Metal Ride Comparison - Zildjian Z Heavy Power Ride vs. A Earth Ride
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- Опубліковано 7 гру 2016
- Note: I have been told that the Earth Ride was NOT buried in the ground and a Zildjian blog post from a while back supports this. However, many used Earth Rides are still listed for sale with the burial story in the description on eBay, Reverb, Guitar Center, etc. I don't know where the story came from, but it is very prevalent and may have even been started by Zildjian... and then walked back decades later. Anyway sorry for the inaccurate (so far as I know now) mention of that apocryphal fact.
![Which Cymbals RECORD Better? [Zildjian A's vs K's]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/WXL75aUssqw/mqdefault.jpg)
6,yrs after i left my initial comment, I actually got my old Paiste Rude back! I also had a 22in Earth Ride but just playing in my garage to music with my headphones there was way too much ring build up, I, believe the 20,in earth ride is what I will get next 👍
Update: I actually sold the Earth Ride for $12 more than I paid for it (even including shipping!) and I am going to just roll with the Heavy Power Ride. Such a nice cymbal.
I actually got the chance to chat with Reno Kiilerich and asked him what ride he had used when recording Vermin with Old Man's Child, as I absolutely loved the pingy sound and high stick definition. He mentioned he had used dual Earth Rides. Even as a Sabian fan, I immediately bought two of them and never looked back. I absolutely LOVE the Earth Rides.
It should also be mentioned that Reno is a super nice, chill guy. These days he has his own recording studio. Sadly, he doesn't do metal anymore, though.
Cool! That’s a great album. I ultimately sold my Earth Ride because it really didn’t cut enough, live. It probably would work great in a studio but on stage I couldn’t even hardly hear it, with a nylon tipped stick, so I’m pretty sure nobody else could either. I mainly play that Z heavy Power as it has more zing. I just got a Light Power but haven’t had a chance to play it much.
I play those exact types of music two. I play death, black and thrash primarily. I primarily use a 22” Earth Ride and love it for any heavy music. I currently play in a thrash metal band and have two rides on my set one on each side. My secondary ride is an A Zildjian 21” Rock Ride.
The Earth Ride is not "buried in the dirt" during production; it's just a raw cymbal; Zildjian presses the bronze casting into a cymbal shape, trims it so it's round, and stamp logos on it. The mottled/dirty appearance happens when cast bronze is quenched, per the information from Zildjian's company blog; all cymbals look like that before they are hammered lathed.
I've got 2 pretty similar cymbals myself: Z Custom Power Ride and an Earth Ride, both 22". My Earth Ride is just over 5000 grams, no joke. I love it, but always find myself going back to the Z Custom.
The Timesmyth "The earth ride gets its name from being buried in the ground to tarnish it." From the caption under an Earth Ride for sale. I didn't come up with that factoid on my own. It's a commonly cited marketing information about these cymbals. If you know it to be false, then so be it. But it's mentioned as being buried in literally hundreds of places in the depths of the internet.
The internet is never wrong, right? Let's also not commit the fallacy of "Argument ad populum" and assume that the popularity of an opinion is proof of its validity or truth value; if one person can be wrong: they all can be wrong ... and they all can post on the internet.
How about straight from Zildjian?
instagram.com/p/BC8ubEogJ1z/
or
blog.zildjian.com/cymbal-firsts-inspired-by-avedis-zildjian
Zildjian isn't burying cymbals before they sell them, and never did. Sabian did that once, but they didn't continue because it was too labor intensive, and didn't produce anything radically interesting.
Hmm. Ok. I'm not particularly attached to believing that it's true. Just reporting what I saw. I wonder where that rumor was started and why.
The Timesmyth - correct - they were never buried. The lathing process was skipped. Dirt has nothing to do the process.
@@RyanAlexanderBloom on zildjian's videos they never talk about it being buried. I'm an old school guy and that was never said back in the day either. I've heard lots of crazy ideas, such as cymbals being spun together with wire. Some people seeing the videos of "wires" coming off the cymbals while lathing, mistakenly think the cymbals are made that way, in reverse.
I have both the Raw and Brilliant Earth Rides, I love them both. I use a Sweet Ride to compliment my Earths, as it is washy but also a magnificent sounding crash. That combo is great for all music
I too heard the legend of burying cymbals. When I was a teenage drummer I sat my 20 in b8Pro Rock Ride into a fire pit and buried it for a few weeks trying to make it darker. It worked sorta but warped the edges. And that drummer from "Extreme" the 90's metal band used an Earth ride. #meaningless facts
I love your description note. “Apocryphal” indeed. Had to look that one up, but certainly the right word for the ole wives’ tale that it is. I highly doubt Zildjian buried their Earth Rides. The discoloration comes from the metallurgical process and quenching of the alloys being used, doubtful it was from any burying process. That said, if you contacted Zildjian and asked, I’m sure there’s a curator at the Zildjian plant that would be more than happy to dig in and settle the mystery once and for all. But yes, I’m in the “most likely not buried” camp. But I must say I find the apocryphal theory of them being buried appealing. It’d be a lot cooler of a ride if it’s true.
The rumor came from an official Zildjian blog. Someone sent me a link to it once but I don’t know if it’s still up or if I could find it. But they started their own false rumors like 20 years ago and then later went back on it. Some old product descriptions for the thing repeat the claim. So it’s not like it was created by customers who misunderstood the coloration. It was Zildjian and the retail companies that sold the cymbals.
Quick tip if you would like to clean your heavy power ride but don't want to Polish it use CLR( Calcium line cleaner) and water. 50/50mix. Simply spray calcium lime cleaner/water on the ride then use a sponge or magic eraser to work it in, then rinse it off with Warm water and some dish soap to remove the CLR. Then use some glass cleaner to shine... I'm not a fan of Polish because you have about a 1000 pounds of black stained rags when you're done and it really never looks that good. I'm a professional cleaner/drummer and use this on Chrome and brass/aluminum in houses all across America...😉
Have you tried Bar Keepers Friend? I use the power and liquid version and they’re both excellent cleaners yet gentle enough when diluted. There is one Zildjian cymbal I have from the mid 90’s that has a layer of tarnish thats very difficult to cut through. Would the CLR work on that? I cleaned a mid 90’s Zildjian China with the same type of tarnish and the BKF cut right through it with a ton of elbow grease but this Ride cymbal hasn’t yielded to my will yet.
20 Inch Z Power Ride I Use The Same One Love It!!!
I'm kind of leaning that way after playing each live at the same 1100 seat theater in a 2 week period.
me too,...this is the great cymbal :)
absolutely savage cymbals!
My 22" Earth Ride is a killer for unmiked metal playing. Great cutting ping with body to it, excellent for Maiden and the like.
nice, I never had a 22" but I think that the drummer from San Diego's Nihilist did back in like 2008. It sounded great for thrash/speed metal though at the time he did not know what it was, it had no logos and had been given to him second hand. Looking back I'm dead certain it was an earth ride.
I think they called it the earth ride because its not lathed.
Not because they buried it.
It wasn’t actually buried but Zildjian started that rumor themselves in a blog post. Then they busted their own myth a few years later.
Raw finish, Not Buried. I remembered when this cymbal came out and the catalog described the finish as raw and never mentioned buried. Ask Zildjian.
If you check the other comments there is quite a bit of discussion on this. Bottom line is that Zildjian started that rumor themselves, it was in an official company blog that has since been taken down. It was also sent out in a product description and is reposted on countless websites that sell Earth Rides. I didn’t make that up and it is a very common belief. Zildjian later took their blog down and changed the product description to the more logical story that it’s just a raw unlathed, unhammmered, unpolished finish. So they both started and busted their own myth.
@@RyanAlexanderBloom From one of Zildjians sites - "The first completely unlathed cymbal to hit the market was the Zildjian Earth Ride, introduced in the early 1970’s. With a look as unconventional as it’s sound, the Earth Ride produced a radical “ping” and was known for its increased power and projection. Its sound was a request from drummer Billy Cobham. One day Armand Zildjian was in the factory and came across some unfinished cymbals and played them….as it turned out, they were exactly what Billy was looking for! The funky, mottled finish is a byproduct of our quenching process and is where the name “Earth Ride” came from. The 1970’s Earth Rides were some of the most beautiful sounding and raw looking cymbals produced. The Brilliant finish model came later and gave the cymbal a slightly higher pitched, brighter tone".
With no accompanying music it would seem the Earth Ride would be better for Metal. You would be surprised what works once the full band is chugging along. I always wanted the 22” Earth Ride growing but I purchased a 20” Z Light Power Ride and never wanted anything else. I just lost out on a 21” Z Custom Mega Bell Ride with the Star pattern this afternoon on Reverb. I could have purchased it for $220 but I offered $195 and someone else bought it. Bummer.
The earth ride is actually too quiet. It sounds good but there aren’t enough overtones to cut. I played it with a band for a couple months before deciding it wasn’t enough. I could see it working for some people, but for me it was a bit underwhelming.
@@RyanAlexanderBloom I could see it working in a mic'd situation. Dude you totally got me hooked on those older Mega Bell Rides after I realized all the different versions. I never realized the Gen 1 Z CUSTOM is just as good as the Original Z model. I need one of these ASAP. I lost out on one yesterday on Reverb for a measly $25. Bummed. I guess worst case scenario I get a brand new A Mega Bell.
One on the left, One on the right for doubling and alternating ride sounds.
I used a left ride on Burn but it wasn’t really worth the effort or space required. If I want to play Erlandsson/Hoglan type double ride stuff I just use my open hi hat top. Most good hi hat cymbals are actually very thick, like little tiny rides. The sound works fairly well if you use the stick tip and play toward the bell...and you don’t need a second cymbal and stand.
Ryan Alexander Bloom Doin' the 'Peart' eh? That's a cool approach. I played in a group called 'Curse Of Denial' ( last CD 'The 13th Sign is on UA-cam, naturally. Semi- Technical Black Death pretty much). Anyway, I use a vintage A 21" Rock Ride left side low so I can not only play left handed way here and there? But I also play it 'Keith Moon' style crossing over w/ my right hand to play it. My main ride of late is a 20" A Medium Ride put up high. I crash both as well. More so the 20" as it has such a great and musical powerful wash. But the double riding I use very sparingly. Usually for only one, maybe 2 songs? And only for a certain verse, chorus, whatever. However I DO make cymbal/ drum overdubs on certain pieces for special effects: Fast double bell Ringing, Mallet and stick crescendos,etc. Last CD I layered 3 different Ride Bells: 2 Large A Rides, 1 Paiste Eclipse directly on top of each other for punctuation on one song part. Came out sounding fuckin' sick! Ha!
@@shawnhapney8784 interesting. I never crash my ride. It seriously just isn't an option with either of the cymbals in this video, or the one I had previously. Crashing an Earth Ride is like hitting a car fender or a washing machine. Not a thing.
Ryan Alexander Bloom Yeah those are quite heavy. Wouldn't mind picking up an Earth Ride for myself.
Supposedly, Dave Grohl played an Earth Ride on Nevermind.
Denise chambers played an earth ride too
and Chuck Biscuits
"Buried the cymbal" Lmao
I know for a fact that the Earth Ride was around before 1979.
Now that you mention it, Zildjian’s blog (the one that dispelled the myth that Earth rides were buried, despite Zildjian starting that myth themselves) says “early 1970s” and that Billy Cobham was the one with the idea. Did not actually find that post until you called me on it. But I guess so.
In their literature, Zildjian described the Z. Heavy Power Ride as having less overtones and spread than the A. Earth Ride, and the Z. Light Power Ride as having more overtones and spread than the A. Earth Ride.
danlc95 they can say what they want. This video clearly shows the Heavy having more spread than the Earth. I’ve never played a Light but its the one with the star hammering and obviously a totally different cymbal that, as far as I can hear on videos, has the most spread and the least ping of all 3.
@@RyanAlexanderBloom Oh for sure. Ears are so subjective, and considering the inconsistent nature of the production methods for that style of cymbals, it would not be surprising that there would be a discrepancy even in their own descriptions.
The fact that your demonstration indicates a higher pitch on the Earth Ride shows that It's heavier than the Z to begin with.
Just thought I'd pass the info along for your reference.
It also demonstrates the value of a comparison video like this.
@@danlc95 right on. Yeah cymbal companies say all kinds of weird things. Like the whole buried in the dirt thing. Turns out that they posted on their company blog a while back that it isn't true... but I think they started that rumor themselves and its in official product descriptions on a lot of websites. Thats where I got it. But other commenters have shown me the blog. A lot of people have ripped me apart for suggesting that A Zildjian is "mid-level" and by that I mean it sits in the middle of the catalog between ZBT/ZXT/ZHT/S on the low side and A Custom/K/KCustom on the high end. Its not a value judgement, but a geographical placement BY THE CYMBAL COMPANY. But, this is just confusing marketing because they also say the A line is the "most musical" and it is a pro level cymbal. Its all presentation and somehow I get yelled at for it.
@@RyanAlexanderBloom No shit? I didn't know they cleared that up!
I just commented on an "Ultimate High End hi hat" video.
Unfortunately the uploader of the video assume that COST is the deciding factor, rather than sound - (accounting for professional standards).
He chose k, hhx, and signature cymbals for his demonstration.
Good playing, nice sounding cymbals..
But the point I was trying to make in my comment was that in the professional realm, there is a base of high quality. From there, a different aound might demand a more labor intensive production method, thus raising the price.
What happens is that you get a bunch of kids breaking their gear because it isn't cutting through. They think that the more money they spend on a cymbal (regardless of sound), it is automatically "better", and more durable...
It's almost disturbing to see this phenomenon online.
Trust me when I say I'm not gonna be using my jazz cymbals on a metal gig. My reason is that I want a sound that will cut through, and is of professional quality - like the classic A. Zildjian.
That A. Zildjian line is the standard.
But yes, mid catalog!
@@RyanAlexanderBloom - If I understand correctly, you no longer have both of these cymbals?
They didn’t actually bury the earth rides, that was just an urban legend. That “finish” is just what raw, unlathed bronze looks like - no dirt necessary
Yes, I’ve been told that a bunch of times so I looked into it. You’re right but Zildjian started that “urban legend” themselves and it can still be found in some of their marketing info. They then “busted” the myth in an old blog they had. They started it then they busted it. Very silly.
I found a Z power 20in for a $100 but it rings a lot, i b like the earth because it's a little darker yet still has a good ping and that what I'm looking for. I want that old 80's rock ride sound, i saw a video on the 22in Z Power Ride and that didn't have as much ring as the 20in. Right now i play a paiste 2002 22in power ride but it's a little too bright and the bell is terrible at least 1 think so, so I'm on the hunt for some that comes close to the old Paiste 3000 22in Power Ride I had in the mid 90's because that ride was perfect, almost no ring or wash just all ride 👍. If you listen to social distortion i believe that the same ride i had or The Implants!
Hmm the heavy power sounds very different from the light Power or whatever they called the other version. Anyway there were 2. you could look into the other one. I used to play a ZBT Plus medium ride (actually very thick, not so medium) and even though it has a lot of ringy overtones by itself, it was never a problem with the full kit or on recordings. The 22 version of anything always sounds different for sure. I don't like the idea of the 22 because it takes up too much space. You may want to look at the Paiste Paragon ride. It's really heavy, it's the Peart signature.
The 3000 Power Ride is very similar to the 2002. If you're going by recordings, they never reveal the amount of noise that comes off a cymbal compared to playing one in real life.
The sound you hear on those old 80's recordings isn't necessarily going to sound the same in person.
The Earth ride would be better for metal because you loose definition with the darker wash,Easily.No question.
You would think so, but it’s actually quieter overall. It’s more pinging but less loud which means it doesn’t cut as well as it seems. I tried both of these on live shows and I sold the Earth ride after a while.
waww0 god sawoht
I have the 24 heavy power ride....PING
they . did not bury the earth ride, they just didnt lathe it
I’ve addressed this like 20 times, but Zildjian started that rumor themselves and then busted it a few years later. It was their own false info. Some product descriptions can still be found that mention burying, even now.
Both are duds terrible for any purpose I have,….esp the Earth Ride bell
God bless