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I love how far this podcast has come. And how open Rich is to the guest, no matter how different their lifestyle is at the time of the interview. Fascinating and beautiful! Full respect to both of these giants.
I rarely comment but as someone who has been following Layne for a long time I must say that he surely is my go to source when I need reliable fitness and nutrition info. Not only does he have a phD in nutriton but also knows how to communicate his thoughts well and most importantly is honest and has integrity which is a rare sight in the industry these days since most of the “health gurus” aka charlatans/scammers have an agenda of selling you something and always spewing claims that support their narrative even if they are not factually correct. Layne is such a breath of fresh air!
Unfortunately, the sure numbers of subscribers of keto, carnivore and IF content creator have a way bigger outreach. It reflects the level of bs people are subscribing to
Layne Norton - & Rich Roll - Thank you for your transparency, honesty, vulnerability, and wisdom. In a time when there's so much noise - lies and cynicism - it is wonderfully empowering to hear honest, truthful, and insightful thoughts and discussions. I appreciate this conversation, particularly the last half hour.
Gotten in the best shape with the least stress following Laynes stuff over the years. Not to mention he’s funny as hell and calls out the industry BS for what it is whenever it’s put out. Keep doing gods work Layne💯
@@SSTillmanEsq Overall just the simplification he’s contributed to making diet/nutrition as a whole, and he’s done that by consistently analyzing and debunking every new fad diet or nutritional strategy since the early 2000s. All while also correcting himself where he was wrong about things when new data comes out like his strong backing of BCAA’s early on, to now calling it for what it is just not being that important if your nutrition is on point. The Keep it Simple Stupid approach is how I’d like to think of it when it comes to Layne, and for me it just made all the scientific nuance really understandable from an early age
Absolutely love Layne, and how he’s 100% fact driven. As non biased as anyone can be, and always willing to change his opinion based on new information. It’s a rare sight in this industry. I really appreciate you having him on your podcast, and having him bust a few of those myths. Thanks Rich, and thanks Layne!!!
Whenever I am not sure about some specific topic, I know I can go to Layne and get the most objective scientific consensus on the matter. Trust Dr. Layne!
I had the privilege and blessing of running into Layne in the airport, and ended up sitting next to him on a flight … Just such a super genuine, honest, and KNOWLEDGEABLE guy…. So glad Rich got him on the RR podcast!
I agree. I am so happy when Rich says "yes, I get it" and moves on to the important detail or another question. Many interviewers want to talk too much themselves, or think the listeners are dummies and need to hear everything explained 10 times.
Rich, you amaze me at your ability of intentionally listening. How you’re able to take in all the information from your guests without interruption, and STILL touch base on your thoughts that may have arose during their speaking. It’s inspiring 🙌🏼
I love this level of respect and high mindedness in this discussion. Internet nutrition influencers are a guilty pleasure and I often know it’s probably not scientifically sound…..but it’s oh so alluring. I am refreshed listening to the evidence behind all of these topics and especially the protein debate. I learned more today than I have in a long while. Thank you for always contributing to the greater good in your podcasts.
I followed the FODMAP diet and figured out that onions and garlic really hurt my stomach. So I eliminated them but I eat LOTS of other fruits and vegetables every single day - lots of salads and pineapples and other fruits every day. Eating fruits and vegetables are GOOD for us. I have no problems with my gut anymore now that I made changes - including DAILY exercise (yoga, peloton). Thank you for doing this video,
I’m sooo frustrated. I freaking love onions and garlic and ate them all my life with no problem, but i’m beginning to figure out that those two, along cauliflower and cabbage are the triggers of my really uncomfortable bloating I’ve stated to experience after moving countries…i’m so sad about it because I don’t want to stop eating them! Garlic is life 😭🧄💨
@@Seanonyoutube I'm with you on that - I ate onions and garlic my whole life too - even a little bit of purple onion destroys my stomach so I avoid them now - but the plus side is that we figured out what was hurting us and our breath is better Sean :-)
@@Wendys_lovinglife no nooo i’m not giving up lol, I noticed the bloating went away for a while after taking antibiotics…I’ll continue to search for solutions! 🧄🧅🧄🧅
What's quantity of onions/garlic are y'all eating? I usually use them to season stuff, very low quantities that would seem unlikely to be an issue. I always heard the old wisdom around onions and garlic is that they were medicinal and meant to be eaten in small quantities, and I kind of follow that by chance. Or maybe you're vampires...
@@limitisillusion7 doesn’t really matter how much I eat honestly even a small amount lately has been causing me bloating all night…obviously more is worse…
What a great conversation! I appreciate both perspectives. I’m a natural skeptic, and although I am plant-based and have been for almost 30 years, I try not to make that my identity. My goal is to always stay open and listen. When I hear somebody say something that intrigues me, I do my own research and I aim and look at both sides. There are people that I look to and you both are on that short list. I love the analogy “the house is on fire… Just get out!“ with regard to obesity, and really any addiction or issue you’re stuck on. The study Layne loosely repeated with regard to Democrats and Republicans and long held beliefs being difficult to shift is interesting… I saw that through the Covid pandemic… There is so much new information and things we’ve learned having gone through the last three years. People that followed what they were told, and believed was the best action are having difficulty considering that the alternative may have been better. Critical thinking skills have waned, and we look to others to make our decisions often times without question. We need to always question, to always ask why, to always ask for more information. These conversations are so helpful to me and both of you have made a huge impact on humanity. Consider about the story of the boy on the beach throwing a sea star back into the ocean, and the question of what difference did it make tossing back one sea star… And the response “it made a difference to that one”. if you touch one life you’ve touched 1000… Thank you both❤❤
Layne was my coach like 15 years ago. He was awesome! Leanest I ever got, and his diet system he helped me to get there was so simple and allowed pretty much any food group. I've continued to learn from him ever since.
just because Layne isn't a vegan doesn't mean he's not a great person who's helping a lot of people. It's great to see Rich discussing very important topics with him.
Would just like to add that although people have to be responsible for changes in how they eat, for example, it is important to realize that in poor communities there are few grocery stores and they don’t carry all the beautiful fruits and veggies my store does and surprisingly prices are higher. I was also surprised by the very limited food available at the store on the Navajo reservation. We were camping and needed to resupply but found very little fresh produce. On the other hand most of these communities have every type of fast food place with low cost menu options. There’s also the whole idea of being emotionally attached to the food you grew up on which in poorer families was largely carbs. Larger community level changes are also needed, there’s a lot of research on this as well. A great help was allowing people to use food stamps at farmers markets for example.
Thank you, Rich Roll, once again. I'd not heard about Layne before, and now my life is better. Layne, what an effort you must put in, to have become such a credible health science filter for good information. Thank you!
Layne is a freakin hero no bias such good studies interpretation. the way he explains things. this was soo informative and really comfortable to watch and everything is so understandable yet explained very intelligently. loved this!
Great interview. 👏 I do think that while diet choices are not binary for weight loss and adherence, they're pretty close to binary for the environment and longevity, no? I don't know any earth scientists (I am one) or actual longevity researchers (Attia is not one) who think diets with a lot of meat work in their fields.
Really great discussion Rich & Layne - what I truly love about all these podcasts is it creates better SELF AGENCY for everyone. Thank you both for all you do in educating, informing, aligning. Peace. Plants.
I really enjoyed this episode. I follow Dr. Norton for about a year now, since I saw him on the Huberman lab. He gives really good information. I like his What the Fitness videos & Educational videos. I am now on a fitness program with a fitness & nutrition coach. We measure everything. I found out at the start that I was already eating more than 2g/kg of protein every day (I am very light, and I eat a lot). I did gain muscle mass in this training program of 8 weeks (5 strength workouts per week, 1 day cardio, 1 day liss). Now going for round two next week. The great thing of gaining muscle mass on a plant based diet is that it's so low in saturated fats, and so high in fiber. I am lifelong vegetarian, and vegan since 2017.
Would just like to say, I gained a deeper respect for @richroll as a result of this conversation. His preparation was impeccable, and his subject matter expertise was really evident.
Just listened to this for the third time. These two brilliant men give me comfort and hope. Thank whatever benevolent power in the universe put them here. ❤
I appreciate this convo, there's so much nuance. I think people get so up in arms about nutrition because it is literally who we are. We are what we eat, so when that is challenged it can feel deeply critical regarding our choices, preferences, blindspots, and insecurities. Layne looks so much like Joey Carbstrong, someone who'd be great on the pod. Rich, your beard is at its maximum glory.
You are fighting the good fight Layne. I’ve always had great respect for you and you actually motivated me with this discussion to not give up trying to tackle this whole health thing. 🙂
Really appreciate that you cover the entire spectrum of possibilities with your guess. It’s important to be open minded however , he did not make me change my mind at all. Plant based for life ….and love as a mojo !
I just wanted to comment from the other end. I've watched Layne's stuff for a long time, and watched this initially because of him. I didn't know until about a 1/3 of the way through the podcast that Rich was plant-based, because there was no hesitation or gravitation away from discourse or the science being presented. I appreciate Rich's openness to both human congenial conversation and for non-dogmatic approaches.
This is great! Love seeing some of the meat eaters finally cheering on fiber and plant based foods for microbiome. Thank you rich for this! Im trying to be open to hearing more from these kind of folks although never changing my vegan diet
1:54:00 this whole Shame Spiral discussion is massive. So glad I got recommended this podcast by the YT Algo. Also just ordered Finding Ultra. thanks Rich and Layne. Dopamine Nation was a great book on this addiction topic
As an endocrine therapist and nutritionist I totally respect Layne Norton....cuts through all the crap and gets to the science...and not just cherry picking data.
💯💯oh my gosh, the part where you mentioned about Ethan’s storey and him saying “ if the house is on fire just get out of the house, figure out what caused the fire later “ huge light bulb 💡 moment 👌💯
Thank you for this excellent information and wonderful interview Rich! As a 90 percent raw vegan I eat a lot of fresh fruits and vegetables and I love it! Occasionally a will have a small amount of grain and cooked vegetables. God bless you and thank you again 🙏🙏
Love what Rich says at 1:39, I feel the same way myself. While some things can be obvious, there are still so many variables in different platforms at play of any one individual.
Layne Norton is great! Watch some of his videos, with an open mind/ear. Layne does not villanize any diet/food, he simply, explains the scientific breakdown of various studies/data and explains it so that even us, with biases, can understand. What he does do is, "debunks" influencers who cherry-picks one detail/claim to villanize a particular food, food group and/or diet, to fit their narrative/agenda. Layne Norton is someone to trust with the info/content he puts out. He explains how he works/thinks, in this video, if you watched it to the end. He makes total sense! 💕👍 💕
I'm a senior who had a heart attack (,Minoca, no blockage). My hdl is high with my trigs low and ldl high. I'm going off red meat for my ldl. I liked what Rich said about rolling the dice. Thanks guys. Good talk.
Wow - kudos to both these guys for doing this. I kind of thought of them as "polar opposites" but this is proof that people can find common ground if they choose to. Diet doesn't need to be a religious war--
I have higher LDL, high HDL and low triglycerides combo they mention at 26mins. I have asked the doctor if it's really a problem with that combo. Layne's statement that you could be healthier with lower LDL and that combo makes it simple and clearer
I'm curious why when the topic of B12 comes up, no one ever seems to mention seaweed as a way to supplement? I wrap up salad greens in organic Nori seaweed sheets all the time. They have Iodine as well. Am I missing something?
I love how Rich rationalizes the vegan side of things too (the protein conversation for example) just such a big fan of this whole conversation amd everything about it
Rich, I’m from a war zone and I’ve been through a lot of devastating circumstances. You are absolutely one of my favorite people in the world!! You really saved my life and in many ways I owe my life to you. I’m excited to share my story of transformation with you at some point and what a leading role you played in it. But I also wanted to share how your stance on diet has been a bit troubling for me. I am suffering from colitis and IBS and nothing I’ve tried helped me manage my symptoms. Carnivore diet was the only thing that fixed my symptoms and I’ve improved by 80-90%. I don’t like the diet and I’m not really a carnivore enthusiast. But I must say I can’t argue how beneficial it has been for me based my personal hands-on experience. I wanted to share just to provide a different perspective. Love what you do and please continue changing lives!! You’re my biggest inspiration and I have a photo of you in my room and my phone wallpaper 😂
Omg.yes 55:47 im wearing a G7 right now and found myself .. well going crazy.. but after a spike withinna hour it leveled out.. so now im just using it to compare tonny mental state . And what im eating and what my number ks cocmpared tonhow i feel .. trying to reduce stress and anxiety .. fatigue.. sleep ect
Seed oils were brought to attention as. being detrimental to health by Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn , Cardiologist who says that research shows the damaging affects on the heart and specifically the endothelial lining. He is now just one of quite a few Cardiologists who agree with him and the research that is now out there. Again, we are speaking about the oil (refined) not from the whole source.
Yes esselstyn doesn't allow meat or saturated fat either as well as not allowing other oils for heart health. He's big on consuming lots or green leafy plants.
Esselstyn does not single out seed oils. He singles out oils period, and even fat content from whole foods. He is not doing this based on science. He points to one "study" where people consumed a large amount of oils and it measured their "endothelial health" based on this test called "flow mediated dilation." And extrapolated this to mean that oil consumption would permanently harm the endothelium, but there's no outcome data that isolates oil as a singular cause of such harm. Esselstyn doesn't want his patients even eating nuts or avocados he's so fat-phobic.
Seed oils increase LDL susceptibility to oxidation which is injurious to the endothelium and potentiates atherosclerosis ultimately. Let these oils lubricate machinery, but not mankind.
It was stated at 24:35 onwards that high level of LDL was atherogenic and ‘causative of a risk factor for heart disease’. It can’t be both. It is rather causative or it’s a risk factor. There has been no literature showing that LDL is causative of heart disease but only that the presence of high density LDL is often present in atheromatous plaques. This begs the accusation of were the firemen there to put out the fire or did they cause the fire?
High levels of LDL track with heart disease because the more of it you have in circulation, the more oxidizable substrate there is. Native LDL may be a risk factor, but it's actually entirely benign and not disimilar to ApoB, has literally zero part in the causal pathway of CVD. Only/until LDL becomes oxidized can it be atherogenic.
@@JasonActualization yes of course. But the op said ‘It is rather causative or it’s a risk factor’ In reality it can be both it’s not an either or situation.
@@739jep I would agree with you. What OP is insinuating however is indeed the case which is that LDL is not causal, but rather, associative. Higher LDL associates with CVD because it means there is more oxidizable substrate. Native LDL is not atherogenic unless/until it becomes oxidized. This is also why we see atherosclerosis ensue predominately in arteries and not veins (both vessels have the same lipoprotein concentration, but it's the former that is oxygen-rich resulting in greater rates of oxidation). In the end, it's not the amount of native cholesterol and lipoproteins or even ApoB (which also tracks with CVD because it indicates how much oxidizable substrate is circulating) in circulation that matters, as none of these are involved in the actual pathogenesis, but rather, it's the absolute amount of oxidized lipoproteins relative to ones HDL and antioxidant status that matters most.
The fact that things like very active cardio, hiit and so on leads to great electrolytes lossthar leads to massive hunger thar leads to overeating and "i can treat myself today" (and its never the right foods that your body is actually trying to get) really needs to be talked about more because this is the most common mistake for newbies in fitness
This is the exact conversation I've been looking for. I've crept up into the near diabetic range and took it serious finally. Gone low carb, getting my 10,000 steps and added body weight training. Down 30 pounds and glucose below 90 consistently. However, I KNOW I'm better off closer to plant based than animal but have been using animal protein to get things in order. The biggest problem I have is getting fiber being low carb. I think my approach will be after 6 months in this phase, start adding back lentils and some quinoa in small doses and measure my glucose and see how I respond. Not easy for me to get my lipid profile other than once a year, but may need to start using Quest to get lipids every 6 months and pay out of pocket to get an idea where I'm heading with certain eating patterns 6 months at a time. It's going to be a long process but I'll have it dialed in eventually.
I would love to be part of a study. I lost almost 130lbs in my 20's, I am now in my 50s and have never regained any of my weight. Never YoYo'd, maintained within the typical 5ish pounds all this time. All through changing my diet and daily exercise.
Thank you!! I did what nobody wants to hear. I cut my portions, eat 3 balanced meals a day, drink 90oz of water a day (Coffee in the morning), walk as much as I can (I have a sit down job) and lift weights 5 days a week. I also have always kept Saturated fats low, I lost my weight in the low fat era so that is just what I've always done just because it's always worked for me@@jerryyono7306
What a great episode, thank you. Can I ask why you wear both a Whoop and an Apple Watch or Garmin? What do you get from the Whoop that you do not get from your other devices?
As a medical doctor I agree with a lot of what has been said here from both sides. That being said, it is important to recognize that the large amount of calories required to maintain muscle, as the most metabolically active tissue in the body, is balanced by the fact that overall caloric reduction and increasing fibre and good sources of plant protein, which produces a markedly different insulin and leptin response, has tremendous health benefits and reduces all-cause mortality.
The counter-argument I could see to the “get all your protein in capsule format” argument is that protein is very satiating. It makes you feel full. I have never had a more filling diet, one that left me so stuffed I couldn’t eat anymore and kept me full all day, than one that contains a serving of lean protein (whatever that means for you) and 2 servings of fruit or vegetables (non-starchy) for every meal. No snacks but that’s for practical reasons, I couldn’t eat them if I wanted to. I use that to cut before climbing season and man… it is difficult to actually eat enough calories to fuel me on that. Has nothing to do with the macros, just practically speaking it’s very difficult to over-eat that way, almost to a fault.
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😊😊😊😊😊
Please interview Gil Carvalo from Nutrition made simple! :)
@@johnnyfog8134and joel fuhrman md
😊😊😊😊1
LdL is bullshit old matrix science ! ❤
I love how far this podcast has come. And how open Rich is to the guest, no matter how different their lifestyle is at the time of the interview. Fascinating and beautiful! Full respect to both of these giants.
I rarely comment but as someone who has been following Layne for a long time I must say that he surely is my go to source when I need reliable fitness and nutrition info. Not only does he have a phD in nutriton but also knows how to communicate his thoughts well and most importantly is honest and has integrity which is a rare sight in the industry these days since most of the “health gurus” aka charlatans/scammers have an agenda of selling you something and always spewing claims that support their narrative even if they are not factually correct. Layne is such a breath of fresh air!
My favourite is ‘plant chompers’. Also check out mark Mattson re fasting.
Integrity ? Are we forgetting when Layne cheated on his pregnant wife ?
Unfortunately, the sure numbers of subscribers of keto, carnivore and IF content creator have a way bigger outreach. It reflects the level of bs people are subscribing to
I haven’t yet listened to this podcast- just downloaded, but am super intrigued already.
@@BradSchoenfailedwhat does that have to do with his work?
Layne Norton - & Rich Roll - Thank you for your transparency, honesty, vulnerability, and wisdom. In a time when there's so much noise - lies and cynicism - it is wonderfully empowering to hear honest, truthful, and insightful thoughts and discussions. I appreciate this conversation, particularly the last half hour.
I love Dr Layne's no bullsh*t approach. Cutting through the noise and giving us facts. 👏🙏
Hahah is that so? Hardly an MD. He’s a stupid jock with a child-like ego.
Or so you think.
Yep all his invisible clients agree
.
@@nymike59name checks out. what a pathetic existence. why not address arguments?
Gotten in the best shape with the least stress following Laynes stuff over the years. Not to mention he’s funny as hell and calls out the industry BS for what it is whenever it’s put out. Keep doing gods work Layne💯
My man quotes Hitchens razor often, which must have some impact on his worldview 🤔😂
If you dont mind me asking, what would was the most impactful advice of his that you used ?
@@SSTillmanEsq
Overall just the simplification he’s contributed to making diet/nutrition as a whole, and he’s done that by consistently analyzing and debunking every new fad diet or nutritional strategy since the early 2000s. All while also correcting himself where he was wrong about things when new data comes out like his strong backing of BCAA’s early on, to now calling it for what it is just not being that important if your nutrition is on point. The Keep it Simple Stupid approach is how I’d like to think of it when it comes to Layne, and for me it just made all the scientific nuance really understandable from an early age
same!
I love dr Anthony chaffees review on him
Love the calmer interviews with Layne. Easier to forward these to people that do not already know him.
Absolutely love Layne, and how he’s 100% fact driven. As non biased as anyone can be, and always willing to change his opinion based on new information. It’s a rare sight in this industry. I really appreciate you having him on your podcast, and having him bust a few of those myths. Thanks Rich, and thanks Layne!!!
Whenever I am not sure about some specific topic, I know I can go to Layne and get the most objective scientific consensus on the matter. Trust Dr. Layne!
I had the privilege and blessing of running into Layne in the airport, and ended up sitting next to him on a flight … Just such a super genuine, honest, and KNOWLEDGEABLE guy…. So glad Rich got him on the RR podcast!
rich, thank you for being a great interviewer. You have a great way of summarizing and getting to the point.
I agree. I am so happy when Rich says "yes, I get it" and moves on to the important detail or another question. Many interviewers want to talk too much themselves, or think the listeners are dummies and need to hear everything explained 10 times.
Rich, you amaze me at your ability of intentionally listening. How you’re able to take in all the information from your guests without interruption, and STILL touch base on your thoughts that may have arose during their speaking. It’s inspiring 🙌🏼
100% !
I love this level of respect and high mindedness in this discussion. Internet nutrition influencers are a guilty pleasure and I often know it’s probably not scientifically sound…..but it’s oh so alluring. I am refreshed listening to the evidence behind all of these topics and especially the protein debate. I learned more today than I have in a long while. Thank you for always contributing to the greater good in your podcasts.
I followed the FODMAP diet and figured out that onions and garlic really hurt my stomach. So I eliminated them but I eat LOTS of other fruits and vegetables every single day - lots of salads and pineapples and other fruits every day. Eating fruits and vegetables are GOOD for us. I have no problems with my gut anymore now that I made changes - including DAILY exercise (yoga, peloton). Thank you for doing this video,
I’m sooo frustrated. I freaking love onions and garlic and ate them all my life with no problem, but i’m beginning to figure out that those two, along cauliflower and cabbage are the triggers of my really uncomfortable bloating I’ve stated to experience after moving countries…i’m so sad about it because I don’t want to stop eating them! Garlic is life 😭🧄💨
@@Seanonyoutube I'm with you on that - I ate onions and garlic my whole life too - even a little bit of purple onion destroys my stomach so I avoid them now - but the plus side is that we figured out what was hurting us and our breath is better Sean :-)
@@Wendys_lovinglife no nooo i’m not giving up lol, I noticed the bloating went away for a while after taking antibiotics…I’ll continue to search for solutions! 🧄🧅🧄🧅
What's quantity of onions/garlic are y'all eating? I usually use them to season stuff, very low quantities that would seem unlikely to be an issue. I always heard the old wisdom around onions and garlic is that they were medicinal and meant to be eaten in small quantities, and I kind of follow that by chance. Or maybe you're vampires...
@@limitisillusion7 doesn’t really matter how much I eat honestly even a small amount lately has been causing me bloating all night…obviously more is worse…
What a great conversation! I appreciate both perspectives. I’m a natural skeptic, and although I am plant-based and have been for almost 30 years, I try not to make that my identity. My goal is to always stay open and listen. When I hear somebody say something that intrigues me, I do my own research and I aim and look at both sides. There are people that I look to and you both are on that short list. I love the analogy “the house is on fire… Just get out!“ with regard to obesity, and really any addiction or issue you’re stuck on. The study Layne loosely repeated with regard to Democrats and Republicans and long held beliefs being difficult to shift is interesting… I saw that through the Covid pandemic… There is so much new information and things we’ve learned having gone through the last three years. People that followed what they were told, and believed was the best action are having difficulty considering that the alternative may have been better. Critical thinking skills have waned, and we look to others to make our decisions often times without question. We need to always question, to always ask why, to always ask for more information. These conversations are so helpful to me and both of you have made a huge impact on humanity. Consider about the story of the boy on the beach throwing a sea star back into the ocean, and the question of what difference did it make tossing back one sea star… And the response “it made a difference to that one”. if you touch one life you’ve touched 1000… Thank you both❤❤
Great comment!
Layne was my coach like 15 years ago. He was awesome! Leanest I ever got, and his diet system he helped me to get there was so simple and allowed pretty much any food group. I've continued to learn from him ever since.
Loving this episode. Rich asks excellent questions and Layne gives very easy to understand answers. The combination of these two guys is awesome.
just because Layne isn't a vegan doesn't mean he's not a great person who's helping a lot of people. It's great to see Rich discussing very important topics with him.
Could not agree more 😊
Would just like to add that although people have to be responsible for changes in how they eat, for example, it is important to realize that in poor communities there are few grocery stores and they don’t carry all the beautiful fruits and veggies my store does and surprisingly prices are higher. I was also surprised by the very limited food available at the store on the Navajo reservation. We were camping and needed to resupply but found very little fresh produce. On the other hand most of these communities have every type of fast food place with low cost menu options. There’s also the whole idea of being emotionally attached to the food you grew up on which in poorer families was largely carbs. Larger community level changes are also needed, there’s a lot of research on this as well. A great help was allowing people to use food stamps at farmers markets for example.
I would say it’s better that he is balanced. All food is good.
If he was vegan, he would be great to animals too, which would make him even greater in the context!
He could be helping humans AND animals at the same time. It's not an either-or scenario.
Thank you, Rich Roll, once again. I'd not heard about Layne before, and now my life is better. Layne, what an effort you must put in, to have become such a credible health science filter for good information. Thank you!
Layne is a freakin hero no bias such good studies interpretation. the way he explains things. this was soo informative and really comfortable to watch and everything is so understandable yet explained very intelligently. loved this!
Thanks for bringing Layne on... I love watching semi-opposite ends of the diet spectrum as it keeps me balanced.
Great interview. 👏 I do think that while diet choices are not binary for weight loss and adherence, they're pretty close to binary for the environment and longevity, no? I don't know any earth scientists (I am one) or actual longevity researchers (Attia is not one) who think diets with a lot of meat work in their fields.
Really great discussion Rich & Layne - what I truly love about all these podcasts is it creates better SELF AGENCY for everyone. Thank you both for all you do in educating, informing, aligning. Peace. Plants.
Another awesome conversation. Thanks to you both for your time and insights. So much of this spoke to me.
I'm halfway through and this is a great conversation. Very accessible and engaging.
I really enjoyed this episode. I follow Dr. Norton for about a year now, since I saw him on the Huberman lab. He gives really good information. I like his What the Fitness videos & Educational videos. I am now on a fitness program with a fitness & nutrition coach. We measure everything. I found out at the start that I was already eating more than 2g/kg of protein every day (I am very light, and I eat a lot). I did gain muscle mass in this training program of 8 weeks (5 strength workouts per week, 1 day cardio, 1 day liss). Now going for round two next week. The great thing of gaining muscle mass on a plant based diet is that it's so low in saturated fats, and so high in fiber. I am lifelong vegetarian, and vegan since 2017.
This may be my favourite rich episode ❤ thank you layne 🤯
Love Layne!!! He is such a trusted authority on nutrition!
Would just like to say, I gained a deeper respect for @richroll as a result of this conversation. His preparation was impeccable, and his subject matter expertise was really evident.
Agreed! Excellent interviewer
Just listened to this for the third time. These two brilliant men give me comfort and hope. Thank whatever benevolent power in the universe put them here. ❤
I appreciate this convo, there's so much nuance. I think people get so up in arms about nutrition because it is literally who we are. We are what we eat, so when that is challenged it can feel deeply critical regarding our choices, preferences, blindspots, and insecurities. Layne looks so much like Joey Carbstrong, someone who'd be great on the pod. Rich, your beard is at its maximum glory.
Thank you Rich for these interviews that you do . I love that you do so much research in your shows . You are inspiring many lives !
This is going to be a good one. I am a huge follower of Layne and his content. He has helped me so much!
I love that you had Layne on the show! One of the few people I trust along with you in nutritional spaces.
You are fighting the good fight Layne. I’ve always had great respect for you and you actually motivated me with this discussion to not give up trying to tackle this whole health thing. 🙂
BEST 3+ hours I’ve spent in listening hours in a minute…thank you Layne and Rich!!🙏🙌
Layne is the GOAT. Unbiased and so informative.
Thank you SO MUCH for talking about lectins. I have been needlessly worried the last few years wondering if my eating lectins was doing harm!
Really appreciate that you cover the entire spectrum of possibilities with your guess. It’s important to be open minded however , he did not make me change my mind at all. Plant based for life ….and love as a mojo !
Thanks for bringing great people on ❤
Always impressed by your podcasts, thanks for you professional approach with all your guests.
Layne is the best! Love listening to him !
I just wanted to comment from the other end. I've watched Layne's stuff for a long time, and watched this initially because of him. I didn't know until about a 1/3 of the way through the podcast that Rich was plant-based, because there was no hesitation or gravitation away from discourse or the science being presented. I appreciate Rich's openness to both human congenial conversation and for non-dogmatic approaches.
This is great! Love seeing some of the meat eaters finally cheering on fiber and plant based foods for microbiome. Thank you rich for this! Im trying to be open to hearing more from these kind of folks although never changing my vegan diet
1:54:00 this whole Shame Spiral discussion is massive. So glad I got recommended this podcast by the YT Algo. Also just ordered Finding Ultra. thanks Rich and Layne. Dopamine Nation was a great book on this addiction topic
As an endocrine therapist and nutritionist I totally respect Layne Norton....cuts through all the crap and gets to the science...and not just cherry picking data.
Great talk! Layne is the man and Rich looks so good with some extra muscle!
Cannot WAIT to listen to this whole 3+ hour interview!
Thank you for giving us a reputable source of nutritional information, great work.
This is extremely helpful and informative, thank you gentlemen
Man, I love your content, Rich! Thanks, brother.
this was a really good interview full of information and insights, thanks for putting this out there.
I coach a girls xc team, and I'm finding this podcast to be very helpful. This is an antidote to the flood of craziness that's out there. 🎉
💯💯oh my gosh, the part where you mentioned about Ethan’s storey and him saying “ if the house is on fire just get out of the house, figure out what caused the fire later “ huge light bulb 💡 moment 👌💯
Thank you both for this episode..sharing widely.
Amazing episode! I have never seen Layne before! Following now ❤
Thank you for this excellent information and wonderful interview Rich! As a 90 percent raw vegan I eat a lot of fresh fruits and vegetables and I love it! Occasionally a will have a small amount of grain and cooked vegetables. God bless you and thank you again 🙏🙏
Wise, educated and really cool dude. Thank you guys!
I got SO MUCH out of this interview. Thank you both.
Love what Rich says at 1:39, I feel the same way myself. While some things can be obvious, there are still so many variables in different platforms at play of any one individual.
Layne Norton is great! Watch some of his videos, with an open mind/ear. Layne does not villanize any diet/food, he simply, explains the scientific breakdown of various studies/data and explains it so that even us, with biases, can understand. What he does do is, "debunks" influencers who cherry-picks one detail/claim to villanize a particular food, food group and/or diet, to fit their narrative/agenda. Layne Norton is someone to trust with the info/content he puts out. He explains how he works/thinks, in this video, if you watched it to the end. He makes total sense! 💕👍 💕
I'm a senior who had a heart attack (,Minoca, no blockage). My hdl is high with my trigs low and ldl high. I'm going off red meat for my ldl. I liked what Rich said about rolling the dice. Thanks guys. Good talk.
Wow - kudos to both these guys for doing this. I kind of thought of them as "polar opposites" but this is proof that people can find common ground if they choose to. Diet doesn't need to be a religious war--
I have higher LDL, high HDL and low triglycerides combo they mention at 26mins. I have asked the doctor if it's really a problem with that combo. Layne's statement that you could be healthier with lower LDL and that combo makes it simple and clearer
What a legend. Loved listening to this.
I'd be interested to know if he's ever read any of the studies about telomeres and longevity and plant-based vs animal product protein.
Isnt part of the anti seed oil stuff about the smoke point of them when used in high heat cooking?
I'm curious why when the topic of B12 comes up, no one ever seems to mention seaweed as a way to supplement? I wrap up salad greens in organic Nori seaweed sheets all the time. They have Iodine as well. Am I missing something?
Yes and chlorella as well, as the most scientifically documented sources, but other sources are emerging as active b12 sources
I love how Rich rationalizes the vegan side of things too (the protein conversation for example) just such a big fan of this whole conversation amd everything about it
I haven’t watched a rich roll podcast in a while. I mostly listen. When did Rich get guns!?💪🏻
Great interview! Thanks!!
1:45:28 I wasn't bullied but my mom was kinda crazy so got the same issues receiving feedback. Thanks Layne
Brilliant interview, thanks
Food is culture. It’s heritage. It’s one of the things you partake of daily. Sharing a meal is huge. That’s what makes people buy in so deeply.
Rich, I’m from a war zone and I’ve been through a lot of devastating circumstances. You are absolutely one of my favorite people in the world!! You really saved my life and in many ways I owe my life to you. I’m excited to share my story of transformation with you at some point and what a leading role you played in it.
But I also wanted to share how your stance on diet has been a bit troubling for me. I am suffering from colitis and IBS and nothing I’ve tried helped me manage my symptoms. Carnivore diet was the only thing that fixed my symptoms and I’ve improved by 80-90%. I don’t like the diet and I’m not really a carnivore enthusiast. But I must say I can’t argue how beneficial it has been for me based my personal hands-on experience.
I wanted to share just to provide a different perspective.
Love what you do and please continue changing lives!! You’re my biggest inspiration and I have a photo of you in my room and my phone wallpaper 😂
exclusion diets and anecdotes are well covered in the podcast
layne's biceps actually make him more credible in my mind. i'm glad to see you too hashing it out; i'll look forward to the whole episode ! *peace*
Omg.yes 55:47 im wearing a G7 right now and found myself .. well going crazy.. but after a spike withinna hour it leveled out.. so now im just using it to compare tonny mental state . And what im eating and what my number ks cocmpared tonhow i feel .. trying to reduce stress and anxiety .. fatigue.. sleep ect
Seed oils were brought to attention as. being detrimental to health by Dr. Caldwell Esselstyn , Cardiologist who says that research shows the damaging affects on the heart and specifically the endothelial lining. He is now just one of quite a few Cardiologists who agree with him and the research that is now out there. Again, we are speaking about the oil (refined) not from the whole source.
Yes esselstyn doesn't allow meat or saturated fat either as well as not allowing other oils for heart health. He's big on consuming lots or green leafy plants.
@@marleriYes, all oils not just seed.
Esselstyn does not single out seed oils. He singles out oils period, and even fat content from whole foods. He is not doing this based on science. He points to one "study" where people consumed a large amount of oils and it measured their "endothelial health" based on this test called "flow mediated dilation." And extrapolated this to mean that oil consumption would permanently harm the endothelium, but there's no outcome data that isolates oil as a singular cause of such harm. Esselstyn doesn't want his patients even eating nuts or avocados he's so fat-phobic.
Dr Esselstyn is not and has never been a cardiologist. He was a surgeon.
Seed oils increase LDL susceptibility to oxidation which is injurious to the endothelium and potentiates atherosclerosis ultimately. Let these oils lubricate machinery, but not mankind.
2:49:00 I'm glad I powered through the first 30min of this video. It was indeed quite technical at the beginning, but then I started getting it.
This was such a good conversation.
amazing!!!! love your podcasts always😍
Hi Richard, really enjoy your podcasts
1:34:00 about tribalism is pure gold, thanks you! 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻❤️
It was stated at 24:35 onwards that high level of LDL was atherogenic and ‘causative of a risk factor for heart disease’. It can’t be both. It is rather causative or it’s a risk factor. There has been no literature showing that LDL is causative of heart disease but only that the presence of high density LDL is often present in atheromatous plaques. This begs the accusation of were the firemen there to put out the fire or did they cause the fire?
High levels of LDL track with heart disease because the more of it you have in circulation, the more oxidizable substrate there is. Native LDL may be a risk factor, but it's actually entirely benign and not disimilar to ApoB, has literally zero part in the causal pathway of CVD. Only/until LDL becomes oxidized can it be atherogenic.
It can be both though. Risk factors can be causative or associative.
@@739jep Right. If something is causative, it is associative, but not necessarily vice versa.
@@JasonActualization yes of course. But the op said ‘It is rather causative or it’s a risk factor’
In reality it can be both it’s not an either or situation.
@@739jep I would agree with you. What OP is insinuating however is indeed the case which is that LDL is not causal, but rather, associative. Higher LDL associates with CVD because it means there is more oxidizable substrate. Native LDL is not atherogenic unless/until it becomes oxidized. This is also why we see atherosclerosis ensue predominately in arteries and not veins (both vessels have the same lipoprotein concentration, but it's the former that is oxygen-rich resulting in greater rates of oxidation). In the end, it's not the amount of native cholesterol and lipoproteins or even ApoB (which also tracks with CVD because it indicates how much oxidizable substrate is circulating) in circulation that matters, as none of these are involved in the actual pathogenesis, but rather, it's the absolute amount of oxidized lipoproteins relative to ones HDL and antioxidant status that matters most.
Great guest
Thank you
Layne is the 🐐
The back half of this podcast is really amazing. All the psychology stuff. 🧠
The fact that things like very active cardio, hiit and so on leads to great electrolytes lossthar leads to massive hunger thar leads to overeating and "i can treat myself today" (and its never the right foods that your body is actually trying to get) really needs to be talked about more because this is the most common mistake for newbies in fitness
This is the exact conversation I've been looking for. I've crept up into the near diabetic range and took it serious finally. Gone low carb, getting my 10,000 steps and added body weight training. Down 30 pounds and glucose below 90 consistently. However, I KNOW I'm better off closer to plant based than animal but have been using animal protein to get things in order. The biggest problem I have is getting fiber being low carb. I think my approach will be after 6 months in this phase, start adding back lentils and some quinoa in small doses and measure my glucose and see how I respond. Not easy for me to get my lipid profile other than once a year, but may need to start using Quest to get lipids every 6 months and pay out of pocket to get an idea where I'm heading with certain eating patterns 6 months at a time. It's going to be a long process but I'll have it dialed in eventually.
❤️👊🏻💯 oh man such a great pod, Layne is such a powerhouse, Rich you are also ❤️💯👊🏻 get Ethan if possible 🙋🏻♂️
One of the reasons Dr Gardner's twin study was not isocaloric was to compare satiety between the diets.
like i said, it's not a criticism, just limitation
I would love to be part of a study. I lost almost 130lbs in my 20's, I am now in my 50s and have never regained any of my weight. Never YoYo'd, maintained within the typical 5ish pounds all this time. All through changing my diet and daily exercise.
What did you do? Congrats by the way.
Thank you!! I did what nobody wants to hear. I cut my portions, eat 3 balanced meals a day, drink 90oz of water a day (Coffee in the morning), walk as much as I can (I have a sit down job) and lift weights 5 days a week. I also have always kept Saturated fats low, I lost my weight in the low fat era so that is just what I've always done just because it's always worked for me@@jerryyono7306
What a great episode, thank you. Can I ask why you wear both a Whoop and an Apple Watch or Garmin? What do you get from the Whoop that you do not get from your other devices?
Informative. Good guest!
As a medical doctor I agree with a lot of what has been said here from both sides. That being said, it is important to recognize that the large amount of calories required to maintain muscle, as the most metabolically active tissue in the body, is balanced by the fact that overall caloric reduction and increasing fibre and good sources of plant protein, which produces a markedly different insulin and leptin response, has tremendous health benefits and reduces all-cause mortality.
Excellent presentation. Well Done, Sirs.
Great interview!
Great podcast!!
Please interview Gil Carvalo from Nutrition made simple too!!!!! :)
The counter-argument I could see to the “get all your protein in capsule format” argument is that protein is very satiating. It makes you feel full. I have never had a more filling diet, one that left me so stuffed I couldn’t eat anymore and kept me full all day, than one that contains a serving of lean protein (whatever that means for you) and 2 servings of fruit or vegetables (non-starchy) for every meal. No snacks but that’s for practical reasons, I couldn’t eat them if I wanted to.
I use that to cut before climbing season and man… it is difficult to actually eat enough calories to fuel me on that. Has nothing to do with the macros, just practically speaking it’s very difficult to over-eat that way, almost to a fault.