In hindsight, the title could have been phrased better, but it is meant to be part of the 'we need to talk about x' series; come to my discord here: discord.gg/pb5b33YTpB to complain
@@LemonCake101 Yeah, I imagine regions like the entire Arabic world (where a surprising number of players are) are less keen on it. They might also have issues in the CCP, since I know that the Mongols have one for a female Khan who wrecked the Ming.
@@Organic_Chemistry_Junkie Because she was leader of a remnant of a part of Genghis Empire, there were dozens of those Also, even though it beated them it didn’t had any really serious long term consequences for the Ming which still lasted a good time after that until being conquered by the manchus (the Qing)
@@nehemiahkenny5027Nah, CCP and Chinese historians just considers all of conquerors just as another branches of Chinese people, like how British considers danelaw vikings, saxons, romans and Normandians just as a part of the British national history
@@nehemiahkenny5027 "the entire Arabic world" is a huge generalization and embellishment. How many hours do you have in map games and you still refer to Arabs as a monolith.
I think it's two things: - DLCs are more promotable than updates, and this was obviously meant to be a very visible addition - Paradox was terminally DLC-brained back in 2015, this was in the bad old days of "improvements to the base game are locked in the dlcs"
5:56 Iirc, back in 2015 you weren't even able to upgrade advisors yet. I'm pretty sure that was added in a later DLC, the one that also increased the advisor level cap to 5 instead of 3.
@@MyUsersDark i think they got a completely new government type that gives their rulers +1 admin. Might have also changed something for the Ottomans, I don't remember. It was in 2017 or 2018 IIRC
Somewhat unrelated, but I found an exploit just the other day involving stacking female advisor chance. Basically, if you're making a custom nation and you want a ton of land and/or an immortal 6/6/6 what you'd do is grab the negative ideas to offset the cost. However, by grabbing max level female advisor chance, which is completely free btw, you can make your ideas unbalanced towards admin, increasing their cost. Now usually that'd be awful, but in this case because all your ideas have free or negative cost, you end up with more points. So with this I was able to reach like -800 points iirc.
5:19 man i completely forgot about the hard coded state limit.... which is pretty funny considering i still seem to subconsciously play as if they exist
"Hire women and Polish, they are underpaid" and talking about Copernicus made me laugh. Especially by watching yesterday comedy that claimed that Copernicus was also a women.
Totally unrelated to the video topic, but it's cool to see so many Eu4 youtubers come up in the last few years. I remember when it was just Drew Durnil doing timelapse videos lmao.
I kid you not, I once picked up a few of the DLC's I didn't have in a Humble Bundle which also included an extra key for the base game and a few I already had, I then came across a dude discussing EU4 and saying he'd like to try it. I figure I'd send him the keys I had duplicates of and the base game, dude said thanks and installed it. He then got back to me and asked "Hey why'd you pick up the Women in History DLC", and I explained it was a free DLC. He comes back later saying he uninstalled the game and removed it because of this DLC making it seem "woke, as it focused on women". Bro, even at this point I knew he was a lost cause, but I still told him "if its that big of a deal for you can just disable it", and he still removed it because the game was "woke". I shouldn't have even told him he could disable it, someone that far gone doesn't deserve to play games.
I’m against all of that stuff and I still never thought it was woke. When I first got the game I was like uhhhh okay and then once I played with it enabled I realized that it’s 100% fine. Guess I thought it was weird that this wasn’t in the base game seeing as I came from Civ games. In no way is women in history “woke” that is just anti-woman rhetoric
I think they cracked down on this, but you used to be able to run a legit copy of CK2 with all 'liberated' DLC just fine. Got one or two friends into it like that, if I'm remembering right.
Probably just for publicity. If someone in paradox wanted to show how much effort they went through for the sake of representing a group they probably want it as a DLC so it shows up as its own unique thing on the steam page, storefront, etc
Exactly what came to mind the moment he questioned it. As a free DLC they get positive publicity, "oh wow paradox made a dedicated DLC for women's impact in history and they even made it free! How virtuous!" vs "oh what? The base game has women events? That's good I guess?" It is quite fundamentally a form of positive virtue signaling.
A big part of the reason this was a DLC originally could be that it was made by 2013 Paradox, and 2013 Paradox saying 'Good news, everyone! We've added a huge pile of new events in the latest patch, which interact with a set of brand-new trigger conditions we've also just added' would have given me pause as to whether I wanted to start any new games before the inevitable patch notes with things like 'Ottomans no longer spawn Joan of Arc as every advisor after 1550', or 'Female heir event now only fires if heir is, in fact, female'
I'm a simple man, if it's free I don't complain about it. That being said, I think they should add this either in base game or as a free update in EU5.
I imagine since the game industry has shifted so much, and Paradox has beeing trying to be better about including more history in their games, this sort of thing would just be in the base game for EU5
Was Lemon Budgetmonks alt account all along?? 😱 Jokes aside, given (many) gaming channels only talk about women in history as a problem, title might draw in a different crowd than usual 😅
This video made me remember about Female Generals and it makes me curious, do they have a bonus of some kind? I saw them in an idea’s group and it makes me wonder what they do.
@ Ah that’s a shame, if they ever look on reworking on it, maybe they can give an overall reduction cost to recruiting Generals or add an extra pip due to having a larger selection of potential generals.
We know you exist but there are so few of you is like paying attention to production income in 1444 some people do, most don't... Nothing against production though
The only Paradox DLC I can think of that people actively disable is CK2's Sunset Invasion. CK3's Friends and Foes maybe deserves it, too, but I haven't heard of anyone that's actually done it.
i recently tried a new game as Milan. but somehow got the event to get a very good heir (the one with alexander as an option). the event talked about how the heir was destined to be a good ruler. they actually ended up replacing the starting ruler because the starting ruler lived to be around 70. unfortunately I'm very strongly hug boxed in that game (the papal state is an ally of France. nobody will help me with savoy (who is allied to Aragon). Venice is to strong for me to beat in a war (and nobody will help me with Venice, they even did decently in a war with the ottomans even though Venice lost that war). Florence is an ally of Venice. Austria is an ally of Aragon (which is among the reasons why i can't expand into Sardinia or Sicily), and Naples is also an ally of Savoy (if it helps. currently it's around 30 to 40 years till 1500. I'm up to date on tech along with all of the nations hug boxing me (aside from Savoy who is 2 techs behind on mil). for the time being i stayed in the hre (I'm allied to the emperor, so why not stay while i get ready to form Italy). Austria has a pu on hungry (it happened without a war). France took all of England's land in mainland Europe in the 100 years war. the ottomans decided to use there golden age early (it will expire around 1507), i have bologna and Ferrara as subjects (i had an opportunity where the papal states wouldn't defend bologna, and i made Ferrara a subject to make a coalition less likely to form) and i can almost diplomatically make mantua a subject)
3:30 Oh, Oh! I know this one! I studied a little bit of programming. That's best practices, you always try to future proof for unseen potential changes you may implement down the line, even if you're sure you won't, you never truly know. Typing in the scope to country accomplishes the same result as just typing in France, but suppose that someday down the line you decide you want to change the event from being French exclusive, like suppose you wanted it to be available to French ducal minors too. Well, instead of having to write two lines of code, one to change "France" to the scope to country method, and another to add the actual additional countries you want to be able to get the event; now instead all you need to do is just add the countries because you already laid the groundwork for that when you originally coded the event.
I've always considered the discount to advisors was to let you run them at higher skills than you could standardly afford to sort of represent their skill, if I'm poor and have a 1,1,2 advisor it makes the 2 skill advisor better. But once you can get them all to skill 5 then you are just paying less for them and this frame falls apart
Yeah also before the favors mechanic rework it would take you 30 years as a weak nations to accumulate 10 favors (currying was not a thing). Favors and estates, which were very underwhelming, were part of the Cossacks DLC. If you disabled it, the calculation for joining a war would just be the basic war exhaustion, manpower, attitude, diplo rep and debt, so a lot of people would disable Cossacks to play Byzantium or some other early ally-dependent strategy
Minor nitpick, but Copernicus was not Polish in the way in which Eu4 uses "culture" despite the game showing him as "Polish" culture - a problem also present in Eu4 when it comes to the game refraining from some or explicitly adopting other nationalist historical narratives of specific countries sometimes. He worked for the Polish Kingdom which is accurately portrayed by advisor roles in Eu4, but it would be more accurate if he was of Prussian culture ingame (or Lower Prussian if the game ever split of the difference between that).
6:47 All of the american natives were playable in 2015. source: I bought EU4 in 2014 after watching TheMeInTeam's Creek playthrough, which started that year. Anyway I've hated Women in History for years because the female advisor portraits aren't supported by Waifu Universalis so they stick out like a sore thumb next to my cute anime girls.
Obviously the women can be payed less, they can sew their own clothes after all. This was a real argument for why women should be payed less in the past.
Hey Lemon 👋 since you sometimes play in the code of the game, I was wondering if you could see somewhere formulas for how the AI takes decisions. In particular, I was curious about how exactly does it choose which side to pick in the Religious Leagues (I know it is tied to rivals more than religion, but beyond that, I can't seem to find anything). Another thing I'm curious about is how colonizers choose where to colonize first. I think it could make for great videos! Thanks
There is speculation regarding the first one, but its not exactly 'clearly demonstrated' in the game code. As for where to colonize, we know from experimentation there is weight to colonize downstream as well as prioritize higher development, but not much more outside of that.
They might be outdated but at least these events work. Some Tengri events are broken because "secondary" religion check is removed for some reason while events aren't updated. So game checks "No Religion". These events worked before, I don't know which exact patch removed them. These events came with Cossacks. It is still being sold.
It's like with United and ready polish "DLC", it's just for prestige. Both could be just day one patches no problem, but making them into DLCs sticks in the player's heads more easily than just a simple patch. Also by placing them in the DLC category both on premiere buyers and players who bought the game even years later have a more positive reaction by seeing this in their "owned DLCs" list and again, it stands out more so players will remember it more. Like, does anyone still remember that patch for CK2 that added monuments? Is anyone making any videos talking about this even though it was great addition to the game? But here we are with women in history, nearly 10 years after premiere people talk and make videos about it
I've always thought that I wasn't paying a single person whole of france's economy at 1444 because they were "level 5". But that they had a "team" of some sorts. Like their own people they've hired and facilities they're maintaning. When you think about it like that they're not being underpaid, they're being efficient because of their talents. But that is never written nor implied anywhere so maybe that would be good
Reminds me of how HOI4 had a free DLC that added content for Poland at launch for some reason. I don't know why it wasn't part of the base game to begin with
One thing you've missed in explaining why this is a DLC is the release date - Women in History was released on 8th of March so it was actually meant to be a gift for International Women's day. That could also explain why it wasn't included in the base game - it's so that the DLC would always be displayed in the Steam Market and everyone would always be reminded of Paradox's, for lack of a better word, "wokeness".
Devils advocate, but is the suggestion at the end not just perpetuating the problem? If they went through and polished up the Women in History advisors to be unique which almost invariably means straight up better, that's insinuating that they were better than the male counterparts and, if we're going to start taking EU4 mechanics at face value as having directly translatable statements (ie; lower upkeep = cheap labour), that the female advisors were uniquely capable of things that no one else could, which would make them even greater (wo)men than Napoleon is portrayed as in the game.
I never understood why Paradox players are so against women in games, literally in Imperator where you had an option at the start of the game to allow women leaders, generals, etc., I saw many complaining even though this It gave you a tremendous advantage since it doubled the possible characters you could use and many women with very good stats could help you a lot, literally I always activated it because I found women with 24 to 27 stat in military and diplomatic among others, it was more of an advantage than anything else.
The majority of Paradox players are playing for some level of immersion in the game and it's incredibly immersion-breaking to see women acting like warriors.
@MekarWB There were several female warriors, especially in Roman times and in areas such as Britannia, the best known is Boudica, but for example in Sparta all women knew how to fight and defend themselves, in fact they were known for that.
@@wersab5960 It is not historical revisionism, especially since these are data passed down by historians, in fact most of the stories of Spartan women, In which it was described that they could practice sports, such as javelin throw, weight lifting and more and even knew how to defend themselves come from Greek historians of that time, there have been women involved In many places, for example, the Norsemen allowed women to join as Vikings and there were even several well-known ones for that reason. Trying to say that they did not exist is historical revisionism.
I turn off women in history because it gives strictly only very good events- I find they're much better than other vanilla events by comparison. when I'm hosting I want my players to suffer with 'intended' mechanics.
I figure the reason why it wasn’t a free update was so that it would be more visible. It might have been a virtue signaling thing. Not in a bad way though, it just tells the world that “hey you can learn about cool women in this game”
I guess you could disable it if you had a balancing concern about adding a bunch of events that give specific countries reliable buffs you don't really have to do anything to get?
You could play as the other natives, unless I'm misunderstanding you and you are saying they just weren't good. EU never had the restrictions of say, CK, where you can't play certain nations on the map. I would know as one of the first games I ever played of a paradox game was a game as the creek back in EU3 in 2012. Given EU3 starting earlier, it was a bit bland to not really be able to colonize for 100 years after I united the 3 nations in the area and then wait for the Euros to colonize my border so I could hit the westernize button and take the massive stab hit. Since national ideas were limited by gov tech and national ideas themselves were very different than eu4, technically you could get a colonist earlier than the euros arriving, but not really as tech groups were really punishing in EU3. Colonists also weren't a thing you always had, but instead were things you generated, spent and had a max cap of how many you could have at once. Edit: Oh yeah, the topic of the video, I do remember people disabling it when it was released. I remember seeing people say they were disabling it because it was obnoxious or something, so I played it myself and completely forgot that it existed until this video was released almost 10 years later.
Dear Lord Lemon Cake, You make many great videos about EU4 that I greatly enjoy, but when will we see you talk about "Project Caesar"? I would love to see "your" "thoughts" and "videos" about "the" so-called "EU5" "!"
I did make a couple indeed as some linked below, but one the issues I have is that I don't want to talk about a hypothetical product as it where: I will certainly be touching upon it when it is with us :)
Well, I did it once. Closest to perfect equality is by stacking 45% female advisor chance (making 47% total, 2% is base). Imho most accessible way to get is Muslim Theocracy event for 20% and 25% on Meritocracy republic reform. You also get female generals. I did it in my Sus into US game. I also gave Muxe rights it unfortunately made my female advisor chance 57%. I hate rolling Zapotek male level 1 or 2 advisor. Once I rolled level 3.
I actually imagine it might be for a different reason: Swedish subsidies. It could be it was part of some initiative or project that the gubmint there pushed for equality and they took part. I assume paid, but possibly no.
@@theminingsageIgnorant modern culture war arguments, it is, very evidently, virtue signaling by the very fact they presented it as a free DLC rather than as an update. It gives off better publicity. "Oh hey paradox added women's events and history as a new DLC and even made it free!" vs "yeah they added women to the base game. Took em long enough."
@@LemonCake101 Thanks, I got an update recently which might well have been the annexation of the DLC. At some point I need to get back into the game and give it a look as I got the Winds of Change DLC last month.
I hate Mongolian queen Mandukhai is never in game because you have to be monarchy to trigger the event for her and who the fuck goes for monarchy as horde. Another very good question would be who the hell told paradox that horde's don't have feudalism. How do you think house of Borjigin stayed in power for 800 years? Who told them no child can be khan? Have they looked at coronation age of some Mongol khans?
You could look at half off advisors as they work more for less money or you could see them as more talented so they can get more done for less money. Advisors could be interpreted as an advisor plus their entourage thus making sense why a level five advisor can cost you the per month upkeep of an entire army of infantry, cav, and artillery
Yeah I can tell you werent around in 2015... the chuds got MAD at this DLC... like a LOT. MANY clowns disabled it, probably because they are emotionally and developmentally disabled themselves.
I don’t get the point the gender of the adviser doesn’t matter and why should it matter if you want a woman then hire her it’s mostly about the modifiers that matter And the woman gets paid less than male is weird to me why would you want to hire a man if he’s more expensive than the woman but do the same things as the woman. And I don’t mean it in the political way
Gender actually does matter for some events. If you don't want your consort sleeping with your advisors in the "desires of the flesh" event, then only hire women, or only hire men if you have a male consort
@mrhjortsoe1857 I looked through some advisor, consort and ruler events a while back when I wanted to see what effect religion can have on them. Found this out in the process
The transoxiana comment someone made was just a joke but it would be cool to see a version of this for queer people in history, or maybe just a general DLC for marginalized groups. Gotz of the iron hand would be a rad as fuck character to have aces too and also showing a disabled historical figure. Especially if he or others in it had unique buffs it would be especially cool to tie this to the renaissance, as during that period in some parts homosexuality was at least somewhat accepted. yeah it would be a lot of work, but it would be really interesting and I think would educate people not just on the figures, but maybe change the way a few people view history who might otherwise slide into reacctionary thinking like a lot of paradox gamers do
@@petar4209 because I don't want it in the game so I'd prefer it be optional. Same as they did with Women in History, probably to appease the large muslim playerbase
In hindsight, the title could have been phrased better, but it is meant to be part of the 'we need to talk about x' series; come to my discord here: discord.gg/pb5b33YTpB to complain
Is a good clickbait title idk what you mean.
Absolutely brilliant.
@@felixschrider9037 while true, I am not sure I want to appeal to the Hoi4 crowd... yet
@@LemonCake101 XD
As someone with over 5k hours in Hoi4...
Its too late.
@@felixschrider9037 maybe Hoi4 is the eventual fate of all pdx players, heard nice things about the last DLC
@@LemonCake101 Is interesting.
Cant wait till the modders start getting ideas.
Lemon, we are Eu4 players, we do not talk to women unless they give us 75% advisor cost reduction
Counter argument: Talented and Ambitious daughter
@@LemonCake101Counter argument to that, heir falls ill
@@BolphesarusMaximusWardius crash :(
That’s a trap I’m not getting PU’d
Or she is 6 6 6 ruler
I really wish that historical advisors in general gave unique bonuses, and werent just being underpayed.
I think it’s about how much money they spend to enact their reforms too
funny thing is i think that WOULD'VE been possible to do, if they wanted to. which means mods probably could!
Main takeaway: hire exclusively Polish women, you can pay them nothing
Noted*
Does this extend to real life too?
@@dean_l33As anyone in Western Europe knows the answer is yes. The polish are shittily paid guest labourers
Of course
My guess why it was not just an update is, because they can region restrict only the DLC and not the whole game.
Oh that's something I hadn't considered in fairness!
@@LemonCake101 Yeah, I imagine regions like the entire Arabic world (where a surprising number of players are) are less keen on it. They might also have issues in the CCP, since I know that the Mongols have one for a female Khan who wrecked the Ming.
@@Organic_Chemistry_Junkie
Because she was leader of a remnant of a part of Genghis Empire, there were dozens of those
Also, even though it beated them it didn’t had any really serious long term consequences for the Ming which still lasted a good time after that until being conquered by the manchus (the Qing)
@@nehemiahkenny5027Nah, CCP and Chinese historians just considers all of conquerors just as another branches of Chinese people, like how British considers danelaw vikings, saxons, romans and Normandians just as a part of the British national history
@@nehemiahkenny5027 "the entire Arabic world" is a huge generalization and embellishment. How many hours do you have in map games and you still refer to Arabs as a monolith.
Paradox have history of making the game woke. They made Oxiana trans for no reason!!!
Fuck, that took me a while
Nah, that map color is giving trans vibes.
This took me 2 seconds I think I'm playing too much
For a long time Timurids weren't letting them came out lmao.
They're next to Nogai so they get bashed often enough.
I think it's two things:
- DLCs are more promotable than updates, and this was obviously meant to be a very visible addition
- Paradox was terminally DLC-brained back in 2015, this was in the bad old days of "improvements to the base game are locked in the dlcs"
Female advisor from event
Special ability: underpaid
They make one have a 10% reduction costs
-23% advisor cost
5:56 Iirc, back in 2015 you weren't even able to upgrade advisors yet. I'm pretty sure that was added in a later DLC, the one that also increased the advisor level cap to 5 instead of 3.
oh fair, excellent point!
I believe that the DLC that allowed you to do that was Cradle of Civilization.
Yup. And I think the same DLC also added professionaliam, army drill and some special government mechanics for the Mamluks
@@poldi2233 I'm pretty sure it was the Ottomans, but it's also possible they added the "no-heir" thing for the Mamluks too I suppose
@@MyUsersDark i think they got a completely new government type that gives their rulers +1 admin. Might have also changed something for the Ottomans, I don't remember. It was in 2017 or 2018 IIRC
Somewhat unrelated, but I found an exploit just the other day involving stacking female advisor chance.
Basically, if you're making a custom nation and you want a ton of land and/or an immortal 6/6/6 what you'd do is grab the negative ideas to offset the cost. However, by grabbing max level female advisor chance, which is completely free btw, you can make your ideas unbalanced towards admin, increasing their cost. Now usually that'd be awful, but in this case because all your ideas have free or negative cost, you end up with more points. So with this I was able to reach like -800 points iirc.
interesting, certainly worth further... investigation
5:19 man i completely forgot about the hard coded state limit.... which is pretty funny considering i still seem to subconsciously play as if they exist
"Hire women and Polish, they are underpaid" and talking about Copernicus made me laugh. Especially by watching yesterday comedy that claimed that Copernicus was also a women.
Oh I haven't seen that one, but yeah, quite the combination... modifier stacking wage cost
Polish one, Sexmission, communist era sci-fi comedy about men going extinct. One of those movies that gets funnier with each passing year xd
Totally unrelated to the video topic, but it's cool to see so many Eu4 youtubers come up in the last few years. I remember when it was just Drew Durnil doing timelapse videos lmao.
There has been a bit of a resurgence recently indeed!
I kid you not, I once picked up a few of the DLC's I didn't have in a Humble Bundle which also included an extra key for the base game and a few I already had, I then came across a dude discussing EU4 and saying he'd like to try it. I figure I'd send him the keys I had duplicates of and the base game, dude said thanks and installed it. He then got back to me and asked "Hey why'd you pick up the Women in History DLC", and I explained it was a free DLC. He comes back later saying he uninstalled the game and removed it because of this DLC making it seem "woke, as it focused on women".
Bro, even at this point I knew he was a lost cause, but I still told him "if its that big of a deal for you can just disable it", and he still removed it because the game was "woke". I shouldn't have even told him he could disable it, someone that far gone doesn't deserve to play games.
Also btw love your content. Always like seeing a modifier stack vid and thinking "I should try this" only for me to do the same 3 runs again.
What? Nocom.
@@joesmoe6454 Did he return you the game?
@@genovayork2468 Nope
I’m against all of that stuff and I still never thought it was woke. When I first got the game I was like uhhhh okay and then once I played with it enabled I realized that it’s 100% fine. Guess I thought it was weird that this wasn’t in the base game seeing as I came from Civ games. In no way is women in history “woke” that is just anti-woman rhetoric
All paradox dlc are free, brother.
Ah yes, the alternative shopfronts...
play where you want cuz a pirate is free
Found my fellow Pie Rats
I think they cracked down on this, but you used to be able to run a legit copy of CK2 with all 'liberated' DLC just fine. Got one or two friends into it like that, if I'm remembering right.
@@DieuDeMort I do this with all paradox games bro.
When's the MEN in history DLC getting released, Paradox?
It's just normal History.
it's every other dlc lol
Probably just for publicity. If someone in paradox wanted to show how much effort they went through for the sake of representing a group they probably want it as a DLC so it shows up as its own unique thing on the steam page, storefront, etc
Exactly what came to mind the moment he questioned it. As a free DLC they get positive publicity, "oh wow paradox made a dedicated DLC for women's impact in history and they even made it free! How virtuous!" vs "oh what? The base game has women events? That's good I guess?"
It is quite fundamentally a form of positive virtue signaling.
@@joelfilho2625 Do you blame them?
@@genovayork2468 well it does feel a tad manipulative and an empty platitude once you realize it so yeah I kinda do blame them.
I disable women in history every time because women are not real bro. I only play with mods that replace every advisor with a cat.
Have you played the furry dlc of crusader kings 2?
A big part of the reason this was a DLC originally could be that it was made by 2013 Paradox, and 2013 Paradox saying 'Good news, everyone! We've added a huge pile of new events in the latest patch, which interact with a set of brand-new trigger conditions we've also just added' would have given me pause as to whether I wanted to start any new games before the inevitable patch notes with things like
'Ottomans no longer spawn Joan of Arc as every advisor after 1550', or 'Female heir event now only fires if heir is, in fact, female'
I would talk to women more if they gave me a -5% tech cost modifier for 20 years.
I'm a simple man, if it's free I don't complain about it.
That being said, I think they should add this either in base game or as a free update in EU5.
I imagine since the game industry has shifted so much, and Paradox has beeing trying to be better about including more history in their games, this sort of thing would just be in the base game for EU5
The title makes it sound like you're gonna complain about women and wokeness in EU4 or something lol.
But we know you, Lemon. You're a good boy.
Yeah, issue is, the DLC is literally called that
Was Lemon Budgetmonks alt account all along?? 😱
Jokes aside, given (many) gaming channels only talk about women in history as a problem, title might draw in a different crowd than usual 😅
Cringe
Yeah, Lemon just bends over for arabs
@@albaniaalban Yea it definitely did
I'm waiting for the Lemon Cakes as Advisors DLC.
It would be the Prestige one
@@idontlikerome2744 Dumb Romaboo.
What is a “women”? I have extensive historical grand strategy knowledge and have never heard of such a thing.
This video made me remember about Female Generals and it makes me curious, do they have a bonus of some kind? I saw them in an idea’s group and it makes me wonder what they do.
Pretty much absolutely nothing actually! Just adds female names to the list, and a gender identifier
@ Ah that’s a shame, if they ever look on reworking on it, maybe they can give an overall reduction cost to recruiting Generals or add an extra pip due to having a larger selection of potential generals.
its fun as a woman having every eu4 youtuber assume all players are dudes
according to my youtuber stats, its 102% male with a 2% margin of error
MtF doesnt count
We know you exist but there are so few of you is like paying attention to production income in 1444 some people do, most don't... Nothing against production though
Trans dont count
@@sasi5841 grow up
7:55 - Since the Kennedy Administration!
He wants his Tunis missions
The only Paradox DLC I can think of that people actively disable is CK2's Sunset Invasion. CK3's Friends and Foes maybe deserves it, too, but I haven't heard of anyone that's actually done it.
i recently tried a new game as Milan. but somehow got the event to get a very good heir (the one with alexander as an option). the event talked about how the heir was destined to be a good ruler. they actually ended up replacing the starting ruler because the starting ruler lived to be around 70. unfortunately I'm very strongly hug boxed in that game (the papal state is an ally of France. nobody will help me with savoy (who is allied to Aragon). Venice is to strong for me to beat in a war (and nobody will help me with Venice, they even did decently in a war with the ottomans even though Venice lost that war). Florence is an ally of Venice. Austria is an ally of Aragon (which is among the reasons why i can't expand into Sardinia or Sicily), and Naples is also an ally of Savoy (if it helps. currently it's around 30 to 40 years till 1500. I'm up to date on tech along with all of the nations hug boxing me (aside from Savoy who is 2 techs behind on mil). for the time being i stayed in the hre (I'm allied to the emperor, so why not stay while i get ready to form Italy). Austria has a pu on hungry (it happened without a war). France took all of England's land in mainland Europe in the 100 years war. the ottomans decided to use there golden age early (it will expire around 1507), i have bologna and Ferrara as subjects (i had an opportunity where the papal states wouldn't defend bologna, and i made Ferrara a subject to make a coalition less likely to form) and i can almost diplomatically make mantua a subject)
3:30 Oh, Oh! I know this one! I studied a little bit of programming. That's best practices, you always try to future proof for unseen potential changes you may implement down the line, even if you're sure you won't, you never truly know. Typing in the scope to country accomplishes the same result as just typing in France, but suppose that someday down the line you decide you want to change the event from being French exclusive, like suppose you wanted it to be available to French ducal minors too. Well, instead of having to write two lines of code, one to change "France" to the scope to country method, and another to add the actual additional countries you want to be able to get the event; now instead all you need to do is just add the countries because you already laid the groundwork for that when you originally coded the event.
I think it's pretty obvious, it's a dlc so it shows up on the store page. They wanted to market the update that puts women in the game.
I didn't play Eu4 in a long time(too lazy to log into Epic) but i even forgot it was a dlc lol
Its in the base game for almost 5years now.
@@minmaus8397 No like it thought it was just a part of the game not a free dlc
I've always considered the discount to advisors was to let you run them at higher skills than you could standardly afford to sort of represent their skill, if I'm poor and have a 1,1,2 advisor it makes the 2 skill advisor better. But once you can get them all to skill 5 then you are just paying less for them and this frame falls apart
Yeah also before the favors mechanic rework it would take you 30 years as a weak nations to accumulate 10 favors (currying was not a thing). Favors and estates, which were very underwhelming, were part of the Cossacks DLC. If you disabled it, the calculation for joining a war would just be the basic war exhaustion, manpower, attitude, diplo rep and debt, so a lot of people would disable Cossacks to play Byzantium or some other early ally-dependent strategy
Minor nitpick, but Copernicus was not Polish in the way in which Eu4 uses "culture" despite the game showing him as "Polish" culture - a problem also present in Eu4 when it comes to the game refraining from some or explicitly adopting other nationalist historical narratives of specific countries sometimes. He worked for the Polish Kingdom which is accurately portrayed by advisor roles in Eu4, but it would be more accurate if he was of Prussian culture ingame (or Lower Prussian if the game ever split of the difference between that).
Oh fair; yeah I had no idea I assumed irl he was very much Polish
Mikołaj Kopernik was literally polish. What the hell are you talking about?
6:47 All of the american natives were playable in 2015.
source: I bought EU4 in 2014 after watching TheMeInTeam's Creek playthrough, which started that year.
Anyway I've hated Women in History for years because the female advisor portraits aren't supported by Waifu Universalis so they stick out like a sore thumb next to my cute anime girls.
thats just because no one bothered to add waifu universalis portraits in place of the female advisor portraits
Each channel membership = 1 formable nation Lemon will do a primary sources analysis to determine the ratio of female to male advisors
I just like the white borders on the advisor graphic
A lot of companies will add "FLC", simply for the purpose of being able to market it.
ill be honest never heard the term FLC before
@@LemonCake101free loadable content I suspect
I do not need to disable woman to make them avoid contact
Obviously the women can be payed less, they can sew their own clothes after all.
This was a real argument for why women should be payed less in the past.
I bet the original intention was to make it a paid DLC but Paradox realized it really wouldn't sell well.
Hey Lemon 👋 since you sometimes play in the code of the game, I was wondering if you could see somewhere formulas for how the AI takes decisions. In particular, I was curious about how exactly does it choose which side to pick in the Religious Leagues (I know it is tied to rivals more than religion, but beyond that, I can't seem to find anything). Another thing I'm curious about is how colonizers choose where to colonize first. I think it could make for great videos! Thanks
There is speculation regarding the first one, but its not exactly 'clearly demonstrated' in the game code. As for where to colonize, we know from experimentation there is weight to colonize downstream as well as prioritize higher development, but not much more outside of that.
They should have just given techcost to the advisors lol
They might be outdated but at least these events work. Some Tengri events are broken because "secondary" religion check is removed for some reason while events aren't updated. So game checks "No Religion". These events worked before, I don't know which exact patch removed them. These events came with Cossacks. It is still being sold.
It's like with United and ready polish "DLC", it's just for prestige. Both could be just day one patches no problem, but making them into DLCs sticks in the player's heads more easily than just a simple patch. Also by placing them in the DLC category both on premiere buyers and players who bought the game even years later have a more positive reaction by seeing this in their "owned DLCs" list and again, it stands out more so players will remember it more. Like, does anyone still remember that patch for CK2 that added monuments? Is anyone making any videos talking about this even though it was great addition to the game? But here we are with women in history, nearly 10 years after premiere people talk and make videos about it
I just don't like women🗿
-Average Paradox gamer
I've always thought that I wasn't paying a single person whole of france's economy at 1444 because they were "level 5". But that they had a "team" of some sorts. Like their own people they've hired and facilities they're maintaning. When you think about it like that they're not being underpaid, they're being efficient because of their talents. But that is never written nor implied anywhere so maybe that would be good
4:47 Which tbh makes sense from a historical perspective.
Reminds me of how HOI4 had a free DLC that added content for Poland at launch for some reason. I don't know why it wasn't part of the base game to begin with
Did I see the upcoming and groundbreaking mod that is the Hartlepool mod in your folders?
Indeed, currently hoping for a pre-2100 release!
One thing you've missed in explaining why this is a DLC is the release date - Women in History was released on 8th of March so it was actually meant to be a gift for International Women's day. That could also explain why it wasn't included in the base game - it's so that the DLC would always be displayed in the Steam Market and everyone would always be reminded of Paradox's, for lack of a better word, "wokeness".
Hire women and Polish, they are underpaid as a Pole I approve employing polish, women and polish women, even for cost saving reasons only
P*lish women 🤮
Legends says this dlc automatically disables when you reach 1000 hours
Alternative title: Lemon Cake gone woke
I can't believe Paradox gave us Developer Mandated Female Advisors.
My guess is that it was meant to be paid, but thought it might be bad press to paylock a woman DLC, so they made it free
I was considering that, but from day 1 it was free the whole time. Indeed though locking women behind a paywall would have been a fascinating decision
@@LemonCake101no one likes a -1 dip rep event...
@@LemonCake101 It being free from day 1 is not conflicting with what they said though. They're just saying paradox realized it before making it paid
Devils advocate, but is the suggestion at the end not just perpetuating the problem?
If they went through and polished up the Women in History advisors to be unique which almost invariably means straight up better, that's insinuating that they were better than the male counterparts and, if we're going to start taking EU4 mechanics at face value as having directly translatable statements (ie; lower upkeep = cheap labour), that the female advisors were uniquely capable of things that no one else could, which would make them even greater (wo)men than Napoleon is portrayed as in the game.
I never understood why Paradox players are so against women in games, literally in Imperator where you had an option at the start of the game to allow women leaders, generals, etc., I saw many complaining even though this It gave you a tremendous advantage since it doubled the possible characters you could use and many women with very good stats could help you a lot, literally I always activated it because I found women with 24 to 27 stat in military and diplomatic among others, it was more of an advantage than anything else.
The majority of Paradox players are playing for some level of immersion in the game and it's incredibly immersion-breaking to see women acting like warriors.
@MekarWB There were several female warriors, especially in Roman times and in areas such as Britannia, the best known is Boudica, but for example in Sparta all women knew how to fight and defend themselves, in fact they were known for that.
@@mateoUR2121 stop larping, that is historical revisionism
@@wersab5960 It is not historical revisionism, especially since these are data passed down by historians, in fact most of the stories of Spartan women, In which it was described that they could practice sports, such as javelin throw, weight lifting and more and even knew how to defend themselves come from Greek historians of that time, there have been women involved In many places, for example, the Norsemen allowed women to join as Vikings and there were even several well-known ones for that reason. Trying to say that they did not exist is historical revisionism.
@@wersab5960 As if the popular perception of ancient civilization wasn't already a product of historical revisionism
My guess:
It was going to be paid DLC, then they made it free last minute to avoid controversy.
anyone else never knew this DLC existed before?
If i speak, I'm in big trouble, BIG trouble.
I turn off women in history because it gives strictly only very good events- I find they're much better than other vanilla events by comparison.
when I'm hosting I want my players to suffer with 'intended' mechanics.
I wish there was a Woman DLC in real life
I figure the reason why it wasn’t a free update was so that it would be more visible. It might have been a virtue signaling thing. Not in a bad way though, it just tells the world that “hey you can learn about cool women in this game”
Am I going insane or did lemon cake take his addy this morning and is speaking at Mach 20 speed
women made this game worth playing
I guess you could disable it if you had a balancing concern about adding a bunch of events that give specific countries reliable buffs you don't really have to do anything to get?
You could play as the other natives, unless I'm misunderstanding you and you are saying they just weren't good. EU never had the restrictions of say, CK, where you can't play certain nations on the map. I would know as one of the first games I ever played of a paradox game was a game as the creek back in EU3 in 2012. Given EU3 starting earlier, it was a bit bland to not really be able to colonize for 100 years after I united the 3 nations in the area and then wait for the Euros to colonize my border so I could hit the westernize button and take the massive stab hit. Since national ideas were limited by gov tech and national ideas themselves were very different than eu4, technically you could get a colonist earlier than the euros arriving, but not really as tech groups were really punishing in EU3. Colonists also weren't a thing you always had, but instead were things you generated, spent and had a max cap of how many you could have at once.
Edit: Oh yeah, the topic of the video, I do remember people disabling it when it was released. I remember seeing people say they were disabling it because it was obnoxious or something, so I played it myself and completely forgot that it existed until this video was released almost 10 years later.
6:17 The woman one vic3 and the pole one Vic 2? What did he mean by this?
Does he know???
Dear Lord Lemon Cake,
You make many great videos about EU4 that I greatly enjoy, but when will we see you talk about "Project Caesar"?
I would love to see "your" "thoughts" and "videos" about "the" so-called "EU5" "!"
He made a few ua-cam.com/video/LRsa3MIW4Fw/v-deo.html
I did make a couple indeed as some linked below, but one the issues I have is that I don't want to talk about a hypothetical product as it where: I will certainly be touching upon it when it is with us :)
@@MyUsersDark Thank you, I missed this!
I guess im the only one that always try to do a perfect democracy with equal rights for men and women(as much as the game allows)😔
Well, I did it once. Closest to perfect equality is by stacking 45% female advisor chance (making 47% total, 2% is base). Imho most accessible way to get is Muslim Theocracy event for 20% and 25% on Meritocracy republic reform. You also get female generals.
I did it in my Sus into US game. I also gave Muxe rights it unfortunately made my female advisor chance 57%. I hate rolling Zapotek male level 1 or 2 advisor. Once I rolled level 3.
@@kazogai im glad im not the only one based, also nice run idea
Playd with sombody that got the mandade of heaven in the game after annation got ridd of it
I've had it disabled since it came out, don't care much for women
I have never noticed that dlc
I actually imagine it might be for a different reason: Swedish subsidies. It could be it was part of some initiative or project that the gubmint there pushed for equality and they took part. I assume paid, but possibly no.
It was a virtue signalling for 8th of March.
Also advisor fishing, promotion and 4-5 levels didn't exist back then.
is it really virtue signaling to put women is a historical game?
@@theminingsage They've put modernist and exaggerated version of them.
@@theminingsageIgnorant modern culture war arguments, it is, very evidently, virtue signaling by the very fact they presented it as a free DLC rather than as an update. It gives off better publicity. "Oh hey paradox added women's events and history as a new DLC and even made it free!" vs "yeah they added women to the base game. Took em long enough."
Still waiting for the furries in history dlc
This might be a silly question but I can't find the DLC on steam.
Is it sold seperately?
It was annexed into the base game recently enough, so if you bought Eu4 after like 2023 you won't have it
@@LemonCake101 Thanks, I got an update recently which might well have been the annexation of the DLC. At some point I need to get back into the game and give it a look as I got the Winds of Change DLC last month.
As a woman who's a big fan of women this is the best DLC and I wish I could turn off men in game as much as I turn them off IRL.
Why are you female
women do not exist, stop lying
Trans doesn't count
@@bradleycooper5436 cry about it
@@jodinha4225 real woman only
Tfw no button to disable the woman DLC.
It's so people see that Paradox has a DLC focused on women in their game about colonialism and give them progressive points.
true
My theory is that it’s to virtue signal, a highly visible DLC in your library is more effective than a forgettable update.
I agree with someone else in the comments who said it's probably so the large muslim part of the playerbase can turn it off
Women's value is the same of the dlc.
I hate Mongolian queen Mandukhai is never in game because you have to be monarchy to trigger the event for her and who the fuck goes for monarchy as horde.
Another very good question would be who the hell told paradox that horde's don't have feudalism. How do you think house of Borjigin stayed in power for 800 years? Who told them no child can be khan? Have they looked at coronation age of some Mongol khans?
is this british voiced
Indeed I currently reside within the UK
You could look at half off advisors as they work more for less money or you could see them as more talented so they can get more done for less money. Advisors could be interpreted as an advisor plus their entourage thus making sense why a level five advisor can cost you the per month upkeep of an entire army of infantry, cav, and artillery
They work the same.
i know what im doing this weekend
I got it disabled from the start
oh dear thank god you're not a misogynist 🙏 it feels so shit whenever a favorite youtuber comes out as such
Yeah I can tell you werent around in 2015... the chuds got MAD at this DLC... like a LOT. MANY clowns disabled it, probably because they are emotionally and developmentally disabled themselves.
Damn really? RIP
tilting at windmills at max
I don’t get the point
the gender of the adviser doesn’t matter and why should it matter if you want a woman then hire her it’s mostly about the modifiers that matter
And the woman gets paid less than male is weird to me why would you want to hire a man if he’s more expensive than the woman but do the same things as the woman. And I don’t mean it in the political way
Gender actually does matter for some events. If you don't want your consort sleeping with your advisors in the "desires of the flesh" event, then only hire women, or only hire men if you have a male consort
@ fair but it’s still just a so small thing to play after on less you role play. Just out of curiosity did you know that without google it
@mrhjortsoe1857 I looked through some advisor, consort and ruler events a while back when I wanted to see what effect religion can have on them. Found this out in the process
@@Andy-wc5xw that pretty cool
A DLC that stays turned off.
Snowflake.
Women ☕
I personally don't have an opinion on it because I always turn it off before starting any game.
The transoxiana comment someone made was just a joke but it would be cool to see a version of this for queer people in history, or maybe just a general DLC for marginalized groups. Gotz of the iron hand would be a rad as fuck character to have aces too and also showing a disabled historical figure. Especially if he or others in it had unique buffs
it would be especially cool to tie this to the renaissance, as during that period in some parts homosexuality was at least somewhat accepted. yeah it would be a lot of work, but it would be really interesting and I think would educate people not just on the figures, but maybe change the way a few people view history who might otherwise slide into reacctionary thinking like a lot of paradox gamers do
Ok but if it exists I hope it is included in settings or an optional DLC, so not necessary for ironman
@@poldi2233...why?
@@petar4209 because I don't want it in the game so I'd prefer it be optional. Same as they did with Women in History, probably to appease the large muslim playerbase
Yeah, I would turn that shit off immediately
You have ck3 for that moron
I love women ❤️❤️❤️
Is EU4 getting nerfed?
I don't think so
@LemonCake101 I will krill myself
Say it loud, say it clear:
Wage gap is real
And that's a good thing
Yes, I disable that DLC. It's also the only EU4 DLC I have😂