I had a 164S for nearly 10 years and over 140,000 miles. I loved that car to death, still sorry to this day I sold it. Great V6 engine that loved to rev to and past the redline, short throw gearbox, nicely appointed and ultra comfortable interior and "those looks"!! Gorgeous from every angle. A beautiful car I still miss over 20 years later.
I had a Lusso V6 for 3 years after buying when 3 years old. An amazing car that made every journey a pleasure. Never let me down and went like stink with a soundtrack to match !
I have been looking for this review for ages. Thank you for putting it up. It was based on this that i bought my first 164 V6. I still think it is the best car Alfa made right up until the current Giulia.
Rover-Ragtop Willson was spot-on! The Alfa Romeo 164's shape and lines are graceful, different and still very fresh. Equipment levels were very high, and performance is higher than its equivalent engine-sized rivals too. Still a brilliant car. I'd take the dark green 3.0 V6 towards the end of the video.
And he was also quite right with the durability. This Alfa silver lasted till mid 2007 and the red one is untaxed, but the MOT status is green, so maybe it is still on as a historic vehicle or (same goes for the top range red)?
Brilliant cars. Had quite a few but the 24v cloverleaf is the pick. I would stay away from autos and the 4x4 which is really complex and fragile. Parts are like hens teeth for the 4x4 as only 1000 or so made.
It wasn't that bad. Unless you needed new suspension bushes of course. I really have no idea what you mean by " lane hopping". Mine had 210 bhp and was perfectly manageable. Also Americans tended to run the front wheels parallel with no factory spec toe-in IIRC. That didn't help.
I owned two Cloverleafs and the car magazine cliché of torque steer was never an issue. The understeer on tight bends at speed a little more so compared to my Audi A4 Quattro which followed them.
I’ve had 4 164’s 1 156 , 2 giulietta and 1 guilia, and I would give my back teeth to have my favourite of all of them my J plate 1992 black 164 cloverleaf 8 valve , I still kick myself I sold it 🤬🤬🤬
@@timhancock6626 Aha. Overhere only the Q4 came with the rims fitted on the 164 in video, but it seems they were around already. The QVs had different ones in Holland
I like the 164 and I had a 3.0 V6 model back in the day. But this doesn't look like a Top gear review, it's more of a paid promo of the 164. Very biased to say the least.
@@cosmicsman666 It's a problem on olderToyota Camry V6s in general. Also Toyota have recalled 44,000 cars in 2020 for cracked block faults on their 2.5 in line 4. It was never a problem on Alfa Romeo 164s. Reliability anybody ?
Well it certainly would've been much better value than a contemporary BMW of the time. The E36, as much as I love it, suffered corrosion issues as well as a poorly built interior. The E34 5 Series would have been a much more expensive second hand purchase, with nowhere near as high specification for the price. Oh and the 2.5 straight 6 in the E34 often received criticism for being the wrong engine for that car.
I had a 156 Sportwagon 2.4 JTD. I loved it, but it was nowhere near as robust as a 164 and tended to eat suspension arms and bushes, and I only used factory parts not pattern cheapies.
Perhaps the 164 was more appealing for the more "traditional" customer base like executives and bosses aged mid-30s and above back in late 80s or early 90s. It was obvious that Alfa wanted to grab the attention of potential BMW, Audi and Mercedes buyers by introducing the 164 as a more refined and cultured alternative to the German executive sedans. On the other hand, Alfa 156 was indeed more widely appealing to most types of car customers. The designers got the design just right and nice that young and old people loved the 156's style and performance.
The 156 and 157 Sportwagons were nice looking cars, but the Centro Stile designed vanilla saloon 156 wasn't a patch on the classically styled Pininfarina 164.
The "electric everything" on the Cloverleaf thing had me wincing. Owned by Fiat, these re-engined and re-styled Chromas were still structural paint, spaghetti wiring and undersealed with pasta. The V6 was good for about 50,000 miles on average and the twin-spark a bit longer. Creeping underseal from the sills to midway up the doors as standard. Lasted 11 years but only 270,000 sold. About 50 left in Britain. Yuk!
All the electric bits were German manufacture.....go figure🙄. For Twin Sparks to go wrong ever was pretty rare ( I had a 75 TS and 2x 164TS) 50,000 miles on V6s was when you changed the cambelt. Do that and the rollers and maybe the water pump and you were good to go. The bottom end was rock solid, the bodies galvanised. One of mine was 14 years old when I bought it with 140,000 on the clock. I have a friend with a 30 year old V6 164. It's just fine and has about 200,000 miles on it. A fine car by any measure you like. There was nothing much wrong with the Fiat Croma, Lancia Thema or Saab 9000, all of which shared the type 4 floor pan with the 164, but little else.
@@johnmarsh2078 Nonsense. That sort of stuff is trotted out by people who have never driven later Alfas and found out how rewarding FWD can be. I've owned both types.
Well it has superb aerodynamics, Its Pininfarina design which is good enough for me and here we are thirty years later still talking about the 164. I owned three 164s and loved every minute of them. Its a fine car by any standards and better made than many of its competitors.
Always the same the word reliability .same old story try looking at the German garbage and come to think of it every other make on the market to talk about reliability rust and after sales loss from a true alfisti.
Absolutely love the 164, looks like it's covered many miles even when brand new, that 6 cylinder busso is a thing to behold 👌
These really were an excellent car and very robust.
I love this car. Design ,sound. Beautiful car 😍
I had a 164S for nearly 10 years and over 140,000 miles. I loved that car to death, still sorry to this day I sold it. Great V6 engine that loved to rev to and past the redline, short throw gearbox, nicely appointed and ultra comfortable interior and "those looks"!! Gorgeous from every angle. A beautiful car I still miss over 20 years later.
You know Jeremy Clarkson owned an Alfa 164 back three years before this aired on television! 🚗
Yep there was a video on the Tube showing him driving it in that year, but I cannot find it anymore.
I had a Lusso V6 for 3 years after buying when 3 years old.
An amazing car that made every journey a pleasure.
Never let me down and went like stink with a soundtrack to match !
I have been looking for this review for ages. Thank you for putting it up. It was based on this that i bought my first 164 V6. I still think it is the best car Alfa made right up until the current Giulia.
Nice! My pleasure! Lovely little backstory on how you went for the 164, thank you!
They certainly rusted less than the Germans, apart from somewhat costly timing belts on all models they were just as good as anything else really
Automobily Alfa Romeo 164 mám velmi rád stejně jako všechna vozidla této skvělé značky.
E sempre la mamma della Ferrari
Rover-Ragtop Willson was spot-on! The Alfa Romeo 164's shape and lines are graceful, different and still very fresh. Equipment levels were very high, and performance is higher than its equivalent engine-sized rivals too. Still a brilliant car. I'd take the dark green 3.0 V6 towards the end of the video.
And he was also quite right with the durability. This Alfa silver lasted till mid 2007 and the red one is untaxed, but the MOT status is green, so maybe it is still on as a historic vehicle or (same goes for the top range red)?
I can remember the rented TVs we watched the programme on after 3 months the TV was your TV, and then it would break down 😂😂😂
Loved the style of the 164...
Probelsome...A new word to me and I like it.
The Alfa 164 was and still is the most beautiful "BERLINA" ever made.
Brilliant cars. Had quite a few but the 24v cloverleaf is the pick. I would stay away from autos and the 4x4 which is really complex and fragile. Parts are like hens teeth for the 4x4 as only 1000 or so made.
I had both the 12V and 24V Cloverleafs and they were both as good as each other.
Era molto bella papà la tua alfa romeo 164
I still miss my 164 :(
well, I guess I better get on with restoring my 164 then so I can experience driving one
Great car. I believe it was also the last model made by Alfa when it was still an independent company.
wrong, the alfa 75 was that
No...era sotto lo stato italiano....poi la venduta alla Fiat....perché per essere.al top sul mercato lo Stato Italiano spendeva una fortuna...
Reliable as a Toyota !!!!
Question. .... how can you talk about a 164 for so long without mentioning the lane-hopping monumental torque-steer of the 3 0V6 Busso?
It wasn't that bad. Unless you needed new suspension bushes of course. I really have no idea what you mean by " lane hopping". Mine had 210 bhp and was perfectly manageable. Also Americans tended to run the front wheels parallel with no factory spec toe-in IIRC. That didn't help.
I owned two Cloverleafs and the car magazine cliché of torque steer was never an issue. The understeer on tight bends at speed a little more so compared to my Audi A4 Quattro which followed them.
Reliable as a Toyota? You couldn't be more right...
I’ve had 4 164’s 1 156 , 2 giulietta and 1 guilia, and I would give my back teeth to have my favourite of all of them my J plate 1992 black 164 cloverleaf 8 valve , I still kick myself I sold it 🤬🤬🤬
Don’t shout about it.. 😂
The Q4 they show is 4x4 but the presenter talks about fwd..
Because its not a Q4 its a Quadrifoglio Verde. The Q4 was not introduced until 1993 and this was filmed in 1992. So it is Front Wheel Drive.
@@timhancock6626 Aha. Overhere only the Q4 came with the rims fitted on the 164 in video, but it seems they were around already. The QVs had different ones in Holland
The 4WD version was left hand drive only, that one is RHD
The 4x4 didn't come to the UK sadly. But the Cloverleafs came with sunroofs, which may not have been the case in Europe. Not sure.
I like the 164 and I had a 3.0 V6 model back in the day. But this doesn't look like a Top gear review, it's more of a paid promo of the 164. Very biased to say the least.
It was a cool car back in the 80s but sadly they was long gone before a BMW checked out.
As reliable as a toyota ????? Quentin Has lost it.
Ask Hub Nut about Toyota Camry V6s and cracked cylinder heads...of which there are plenty I gather.
@@timhancock6626 but he bought one with that problem. Very hubnut of him to do so but im sure he will get it sorted.
@@cosmicsman666 It's a problem on olderToyota Camry V6s in general. Also Toyota have recalled 44,000 cars in 2020 for cracked block faults on their 2.5 in line 4. It was never a problem on Alfa Romeo 164s. Reliability anybody ?
They were very reliable, the only let down really were a few of the minor electrics.
@@simonh870 German electrics too..
"a thinking mans BMW" LOL
I'd say that was fair comment. I don't see that many BMW drivers thinking at all.
Well it certainly would've been much better value than a contemporary BMW of the time. The E36, as much as I love it, suffered corrosion issues as well as a poorly built interior. The E34 5 Series would have been a much more expensive second hand purchase, with nowhere near as high specification for the price. Oh and the 2.5 straight 6 in the E34 often received criticism for being the wrong engine for that car.
Reliable as a Toyota....🤣🤣🤣🤣
An interesting statement on his part.
stupidi bastardi gelosi delle auto italiane🤣
Controversial but I never liked the 164. I prefer the 156, just looked smarter as it wasn't so slab sided
I had a 156 Sportwagon 2.4 JTD. I loved it, but it was nowhere near as robust as a 164 and tended to eat suspension arms and bushes, and I only used factory parts not pattern cheapies.
Perhaps the 164 was more appealing for the more "traditional" customer base like executives and bosses aged mid-30s and above back in late 80s or early 90s. It was obvious that Alfa wanted to grab the attention of potential BMW, Audi and Mercedes buyers by introducing the 164 as a more refined and cultured alternative to the German executive sedans.
On the other hand, Alfa 156 was indeed more widely appealing to most types of car customers. The designers got the design just right and nice that young and old people loved the 156's style and performance.
The 156 and 157 Sportwagons were nice looking cars, but the Centro Stile designed vanilla saloon 156 wasn't a patch on the classically styled Pininfarina 164.
The "electric everything" on the Cloverleaf thing had me wincing. Owned by Fiat, these re-engined and re-styled Chromas were still structural paint, spaghetti wiring and undersealed with pasta. The V6 was good for about 50,000 miles on average and the twin-spark a bit longer. Creeping underseal from the sills to midway up the doors as standard. Lasted 11 years but only 270,000 sold. About 50 left in Britain. Yuk!
I've seen 164 and 166 with 200k miles still running smoothly
Jealous brit spotted
All the electric bits were German manufacture.....go figure🙄. For Twin Sparks to go wrong ever was pretty rare ( I had a 75 TS and 2x 164TS) 50,000 miles on V6s was when you changed the cambelt. Do that and the rollers and maybe the water pump and you were good to go. The bottom end was rock solid, the bodies galvanised. One of mine was 14 years old when I bought it with 140,000 on the clock. I have a friend with a 30 year old V6 164. It's just fine and has about 200,000 miles on it. A fine car by any measure you like. There was nothing much wrong with the Fiat Croma, Lancia Thema or Saab 9000, all of which shared the type 4 floor pan with the 164, but little else.
@@sotirismp2883 Love the V6 exhast note. But FWD and Fiat underpinnings! The Bertone Spiders and Coupes of the 60s and 70s were the last great Alfas.
@@johnmarsh2078 Nonsense. That sort of stuff is trotted out by people who have never driven later Alfas and found out how rewarding FWD can be. I've owned both types.
for an alfa the 164 is pretty dull and bland looking, certainly compared to other alfa models
Well it has superb aerodynamics, Its Pininfarina design which is good enough for me and here we are thirty years later still talking about the 164. I owned three 164s and loved every minute of them. Its a fine car by any standards and better made than many of its competitors.
Not a crazy exterior, but i drive this thing for the beautiful Blade runner-looking interior and the engine note.
Always the same the word reliability .same old story try looking at the German garbage and come to think of it every other make on the market to talk about reliability rust and after sales loss from a true alfisti.
My God. He called it pretty?
probably the first person I've ever seen who thinks the 164 isn't pretty
This car is disgusting
@@keita3434 thanks for your deep analysis
Yes, he did. And this car looked drop dead sexy in race car uniform aswell, check out the concept that was supposed to replace the 155 DTM.
It's in the eye of the beholder I guess.