What no LiveWire? :P This was a really nice comparison. I hope to get to Deal's Gap someday. Although I'm mostly happy with my HD LiveWire I am considering a move to a Zero or possibly an Energica. Here in Atlantic Canada the closest Energica Dealer is in Maine and it could be tricky getting it insured as they aren't sold in Canada yet AFAIK. There was recently a big price drop in the Zero's though so that might be the route to go. My ONLY issue with the LiveWire is the lack of L2 charging and in my area it would be more useful to have the L2 then to have DC Charging.
Great video man! Thanks for sharing - I didn't realise the Zero has less maintenance worries and it's certainly a bike that is available here in Scotland. There are lots of new electric big Chinese motorcycles coming out which are half or quarter of the price, but the Zero is a quality product so you get what you pay for :)
Ive put a bit under 50k miles on my SRS bought new in 2020. Holding up well so far. The only decay in the battery Ive seen isnt capacity, but a lower tolerance for high speed. If I travel 90mph continually, sometimes after about 10 miles its in the red and slows me down to 80. Sometimes not. When it was new I could go as fast as I chose until the battery was depleted , nonstop,without hitting the battery thermal limit. Its a minor point but I do like fast on the highway so its a little disappointing. If I keep to 85 it never warms. To be fair im 200lb in full gear, not tucking behind the screen, and Im carrying 30+ of stuff in side and top cases, so pretty much worst case scenario for wind drag.
Thanks for posting the update on your SR/S. Based on your description it sounds like it might be worth checking with Zero and downloading your logs to email them in case you qualify for a battery warranty replacement before your 5-year warranty expires.
did you get this sorted under warantee? Defo sounds like a fault with the battery. I know going 90 everywhere is not what this bike is about if you want to get any sort of range out of it but sometimes you just want to have a blast around for a half hour so so...
@@FlyingFun.I am going to bring it in for a look when the warranty is closer to expiration. While it is limiting, it does get me back and forth to work. I put over 300 miles per week on this bike. If,by chance, it is a warranty battery issue id prefer to deal with it as is and get the new one later.
@@FlyingFun.My use case is somewhat unusual. Going out to work, and going in, there is an approximately 15 mile stretch of wide, new beltway around the city, and the traffic has long ago discarded speed limits. Mom wagons with cheerios on the floor are going 80mph. So 90 is basically the slow roll past traffic I like to do because it seems the safest to me.
Thanks for the video and comparison, and for making me miss Deals Gap and the Tail. Having also owned both a Zero SR and an Energica Eva Ribelle RS, I'm surprised you and Austin didn't discuss the owner experience with both companies. I find this to be one of the bigger differences between the two. Zero offers many more local dealers than Energica, but the quality and customer support of those plentiful dealerships is very hit and miss. Dealing with Zero and Energica HQs is night and day as well. Zero doesn't return calls, and I'm on first name basis with Energica VPs. Then there is the OTA updates. Zero has them, Energica doesn't. And the quality of those updates could be a video of its own. The mobile app reveals another stark difference. You touched on charging at the end, but as an owner, that could have been expanded upon quite a bit as there are numerous nuances to explore. Perhaps a follow-up video? Thanks again!!
Hi @SonOfAnakin, In regards to my personal Zero ownership experience, I've been happy with my RideNow Zero dealer in Jacksonville, FL. I've owned my 2020 Zero SR/F for 4 years & 19k+ miles. My maintenance has been one brake fluid change, tires & 2 recalls, all done during the same service visit at RideNow. I also had an occasion where the bike was throwing error codes & wouldn't start consistently. I took it in & a free firmware update fixed the problem. Generally I've been happy with my SR/F. I say generally because I've also seen it throw error codes in heavy downpours. I especially appreciated that Zero provided a firmware update that upped my SR/F's charging speed. It was a pleasant surprise. In my case the update was free since my dealer advertises free firmware updates for the life of the bike. Since I've not owned an Energica, I can't speak to its ownership experience, but for the most part I have read good things on the Energica owners Facebook page. I can't speak for Austin, but I got the impression he has been pleased with the reliability of both his SR/S & Eva Ribelle. Perhaps he'll see this and weigh in. Concerning your other comments, I've addressed some of those as well in my other videos: evrider.tv/category/motorcycles/
The review mentioned the poor handling of the Energica, including a reluctance to turn and a top-heavy feel. I can categorically state that this trait is due to the OEM Rosso III tyres - they are not suitable for the bike. The weight of the bike distorts their sidewalls, thereby flattening the tyre profiles and giving the vague handling feeling like they are running too low a tyre pressure. Looking back, I just assumed it was a characteristic of the bike but I couldn't have been more wrong.. I recently changed to the sports touring tyre in Pirelli's range, the Angel GT2 and the handling is transformed. The bike feels like a 600 sports bike with completely neutral handling and remarkable, almost telepathic, handling - I don't feel the weight now and can ride the bike way more aggressively yet feel completely in control. When leant over the bike is happy to change line and brake with the front without running wide - it's awesome.. If you want to experience what the bike should handle like I'd insist that you swap over the tyres ASAP and re-test the bike - you will be amazed of the difference. I expect the top-heavy feeling you mentioned is the weight felt needing to counter steer to initiate steering which is COMPLETELY gone now. Incidentally, the rear wheel oscillation/pumping that was mentioned in the review completely disappears with the tyre change - the behaviour stems from the rear tyre sidewalls flexing (they are the weakest part of the tyre and distort here when static and especially under braking and under power) and the shock trying the keep the rear under control - with the Angel Gets it now tracks perfectly and hooks up the rear tyre instantly and with complete control. I've notified the factory through my aussie dealer and they are looking into it - it appears to be an almost unbelievable blunder by the original factory designers or Pirelli management in specifying a sports tyre when the bike clearly needs the stiffer sidewall of the sports touring rubber. My local dealer tried my bike and commented it was 'chalk and cheese' compared to the demo... the transformation is epic.. ;)
Thanks for the detailed update and I'm glad to hear the tire swap made such a big difference. One clarification: I in no way meant to imply the Ribelle's handling was "poor," but rather I found it more top heavy than the SR/S. I think they are both great handling bikes.
You men the Livewire? I am still in love with that bike, I drove test it in Paris and man, that was an experience. However, the 1.8 kW onboard charger is just not enough for me. There are not so many DC stations yet and I like to get lost in the countryside, where Type2 are almost everywhere
@@DanielMonteroElectraveler yes, currently Livewire 1. The AC is a downside for some. It's for home or cabin charging only. The DC is much more around than most think. The CCS beats having max. 11kW on a Zero. Which standard is 3kW.
@@RedBatteryHead the presence of CCS strongly depends on where you live. In Europe, there are around 100 times more type 2 than CCS2. Thus, CCS2 tend to be taken by cars, while type 2 are often less occupied. For now it seems to be working. Let's see if in the future this is reversed, but while a 22 kW charging station installation cost maybe be in the ballpark of 5000 euro, a CCS2 is closer to 30000 euro. So most small shops and businesses are installing the former, while the latter is mostly found around highways on gas stations
@@DanielMonteroElectraveler as is, that's not fully True. CCS has more customers on a day. AC Stalls also suffer from blockages. For several hours on end. CCS is free in very short time when occupied. Here more shops install CCS too. Seen it in Germany too. Lots of CCS at dealers and shopping area's.
@@RedBatteryHead just take a screenshot of charging apps like Chargemap, Shell Recharge and others and filter using CCS2 and Type 2, and you will see for yourself. While type 2 indeed tend to need longer changing times (obvious) you can always rely on another place with type 2 nearby. This is not the case for CCS2. Just an example, of course it does not always happen. They opened a somewhat large CCS2 Charging area in Wellin (south Belgium), total of 6 chargers. There were 10 cars waiting on queue. I just went 500 m away, found 4 type 2 22 kW stations unoccupied. By the time I finished charging, there were still some cars that I previously saw waiting to charge. So yes, scarcity is a big price to pay when you are trying to do a weekend trip on CCS2 on the areas where there are not many. They will be simply populated by all the electric cars around... Type 2 is way less appealing for big electric cars, so they tend to be free most of the time
Wow. Great surroundings. Content wise: I am a bit critical about the mentioned ranges. It surprises me the Zero would go similar distances with a smaller battery capacity. On average one uses about 0,1 Kw per km if one does not ride too aggressively, which is more or less equivalent to riding 20 km’s on 1 liter of fuel (sorry for all the European metric stuff but it actually makes it easier to have a general comparison). There is a reason for the Energica’s higher weight. It has the bigger = heavier battery. So even when accepting the Zero 110 % mumbo jumbo there is still a difference of about 5 KW in capacity, which alone should already amount to a range difference of about 50 km / 30 miles. The extra weight of the Energica would not be enough to have the Zero catch up in range. So something simply doesn’t add up. Sounds like some red whit and blue tinted vision stuff going on to me. Otherwise I’d probably agree if I had the opportunity to compare them myself to be proven wrong.
I don't own an Energica, but based on more than 22 thousand miles of riding with an SR/F, now with a new 17.3 kWh (capacity, capped at 15.6) warranty replacement battery, Austin's SR/S estimates certainly seem to add up, based on my riding experience. I now regularly get 120+ miles per charge here in Florida with a mix of urban/highway riding. I also rented an DSR/X from eMoto Powersports in the mountains. Based on my personal riding experience that day, had I ridden it to 0%, based on the bike's battery percentage, it appears I would have gotten 150 miles or more. We stopped to charge around the 100-mile mark so I can't confirm whether that estimate would have proved accurate. Don't forget how slow speeds are on those curvy roads or the regen gained due to constant slow downs for curves/downhill. Also, as you point out, Energicas are heavier bikes, which to an extent negates their higher battery capacity, although Austin did of course confirm the Energica was still the range champ, just not by as much as you were thinking. With all that said, I'd love to have the opportunity to spend more time on an Eva Ribelle to thoroughly compare differences. A day hopping between bikes really isn't enough, which is why Austin's perspective is so valuable. He's one of the few people out there that is racking up saddle time simultaneously on both Energicas and Zeros.
@@EVRider I recently tried out a Brammo Empulse R (yes!). There was a lot I liked but I did not buy it because of clutch problems (yep, the Empulse had a clutch and gearbox!) Anyway. As a part of the testride I insisted on riding it “dry”. It is after all an older bike. When it got to 9 % it suddenly dropped to 0 without a single warning. Depending on graph trends only has already led to big problems for manufacturers because they didn’t predict the dendrite building problems between poles in early EV batteries. It is however a good test if you are buying as a consumer anyway. Never assume too much.
@@marcbrasse747 Wow! An Empulse. I never got the chance to ride one of those, although with a 6-speed manual, it definitely would have been fun to try. EVs have come a long way since then. It's a shame Polaris dropped Brammo along with Victory. Had they kept Brammo's development team I have to wonder how far Brammo might have progressed by now. Funny enough, now Polaris has farmed out its EV development to Zero (Ranger XP Kinetic).
@@EVRider It is a great bike as such but did indeed seems to suffer from some theething problems. There is an extreme play in the drive train comparable to what one feels if one rides an ICE bike on which the cush rubbers have gone. So best thing to do is to back it up a few cm's before you take off. Then there is the rather front oriented riding stance which is made more extreme by the high step in the seat. The problems I encountered with the drive system also make me a bit suspicioous about the longevity of that clutch and gearbox combo. Parts like the clutch plates and clutch master cylinder have however been sourced from other types so their availablilty should not be a problem. And then there is the range of course. This one held out for 90 km's (approx. 55miles) but then all the lights suddenly went out while it was still promising 9 % range. In many aspects it is however very near to my ideal electric bike (sufficient power, a gearbox, high spec chassis parts, a reasonably low weight and excellent roadholding) and therefore I am still on the lookout for a good one.
Those minic some of my reasons for also choosing a Zero over an Energica. Although the need for Energica oil changes is far less than back in 2019 when I was making my choice. Energica's service intervals have been decreased to 18,600 miles or 28,000 miles on the new models - three to four times less than before. Source: www.energicamotor.com/us/models/electric-motorcycle-energica-ego/
@@EVRider 18k is enough to not worry about it as a cost / inconvenience. Lookinga after the chain is going to be the main pita imho. I wonder how the tyre wear compares? Being water cooled there is the possibilty of a water leak into the motorif the seal goes maybe?
@@FlyForFun286 I've not seen any concerns about excessive tire wear with either brand. In the case of my Zero, I've been impressed with how long tires last as compared to other bikes I've owned. Regarding the Energica, I've not come across any reports of fluid leaks so personally I wouldn't be concerned about fluids from a reliability standpoint.
I'd love to. Hook me up with one and I'll be happy to give it a go. Although I've not ridden an Esse Esse 9 I'm pretty sure I'd prefer its more relaxed riding position.
Even with the minimal fluid changes on the Eva Ribelle, it's only like once a year and you can really do it in about an hour. It's very simple really. The belt .vs. the chain, there have been some issues with the belt drives, mainly noise complaints is what I have been seeing. Some sort of vibration. The chain maintenance is not that bad, if you use one of the dry lubes, it dries once you spray it on it's a bit less messier. Even with maintenance intervals not withstanding, you really SHOULD check your bike over fairly often anyways. What if something leaks, what if something frays, what if something is coming loose. You are down there in the thing anyways, is it that bad to have to spend an extra 10 minutes replacing half a cup of fluid? With a belt drive, don't you still have to lubricate the belt and check it's tension anyways, like you do with a chain? I'll say what he does not want to say aloud. The Energica is your dads bike, the zero is your moms bike. Your guess on the interstate is pretty accurate. 65 to 80 MPH I am seeing 100 ish miles per charge, im 5'7 and about 175. I don't do the crouch very much either so am also adding a bit of wind resistance as well when riding. Your riding position can add about 10 KW of power burn to the motor load at higher speeds! (this would be with pretty much any bike with similar wind shielding) So yes, crouching can be a HUGE difference if you are really really worried about range. The whole range thing is so subjective and there are so many variables, that the only advice I can give to anyone is, don't get too hung up on it. Same goes for 'Remaining miles / km ' estimates. Also FWIW, the Energica can go pretty much WOT for several miles in the hot Florida sun and overheating is absolutely NOT an issue. No power reduction because things are getting too hot, it just keeps hauling on. YES, that liquid cooling does make a world of difference. The Energica you can also adjust the front shocks too, the preload and the rebound I believe. YES I would highly recommend, even if you are not a 'sporty' rider, tweak your shocks, get them tuned in the way YOU like them. It doesn't have to be professionally or micrometer accuaracy but just play a bit, it DOES make a big difference in ride quality. This goes for any bike really. Tune in your shocks for a much better ride! As far as touring, if one wants to do such, Energica has a new bike out the Experia which covers that market now as well, however the Ribelle DOES have an option where you can put side bags on it, and you can store quite a bit of stuff in them. You can also strap additional bags like the Kriega on it as well, on the sides and across the rear seat pad if you need as well. I use my bike to make deliveries sometimes and am putting 50 to 60 lbs of cargo on it! It handles very well even with that weight on it. Although I do not have one, the Ribelle also comes with an option to strap a tank bag on it too. Id say it does very with luggage space as well. Since we are on touring, the bike also has a cruise control which can come in handy as well, lets you relax your grip a bit on the throttle to stretch the hand a bit if you need to do so. It is a bit top heavy but has a parking assist feature so you can literally walk and reverse your bike around in the parking lot under power! It'll help get you up over ramps and stuff too if you are loading it onto a trailer. Once you get up to about 5 or 6 mph, tbh the top heaviness of the Ribelle becomes much less noticeable and Id say about 8 or 9 mph, it's pretty much all but gone away I take a hard 110 degree turn out of my driveway at about 7 yo 9 mph with no issues when I leave the house. One final note on charging. I have a DC fast charger at home and the bike tends to have no issues hooking up and starting with the charge. The Ribelle lets you adjust your charge rate in 5 amp increments, down to like 10 amps then it will let you take it all the way down in 1 amp increments. This comes in very helpful if you find yourself on the track or somewhere where there is only say a 30 amp breaker, so you can fine tune your amp draw to get the max charge available w/o popping breakers. Disclaimer: I own the 2023 Eva Ribelle, so am writing this off my own personal experiences. Yours may differ however I am betting that no matter which bike you own, you are having a TON of fun with it :D Aaron
Thanks for the write up Arron. One quick note. You mentioned fuilds/overheating. I can confirm with over 19k miles here in hot Florida, my SR/F has never experienced overheating, even with 95+ degree interstate trips with multiple charging stops. I imagine riders that do full-on track days might appreciate liquid cooling but for street use Zero's air cooling works well and I love the fact I don't have to mess with fluid changes (outside of brakes).
@@EVRider I can absolutely appreciate that sentiment. Antifreeze, Oil, Tranny Fluids can be a real pita to have to mess with, however pretty much every E bike, any fluids they DO have, are very minimal, and it's more of a check to make sure the level is correct thing on most of them. Another thing Id like to point out for any E bike with a decent regen system, once you learn how to work it, your brake use is really minimal. I bet I could get 100 K plus on my bike brakes. I almost never have to use them in normal riding. Track now, that's a different world, but other than a sudden braking event, the regen pretty much does what you need stopping wise.
@@aarons7975 Agreed. I've had one brake fluid change done in 3.5 years, purely based on the age of the fluid. It still looked nice and clean. I won't be surprised if my pads last the life of the bike.
the energinca uses LIFE battery right? Thats good for about twice as many charges as a normal battery i think. I dont mind a bit of maintenance say once a year with a bit of checking over in between, I dont like the idea of messing with the wheel alignment every 500 miles in order to tension the belt / chain, how much of an issue is this actually? My only experience with motorbikes was a shaft drive in a xv535 which needed nothing but the odd oil change every few years lol.
Yeah the Cypher store was a terrible idea. But at least they realized the error and made a change. I picked up a used 2022 SR/S and was able to get the "upgrades" for free that come standard on the 2023. I'm really enjoying the bike.
As much as I hate it, the industry as a whole is looking at charging for stuff that can be turned on or off over the air. For example, Ford says my Mustang Mach-E's Blue Cruise will cost $75 per month at the end of three years. I won't pay $75 a month but I will miss the feature when Ford turns it off.
Dont forget the livewire indeed or even the energica experia .. and dont forget all the customer service stories from zero ..i really hope they are on their game now .. but i ll never ever will buy a zero .
It's not a question of forgetting the LiveWire. At the time of the video's production eMoto Powersports didn't have one. As for Zero's service, I've owned my SR/F for more than 4 years. So far I've been happy with my dealer's Zero tech. The only non-firmware service (which is at home over-the-air, so no biggie) it's needed is the regular maintenance that all motorcycles need (tires, brake fluid change). I'm about to hit 20k on the odometer. Concerning the Experia, here's a road test I did on it a while back that I think you'll enjoy: ua-cam.com/video/zzlQvTEas40/v-deo.html
@@EVRider zero is a great bike if it works .. i had one for 8 years and i simply know too many peoooe breaking up their love for zero .. i visited an ex zero dealer with far too many broken bijes in the shed too many sad stories .. though i wish you the best and your bike will last !!!
I love my Eva RS, i'll never get bored of twisting the throttle and feeling that front wheel lift
What no LiveWire? :P This was a really nice comparison. I hope to get to Deal's Gap someday. Although I'm mostly happy with my HD LiveWire I am considering a move to a Zero or possibly an Energica. Here in Atlantic Canada the closest Energica Dealer is in Maine and it could be tricky getting it insured as they aren't sold in Canada yet AFAIK. There was recently a big price drop in the Zero's though so that might be the route to go. My ONLY issue with the LiveWire is the lack of L2 charging and in my area it would be more useful to have the L2 then to have DC Charging.
DC Charging is ramping up. On L2 you'll need hefty add on price to get max 11kW AC.
Great video man! Thanks for sharing - I didn't realise the Zero has less maintenance worries and it's certainly a bike that is available here in Scotland. There are lots of new electric big Chinese motorcycles coming out which are half or quarter of the price, but the Zero is a quality product so you get what you pay for :)
Thanks for the compliment and for watching!
Very wise and unbiased video, loved it! Keep up with the good work!
Thanks!
Ive put a bit under 50k miles on my SRS bought new in 2020. Holding up well so far. The only decay in the battery Ive seen isnt capacity, but a lower tolerance for high speed. If I travel 90mph continually, sometimes after about 10 miles its in the red and slows me down to 80. Sometimes not. When it was new I could go as fast as I chose until the battery was depleted , nonstop,without hitting the battery thermal limit. Its a minor point but I do like fast on the highway so its a little disappointing. If I keep to 85 it never warms. To be fair im 200lb in full gear, not tucking behind the screen, and Im carrying 30+ of stuff in side and top cases, so pretty much worst case scenario for wind drag.
Thanks for posting the update on your SR/S. Based on your description it sounds like it might be worth checking with Zero and downloading your logs to email them in case you qualify for a battery warranty replacement before your 5-year warranty expires.
did you get this sorted under warantee?
Defo sounds like a fault with the battery.
I know going 90 everywhere is not what this bike is about if you want to get any sort of range out of it but sometimes you just want to have a blast around for a half hour so so...
@@FlyingFun.I am going to bring it in for a look when the warranty is closer to expiration. While it is limiting, it does get me back and forth to work. I put over 300 miles per week on this bike. If,by chance, it is a warranty battery issue id prefer to deal with it as is and get the new one later.
@@FlyingFun.My use case is somewhat unusual. Going out to work, and going in, there is an approximately 15 mile stretch of wide, new beltway around the city, and the traffic has long ago discarded speed limits. Mom wagons with cheerios on the floor are going 80mph. So 90 is basically the slow roll past traffic I like to do because it seems the safest to me.
Thanks for the video and comparison, and for making me miss Deals Gap and the Tail. Having also owned both a Zero SR and an Energica Eva Ribelle RS, I'm surprised you and Austin didn't discuss the owner experience with both companies. I find this to be one of the bigger differences between the two. Zero offers many more local dealers than Energica, but the quality and customer support of those plentiful dealerships is very hit and miss. Dealing with Zero and Energica HQs is night and day as well. Zero doesn't return calls, and I'm on first name basis with Energica VPs. Then there is the OTA updates. Zero has them, Energica doesn't. And the quality of those updates could be a video of its own. The mobile app reveals another stark difference. You touched on charging at the end, but as an owner, that could have been expanded upon quite a bit as there are numerous nuances to explore. Perhaps a follow-up video? Thanks again!!
Hi @SonOfAnakin, In regards to my personal Zero ownership experience, I've been happy with my RideNow Zero dealer in Jacksonville, FL. I've owned my 2020 Zero SR/F for 4 years & 19k+ miles. My maintenance has been one brake fluid change, tires & 2 recalls, all done during the same service visit at RideNow. I also had an occasion where the bike was throwing error codes & wouldn't start consistently. I took it in & a free firmware update fixed the problem. Generally I've been happy with my SR/F. I say generally because I've also seen it throw error codes in heavy downpours. I especially appreciated that Zero provided a firmware update that upped my SR/F's charging speed. It was a pleasant surprise. In my case the update was free since my dealer advertises free firmware updates for the life of the bike. Since I've not owned an Energica, I can't speak to its ownership experience, but for the most part I have read good things on the Energica owners Facebook page. I can't speak for Austin, but I got the impression he has been pleased with the reliability of both his SR/S & Eva Ribelle. Perhaps he'll see this and weigh in. Concerning your other comments, I've addressed some of those as well in my other videos: evrider.tv/category/motorcycles/
Amazing video :) North Carolina looks so beautiful! I have to visit
Thanks and NC is most definitely worth a visit.
The review mentioned the poor handling of the Energica, including a reluctance to turn and a top-heavy feel. I can categorically state that this trait is due to the OEM Rosso III tyres - they are not suitable for the bike. The weight of the bike distorts their sidewalls, thereby flattening the tyre profiles and giving the vague handling feeling like they are running too low a tyre pressure. Looking back, I just assumed it was a characteristic of the bike but I couldn't have been more wrong.. I recently changed to the sports touring tyre in Pirelli's range, the Angel GT2 and the handling is transformed. The bike feels like a 600 sports bike with completely neutral handling and remarkable, almost telepathic, handling - I don't feel the weight now and can ride the bike way more aggressively yet feel completely in control. When leant over the bike is happy to change line and brake with the front without running wide - it's awesome.. If you want to experience what the bike should handle like I'd insist that you swap over the tyres ASAP and re-test the bike - you will be amazed of the difference. I expect the top-heavy feeling you mentioned is the weight felt needing to counter steer to initiate steering which is COMPLETELY gone now. Incidentally, the rear wheel oscillation/pumping that was mentioned in the review completely disappears with the tyre change - the behaviour stems from the rear tyre sidewalls flexing (they are the weakest part of the tyre and distort here when static and especially under braking and under power) and the shock trying the keep the rear under control - with the Angel Gets it now tracks perfectly and hooks up the rear tyre instantly and with complete control. I've notified the factory through my aussie dealer and they are looking into it - it appears to be an almost unbelievable blunder by the original factory designers or Pirelli management in specifying a sports tyre when the bike clearly needs the stiffer sidewall of the sports touring rubber. My local dealer tried my bike and commented it was 'chalk and cheese' compared to the demo... the transformation is epic.. ;)
Thanks for the detailed update and I'm glad to hear the tire swap made such a big difference. One clarification: I in no way meant to imply the Ribelle's handling was "poor," but rather I found it more top heavy than the SR/S. I think they are both great handling bikes.
I come from an Energica. Gone to an ELW now. That would best be described as an cross between both.
You men the Livewire? I am still in love with that bike, I drove test it in Paris and man, that was an experience. However, the 1.8 kW onboard charger is just not enough for me. There are not so many DC stations yet and I like to get lost in the countryside, where Type2 are almost everywhere
@@DanielMonteroElectraveler yes, currently Livewire 1.
The AC is a downside for some. It's for home or cabin charging only.
The DC is much more around than most think. The CCS beats having max. 11kW on a Zero. Which standard is 3kW.
@@RedBatteryHead the presence of CCS strongly depends on where you live. In Europe, there are around 100 times more type 2 than CCS2. Thus, CCS2 tend to be taken by cars, while type 2 are often less occupied. For now it seems to be working. Let's see if in the future this is reversed, but while a 22 kW charging station installation cost maybe be in the ballpark of 5000 euro, a CCS2 is closer to 30000 euro. So most small shops and businesses are installing the former, while the latter is mostly found around highways on gas stations
@@DanielMonteroElectraveler as is, that's not fully True. CCS has more customers on a day. AC Stalls also suffer from blockages. For several hours on end. CCS is free in very short time when occupied.
Here more shops install CCS too. Seen it in Germany too. Lots of CCS at dealers and shopping area's.
@@RedBatteryHead just take a screenshot of charging apps like Chargemap, Shell Recharge and others and filter using CCS2 and Type 2, and you will see for yourself. While type 2 indeed tend to need longer changing times (obvious) you can always rely on another place with type 2 nearby. This is not the case for CCS2. Just an example, of course it does not always happen. They opened a somewhat large CCS2 Charging area in Wellin (south Belgium), total of 6 chargers. There were 10 cars waiting on queue. I just went 500 m away, found 4 type 2 22 kW stations unoccupied. By the time I finished charging, there were still some cars that I previously saw waiting to charge. So yes, scarcity is a big price to pay when you are trying to do a weekend trip on CCS2 on the areas where there are not many. They will be simply populated by all the electric cars around... Type 2 is way less appealing for big electric cars, so they tend to be free most of the time
Wow. Great surroundings. Content wise: I am a bit critical about the mentioned ranges. It surprises me the Zero would go similar distances with a smaller battery capacity. On average one uses about 0,1 Kw per km if one does not ride too aggressively, which is more or less equivalent to riding 20 km’s on 1 liter of fuel (sorry for all the European metric stuff but it actually makes it easier to have a general comparison). There is a reason for the Energica’s higher weight. It has the bigger = heavier battery. So even when accepting the Zero 110 % mumbo jumbo there is still a difference of about 5 KW in capacity, which alone should already amount to a range difference of about 50 km / 30 miles. The extra weight of the Energica would not be enough to have the Zero catch up in range. So something simply doesn’t add up. Sounds like some red whit and blue tinted vision stuff going on to me. Otherwise I’d probably agree if I had the opportunity to compare them myself to be proven wrong.
I don't own an Energica, but based on more than 22 thousand miles of riding with an SR/F, now with a new 17.3 kWh (capacity, capped at 15.6) warranty replacement battery, Austin's SR/S estimates certainly seem to add up, based on my riding experience. I now regularly get 120+ miles per charge here in Florida with a mix of urban/highway riding. I also rented an DSR/X from eMoto Powersports in the mountains. Based on my personal riding experience that day, had I ridden it to 0%, based on the bike's battery percentage, it appears I would have gotten 150 miles or more. We stopped to charge around the 100-mile mark so I can't confirm whether that estimate would have proved accurate. Don't forget how slow speeds are on those curvy roads or the regen gained due to constant slow downs for curves/downhill. Also, as you point out, Energicas are heavier bikes, which to an extent negates their higher battery capacity, although Austin did of course confirm the Energica was still the range champ, just not by as much as you were thinking. With all that said, I'd love to have the opportunity to spend more time on an Eva Ribelle to thoroughly compare differences. A day hopping between bikes really isn't enough, which is why Austin's perspective is so valuable. He's one of the few people out there that is racking up saddle time simultaneously on both Energicas and Zeros.
@@EVRider I recently tried out a Brammo Empulse R (yes!). There was a lot I liked but I did not buy it because of clutch problems (yep, the Empulse had a clutch and gearbox!) Anyway. As a part of the testride I insisted on riding it “dry”. It is after all an older bike. When it got to 9 % it suddenly dropped to 0 without a single warning. Depending on graph trends only has already led to big problems for manufacturers because they didn’t predict the dendrite building problems between poles in early EV batteries. It is however a good test if you are buying as a consumer anyway. Never assume too much.
@@marcbrasse747 Wow! An Empulse. I never got the chance to ride one of those, although with a 6-speed manual, it definitely would have been fun to try. EVs have come a long way since then. It's a shame Polaris dropped Brammo along with Victory. Had they kept Brammo's development team I have to wonder how far Brammo might have progressed by now. Funny enough, now Polaris has farmed out its EV development to Zero (Ranger XP Kinetic).
@@EVRider It is a great bike as such but did indeed seems to suffer from some theething problems. There is an extreme play in the drive train comparable to what one feels if one rides an ICE bike on which the cush rubbers have gone. So best thing to do is to back it up a few cm's before you take off. Then there is the rather front oriented riding stance which is made more extreme by the high step in the seat. The problems I encountered with the drive system also make me a bit suspicioous about the longevity of that clutch and gearbox combo. Parts like the clutch plates and clutch master cylinder have however been sourced from other types so their availablilty should not be a problem. And then there is the range of course. This one held out for 90 km's (approx. 55miles) but then all the lights suddenly went out while it was still promising 9 % range. In many aspects it is however very near to my ideal electric bike (sufficient power, a gearbox, high spec chassis parts, a reasonably low weight and excellent roadholding) and therefore I am still on the lookout for a good one.
The only reasons I ride EV: instant power at any speed and (almost) no maintenance. An Energica is like an ICE, so Zero still the bike for me.
Those minic some of my reasons for also choosing a Zero over an Energica. Although the need for Energica oil changes is far less than back in 2019 when I was making my choice. Energica's service intervals have been decreased to 18,600 miles or 28,000 miles on the new models - three to four times less than before. Source: www.energicamotor.com/us/models/electric-motorcycle-energica-ego/
@@EVRider 18k is enough to not worry about it as a cost / inconvenience.
Lookinga after the chain is going to be the main pita imho.
I wonder how the tyre wear compares?
Being water cooled there is the possibilty of a water leak into the motorif the seal goes maybe?
@@FlyForFun286 I've not seen any concerns about excessive tire wear with either brand. In the case of my Zero, I've been impressed with how long tires last as compared to other bikes I've owned. Regarding the Energica, I've not come across any reports of fluid leaks so personally I wouldn't be concerned about fluids from a reliability standpoint.
You should’ve ridden the Esse Esse 9 to compare with the SRS ..
I'd love to. Hook me up with one and I'll be happy to give it a go. Although I've not ridden an Esse Esse 9 I'm pretty sure I'd prefer its more relaxed riding position.
Even with the minimal fluid changes on the Eva Ribelle, it's only like once a year and you can really do it in about an hour. It's very simple really.
The belt .vs. the chain, there have been some issues with the belt drives, mainly noise complaints is what I have been seeing. Some sort of vibration.
The chain maintenance is not that bad, if you use one of the dry lubes, it dries once you spray it on it's a bit less messier. Even with maintenance intervals not withstanding, you really SHOULD check your bike over fairly often anyways. What if something leaks, what if something frays, what if something is coming loose. You are down there in the thing anyways, is it that bad to have to spend an extra 10 minutes replacing half a cup of fluid? With a belt drive, don't you still have to lubricate the belt and check it's tension anyways, like you do with a chain?
I'll say what he does not want to say aloud. The Energica is your dads bike, the zero is your moms bike.
Your guess on the interstate is pretty accurate. 65 to 80 MPH I am seeing 100 ish miles per charge, im 5'7 and about 175. I don't do the crouch very much either so am also adding a bit of wind resistance as well when riding. Your riding position can add about 10 KW of power burn to the motor load at higher speeds! (this would be with pretty much any bike with similar wind shielding) So yes, crouching can be a HUGE difference if you are really really worried about range. The whole range thing is so subjective and there are so many variables, that the only advice I can give to anyone is, don't get too hung up on it. Same goes for 'Remaining miles / km ' estimates.
Also FWIW, the Energica can go pretty much WOT for several miles in the hot Florida sun and overheating is absolutely NOT an issue. No power reduction because things are getting too hot, it just keeps hauling on. YES, that liquid cooling does make a world of difference.
The Energica you can also adjust the front shocks too, the preload and the rebound I believe. YES I would highly recommend, even if you are not a 'sporty' rider, tweak your shocks, get them tuned in the way YOU like them. It doesn't have to be professionally or micrometer accuaracy but just play a bit, it DOES make a big difference in ride quality. This goes for any bike really. Tune in your shocks for a much better ride!
As far as touring, if one wants to do such, Energica has a new bike out the Experia which covers that market now as well, however the Ribelle DOES have an option where you can put side bags on it, and you can store quite a bit of stuff in them. You can also strap additional bags like the Kriega on it as well, on the sides and across the rear seat pad if you need as well. I use my bike to make deliveries sometimes and am putting 50 to 60 lbs of cargo on it! It handles very well even with that weight on it. Although I do not have one, the Ribelle also comes with an option to strap a tank bag on it too. Id say it does very with luggage space as well. Since we are on touring, the bike also has a cruise control which can come in handy as well, lets you relax your grip a bit on the throttle to stretch the hand a bit if you need to do so.
It is a bit top heavy but has a parking assist feature so you can literally walk and reverse your bike around in the parking lot under power! It'll help get you up over ramps and stuff too if you are loading it onto a trailer. Once you get up to about 5 or 6 mph, tbh the top heaviness of the Ribelle becomes much less noticeable and Id say about 8 or 9 mph, it's pretty much all but gone away I take a hard 110 degree turn out of my driveway at about 7 yo 9 mph with no issues when I leave the house.
One final note on charging. I have a DC fast charger at home and the bike tends to have no issues hooking up and starting with the charge. The Ribelle lets you adjust your charge rate in 5 amp increments, down to like 10 amps then it will let you take it all the way down in 1 amp increments. This comes in very helpful if you find yourself on the track or somewhere where there is only say a 30 amp breaker, so you can fine tune your amp draw to get the max charge available w/o popping breakers.
Disclaimer: I own the 2023 Eva Ribelle, so am writing this off my own personal experiences. Yours may differ however I am betting that no matter which bike you own, you are having a TON of fun with it :D
Aaron
Thanks for the write up Arron. One quick note. You mentioned fuilds/overheating. I can confirm with over 19k miles here in hot Florida, my SR/F has never experienced overheating, even with 95+ degree interstate trips with multiple charging stops. I imagine riders that do full-on track days might appreciate liquid cooling but for street use Zero's air cooling works well and I love the fact I don't have to mess with fluid changes (outside of brakes).
@@EVRider I can absolutely appreciate that sentiment. Antifreeze, Oil, Tranny Fluids can be a real pita to have to mess with, however pretty much every E bike, any fluids they DO have, are very minimal, and it's more of a check to make sure the level is correct thing on most of them.
Another thing Id like to point out for any E bike with a decent regen system, once you learn how to work it, your brake use is really minimal. I bet I could get 100 K plus on my bike brakes. I almost never have to use them in normal riding. Track now, that's a different world, but other than a sudden braking event, the regen pretty much does what you need stopping wise.
@@aarons7975 Agreed. I've had one brake fluid change done in 3.5 years, purely based on the age of the fluid. It still looked nice and clean. I won't be surprised if my pads last the life of the bike.
I've never in my life, heard of lubricating a belt.
the energinca uses LIFE battery right? Thats good for about twice as many charges as a normal battery i think.
I dont mind a bit of maintenance say once a year with a bit of checking over in between,
I dont like the idea of messing with the wheel alignment every 500 miles in order to tension the belt / chain, how much of an issue is this actually?
My only experience with motorbikes was a shaft drive in a xv535 which needed nothing but the odd oil change every few years lol.
I own a Zero SR which I love. The reason I'll never buy another Zero is Cypher.
Yeah the Cypher store was a terrible idea. But at least they realized the error and made a change.
I picked up a used 2022 SR/S and was able to get the "upgrades" for free that come standard on the 2023. I'm really enjoying the bike.
As much as I hate it, the industry as a whole is looking at charging for stuff that can be turned on or off over the air. For example, Ford says my Mustang Mach-E's Blue Cruise will cost $75 per month at the end of three years. I won't pay $75 a month but I will miss the feature when Ford turns it off.
If you hate Cypher, buy it full options, problem solved.... 😅🙄
So says the American , as for the speed and road ease you have a right hand
12:33 LOL, no... that's the exact opposite.
This is why it's top heavy.
Dont forget the livewire indeed or even the energica experia .. and dont forget all the customer service stories from zero ..i really hope they are on their game now .. but i ll never ever will buy a zero .
It's not a question of forgetting the LiveWire. At the time of the video's production eMoto Powersports didn't have one. As for Zero's service, I've owned my SR/F for more than 4 years. So far I've been happy with my dealer's Zero tech. The only non-firmware service (which is at home over-the-air, so no biggie) it's needed is the regular maintenance that all motorcycles need (tires, brake fluid change). I'm about to hit 20k on the odometer. Concerning the Experia, here's a road test I did on it a while back that I think you'll enjoy: ua-cam.com/video/zzlQvTEas40/v-deo.html
@@EVRider zero is a great bike if it works .. i had one for 8 years and i simply know too many peoooe breaking up their love for zero .. i visited an ex zero dealer with far too many broken bijes in the shed too many sad stories .. though i wish you the best and your bike will last !!!