You prolly dont care at all but does anyone know a method to get back into an Instagram account..? I somehow forgot the account password. I would love any help you can offer me!
@Jaiden Marcellus i really appreciate your reply. I got to the site thru google and I'm waiting for the hacking stuff atm. Looks like it's gonna take quite some time so I will get back to you later with my results.
Showing the flow difference would have been a better way to display how much better each head flows and how the flow at certain valve lifts changes the way the engine power is produced. As we know keeping port velocity high is good for torque and if you open up the ports too much then flow may be awesome but velocity is reduced so you end up with an engine with crap low end power and torque yet monsterous high RPM power. The area of flow under the curve of the graph when mapping flow to valve lift gives a similar graph as to that which the engine makes on a dyno. A good explanation of what is involved in porting but backing it up with flow graphs woulda been nice.
You absolutely nailed it!!! It completely blows me away that a well-known company like Map is charging so much money for a product that they have no clue what their product is actually doing. My biggest issue with this is the fact that all of the 4G63 cylinder heads will be a boosted application. So does Increasing the volume too much actually reduces velocity? There are so many factors at play. They and so many others are completely shooting in the dark. so many shops Making Huge claims ass-u-mi-ng every step along the way... There are so many questions they don't have a single solid answers to. It drives me crazy that they can make the claims they do and actually charge $$$$$ for it.😡😡😡 But then again, what do I know?
I agree they should show a flow rate comparison for like 200-600 or more lift depending on cams ran then do a back to back dyno comparison of the head on a NA motor. No other changes! Then show how much less boost is needed to make 1000hp.
Nice. For hand porting, matching and port volume are important since only master scrapers with a complete set of tools can machine by hand accurately. Hence the popularity of cnc porting. I use liquid to match port volume by hand.
With CNC porting now with new programming options you can run a program on ports by using a probe in the port to compensate for the casting shift from port to port, super accurate fron port to port. I am Now a retired CNC Machinist / programmer. Also 5 axis machines are very flexible for compounding angles. Yet polishing is still done by hand.
Enjoyed this video. Been thinking hard to port my heads for my 345 Hemi. I’m running a 270 cam in it and I wasn’t sure which stage to go with. But with this video, definitely going with Stage 3. Thanks!
I have been hand porting heads and intakes for 20+yrs, all with carbide bits and flap wheels/then hand polish the pockets and the block. Most of the time I will try to find the correct size volume for the application. It is time based vs results process. My father had more than 30 yrs taught me starting at 12yrs old, We did it with water or very thin oil to get the volume dead on. Its not expensive if you do it in your shop. cutting the valve boss included fantastic power. oB
Awesome vid! No one explains much on cylinder heads. I have been hunting any information for a FA20 build. This helps, ill be looking into some of your other vids
Great video guys love The content yes definitely more videos on port and polishing heads as well as the block and turbos from the housing to the spindles of the sizes all that and if you can do it on evolution 10 even better once the thank you great job can't wait for the next one
@@mr.know_it_all they still are....but self learning cfd software is maybe replacing that within 5 to 10 years..... Although till now the quickest way is having a port done by porter ...run some self learning cfd on it...the cnc it.......
Actually cnc will be gone soon. Biden says that by 2030 half of all new cars must be electric. There will soon be nothing port. Y'all had better study up on automotive computers, electronics, and electricity!
@@johnmurdock5001 true but keep in mind there are still older cars driving out on the roads and highways to this day. They just can’t ban all older vehicles like that, it would be unlawful but yes if you want to buy a newer car they will be electric vehicles by that time. Not sure if it will be a thing when Biden eventually gets out of office
So I’m hearing that right? If I get a ported head but use the stock cams, it’s probably not going to produce much power besides being able to hit higher RPMs?
They may have benched flowed their heads in the past. If their doing the same porting to the same heads every time, they don't need to bench flow every single one.
You can do this yourself with a dremel. Porting is theoretical. You really don't know how effective it was unless you're able to flow test the head. Sometimes you get next to no gain at all. I'd say give it a shot on a junk head then do it to yours.
I thought stage one port and polish was considered street. I'm aiming for 320-330 HP on my Saturn SL2 1.9 with .20 over, gonna run dual intake cams, heavier 3rd gen crank and tie plate with 14-15 PSI so maybe a stage 2 or three is better to achieve that? From what I've learned also, on ported FI your gains are less after stage one , but on direct injection the gains are more, but more carbon deposits on the intake valves, etc.
Fantastic video! Gave me a few ideas for my build. I'd love to pick someone's brain who knows more than me about all these little details. Even put a team together to create a plan for the dream build and giveaway... 🤔😲😏..... *grabs pen and paper*
Simply out of curiosity. Say you added material to the exhaust side to decrease the diameter. Youd increase the pressure of the gas leaving the head. Or even have it tapered down to a smaller hole as the exhaust leaves. If you bolted a turbo and had higher velocity gas pushing it would it be beneficial? Im sure it would add extra stress to parts but im just curious if there would be any positives at all? I would be inclined to believe narrowing the exhaust to increase velocity of gas would turn the turbine and pump more air into the combustion chamber. If anyone knows anything please lemme know. Im curious
That is a very perceptive question!!! The turbo is looking for volume more than pressure. The cross sectional area of the turbine housing rapidly decreases before the exhaust gases hit the turbine vanes, that is where the pressure increase should take place. Too small exhaust ports will create an unnecessary bottleneck for the exhaust flow to get good overall efficiency.
Polishing strips away the boundary layer and slows down the air flow. Taking a ball carbine and bouncing it around and roughing swirls will get you 5-8% higher airflow across the board. We used to polish them like glass. It was determined 10 years ago and is now known everywhere that it slows down the flow. Bernoulli's Principle and boundary layer rules as well as area rule that are all from aviation is what gets the best ports.
I'm not saying it means that port design is not amazing. The rough surface is simply a new twist on surface prep. The new thing is CNC dimpling to mimic the surface of a golf ball is done at the top shops and used by all class leaders in racing except where is banned 🚫 🚫🧸⛳
What would be a good example of head that is easier to port with CNC, because they use less castings or castings are more consistent? Or is the 4g63 has so many differences because it was around for so long?
I have been developing porting flow benching and producing ported race heads how do you have stages in porting. . Cost of porting is time and the time it would take to cut stop measure cut stop measure to produce stages past 3 is bull shit. The goal is efficiency build power if one cyl flows 18 more cfm across the range that cyl is making more power then the others ...tbt its a sales strategy. You either map it out or do bowl work blend and finish . It takes along time to massage a port and make it improve you learn after many many years porting and testing what to look for .. and even then it is hard without a bench some smoke and velocity measures. I seen so many heads from Hondas and Mitsubishi toyotas turbo cars come in get corrected most time by starting over on a uncut head and using the stage 5 head for a boat anchor . To bringing the head I spent days on back to shop installing it and having to turn the boost down due to the head wants to produce same 1000 they were getting with half the boost 🙃
No, the reasoning behind not polishing intake ports is due to the fuel droplets in the intake stream tend to stick to a polished surface due to the surface tension of the fuel and a slightly rougher surface will help the fuel return to the moving column of air better. But that seems to me to really only matter significantly when you are running carbs or throttle body injection and not so much for port injection and not at all for direct injection.
It's not hard to figure out how much power you pick up you put the head on a Dyno! And get numbers now it will vary based of the NA combo but boost will multiply your NA combo!
Seats come installed in the cylinder head. Springs are not usually sold with valves. The springs must be ordered to accommodate the cam lift and intended maximum RPM number.
Anymore it is just more time efficient to buy them already done....like everything else is today............IF IF IF THE ELECTRICAL VEHICLES DO SUSTAIN LONGEVITY THIS ART WILL BE LOST AND OF NO USE....
Aric knows his stuff! It is an art if you are doing it by hand.
You prolly dont care at all but does anyone know a method to get back into an Instagram account..?
I somehow forgot the account password. I would love any help you can offer me!
@Caiden Vincenzo Instablaster ;)
@Jaiden Marcellus i really appreciate your reply. I got to the site thru google and I'm waiting for the hacking stuff atm.
Looks like it's gonna take quite some time so I will get back to you later with my results.
@Jaiden Marcellus It did the trick and I now got access to my account again. Im so happy:D
Thank you so much you saved my account :D
@Caiden Vincenzo you are welcome :D
Showing the flow difference would have been a better way to display how much better each head flows and how the flow at certain valve lifts changes the way the engine power is produced.
As we know keeping port velocity high is good for torque and if you open up the ports too much then flow may be awesome but velocity is reduced so you end up with an engine with crap low end power and torque yet monsterous high RPM power.
The area of flow under the curve of the graph when mapping flow to valve lift gives a similar graph as to that which the engine makes on a dyno.
A good explanation of what is involved in porting but backing it up with flow graphs woulda been nice.
You absolutely nailed it!!! It completely blows me away that a well-known company like Map is charging so much money for a product that they have no clue what their product is actually doing. My biggest issue with this is the fact that all of the 4G63 cylinder heads will be a boosted application. So does
Increasing the volume too much actually reduces velocity? There are so many factors at play. They and so many others are completely shooting in the dark. so many shops Making Huge claims ass-u-mi-ng every step along the way... There are so many questions they don't have a single solid answers to. It drives me crazy that they can make the claims they do and actually charge $$$$$ for it.😡😡😡 But then again, what do I know?
I agree they should show a flow rate comparison for like 200-600 or more lift depending on cams ran then do a back to back dyno comparison of the head on a NA motor. No other changes! Then show how much less boost is needed to make 1000hp.
Nice.
For hand porting, matching and port volume are important since only master scrapers with a complete set of tools can machine by hand accurately. Hence the popularity of cnc porting.
I use liquid to match port volume by hand.
With CNC porting now with new programming options you can run a program on ports by using a probe in the port to compensate for the casting shift from port to port, super accurate fron port to port. I am Now a retired CNC Machinist / programmer. Also 5 axis machines are very flexible for compounding angles. Yet polishing is still done by hand.
Perfect explanation of what I was trying to do to my hemi heads. Trying to figure out how much to remove. Aric awesome vid and info!!!
Glad it helped! Aric is super smart and we're lucky to have him here!
A amazing job Man.. congratulacion the team maperformance.
Enjoyed this video. Been thinking hard to port my heads for my 345 Hemi. I’m running a 270 cam in it and I wasn’t sure which stage to go with. But with this video, definitely going with Stage 3. Thanks!
AMAZING vid guys. i love this stuff :D
Also will be intrested in 2.2 or 2.4 stroker kit for evolution 10
Stick with a 2.2 so you can really utilize a bigger cam
I have been hand porting heads and intakes for 20+yrs, all with carbide bits and flap wheels/then hand polish the pockets and the block. Most of the time I will try to find the correct size volume for the application. It is time based vs results process. My father had more than 30 yrs taught me starting at 12yrs old, We did it with water or very thin oil to get the volume dead on. Its not expensive if you do it in your shop. cutting the valve boss included fantastic power. oB
40 years porting under my belt and some N.H.R.A. National records on the wall...2004 Hemi Challenge winner U.S. Nationals...
And?? LOL
@@sweetassugar2076 xDDDDDD
@@sweetassugar2076 that’s awesome bro! Tell me who lives that kind of life that you know! Clown!
@@Paper.Power.Politics what is your act ?
awesome video. Aric absolutely had my attention. He speaks like an egineer, idk if he is, but hes so professional and insightful.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Awesome vid! No one explains much on cylinder heads. I have been hunting any information for a FA20 build. This helps, ill be looking into some of your other vids
Thanks for watching! Let us know if you have any questions.
dsportmag.com/the-tech/education/fa20-cylinder-heads/
Great video guys love The content yes definitely more videos on port and polishing heads as well as the block and turbos from the housing to the spindles of the sizes all that and if you can do it on evolution 10 even better once the thank you great job can't wait for the next one
Size does matter shirt is hilarious on this too 😂
That’s why you 3D the heads than program those diameters into the cnc milling machine
Its so sad that porting skills like these will all get replaced with cnc machines :(
Keep up the good work
cnc programs are developed, from a hand ported runner first.
@@mr.know_it_all they still are....but self learning cfd software is maybe replacing that within 5 to 10 years.....
Although till now the quickest way is having a port done by porter ...run some self learning cfd on it...the cnc it.......
Actually cnc will be gone soon. Biden says that by 2030 half of all new cars must be electric. There will soon be nothing port. Y'all had better study up on automotive computers, electronics, and electricity!
@@johnmurdock5001 true but keep in mind there are still older cars driving out on the roads and highways to this day. They just can’t ban all older vehicles like that, it would be unlawful but yes if you want to buy a newer car they will be electric vehicles by that time. Not sure if it will be a thing when Biden eventually gets out of office
Cnc is always better then hand porting.
So I’m hearing that right? If I get a ported head but use the stock cams, it’s probably not going to produce much power besides being able to hit higher RPMs?
Love this thank you
Handport!!! FTW🤟🏼
Great content! Keep it up!
Thanks man, will do!
My Evo 9 head is head ported by Curt Brown. Rip Curt 🙏
Are the heads bench flowed before and after ?
Doesn't look like it
If not he doesnt know if hes doing much good. But when you add 35lbs boost it dont matter much. NA motor it would run like shit.
They may have benched flowed their heads in the past. If their doing the same porting to the same heads every time, they don't need to bench flow every single one.
@@4thdimensiontravels855 n/a i would do a stage 2 ans some cams will increase power
Hand finishing after CNC port work is absolutely necessary but seldom done.
Not needed at all theres no real advantage to smoothing cnc lines.
It was a very useful and educational program, but you could draw on paper what you want to do.
I'd love to have a stage 3 port like this done to my 4.0L V6. I don't care what any of you Ford haters say, I love my V6 Mustang. #4_0Life
You can do this yourself with a dremel. Porting is theoretical. You really don't know how effective it was unless you're able to flow test the head. Sometimes you get next to no gain at all. I'd say give it a shot on a junk head then do it to yours.
david vizards literally wrote the book on head porting its a very good read
Lol, he may have "wrote the book", but he took dictation from Joe Mondello by doing so. 😆
What are you doing to check wet flow and things to help hold fuel in suspension or help the fuel make the turn
I thought stage one port and polish was considered street. I'm aiming for 320-330 HP on my Saturn SL2 1.9 with .20 over, gonna run dual intake cams, heavier 3rd gen crank and tie plate with 14-15 PSI so maybe a stage 2 or three is better to achieve that? From what I've learned also, on ported FI your gains are less after stage one , but on direct injection the gains are more, but more carbon deposits on the intake valves, etc.
Fantastic video! Gave me a few ideas for my build. I'd love to pick someone's brain who knows more than me about all these little details. Even put a team together to create a plan for the dream build and giveaway... 🤔😲😏..... *grabs pen and paper*
Do you use a flowbench to dictate how much you are porting?
Flow bench testing is coupled with cnc, master scrapers are the only people able to machine to exact tolerances by hand.
How do you go about getting into that career field?
Just wondering, did you just cut a stock head in pieces to find the water jackets?
What tool is that you’re using with the carbide bit?
Simply out of curiosity. Say you added material to the exhaust side to decrease the diameter. Youd increase the pressure of the gas leaving the head. Or even have it tapered down to a smaller hole as the exhaust leaves. If you bolted a turbo and had higher velocity gas pushing it would it be beneficial?
Im sure it would add extra stress to parts but im just curious if there would be any positives at all? I would be inclined to believe narrowing the exhaust to increase velocity of gas would turn the turbine and pump more air into the combustion chamber.
If anyone knows anything please lemme know. Im curious
That is a very perceptive question!!! The turbo is looking for volume more than pressure. The cross sectional area of the turbine housing rapidly decreases before the exhaust gases hit the turbine vanes, that is where the pressure increase should take place. Too small exhaust ports will create an unnecessary bottleneck for the exhaust flow to get good overall efficiency.
Polishing strips away the boundary layer and slows down the air flow. Taking a ball carbine and bouncing it around and roughing swirls will get you 5-8% higher airflow across the board. We used to polish them like glass. It was determined 10 years ago and is now known everywhere that it slows down the flow. Bernoulli's Principle and boundary layer rules as well as area rule that are all from aviation is what gets the best ports.
I'm not saying it means that port design is not amazing. The rough surface is simply a new twist on surface prep. The new thing is CNC dimpling to mimic the surface of a golf ball is done at the top shops and used by all class leaders in racing except where is banned 🚫 🚫🧸⛳
What would be a good example of head that is easier to port with CNC, because they use less castings or castings are more consistent? Or is the 4g63 has so many differences because it was around for so long?
Want more porting vids
Do you leave the port smooth or rough or what if you leave rough what Grit or how rough is it
Because removing a lot doesnt mean power
So if I ported a saab b204 head it would ideally need stage 3 type due to them only revving to 7k rpm?
How do I find a company that does reliable porting?
Be careful porting evo8-9 heads too much! Mine just cracked in an exhaust port! Won't be porting my new head this time, only making 600-650whp
I have been developing porting flow benching and producing ported race heads how do you have stages in porting. . Cost of porting is time and the time it would take to cut stop measure cut stop measure to produce stages past 3 is bull shit. The goal is efficiency build power if one cyl flows 18 more cfm across the range that cyl is making more power then the others ...tbt its a sales strategy. You either map it out or do bowl work blend and finish . It takes along time to massage a port and make it improve you learn after many many years porting and testing what to look for .. and even then it is hard without a bench some smoke and velocity measures. I seen so many heads from Hondas and Mitsubishi toyotas turbo cars come in get corrected most time by starting over on a uncut head and using the stage 5 head for a boat anchor . To bringing the head I spent days on back to shop installing it and having to turn the boost down due to the head wants to produce same 1000 they were getting with half the boost 🙃
What is the colour paint code of the walls in the head porting room ?
so, you assume that air flow is more laminar than turbulent in head channels?
Laminar flow is the intended goal. More than likely you will never completely eliminate all turbulence in intake and exhaust ports.
What about ported heads, stock cam but higher rocker ratio? Specifically yella terra rollers
You'll be missing out on the advantage of more valve overlap.
Do you bore the intake seats to .9 of the OS valve diameter?
Isnt polishing intake ports detrimental to air flow ?
No, the reasoning behind not polishing intake ports is due to the fuel droplets in the intake stream tend to stick to a polished surface due to the surface tension of the fuel and a slightly rougher surface will help the fuel return to the moving column of air better. But that seems to me to really only matter significantly when you are running carbs or throttle body injection and not so much for port injection and not at all for direct injection.
It's not hard to figure out how much power you pick up you put the head on a Dyno! And get numbers now it will vary based of the NA combo but boost will multiply your NA combo!
Around how much would this work cost 300 a head
More like $1500-$3000 for good work.
Like to know your
price on porting
Just add more boost
10 Hours of porting and will still flow less cfm than a k20 head
Whats a shame is even with all that air flow the k20 will never produce the power, adrenaline, or feel that that hemi will 🤣
@@gregscherf9385 yea I love me a hemispherical combustion chamber
Use no head even more than a k20.
No flow bench?
I want this guy to perform a Stage III on my DSM head.
Do new valves come with seats and springs?
Seats come installed in the cylinder head. Springs are not usually sold with valves. The springs must be ordered to accommodate the cam lift and intended maximum RPM number.
No dyno?...
C & C 5 access machine
WTF are you trying to say? LOL
Anymore it is just more time efficient to buy them already done....like everything else is today............IF IF IF THE ELECTRICAL VEHICLES DO SUSTAIN LONGEVITY THIS ART WILL BE LOST AND OF NO USE....
Why not just have a robot do the work
So much easier on my sbc lol
Does anybody know what in the hell he is saying . Because he is really bad at explaining the concept of what he is doing.