THE PROBLEM with the AMPRO II - weak wiggle stick spring on the panorama tremolo? & IS THERE A FIX?

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  • Опубліковано 17 лис 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 117

  • @captainbob406
    @captainbob406 6 місяців тому +2

    I understand this is a 2 year old video but.... I may have noticed something interesting. I recently purchased a Am Pro II Jazzmaster. I was thinking I was going to have this issue so I picked up the "eBay" springs as recommended by Puisheen. I just today installed some 10 gauge strings. However, what I did was loosen the tremolo spring preload. I noticed on your guitar, the screw holding the trem spring in place, is sticking out quite a ways beyond the keeper that it screws into. You do not need to have the screw screwed in that far. If you unscrew so the end is below the keeper (it still has plenty of threads holding it in place) you may notice that you may not bottom out when you put it all back together. When you tighten that screw, you are tightening the spring which reduces whammy bar travel. It can reduce it enough that the spring will prematurely coil bind preventing the whammy bar going to the body. My belief is that the screw should be screwed in just enough to put just a slight amount of tension on the spring. I bet if you relax that screw you will no longer have the problem. Try it... see what happens.

  • @darthfaderlives89
    @darthfaderlives89 2 роки тому +2

    I am no springicist (my expertise is limited to playing with the springs in pens and mechanical pencils), but I think you hit the nail on the head. They wanted to address the previous issues with lighter strings on JM’s, but by doing that it seems new issues have arisen for heavier gauges. I would assume that most offset players are like yourself and don’t really dive, but everyone loves to mess around like that every once in a while and, by gum, I’d want the fullest dive range possible! Important work you’re doing, friend.

  • @ccfmafia3301
    @ccfmafia3301 2 роки тому +3

    That Mike Adams video was so good....

  • @johnenglish8261
    @johnenglish8261 2 роки тому +4

    Measure everything on the spring including the compression on a scale, there are companies that specialize in springs, gears, fasteners, etc., Nuts and bolts of guitars can be as much fun as playing them. Have fun and take care.🌞👍🎸

  • @leeoffender8406
    @leeoffender8406 2 роки тому +5

    The old fenders would easily accommodate heavy strings. A lot of guys used big gauge flatwounds even. The clean heavy tone got so popular for that brief time I'm inclined to think it spawned the late 60's baritone models.

  • @thseed7
    @thseed7 2 роки тому +3

    Love the Am Pro bridge, but I did replace the vibrato with a Mastery on mine. It's so much better than Fender's design. Thought it was hype, but I was wrong.

  • @niclastname
    @niclastname 2 роки тому +6

    Just a pedantic correction: B is a fourth down from E. Going down a fifth would be A. Going a fifth *UP* from E would be B. I only noticed the confusion because I play a lot of baritone, and the lowest string is a B, which is the same as a 7 string so the next string down is the low E when tuned down to B, and to drop tune that your B goes down to an A which makes the low E a fifth for the easy power chords! :D
    Super interesting video! I don't really understand how the tension is causing an issue unless it's causing the bridge to float, which it doesn't look like it is. It's breaking my brain trying to figure out how the issue is even happening. I gotta go watch Pusheen's video now, because maybe I'm just missing something in my mental image of how the bridge works.
    *Edit:* Okay I watched his dissection, and it makes perfect sense now. I wasn't fully aware of how the JM vibrato worked mechanically. Now that I see it, I can totally see how this problem happens. I didn't realize that you have to tighten the spring to compensate for heavier strings. Now it makes sense. So it's not just that the heavy strings compress the spring, it's that it compresses the spring, which you then tighten to compensate. Then, obviously, the more you tighten a spring, the less range of motion it has left.

  • @CW0123
    @CW0123 2 роки тому +3

    Fender is keeping Leo’s legacy with the offsets alive by having engineering headaches I see 😏

  • @DYI_SEBASTIEN
    @DYI_SEBASTIEN 2 роки тому +4

    Maybe add a longer screw on which the spring is mounted and a longer, stiffer spring, if the routing is deep enough of course. That would give more range.

  • @galaxieman24
    @galaxieman24 2 роки тому +2

    I just got my American Pro II Jazzmaster. I absolutely love it.
    I have 9.5’s on it now and it functions nicely. I probably won’t go heavier than 10’s on this one.

    • @sgd5k292
      @sgd5k292 2 роки тому

      How long did it take to get shipped? I have been waiting 8 weeks now for mine.

    • @galaxieman24
      @galaxieman24 2 роки тому

      I bought a used one in mint condition. I didn’t want to play the waiting game either.

    • @sgd5k292
      @sgd5k292 2 роки тому

      @@galaxieman24 ok, I have not seen any used by owners, but I have found a couple of returned ones from a popular music store. Fortunately, I have a Strat VG that I love and will continue to play it until the New AMProiiJM arrives, whenever that might be.

  • @mykhedelic6471
    @mykhedelic6471 2 роки тому

    I generally don't like Jazzmasters with white/off guards but damn that thing is glorious. It's like the nail polish on the 60s lady of your dreams and just an overall beautiful aesthetic. It glows and sings to me, and I shall crash on the rocks, every time.

  • @Incuensuocha
    @Incuensuocha 2 роки тому

    I 100% agree. I have a new AmPro II JM. I love everything about it but I want the tremolo to have a little bit of a stiffer feel.

  • @OutstandingBill1
    @OutstandingBill1 2 роки тому

    Judging by Mike's wiggle at 1:16 perhaps you were getting one full tone on the old spring, assuming that chopping the guitar in half didn't affect the range. Props to him for that!

  • @dejadejayoutube
    @dejadejayoutube 2 роки тому +6

    Coming up in the bizarro world of an indie scene, most people play offsets so I never got one, to be different lol. There are very few affordable options in Australia that don't sell within milliseconds so when I finally succumb I want a good one. These kind of videos are great for offset curious types. Working Class Music are good with these details too. No other guitar(s) have ever required more research, but it still seems a Mastery bridge is the go with really decent rolling saddles and don't even get me started on wtf are even "genuine" vintage accurate jazzmaster or jag pickups and wiring layouts. I'll check out this offset specialist düd then as well. Thanks for the deep dive.

    • @Dram1984
      @Dram1984 2 роки тому +1

      Nothing is more indie than playing an indie gig with a Les Paul.

    • @mattdoliver1984
      @mattdoliver1984 2 роки тому

      The Staytrem bridge could be worth looking into for the Jag/Jazz or Mustang ....But like you say the Mastery seems to be the go.
      I prefer the Staytrem I find it intonates better for me anyway the Mastery doesn’t offer intonation adjustments on every string

  • @MillerCustomGuitars
    @MillerCustomGuitars 2 роки тому +8

    I thought about going to college to become a spring scientist but there was too much homework so I had to bounce.

  • @gathda
    @gathda 2 роки тому +1

    I wasn't thinking and posted a URL. Sigh. Anyway, check out McMaster-Carr (search for springs and you will find a lot of options). They are an industrial supply place that focuses on mechanical parts and tools. I've placed a bunch of orders through them and they always deliver promptly (got good plastic tubing to put inside trem springs for dampening). The only downside is that they have a _lot_ of stuff and it may take a bit of sleuthing to find what you are looking for. All measurements and technical details for every part are included, so you should be able to measure your existing spring and find a few matches to try in their catalog.

    • @gathda
      @gathda 2 роки тому

      From looking at their catalog, I think you will find a spring that suits your needs. They have some stainless springs that have a really high tension (spring rate, lbs/in) and closed ends. The prices aren't too bad, especially considering that they have hard to find parts. They will also do made-to-order springs with data sheets, etc., but those are really expensive. Might be a good side business for someone if you don't mind an initial design investment. 60 Cycle Parts - Accessories For Your Wiggle Stick.

    • @60CycleHumcast
      @60CycleHumcast  2 роки тому +2

      I just spent some time on the site after measuring one of my springs and they dont have anything close enough. Trem springs are oddly very hard to source.

    • @gathda
      @gathda 2 роки тому

      @@60CycleHumcast Dang. I was hoping they would have something.

  • @leeoffender8406
    @leeoffender8406 2 роки тому +1

    I don't think I ever played a jaguar or jazzmaster but my first decent guitar was a 60's mustang. The vibrato on it was a completely different design, but if the springs weren't strong enough for heavy gauge strings it would certainly done the same thing.

  • @gringogreen4719
    @gringogreen4719 2 роки тому +1

    If you want a big warble, get a Synchronized Tremelo from a Strat. Otherwise Bigsbys and Wide Swing Tremelos are more subtle waivers and hitting those blue notes that other trems blow right past.
    I do want a Jaguar and a Jazzmaster but it is for that surf waiver and those blue notes. Otherwise go get a Strat or a guitar with a Floyd Rose.

  • @lancecox8084
    @lancecox8084 2 роки тому +1

    I love my AmPro II Tele Deluxe, no wiggle stick on that, but I also have the Paranormal Sixty Six, Not so happy with the stock Trem on that and looking for a replacement, you tried the Sixty Six out awhile back and found it pretty nice as I did.

  • @thecalvin2481
    @thecalvin2481 2 роки тому +1

    I personally can't imagine needing that much vibrato range - but good to know for those that do!

    • @60CycleHumcast
      @60CycleHumcast  2 роки тому

      F# is close to floyde rose dives. so maybe steve vai wants that on a jazzmaster? lol

  • @sgd5k292
    @sgd5k292 2 роки тому

    Well, sorry to say this has already been covered. No problem for me as I always use 9's anyway. PS your review's are the reason I decided on buying an AMPRO ii Jazzmaster instead of a MIM version I was thinking seriously about. Thanks!

    • @LeviBulger
      @LeviBulger Рік тому

      9s on a Jazzmaster? That's Uber light for that guitar

  • @OzziePete1
    @OzziePete1 2 роки тому

    15:50 The original Bigsby vibrato was invented using a Harley-Davidson Valve Spring. Paul Bigsby was a motorcycle tweaker as well. With the redesign brings new challenges. It's why I have long been 'off' these vibrato systems. Leo got things wrong in the first release and we've been chasing our tail for a better design ever since. Maybe a decent valve spring from a motorcycle engine will do the trick again?
    It's starting to look like Fender should enclose an optional heavier spring for when you go above 10s, with instructions for installation.

  • @haroldlyman8833
    @haroldlyman8833 2 роки тому +2

    A conical spring will probably work. A coil spring will always have issues due to the fact the coils compress on top of each other.

  • @NoCoverCharge
    @NoCoverCharge 2 роки тому

    Yes change the Trem and bridge out for a mastery trem and bridge and this will not only solve that problem but it will sound better

  • @thedanksavatron7782
    @thedanksavatron7782 2 роки тому

    Nissssssssssssssssssce 🍻
    Another episode of Wigglestick Wizardry!🐇🎩🎸

  • @gorlagOv
    @gorlagOv 2 роки тому +1

    My problem with my am pro 2 is I snap my high e, every other time I pick it up (when I had 9s on it). I saw Mike’s video about the spring and popped in my extra bigsy spring after I saw your video about longer wiggle stick springs. Can say works very well with 11s.

  • @ryanmccutcheon4298
    @ryanmccutcheon4298 2 роки тому +1

    I have the same guitar with 10s. I've never noticed the issue, but I also don't dive it. I guess ignorance is bliss. 😆

  • @thecappy
    @thecappy 2 роки тому

    I just returned mine to MF because of this. The allparts didn’t work for me and the local spring place didn’t have a close enough replacement. I did find a used 2016 FCS ltd '58 Jazzmaster in desert sand.

  • @TheMyndsurfer
    @TheMyndsurfer 2 роки тому

    I have the American Pro-Series 1 and right at the start I didn't like the Tremelo arm. Wrong angle, too short. I did what I did on my American Vintage 2009 Jaguar and bought a Mastery Tremelo. Problem solved on both guitars. LOVE MASTERY TREMELOS!!! ......and Bridges.

  • @timothypotter2137
    @timothypotter2137 2 роки тому

    Don't know what pedal you were using but is was fantastic.

  • @TheDrunkenScoundrel
    @TheDrunkenScoundrel 2 роки тому

    One of the techs at Sam Ash in Hollywood knows a ton about Bigsby springs…..If I see him next time I’m in there I’ll ask.

  • @CoyCrawfordII
    @CoyCrawfordII 2 роки тому +1

    McMaster Carr! They sell all kinds of little springs. With different spring rates and load ratings! Diameter, length, and wire Diameter

    • @60CycleHumcast
      @60CycleHumcast  2 роки тому +1

      I just checked and they dont have anything, Id have to do a custom order and that costs $$$

    • @CoyCrawfordII
      @CoyCrawfordII 2 роки тому

      @@60CycleHumcast well dang they usually have what seems like every size. I'm sure the custom order is $$$and probably have to buy quite a few as a minimum order. Maybe MSC. That's another supplier that sells a lot of stuff like that.

    • @nesicus
      @nesicus 2 роки тому +1

      @@60CycleHumcast What are the dimensions of the spring? And if that's true, then make a Kickstarter or some other kind of crowd-funding thing and the nerds who watch your channel will buy into it; that ought to be enough for a little side business.

  • @ice9snowflake187
    @ice9snowflake187 2 роки тому +1

    There must be an industrial source for springs somewhere. Where does Fender get theirs? there are also machines for making springs that machinists have- not too mechanically complicated, and not too expensive as things go, but probably too expensive to be worthwhile to get just for one guitar vibrato spring.

    • @gathda
      @gathda 2 роки тому

      Check out McMaster-Carr. They have everything. I've ordered a bunch of stuff from them and they are great.

  • @alanturingandthetapes5575
    @alanturingandthetapes5575 2 роки тому +1

    thanks for the info! seems weird that fender would neglect the 10s users. i understand that 11s and above probably aren't too many users, but don't most fender users switch to 10s?

    • @TheMyndsurfer
      @TheMyndsurfer 2 роки тому

      All I play is Surf Guitar and I can't imagine using anything under 11's. Sometimes go to 13s and always play with my little finger wrapped around the Tremelo arm. D'Addario Chromes, Flat Wounds of course!

  • @BrentAdams
    @BrentAdams 2 роки тому +1

    You should be able to find a spring at a well stocked Hardware Store.

    • @60CycleHumcast
      @60CycleHumcast  2 роки тому +2

      Its actually incredibly difficult to find a compatible spring.

  • @ronmaljak8401
    @ronmaljak8401 Рік тому

    Seriously considering purchasing a Fender AmPro2 Jazzmaster. One year after this video, has Fender addressed this issue?

  • @miket2728
    @miket2728 2 роки тому

    Mike is awesome!

  • @todddammit4628
    @todddammit4628 2 роки тому

    Lol "I don't know, I'm not a spring scientist."

  • @maxthub
    @maxthub 2 роки тому +4

    “I’m not a spring scientist” needs to be on a shirt.

  • @JeffV
    @JeffV 2 роки тому +1

    What about a bigsby spring

  • @steveclark7736
    @steveclark7736 2 роки тому

    Woah I didn’t even notice this in my AMPRO 2 Jazzmaster. Would it be worth it to just put a mastery bridge onto it or get a better spring? I play with 9’s on it right now but was wanting to jump to some 11’s on it!

  • @mattdoliver1984
    @mattdoliver1984 2 роки тому

    There was me trying to work out from the thumbnail if Ampro was a brand of guitar that I’ve never heard of before lol 😂
    I googled Ampro before realising 🤷🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️

  • @bbkoopmeiners8816
    @bbkoopmeiners8816 2 роки тому

    Having a tremolo that bottoms out isnt about how hard or soft the spring is. Even without a spring you will see that it limmits out on 1 point. Its just the build up or design of that part. There will always be 1 point where there is no to go because metal is totaly compressed and will stop moving. If you want more movement you'll need a longer spring so there will be room for movement. And you'll need a design that have way of movement. The newer design has the turning point more to the middle, and that also causes less movement. Its just a mechanical limmit than a spring littim.

    • @bldallas
      @bldallas 2 роки тому

      If it were only about the mechanical dimensions of the metal parts, sure. But the heavier strings, increase the tension on the bridge, which partially compresses the spring. So the early “bottoming out” comes from the remaining compression available after the guitar strings are t7ned to pitch.

    • @bbkoopmeiners8816
      @bbkoopmeiners8816 2 роки тому

      @@bldallas but that wouldnt change the point where it bottoms out near the guitar body. That would be the same point. And thats mechanical thing.

    • @bldallas
      @bldallas 2 роки тому

      @@bbkoopmeiners8816 yes, but it would change the distance it has to travel to get to the bottoming-out point.
      Wait are we still talking about today’s podcast regarding the tone produced by offset guitars? Or that weird orange guitar that sucked, right out of the box.

  • @timothypotter2137
    @timothypotter2137 2 роки тому

    What is the color of that guitar called?! It is amazing!

  • @mikehardy2418
    @mikehardy2418 2 роки тому

    Would tuning down a half step fix it?

  • @marcmistermarc
    @marcmistermarc 2 роки тому +1

    I’d probably just swap the vibrato for a USA vintage reissue model and be done with

  • @thecappy
    @thecappy 2 роки тому

    Do you have a set of calipers? Measure the mastery spring’s (length, ID, OD, #of coils, and wire thickness). Post them and people can buy replacements matching a spring that is known to work.

    • @60CycleHumcast
      @60CycleHumcast  2 роки тому

      I've been sitting here with calipers trying to find a site that sells anything close to the same dimensions as the all parts spring and so far no dice. Tremolo springs are apparently a very difficult thing to source.

    • @thecappy
      @thecappy 2 роки тому

      @@60CycleHumcast I searched for a week finally sent the guitar back. I’ll rebuy if/when Fender address it.

  • @CA10Z
    @CA10Z 2 роки тому

    Question:
    On your EART Strat when you put heavier gauge strings on it, did it raise the string action?

    • @60CycleHumcast
      @60CycleHumcast  2 роки тому

      Probably, but it’s easy to adjust around that

  • @ClintsCrypt
    @ClintsCrypt 2 роки тому

    Ryan, the master of "spring" reverb, doesn't know anything about springs! 🤣🤣🤣
    I get springs from Ace Hardware. They have a good, inexpensive collection of them.

  • @timothypotter2137
    @timothypotter2137 2 роки тому

    What is the guitar in this video?

  • @starboardlarboard
    @starboardlarboard 2 роки тому

    Order springs you want from McMaster?

  • @leonruvalcaba1549
    @leonruvalcaba1549 2 роки тому

    The bigger and stiffer the better😎🤙

  • @CassDase7
    @CassDase7 2 роки тому

    Have you ever done a video on floating a strat trem? On my paranormal super sonic I’ve been wanting to do that on my own since I partly got it because nick reinhart plays them and does crazy shit with trems like those

  • @mougabo
    @mougabo 2 роки тому

    Is a shame , that model in that color I feel is the prettiest JM, but nor the pickups nor the vibrato will give you the JM experience

  • @jonartscc968
    @jonartscc968 2 роки тому

    I actually have a different problem with my AM Pro II as well. Whenever I use the Tremolo, the guitar goes horribly out of tune. Like over a semitone in either direction from one dive bomb. Considering no one has talked about this in their reviews, I guess this isn't an issue that's common with these guitars. Any ideas what the problem could be?

    • @ArmandoPrado
      @ArmandoPrado 2 роки тому +1

      haven't had this issue with either of my am pro 2s

    • @kevinkeith3530
      @kevinkeith3530 2 роки тому

      Are you using any lubricant on nut and or bridge?

    • @jonartscc968
      @jonartscc968 2 роки тому

      @@kevinkeith3530 yes, but I have realised since then that it is essentially the same problem with the spring. I have 10s on it and the spring seems to be too weak to get it back in tune fully so it just goes a little flat/sharp until I manually pull it up/down a bit again

    • @kevinkeith3530
      @kevinkeith3530 2 роки тому +1

      Ah interesting. Bloody spring! I wish Fender would acknowledge the fact they made a mistake and offer a stiffer spring ffs, I paid $2200 Canadian for the guitar...

    • @Camspam100
      @Camspam100 2 роки тому

      Yeh I’m getting sick of mine going out of tune even with 9s ... I’ve tried everything and seems it’s just the vibrato spring or design so going to put a mastery on it , that said everything thing is pretty nice on this model imo ... love the pickups and neck .

  • @Realroyrogers
    @Realroyrogers 2 роки тому

    The Babylon Bee story "Worship Guitarist's Pedals Now Outnumber Chords In Repertoire 2 To 1"

  • @philippebrogard5183
    @philippebrogard5183 2 роки тому

    Rayan je pense qu'il faut trouver un fabriquant de ressort lui exposerez le problème bien en détail et faire des essais avec des ressorts de différente longueurs et épaisseurs la est solution la plus juste

  • @sharmaman87
    @sharmaman87 2 роки тому

    Whats that Bad Cat in the background?

  • @joshgray3581
    @joshgray3581 Рік тому

    Use the 40th anniversary model desert sand and if you noticed all the hardware is beefier such as the tremulous bar all the screws and yes the spring is to and you can totally switch it out please look into it my bridge works fine

  • @philiptnt
    @philiptnt 7 місяців тому

    My problem with my jazzmaster is that it has a lot of hum with any distortion and overdrive effect

    • @60CycleHumcast
      @60CycleHumcast  7 місяців тому

      that's because the pickups are single coils.

    • @philiptnt
      @philiptnt 7 місяців тому

      @@60CycleHumcast okay, there just isn’t a lot of hum on strat single coils. It must the size difference between the two of them

  • @nizodizo9549
    @nizodizo9549 2 роки тому

    what is an Ampro II? Never heard it.

  • @rivulus
    @rivulus 2 роки тому +2

    Do bigsby springs fit?

    • @henrystewart3882
      @henrystewart3882 2 роки тому

      I have always wondered this

    • @rivulus
      @rivulus 2 роки тому +1

      To answer my own question : probably not. I just checked, and the spring is longer and has a larger diameter. You might be able to cram it in but I doubt it would function.

  • @bbkoopmeiners8816
    @bbkoopmeiners8816 2 роки тому

    Wow, "I'm not a spring expert" says the guy that is a SPRING reverb expert.....

  • @sidestyle05
    @sidestyle05 2 роки тому

    A Bigsby spring maybe?

    • @60CycleHumcast
      @60CycleHumcast  2 роки тому

      bigsby springs are wider and non compatible without modification of the trem.

  • @citybirds8668
    @citybirds8668 2 роки тому +1

    Wiggle wiggle wiggle 😂

  • @RA.lightofwarz
    @RA.lightofwarz 2 роки тому

    Wiggle your tone 👀

  • @joshgray3581
    @joshgray3581 Рік тому

    The answer is use the squier spring screw and brass cone and it all fit perfectly on my American jazz master bridge

  • @romantrix
    @romantrix 2 роки тому

    is your beard bigger than ever?

    • @60CycleHumcast
      @60CycleHumcast  2 роки тому

      yep, ive been letting it go wild this winter.

  • @maxheadroom6067
    @maxheadroom6067 2 роки тому +1

    First?

  • @connorflatt
    @connorflatt 2 роки тому

    take the spring out and take a trip to home depot

    • @60CycleHumcast
      @60CycleHumcast  2 роки тому

      find a link to a home depot spring that would work and post it here.

    • @connorflatt
      @connorflatt 2 роки тому

      @@60CycleHumcast if you can give me the measurements of the height and diameter of the spring i can try find something. that why i initially thought itd just be easier to bring the spring with you to the store and eyeball it/ compare the tension to something in hand

  • @joshgray3581
    @joshgray3581 Рік тому

    Why can't you heat to red hot with torch and drop in oil