Had a Range Rover on order for 30 months! I cancelled the order two weeks ago after JLR insurance declined me. I have a clean licence. So JLR will sell me a car but won’t insure me. Make your own mind up on the CEO’s claims.
Great work Richard . If Land Rover say it’s car not high theft why do their own insurer refuse or charge as much as main stream. All smoke and mirrors .
Because it’s said to be provided by LV. They are not just gonna ignore the risks and give people cheap insurance premiums. Also the CEO only quoted figures for “latest” Range Rover.
The fact that Land Rover “provide/back” an insurance proposition for its customer that refuses on mass to ensure is ludicrous. They shouldn’t have their badge all over it
@@davidgirvan6007 mine is a 2023 RRS where the CEO has confirmed few thefts of these . So LR insurer must be ignoring this data as no cheaper than other insurers . He mentions how many quotes done which is different to number of cars underwritten by LR insurer
Thanks for the update. Keep up the great work Richard, JLR simply cannot blame the insurance industry in general when their own insurance refuses to cover their own Range Rovers
Hi Richard thank you so much for the work you’re doing for us Land Rover owners.I purchased a 2017 Range Rover Vogue in June 2021 for £42000.Ive just had the car valued at £21000 and my insurance has tripled.
There have been reports in the press/media of JLR spending money on helping owners. Not once has anyone mentioned that they would have done the square root of zero if it were not for you. JLR are using this as a publicity stunt making out THEY were the ones who were concerned about people's cars and doing this proactively and out of the good of their heart. Us subscribers to your channel know the truth.
I have just received my insurance renewal from Footman James that covers my 4 classic cars with agreed valuations along with my 2022 Velar diesel. I'm delighted to report my premium only went up by £300 from last year. One happy chap 👍🙃
I own a 2014 SDV8 Autobiography with Trackstar fitted. My insurance went from £450 per annum to £2k! Went on JLR’s own insurance, they wouldn’t quote me! The cars lost £10k in its value in less than one year! JLR MUST redesign the key reading issue & recall ALL vehicles to end this known issue once & for all, OR they will go bankrupt!
Percentage wise the ford has a lot more vehicles on the road I believe the ratio of cars on the road to thefts is under 1% the Range Rover is considerably higher percentage wise, just another example of stats been manipulated, JLR insist my vehicle had the security update in 2022 what is the latest update ref, I do not trust JLR at all, I am also another customer who they would not insure, keep up the good work.👍🏼
Glad you mentioned about PINs for vehicles. Seems the easiest system. Good enough for bank cards and log ins. Assume its just too simple for JLR to comprehend. Think JLR are stuck in " we know best " scenario.
Hi Richard, you already know that I am a fan of your content ( RR ) reference your fuel station thefts, I use Shell, fill & go, it’s done via your mobile phone, and you never actually leave your vehicle. It doesn’t resolve going in to get a sandwich, but for fuelling only it’s a good system. The bonus is no queuing to pay, you just fill up your tank and then drive off. Keep going with your campaign, you are doing a great job and a fantastic service.
Hi Richard. keep up the great work, you are doing a super job for all of us Landy owners. I do find this insurance thing such a farse, i have a new Defender 110 HardTop on order, my current insurance company wont cover it. I did a search engine comparison and it came out at around £1500 for the year, I guess cheap compared to some of your viewers quotes but still in my opinion expensive for a middle aged chap with no points living in Cornwall. I was then intrigued to get some more quotes on other Land Rover Models, I found a reg for a 2022 Range Rover Sport, this came out cheaper at £1200. I then went on to do a quote for a Defender 110 525bhp V8 that my local deal had, 100k car, double the power of my 110, the premium was nearly half price at £800... Go figure ??? I think they just pluck a figure out of the sky :(
Hi Richard, 2017 Vogue 4.4 SE. Following my letter to JLR, CEO. Adrian Mardell, I had a call from a PA at his office I was hoping that JLR might do something for us older model owners, I had suggested a continued free subscription to Landrover remote. Unfortunately, I got a blunt NO.
Was the CEO also stamping his feet when he spat his dummy out! Group insurance or group action, but there’s now a real sense that something is about to happen in this war of words. Kudos to you.
Richard, many thanks for your time effort and professionalism on this project. You are objective and more importantly holding JLR accountable. It’s becoming clear in my eyes that as an owner of a 17 plate RRS you’re the only hope I have of lower premiums and in turn hopefully returning some capital back to the shrinking residuals of these beautiful cars. On the upside at least it’s taken the spotlight away from their reliability issues 😊 Keep up the good work, the LR community is extremely lucky to have you championing this battle for us.
Quick update from me - insurance quotes floating around £2400 (up from £900) last year for my 69 plate RRS, Direct Line refusing to insure. I also made enquiries to 2 BMW dealer groups looking for a part-exchange value for my car against an X5 45e and a 5 series - both dealerships took my details, car info, mileage etc - neither have got back to me. Clearly they wont touch Range Rover Sports. I'll probably have to suck it up and pay the ridiculous insurance price, but please relay this to JLR - I'll never buy another one of their cars, and I'm warning all my mates to steer well clear.
Hi there CTR, I've posted a few times on your LR videos - I've now had my insurance renewal on my 69 plate RRS - up to £2800 from £900 last year. Shopping around, the best deal I can get right now is £2,400. Weirdly, when I did a comparison a week ago, I got as low as £1,800. Either way, it's between 2 and 3 times what I paid last year, with a car a year older and much less valuable. As a result, I'm probably going to have to sell it - I just can't justify paying that much just to insure it. I'll probably swap out to a BMW X5 45e, which by comparison is coming in at £1,400 for insurance. I do hope in future there is a class action against JLR because this issue has probably cost me in the region of £10,000 in lost value, for a problem they've known about for many years, and until recently refused to openly admit.
Thanks for the update Richard, adding to the BBC interview. I ran a DB11 for a year, sold it back to the dealership for the same money, then moved to the Autobiography where after a year I am best part of £30k negative equity, I am waiting for my insurance renewal now with everything crossed that it will be a reasonable number - keep up the good work
On another issue, I saw JLR pre tax profits for the Quarter to Dec 2023 were £627M. Possibly boosted by the sales of replacements for stolen vehicles you touched on, paid for by Insurance company payouts of course. 🤔 it puts the £10M investment in their “security enhancement” into perspective!
The problem is that jlr are not taking into consideration % of cars being stolen, yes the fiesta is stolen more, but out of a total % on the road they are a lot lower.
Liked your point about PIN CODES to secure a car ! Perhaps facial recognition too! They can do it easily for phones - why not cars! Or even use the phone as the key!? Keep going Richard you’re doing sterling work!
JLR's own insurance will not even give me a quote for my 2021 car. The irony here is that I live a few miles from JLR's Solihull factory. I'm 59 year old professional with >10 years NCB and a clean licence. If JLR are serious, they need to address this.
Hi Richard, I tried again but I still cannot get a Range Rover Sport Autobiography insured despite being a model driver. For context my Porsche cost £600 Pa to insure. So despite wanting to buy this car I cannot not even JLR will insure me.🤯 absolutely maddening.
3;58 a JLR dealer told me different and that was months ago 5k a year is still stupid on insurance i pay 1200 on a f type v8 r THANKS for taking the time to do this and inform people
No chance of this being sorted by May. 18 months to 2 years is my guess and possibly never. The insurance companies will make as much as they can for as long as they can.
Thank you Richard keep pushing please my insurance in due April am just hoping I can get insurance and afford it. I really don’t get why insurance won’t offer third party if there worried about theft
Whilst JLR may have not done themselves any great favours lately, I honestly feel we're yelling at the wrong people. This whole issue is about crime not cars. What we're experiencing is a predictable breakdown of law and order. We expect JLR to manufacture and sell cars and they do just that, good ones. We also expect our police and criminal justice system to to prevent crime and punish offenders, they don't. You can fit all the security you like to a car but a determined thief can always lift it onto a trailer and be off with it. The people stealing these vehicles are career criminals, it's how they make their living. They don't steal one car and retire, they go on stealing as long as it's profitable to do so. Catching car thieves not only stops them stealing, it frequently leads to recovery of previously stolen vehicles and potentially further arrests. Catch enough of them and you ruin their career prospects. New locks and keys is simply treating the symptoms and ignoring the disease. I'd like to hear someone from Westminster come on here and explain to us why theft has ceased to be a criminal offence and become a technical challenge for industry.
But why aren't Audi, Mercs and BMW's SUV's being stolen in the same numbers, I can't see they are any less attractive to the thieves, so they must be harder to steal?
That’s not true they are targeting RR because they are simple to steal. Fit the ghost or a driveway pole and it won’t be stolen. There will always be car thieves in the Uk
Thanks for the update Richard again. I experienced the locking issue with mine last year in a carpark. I’d unlocked the boot to get something out now. I’m not exactly sure what happened, but I inadvertently pressed the close button again whilst it was closing that stopped the boot in its tracks and I can’t quite remember if I had to close it manually. I then went to lock the car and it would not lock I started the car I stopped the car. It still would not lock. The only way it would lock was when I pressed the button on the handle. And that seemed to sort it. To be fair, I’ve never had a problem since and that was last summer. On the Insurance side of things, I think it would be good for you to get a database or get some samples of what people are paying today i.e. model age, postcode type of insurance, e.g. full business or SDP, age, driving, history/points etc. Appreciate that a shed load of work unless you had a shared space where people could go in and enter their details as I may have mentioned and for what it’s worth. I’m in a March 2023 range Rover 300 SE diesel 16 K miles per annum full business one four-year-old SP30, one fault claim in 2022 postcode is WN8 I’m 57 full no claims protected wife on policy too as second driver, in August last year I renewed at £2400 per annum fully comprehensive. I thought that was extortionate! And then I started hearing about other who were getting 4,5,6,7,8, 9,10 K quotes! that’s on the multicar policy. My building insurance has gone to them and we have three cars on that policy. Obviously the £2400 is for the range Rover. Only. Please feel free to use this info if it is of any use to you and as you see fit. Interested to see what your insurance company is going to come up with that would be pretty awesome. If the theft of the new range rovers are as low as JLR suggesting there is no reason for them to be quoting you 5KPA that is frankly ridiculous. If you need a helper I’m happy to chat. I’m livid about this stuff.
Great stuff - last one. Wouldn’t it be great to know if you can’t get a quote from JLR insurance - I was one of those - why not? What’s the reason AND if you’ve gone to the trouble of installing Ghost for example (not withstanding any warranty risks although I have heard of dealers encouraging it!) why is that not recognised - it def makes theft a lot harder. I’ll shut up now!!!
Well done ....keep it up ! I drew a blank when trying to find out if my 21 velar would need an update. No one would or could tell me. I feel JLR are talking doublespeak.
Yesterday I received my Landover insurance renewal Doc I have been with JLR insurance on my Evoque from new 2016. It is now under written by Wrisk transfer limited last year it was LV, I had to phone the call centre and basically they refused to insure my vehicle as my circumstances has changed, they will not tell me what changes basically they don't like my postcode CM which is Essex but only 15 miles from Suffolk. Luckily I contacted LV and they will insure my car but it has gone up by £150. The CEO of JLR saying they will insure vehicle through there insurance is rubbish dot think I will buy another cant trust them.
Keep going Richard. If I can get a decent quote on my Disco and our other car together with my house insurance then brilliant. If I fail to get insurance on my Discovery Sport then I might try crowd funding to have it crushed and then taken and left outside JLR Headquarters. At least it will be more difficult to steal.
Really appreciate the time and effort you are putting into this one Richard, it’s all positive. Last week I did a quick online quote on one of the comparison websites which I used in September when I purchased the car, it’s now coming in £200 cheaper (same company) and Is sub £1k, so it’s clear the coverage and exposure on this topic from you and the community is helping, great work and looking forward to the next update 🙌
You’ll have a customer with me for the insurance 👍🏻. I also know numerous people in this position in the midlands that would be happy to do the same. Keep up the good work Richard, I hope all your hard work pays off with you gaining some benefit from forming the insurance and filling the gap in the market.
Just saw the PR piece, before watching the remainder of this video, saying that JLR products are not the most stolen in the UK in 2023, I read somewhere that it is Ford’s Fiesta at number one and Focus at number 2, but when one looks at the numbers of cars registered in the UK, the percentage of JLR products is massively higher. However in 2022, the Official Figures have Velar as the most stolen and Sport at number 2, indeed Land Rover (Range Rover also) had 6 out of the 10 most stolen cars per 100,000, that makes it look like a massive improvement over 12 months but as Disraeli (well Mark Twain attributed it to Benjamin) once said “Lies, Damned Lies and Statistics”. The question that JLR must answer is “Why weren’t these £millions spent on security right from the beginning”? Key cloning, remote scanning etc have been with us ever since remote car unlocking has been around.
Insured my 2018 Range Rover 3.0 Desel Vogue December 2022 - 2023 insured for £670.00 insurers refused to re-ensure on renewal. Went on to comparison site on the internet 3 no. insurance companies would insure Got insured fully com in December 2023 -2024 for just under £1400.00 pounds
Thank you for continuing to push for answers and solutions. Please know it is greatly appreciated !! I have four vehicles and presently it’s cheaper for me to insure them individually. My RR insurance is due in June and depending on what quotes I get I may be looking at other ways of insuring them going forward. I’m following the journey with your insurance company with great interest !! Thank you again for all your hard work in pushing the companies that definitely seem to be reactive to media rather than proactive to their customers.
i popped in my local dealer last week as they had emailed saying MOT is due soon, asked again if i could have the security update whilst they did the MOT. Once again told my batch is not available yet ! Although they are launching a new all singing/dancing tracker for £800 including 5 years subscription.
Being selfish I have 23 RRS model but despite all talk still insurance ridiculous cost by LR and traditional insurers. What are they actually doing to speak with insurers with their data . Regarding ghost my LR dealer recommended having it fitted which I did😮 Secondly at end of first year I have to pay subscription for LR tracker system why can’t LR during this uncertain period pay for this ?
We have just swapped our range rover velar P400e 2022, Due to our renewal from 700£ last year to 2984.80£ for this year and the cheapest we could get it to was 1900.80£- our new 2024 land rover discovery 3.0l Diesel we have insured for 724.60£ 🤷♂
I have just received my upgrade security letter from JLM to arrange a date for the car software to be updated at the dealer, I already have the newer key with the logo ! my car is the 2018 face lift model
Don’t be fooled, JLR for a long time were loving their products being stolen as it meant more profit for them. Only now it’s in the public light they’re trying to show they care and it’s biting them on the ar*e. it’s a disgrace how easy these cars are to steal. Yes the Fiesta is the most stolen but there’s probably 100 Fiesta’s on the roads to 1 JLR product.
Why is my security upgrade being refused when my car is at the dealer for other work. I live in a low risk area but I drive from a rural Sussex into London, Birmingham and Manchester that are deemed higher risk areas. Others probably do as well. If all dealers in all areas did the updates everytime a car is at the dealer, all updates would be completed quicker, thereby if the updates work, reducing the number stolen. I asked my Sussex dealer about my pre 2018 model and was informed that the roll-out for these will not start until all newer models are done as JLR will not release the software. Why can't different age models be done along with newer ones as and when they are at a dealer. It doesn't make sense to stop some dealers providing the service to ALL their customers.
I have had 3 L322 range rovers with nine years no claims my insurance company have said they will not insure it after a lot of arguments they have finally agreed to insure it at triple the price I think this problem is about money as I live 200 miles from London
Hi Richard... thats great work thank you... that letter sounds like a pre-emptive strike against possible litigation... my premiums have gone from £480 pa in 21 to 22 to ... £1000 in 23 to 24 and I now being asked for £1800.... if thefts are on the decrease according to JLR why are my premiums still going skywards... are JLR somehow using different sets of data to the rest of the insurance world !... when JLR talk about residual values against the competition... who do they classify as the competition.... and how much is it to insure those cars... because there is a huge difference in prices and number of cars sold if JLR state the competition is Bentley rather than BMW . Great work and big thanks
Great job Richard. If we take LR at face value on their updates, is it not time to take the insurers to task on whether they are using the detailed information LR say is available to them as to exactly which vehicles are "updated and secure" so they do not bracket all Range Rovers into the same bucket when calculating the risk premium, as it seems now?
It’s good that JLR are acknowledging this problem at the highest levels in the company and it does seem that they are trying to do all they possibly can across a number of areas - let us hope that the newer cars continue to show lower theft levels and that the retro fit of older cars to the new enhanced security also helps improve things.
Hi , firstly - thanks for all the time and effort you’re putting into this problem .. I’ve owned many JLR vehicles, my daily is and pre 18 l405 & I was looking to upgrade or add the newer model until this problem presented itself. One quick question :- how is the rest of the world tackling this problem ? Especially the US ? Kind regards Daniel
Richard you are an absolute jewel in the crown and add value to any landrover owner thank you for all your hard work also may i add that once a car is stolen were do the parts end up? Ive been thru ebay and regularly looks at SVR parts having had myRS focus stolen some years ago it intrigues me so i typed in svr seats and it came up with a seller certified recycled by ebay with a picture of svr seats on a patio from a 2022 model and when looking thru other items by the seller there was no other car parts only clothes pegs and baby clothes so obviously stolen ask ones self how would you end up with a set svr seats from a 2022 model and have no other associated car parts ive confacted ebay regards this matter and there not interested but you get what im saying also i have a rrs
Hi All, On a 71 plate Vogue 525p Autobiogrophy, My wifes insurance quote is sub £1k per year for a bells and whistles policy and from JLR insure is a not very impressive £1600 more for a lesser policy per year.
Hi Richard, Excellent work, you are keeping JLR on their toes. Keep the pressure up. Any chance of a copy / transcript of the email from the CEO so I / we can study it and give you more feedback?
Great update Richard. Very interesting. Thank you. My insurance is due in 10 days. Price has doubled. According to to insurance company I’ve lost 35k in 12 months😮 my previous RR I had for 5 years and lost 40k in five years. Luckily for me I like to keep my cars for 4-5 years so hopefully the price may balance out. It will be a sad day when I do not own a RR. It might be sooner than I think. The problem I have. Every time I look at another car it always ends up the same way me saying “its nice but it isn’t a RR”
Again chap. Great work and really impressive the traction you have managed to gain. That press/update seems to have a changing posture to me and whilst I understand need to defend and clarify, as you noted no empirical data or references, and a changing tone.
Hi.thanks so much for your efforts. Regarding pin immobiliser. My screen ask me for a pin when I enter the Defender. But if I don't use it starting ok. Maybe if I enter the pin wrong 3 time's it totally immobilises the vehicle until I contacteding incontrol with a password and code the vehicle just sounds alarms and locks the brakes on.then only lifting the vehicle is possible.
JLR saying it’s not the most stolen car is a lie. One of my close friends is a specially qualified Met copper based out of East London. They have a WhatsApp group which allows instant communication between a major car tracker company (I believe it’s TrackStar or StarTrack something like that) and certain units in the met police. When a car is triggered as stolen, the car’s make, model, colour and reg is immediately posted on this group in the hopes that a cop might spot it or search the WhatsApp group if car is stopped. He showed me it about 6 months ago and said “notice a pattern here?” It looked like this: Range Rover Range Rover Range Rover “Random car make” Range Rover Range Rover Jaguar F-Pace Range Rover Range Rover Range Rover Range Rover “Random car make” … and so on. It was laughable how many Range Rovers were on the list. They pretty much outnumbered all the other car makes combined.
I think the cost of the in control remote tracking is a p take. £260 ish it should be offered free if they are serious in helping out. Tried JLR for an insurance quote and they won’t quote me??!! I love the product but hate the company!
My 2023 Evoque comes with a one year included to the InControl Secure Tracker. I may extend it but I would have thought that with all the present problems JLR would include the subscription for 3 years as with the warranty. The certificate that comes with the tracker says that it is Thatcham Cat 6 approved which concerns me as Thatcham moved from Cat 6 to S7 category in 2019! Also cat S7 is just a tracker, to quote Thatcham "Thatcham Category 6 - A good, reliable entry level system"! I would have thought that a more comprehensive system should be used on such valuable vehicles! The difference between the InControl Secure Tracker and the InControl Secure Tracker Pro - The InControl Secure Tracker is a Thatcham Cat 6 (S7) basic entry level system which "Secure Tracker alerts you and the Stolen Vehicle Tracking Centre if someone tries to steal your vehicle". The InControl Secure Tracker Pro is a better system being Thatcham S5 compliant as it also "Prevents unauthorised keys from starting your vehicle with our cutting-edge authentication technology". Apparently as they are completely different trackers you cannot upgrade from the S7 to the S5 at renewal. What a cheapskate of JLR not to put the best system on a £57K vehicle!!!! In fact they should have put the highest level of Thatcham approved tracker that is 5+ as this includes an immobiliser. Rewire Security do Thatcham approved trackers as S7, S5 and S5+. I know that you would have to pay for the installation (£150, £200 and £350 respectively) but their monitoring is cheaper than the JLR product, also JLR do not do a Thatcham S5+ tracker. I personally am considering getting one S5+ fitted when my 1 year supposedly free (included in purchase price and 1 year extension to tracker) JLR S7 tracker ends
Richard thanks as always, one question would be if there could be a table of which RR are being stolen and the age of the car. But regardless i cannot understand why there own insurance wont insure its own cars it just goes to show that they have no faith in there own product. The dealers are ignorant and don't care, when you speak to them they are all about selling and when you have bought they are not providing after sales service or in fact they do not give a toss especially if it was a Used RR this I learnt from my own experience. They are wriggling out of any liability not calling it a recall.. surely this is a basic and intrinsic Fault just because the legal body has not insisted in a recall does not detract from the fact that it is.
Thanks Richard, I’m on my 5th Range Rover and tba if it take you and us to sort the problem for them then I think it’s time to change brand and leave them to their own fate 😢
Just bought the Discovery Sport 2023 and quoted today 4000-9000 to ensure it!! Can I go back to them tomorrow to cancel my purchase before they register it on Monday 😢
If you havent given them the full amount yet or signed the paperwork they can't force you to buy it. Explain the situation and they will probably return the deposit, I spoke to a salesman a week ago and he said in most cases where customers have a genuine reason they will refund the deposit as it's more expensive for them not to.
Richard a few years ago there was clone strips at atm machines so the criminal s will more than likely have placed jammmers in the forecourts of petrol stattions ax they can bee very buzy at times . All it needs is a battery operated jammer placed at fuel stations as there is always goods outside for sale during the day and put inside at nighf so easy to put a jammer or several jammmers that may been how you couldn't lock you car
My 2020 RR Sport wouldn't lock in my Golf Clubs car park sometimes, I'd have to move the car to the far end of the car park. There was a mast full of transmitters close by, so I'm guessing it was due the proximity of that?
On Range Rover website they say "Key jammers can prevent vehicles from locking via the smart key. If your vehicle won’t lock using the smart key, lock your vehicle via the Remote App* or by using the emergency key." Also Tracker Retrieve is a battery powered S7 tracker. Most insurance companies would be looking for S5 as a minimum
My 2023 Evoque comes with a one year included to the InControl Secure Tracker. I may extend it but I would have thought that with all the present problems JLR would include the subscription for 3 years as with the warranty. The certificate that comes with the tracker says that it is Thatcham Cat 6 approved which concerns me as Thatcham moved from Cat 6 to S7 category in 2019! Also cat S7 is just a tracker, to quote Thatcham "Thatcham Category 6 - A good, reliable entry level system"! I would have thought that a more comprehensive system should be used on such valuable vehicles! The difference between the InControl Secure Tracker and the InControl Secure Tracker Pro - The InControl Secure Tracker is a Thatcham Cat 6 (S7) basic entry level system which "Secure Tracker alerts you and the Stolen Vehicle Tracking Centre if someone tries to steal your vehicle". The InControl Secure Tracker Pro is a better system being Thatcham S5 compliant as it also "Prevents unauthorised keys from starting your vehicle with our cutting-edge authentication technology". Apparently as they are completely different trackers you cannot upgrade from the S7 to the S5 at renewal. What a cheapskate of JLR not to put the best system on a £57K vehicle!!!! In fact they should have put the highest level of Thatcham approved tracker that is 5+ as this includes an immobiliser. Rewire Security do Thatcham approved trackers as S7, S5 and S5+. I know that you would have to pay for the installation (£150, £200 and £350 respectively) but their monitoring is cheaper than the JLR product, also JLR do not do a Thatcham S5+ tracker. I personally am considering getting one S5+ fitted when my 1 year supposedly free (included in purchase price and 1 year extension to tracker) JLR S7 tracker ends
They may well be saying thefts have been reduced, but what about attempted thefts? I have a 23yr model Sport and found it on my driveway this week with a large hole cut out of the tailgate and wiring cut, ( I think this was a well know issue with the previous model, so why didn't LR take account of this for 2023 model and change it?) I'm led to believe access to this wiring allows access to the vehicle. Not sure why they didn't take it, but could have been saved by after market steering lock! Car is also fitted with Ghost but I don't think they actually started it. This will require new tailgate, wiring, spraying etc, so still a hefty bill and excess to pay. I was advised by someone today that rear tailgates are now on back order due to demand! I've owned a RR Sport for the last 6 years, but after this I'll be looking to change to a different marque.
Thank you Richard for your work. I am interested in your insurance work you are doing. My policy is up May time so will wait and see what you can come up with. As a side note two top spec 1yr old Toyota Hi-Lux were taken off driveways in my area (sussex) in the last few days with owners using social media for help in tracking them down.
Why JLR do not recall these vehicles for rectification of the vulnerable ignition modules so they can't be stolen. Surely car owners will glad pay the cost and once provided with documents from JLR the insurance companies will obviously reduce their premiums. There are rumours that JLR have gone into partnership with some insurance companies and keep recommending them to jaguar and range rover owners. The problem is that even those insurance companies are asking for an arm and a leg which favours them both as the profit is split between the dealership and the insurance company. If JLR weren't making money out of this they could stop these theft within a week by replacing the ignition modules. They simply don't want to.
Thanks for the update and the news on ghost, just to add I have a dispure with JLR saying my ghost voids warrenty, it a bully tactic to not take ownership of a car fault, so I contacted Autowatch and their comments are below Thanks for your query. Firstly, just to make it clear for the Range Rover Dealership to understand, the Ghost is not installed anywhere near your steering wheel or steering rack according to the installation information registered with us by the Installer. It has been installed somewhere behind the glove box in your vehicle, so the physical installation of the product could not possibly have had anything to do with interfering with the steering wheel rack of the vehicle. Secondly, the entering of a disarm sequence by pressing a pre-learnt “Push Sequence” on some of the buttons on the steering wheel are communicated on the canbus network like they normally would even if a Ghost was not on the vehicle. As the ignition is switched on, the Ghost is instantly looking on the canbus network to see if the correct buttons have been pressed to disarm the system. There is no way possible that pressing some of the steering wheel buttons would suddenly interfere with anything on the canbus network. If there was a problem with some of the buttons being used to disarm the system, then the Ghost would not disarm. Thirdly, the Ghost file used on your vehicle doesn’t have digital blocking selected so cannot cause any communication problems.
The CEO thinks we are all stupid! How many Fiestas on the road compared to Land-RangeRovers! I think that's a good enough reason in itself to buy a Toyota-Lexus instead! They don't call you stupid!
I agree the stats should be by % of thefts of vehicles compared to number registered in UK. Should also be broken down by model and year of manufacture
Interesting as always Richard theft figures were up to march 2023, figures are now down re upgrades so should be reflected from March 2024 insurance companies need to catch up but that's not in their interest, or is that the cynic in me. Also does sound like you were being jammed, thanks again John.😊
Hi Richard, thanks for the update. All the feedback from them seems to be against latest RR models but that is not where the bulk of their sales come from in the UK (I would imagine). It doesn't seem like they can provide a sensitive list of impacted models but they must hold build details by vin so why is that so hard. The switch over from 2018 technology installed in next MY seems misleading but they will know what models have it and which don't. Insurers are applying a broad brush to premiums and I'm not surprised given the general nature of the info LR are providing. They know they've let owners down and need to do something about it quickly. 200 updates a week is a miniscule amount of vehicles and we'll be lucky to see all cats updated by the end of 2025! How many cars will have been pinched in that time frame? Their update smacks of politics and ar*e covering - blind them with contradictory information. Keep pushing for us all.
My interest in security is not really with any form of tracker as once the car is taken I don’t want it back as it’s resale price has taken a huge hit. I want it not to go in the first place.
Punishment for car thieves is far too lenient, according to research. Of the 7,405 criminals prosecuted for theft of a motor vehicle in England and Wales between 2012 and 2016, just 20 per cent were handed custodial sentences, with the average length of 21 months. I appreciate this is old data but it goes to show how pathetic things are.
jlr in trouble.. most likely going into server finacial difficulty .. i could not get insurance for less than 6.5k so pulled out of a rrs .. how many like me? buy at your own risk this will not be sorted within the next 3-5 years at least
Did you not say on one of your previous videos that your insurance for the Porsche Taycan was around £800.? Surely around £5,000 for a Range Rover .... is a massive step up in premiums.
Richard. How can we discuss what you’re doing with insurance? I’m scheduled to pick up my new p460e LWB in a few weeks. Kind of need to know asap please.
Why is JLR insurance only on monthly, I want to pay my insurance with one payment that covers the year. I wonder the monthly payment means that they can cancel the policy if the theft rise, or increase the cost Most other insurance payment is for the whole year
Exactly that - monthly allows them to legally cancel your insurance!! Seen it done. Then you have to declare to your next insurer that you’ve had a policy cancelled and then you are screwed for years. Good luck
Richard, update, 2017 Vogue 4.4 SE JLR has done nothing to help so far but I have just been sent a renewal for my Landrover Remote (£260) this is one thing that JLR could do for owners like me so I contacted JLR customer service to ask for renewal FOC I have written to you and Adrian Mardel just to point out what a cheap PR move this could be.
Mr. Mardell really needs to get out of his Ivory tower and look at the reality. Despite all his words it’s a complete disgrace . Ask him why I can insure a similar priced prestige model for a third of the RRS.
Thank you Richard. However your account of your garage visit with your PA (@13:52) is still a little troubling. As I understand it, you were unable to lock a brand new JLR vehicle using the key fob? It is my understanding that the latest UWB tech (since ~2018) in their keys is supposed to eradicate this type of vehicle theft. So do these criminals now possess the ability to intercept UWB waveband and thus have rendered this security 'upgrade' practically useless in these situations?
Firstly not all RR models had UWB tech introduced in 2018, it looks like it was phased in from 2018 to 2022 as and when a new version was introduced. I suspect that JLR despite knowing that there was a problem with keyless entry with the old tech they kept using it until the old stock was depleted. Absolutely disgusting of JLR. Secondly (I am not a tech expert) but I think UWB tech was introduced to stop the relay attacks but I don't think it stops the keys being jammed.
@@GrahamJackson-l9x @13:55 Richard clearly states that "When I was out, I had the new car.....". So I think it's safe to assume it was built no earlier than 2023? That to one side, the ability to jam the key fob in this way, clearly shows there is still a significant vulnerability in spite of the BCM upgrades, which I assume Richard's car came equipped with. What a mess.
The remotes use a frequency in a shared band (433MHz) and are vulnerable to jamming even by innocent radio users operating in that band. With my car (not JLR) I try to watch the car for confirmation that it has locked... ie the indicator blink and the mirrors folding.
@@nicolassales8679 not just Chinese, it is a shared band with other users. I suspect you are referring to the likes of the UV5R which can create chaos across a huge car park.
Had a Range Rover on order for 30 months!
I cancelled the order two weeks ago after JLR insurance declined me. I have a clean licence.
So JLR will sell me a car but won’t insure me. Make your own mind up on the CEO’s claims.
Great work Richard . If Land Rover say it’s car not high theft why do their own insurer refuse or charge as much as main stream. All smoke and mirrors .
Because it’s said to be provided by LV. They are not just gonna ignore the risks and give people cheap insurance premiums. Also the CEO only quoted figures for “latest” Range Rover.
The fact that Land Rover “provide/back” an insurance proposition for its customer that refuses on mass to ensure is ludicrous. They shouldn’t have their badge all over it
@@davidgirvan6007 mine is a 2023 RRS where the CEO has confirmed few thefts of these . So LR insurer must be ignoring this data as no cheaper than other insurers . He mentions how many quotes done which is different to number of cars underwritten by LR insurer
Thanks for the update. Keep up the great work Richard, JLR simply cannot blame the insurance industry in general when their own insurance refuses to cover their own Range Rovers
Thanks Richard, all your hard work and time appreciated. If I could thank you personally I certainly would!
I hope this new CEO concentrates on looking after the workforce too. Mental health is rife in there. Me and many others left broken
Hi Richard thank you so much for the work you’re doing for us Land Rover owners.I purchased a 2017 Range Rover Vogue in June 2021 for £42000.Ive just had the car valued at £21000 and my insurance has tripled.
There have been reports in the press/media of JLR spending money on helping owners. Not once has anyone mentioned that they would have done the square root of zero if it were not for you. JLR are using this as a publicity stunt making out THEY were the ones who were concerned about people's cars and doing this proactively and out of the good of their heart. Us subscribers to your channel know the truth.
I have just received my insurance renewal from Footman James that covers my 4 classic cars with agreed valuations along with my 2022 Velar diesel. I'm delighted to report my premium only went up by £300 from last year. One happy chap 👍🙃
I own a 2014 SDV8 Autobiography with Trackstar fitted. My insurance went from £450 per annum to £2k! Went on JLR’s own insurance, they wouldn’t quote me! The cars lost £10k in its value in less than one year! JLR MUST redesign the key reading issue & recall ALL vehicles to end this known issue once & for all, OR they will go bankrupt!
Percentage wise the ford has a lot more vehicles on the road I believe the ratio of cars on the road to thefts is under 1% the Range Rover is considerably higher percentage wise, just another example of stats been manipulated, JLR insist my vehicle had the security update in 2022 what is the latest update ref, I do not trust JLR at all, I am also another customer who they would not insure, keep up the good work.👍🏼
HI Richard, keep pressing them for pre 2018 models to be fixed. keep up the good work. Thank you for everything you’re doing.
Thank you
JLR just gave me 5000 pounds towards my insurance for New Range Rover. I think it thanks to people like you putting on the prerssure. ! Well Done
Subsidisation like this isn’t to be celebrated IMO. It’ll just bump up prices even more
Glad you mentioned about PINs for vehicles. Seems the easiest system. Good enough for bank cards and log ins.
Assume its just too simple for JLR to comprehend.
Think JLR are stuck in " we know best " scenario.
Hi Richard, you already know that I am a fan of your content ( RR ) reference your fuel station thefts, I use Shell, fill & go, it’s done via your mobile phone, and you never actually leave your vehicle. It doesn’t resolve going in to get a sandwich, but for fuelling only it’s a good system. The bonus is no queuing to pay, you just fill up your tank and then drive off. Keep going with your campaign, you are doing a great job and a fantastic service.
Hi Richard. keep up the great work, you are doing a super job for all of us Landy owners. I do find this insurance thing such a farse, i have a new Defender 110 HardTop on order, my current insurance company wont cover it. I did a search engine comparison and it came out at around £1500 for the year, I guess cheap compared to some of your viewers quotes but still in my opinion expensive for a middle aged chap with no points living in Cornwall. I was then intrigued to get some more quotes on other Land Rover Models, I found a reg for a 2022 Range Rover Sport, this came out cheaper at £1200. I then went on to do a quote for a Defender 110 525bhp V8 that my local deal had, 100k car, double the power of my 110, the premium was nearly half price at £800... Go figure ??? I think they just pluck a figure out of the sky :(
Hi Richard, 2017 Vogue 4.4 SE. Following my letter to JLR, CEO. Adrian Mardell, I had a call from a PA at his office I was hoping that JLR might do something for us older model owners, I had suggested a continued free subscription to Landrover remote. Unfortunately, I got a blunt NO.
Was the CEO also stamping his feet when he spat his dummy out! Group insurance or group action, but there’s now a real sense that something is about to happen in this war of words. Kudos to you.
Richard, many thanks for your time effort and professionalism on this project.
You are objective and more importantly holding JLR accountable. It’s becoming clear in my eyes that as an owner of a 17 plate RRS you’re the only hope I have of lower premiums and in turn hopefully returning some capital back to the shrinking residuals of these beautiful cars.
On the upside at least it’s taken the spotlight away from their reliability issues 😊
Keep up the good work, the LR community is extremely lucky to have you championing this battle for us.
Thanks Andrew
Quick update from me - insurance quotes floating around £2400 (up from £900) last year for my 69 plate RRS, Direct Line refusing to insure. I also made enquiries to 2 BMW dealer groups looking for a part-exchange value for my car against an X5 45e and a 5 series - both dealerships took my details, car info, mileage etc - neither have got back to me. Clearly they wont touch Range Rover Sports. I'll probably have to suck it up and pay the ridiculous insurance price, but please relay this to JLR - I'll never buy another one of their cars, and I'm warning all my mates to steer well clear.
Hi there CTR, I've posted a few times on your LR videos - I've now had my insurance renewal on my 69 plate RRS - up to £2800 from £900 last year. Shopping around, the best deal I can get right now is £2,400. Weirdly, when I did a comparison a week ago, I got as low as £1,800. Either way, it's between 2 and 3 times what I paid last year, with a car a year older and much less valuable. As a result, I'm probably going to have to sell it - I just can't justify paying that much just to insure it. I'll probably swap out to a BMW X5 45e, which by comparison is coming in at £1,400 for insurance.
I do hope in future there is a class action against JLR because this issue has probably cost me in the region of £10,000 in lost value, for a problem they've known about for many years, and until recently refused to openly admit.
Thanks for the update Richard, adding to the BBC interview. I ran a DB11 for a year, sold it back to the dealership for the same money, then moved to the Autobiography where after a year I am best part of £30k negative equity, I am waiting for my insurance renewal now with everything crossed that it will be a reasonable number - keep up the good work
On another issue, I saw JLR pre tax profits for the Quarter to Dec 2023 were £627M. Possibly boosted by the sales of replacements for stolen vehicles you touched on, paid for by Insurance company payouts of course. 🤔 it puts the £10M investment in their “security enhancement” into perspective!
Thanks
Thank you Phil
The problem is that jlr are not taking into consideration % of cars being stolen, yes the fiesta is stolen more, but out of a total % on the road they are a lot lower.
Liked your point about PIN CODES to secure a car ! Perhaps facial recognition too! They can do it easily for phones - why not cars! Or even use the phone as the key!? Keep going Richard you’re doing sterling work!
Thank you 🙏
JLR's own insurance will not even give me a quote for my 2021 car. The irony here is that I live a few miles from JLR's Solihull factory. I'm 59 year old professional with >10 years NCB and a clean licence. If JLR are serious, they need to address this.
Hi Richard, I tried again but I still cannot get a Range Rover Sport Autobiography insured despite being a model driver. For context my Porsche cost £600 Pa to insure.
So despite wanting to buy this car I cannot not even JLR will insure me.🤯 absolutely maddening.
3;58 a JLR dealer told me different and that was months ago
5k a year is still stupid on insurance
i pay 1200 on a f type v8 r
THANKS for taking the time to do this and inform people
Keep up the good work 👍🏻 Hoping & praying this mess is sorted out before my insurance is due in May. Selling is not an option!
No chance of this being sorted by May. 18 months to 2 years is my guess and possibly never. The insurance companies will make as much as they can for as long as they can.
Thank you Richard keep pushing please my insurance in due April am just hoping I can get insurance and afford it.
I really don’t get why insurance won’t offer third party if there worried about theft
Will keep going 💪
Whilst JLR may have not done themselves any great favours lately, I honestly feel we're yelling at the wrong people. This whole issue is about crime not cars. What we're experiencing is a predictable breakdown of law and order. We expect JLR to manufacture and sell cars and they do just that, good ones. We also expect our police and criminal justice system to to prevent crime and punish offenders, they don't. You can fit all the security you like to a car but a determined thief can always lift it onto a trailer and be off with it. The people stealing these vehicles are career criminals, it's how they make their living. They don't steal one car and retire, they go on stealing as long as it's profitable to do so. Catching car thieves not only stops them stealing, it frequently leads to recovery of previously stolen vehicles and potentially further arrests. Catch enough of them and you ruin their career prospects. New locks and keys is simply treating the symptoms and ignoring the disease. I'd like to hear someone from Westminster come on here and explain to us why theft has ceased to be a criminal offence and become a technical challenge for industry.
Exactly it is a soft on crime culture that's taken over the UK! Most of Europe and part of the U.S. truly a cancer in society!!!
Well said..you can leave your keys in the car with the engine running in Dubai..why..because the consequences of stealing it are severe..
But why aren't Audi, Mercs and BMW's SUV's being stolen in the same numbers, I can't see they are any less attractive to the thieves, so they must be harder to steal?
That’s not true they are targeting RR because they are simple to steal. Fit the ghost or a driveway pole and it won’t be stolen. There will always be car thieves in the Uk
@@oneeleven9832If you leave your key in the car here and it gets taken, it's considered gifting and insurance won't pay out for that. 😂
Thanks for the update Richard again. I experienced the locking issue with mine last year in a carpark. I’d unlocked the boot to get something out now. I’m not exactly sure what happened, but I inadvertently pressed the close button again whilst it was closing that stopped the boot in its tracks and I can’t quite remember if I had to close it manually. I then went to lock the car and it would not lock I started the car I stopped the car. It still would not lock. The only way it would lock was when I pressed the button on the handle. And that seemed to sort it. To be fair, I’ve never had a problem since and that was last summer.
On the Insurance side of things, I think it would be good for you to get a database or get some samples of what people are paying today i.e. model age, postcode type of insurance, e.g. full business or SDP, age, driving, history/points etc. Appreciate that a shed load of work unless you had a shared space where people could go in and enter their details as I may have mentioned and for what it’s worth. I’m in a March 2023 range Rover 300 SE diesel 16 K miles per annum full business one four-year-old SP30, one fault claim in 2022 postcode is WN8 I’m 57 full no claims protected wife on policy too as second driver, in August last year I renewed at £2400 per annum fully comprehensive. I thought that was extortionate! And then I started hearing about other who were getting 4,5,6,7,8, 9,10 K quotes! that’s on the multicar policy. My building insurance has gone to them and we have three cars on that policy. Obviously the £2400 is for the range Rover. Only. Please feel free to use this info if it is of any use to you and as you see fit. Interested to see what your insurance company is going to come up with that would be pretty awesome. If the theft of the new range rovers are as low as JLR suggesting there is no reason for them to be quoting you 5KPA that is frankly ridiculous. If you need a helper I’m happy to chat. I’m livid about this stuff.
Thank you, yes that the plan on data, I have my own development team that can really put this together quickly.
Great stuff - last one. Wouldn’t it be great to know if you can’t get a quote from JLR insurance - I was one of those - why not? What’s the reason AND if you’ve gone to the trouble of installing Ghost for example (not withstanding any warranty risks although I have heard of dealers encouraging it!) why is that not recognised - it def makes theft a lot harder. I’ll shut up now!!!
Well done ....keep it up !
I drew a blank when trying to find out if my 21 velar would need an update. No one would or could tell me. I feel JLR are talking doublespeak.
Yesterday I received my Landover insurance renewal Doc I have been with JLR insurance on my Evoque from new 2016. It is now under written by Wrisk transfer limited last year it was LV, I had to phone the call centre and basically they refused to insure my vehicle as my circumstances has changed, they will not tell me what changes basically they don't like my postcode CM which is Essex but only 15 miles from Suffolk. Luckily I contacted LV and they will insure my car but it has gone up by £150. The CEO of JLR saying they will insure vehicle through there insurance is rubbish dot think I will buy another cant trust them.
Thanks for the latest update Richard. Let’s hope the Insurance companies react positively to the improving position.
Great work thank you for the update and the hard work it’s much appreciated 🤗
Much appreciated
Keep going Richard. If I can get a decent quote on my Disco and our other car together with my house insurance then brilliant. If I fail to get insurance on my Discovery Sport then I might try crowd funding to have it crushed and then taken and left outside JLR Headquarters. At least it will be more difficult to steal.
Really appreciate the time and effort you are putting into this one Richard, it’s all positive. Last week I did a quick online quote on one of the comparison websites which I used in September when I purchased the car, it’s now coming in £200 cheaper (same company) and Is sub £1k, so it’s clear the coverage and exposure on this topic from you and the community is helping, great work and looking forward to the next update 🙌
Thank you 🙏
You’ll have a customer with me for the insurance 👍🏻. I also know numerous people in this position in the midlands that would be happy to do the same. Keep up the good work Richard, I hope all your hard work pays off with you gaining some benefit from forming the insurance and filling the gap in the market.
Thank you, looking forward to starting
Great work. Really appreciate it.
Keep up the good work! Been test driving a Defender 90 today 😊
Thanks Rob, I really like the defenders
@@ChallengetheroadD300 is sublime. Very similar to my 4.4 TDV8 2011 Rangie. Tempted 😊
Just saw the PR piece, before watching the remainder of this video, saying that JLR products are not the most stolen in the UK in 2023, I read somewhere that it is Ford’s Fiesta at number one and Focus at number 2, but when one looks at the numbers of cars registered in the UK, the percentage of JLR products is massively higher.
However in 2022, the Official Figures have Velar as the most stolen and Sport at number 2, indeed Land Rover (Range Rover also) had 6 out of the 10 most stolen cars per 100,000, that makes it look like a massive improvement over 12 months but as Disraeli (well Mark Twain attributed it to Benjamin) once said “Lies, Damned Lies and Statistics”.
The question that JLR must answer is “Why weren’t these £millions spent on security right from the beginning”? Key cloning, remote scanning etc have been with us ever since remote car unlocking has been around.
Thank you for all you are doing for us owners
Thank you
Insured my 2018 Range Rover 3.0 Desel Vogue December 2022 - 2023 insured for £670.00 insurers refused to re-ensure on renewal. Went on to comparison site on the internet 3 no. insurance companies would insure
Got insured fully com in December 2023 -2024 for just under £1400.00 pounds
Thank you for continuing to push for answers and solutions. Please know it is greatly appreciated !!
I have four vehicles and presently it’s cheaper for me to insure them individually. My RR insurance is due in June and depending on what quotes I get I may be looking at other ways of insuring them going forward. I’m following the journey with your insurance company with great interest !!
Thank you again for all your hard work in pushing the companies that definitely seem to be reactive to media rather than proactive to their customers.
EV9 has a fingerprint scanner. Not been in one though.
I remember Audi having this too, there needs to be something
The encryption on the kvm have been broken . Hence they don’t even need key to relay now . The telematics can be coded out of ignition loop also
i popped in my local dealer last week as they had emailed saying MOT is due soon, asked again if i could have the security update whilst they did the MOT. Once again told my batch is not available yet !
Although they are launching a new all singing/dancing tracker for £800 including 5 years subscription.
Annoying as it only takes 20 mins to do!
Being selfish I have 23 RRS model but despite all talk still insurance ridiculous cost by LR and traditional insurers. What are they actually doing to speak with insurers with their data . Regarding ghost my LR dealer recommended having it fitted which I did😮 Secondly at end of first year I have to pay subscription for LR tracker system why can’t LR during this uncertain period pay for this ?
We have just swapped our range rover velar P400e 2022, Due to our renewal from 700£ last year to 2984.80£ for this year and the cheapest we could get it to was 1900.80£-
our new 2024 land rover discovery 3.0l Diesel we have insured for 724.60£ 🤷♂
I have just received my upgrade security letter from JLM to arrange a date for the car software to be updated at the dealer, I already have the newer key with the logo ! my car is the 2018 face lift model
Don’t be fooled, JLR for a long time were loving their products being stolen as it meant more profit for them. Only now it’s in the public light they’re trying to show they care and it’s biting them on the ar*e. it’s a disgrace how easy these cars are to steal.
Yes the Fiesta is the most stolen but there’s probably 100 Fiesta’s on the roads to 1 JLR product.
👏👏 We would be interesting in recommending our customers the option of whatever insurance you’re working on.
Why is my security upgrade being refused when my car is at the dealer for other work. I live in a low risk area but I drive from a rural Sussex into London, Birmingham and Manchester that are deemed higher risk areas. Others probably do as well. If all dealers in all areas did the updates everytime a car is at the dealer, all updates would be completed quicker, thereby if the updates work, reducing the number stolen.
I asked my Sussex dealer about my pre 2018 model and was informed that the roll-out for these will not start until all newer models are done as JLR will not release the software. Why can't different age models be done along with newer ones as and when they are at a dealer. It doesn't make sense to stop some dealers providing the service to ALL their customers.
I have had 3 L322 range rovers with nine years no claims my insurance company have said they will not insure it after a lot of arguments they have finally agreed to insure it at triple the price I think this problem is about money as I live 200 miles from London
Hi Richard... thats great work thank you... that letter sounds like a pre-emptive strike against possible litigation... my premiums have gone from £480 pa in 21 to 22 to ... £1000 in 23 to 24 and I now being asked for £1800.... if thefts are on the decrease according to JLR why are my premiums still going skywards... are JLR somehow using different sets of data to the rest of the insurance world !... when JLR talk about residual values against the competition... who do they classify as the competition.... and how much is it to insure those cars... because there is a huge difference in prices and number of cars sold if JLR state the competition is Bentley rather than BMW . Great work and big thanks
Thank you 🙏
Great job Richard.
If we take LR at face value on their updates, is it not time to take the insurers to task on whether they are using the detailed information LR say is available to them as to exactly which vehicles are "updated and secure" so they do not bracket all Range Rovers into the same bucket when calculating the risk premium, as it seems now?
It’s good that JLR are acknowledging this problem at the highest levels in the company and it does seem that they are trying to do all they possibly can across a number of areas - let us hope that the newer cars continue to show lower theft levels and that the retro fit of older cars to the new enhanced security also helps improve things.
Hi , firstly - thanks for all the time and effort you’re putting into this problem .. I’ve owned many JLR vehicles, my daily is and pre 18 l405 & I was looking to upgrade or add the newer model until this problem presented itself. One quick question :- how is the rest of the world tackling this problem ? Especially the US ? Kind regards Daniel
I need to look into that more on Rest of the world
Thank you for the update. Been looking forwards to this for days.
Looking forwards to hearing more about the insurance scheme.
Thank you, yes I am looking forward to this too
@@Challengetheroadperhaps difficult to answer but what do you think the timing of an insurance product may be?
Shouldn’t UWB remotes be un-jammable? I think it would be good for the car to have led in the dash if the car detects jammers.
Richard you are an absolute jewel in the crown and add value to any landrover owner thank you for all your hard work also may i add that once a car is stolen were do the parts end up? Ive been thru ebay and regularly looks at SVR parts having had myRS focus stolen some years ago it intrigues me so i typed in svr seats and it came up with a seller certified recycled by ebay with a picture of svr seats on a patio from a 2022 model and when looking thru other items by the seller there was no other car parts only clothes pegs and baby clothes so obviously stolen ask ones self how would you end up with a set svr seats from a 2022 model and have no other associated car parts ive confacted ebay regards this matter and there not interested but you get what im saying also i have a rrs
Hi All, On a 71 plate Vogue 525p Autobiogrophy, My wifes insurance quote is sub £1k per year for a bells and whistles policy and from JLR insure is a not very impressive £1600 more for a lesser policy per year.
Any chance mentioning what insurance company this was with so we can all have a go?
If they are so secure as JLR Chairman says. Then why not give 3 years free insurance cover. Then we will see if they have any backbone.
Hi Richard,
Excellent work, you are keeping JLR on their toes. Keep the pressure up.
Any chance of a copy / transcript of the email from the CEO so I / we can study it and give you more feedback?
I cannot show details anymore, but getting weekly updates from JLR
Great update Richard. Very interesting. Thank you. My insurance is due in 10 days. Price has doubled. According to to insurance company I’ve lost 35k in 12 months😮 my previous RR I had for 5 years and lost 40k in five years. Luckily for me I like to keep my cars for 4-5 years so hopefully the price may balance out. It will be a sad day when I do not own a RR. It might be sooner than I think. The problem I have. Every time I look at another car it always ends up the same way me saying “its nice but it isn’t a RR”
I have to agree with you. My 2007 Range Rover Supercharged was my last one. At £57,000. That was my limit
Again chap. Great work and really impressive the traction you have managed to gain. That press/update seems to have a changing posture to me and whilst I understand need to defend and clarify, as you noted no empirical data or references, and a changing tone.
Thanks Danny
My 2018 Ranger Rover Sport is having the security enhancement on Monday 2th Feb at Stratstone Land Rover Stockton
Hi.thanks so much for your efforts. Regarding pin immobiliser. My screen ask me for a pin when I enter the Defender. But if I don't use it starting ok. Maybe if I enter the pin wrong 3 time's it totally immobilises the vehicle until I contacteding incontrol with a password and code the vehicle just sounds alarms and locks the brakes on.then only lifting the vehicle is possible.
I think the PIN is only to secure your profile from being edited. But it may be a good idea to extend it to being an immobiliser if that is possible.
JLR saying it’s not the most stolen car is a lie. One of my close friends is a specially qualified Met copper based out of East London. They have a WhatsApp group which allows instant communication between a major car tracker company (I believe it’s TrackStar or StarTrack something like that) and certain units in the met police.
When a car is triggered as stolen, the car’s make, model, colour and reg is immediately posted on this group in the hopes that a cop might spot it or search the WhatsApp group if car is stopped. He showed me it about 6 months ago and said “notice a pattern here?”
It looked like this:
Range Rover
Range Rover
Range Rover
“Random car make”
Range Rover
Range Rover
Jaguar F-Pace
Range Rover
Range Rover
Range Rover
Range Rover
“Random car make”
… and so on.
It was laughable how many Range Rovers were on the list. They pretty much outnumbered all the other car makes combined.
JLR still are not recognising the power steering fault that is affecting nearly all Jaguar F pace and RR Velar models ??
I think the cost of the in control remote tracking is a p take. £260 ish it should be offered free if they are serious in helping out. Tried JLR for an insurance quote and they won’t quote me??!! I love the product but hate the company!
My 2023 Evoque comes with a one year included to the InControl Secure Tracker. I may extend it but I would have thought that with all the present problems JLR would include the subscription for 3 years as with the warranty. The certificate that comes with the tracker says that it is Thatcham Cat 6 approved which concerns me as Thatcham moved from Cat 6 to S7 category in 2019! Also cat S7 is just a tracker, to quote Thatcham "Thatcham Category 6 - A good, reliable entry level system"! I would have thought that a more comprehensive system should be used on such valuable vehicles!
The difference between the InControl Secure Tracker and the InControl Secure Tracker Pro - The InControl Secure Tracker is a Thatcham Cat 6 (S7) basic entry level system which "Secure Tracker alerts you and the Stolen Vehicle Tracking Centre if someone tries to steal your vehicle". The InControl Secure Tracker Pro is a better system being Thatcham S5 compliant as it also "Prevents unauthorised keys from starting your vehicle with our cutting-edge authentication technology". Apparently as they are completely different trackers you cannot upgrade from the S7 to the S5 at renewal.
What a cheapskate of JLR not to put the best system on a £57K vehicle!!!! In fact they should have put the highest level of Thatcham approved tracker that is 5+ as this includes an immobiliser.
Rewire Security do Thatcham approved trackers as S7, S5 and S5+. I know that you would have to pay for the installation (£150, £200 and £350 respectively) but their monitoring is cheaper than the JLR product, also JLR do not do a Thatcham S5+ tracker.
I personally am considering getting one S5+ fitted when my 1 year supposedly free (included in purchase price and 1 year extension to tracker) JLR S7 tracker ends
Richard thanks as always, one question would be if there could be a table of which RR are being stolen and the age of the car. But regardless i cannot understand why there own insurance wont insure its own cars it just goes to show that they have no faith in there own product. The dealers are ignorant and don't care, when you speak to them they are all about selling and when you have bought they are not providing after sales service or in fact they do not give a toss especially if it was a Used RR this I learnt from my own experience. They are wriggling out of any liability not calling it a recall.. surely this is a basic and intrinsic Fault just because the legal body has not insisted in a recall does not detract from the fact that it is.
Thanks Bill
VAG Technic has had trouble with Ghost immobilisers not being removed properly! They charge £399 to fit an alternative that isn't a pain to use.
Thanks Richard, I’m on my 5th Range Rover and tba if it take you and us to sort the problem for them then I think it’s time to change brand and leave them to their own fate 😢
Just bought the Discovery Sport 2023 and quoted today 4000-9000 to ensure it!!
Can I go back to them tomorrow to cancel my purchase before they register it on Monday 😢
Yes you should be able to there’s a cooling off period especially if you have not taken delivery. Do it ASAP.
If you havent given them the full amount yet or signed the paperwork they can't force you to buy it. Explain the situation and they will probably return the deposit, I spoke to a salesman a week ago and he said in most cases where customers have a genuine reason they will refund the deposit as it's more expensive for them not to.
Richard a few years ago there was clone strips at atm machines so the criminal s will more than likely have placed jammmers in the forecourts of petrol stattions ax they can bee very buzy at times . All it needs is a battery operated jammer placed at fuel stations as there is always goods outside for sale during the day and put inside at nighf so easy to put a jammer or several jammmers that may been how you couldn't lock you car
I remember them times - just could you work out what was going on at the garage
My 2020 RR Sport wouldn't lock in my Golf Clubs car park sometimes, I'd have to move the car to the far end of the car park. There was a mast full of transmitters close by, so I'm guessing it was due the proximity of that?
On Range Rover website they say "Key jammers can prevent vehicles from locking via the smart key. If your vehicle won’t lock using the smart key, lock your vehicle via the Remote App* or by using the emergency key."
Also Tracker Retrieve is a battery powered S7 tracker. Most insurance companies would be looking for S5 as a minimum
Thank you, that maybe what happened
My 2023 Evoque comes with a one year included to the InControl Secure Tracker. I may extend it but I would have thought that with all the present problems JLR would include the subscription for 3 years as with the warranty. The certificate that comes with the tracker says that it is Thatcham Cat 6 approved which concerns me as Thatcham moved from Cat 6 to S7 category in 2019! Also cat S7 is just a tracker, to quote Thatcham "Thatcham Category 6 - A good, reliable entry level system"! I would have thought that a more comprehensive system should be used on such valuable vehicles!
The difference between the InControl Secure Tracker and the InControl Secure Tracker Pro - The InControl Secure Tracker is a Thatcham Cat 6 (S7) basic entry level system which "Secure Tracker alerts you and the Stolen Vehicle Tracking Centre if someone tries to steal your vehicle". The InControl Secure Tracker Pro is a better system being Thatcham S5 compliant as it also "Prevents unauthorised keys from starting your vehicle with our cutting-edge authentication technology". Apparently as they are completely different trackers you cannot upgrade from the S7 to the S5 at renewal.
What a cheapskate of JLR not to put the best system on a £57K vehicle!!!! In fact they should have put the highest level of Thatcham approved tracker that is 5+ as this includes an immobiliser.
Rewire Security do Thatcham approved trackers as S7, S5 and S5+. I know that you would have to pay for the installation (£150, £200 and £350 respectively) but their monitoring is cheaper than the JLR product, also JLR do not do a Thatcham S5+ tracker.
I personally am considering getting one S5+ fitted when my 1 year supposedly free (included in purchase price and 1 year extension to tracker) JLR S7 tracker ends
They may well be saying thefts have been reduced, but what about attempted thefts? I have a 23yr model Sport and found it on my driveway this week with a large hole cut out of the tailgate and wiring cut, ( I think this was a well know issue with the previous model, so why didn't LR take account of this for 2023 model and change it?) I'm led to believe access to this wiring allows access to the vehicle. Not sure why they didn't take it, but could have been saved by after market steering lock! Car is also fitted with Ghost but I don't think they actually started it.
This will require new tailgate, wiring, spraying etc, so still a hefty bill and excess to pay. I was advised by someone today that rear tailgates are now on back order due to demand!
I've owned a RR Sport for the last 6 years, but after this I'll be looking to change to a different marque.
Thank you Richard for your work. I am interested in your insurance work you are doing. My policy is up May time so will wait and see what you can come up with. As a side note two top spec 1yr old Toyota Hi-Lux were taken off driveways in my area (sussex) in the last few days with owners using social media for help in tracking them down.
Why JLR do not recall these vehicles for rectification of the vulnerable ignition modules so they can't be stolen. Surely car owners will glad pay the cost and once provided with documents from JLR the insurance companies will obviously reduce their premiums.
There are rumours that JLR have gone into partnership with some insurance companies and keep recommending them to jaguar and range rover owners. The problem is that even those insurance companies are asking for an arm and a leg which favours them both as the profit is split between the dealership and the insurance company. If JLR weren't making money out of this they could stop these theft within a week by replacing the ignition modules. They simply don't want to.
Thanks for the update and the news on ghost, just to add I have a dispure with JLR saying my ghost voids warrenty, it a bully tactic to not take ownership of a car fault, so I contacted Autowatch and their comments are below
Thanks for your query. Firstly, just to make it clear for the Range Rover Dealership to understand, the Ghost is not installed anywhere near your steering wheel or steering rack according to the installation information registered with us by the Installer. It has been installed somewhere behind the glove box in your vehicle, so the physical installation of the product could not possibly have had anything to do with interfering with the steering wheel rack of the vehicle.
Secondly, the entering of a disarm sequence by pressing a pre-learnt “Push Sequence” on some of the buttons on the steering wheel are communicated on the canbus network like they normally would even if a Ghost was not on the vehicle. As the ignition is switched on, the Ghost is instantly looking on the canbus network to see if the correct buttons have been pressed to disarm the system. There is no way possible that pressing some of the steering wheel buttons would suddenly interfere with anything on the canbus network. If there was a problem with some of the buttons being used to disarm the system, then the Ghost would not disarm.
Thirdly, the Ghost file used on your vehicle doesn’t have digital blocking selected so cannot cause any communication problems.
The CEO thinks we are all stupid! How many Fiestas on the road compared to Land-RangeRovers! I think that's a good enough reason in itself to buy a Toyota-Lexus instead! They don't call you stupid!
I agree the stats should be by % of thefts of vehicles compared to number registered in UK. Should also be broken down by model and year of manufacture
Interesting as always Richard theft figures were up to march 2023, figures are now down re upgrades so should be reflected from March 2024 insurance companies need to catch up but that's not in their interest, or is that the cynic in me. Also does sound like you were being jammed, thanks again John.😊
Thanks John 👍
Where the crime stoppers and what our government doing about it
Hi Richard, thanks for the update. All the feedback from them seems to be against latest RR models but that is not where the bulk of their sales come from in the UK (I would imagine). It doesn't seem like they can provide a sensitive list of impacted models but they must hold build details by vin so why is that so hard.
The switch over from 2018 technology installed in next MY seems misleading but they will know what models have it and which don't.
Insurers are applying a broad brush to premiums and I'm not surprised given the general nature of the info LR are providing.
They know they've let owners down and need to do something about it quickly. 200 updates a week is a miniscule amount of vehicles and we'll be lucky to see all cats updated by the end of 2025! How many cars will have been pinched in that time frame?
Their update smacks of politics and ar*e covering - blind them with contradictory information.
Keep pushing for us all.
Thanks Adrian
My interest in security is not really with any form of tracker as once the car is taken I don’t want it back as it’s resale price has taken a huge hit. I want it not to go in the first place.
Punishment for car thieves is far too lenient, according to research. Of the 7,405 criminals prosecuted for theft of a motor vehicle in England and Wales between 2012 and 2016, just 20 per cent were handed custodial sentences, with the average length of 21 months. I appreciate this is old data but it goes to show how pathetic things are.
Probably seen as another faceless crime as victims are paid out by their insurers?
jlr in trouble.. most likely going into server finacial difficulty .. i could not get insurance for less than 6.5k so pulled out of a rrs .. how many like me? buy at your own risk this will not be sorted within the next 3-5 years at least
Did you not say on one of your previous videos that your insurance for the Porsche Taycan was around £800.?
Surely around £5,000 for a Range Rover .... is a massive step up in premiums.
Big rise
Richard. How can we discuss what you’re doing with insurance? I’m scheduled to pick up my new p460e LWB in a few weeks. Kind of need to know asap please.
Hi - aiming to Launch 1st March - thank you for your support 👍
Re garages, due to risks around phones, are some blocking signals?
Maybe 🤔
I Drive 2023 BMW M240I , 60 years old clean DL ,10k a year , insurance is £1250 , just done a quote for diesel 2022 Defender and its £3000 WTF !!!!
Why is JLR insurance only on monthly, I want to pay my insurance with one payment that covers the year.
I wonder the monthly payment means that they can cancel the policy if the theft rise, or increase the cost
Most other insurance payment is for the whole year
Exactly that - monthly allows them to legally cancel your insurance!! Seen it done. Then you have to declare to your next insurer that you’ve had a policy cancelled and then you are screwed for years. Good luck
Richard, update, 2017 Vogue 4.4 SE JLR has done nothing to help so far but I have just been sent a renewal for my Landrover Remote (£260) this is one thing that JLR could do for owners like me so I contacted JLR customer service to ask for renewal FOC I have written to you and Adrian Mardel just to point out what a cheap PR move this could be.
Will put that point to JLR
Mr. Mardell really needs to get out of his Ivory tower and look at the reality. Despite all his words it’s a complete disgrace . Ask him why I can insure a similar priced prestige model for a third of the RRS.
Thank you Richard. However your account of your garage visit with your PA (@13:52) is still a little troubling. As I understand it, you were unable to lock a brand new JLR vehicle using the key fob? It is my understanding that the latest UWB tech (since ~2018) in their keys is supposed to eradicate this type of vehicle theft. So do these criminals now possess the ability to intercept UWB waveband and thus have rendered this security 'upgrade' practically useless in these situations?
Firstly not all RR models had UWB tech introduced in 2018, it looks like it was phased in from 2018 to 2022 as and when a new version was introduced. I suspect that JLR despite knowing that there was a problem with keyless entry with the old tech they kept using it until the old stock was depleted. Absolutely disgusting of JLR.
Secondly (I am not a tech expert) but I think UWB tech was introduced to stop the relay attacks but I don't think it stops the keys being jammed.
@@GrahamJackson-l9x @13:55 Richard clearly states that "When I was out, I had the new car.....". So I think it's safe to assume it was built no earlier than 2023? That to one side, the ability to jam the key fob in this way, clearly shows there is still a significant vulnerability in spite of the BCM upgrades, which I assume Richard's car came equipped with. What a mess.
The remotes use a frequency in a shared band (433MHz) and are vulnerable to jamming even by innocent radio users operating in that band. With my car (not JLR) I try to watch the car for confirmation that it has locked... ie the indicator blink and the mirrors folding.
Plus tonnes of Chinese rubbish swamping the frequency. Ask me how I know!
@@nicolassales8679 not just Chinese, it is a shared band with other users. I suspect you are referring to the likes of the UV5R which can create chaos across a huge car park.
Hi Richard, have you used a comparison website as my RRS premium is fair priced, I think for fairness you should quote a 2022 RRS with maximum NCB.
Not yet as did not want more problems if it’s bad