I’ve never sent a book either I’ve been thinking about getting some of them graded because I have a lot of big keys but this is one of the reasons why I still haven’t. I think if I so I’m gonna go with cbcs
I grade coins and my tip is take scans and close up pictures of anything you thing would show uniqueness for that very reason..old coins have unique minute scratches or toning which would help in a court case of switching out or destruction.
Personally if that happened to me I wouldn’t submit another book ever ! All confidence GONE . And their policy of no accountability is ridiculous. 🤦🏻♂️ I can feel your pain !
CBCS has figured out a way to get around this problem!! Is CGC so sure in their hold on the comic grading market that they are not even gonna try to fix this problem??
Cgc has a strangle hold on the hobby and probably will continue to for a while. While cbcs has caught up a bit I believe there is on average about a 20% difference in value. It makes no sense to me but that's just the way collectors feel. Money talks my friend and it's pretty much number one on most collectors minds.
It always boggled my mind the concept of a "permanent grade". Be it oxidation, humidity or blunted ends/corners while encapsulated... Sellers will still default to the graded price. The same way you know one of your books is mint condition raw.. You will still get ripped off for insane money because it isn't slabbed. It's a catch 22 because you also do not want to have it graded over and over subjecting it to wear.
Yeah, I expect the issue of “post-grading condition decline” to become more significant in the coming years. Among other things, it’s going to cause pressure on grading companies to put a date on the slab indicating when the comic was graded.
Grading is subjective, you could think you have a 9.8 but actually get back at 9.2 in wasted your money when you could’ve sold it for a higher grade being raw.
There needs to be an Association of CGC graders and services all over the country where you can take your books to a certifier in a LCS and have it graded right in front of you. Sort of like certified Notary Publics.
I have a set of CBCS graded, and I have a set currently at CGC, but I knew I would need to decide on a primary company. This is helping back away from CGC and go with CBCS. Yes, CGC has a better resale price, but CBCS seems to have a better slab.
Wow, sorry about your book. Was this an older slab? I was under the impression that the newer slabs did not have the issue of books moving in them. I must say although I don't always agree with your takes I do respect your knowledge and thoughts. That being said I have to agree with you in this case, as this is a situation where CGC needs to be accountable and they should have some type of remediation process for when things like this happen. I think it's important to have people like yourself and others call out CGC and the other grading companies when they have clearly made a mistake. If we are entrusting our dollars to them and they are profiting from us they have not just an obligation but a duty to improve their processes and take accountability when necessary. Thanks for your video.
CGC does not have the standards they use to have. That sucks they ruined your book. Ever since they were sold, I have noticed more content creators have issues with them.
DOES CGC have a QC department? It sure doesn't seem like it to me. I did a 36-book prescreen earlier this year, and 28 books got slabbed. Of the 28, 7 came back in damaged cases (received in boxes with 0 damage). 7 of 28, that's 25%! I sent the 7 back as mechanical errors, but when I got those back, 2 showed damage yet again!! (And again, in a box with 0 damage.) 2 of 7, that's 28.6%! I don't believe that they HAVE a QC department, or if they do, they're doing an abhorrent job of it.
That happens more than you think. The book moves in the case. If it's too tight in one area of the book, when it moves it pinches the area thats tight to the book causing it to rip. Usually it's the spine that gets pinched causing the staples to pull detaching the cover. Can't really put the same pressure all over the book because it's not the same thickness all over. CGC tried something to improve it years ago, but it caused alot of damage to books. I had a 9.8 asm 298 signed by MacFarlane get it's cover completely detached in the case. I now store all my CGCs laying down. So no chance of them moving in the case.
Sorry to hear this-the books we buy as collectors mean so much to us-cgc is so big now that cases like yours seem to happen way too frequently-hope it all works out for the best
I agree to a certain extent. However, l personally like to get actors to sign books of characters that they played. Now the books are from my personal collection. They aren't high end books. Their low grade books mostly.
I’ve gotten quite a few of my vintage back issues signed such as my Golden Age Spirit comics from the early 1940’s signed by Will Eisner among some others, but these are part of my own personal collection and there’s no way I would ever get them slabbed and sealed away. Mylar and an acid free Full Back and box is all I need for them.
@@ooneybird27 Well I use nothing but 2 mil Super Golden Age Mylar Mylites and acid free Full Back boards and acid free boxes as well from Gerber and I keep them away from light and at a cool temperature, and I’ve been collecting Golden Age comics since the late 1980’s and early 1990’s and have never had problems with gassing or off white and yellowing boards and I’m rereading my 11 box collection pretty regularly with literal kid gloves made out of latex, if I used Polyethylene bags and more cheap run of the mill backing boards I might be more concerned there but I’d never dream of using those for my Golden Age & Platinum Age comics. I own a handful of high grade GA comics such as a 7.0 Marvel Mystery Comics #45 that I bought back in 1991 and it still has a glossy Alex Schomburg cover and white pages and I’ve never kept it in anything but an archival Mylar and acid free board and acid free box and it’s still a higher grade book that looks as pristine as the day I bought it. Most of my other books of that era are 2.0-4.0 or so, but I keep them all in Mylar regardless. Archival supplies may cost more but they’re worth it in the long term.
As long as the signature is placed in a nice spot and isn't huge it really can infancy the book almost like a date stamp can. A AMS 300 signed by Stan Lee is way more coveted than a non signed one because frankly the non signed ones out number the signed ones by a huge amount. So I totally disagree with you on that. With that said except for signatures like Stan and maybe a few artists I prefer mo signature in the cover.
I too am a CGC fan. The presentation alone makes me love the product. With that said, I use CGC to protect my Comics not damaged him. When I hear that comics are being damaged while in the slab, it makes me second-guess if that is the route that I want to go.
I've had a Hulk 180, 181 and Spider-Man 101 all damaged while with CBCS or the outside company that they recommended for cleaning and pressing. Now they have inhouse pressing services but it might well be the same service. I mention the cleaning and pressing service because my Hulk 181 came back with foxing on the back cover in a grid pattern from a humidity chamber . I stopped using CBCS and haven't submitted anything to CGC in over 2 years. The last batch of books I submitted for cleaning and pressing before grading came back looking like they were never touched . Whether the books reverted back to pre-pressed condition before they were graded, or if they were never pressed, I'll never know.
I also had a damaged cgc book. I crack out most of my books unless they're a really big key. I had an avengers #51 in 8.5 and when I tried to remove it from the inner sleeve, it was stuck like it had been glued along the spine to the sleeve. The only way to remove it without damaging it was to cut the inner sleeve and leave it stuck to the cover.
This happened to me a few weeks back. I sent in my FF48 for a simple Re-encapsulation. Cgc returns my book with a severely damaged case. I sent it back and they game me a new case but This time they returned the book to me without the custom FF label that i initially sent It in. Finally after the 3rd try they returned the book back to me but this time a chunk was missing in the book! They are now asking me to return the book to be “looked at”. By their claim team. I’ve never handled the book since owning it. Any and all reencapsulation of this book was performed by cgc. It remains unclear what CGCs claim team need to “look at”when they are the one who actually handled the book! What I am expecting is they will now regrade it and reduce the existing grade due to the new damages (caused by cgc). The problem with all of this is that this was acquired at the current grade for more than the current FMV. Cgc will ultimately send me a much lower graded book And refund me the difference between the initial grade and the new grade based on current fmv(and not what i paid for it)Ultimately I will loose! Matt Nelson and the people at cgc simply do Not care! Like you I WAS a cgc fan and was reslabbing this book to ensure it continued to preserve nicely. I am highly upset about all of this and not sure what to do. Sorry this happened to you but this seems to be a serious problem at cgc that is affecting us. Matt Nelson take action!
I have some cracked cases that I would love to get reholdered but after going on the CGG forums and seeing the horror show some people experience I decided it's just not worth the risk. Especially on high value books. Hopefully CGC will help you since there is no damage to the case.
So sorry to hear about your experience stickygoose, absolutely devastating. I have a few boxes of pristine bronze age books that I bought off the racks that I don't think I will ever send in for grading. I'd rather sell them raw at a lower price than watch a book I've cherished and preserved for 40 years get battered beyond repair due to a faulty encapsulation design. I remember when I first learned about shaken comic syndrome (SCS) a few years ago, what a blow to the gut. I was convinced the CGC design was foolproof. After reading various threads, I immediately reviewed my books and sure enough roughly 5% have SCS damage. All of my graded books are 9.4 or higher so there's just no way those folded corners, edges, etc. factored into the grade. Buyers, beware books with low quality images or with no back-cover images. Pay close attention to all edges, especially the top and bottom right sides (but the top and the bottom edge, as in this video, are also susceptible). Torn staples, on the other hand, are almost impossible to detect unless you're actually holding the book in your hands. IMO the fees CGC charges are already border-line scandalous and if their product isn't either fully guaranteed or iron-clad, they're never going to put their hands on any of my books. Here's a CGC board thread (ruined Giant Size X-men in 9.8): boards.cgccomics.com/topic/466876-shaken-comic-syndrome-warn-buyers/#comment-11266423
Question, so if this book was already signed (7:52), why would the slab label be blue? I thought any type of signature would make this book be a green label if it's not a verified/witnessed signature, correct? I have been snubbed by CGC a couple of times as well recently. Both times were from sending flawless raw 9.8 copies of books in for a CGC SS only to get them back with a 9.6! I was extremely disappointed as well, and I'm sure the books were mishandled on their end. I tried pleading my case to CGC w close-up photos of the books taken and recorded before sending them in, but they "weren't able to do anything about it." Their service has been such a disgrace since 2019 from my xp and what I've been hearing as well.
They F’d that book up bad. I bought an X-Men 129 graded. Noticed the inside of the comic was slightly askew from the cover once it was delivered. Had a hunch… cracked it and the cover was indeed detached. Clearly damaged during encapsulation.
I have some key books I would love to get graded, but can't risk the possible shenanigans that could possibly occur. The only way I would allow my books to be graded is if I was standing right there in foot to a$$ range.
Thank you for your video about CGC damaging your ASM. I took have a damage book. The book is Fantastic 4 #1 Clayton Crain cover. I have those newton rings on the book right in the middle.😢
I applaud your integrity of you truly couldn't sell this book as a 9.6. From my conversations online, there are MANY who have zero issues with selling it as a 9.6 and would likely have just one picture to show the front and the grade.
I feel for you. I sent my 9.6 Amazing Spider-Man 300 to CGC for the Toddy signing, and got it back a 9.2! I was so disappointed. I cant help but think they 'man handled' the book and regraded it. OR the book's cleaning & pressing reverted after a few years. I dont know. I'm debating if i should send it back to get pressed & cleaned and reholdered. I know my story doesnt compare to yours, but they def need to rethink their slabbing technology. Otherwise CBCS is going to be getting new customers. thank you for the transparency.
I have a lot of very high grade Bronze Age books in my collection and am fearful of the same thing happening to me. The one and only time I used CGC was after I purchased a lower grade copy of FF 5 from my Comic Book shop. He agreed to send it to CGC using his account for grading. We both knew it was probably a 2.5 to 3.5 copy with some staining on the back cover. The interior is OW/W and presents well. To my dismay it came back with a detached cover and was graded 2.5. My comic shop guy and I both knew the cover was attached when we sent it and while it wasn’t attached as tight as a new book, it also wasn’t just hanging by a thread. So someone at CGC must have given it the rough treatment when opening the book. So I have a FF 5 now in a blue label at 2.5 that clearly says detached cover on the label! Since then I have not sent any books from my PC to get graded. The only graded books I have are from eBay purchases that are already graded.
It was more than likely damaged during the process of encapsulation. I've had books come back 9.8 with damage like bad bends on a card stock foil cover almost 6 inches across the book. No way that happens after encapsulating, and no way it hits a 9.8 with those bends either. They have too many people handling these books that have no clue what they're doing and do not care.
Yes I’ve had the same problem my 9.8 spider man #1 signed & sketch by Mike Mayhew the A variant has a been bent in the case and has the Newton rings it’s very frustrating that my comic had been damaged inside the cgc case especially something as valuable as this cgc needs to figure something out to where nothing can happen to the comic after grading
Sent an absolutely perfect venom lethal protector #1 Newsstand edition in for the Bagley SS event. When I finally got my submission back they sent me a 9.0 direct edition.... CGC told me they dont differentiate between editions.. long story short I fought with them and still never got my book back.😒
Thats too bad, thats a nice key too. I had sent 10 issues in to CGC last summer and soon as I sent them I got senders remorse. I thought they were all 9.6 -9.8's, they came back and the scores were any where from an 8.5 and higher. IDK if I can keep sending my books to CGC, they just seem off their game this year. (Yes I know they hired a whole new staff). Great Video, sry about that damaged book.
CGC and other grading companies need to understand, while there is a chance of damage to what ever it is they are grading. We pay so much for the trust, expertise and care that these companies advertise to create this whole aura of why we grade items. We grade items to maintain/preserve the condition and value and to ensure the authenticity of a specific item. They need to be accountable for this, if not...they should not be in business. I understand mistakes happen, but to have a blanket agreement that when under their care they are not liable. Makes no sense
This is hilarious. That's what you all get for falling for the gimmick that is CGC. Comics are meant to be read not to be encased in a plastic death tomb. IMO, anyone who grades a comic isn't a true comic fan.
Yeah I'll buy a comic already graded if the price isn't that much higher than raw but I wouldn't send any raw books in until things get a little cleaned up
I sent in a SUPER clean copy of ASM #55 (the Gleason cover) and it came back a 9.0 with bends to the cover. I've considered sending it in for a press and reholder, but I've just had it sitting around. Kinda disheartening to think of it coming back a 9.4 or 9.6
Was the damage caused during shipping from CGC or from just handling the slab? I am not a fan of slabs as I prefer my comics RAW, however I do "Slab to Sell".....
@@Stickygoose yes. It is the series with the chimpanzee with glasses who is head of CGC quality control. CGC viewed it as a mechanical error without regrading, only reslabed.
I’m sorry that happened, I’d be furious if it were mine. But also, signed on the inside and still got a 9.6 blue label? How does that work? At best it should get a green label or the writing would be a significant hit to the grade. What do the graders notes say?
Signature's on the inside have always been allowed on the inside for the blue label at any grade and can get a blue label on the cover at low grade, you just don't get credit for who signed it.
Are you sure that maybe you didn't overlook the damage when you got it in? I've never seen that happen later down the line. And did CGC not notate "Todd McFarlane" written on 1st page?? I don't see it on the Label. I'm sorry to hear that's happened. My Team-Up 141 (tied with ASM 252 / Spectacular Spider-Man 90 for 1st Black Suit appearance) CGC 9.4 has a similar issue, but on the right side of the book opposite spine. I've seen the issue with quite a few Slabs of books from the 80's and 90's. Part of the cover edge has been creased down for about 1.5 inches. It looks mostly pressable, but I'm afraid there's a 1/16" tear also from it (it's hard to tell cuz of the angle and it being Encapsulated).
I had a 1 inch tear on a book along the spine that I sent into the Mcfarlane singing, when I saw it came at a 3.5 I knew something was really off. That tear went from 1 inch to about 6 or more.
Did u show us the newton rings? That tear on the back bottom didnt happen when your graded comic fell from the wall or during shipping back to you or shaking since inside sleeve could be tighter on outside edges? Did you take pics of the comic before you sent it away? That sucks if the back page got torn when the book was moved in maybe different directions. I dont know anything about comic book gradings.
@@User8vfjhejf. SCS is rare but more common then it should be. The question is whether it’s worth it to slab a book if you are not selling it. It’s not really a safe way to protect a book, and how much does that grade reflect the condition of the book 3, 5, 10, 25 years down the road. Grading should only be used to sell or to verify the condition of newly purchased book. There are better, cheaper, more effective way t9 protect books.
@@User8vfjhejf but he has taken a big hit ! Didn’t realise they don’t take responsibility for any damage. That’s me finished with CGC . What a horror story 😢
I bought two book soff eBay ( two different sellers) that did the same thing. In the original photos there’s clearly no damage but when it arrived it had the same type of damage. There was no damage to the packaging or to the slab itself. Thankfully they were not expensive books and both sellers issued refunds but this is more common than people think.
I got a first bane appearance in 9.2. Broke in shipping. Pieces floating around inside. And cracked corner. Pieces were inside box was shipped in. Did not pack it right. No protection really. Only one slip of thin bubble looking paper. Only 1 out of 30 slabs ordered that came broken. Seller did not accept returns. But if you know your eBay rights like I do, you can get a refund through eBay. But only buy from returns accepted sales. Way easier.
Love the honesty sticky. I too would be angry about the poor handling of this book. If they had put the book down to the bottom there is a good chance it would not have happened
What’s up with your FF 48 getting such a low score, I was on another comic channel and his FF 48 was basically the same grade. I guess no one showed Galactus any love back in the day.😓
What I prefer to do is to crack my own cases and then I double mylar the book and i stuff it full of microchamber paper cut the same size as the book it looks better that way and you don't have that inner poly that is bad for the comic book
I just submitted an ASM 238 Newstand WITH Tattoo, and it was returned with a green label. I emailed CGC about it with photos I took before submission…are they stealing tattoos!? Really hope they make it right…This happen to anyone else?
I grade to preserve my comics and not resell. I will never use CGC again after multiple quality control failures such as: receiving wrong books back, poor quality return of cases. Im now useing EGS. I gotta say EGS has way more sturdier cases and ive never had an issue with my books from them.
It’s also why I didn’t send anything already slabbed to the signing i don’t like the idea that if it’s damaged and gets a lower grade they’re not at fault makes me feel like they’re not professional or careful enough to be opening your comic Which is odd because I’ve seen ordinary collectors on UA-cam open a slab without issues or damage but certified experts need liability protections 🤨
I’m so sorry about your book. CGC has gotten really bad with QA. I just had a Daredevil 158 in a 9.6 go to the Frank Miller signing and it’s coming back a 7.5. Clearly something happened to the book while in CGC’s possession.
That sucks man, are you sure there is even an inner well? Because that is pretty crazy amount of damage after encapsulation. I have definitely seen books damaged after encapsulation. The books move around inside I have seen staples get detached because the cover is stationary and the spine has pressure on it which slowly pushes the pages out. I have seen books sealed into the inner well. I've seen corners get rounded but never seen tears and damage like that.
That's heartbreaking. Especially how a supposed legit business denies any accountability even when a product is literally damaged while in their possession and during handling. Who does that? What did you end up doing with this asm 300? You ever address it with cgc?
@@Stickygoose i've heard and read much about this topic in the past. The sales data is not conclusive enough imo and sentiment varies strongly. I think its maybe a brand vs value debate (I see more value in better quality holder/cases and more consistent grading standards). if you're in the flipping game then the brand perception "might" be a factor in some cases, but overall I would still strongly recommend CBCS for overall quality myself.
I’ll tell you this about my experiences with CGC recently. I also submitted an ASM 300. I was hoping for somewhere in the 9s. 9.0 minimum…. Got 8.5, was kinda sad…. Shoulda sucked it up. I resubmitted the book and it came back this time 7.5. So I’ve already spent 100$. I’m gonna try a third time. And I bet you dollars to donuts it’ll probably come back 8.0 and I’ll just leave it. Wishing I stuck with the 8.5 Your book in comparison would come back 6.5 if the same grader did our books…. I’ve gotten 2.0 on some nice silver age books recently that I was expecting probably 4.0? Maybe 4.5. And I’m looking at my books at 2.0 and then I go to eBay and I’m seeing books that are 2.5 that are missing huge chunks out of the cover. Are they trying to create a business out of resubmitting books?
Did you clean and press the book when you resubmitted? I'm not sticking up for CGC here, I'm generally curious if you thought you'd just get a better grade on a gamble without actually doing any improvements to possible defects on the comics, because that's not really how it works.
i don't get why people ship their comics to them... especially expensive ones just to have it shipped back to you and it moving around everywhere like just take it yourself or don't get it graded
Shame on CGC, they did me wrong several times in a signature series and normal grading encapsulation. They don't give a craop and never admited their mistake. They are a bad company !
Their updated policy for Rings and mechanical errors are absurd rings don’t fall under error even though CBCS doesn’t have that issue And it’s 14 day return and it must be sent back by original submitter not sure how that works if you sent it to a 3rd party for a signing But it feels like CGC is trying to make the process so complicated that you’ll just give up and they don’t have to fix what quality control should’ve never approved before shipping out I have one book with them nothing expensive but I’m absolutely worried about how they’ve stored it for 2 months for the signing Being put in their vault sounds fancy and safe but what if that just means it’s just thrown in a box in a room they call the vault I love the idea of protecting old books and grading them so you don’t have to guess and possibly over pay i even like the idea that they’ll slab signed Sketches I definitely don’t like the idea though about paying for a service and when something goes wrong they wash their hand of acceptability and it’s wild that they get away with it Any other place like if someone sells you a bad car there’s lemon laws to protect the buyer from a dealership’s failing upkeep or if that car was damaged in a flood and they didn’t disclose that to you That’s definitely a tough situation cause you could sell as long as you disclose the damage but you’ll definitely be taking a hit on both what you paid and what someone is willing to spend regardless of damage
Aside from CGC sending a book back with Newton rings how are they responsible for the damage? It was not in their care at all. You state the book moved from one location to another including a plastic storage box, it is possible that placing it in said box at one time or another the slab was placed down too hard and the damage occurred. I have no doubt you handle slabs with care but knowing that the books move inside of the slab itself being a "well known issue" there can be no blame other than on the one handling the slab. As unfortunate as it is. It is very very rare for any product to come out that is perfect after even two or three attempts. Hopefully they figure out a better way sooner than later but with time comes improvements.
You don’t explain how this got damaged. I don’t see how this book got damaged simply by sitting in a box for some time. I’m not sure how this is cgc’s fault. Unless they damaged it before encapsulation. There is always a risk with these things. Sucks that your book is like that now though. That hurts bad. 😢
You yourself say in this video that you cannot guarantee the book stays that grade after encapsulation. So how can cgc guarantee that. And how can QC catch something that didn’t happen yet? It sounds like you damaged your book at home.
I don’t know when or how it got damaged but the book moves inside the case. It’s cgc’s fault for not securely stabilizing the book. Don’t try to blame this on me Nate dawg
There is no way that the cover peeled up the page like that after being in the slab. Also you got lucky to get a blue label 9.6 with a sig on the inside that should have gone down to at least a 9.0 or 8.5 and has color rub on back.
The grading scale is awful, books that are obvious 7.5 are getting up too 9.0. Books getting damaged are on the rise and so are the layoffs. As CGC moves into automation things will continue to get worse. Like most companies the only true thing that will hurt them is the damage to there bottom line.
Yo Goose, have you ever heard of any former CGC employees discussing their work candidly - especially foolish, shady or flat-out dishonest practices? I’ve gotta think the company receives insightful feedback from customers that the company basically ignores on the grounds that it’d reduce profits.
@@Stickygoosenope, I’m serious. I have a bunch of valuable books from back in the day and never wanted to send them out for grading precisely for this reason.
Man, how the book can get a blue label instead of green if it's signed by Todd McFarlane? You really might get a green label in case of another reholder.
I feel for you, and this comment isn't going to make you feel any better. But this is the EXACT reason why CGC's services just aren't for me. There is an inherent risk in sending your comics through the mail -- not once, but twice -- and I think the law of averages dicatates that if you do a lot of this, you are eventually going to get bit. So unless I am absolutely going to sell a book, chasing that 9.6 or 9.8 is just not worth it. And because you are an ethical guy, you can't recoup the loss, unless you can get CGC to make good on this. In the end, I get more enjoyment out of my books by being able to look at them and not take the risk of any of them leaving my sight.
If you had taken your book to CBCS, you would’ve had a yellow label certified by Beckett. And no Newton rings. I hate that this happens to you. But you might give CBCS a try. I have both and I think they’re slabs are higher quality.
525 in .... your not crazy,just honest. This is why I dont get my comics graded. You are now the 2nd collector I know that has had this happen on a book that was sent in and worth over 500 $ and came back worth less then what it was sent in as.
I bought a Ashkam from Ebay that was in a cgc case and a broke the holder and it was sticking out of the holder inside if that explains it well. I told the seller trying to be fair I'm willing to keep the book but I need you to give me a discount to send it into cgc he said no I'm just going to mail you a label for you to mail it back to them. I said no I don't want to wait either you can give me a discount and I do it myself or I can send it back to you for a full refund. So he didn't want to give me a discount so I send it back for full refund 🤷♂️ But that book that I got was the worst I have ever seen
The poor encapsulation of the comic inside the inner well is called Shaken Comic Syndrome (SCS) and has several threads in the CGC forums. Give it a look.
I have a spawn number 1 cgc 9.8 same thing happened to me there's no way it's a 9.8 anymore the book is trashed inside the case same thing the book slide down and actually ripped the cover
This really stinks for you. I stopped submitting to CGC back in December 2022. I typically send between one to two 25-book submissions per month. I got one of the submissions back with half the books damaged. I always do pre-screen 9.8 and always send 9.8 books. This time, I didn't pre-screen. They all looked like they had been dropped on the corners. No chance it was damage from mail. I got a bunch of 9.2's and 9.4's. I sent CGC photos of "before" I sent the books. I press all of my books before sending them. They didn't pay me anything for the damage they caused. Fast forward to April 2023, on the first box I received from CGC after months of not sending them anything, 10 of the books came back as "rejects." Again, all of the books had consistent damage of being dropped on the corners. I don't get it. Do they have gorillas handling our submissions? And quality control, I guess they have blind people doing this.
Damn Bro.... 9.6 ASM 300 newsstand ! Smmfh they need to do better quality control. I do it for a living and I take real pride in my work. Cgc should to. Sorry Bro. I has my 9.6 Simpsons newsstand have outrageous Newton rings. Smmfh
Any good lawyer will tell you it doesnt matter what you agree to before giving your property to a company for any service. Those disclosures are there for frivolous lawsuits. If you could show its previous state, its current condition and a professional appraisal showing the difference, its lawsuit worthy. Of course CGC knows this, and also knows that most comic book collectors wont sue for a $1000 book.
@@Stickygoose No lawyers allowed in small claims court, but you'd probably still want one to file the paperwork. But even then, I doubt anything would come from it. Call me old fashioned but I have zero graded comics. I simply dont trust them, or the technology behind their cases. There's no data saying comics in those cases are safer long term than in a regular box.
... I dont send my books to get graded because I get worried that shady people might switch it with a lower graded copy.
That’s why I don’t send out for pressing and cleaning
I’ve never sent a book either I’ve been thinking about getting some of them graded because I have a lot of big keys but this is one of the reasons why I still haven’t. I think if I so I’m gonna go with cbcs
I remember an old UA-cam video where cgc switched some kids tmnt 1, first print
I grade coins and my tip is take scans and close up pictures of anything you thing would show uniqueness for that very reason..old coins have unique minute scratches or toning which would help in a court case of switching out or destruction.
@@5x106 that was pgx
Personally if that happened to me I wouldn’t submit another book ever ! All confidence GONE . And their policy of no accountability is ridiculous. 🤦🏻♂️ I can feel your pain !
I will be letting my membership end
@@Stickygoose I'm sorry to hear that. Do you buy many Slabs on the aftermarket? That's where I now get 98% of my Slabs.
CBCS has figured out a way to get around this problem!! Is CGC so sure in their hold on the comic grading market that they are not even gonna try to fix this problem??
Yes they do. Until the market puts the same value on their cases, then CGC will continue to stomp them across the hobby.
Cgc has a strangle hold on the hobby and probably will continue to for a while. While cbcs has caught up a bit I believe there is on average about a 20% difference in value. It makes no sense to me but that's just the way collectors feel. Money talks my friend and it's pretty much number one on most collectors minds.
when people are paying for a service, companies should willingly accept responsibility for damages they caused.
Hard to prove it that’s the problem
It always boggled my mind the concept of a "permanent grade". Be it oxidation, humidity or blunted ends/corners while encapsulated... Sellers will still default to the graded price. The same way you know one of your books is mint condition raw.. You will still get ripped off for insane money because it isn't slabbed. It's a catch 22 because you also do not want to have it graded over and over subjecting it to wear.
I should have talked about that. What about books that become sun soaked are they still that grade of course not
Yeah, I expect the issue of “post-grading condition decline” to become more significant in the coming years. Among other things, it’s going to cause pressure on grading companies to put a date on the slab indicating when the comic was graded.
@@reprintranch this should have been implanted from the very beginning of their existence
Grading is subjective, you could think you have a 9.8 but actually get back at 9.2 in wasted your money when you could’ve sold it for a higher grade being raw.
There needs to be an Association of CGC graders and services all over the country where you can take your books to a certifier in a LCS and have it graded right in front of you. Sort of like certified Notary Publics.
Problem is you have to separate the person from the book
I have a set of CBCS graded, and I have a set currently at CGC, but I knew I would need to decide on a primary company. This is helping back away from CGC and go with CBCS. Yes, CGC has a better resale price, but CBCS seems to have a better slab.
I would agree with that
"Slab with CBCS and buy CGC". I'm making t-shirts of that motto. Who wants one?
Wow, sorry about your book. Was this an older slab? I was under the impression that the newer slabs did not have the issue of books moving in them. I must say although I don't always agree with your takes I do respect your knowledge and thoughts. That being said I have to agree with you in this case, as this is a situation where CGC needs to be accountable and they should have some type of remediation process for when things like this happen. I think it's important to have people like yourself and others call out CGC and the other grading companies when they have clearly made a mistake. If we are entrusting our dollars to them and they are profiting from us they have not just an obligation but a duty to improve their processes and take accountability when necessary. Thanks for your video.
This was graded in 2020 should not have happened
CGC does not have the standards they use to have. That sucks they ruined your book.
Ever since they were sold, I have noticed more content creators have issues with them.
This was back in 2020 as well
DOES CGC have a QC department? It sure doesn't seem like it to me. I did a 36-book prescreen earlier this year, and 28 books got slabbed. Of the 28, 7 came back in damaged cases (received in boxes with 0 damage). 7 of 28, that's 25%! I sent the 7 back as mechanical errors, but when I got those back, 2 showed damage yet again!! (And again, in a box with 0 damage.) 2 of 7, that's 28.6%! I don't believe that they HAVE a QC department, or if they do, they're doing an abhorrent job of it.
they do but the QC needs QC
That happens more than you think. The book moves in the case. If it's too tight in one area of the book, when it moves it pinches the area thats tight to the book causing it to rip. Usually it's the spine that gets pinched causing the staples to pull detaching the cover. Can't really put the same pressure all over the book because it's not the same thickness all over. CGC tried something to improve it years ago, but it caused alot of damage to books. I had a 9.8 asm 298 signed by MacFarlane get it's cover completely detached in the case. I now store all my CGCs laying down. So no chance of them moving in the case.
That’s a really good idea
Sorry to hear this-the books we buy as collectors mean so much to us-cgc is so big now that cases like yours seem to happen way too frequently-hope it all works out for the best
Is what it is still a great book though
I think that writing in the book (even a signature) should effect it more, it kind of shows how little people value a comic beyond it’s cover.
especially when it comes to grading
I agree to a certain extent. However, l personally like to get actors to sign books of characters that they played. Now the books are from my personal collection. They aren't high end books. Their low grade books mostly.
I’ve gotten quite a few of my vintage back issues signed such as my Golden Age Spirit comics from the early 1940’s signed by Will Eisner among some others, but these are part of my own personal collection and there’s no way I would ever get them slabbed and sealed away.
Mylar and an acid free Full Back and box is all I need for them.
@@ooneybird27 Well I use nothing but 2 mil Super Golden Age Mylar Mylites and acid free Full Back boards and acid free boxes as well from Gerber and I keep them away from light and at a cool temperature, and I’ve been collecting Golden Age comics since the late 1980’s and early 1990’s and have never had problems with gassing or off white and yellowing boards and I’m rereading my 11 box collection pretty regularly with literal kid gloves made out of latex, if I used Polyethylene bags and more cheap run of the mill backing boards I might be more concerned there but I’d never dream of using those for my Golden Age & Platinum Age comics.
I own a handful of high grade GA comics such as a 7.0 Marvel Mystery Comics #45 that I bought back in 1991 and it still has a glossy Alex Schomburg cover and white pages and I’ve never kept it in anything but an archival Mylar and acid free board and acid free box and it’s still a higher grade book that looks as pristine as the day I bought it.
Most of my other books of that era are 2.0-4.0 or so, but I keep them all in Mylar regardless. Archival supplies may cost more but they’re worth it in the long term.
As long as the signature is placed in a nice spot and isn't huge it really can infancy the book almost like a date stamp can. A AMS 300 signed by Stan Lee is way more coveted than a non signed one because frankly the non signed ones out number the signed ones by a huge amount. So I totally disagree with you on that. With that said except for signatures like Stan and maybe a few artists I prefer mo signature in the cover.
I too am a CGC fan. The presentation alone makes me love the product. With that said, I use CGC to protect my Comics not damaged him. When I hear that comics are being damaged while in the slab, it makes me second-guess if that is the route that I want to go.
This book was damaged because I chose to have it encapsulated. I took the risk and it cost me
Yeah, they damaged my ASM #129 9.0 as well. Pinched it in the encapsulation process
oh lord thats a nice book wow
😞
@@Stickygoose yeah, PC book but kinda at a loss on what to do with it.
I've had a Hulk 180, 181 and Spider-Man 101 all damaged while with CBCS or the outside company that they recommended for cleaning and pressing.
Now they have inhouse pressing services but it might well be the same service. I mention the cleaning and pressing service because my Hulk 181 came back with foxing on the back cover in a grid pattern from a humidity chamber .
I stopped using CBCS and haven't submitted anything to CGC in over 2 years. The last batch of books I submitted for cleaning and pressing before grading came back looking like they were never touched . Whether the books reverted back to pre-pressed condition before they were graded, or if they were never pressed, I'll never know.
Regardless of anything they have that says that aren't responsible, by law they still are responsible. Speak with your lawyer and he'll tell you this.
stay tuned for big update
Sorry that happened. Can ypu show the damage up close? It might be able to be fixed.
stay tuned for update video
I also had a damaged cgc book. I crack out most of my books unless they're a really big key. I had an avengers #51 in 8.5 and when I tried to remove it from the inner sleeve, it was stuck like it had been glued along the spine to the sleeve. The only way to remove it without damaging it was to cut the inner sleeve and leave it stuck to the cover.
This happened to me a few weeks back. I sent in my FF48 for a simple Re-encapsulation. Cgc returns my book with a severely damaged case. I sent it back and they game me a new case but
This time they returned the book to me without the custom FF label that i initially sent
It in. Finally after the 3rd try they returned the book back to me but this time a chunk was missing in the book! They are now asking me to return the book to be “looked at”. By their claim team. I’ve never handled the book since owning it. Any and all reencapsulation of this book was performed by cgc. It remains unclear what CGCs claim team need to “look at”when they are the one who actually handled the book! What I am expecting is they will now regrade it and reduce the existing grade due to the new damages (caused by cgc). The problem with all of this is that this was acquired at the current grade for more than the current FMV. Cgc will ultimately send me a much lower graded book
And refund me the difference between the initial grade and the new grade based on current fmv(and not what i paid for it)Ultimately I will loose! Matt
Nelson and the people at cgc simply do
Not care! Like you I WAS a cgc fan and was reslabbing this book to ensure it continued to preserve nicely. I am highly upset about all of this and not sure what to do. Sorry this happened to you but this seems to be a serious problem at cgc that is affecting us. Matt Nelson take action!
Oh man that is a crazy story! That is freaking brutal
An FF 48? Damn…
Another reason I have older Cgc slabs and am scared to get them re-encapsulated
I have some cracked cases that I would love to get reholdered but after going on the CGG forums and seeing the horror show some people experience I decided it's just not worth the risk. Especially on high value books. Hopefully CGC will help you since there is no damage to the case.
There is nothing they can do the damage is done
So sorry to hear about your experience stickygoose, absolutely devastating. I have a few boxes of pristine bronze age books that I bought off the racks that I don't think I will ever send in for grading. I'd rather sell them raw at a lower price than watch a book I've cherished and preserved for 40 years get battered beyond repair due to a faulty encapsulation design. I remember when I first learned about shaken comic syndrome (SCS) a few years ago, what a blow to the gut. I was convinced the CGC design was foolproof. After reading various threads, I immediately reviewed my books and sure enough roughly 5% have SCS damage. All of my graded books are 9.4 or higher so there's just no way those folded corners, edges, etc. factored into the grade. Buyers, beware books with low quality images or with no back-cover images. Pay close attention to all edges, especially the top and bottom right sides (but the top and the bottom edge, as in this video, are also susceptible). Torn staples, on the other hand, are almost impossible to detect unless you're actually holding the book in your hands. IMO the fees CGC charges are already border-line scandalous and if their product isn't either fully guaranteed or iron-clad, they're never going to put their hands on any of my books. Here's a CGC board thread (ruined Giant Size X-men in 9.8): boards.cgccomics.com/topic/466876-shaken-comic-syndrome-warn-buyers/#comment-11266423
That’s what happened to mine shaken comic syndrome
Question, so if this book was already signed (7:52), why would the slab label be blue? I thought any type of signature would make this book be a green label if it's not a verified/witnessed signature, correct?
I have been snubbed by CGC a couple of times as well recently. Both times were from sending flawless raw 9.8 copies of books in for a CGC SS only to get them back with a 9.6! I was extremely disappointed as well, and I'm sure the books were mishandled on their end. I tried pleading my case to CGC w close-up photos of the books taken and recorded before sending them in, but they "weren't able to do anything about it."
Their service has been such a disgrace since 2019 from my xp and what I've been hearing as well.
Inside the book not on cover
They F’d that book up bad. I bought an X-Men 129 graded. Noticed the inside of the comic was slightly askew from the cover once it was delivered. Had a hunch… cracked it and the cover was indeed detached. Clearly damaged during encapsulation.
They screwed me big time buddy
I have some key books I would love to get graded, but can't risk the possible shenanigans that could possibly occur. The only way I would allow my books to be graded is if I was standing right there in foot to a$$ range.
Thank you for your video about CGC damaging your ASM. I took have a damage book. The book is Fantastic 4 #1 Clayton Crain cover. I have those newton rings on the book right in the middle.😢
Sorry to hear that hopefully not to noticeable
The book itself is not going to slide down till it starts to tear. Definitely some shaking helped that.
It is mobile
I applaud your integrity of you truly couldn't sell this book as a 9.6. From my conversations online, there are MANY who have zero issues with selling it as a 9.6 and would likely have just one picture to show the front and the grade.
that is exactly what Im talking about
That’s why you should always inspect slabs.
I feel for you. I sent my 9.6 Amazing Spider-Man 300 to CGC for the Toddy signing, and got it back a 9.2! I was so disappointed. I cant help but think they 'man handled' the book and regraded it. OR the book's cleaning & pressing reverted after a few years. I dont know. I'm debating if i should send it back to get pressed & cleaned and reholdered. I know my story doesnt compare to yours, but they def need to rethink their slabbing technology. Otherwise CBCS is going to be getting new customers. thank you for the transparency.
that is even worse than what happened to me no question
I have a lot of very high grade Bronze Age books in my collection and am fearful of the same thing happening to me. The one and only time I used CGC was after I purchased a lower grade copy of FF 5 from my Comic Book shop. He agreed to send it to CGC using his account for grading. We both knew it was probably a 2.5 to 3.5 copy with some staining on the back cover. The interior is OW/W and presents well. To my dismay it came back with a detached cover and was graded 2.5. My comic shop guy and I both knew the cover was attached when we sent it and while it wasn’t attached as tight as a new book, it also wasn’t just hanging by a thread. So someone at CGC must have given it the rough treatment when opening the book. So I have a FF 5 now in a blue label at 2.5 that clearly says detached cover on the label! Since then I have not sent any books from my PC to get graded. The only graded books I have are from eBay purchases that are already graded.
Nice books!
It was more than likely damaged during the process of encapsulation. I've had books come back 9.8 with damage like bad bends on a card stock foil cover almost 6 inches across the book. No way that happens after encapsulating, and no way it hits a 9.8 with those bends either. They have too many people handling these books that have no clue what they're doing and do not care.
Im not sure exactly how many people come in contact with a book as it passes through
Matt Nelson claims they don't come out of the bag and board u til the graders get it...
Yes I’ve had the same problem my 9.8 spider man #1 signed & sketch by Mike Mayhew the A variant has a been bent in the case and has the Newton rings it’s very frustrating that my comic had been damaged inside the cgc case especially something as valuable as this cgc needs to figure something out to where nothing can happen to the comic after grading
Sent an absolutely perfect venom lethal protector #1 Newsstand edition in for the Bagley SS event. When I finally got my submission back they sent me a 9.0 direct edition.... CGC told me they dont differentiate between editions.. long story short I fought with them and still never got my book back.😒
Thats too bad, thats a nice key too. I had sent 10 issues in to CGC last summer and soon as I sent them I got senders remorse. I thought they were all 9.6 -9.8's, they came back and the scores were any where from an 8.5 and higher. IDK if I can keep sending my books to CGC, they just seem off their game this year. (Yes I know they hired a whole new staff). Great Video, sry about that damaged book.
Brutal when your predictions are that far off
@@Stickygoose i can look back now and see why...
Sorry to hear about that. I really appreciate your honesty here.
Try to be as transparent as possible
the "g" in "cgc" used to stand for "guaranty". What does it stand for now?
CGC and other grading companies need to understand, while there is a chance of damage to what ever it is they are grading. We pay so much for the trust, expertise and care that these companies advertise to create this whole aura of why we grade items. We grade items to maintain/preserve the condition and value and to ensure the authenticity of a specific item. They need to be accountable for this, if not...they should not be in business. I understand mistakes happen, but to have a blanket agreement that when under their care they are not liable. Makes no sense
We will see how all this handled stay tuned
This is hilarious. That's what you all get for falling for the gimmick that is CGC. Comics are meant to be read not to be encased in a plastic death tomb. IMO, anyone who grades a comic isn't a true comic fan.
That is definitely an opinion Ron
Yeah I'll buy a comic already graded if the price isn't that much higher than raw but I wouldn't send any raw books in until things get a little cleaned up
I sent in a SUPER clean copy of ASM #55 (the Gleason cover) and it came back a 9.0 with bends to the cover. I've considered sending it in for a press and reholder, but I've just had it sitting around. Kinda disheartening to think of it coming back a 9.4 or 9.6
Possibly damaged there
Was the damage caused during shipping from CGC or from just handling the slab? I am not a fan of slabs as I prefer my comics RAW, however I do "Slab to Sell".....
the comic was mobile inside the sleeve
CGC did the same thing to one of my Captain Marvel Adventures. I have a series about it. They reholdered the book and gave the same grade.
Same grade!?
@@Stickygoose yes. It is the series with the chimpanzee with glasses who is head of CGC quality control. CGC viewed it as a mechanical error without regrading, only reslabed.
I’m sorry that happened, I’d be furious if it were mine.
But also, signed on the inside and still got a 9.6 blue label? How does that work? At best it should get a green label or the writing would be a significant hit to the grade. What do the graders notes say?
Signature's on the inside have always been allowed on the inside for the blue label at any grade and can get a blue label on the cover at low grade, you just don't get credit for who signed it.
Are you sure that maybe you didn't overlook the damage when you got it in? I've never seen that happen later down the line.
And did CGC not notate "Todd McFarlane" written on 1st page?? I don't see it on the Label. I'm sorry to hear that's happened. My Team-Up 141 (tied with ASM 252 / Spectacular Spider-Man 90 for 1st Black Suit appearance) CGC 9.4 has a similar issue, but on the right side of the book opposite spine. I've seen the issue with quite a few Slabs of books from the 80's and 90's. Part of the cover edge has been creased down for about 1.5 inches. It looks mostly pressable, but I'm afraid there's a 1/16" tear also from it (it's hard to tell cuz of the angle and it being Encapsulated).
the book is completely loose in the sleeve
After reading all the comments here, I don't think I'll ever send any of my comics to be graded. Raw for life!
I had a 1 inch tear on a book along the spine that I sent into the Mcfarlane singing, when I saw it came at a 3.5 I knew something was really off. That tear went from 1 inch to about 6 or more.
That is brutal
We the collectors have given CGC way to much power we have to be open to competition. IMO. Thanks for sharing.
I agree with that
Did u show us the newton rings? That tear on the back bottom didnt happen when your graded comic fell from the wall or during shipping back to you or shaking since inside sleeve could be tighter on outside edges? Did you take pics of the comic before you sent it away? That sucks if the back page got torn when the book was moved in maybe different directions. I dont know anything about comic book gradings.
Yes I showed the newton rings? Did you watch the video?
This begs the question - why take the risk to grade books?!
@@User8vfjhejf. SCS is rare but more common then it should be. The question is whether it’s worth it to slab a book if you are not selling it. It’s not really a safe way to protect a book, and how much does that grade reflect the condition of the book 3, 5, 10, 25 years down the road. Grading should only be used to sell or to verify the condition of newly purchased book. There are better, cheaper, more effective way t9 protect books.
why do anything? This does sound like another video idea though haha "The pros and cons of grading comic books"
I buy expensive golden age books that I need more than “ trust me bro” it’s not restored.. so I buy CGC 🤷🏽♂️
@@User8vfjhejf but he has taken a big hit ! Didn’t realise they don’t take responsibility for any damage. That’s me finished with CGC . What a horror story 😢
no the real question is why ship them to get grade when anybody could do anything lmao just take the book urself...
I bought two book soff eBay ( two different sellers) that did the same thing. In the original photos there’s clearly no damage but when it arrived it had the same type of damage. There was no damage to the packaging or to the slab itself. Thankfully they were not expensive books and both sellers issued refunds but this is more common than people think.
Probably weren’t shipped very well
I got a first bane appearance in 9.2. Broke in shipping. Pieces floating around inside. And cracked corner. Pieces were inside box was shipped in. Did not pack it right. No protection really. Only one slip of thin bubble looking paper. Only 1 out of 30 slabs ordered that came broken. Seller did not accept returns. But if you know your eBay rights like I do, you can get a refund through eBay.
But only buy from returns accepted sales. Way easier.
Love the honesty sticky. I too would be angry about the poor handling of this book. If they had put the book down to the bottom there is a good chance it would not have happened
If they had the proper size sleeve this would have never happened
What’s up with your FF 48 getting such a low score, I was on another comic channel and his FF 48 was basically the same grade. I guess no one showed Galactus any love back in the day.😓
It was graded when I bought it
What I prefer to do is to crack my own cases and then I double mylar the book and i stuff it full of microchamber paper cut the same size as the book it looks better that way and you don't have that inner poly that is bad for the comic book
I just submitted an ASM 238 Newstand WITH Tattoo, and it was returned with a green label. I emailed CGC about it with photos I took before submission…are they stealing tattoos!? Really hope they make it right…This happen to anyone else?
Yikes I would just crack and resubmit
No doubt
There’s a reason they don’t take certain forms of payment (PayPal etc)
I’ve wondered that as well
I grade to preserve my comics and not resell. I will never use CGC again after multiple quality control failures such as: receiving wrong books back, poor quality return of cases. Im now useing EGS. I gotta say EGS has way more sturdier cases and ive never had an issue with my books from them.
It’s a bit of both for me
It’s also why I didn’t send anything already slabbed to the signing i don’t like the idea that if it’s damaged and gets a lower grade they’re not at fault makes me feel like they’re not professional or careful enough to be opening your comic
Which is odd because I’ve seen ordinary collectors on UA-cam open a slab without issues or damage but certified experts need liability protections 🤨
hahah never thought about it like that
I’m so sorry about your book. CGC has gotten really bad with QA. I just had a Daredevil 158 in a 9.6 go to the Frank Miller signing and it’s coming back a 7.5. Clearly something happened to the book while in CGC’s possession.
Omg that is absolutely ridiculous I would be so pissed off
That sucks man, are you sure there is even an inner well? Because that is pretty crazy amount of damage after encapsulation. I have definitely seen books damaged after encapsulation. The books move around inside I have seen staples get detached because the cover is stationary and the spine has pressure on it which slowly pushes the pages out. I have seen books sealed into the inner well. I've seen corners get rounded but never seen tears and damage like that.
It’s like they used the incorrect size of sleeve like it was too big for the book
How do I tell if the one I have is "facsimile" edition?
That's heartbreaking. Especially how a supposed legit business denies any accountability even when a product is literally damaged while in their possession and during handling. Who does that?
What did you end up doing with this asm 300? You ever address it with cgc?
Things are happening stay tuned
my 2c: send it to CBCS. I think their quality (holder, case, grading standards etc) is just far superior.
there is a premium on cgc graded books
@@Stickygoose i've heard and read much about this topic in the past. The sales data is not conclusive enough imo and sentiment varies strongly. I think its maybe a brand vs value debate (I see more value in better quality holder/cases and more consistent grading standards). if you're in the flipping game then the brand perception "might" be a factor in some cases, but overall I would still strongly recommend CBCS for overall quality myself.
Seems like grading is for sellers, sell it quick. Keep it raw unless you like people that don't care about your book to mishandle them
I love my graded books
@@Stickygoose you take the good with the bad I guess
Facsimile is coming out in August.
lmao
This is why my collection doesn’t get graded! I will buy graded books but just can’t send my books away and I believe I have a 9.8 ASM 300 as well.
That is a monster book
I think the only way I would grade books would be at a live event.
They don’t grade them on site
They should. Lol
Well this is an opportunity for another grading company to step up and give better grading procedures and an insurance policy.
Best case scenario is to crack it out, get it pressed and sell it raw
That’s definitely an option
@@Stickygoose Whatever you make from that you can save until you have enough to buy 9.6 ASM 300
I’ll tell you this about my experiences with CGC recently. I also submitted an ASM 300. I was hoping for somewhere in the 9s. 9.0 minimum….
Got 8.5, was kinda sad…. Shoulda sucked it up.
I resubmitted the book and it came back this time 7.5.
So I’ve already spent 100$. I’m gonna try a third time.
And I bet you dollars to donuts it’ll probably come back 8.0 and I’ll just leave it.
Wishing I stuck with the 8.5
Your book in comparison would come back 6.5 if the same grader did our books….
I’ve gotten 2.0 on some nice silver age books recently that I was expecting probably 4.0? Maybe 4.5.
And I’m looking at my books at 2.0 and then I go to eBay and I’m seeing books that are 2.5 that are missing huge chunks out of the cover.
Are they trying to create a business out of resubmitting books?
that is brutal!
Did you clean and press the book when you resubmitted? I'm not sticking up for CGC here, I'm generally curious if you thought you'd just get a better grade on a gamble without actually doing any improvements to possible defects on the comics, because that's not really how it works.
Uh oh, dont tell Comic Man Andy. He wont want to hear it
dude is a SJW im not a fan
Cgc should put each comic they grade in the Blockchain to track authenticity
thats interesting Im not a big VEVE guy
i don't get why people ship their comics to them... especially expensive ones just to have it shipped back to you and it moving around everywhere like just take it yourself or don't get it graded
I had the same exact thing happen to a golden age Submariner in 9.0
i have an ff1 that has that oil, i dont know if i should return it to get it fix. or crack it open then sent it
risky business playing that game
Shame on CGC, they did me wrong several times in a signature series and normal grading encapsulation. They don't give a craop and never admited their mistake. They are a bad company !
Their updated policy for Rings and mechanical errors are absurd
rings don’t fall under error even though CBCS doesn’t have that issue
And it’s 14 day return and it must be sent back by original submitter not sure how that works if you sent it to a 3rd party for a signing
But it feels like CGC is trying to make the process so complicated that you’ll just give up and they don’t have to fix what quality control should’ve never approved before shipping out
I have one book with them nothing expensive but I’m absolutely worried about how they’ve stored it for 2 months for the signing
Being put in their vault sounds fancy and safe but what if that just means it’s just thrown in a box in a room they call the vault
I love the idea of protecting old books and grading them so you don’t have to guess and possibly over pay i even like the idea that they’ll slab signed Sketches
I definitely don’t like the idea though about paying for a service and when something goes wrong they wash their hand of acceptability and it’s wild that they get away with it
Any other place like if someone sells you a bad car there’s lemon laws to protect the buyer from a dealership’s failing upkeep or if that car was damaged in a flood and they didn’t disclose that to you
That’s definitely a tough situation cause you could sell as long as you disclose the damage but you’ll definitely be taking a hit on both what you paid and what someone is willing to spend regardless of damage
I didnt even realize there was a new policy in regards to newton rings
@@Stickygoose ya they call it a natural occurrence so if a case has rings they won’t fix it for free
Aside from CGC sending a book back with Newton rings how are they responsible for the damage? It was not in their care at all. You state the book moved from one location to another including a plastic storage box, it is possible that placing it in said box at one time or another the slab was placed down too hard and the damage occurred. I have no doubt you handle slabs with care but knowing that the books move inside of the slab itself being a "well known issue" there can be no blame other than on the one handling the slab. As unfortunate as it is. It is very very rare for any product to come out that is perfect after even two or three attempts. Hopefully they figure out a better way sooner than later but with time comes improvements.
The book was mobile inside the case
You don’t explain how this got damaged. I don’t see how this book got damaged simply by sitting in a box for some time. I’m not sure how this is cgc’s fault. Unless they damaged it before encapsulation. There is always a risk with these things. Sucks that your book is like that now though. That hurts bad. 😢
You yourself say in this video that you cannot guarantee the book stays that grade after encapsulation. So how can cgc guarantee that. And how can QC catch something that didn’t happen yet? It sounds like you damaged your book at home.
I don’t know when or how it got damaged but the book moves inside the case. It’s cgc’s fault for not securely stabilizing the book. Don’t try to blame this on me Nate dawg
There is no way that the cover peeled up the page like that after being in the slab. Also you got lucky to get a blue label 9.6 with a sig on the inside that should have gone down to at least a 9.0 or 8.5 and has color rub on back.
The grading scale is awful, books that are obvious 7.5 are getting up too 9.0. Books getting damaged are on the rise and so are the layoffs. As CGC moves into automation things will continue to get worse. Like most companies the only true thing that will hurt them is the damage to there bottom line.
Yo Goose, have you ever heard of any former CGC employees discussing their work candidly - especially foolish, shady or flat-out dishonest practices? I’ve gotta think the company receives insightful feedback from customers that the company basically ignores on the grounds that it’d reduce profits.
I have heard some of that from Keep it thoro comics but Ive never seen an interview that would be huge
I'm sorry to hear about this man. That's rough.
Thank you it’s still a great book
how do you get comics graded without sending them out?
Lol are you trolling me
@@Stickygoosenope, I’m serious. I have a bunch of valuable books from back in the day and never wanted to send them out for grading precisely for this reason.
I would have hoped you would be honest about the damage to the book when selling--whether this video held you to it or not.
I would be…I said that in the video
Man, how the book can get a blue label instead of green if it's signed by Todd McFarlane? You really might get a green label in case of another reholder.
Wow maybe
@@Stickygoose sometimes the graders just miss inside signatures. But you might not be that lucky next time.
Tough situation anyway...
I feel for you, and this comment isn't going to make you feel any better. But this is the EXACT reason why CGC's services just aren't for me. There is an inherent risk in sending your comics through the mail -- not once, but twice -- and I think the law of averages dicatates that if you do a lot of this, you are eventually going to get bit. So unless I am absolutely going to sell a book, chasing that 9.6 or 9.8 is just not worth it. And because you are an ethical guy, you can't recoup the loss, unless you can get CGC to make good on this. In the end, I get more enjoyment out of my books by being able to look at them and not take the risk of any of them leaving my sight.
I chose to have it encapsulated, I took the risk
If you had taken your book to CBCS, you would’ve had a yellow label certified by Beckett. And no Newton rings. I hate that this happens to you. But you might give CBCS a try. I have both and I think they’re slabs are higher quality.
there is a premium for CGC
525 in .... your not crazy,just honest. This is why I dont get my comics graded. You are now the 2nd collector I know that has had this happen on a book that was sent in and worth over 500 $ and came back worth less then what it was sent in as.
Really appreciate you saying that thanks manny
there goes CGC as a reliable indicator of grade.
They are the standard right now
Funny how he resembles sigourney when he speaks
i will take that as a compliment
I bought a Ashkam from Ebay that was in a cgc case and a broke the holder and it was sticking out of the holder inside if that explains it well.
I told the seller trying to be fair I'm willing to keep the book but I need you to give me a discount to send it into cgc he said no I'm just going to mail you a label for you to mail it back to them. I said no I don't want to wait either you can give me a discount and I do it myself or I can send it back to you for a full refund. So he didn't want to give me a discount so I send it back for full refund 🤷♂️
But that book that I got was the worst I have ever seen
I can send you pictures on Instagram if you like
Good for you! eBay can be a rough place to buy and sell I know from experience
The poor encapsulation of the comic inside the inner well is called Shaken Comic Syndrome (SCS) and has several threads in the CGC forums. Give it a look.
Yes I was actually aware of this and should have said it. This is exactly what happened
Nope never had anything damaged. Just stick it on the wall.
I have a spawn number 1 cgc 9.8 same thing happened to me there's no way it's a 9.8 anymore the book is trashed inside the case same thing the book slide down and actually ripped the cover
Some people call it shaken comic syndrome
They popped the staples on my ff49 which hurt
Damn how’d that happen
This really stinks for you. I stopped submitting to CGC back in December 2022. I typically send between one to two 25-book submissions per month. I got one of the submissions back with half the books damaged. I always do pre-screen 9.8 and always send 9.8 books. This time, I didn't pre-screen. They all looked like they had been dropped on the corners. No chance it was damage from mail. I got a bunch of 9.2's and 9.4's. I sent CGC photos of "before" I sent the books. I press all of my books before sending them. They didn't pay me anything for the damage they caused. Fast forward to April 2023, on the first box I received from CGC after months of not sending them anything, 10 of the books came back as "rejects." Again, all of the books had consistent damage of being dropped on the corners. I don't get it. Do they have gorillas handling our submissions? And quality control, I guess they have blind people doing this.
I’m probably done submitting for a very long time
CBCS time?
That would be my last submission.
Damn Bro.... 9.6 ASM 300 newsstand ! Smmfh they need to do better quality control. I do it for a living and I take real pride in my work. Cgc should to. Sorry Bro. I has my 9.6 Simpsons newsstand have outrageous Newton rings. Smmfh
It was a big boy book
Where did u get your t-shirt
Ript apparel use the link in the bio
@StickyGoose Comics thanks bro I appreciate it thanks to you I now know the rainbow rings in my slabs are called Newton rings
Any good lawyer will tell you it doesnt matter what you agree to before giving your property to a company for any service. Those disclosures are there for frivolous lawsuits. If you could show its previous state, its current condition and a professional appraisal showing the difference, its lawsuit worthy. Of course CGC knows this, and also knows that most comic book collectors wont sue for a $1000 book.
The legal fees would be ridiculous
@@Stickygoose No lawyers allowed in small claims court, but you'd probably still want one to file the paperwork. But even then, I doubt anything would come from it.
Call me old fashioned but I have zero graded comics. I simply dont trust them, or the technology behind their cases. There's no data saying comics in those cases are safer long term than in a regular box.
Cgc should meet you halfway with a credit $1k
things are happening stay tuned