How to Build an Epic Work Desk for Under $75 | Custom All Wood Desktop

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  • Опубліковано 19 лис 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 740

  • @TheEverGreen84
    @TheEverGreen84 4 роки тому +1275

    That's the straightest, flattest board I've ever seen from Home Deopt.

    • @nightstringers
      @nightstringers 4 роки тому +7

      yeah.

    • @ShakaCollectsAZ
      @ShakaCollectsAZ 4 роки тому +7

      agreed

    • @nobytes2
      @nobytes2 4 роки тому +36

      Pine wood boards are usually flat. Now if you pick common boards then yeah gonna be crook af.

    • @ABrokenSociety
      @ABrokenSociety 4 роки тому +35

      If you live in a humid area, you're not going to find very straight and flat wood in home shops, You'd have to go to a specialty lumber store to get those since they keep them stored in different ways. Humidity gets to wood and bows and twists it according to the grain it was cut at. So that could also be a huge factor!

    • @hungrythundr4892
      @hungrythundr4892 4 роки тому +31

      yep, just like my ex.

  • @ButImThebee
    @ButImThebee 4 роки тому +169

    So I built this entire desk without any of those extra tools. I used a DRILL, Tape Measure and just sand paper and screws. It all is up to you and how crafty you can be! My desk turned out gorgeous!

    • @codacreator6162
      @codacreator6162 4 роки тому +6

      I tried making another design from 2x12 lumber... My first project. Didn't know anything about green wood, moisture content, or that a box store can sell pipe wood and call it "prime." Needless to say, it would make a great substitute like raft, but as a desk it's pretty bad. Looks like I'll either get a lot craftier with planing/jointing w/o planer or jointer or stick to plywood...

    • @ButImThebee
      @ButImThebee 4 роки тому +5

      @@codacreator6162 I wish I could take a photo of my desk and how it came out... because its gorgeous!

    • @kliether33
      @kliether33 3 роки тому +4

      @@codacreator6162 Get a hand plane! You can flatten the world with a good jack plane and some determination.

    • @sharkbear9570
      @sharkbear9570 3 роки тому

      What did you do to supplement the pocket hole jig?

    • @ButImThebee
      @ButImThebee 3 роки тому +7

      @@sharkbear9570 I figured out the angel and than made cardboard for the angel needed and used that as a guide.

  • @waltofalltrades6817
    @waltofalltrades6817 4 роки тому +361

    "The first coat especially doesn't get that dark." *proceeds to use what looks like black paint*

    • @soultheory8441
      @soultheory8441 4 роки тому +4

      Walt of All Trades it was wet, what do you expect

    • @HaploPrime
      @HaploPrime 3 роки тому +1

      It's stain. You put it on and it absorbs into the wood and you wipe it off.

  • @denishp1985
    @denishp1985 4 роки тому +10

    Thanks for posting this video. Will be making similar desk soon. I don’t know why people are complaining about the cost of the tools you use regardless of what the materials cost. Every one freaking knows that you have to invest in tools to make stuff faster. Great video. Great looking desk.

    • @GreenLightLife1
      @GreenLightLife1  4 роки тому +5

      Thank you so much. The negativity is unfortunately just part of UA-cam. Thanks breaking the mold 👊🏼

    • @vivimu
      @vivimu 3 роки тому

      I paid a retired guy i found on Facebook swap shop 20 bucks to cut the round ends off my 2x12s and he did some slot tongue and groove thingies so the boards fit into each other and I glued and put it together.

  • @iwanhaniyoto
    @iwanhaniyoto 4 роки тому +20

    I made 2 of the same tables for 2 computers at a cost under 10 dollars, all with recycled wood.
    It took it $10 costs to buying nails, screws and black paint.
    And I'm very satisfied.

  • @mr.rocket9306
    @mr.rocket9306 4 роки тому +77

    Had to go back to the store to get a tape measure... Still haven't continued to build.

  • @kyore789
    @kyore789 4 роки тому +54

    This is perfect, all I needed to know was how to make a solid table top. time to go steal my dads shop for a bit.

  • @jsdevtom
    @jsdevtom 3 роки тому +123

    "we're gonna try to keep this build under $75" *proceeds to use $6919.89 worth of equipment*

    • @matthewabela2305
      @matthewabela2305 3 роки тому +1

      Don’t know where you are in the world, but in oz it only cost me about $70 Australian to hire all the equipment

    • @thegreat4954
      @thegreat4954 3 роки тому +6

      @@matthewabela2305 So just buy a nice $145 desk

    • @Palpatine4Senate
      @Palpatine4Senate 3 роки тому

      @@thegreat4954 wtf

    • @zyphe
      @zyphe 2 роки тому +6

      Lol how much do you think a circular saw and drill costs?

    • @jsdevtom
      @jsdevtom 2 роки тому

      @@zyphe lol, you clearly are blind and deaf if you didn't see all the other equipment. Or mentally challenged.

  • @Tailgatesntoolboxes
    @Tailgatesntoolboxes 5 місяців тому

    Hi. I built this desk today...did basically everything you did but mine was 20 inches by 48 inches . the legs from home depot are awesome. Ty for doing this. I hope all is well

  • @Cymanytb
    @Cymanytb 2 роки тому

    The fact that your edge sharpener tool made some notes that went well with the music is amazing.

  • @feitanthegoat
    @feitanthegoat 2 роки тому

    I like how he tells us if we dont have a specific tool or something that it is not a big deal so that it won't stop us from doing it. I really like it man 🤝🏼

  • @lieferic9
    @lieferic9 3 роки тому

    A sick desk is the sign of a clean mind.

  • @kinnn9258
    @kinnn9258 4 роки тому +92

    who’s here for working at home/ online school and there’s no desks in stock near you :(

    • @no_not_that_one_again
      @no_not_that_one_again 4 роки тому

      Ours were supposed to be delivered today. Just called in and they said "sorry, backordered until mid-October!".

    • @kinnn9258
      @kinnn9258 4 роки тому

      Nanocephalic wow!

    • @JustBeREAL1st
      @JustBeREAL1st 4 роки тому

      Nanocephalic can’t find anything worth buying

    • @no_not_that_one_again
      @no_not_that_one_again 4 роки тому

      JustBeREAL we repurposed our dining room table and put some Elmer’s Tri-Fold Display Boards to separate the kids. They can decorate them and it’s working well enough.

    • @codacreator6162
      @codacreator6162 4 роки тому

      Everybody and their brother has desks for sale on OfferUp in my neck of the woods. If you're making desks to sell, make them special... Or, pick up an old desk from OU and refinish it. That's a cool project, you'll get a desk finished the way you like and possibly a money-making opportunity when this thing peters out.

  • @patrickwest5494
    @patrickwest5494 3 роки тому +4

    This is the best one out there! I love how you break it down from milling to gaps in the jointing for the farmhouse look

    • @SuckyMike
      @SuckyMike 2 роки тому

      I just found this channel. This guy is legit

  • @loganmisejka1341
    @loganmisejka1341 2 роки тому

    Thats right first time watching any of your video I'm 57 seconds "don't forget your Fedora" just met me dream UA-camr!!

  • @jonahsheppard4202
    @jonahsheppard4202 4 роки тому +40

    Him: Use a credit card or paint scraper.
    Later at the pharmacy: sir why is there glue on your credit card

  • @tzarius78
    @tzarius78 3 дні тому

    I also would look into cerusing. Now you can paint and pull up grains for beautiful looks.

  • @jenningsguitarscompany1730
    @jenningsguitarscompany1730 Рік тому

    That green in your back ground looks sooo epic!

  • @marcosmyros
    @marcosmyros 3 роки тому +25

    When he didn't just use his finger to spread the glue....... I learned all I needed to know about him.

    • @jrAndThings
      @jrAndThings 3 роки тому +2

      I cringed when I saw him spread the glue

  • @BenG123
    @BenG123 4 роки тому +10

    Nice tutorial. Getting more into woodworking these days and followed your video for the most part. Used 2.25 inch black square steel for the legs and it came out beautiful. Thank you.

  • @pynpotha
    @pynpotha Рік тому

    Whata brilliant Teacher you are 🫡 Much appreciated Sir 🇱🇰

  • @brittscreativevibezdiy
    @brittscreativevibezdiy 4 роки тому +5

    Thank you so much! Absolutely love this video. I have been looking a office desk online for the last few days and I decided to google build your own office desk and your video was perfect to watch.

  • @jonalano
    @jonalano Рік тому +4

    Thanks for the tutorial video. Built my first desk according to your advice and I love how it turned out!

  • @st3218
    @st3218 10 місяців тому

    I learned a trick to keep sanding smooth: draw on the surface with a carpenter pencil, just lines covering the surface and sand the pencil lines off. Then you're not spending too much time in one spot going too deep.

  • @maz_mtb3266
    @maz_mtb3266 4 роки тому +2

    One thing I'd mention is how lumber sizes work, that a 2x10 truly isn't a 2x10 like you pointed in the video. May not seem like a big deal, but if you are trying to design a piece of furniture to specific dimensions, that will come in to play at some point in the project.

    • @kylebrenner2929
      @kylebrenner2929 2 роки тому

      Yeah, figure out what you need ahead of time. If you can't rip the board at home, you can rip it at home depot when you buy it.

  • @ZackofAllTradesct
    @ZackofAllTradesct 2 роки тому +1

    Loved your energy and your down to earth instructions. Thanks Brotha.

  • @Xphantomgamer
    @Xphantomgamer 3 роки тому

    I never though Joji would teach me how to build a desk

  • @achillesbuilds2432
    @achillesbuilds2432 3 роки тому +3

    Biscuit joiner helps to connect them as well. Also running them through a plainer helps create a flat surface as well. I have a build in mind. I can't start it until I clear the garage out some more to "complete" my wood shop. I'm just watching videos bc I'm excited about starting the project lol.

  • @SoftwareJournal
    @SoftwareJournal 3 роки тому

    Looks better than my table. I saw after making mine and I wish I had a way to keep the lumbar flush on each other.

  • @andrewluberto
    @andrewluberto 3 роки тому +10

    This desk is absolutely beautiful and I’m going to make it for myself soon can’t wait !!

  • @ramonbannister9498
    @ramonbannister9498 4 роки тому

    Nice one. Prices for supplies went straight through the roof. Legs are $44. For the wood, I went to my local Home Depot and found out they don't even sell pine planks of that size unless it's pressure treated. They only sell fir which is more expensive. We're talking $70ish just for the wood. And that's not including the pre-stain and stain. I could easily spend $100+. It's possible I looked at the wrong bays for the wood. But so far, w/ all the how-to videos I've seen, I'm armed w/ enough info to build a desk. This video is the best/easiest, so my design for the top will be based on this one.

  • @strykeback1
    @strykeback1 3 роки тому

    Oh a wood guy and a gun guy I love it!. Was just looking for videos for ideas on building an audio mixing desk that I could put between two custom dressers so it fits on the bedroom. Subscribed!

  • @camerongainer1638
    @camerongainer1638 Рік тому

    Love this and gonna make it! But WHERE DID YOU GET THOSE OVERALLS!?

  • @MSH3423
    @MSH3423 3 роки тому

    Sir.... You have full wood working shop👌

  • @MikeJohnson-dr2tu
    @MikeJohnson-dr2tu 3 роки тому

    If anyone is watching this and notices this comment . Do yourself a favor and invest in a biscuit joiner for your tabletop . I've built them with pocket screws and recently purchased a biscuit joiner and they both work , BUT it's been my experience that the sanding process is much faster and easier without the pocket screws . I may have over tightened the screws which caused the top to bow too ?? The last one I made was with the joiner and it turned out awesome . If you have a Harbor Freight near you theses biscuit joiners are pretty cheap . Buy a better quality one if this is something that you're going to be doing a lot of , but if you're just building a few things that have tops on them the cheaper one works fine .

  • @thatoneperson256
    @thatoneperson256 4 роки тому +1

    Made this desk the other day at 7 foot and turned out great! Used black iron pipe for the legs though.

    • @live2paybills
      @live2paybills 4 роки тому

      Did you have any wobble... how to avoid wobble

    • @vivimu
      @vivimu 3 роки тому

      @@live2paybills if using pipe just turn the pipe in the threads until your level

  • @VicNight
    @VicNight 4 роки тому +3

    the wood looked very good, natural, I almost cried when he painted it

    • @GreenLightLife1
      @GreenLightLife1  4 роки тому

      Haha it was just stain. It went on really dark like paint but you wipe it off and it still retains all the wood grain. Just makes it a little darker. But if you like it that natural color, just use a polyurethane top coat or something to protect the wood and it’ll still look the same after.

  • @JoshuaMSchroeder
    @JoshuaMSchroeder 3 роки тому

    Thanks for the video, I think I am going to do this to make a desk for my office with some cool glass see-through setups for a monitor underneath.

  • @freeus6085
    @freeus6085 2 роки тому

    Good stuff man. Thank you for this, I'm building a custom live edge desk for my studio and looking through tips and this was a good quality video. Nice camera angles music/sound/ lighting, very professional content bro kudos 👏 👌

  • @sabio234
    @sabio234 4 роки тому +10

    If only I had the tools to work on it and a place to all this !

  • @TheBlacSumrfs
    @TheBlacSumrfs 4 роки тому

    Yo that table top is fire

  • @krislol6782
    @krislol6782 2 роки тому

    wow dude you've inspired me to try it myself thanks! the finished product looks awesome

  • @glendagilner3438
    @glendagilner3438 2 роки тому

    I enjoyed watching this. Very simple and I believe that I can build one for myself. Thank's dude👍

  • @tzarius78
    @tzarius78 3 дні тому

    If going to flatten with a planar you will need a sled that is flat or it will push the board down. Or use a jointer to flatten.

  • @abdomination
    @abdomination 4 роки тому +1

    Wow that is awesome. After I get my garage fixed up a bit I will totally do something like this. I'm getting my starter tools delivered from Home Depot soon and now I need a router haha.

  • @youngphoenix1915
    @youngphoenix1915 3 роки тому +1

    super clean and seems fairly simple. im up for it

  • @RyanDimal
    @RyanDimal 4 роки тому +2

    That's awesome, didn't know you could just buy legs. Thank you.

    • @Brandorando
      @Brandorando 4 роки тому

      @@g2jxGhF5G8z1gL7S having that same struggle now. I found everything else and we just get ripped on the legs.

  • @traciebarrass6612
    @traciebarrass6612 4 роки тому +3

    This looks like a piece of cake no frame or legs, I’m so going to be doing this. Thank you 😊

  • @nightstringers
    @nightstringers 4 роки тому

    One word..AWESOME

  • @Febrezerr
    @Febrezerr 2 роки тому

    This is yellow pine right? Is it a good wood to build a desk out of? Pine is a fairly cheap lumber and sometimes very durable,

  • @nike33ws
    @nike33ws 2 роки тому +1

    Awesome video, thanks! I just built mine and it looks great but wondering if I should put a clear coat protective lacquer over the final coat of stains once it’s dried. Did you do that?

  • @lorenzoboiko
    @lorenzoboiko 3 роки тому

    Very good video, very professional!!

  • @EveryDayGuyStuff
    @EveryDayGuyStuff 8 місяців тому

    Good stuff, I just started working on this as well.

  • @Josh-sp1qn
    @Josh-sp1qn 4 роки тому +4

    I'm going to try and follow this for a corner desk - aw yeah. Thanks man!

  • @wanderandreel
    @wanderandreel 3 роки тому

    definitely gonna do this, love the video

  • @goatsnaggler
    @goatsnaggler 3 роки тому

    Looks very well done.
    what would you quote a table that was 36 inches tall
    and also to ship to Chanute,KS

  • @Absorb81
    @Absorb81 4 роки тому +1

    Great video showing people how they don't need to have all the top-dollar equipment to make a solid build.

  • @TsunamisZone
    @TsunamisZone 4 роки тому +2

    What did you put on after the wood stain?

  • @Bruh-mg5ff
    @Bruh-mg5ff 4 роки тому +1

    This is a good video and it’s so cheap compared to IKEA desks. I also feel like this desk will hold up longer and be sturdy

    • @shouldent
      @shouldent 3 роки тому

      Yeah it might be cheap materials, but do you have all the expensive tools?

    • @maeeeolszyk9493
      @maeeeolszyk9493 2 роки тому

      @@shouldent To be fair you don’t need all the tools, you can get away with using a hacksaw, screw driver, and just sandpaper along with the actual required “ingredients”

  • @eyeflip1
    @eyeflip1 4 роки тому

    Just a stain no top coat? I used a pre stained butcher block counter top from lowes. The acacia wood with spice stain and put 3 coats of Arm-n-seal on top. Mounted it to a Autonomous smart desk 2 DIY base and it came out great!

  • @lettuce965
    @lettuce965 4 роки тому +30

    He looks like the guy from the lorax

  • @ChristieAnnMusic
    @ChristieAnnMusic 4 роки тому +5

    Very cool. I want to build a custom music production desk. Will use this tut, thanks!

  • @jackhartle863
    @jackhartle863 Рік тому

    these boards look exquisite where did you get your wood

  • @rafaelsosa7314
    @rafaelsosa7314 4 роки тому

    No te conozco, no termine de ver el video, pero esa intro merece un like.

  • @davidrock3936
    @davidrock3936 4 роки тому

    Thats a nice looking top! With that being said, the legs and the way they attach to that soft wood makes me nervous. I would think this desk would be 'rickety' because of it. Maybe highlight another video on how to build a solid (cheap) base that would add some support?

    • @peterraih29
      @peterraih29 4 роки тому

      Great video. Right, like how sturdy/wobbly is it with those legs from HD?

  • @RotsenTeleVision
    @RotsenTeleVision 3 роки тому

    Nice now i gotta go buy a bunch of tools

  • @xCaPz
    @xCaPz 3 роки тому +1

    When you do pocket holes like that how do you know what length screws to use? How do you know the screw won’t push out to the other side when going in at that angle?

    • @mr_KLOB
      @mr_KLOB 3 роки тому

      Use 2 1/2" softwood pocket holes. Set the drill bit for drilling into 1 1/2" thick wood.

  • @50PieceMatt
    @50PieceMatt 4 роки тому

    Just finished mine the same way in the video and man it looks good

  • @danielgonzalez2582
    @danielgonzalez2582 2 роки тому

    Congrats for your channel!! Awesome content... this one and your other channel as well, Veritasium, cool stuff.

  • @angelmc747
    @angelmc747 4 роки тому +303

    "these are the tools you'll need"
    *Proceeds to use other tools not on that list*

    • @GreenLightLife1
      @GreenLightLife1  4 роки тому +46

      😂😂 you right, you right. But I tried to give options to do it as minimally as possible as well.

    • @JonLake
      @JonLake 4 роки тому +16

      Just use sand paper a 6 foot level and a circular saw next time. Its about the cheapest but most usefull tool to get started on any wood projects. I'd also suggest that you show how to do pocket holes without the jig. Not everyone know how to make this kind of thing 🤷

    • @ButImThebee
      @ButImThebee 4 роки тому +3

      So I built this entire desk without any of those tools. I used a DRILL, Tape Measure and just sand paper and screws. It all is up to you and how crafty you can be! My desk turned out gorgeous!

    • @nobytes2
      @nobytes2 4 роки тому +8

      Just use your hands, a hammer, and brute force, be a man for once!

    • @L3GITFIXIE
      @L3GITFIXIE 4 роки тому +2

      cmon lol give him a break, hes just givin you the bare necessities but since he has specific tools to make it look better why wouldn't he use em.

  • @g.blacksheep525
    @g.blacksheep525 Рік тому +1

    Can you make a video with epoxy? I wanted to paint something on my desk

  • @mayacarney2809
    @mayacarney2809 3 роки тому

    can you share the link to the type of wood you bought from home depot?

  • @ReveredDead
    @ReveredDead 3 роки тому +1

    Bro I worked at home depot and I have never seen such straight and flat lumber. And I worked as a supervisor in Lumber and we can never get straight 2 x 10's, 12 and 20 footers in orders. The 2 x 4's were much worse. What store did you go to so I can commend the lumber department there.

  • @MegaTmoore11
    @MegaTmoore11 4 роки тому +11

    if you dont want the hassle of trying to screw/glue 2x10s or 2x12s together you can also use butcher block counter tops.

    • @davidrock3936
      @davidrock3936 4 роки тому

      I just bought a birch butcher block top for a different purpose. These cost 100's of dollars for just the top. Big difference from the $70.00 build that is shown here.

    • @MegaTmoore11
      @MegaTmoore11 4 роки тому

      @@davidrock3936 I didn't say anything about it being under a certain amount just that it was another option

  • @ethanbruh3476
    @ethanbruh3476 4 роки тому

    I only have boards that are 1 inch thick.. it’s only 4 foot long though. Would the 1 i ch be enough? I plan on adding wooden supports to the top and the legs.

  • @mmmtvmounting813
    @mmmtvmounting813 4 роки тому +11

    Hey, what type and size nails did you use to connect the 2x10

  • @cheeseymccheese7249
    @cheeseymccheese7249 4 роки тому

    Thats pretty nice fella, good job

  • @NewYears1978
    @NewYears1978 21 день тому

    I was going to buy a butcher block (done it before) but they are like $400. This would be like $30 (+ legs and stuff). I thin kit looks just as good really. Maybe I will go this route! I am just bad at pocket holes it always seems to split the board or I get the angle wrong or something.

  • @jaysmith2151
    @jaysmith2151 3 роки тому

    Thank you sir I hope I can build the same desk.

  • @zacharycochran1584
    @zacharycochran1584 4 роки тому

    You deserve more subs man.

  • @kirylchetyrbak6542
    @kirylchetyrbak6542 3 роки тому +1

    Hi. Did you apply any clear coat? I used same wood finish and it comes off onto my hands, even after 24 hours

  • @diyfusionhelp472
    @diyfusionhelp472 4 роки тому

    For the similar looking table
    get Sanded pine plywood $20
    sand paper $5
    4 ikea table legs $20
    $55 + no tolls = table
    apply leather vinyl or wood vinyl $12 from amazon.

    • @SomeTechGuy666
      @SomeTechGuy666 Рік тому

      Plywood isn't nearly as strong as those 2x10s. It will sag. And have you price out thick plywood lately ?

  • @bobp5523
    @bobp5523 2 роки тому

    Can you tell me what sized roundover bit you used for the edges?
    I have a desk with a sharp edge that's hard on my hands. I tried attaching 1/2 inch quarter round molding to the edge, but the feel is still not right. Thanks.

  • @Reblwitoutacause
    @Reblwitoutacause 3 роки тому

    That intro? Instantly liked and subbed.

  • @rango_unchained
    @rango_unchained 3 роки тому +1

    What length of pocket-hole screw did you use?

  • @ryanh6473
    @ryanh6473 2 роки тому +1

    Ryan Bergara’s doppelgänger

  • @fabian_ftn6604
    @fabian_ftn6604 3 роки тому

    How much weight can something like this support Im tjinking about maki g it for my gaming pc

  • @abanoubrafat6862
    @abanoubrafat6862 2 роки тому

    can you give me the link for legs that you used to made this table

  • @ivopellei8802
    @ivopellei8802 Рік тому

    Where do you get the metal legs? Sorry if I missed it.

  • @chompachangas
    @chompachangas 3 роки тому

    Holy crap. I really could have used a pocket jig more times than I can count.

  • @dannowaso
    @dannowaso 2 роки тому

    I like this desk. I'm just wondering why several desk builders use more than one board and clamp them together instead of buying one big board and sand it like the one in this video? Is it cost? Availability? Sturdiness? All of the above? Thank you!

  • @frmtheden
    @frmtheden 4 роки тому

    Definitely using this for my new PC setup for my music studio! Thanks!

  • @audreycardona3437
    @audreycardona3437 3 роки тому

    dude amazing video

  • @1RungAtATime
    @1RungAtATime 4 роки тому +3

    This video inspired me...to just use a door for my desk top.

    • @Dreamst8r
      @Dreamst8r 4 роки тому +1

      aint a bad idea tbh

  • @WCxColosus
    @WCxColosus Рік тому

    I plan on building something similar but in an L shape desk. Would you suggest any extra support or will the screws and glue be enough to keep it from bowing. Not gonna put anything crazy heavy but i just want to make sure no extra support is needed

  • @cassiecurtis1673
    @cassiecurtis1673 2 роки тому

    What size screws would be best for this project? This will be my first time building something on my own.

  • @UnitedRedDevil13
    @UnitedRedDevil13 3 роки тому

    Nice table. What size screws for the pocket holes and besides the pockets holes/screws at 2” from each end, how often in between? Thanks.

  • @astrofiggy2321
    @astrofiggy2321 3 роки тому

    moving to a new house need a new desk for my pc never done wood working aand i really want to try to make my own but im nervous

  • @AceofDlamonds
    @AceofDlamonds 3 роки тому

    incredible.

  • @amalgamated6448
    @amalgamated6448 Рік тому

    What type of screws did you use? And how long were they?