what he's likely referencing is the bizarre result from quantum physics that completely empty space still has non-zero energy. it's called vacuum energy, it's been measured and we know it's real
Exactly, I'm imagining it as violently changing pressure zones and how tornados can be formed with the entropy of high and low pressure zones colliding, void gives us that power but on a cosmic scale
YES. Vfx references. Really good to study since they're just there, suspended. No need to record gameplay, go frame by frame etc. The only better thing would've been this but in a cinematic(high quality sims, no more real-time/performance limitations), but that's already asking for a bit too much. :)
@@RobertPerez862 Possibly. I've been racking my two brain cells for years now trying to find where the final element fits but keep coming into the concepts behind the other elements.
@Alassandros yee. To me I'm just thinking it has to do with lifesteal only cuz for tangles the warmind cells were like the test dummies. RN have heal clip which is like life steal but idk. I'm not Warlock. My Titan brain only has so much capacity to work.
I like how light powers are the things observable in the universe: electromagnetism, radiant energy, and gravity. Meanwhile darkness focuses on aspects within the self: desire for order and control, bonds and personal attachment. I gotta admit though, I thought strand was supposed to be a reference to string theory but it's actually a reference to the morphogenetic field. That was a twist.
I wholeheartedly believe that light is the power of manipulating the physicals and darkness is the Power of not really manipulating but drawing something from inside the non-physical world. Some of my proof stems from the fact that looking at the traveler, a completely physical form to what we have seen and the witness seems to be something of a dimensional being that can not be touched, as in the witness is too strong, and as in literally cannot be physically touched. Except of course maybe using paracuasal powers which can easily break the rules of the universe.
Seems like both Dark elements represent a fundamental aspect for the human (or just sapient-sentient beings in general) mind, *Stasis* represents our necessity for structure and control while Strand our need for connection and freedom. Makes me wonder what the final Dark element will represent.
The Light is the domain of the physical, where it depends on and bends the laws of time and space to create, where the Darkness is the domain of the mind, where your thoughts and your mind will make the world around you different or will make you see it differently. Light takes strength to master and Darkness takes a change of perspective to adapt to it.
I think want fits more than need. I think the 3rd will revolve around our want to remember. Something like Mirage in apex, prophet in bo3 and possibly something like Yun's genei jin (and/or Yang's similar super) from street fighter. Maybe a darkness patronus idk
I’d been wondering what role Osiris could have now that he is lightless. But, his centuries of complied knowledge and learning as a scientist as well as a former Guardian can be of great use to the Coalition as a whole, especially where he is now: angina fellow scientists and rescearcers of Neomuna, surrounded by an untapped wealth of knowledge from the before, during and after the Golden Age. He’s the best person to trust with the job of exchanging knowledge, culture, and history with Neomuna the City, and our other allies. Though he is now lightless, he fits the role of a paracausal scientist, philosopher, and now real advisor, well.
This is one of the many reasons why I have been so excited for Lightfall and where the story could go from here. Lightfall has been reaching very far back into D1 lore, so far back I had honestly forgotten about the majority of the lore that supports Lightfall, so I have been very excited to watch it all unfold.
@@marcuscersy2393ot sure if he’d have the same vision and policies as the Speaker of the City, but he certainly is fitting into one of his many roles he’s taken: ambassador between the City, Humanity, and its Guardians, and Neomuna and its people, well. Of course he also seems to be playing the role of scientist well, with his research of paracausality, and advisor to the Vaguard and Coalition. Though, it’s hard to say how our City will restructure its government and even rename itself (with there being more than one city now) after the war with the Witness has concluded. I predict an era of peace within almost all of Sol, and our own self made Golden Age. One built by the restoration efforts of the entire Coalition, as whatever fate befalls the Traveler after Final Shape, I don’t think it will be in any state to help us. Especially directly.
as osiris mentioned in the campaign, darkness elements are powered on the guardians perspective, a mental state. with this and what he mentions about the elements themselves. light elements deal with creation and change, darkness elements deal with perceptions and emotions. I conclude the final darkness subclass will be red and will be one created out of anger and fear. any inquiries will be answered to further extend this belief.
light elements are powered through creation and change because the philosophy of the light or the gardener is that life should be infinite and empowered to foster change. darkness on the other hand is the paracausal consequence of the lights infinite creation. infinite life creates beings of evil, it promotes evolution, so thousands of beings exist to only be eaten or killed by superior beings. thus light creates a cycle, where the lights infinity will bring the creation of destructive beings that only mean to put an end to the light, this is why the light and the dark are drawn to each other, they are destined to clash. in theory, all sentient beings create a force similar to the light, that also opposes it. this force is the darkness. thus, the darkness elements are powered on the mental and philosophical perceptions that the light creates in its infinity. this would mean both forces of light and dark are linked to creation and life. stasis being the feeling of will and order, the power that life creates when going to war, a feeling that can drive, shatter, slow, and conquer like osiris mentioned. strand would be the feeling similar to meditation or what people i guess allude lsd to and such. a higher state of mind that connects all beings, a very spiritual and flowy feeling. this state is connected through all life in a string of webs that we create and pull on. thus the third ability could be any emotion or mental state that similarly aligns with these properties, a feeling that fosters some sort of creation that we can manifest. fear creates anger, which in turn creates more fear, and this force could maybe be what drives us in the final shape, that we end up harnessing by ourselves to fight the witness, maybe after a tragic loss. we know nezarec uses the darkness to create nightmares out of fear to inflict pain, but i think nezarec switched paracausal sides and went with the light after he realized the witness’s final shape creates a universe without pain (we’ll find out in the raid, maybe hes the boss and uses more nightmare like red abilities) so technically the power of fear is a power the darkness is capable of that we’ve already seen. also, we’re running out of subclass colors so it has to be red, i’m tired of different blues, strand even looks blue on some solstice armor. and we’ve already seen the darkness use red powers on the moon, through the nightmares on the moon, which harness the power of fear created by the pyramid (nezarec’s) ship. they use the power of fear to inflict pain, which is what nezarec gets off on. it would come full circle and be so cool if we saw us harness this power in the end.
While I do believe it will likely be a red subclass, I do not think it’ll be about rage or fear. Based on the cutscene where Osiris talks to Nimbus about the relationship between Light and Darkness, things like rage and fear or anything relating to emotion and pain is already represented through Stasis. So having another element that focuses on only one or two emotions would be redundant. Looking at Bungie’s track record of how they’ve approached the darkness subclasses, this third element will likely be based on an aspect of the mind that hasn’t been featured in the game yet. Personally, and this is only speculation, I think it could involve the aspect of imagination.
@@maciejas2471 I think it would have more of a tree motif to it personally, since trees have had a long history of symbolizing knowledge and ideas. One problem with this idea though is that Resonance seems to have some connection to trees already. Whenever we destroy something that seems to be connected to Resonance, we see tree roots sprout out from them. Case in point, Rhulk and Calus.
Going back to this, you can pretty much see that during this time Bungie is still probably trying to come up with an explanation regarding how Stasis works. So much so, they had to elaborate further with another lore entry that had Zavala and Elsie talk about it. So based on Elsie's description, Stasis actually closely resembles void but reversed. The idea for stasis is to imagine things moving at the speed of your thought. Slowing them down, or freezing them to a stop. It's almost a manipulation of time itself. Which isn't surprising, cause we've seen Darkness manipulate time several times already. Just look at what the Witness did to Mars.
I think light is physical, stasis is from the inside of the non-physical or meta-physical world and draw it into the real world and be able to feel it. That's why the traveler is like a big huge physical planet, and the witness looks all foggy like a gas giant except bit physical. Basically the traveler is a big ball and the witness is some hyper-dimensional fog man.
Been a hammer titan since TK, I love how it is pure destruction and creation at once. It will scorch and kill anything it touches. But if used correctly could also heal even the most mortal wounds one can imagine.
And after that, we get a combination of all the dark subclasses and call it pyramid energy and all the light subclasses and call it ghost energy. whoops my imagination is running wild again, or is that maybe the next darkness subclass?
This was definitely put into the game to define what all the elements are for the purpose of leaving space for a new element,a sixth element (and maybe a seventh when all are combined).
@@exter0078 Man, I've been saying something like Prismatic should be in the game when we het all six elements from the very start. The lore talked about it years ago.
I think the 3rd darkness subclass will be linked to loss. Either the loss of our previous life and memories, or the loss in our current situation in the game (ie losing friends or the last city). Using that, I think it will be linked to remembering OR my favorite theory, rage. Imagine a subclass linked to rage that is red (a color I think is likely to be used).
The way Osiris acted made sense to me. He was possessed for a year, woke up 4 months ago and since then his closets friends don’t trust him. The entire Spire of the Watcher dungeon happened because Osiris needed a win, which we gave to him. He’s basically been told to “stfu schizo” whenever he brings up the city on Neptune and to add onto that. The witness is here to maybe end the universe. To be honest, he’s the only person who seems to appropriately respond to the current situation
I love how he described the subclass elements. Light is physical while darkness is spiritual and mental. Btw I'm expecting a sixth and final subclass. Something that allows us to enter into the portal created by the Witness
Seems like the Veil has a lot to do with consciousness and blending the physical with the metaphysical so I am in the boat with you on this theory. One of the Lightfall's trailers brought back "the line between light and dark is so very thin"..."let's cross it together" so that's what I am expecting to happen, not just with wielding new darkness abilities but following the Witness beyond that line between light and dark that Calus mentioned in Duality.
I can’t wait to hear how Osiris will try to explain the Prismatic subclass which is basically a mix of all four subclasses. “Prismatic…uh…it’s, well…during my research I came across a children’s story that I believe predates even the Golden Age. It tells of four nations, each being masters of four elements: air, water, earth, and fire. An individual being able to wield all four elements was known as the Avatar…”
I wonder what Osiris’ descriptive observations will be on the last darkness element? On another note, I enjoy this, researcher/negotiator/advisor/mediator/teacher role Osiris has adopted since loosening his Light. Given he’s been a researcher all his life, but still. Also, even if Osiris never can get his Light back, or Sagira, it’d be interesting if he became a guide/mentor to Guardians that have died and moved on into the plane beyond the Traveler as pure spirits of paracuasality. Let me explain the last point. I have a theory, that the setting we see from the teaser with Cayde, may be the Garden before time began. The chosen Guardians humanity, after dying final deaths, return to the Garden and, “join the garden”, in an eternal rest for all they’ve done to protect Sol and the Traveler. But, the Witness’ invasion provoked the Gardener to awaken these sleeping spirits. Eventually, Osiris dies, but, death is not the end, and he later becomes a mentor and guide within the Garden, communicating to the Vanguard and Coalition, via Strand, and the “River of Souls”, to educate and aid his allies in the mortal plane of Sol. Ikora, and certain other Guadrains, and Mara, are able to communicate with Osiris’ spirit. This is done to learn more about the Garden and exchange information between the living, and the dead, until the Coalition eventually builds a device that can communicate with Osiris to be kept up to date on the worlds within and without, on a more frequent basis. This being the end of Osiris’ journey would be fitting, as his new role would reflect his namesake. That’s the speculative theory I have, anyway.
Scientific Understanding: Solar - Nuclear Fusion Arc - Electro-Magnetism Void - Gravitational Force, Entropy, Zero Point Energy. Stasis - Cryogenisis, Control of Inertia. Strand - String Theory, Unified Field Theory
That's actually kinda cool. I actually felt Strand was the opposite to Arc. Whereas arc is forceful powerful movement created from colliding forces strand is flowing momentum not directed but following whatever way you choose to go.
@@giftedmonster5293 I mean more than creating and severing connections as severing and unraveling connections IS part of Strand. Void is the power in the absence. The literal light at the end of the tunnel. The force that pulls at all things. Strand is about the link between minds, a physical manifestation of the forces that connect us to each other, a living and growing tree that can be grown, sculpted, and destroyed. This is why I see solar and stasis as opposites as much as arc and strand. Though perhaps I should rethink things some more
Stasis is the mirror of Solar. Even excluding cold and heat, there is also the colour theory. Invert the colours of the Light subclasses and you will get: - Solar becoming a dark blue like Stasis. - Void becoming green like Strand. - Arc apparently becoming a red or reddish colour.
i would argue for arc and stasis being opposites, arc is all about letting things move and steadily flow, while stasis is about holding things still and restricting them, solar is about breaking things down while the same force also helps existing sources to rejuvenate themselves,
So Void is just as much as about Gravoty, Entropy, Vacuum, & gravitational forces. Hmm makes sense. I knew it was linked to Gravity as an old lore card said something about Fundamental Forces. That Solar is Strong, Arc is Electromagnetism, & Void is linked to Gravity. But there is more depth to the elements we use which is insightful. It does raise the question of the possible 3rd darkness subclass. In more of a "Fantasy" setting Solar is really power Fire Magic. Arc would be Lightning Magic, which is higher than electricity magic. Void would be Gravity Magic. Stasis would be Ice Magic. And Strand would be either Psionic/Psychic Magic. Hmm I wonder
So.. what I get from this is that both light and dark are made of three seperate parts: Fabric, motion and duality. Void is the fabric of the universe while strand is the fabric of intelligent connection Solar is the duality between destructive heat and healing heat while stasis is the duality between structure and shatterring. Arc is motion and flow between charge, meaning the dark version of arc has to be the motion of emotion and such
The lore tab seems to imply the opposite actually The first paragraph describes how the warlock ignored the pull of stasis, instead burning "the hive vermin with vengeance and fire" Which implies that the rage fueled solar light, and that vengeance isn't a part of stasis
Is it just me, or has bungie been kind of ignoring that void also has a connection to life energy? Gravity gravity, cool, but I'm pretty sure I don't use gravity to get health back when killing enemies. Nor do I see it as particularily controversial or dark to... use purple telekinesis and mini-black holes.
@@AlexTekle I didn't say it's life giving, I said it's life-manipulating. yes, it's technically still "sucking", but they seem to have put a bit too much emphasis on the physical, gravity aspect of it lately when it's clearly much more.(there are references in the lore of it being connected to the metaphysical in some way too: dialogue in the shard of the traveler mission that compares ancient shamans to voidwalkers, thanatonauts interacting with the void before resurrecting, the "Savathûn's song" mission had guardians souls/light drained and channeled into void crystals etc.)
I'm really vibing with the people who mentioned the idea of remembrance as our next darkness emanation. The way I see it is... Solar and Strand are opposites: Solar's domain of creation and destruction correlates with Strand's manifestation to access the hidden network of creation to manipulate and unravel it. Arc and Stasis are opposites: Arc's occurrence when the world fails to find balance during change correlates to Stasis' emulation of our need for control and to project our will onto things that are seemingly beyond our control. With this and understanding Void's domain of the unknown and the unfathomableness of the cosmos, remembrance would make perfect sense. Correlating the acceptance of that which eludes understanding with a firm grasp of previous paths. If they did choose memory or remembrance as our next darkness elements, they could draw inspiration from games like Quantum Break for how that power over time can look. Gimme thoughts!
i do think its interesting that solar/stasis are counterparts and void/strand are (potentially? both are a bit "nothing is something") counterparts, the third damage type would be the counterpart of arc? not quite sure what it would be but maybe something related to the earth/stones? something that doesnt change as opposed to something that does + the weird "smelled like wet earth" darkness creatures from old chicago/the black armory lorebook. i do think that an earth based class would encroach a bit too hard on stasis being destinys version of a 'builder' class tho
I don't think Solar and Stasis are the counterparts here. Again, Arc is the power of locomotion and change, and Stasis is the power of detainment and control. Arc is speed, while Stasis is slowness. Arc is the ability to bend and weave around obstacles, Stasis is the unrelenquishing control to shatter them. Thus, I think Arc and Stasis are counterparts, just as Void and Strand are counterparts (Void is power in the absence, Strand is power in the ever present). Thus, the third Darkness ability would be an opposite to Solar's duality, a singular, driven mindset. The phrase goes, "where there's a will, there's a way", and I think the third Darkness subclass will embody this sentiment
@@moxie6132 Void is the fabric of reality, and its pair Strand is the fibers. Stasis is rigidity and control, stopping motion, a fitting opposite to the idea that Arc is general chaos, boundless, otherwise uncontrollable movement. Solar is life and death, creation and destruction, the idea of an eternal cycle. The third darkness subclass could, rather than perpetuity, be finality, absolution, the idea that there is in fact an end to things.
@@moxie6132if you're looking for a "will" element, Stasis is what you're looking for; Osiris plainly describes it as such at 1:30. It's all about exercising direct control on the world around you through your will. To further the idea that Solar and Stasis are opposites, there's the contrasting ideas of change between them. Solar describes a natural cycle of destruction and recreation. Stasis is a personal stand against cycles, commanding the world to "be still", as said in the Shadebinder lore tab. There's also the simple contrast between Solar being "fire" and Stasis being "ice." While neither are entirely accurate, that's what they're clearly designed after. Solar is meant to be a "fire" element and Stasis is meant to be an "ice" element. Bungie knows whay they're implying. The only way I see them subvert this idea is if they introduce another element that on a basic level contrasts with fire. The only one I can think of is water, and thst would give us 3 blue subclasses.
Since it seems that the darkness elements are supposed to be opposites and based on consciousness, I wonder what the opposite of Arc would be, since stasis is opposite of solar, and strand is opposite of void, apparently both in structure and the elements being the inverted colors those elements, Arc’s opposite would be Red
Arc is about deconstructing form by breaking down matter at the molecular level. By that viewpoint, perhaps the Darkness opposite is less about breaking down a form, and more about changing forms? Transfiguring oneself into another form, or polymorphing an opponent? I, for one, would love to go into the Crucible and see the looks on the other team’s stupid faces as I turn their champion 25x Flawless Hunter into a sheep. XD
I don't quite get how strand makes sense. How can you *use* something by relinquishing control? The river analogy kinda makes sense, but that would mean it's completely unreliable(super useful if it so happens to "flow" in the direction you actually want to go at that time, useless in any other case). Also, you can't shape something into needles, rope-darts, blades, grenades etc. by giving up control. Acceptance is for receiving what already exists, creating/shaping something is an act of will.
I take it as you need to stop thinking about control and just allow it do do it for you, like a external muscle memory. When you do an exercise or marital art, you have this "flow state" where you don't think, but just do. Also you just gotta take "space magic" into consideration
Strand is fundamentally based on the nature and relationships between others. Think about it too much or try to take control too hard and it falls apart.
It's easier to view the super abilities if you look at the the Sisters of Fate in Greek Mythology. Clotho weaves every life into being; these would be the warlock needles and the fact that their exotic boots focus on threadlings, which would be interpreted as creating life in this case. Lachesis measured each thread of life; while a bit of a stretch, i think you could interpret this as the hunter's rope dart, which can extend and is by far the most "flexible", representing the different lengths of lives and the different ways that an individual's life can go. Atropos severed each thread, representing death. Blade hands on the titan super, pretty much. I choose to see Strand as you not trying to force control over things; it's like being the dungeon master of a D&D campaign. You can give your players some nudges here or there to push them along the story or have them head somewhere you want them to, but try to exert too much control over their decisions, and they don't enjoy themselves because you've taken away their ability to do anything on their own. Think of how stasis just completely stops the target from doing anything. But strand suspension still lets the target do something on their own, whether that's move their head or in players cases, fight back. Strand is kind of like being that dungeon master and accepting that things might not always go the way you planned, but you can still go with the flow and make something incredible out of it.
I think strand works similar to Gokus UI. You don't activly use strand. It works like a reflex of the body. Giving strand the form and utility the subconscious needs at the moment.
Well technically they talked about them over time, but it's been mostly in lore pages. This clearly a example of Bungie trying to lift subject out of lore pages and into the game world.
Lmao why is Osiris quoting his student? I guess he’s proud of her but man shouldn’t he know more about the elements? Also why is his voice so different sounding?
Bro just casually captured the manifestation of psychic connections and put it in a jar
Void was the one I had no idea what it was based on. This helps to explain it as, "What is there, when there is nothing."
Void is the same as ether/spirit and is often considered the 5th of the classical elements after earth, water, wind and fire.
what he's likely referencing is the bizarre result from quantum physics that completely empty space still has non-zero energy. it's called vacuum energy, it's been measured and we know it's real
Kinda says it in the name
Exactly, I'm imagining it as violently changing pressure zones and how tornados can be formed with the entropy of high and low pressure zones colliding, void gives us that power but on a cosmic scale
Vacuum energy and quintessence, used to manipulate gravity and space-time. The Casimer Effect is a certain aspect of Void
I like being able to appreciate the unique vfx each subclass has through things like this. Contained pockets of elemental energy to observe and study.
YES. Vfx references. Really good to study since they're just there, suspended. No need to record gameplay, go frame by frame etc. The only better thing would've been this but in a cinematic(high quality sims, no more real-time/performance limitations), but that's already asking for a bit too much. :)
You can only imagine how hard it was for Osiris to contain them to give his explanations and studies.
I imagine that our guardian and or guardians played a role in helping Osiris creating containment fields to hold the elements in suspended animation.
Solar: Creation and Destruction
Arc: Change and Motion
Void: Gravity and Entropy
Stasis: Will and Control
Strand: Mind and Flow
Shape: Form and Stability
@Alassandros Isn't that stasis Will and Control? 🤔
@@RobertPerez862 Possibly. I've been racking my two brain cells for years now trying to find where the final element fits but keep coming into the concepts behind the other elements.
@Alassandros yee. To me I'm just thinking it has to do with lifesteal only cuz for tangles the warmind cells were like the test dummies. RN have heal clip which is like life steal but idk. I'm not Warlock. My Titan brain only has so much capacity to work.
@@RobertPerez862 Void already uses "lifesteal", as you put it. That's what devour is, but also, what the child of the old gods does (void soul).
I like how light powers are the things observable in the universe: electromagnetism, radiant energy, and gravity. Meanwhile darkness focuses on aspects within the self: desire for order and control, bonds and personal attachment.
I gotta admit though, I thought strand was supposed to be a reference to string theory but it's actually a reference to the morphogenetic field. That was a twist.
I wholeheartedly believe that light is the power of manipulating the physicals and darkness is the Power of not really manipulating but drawing something from inside the non-physical world. Some of my proof stems from the fact that looking at the traveler, a completely physical form to what we have seen and the witness seems to be something of a dimensional being that can not be touched, as in the witness is too strong, and as in literally cannot be physically touched. Except of course maybe using paracuasal powers which can easily break the rules of the universe.
Could be both.
It could also be a nod at the akashic record. Basically the same idea as strand. It’s more like a direct inspiration, probably
Thank you Osiris i'm tired of everyone telling me that void is not gravity, there you go now is canon dammit
Yeah so many dummies out there that don't read the lore
It's gravity + life energy manipulation(kinda).
I didn’t even read the lore and that’s what I figured just by how it’s designed
I always thought it was dark matter and dark energy
It is more than gravity
Seems like both Dark elements represent a fundamental aspect for the human (or just sapient-sentient beings in general) mind, *Stasis* represents our necessity for structure and control while Strand our need for connection and freedom.
Makes me wonder what the final Dark element will represent.
Per the developers, The light is creation and the darkness is psychic.
Maybe we will be able to use the energy that rhulk and calus used against us. The energy that the pyramids use is a power of the darkness
The Light is the domain of the physical, where it depends on and bends the laws of time and space to create, where the Darkness is the domain of the mind, where your thoughts and your mind will make the world around you different or will make you see it differently.
Light takes strength to master and Darkness takes a change of perspective to adapt to it.
I think want fits more than need. I think the 3rd will revolve around our want to remember.
Something like Mirage in apex, prophet in bo3 and possibly something like Yun's genei jin (and/or Yang's similar super) from street fighter. Maybe a darkness patronus idk
The final element will probably something that involves balance.
I’d been wondering what role Osiris could have now that he is lightless. But, his centuries of complied knowledge and learning as a scientist as well as a former Guardian can be of great use to the Coalition as a whole, especially where he is now: angina fellow scientists and rescearcers of Neomuna, surrounded by an untapped wealth of knowledge from the before, during and after the Golden Age. He’s the best person to trust with the job of exchanging knowledge, culture, and history with Neomuna the City, and our other allies. Though he is now lightless, he fits the role of a paracausal scientist, philosopher, and now real advisor, well.
Osiris for new Speaker?
This is one of the many reasons why I have been so excited for Lightfall and where the story could go from here. Lightfall has been reaching very far back into D1 lore, so far back I had honestly forgotten about the majority of the lore that supports Lightfall, so I have been very excited to watch it all unfold.
He may be lightless but he has strand to master now, I’d like to see a strand master Osiris
@@marcuscersy2393ot sure if he’d have the same vision and policies as the Speaker of the City, but he certainly is fitting into one of his many roles he’s taken: ambassador between the City, Humanity, and its Guardians, and Neomuna and its people, well. Of course he also seems to be playing the role of scientist well, with his research of paracausality, and advisor to the Vaguard and Coalition. Though, it’s hard to say how our City will restructure its government and even rename itself (with there being more than one city now) after the war with the Witness has concluded. I predict an era of peace within almost all of Sol, and our own self made Golden Age. One built by the restoration efforts of the entire Coalition, as whatever fate befalls the Traveler after Final Shape, I don’t think it will be in any state to help us. Especially directly.
as osiris mentioned in the campaign, darkness elements are powered on the guardians perspective, a mental state. with this and what he mentions about the elements themselves. light elements deal with creation and change, darkness elements deal with perceptions and emotions. I conclude the final darkness subclass will be red and will be one created out of anger and fear. any inquiries will be answered to further extend this belief.
light elements are powered through creation and change because the philosophy of the light or the gardener is that life should be infinite and empowered to foster change.
darkness on the other hand is the paracausal consequence of the lights infinite creation. infinite life creates beings of evil, it promotes evolution, so thousands of beings exist to only be eaten or killed by superior beings. thus light creates a cycle, where the lights infinity will bring the creation of destructive beings that only mean to put an end to the light, this is why the light and the dark are drawn to each other, they are destined to clash.
in theory, all sentient beings create a force similar to the light, that also opposes it. this force is the darkness. thus, the darkness elements are powered on the mental and philosophical perceptions that the light creates in its infinity. this would mean both forces of light and dark are linked to creation and life.
stasis being the feeling of will and order, the power that life creates when going to war, a feeling that can drive, shatter, slow, and conquer like osiris mentioned. strand would be the feeling similar to meditation or what people i guess allude lsd to and such. a higher state of mind that connects all beings, a very spiritual and flowy feeling. this state is connected through all life in a string of webs that we create and pull on.
thus the third ability could be any emotion or mental state that similarly aligns with these properties, a feeling that fosters some sort of creation that we can manifest.
fear creates anger, which in turn creates more fear, and this force could maybe be what drives us in the final shape, that we end up harnessing by ourselves to fight the witness, maybe after a tragic loss.
we know nezarec uses the darkness to create nightmares out of fear to inflict pain, but i think nezarec switched paracausal sides and went with the light after he realized the witness’s final shape creates a universe without pain (we’ll find out in the raid, maybe hes the boss and uses more nightmare like red abilities) so technically the power of fear is a power the darkness is capable of that we’ve already seen.
also, we’re running out of subclass colors so it has to be red, i’m tired of different blues, strand even looks blue on some solstice armor. and we’ve already seen the darkness use red powers on the moon, through the nightmares on the moon, which harness the power of fear created by the pyramid (nezarec’s) ship. they use the power of fear to inflict pain, which is what nezarec gets off on. it would come full circle and be so cool if we saw us harness this power in the end.
While I do believe it will likely be a red subclass, I do not think it’ll be about rage or fear. Based on the cutscene where Osiris talks to Nimbus about the relationship between Light and Darkness, things like rage and fear or anything relating to emotion and pain is already represented through Stasis. So having another element that focuses on only one or two emotions would be redundant.
Looking at Bungie’s track record of how they’ve approached the darkness subclasses, this third element will likely be based on an aspect of the mind that hasn’t been featured in the game yet. Personally, and this is only speculation, I think it could involve the aspect of imagination.
@@cameronalt190 So Green Lantern, or Calus's golden chalice thingy then?
@@maciejas2471
I think it would have more of a tree motif to it personally, since trees have had a long history of symbolizing knowledge and ideas. One problem with this idea though is that Resonance seems to have some connection to trees already. Whenever we destroy something that seems to be connected to Resonance, we see tree roots sprout out from them. Case in point, Rhulk and Calus.
@@cameronalt190 it could be something oddly scary like rationality?
Going back to this, you can pretty much see that during this time Bungie is still probably trying to come up with an explanation regarding how Stasis works. So much so, they had to elaborate further with another lore entry that had Zavala and Elsie talk about it.
So based on Elsie's description, Stasis actually closely resembles void but reversed. The idea for stasis is to imagine things moving at the speed of your thought. Slowing them down, or freezing them to a stop. It's almost a manipulation of time itself. Which isn't surprising, cause we've seen Darkness manipulate time several times already. Just look at what the Witness did to Mars.
Fascinating thank you for this
So I guess Darkness is about thought and something more about the mind while the Light is about bending the elements and creation.
I guess?
Now I know why The Witness has so many faces at its head. Its meant to represent consciousness or thought.
Maybe?
Light creation. Darkness psychic. Light is matter and body. Darkness mind and thought.
@@admiz6592 Now I understand why they are so separate from each other. At the same time also needed each other.
I think light is physical, stasis is from the inside of the non-physical or meta-physical world and draw it into the real world and be able to feel it. That's why the traveler is like a big huge physical planet, and the witness looks all foggy like a gas giant except bit physical.
Basically the traveler is a big ball and the witness is some hyper-dimensional fog man.
Been a hammer titan since TK, I love how it is pure destruction and creation at once. It will scorch and kill anything it touches. But if used correctly could also heal even the most mortal wounds one can imagine.
I've always loved Stasis. I could never put it into words. This sums up perfectly what I've always felt about that subclass.
One more darkness subclass to complete the trinity
And after that, we get a combination of all the dark subclasses and call it pyramid energy and all the light subclasses and call it ghost energy. whoops my imagination is running wild again, or is that maybe the next darkness subclass?
@@abudielzein4841 They're called "Darkness" and "Light" subclasses for a reason
@@abudielzein4841 from what it seems as of now, Light energy is called Terraformation
@@abudielzein4841 well you were on the right track
This was definitely put into the game to define what all the elements are for the purpose of leaving space for a new element,a sixth element (and maybe a seventh when all are combined).
Bro knew
@@exter0078 Man, I've been saying something like Prismatic should be in the game when we het all six elements from the very start. The lore talked about it years ago.
I think the 3rd darkness subclass will be linked to loss. Either the loss of our previous life and memories, or the loss in our current situation in the game (ie losing friends or the last city). Using that, I think it will be linked to remembering OR my favorite theory, rage. Imagine a subclass linked to rage that is red (a color I think is likely to be used).
Leaks say red
I want it to be a sonic vibration subclass. Since it's the opposite side of Arc
Thank you for this! I've been wanting to listen to these explanations.
This is the Osiris the campaign needed. Not the whiny asshole we got. Hope to see more of THIS in the seasonal stories.
Seriously, I wanted so badly just to tell him to shut the hell up while I was busy fighting for my (and by extension everyone else's) life.
The way Osiris acted made sense to me. He was possessed for a year, woke up 4 months ago and since then his closets friends don’t trust him. The entire Spire of the Watcher dungeon happened because Osiris needed a win, which we gave to him. He’s basically been told to “stfu schizo” whenever he brings up the city on Neptune and to add onto that. The witness is here to maybe end the universe. To be honest, he’s the only person who seems to appropriately respond to the current situation
Bro, he was always a whiny asshole
Its called a flawed character, he has knowledge but he is also a egocentrical bitch
He is a human being who is still going through a lot of anxiety and grief, leave him alone
Thanks for keeping this, I went back to listen again and was disappointed I couldn't.
I love how he described the subclass elements.
Light is physical while darkness is spiritual and mental.
Btw I'm expecting a sixth and final subclass. Something that allows us to enter into the portal created by the Witness
Seems like the Veil has a lot to do with consciousness and blending the physical with the metaphysical so I am in the boat with you on this theory. One of the Lightfall's trailers brought back "the line between light and dark is so very thin"..."let's cross it together" so that's what I am expecting to happen, not just with wielding new darkness abilities but following the Witness beyond that line between light and dark that Calus mentioned in Duality.
I can’t wait to hear how Osiris will try to explain the Prismatic subclass which is basically a mix of all four subclasses.
“Prismatic…uh…it’s, well…during my research I came across a children’s story that I believe predates even the Golden Age. It tells of four nations, each being masters of four elements: air, water, earth, and fire. An individual being able to wield all four elements was known as the Avatar…”
This reminds me of avatar the last airbender when Guru Pahtik is explaining the chakras to Aang
I wonder what Osiris’ descriptive observations will be on the last darkness element?
On another note, I enjoy this, researcher/negotiator/advisor/mediator/teacher role Osiris has adopted since loosening his Light. Given he’s been a researcher all his life, but still. Also, even if Osiris never can get his Light back, or Sagira, it’d be interesting if he became a guide/mentor to Guardians that have died and moved on into the plane beyond the Traveler as pure spirits of paracuasality.
Let me explain the last point. I have a theory, that the setting we see from the teaser with Cayde, may be the Garden before time began. The chosen Guardians humanity, after dying final deaths, return to the Garden and, “join the garden”, in an eternal rest for all they’ve done to protect Sol and the Traveler. But, the Witness’ invasion provoked the Gardener to awaken these sleeping spirits. Eventually, Osiris dies, but, death is not the end, and he later becomes a mentor and guide within the Garden, communicating to the Vanguard and Coalition, via Strand, and the “River of Souls”, to educate and aid his allies in the mortal plane of Sol. Ikora, and certain other Guadrains, and Mara, are able to communicate with Osiris’ spirit. This is done to learn more about the Garden and exchange information between the living, and the dead, until the Coalition eventually builds a device that can communicate with Osiris to be kept up to date on the worlds within and without, on a more frequent basis.
This being the end of Osiris’ journey would be fitting, as his new role would reflect his namesake.
That’s the speculative theory I have, anyway.
I need a full dialogue on any of Osiris' reports.
Solar main for life, but I do like to have an affair with Void every once in a while 😋
Same, you warlock master race? I am 😈
Nightstalker hunter for lyf! With just a smidge of gunslinger for me ❤️
Me too! HAMMER TITAN FOR LIFE (I do enjoy spamming lightning nades from time to time tho)
@@thevalleyard3942 Hunter. You'll never catch me in that dress lol
@Ronald Blanks dress? Pls you run around with a cape, haven't you seen Incredibles?
I mean yeah makes sense and always expected for void because well vortex grenade, nova bomb, and more are all about pulling the enemy in
This was pretty cool ngl
Hearing Osiris say Elsie and not Elizabeth is weird for me. He seems the type to use everyone proper name.
Probably a result of his time with Ana
@@Sky_Ler2000 I can see that for sure. Given he helped Ana as much as he could during Season of the Seraph from his own experiences.
Timestamps in case you need it:
Void: 0:02
Arc: 0:32
Solar: 0:59
Stasis: 1:30
Strand: 2:19
Scientific Understanding:
Solar - Nuclear Fusion
Arc - Electro-Magnetism
Void - Gravitational Force, Entropy, Zero Point Energy.
Stasis - Cryogenisis, Control of Inertia.
Strand - String Theory, Unified Field Theory
So would you say they have opposites or no?
lets hope that add something when we get element number 6
See, it sounds like Stasis and Arc are mirrors of one another, not so much Solar and Stasis
That's actually kinda cool. I actually felt Strand was the opposite to Arc.
Whereas arc is forceful powerful movement created from colliding forces strand is flowing momentum not directed but following whatever way you choose to go.
@@yugijak See, I see Strand and Void as being opposites. Strand is all about making connections. And void is about severing them.
@@giftedmonster5293 I mean more than creating and severing connections as severing and unraveling connections IS part of Strand.
Void is the power in the absence. The literal light at the end of the tunnel. The force that pulls at all things.
Strand is about the link between minds, a physical manifestation of the forces that connect us to each other, a living and growing tree that can be grown, sculpted, and destroyed.
This is why I see solar and stasis as opposites as much as arc and strand. Though perhaps I should rethink things some more
Stasis is the mirror of Solar.
Even excluding cold and heat, there is also the colour theory.
Invert the colours of the Light subclasses and you will get:
- Solar becoming a dark blue like Stasis.
- Void becoming green like Strand.
- Arc apparently becoming a red or reddish colour.
i would argue for arc and stasis being opposites, arc is all about letting things move and steadily flow, while stasis is about holding things still and restricting them, solar is about breaking things down while the same force also helps existing sources to rejuvenate
themselves,
So Void is just as much as about Gravoty, Entropy, Vacuum, & gravitational forces.
Hmm makes sense. I knew it was linked to Gravity as an old lore card said something about Fundamental Forces. That Solar is Strong, Arc is Electromagnetism, & Void is linked to Gravity.
But there is more depth to the elements we use which is insightful. It does raise the question of the possible 3rd darkness subclass.
In more of a "Fantasy" setting Solar is really power Fire Magic.
Arc would be Lightning Magic, which is higher than electricity magic.
Void would be Gravity Magic.
Stasis would be Ice Magic.
And Strand would be either Psionic/Psychic Magic.
Hmm I wonder
That might be why I like stasis so much.
So.. what I get from this is that both light and dark are made of three seperate parts: Fabric, motion and duality.
Void is the fabric of the universe while strand is the fabric of intelligent connection
Solar is the duality between destructive heat and healing heat while stasis is the duality between structure and shatterring.
Arc is motion and flow between charge, meaning the dark version of arc has to be the motion of emotion and such
The light is about creation while the darkness is about consciousness.
So solar main are disciple of god shiva?
For a moment I misread that as SIVA.
The warlock lore tab heavily implied Stasis was about rage given shape. Now it's clear it's meant to be seen as the state of control.
The lore tab seems to imply the opposite actually
The first paragraph describes how the warlock ignored the pull of stasis, instead burning "the hive vermin with vengeance and fire"
Which implies that the rage fueled solar light, and that vengeance isn't a part of stasis
Is it just me, or has bungie been kind of ignoring that void also has a connection to life energy? Gravity gravity, cool, but I'm pretty sure I don't use gravity to get health back when killing enemies. Nor do I see it as particularily controversial or dark to... use purple telekinesis and mini-black holes.
not really life giving like solar, more life stealing from foes, sucking energy in like a black hole
indeed
@@AlexTekle I didn't say it's life giving, I said it's life-manipulating. yes, it's technically still "sucking", but they seem to have put a bit too much emphasis on the physical, gravity aspect of it lately when it's clearly much more.(there are references in the lore of it being connected to the metaphysical in some way too: dialogue in the shard of the traveler mission that compares ancient shamans to voidwalkers, thanatonauts interacting with the void before resurrecting, the "Savathûn's song" mission had guardians souls/light drained and channeled into void crystals etc.)
@@unveiling_visuals "The promise of entropy, what is there when there is nothing"
It's not just gravity and he says as much.
It steals the enemy’s matter
Three light elements representing creation.
And two dark elements representing psychic/thought.
I'm really vibing with the people who mentioned the idea of remembrance as our next darkness emanation. The way I see it is...
Solar and Strand are opposites: Solar's domain of creation and destruction correlates with Strand's manifestation to access the hidden network of creation to manipulate and unravel it.
Arc and Stasis are opposites: Arc's occurrence when the world fails to find balance during change correlates to Stasis' emulation of our need for control and to project our will onto things that are seemingly beyond our control.
With this and understanding Void's domain of the unknown and the unfathomableness of the cosmos, remembrance would make perfect sense. Correlating the acceptance of that which eludes understanding with a firm grasp of previous paths.
If they did choose memory or remembrance as our next darkness elements, they could draw inspiration from games like Quantum Break for how that power over time can look.
Gimme thoughts!
Man, what is Arc exactly? Or moreover, what is its opposite?
Finally!!! Now i know what the fuck void is.
If Stasis is the element of control, wouldn't that means we should manipulate other around us as well?
i do think its interesting that solar/stasis are counterparts and void/strand are (potentially? both are a bit "nothing is something") counterparts, the third damage type would be the counterpart of arc? not quite sure what it would be but maybe something related to the earth/stones? something that doesnt change as opposed to something that does + the weird "smelled like wet earth" darkness creatures from old chicago/the black armory lorebook. i do think that an earth based class would encroach a bit too hard on stasis being destinys version of a 'builder' class tho
I don't think Solar and Stasis are the counterparts here. Again, Arc is the power of locomotion and change, and Stasis is the power of detainment and control. Arc is speed, while Stasis is slowness. Arc is the ability to bend and weave around obstacles, Stasis is the unrelenquishing control to shatter them. Thus, I think Arc and Stasis are counterparts, just as Void and Strand are counterparts (Void is power in the absence, Strand is power in the ever present). Thus, the third Darkness ability would be an opposite to Solar's duality, a singular, driven mindset. The phrase goes, "where there's a will, there's a way", and I think the third Darkness subclass will embody this sentiment
@@moxie6132 Exotic Shotgun much?
@@moxie6132 Void is the fabric of reality, and its pair Strand is the fibers. Stasis is rigidity and control, stopping motion, a fitting opposite to the idea that Arc is general chaos, boundless, otherwise uncontrollable movement. Solar is life and death, creation and destruction, the idea of an eternal cycle. The third darkness subclass could, rather than perpetuity, be finality, absolution, the idea that there is in fact an end to things.
@@moxie6132if you're looking for a "will" element, Stasis is what you're looking for; Osiris plainly describes it as such at 1:30. It's all about exercising direct control on the world around you through your will.
To further the idea that Solar and Stasis are opposites, there's the contrasting ideas of change between them. Solar describes a natural cycle of destruction and recreation. Stasis is a personal stand against cycles, commanding the world to "be still", as said in the Shadebinder lore tab.
There's also the simple contrast between Solar being "fire" and Stasis being "ice." While neither are entirely accurate, that's what they're clearly designed after. Solar is meant to be a "fire" element and Stasis is meant to be an "ice" element. Bungie knows whay they're implying. The only way I see them subvert this idea is if they introduce another element that on a basic level contrasts with fire. The only one I can think of is water, and thst would give us 3 blue subclasses.
Our classic 3 light elements are the physics of the universe, while darkness classes are psychic powers
Kinetic damage is the meme of damage types confirmed
Okay uncle iroh
i deducted what all of these were beforehand except for stasis, pretty cool power system this game has
Since it seems that the darkness elements are supposed to be opposites and based on consciousness, I wonder what the opposite of Arc would be, since stasis is opposite of solar, and strand is opposite of void, apparently both in structure and the elements being the inverted colors those elements, Arc’s opposite would be Red
Arc is about deconstructing form by breaking down matter at the molecular level. By that viewpoint, perhaps the Darkness opposite is less about breaking down a form, and more about changing forms? Transfiguring oneself into another form, or polymorphing an opponent?
I, for one, would love to go into the Crucible and see the looks on the other team’s stupid faces as I turn their champion 25x Flawless Hunter into a sheep. XD
The light elements are the base for the universe while darkness is the base for human mind
That's and interesting way of saying that it's straight fucking electricity
There is one more spot for a new element.
And it's the opposite of Arc, Change vs Constancy
I don't quite get how strand makes sense. How can you *use* something by relinquishing control? The river analogy kinda makes sense, but that would mean it's completely unreliable(super useful if it so happens to "flow" in the direction you actually want to go at that time, useless in any other case). Also, you can't shape something into needles, rope-darts, blades, grenades etc. by giving up control. Acceptance is for receiving what already exists, creating/shaping something is an act of will.
I take it as you need to stop thinking about control and just allow it do do it for you, like a external muscle memory. When you do an exercise or marital art, you have this "flow state" where you don't think, but just do.
Also you just gotta take "space magic" into consideration
Strand is fundamentally based on the nature and relationships between others. Think about it too much or try to take control too hard and it falls apart.
It's easier to view the super abilities if you look at the the Sisters of Fate in Greek Mythology. Clotho weaves every life into being; these would be the warlock needles and the fact that their exotic boots focus on threadlings, which would be interpreted as creating life in this case. Lachesis measured each thread of life; while a bit of a stretch, i think you could interpret this as the hunter's rope dart, which can extend and is by far the most "flexible", representing the different lengths of lives and the different ways that an individual's life can go. Atropos severed each thread, representing death. Blade hands on the titan super, pretty much.
I choose to see Strand as you not trying to force control over things; it's like being the dungeon master of a D&D campaign. You can give your players some nudges here or there to push them along the story or have them head somewhere you want them to, but try to exert too much control over their decisions, and they don't enjoy themselves because you've taken away their ability to do anything on their own. Think of how stasis just completely stops the target from doing anything. But strand suspension still lets the target do something on their own, whether that's move their head or in players cases, fight back. Strand is kind of like being that dungeon master and accepting that things might not always go the way you planned, but you can still go with the flow and make something incredible out of it.
I think strand works similar to Gokus UI. You don't activly use strand. It works like a reflex of the body. Giving strand the form and utility the subconscious needs at the moment.
Great, Now can you explain what the fuck the veil is? and why it’s so important?
No one can, i dubt Bungo knows.... someone was to high making it to explain before he forgets.
Im guessing its a light device that allows the Witness to "commune" with the Traveler in some way. Sucks that they didn't explain it more.
I think it's a core sample from the Traveler.
Yo let me get this either dumbed down or explain in dbs terms
So Osiris is now Iroh, except he's a non-bender and a bit of a dick.
This series has been out for almost a decade and now they talk about the elements?!
Well technically they talked about them over time, but it's been mostly in lore pages.
This clearly a example of Bungie trying to lift subject out of lore pages and into the game world.
Lmao why is Osiris quoting his student? I guess he’s proud of her but man shouldn’t he know more about the elements? Also why is his voice so different sounding?