, judge me not for my lack of intelligence. 🤣, anyway, I wanted to comment, on your comments, about the power between the two. I raced 250cc 2-strokes for years, and then switched to 450 4-strokes for years. Typically, a 2-stroke will actually have much more horse power, per cc, but in a limited RPM range (the sweet spot). A 4-stroke typically has more torque, hence when you say "grunt," you are really talking about torque. For example, one of the reasons the AMA will not let 300 or 350cc 2-stroke bikes race in MX Nationals or SX, is because they produce more than the maximum horse power allowed. Yes, 2-strokes pollute more, but with the current generation/technology of fuel injected, and computer controlled 2-strokes, that's not a huge factor, at least it shouldn't, IMHO. So, the power curve will no doubt be "longer" on the FSE, thus letting you chug it around more (better for when a rider is tired). There are several, major pro's and con's to each type of engine. 2-strokes are much cheaper to own, because of the simplicity of the engine and, like you mentioned, they are usually noticeably lighter. Great video and it did help me lean towards the FSE, because I would want to plate it and ride on the main roads, as well. Thank you very much! 👍👍 Depending on one's needs, one is better than the other, however, why not have both for the price of one Japanese/Euro bike? 😃😎🤷♂️
Dark Helmet! Love the name! Somewhere in the middle I guess. Not as plush as KTM or Beta for sure, but decent and a lot better than the Fastace they used to come with as those were stiff
The suspension is fully tunable both front and rear like any modern bike. The TSE in this video was lowered 1”, sprung and revalved for the riders weight and riding style. The end result is a near perfect balance between the fast and technical stuff.
You registered both of them in New York , I'm interested in getting one and riding trail in Lewis County requires it. Deff want to get TSE now. Thank you for being GPX pioneer in NY.
The guy on the TSE looks pretty big. Did he change his rear spring? I weight 208 with no gear and my 2021 TSE rear spring seems pretty good to me. I would like to soften the front end a little, but not sure how the adjustments work on the new forks.
Lol poor Bob. Yeah Bob did have his suspension done, not sure what exactly. I weight 180 ish and I think that’s good for the what comes with the bikes. I would totally recommend taking your bike to a suspension guy and have him adjust your clickers, it makes a huge difference! It’s all voodoo to me and having someone know what they are doing really helped
IMO, electronics and fuel injection can be a bonus, especially if you ride includes a lot of elevation changes. When my brother and I traveled the country for our race team, we almost always had to re-jet (this was before fuel injection). Again, good video and thanks.
PS: notice how your friends back tire was often slipping / losing traction? Another "side effect" of a 2-stroke. You will almost always have more traction on a 4 - stroke.
Yeah I kind of wish I had the FSE300 when I went to Utah for that reason, I didn't rejet and it was pretty boggy down low
Was this a dual sport ride you guys were doing? If so, happen to have a name of the ride? Looks like some fun trails! Thanks for any info!
We were invited there by the property owner to ride there, however I guess he does hold events there.
Overheating question: I still cannot decide between these two models, especially after riding my friends 2020 KTM 250 tpi. I liked that powerband feel but thought his bike had too much power for my skill level. I rode his old honda 250 4 stroke and we had to stop several times to let it cool down. He has a radiator fan on his KTM and never worried about overheating. Here is the question: Does the TSE need a fan? I know the FSE comes with a fan, which is great. I will be riding all over the mountains of colorado, Western Colorado, and eastern Utah (where it can get really warm) and think that this factor may sway me in a direction to finally choose.
250tpi is a sweet ride for sure. If you watch some of my other vids I took my tse out to Utah with me in 95-100 degree heat all day I some tight technical stuff and it did fine. Obviously peace of mind comes with a fan and for $100 you can add a tusk one. But no, no over heating. The fse runs way hotter if you ask me.
Like the Hondas parked in the driveway, hard to beat!
I love my Hondas! Lol
I wonder how the gas mileage improves with the Xtng electronic carburator installed. It would also limit all the elevation worries.
Yeah a couple of guys in the fb group have tried the lectron etc. those things really improve mpg for sure and do the elevation change. I’ve heard the low end suffers a little though. Maybe I’ll throw one on the tse eventually
Which one is happier to rev higher and is a better Hill climber. I'm trying to decide which one will be better at technical trails and steeper Hill climbs. Thanks
Hello-Dirt S I think the tse would be better at technical because it’s a 2 stroke and feels and rides lighter. As for hill climb that’s a tough one, I’ve never had issues with the tse on hill climbs, you just have to be on the pipe and use your clutch if your rpm drops, but the fse is a typical 4 stroke chugged and has good off the start throttle. Hill climb edge to fse and technical riding edge to tse
Do you think either could be set up out of the box to be decent on an MX track? I like to trail ride but my nearest riding areas are a couple of pretty tame MX tracks
No, these are enduro bikes with wide ratio transmissions which aren’t good for mx. they are fantastic trail and enduro bikes though
If make some sprocket change and modify the suspension for MX, they will do fine on a MX track. You could have lots of fun. Could you race competitively, no. But it’s probably 70% rider/30% bike.
Coetes de moto ✊
Can you tell me the actual weights of the two bikes...I hear the Chinese specs can be a little loosely optimistic with their numbers.
I don’t know the exact weights but I think the fse is in the 265ish realm and the tse is probably lighter
Hey great video man! Where are you and everyone else buying your GPX bikes? I emailed a dealer out in Utah and they won't get back to me about ordering one :/
Ordered both my bikes right from the website. Bob bought his from a dealer. I would just call. They are really easy to deal with
@@LCARSADV thats the thing, I did call. Talked to a guy there and he gave me an email address. I emailed and no response. I'll have to just go straight to the website and see what I can figure out.
Very odd. Ask for Gary
I wonder how much the emissions compliance forces the Japanese manufacturers hands in the way the power is on the dual sports. I do think honda should have converted the crf250l to a 300L like they did with the cbr250-300 beings it uses the same basic engine. Wondering if maybe that is why this is the last year of 250L and maybe they bring something that makes sense to the U.S. market. I bet since GPX isn't selling them as dual sports they probably don't near have to face the same scrutiny as honda. Also being a small manufacturer lets you get by with some of that just read about the Beta dual sports.
Exactly, that’s how beta and ktm get around it. But these bikes I think are mapped lean just like every other bike. I honestly don’t think making the 250l a 300 would help. It’s just not a great engine. Plus it’s still heavy with crappy suspension.
My only concern with the TSE. How often do you have to replace piston and rings?
This engine is a Yamaha dt230 which was a dual sport. I have looked at both the manual and the service manual and it doesn’t list rebuild times. This is not an engine you need to rebuild often or even think about.
@@LCARSADV Thanks for the info
I saw on a Facebook page that a guy that got one of the first TSE's was well over 100hrs on his and still going strong. Hope that helps.
How come every GPX bike review there is no good review of the power of these bikes? I want one but if my modded pit bike has more power than thats a deal breaker for me can someone for the love of god please tell me if either the FSE or the TSE have comparable performance the bikes in its class? Like is a TSE250 faster than a cr125? Can someone please answer me this question because I want to purchase one.
because you can only compare them to the bikes you've ridden. Both bikes are less powerful than their KTM/Beta counterparts, but way more powerful than a crf250l. The 300 is less powerful than the drz400 (obviously) but not crazy less as it still has lots of torque. These bikes are low maintenance performance engines so they are somewhere in the middle. It's hard to describe engine power, but if you'll notice, everyone consistently states that the engines are very linear.
@@LCARSADV Thank you for trying. I don't care if they are less powerful but I do care if they are twice as slow as their counterpart. Like a Chinese 250cc enduro is horribly slow and I was hoping it wasn't in a similar category.
Another reason I am concerned about performance is when I am on trails I like to lift the front wheel in the air when going over puddles and obstacles and I need a bike that can do that.
Micscience it is possible to do that but not easy, and you’ll probably need the clutch to do that. Maybe the tse and fse300r aren’t the bikes you’re looking for. If you want that you’re gonna need a solid performance bike like a ktm or beta
@@LCARSADV Thanks bro that is something I definitely needed to know. I had two conflicting comments about the TSE putting the front wheel in the air before. I wasn't so sure about the FSE300. My pit bike power wheelies with ease which makes trail riding pretty easy in certain circustances.
Look up WR250R vs TSE250R.
My TSE wheelies in 4th with clutch.
I know you don't have one but I'm Thinking about getting the fse 450 but I want to race it and I'm afraid to pull the trigger on it because idk if it can keep up with me and if the suspension is good enough I believe they all use the same suspension do you think it is good enough for a intermediate rider doing hair scrambles in the 450 class?
The suspension on these are not junk. It’s actually really good when setup properly. are they wp good? No. But they are good. I’ve had a couple of really good riders get off my 300 and they are really surprised at how good the suspension is. And honestly for the price of these bikes you could buy all new wp suspension and still be on top.
I sold my GPX because the suspension is stiff stock . Test a Japanese bike they don’t cost much more . China bikes ? Not good enough yet .
Did anyone else notice that the names of these bikes seem to directly correlate to their engine types (FSE = Four Stroke Engine and TSE = Two Stroke Engine)? In a Yoda voice, hmm, judge me not for my lack of intelligence. 🤣, anyway, I wanted to comment, on your comments, about the power between the two. I raced 250cc 2-strokes for years, and then switched to 450 4-strokes for years. Typically, a 2-stroke will actually have much more horse power, per cc, but in a limited RPM range (the sweet spot). A 4-stroke typically has more torque, hence when you say "grunt," you are really talking about torque. For example, one of the reasons the AMA will not let 300 or 350cc 2-stroke bikes race in MX Nationals or SX, is because they produce more than the maximum horse power allowed. Yes, 2-strokes pollute more, but with the current generation/technology of fuel injected, and computer controlled 2-strokes, that's not a huge factor, at least it shouldn't, IMHO. So, the power curve will no doubt be "longer" on the FSE, thus letting you chug it around more (better for when a rider is tired). There are several, major pro's and con's to each type of engine. 2-strokes are much cheaper to own, because of the simplicity of the engine and, like you mentioned, they are usually noticeably lighter. Great video and it did help me lean towards the FSE, because I would want to plate it and ride on the main roads, as well. Thank you very much! 👍👍
Depending on one's needs, one is better than the other, however, why not have both for the price of one Japanese/Euro bike? 😃😎🤷♂️
I love having both! The 2 is more "fun" though, but I like the torque of the 300. If I wanted a tru dual sport, I might lean towards the 450
@@LCARSADV I was thinking the same. Thanks!
Have you ridden the 450? Wondering if it’s worth the extra 1500$ or so also does the 300 have enough power to power wheelie over obstacles ?
I have not, but I would imagine it wheelies easier. The 300 will power wheelie but it requires a little effort
How is the suspension? Mainly the front forks...Plush or MX stiff?
Dark Helmet! Love the name! Somewhere in the middle I guess. Not as plush as KTM or Beta for sure, but decent and a lot better than the Fastace they used to come with as those were stiff
The suspension is fully tunable both front and rear like any modern bike. The TSE in this video was lowered 1”, sprung and revalved for the riders weight and riding style. The end result is a near perfect balance between the fast and technical stuff.