This Is How The Music Industry F**ks Musicians Over!
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- Опубліковано 15 лют 2022
- Today I'm reacting to a video of musicians talking about what being part of the music industry as an artist is really like. It's an interesting topic layered with legalities, negotiations and power. Let me know what you think of this video, I find these kinds of conversations interesting.
Thanks to @LoudwireMusic for the source compilation video.
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Indeed. You are a treasure.
Of course, the music trade damaged itself immensely via the same venal greed. Karma? If not, close enough.
Max Goldberg Liu at Webster Hall before the show!
As someone once sang - "Was that fin on your back part of the deal? Shark!!
I have the same experience. This is greatness in action.
I can confirm what this man said with no hesitation. You want to have fun? Join Justin on his Patreon and don't miss all his videos here!🤘🖤
Where dya get that shirt bud
“The music business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway where thieves and pimps run free, and good men die like dogs. There's also a negative side.” - Hunter S Thompson
He said this about television in "Generation of Swine."
The satanic CULT industry!
Thompson was a part of that same satanic cult. Check him out on Letterman back in the day talking about killing people for sport.
@@silke9479 ooooo00000! Scary
🤣🤣🤣
He was a snuff film maker, fuck that monster.
Who knew my favorite musician in 2003 would become my favorite UA-camr in 2022?? You’re amazing, Justin. Always have been.
I knew
Important topic! I got a taste of the sleaze when I made music videos for bands in Seattle pre/post grunge explosion. Locally it was petty scheming, very neanderthal, everyone on the take, many musicians living off crap jobs, groupies, and/or drug side-hustles,
Nationally it was rapacious and predatory and pro. So many cool bands were signed, but all the ones I was close with were quickly driven into the ground and became broke. Only a couple emerged by making it huge enough to compensate for the speed at which that they were being robbed.
I got to film a couple of Alice in Chains concerts in '93. Seeing Layne furtively emerge from his trailer, eyes hollow and full of fear (then onstage trying to compensate by wearing Armani suits and designer shades!), I remember thinking, Holy shit that poor bastard needs help! Everyone close to him seemed trained through experience to ignore the obvious. Too many livelihoods at stake. A fly caught in a web came to mind. Compared to the Layne from 89-90 he was already a shell.
It is not a coincidence that four of Seattle's most talented frontmen, Cornell, Staley, Cobain, and Wood all died from the business at different times and at different levels. People blame drugs, but I think that's blaming the medicine for the disease. I realized by the end of '93 that I was a tiny part of that disease. I wasn't so big that I could walk on air down in LA; I had to watch the carnage at street level. The situation was causing just about every musician I knew misery in one way or another, even as they kept grasping at a big mythical win. It was too depressing. You don't have to quit showbiz, you only have to let it go. I let it go.
One exception was Pearl Jam. They remained pretty rooted because Gossard came from wealth and knew how to find advisers that weren't gross or ignorant -- and they knew the tragedy of losing their frontman, Andrew Wood, before anyone else figured out how treacherous even modest success could be.
Like many of my friends, I think Hawkins is incredibly lucky NOT to have succeeded more than he did. Actual life is good.
Great comment. Thanks for sharing your experiences.
20 years working for a defense contractor...the job started out as a way to pay the bills until I "made it" in music. Couple albums later I realize how hard it is to make it...even got on an album with a former legit (hair-band) rock-star with gold albums on his walls. By the 90's even he had no-idea how to get a decent deal. It was all distribution deals by then. I made it onto an album with Kenny Aronoff & that went nowhere. Now I have a pension, 401K, vacations, insurance & over 6 figure income. I'm lucky I had this "backup plan".
@@porknbeans7420If you can't beat em, join em... and then beat the hell out of em.
Thanks for sharing. This was really interesting
@@porknbeans7420 So, a 7 figure income?
The part about the 'hip young execs' reminds me of the Wu tang Clan lyric: "who's your a&r? A mountain climber who plays an electric guitar. He don't know the meaning of dope, so here's a suit and tie rap that's cleaner than a bar of soap"
Love your channel Justin! \m/ \m/
duuuuude shout me out 😱😱
There was one other aspect to Prince writing ‘slave’ on his face besides the obvious. WB told him they owned his name. If he wanted to record anything else outside Warner Brothers he could not do it under the name Prince, even though Prince was his actual given name- Prince Rogers Nelson. That is some horrific BS to say well you can go off to some other label, but we own your actual name, and you can never record anything else under the name Prince.
Hard to believe but…. He didn’t make any money from the Purple Rain album after 87.
@@frankzappa951 That’s nuts!
@@frankzappa951 Also he’d finally won what would have been a landmark case right before he passed. He won his rights back from everything with Warner Brothers. He died just a few weeks later and his sister was happy to let Warner Brothers not only retain the publishing rights, but also gave them everything from the fabled vault. It is sad that he fought so hard for so long and finally won, only to die and have WB get everything back plus. That legal precedent would have been huge, but I’m afraid it got essentially ignored with his subsequent death. Had he lived other artists would probably have been able to use that legal precedent to win cases of their own.
@Lisa Marie Thanks, I have read this before and guess this is where the conspiracy theory comes from ….. Professional thieves !
@@frankzappa951 yes the conspiracy theory does stem from this. The day Prince finally won the lawsuit he had a small gathering at home to celebrate and actually received a few death threats almost immediately by phone and by at least one person outside the gate at Paisley Park. The people at that small gathering corroborated that there were death threats while they were there. Of course that only adds fuel to the flame of the conspiracy theory unfortunately.
Prince was a genuine musical genius, on top of saving a lot of musicians from horrendous contract situations. This whole area is a minefield. Bands like the Stone Roses were royally shafted.
Prince is truly missed, he really was the Purple Yoda.
I loved the roses, love the martin Hannet first album, played the official first album to death, loved the second album, even more, they were getting better all the time, but the record companies and drug habits, mainly squiers ruined the band for everyone , i don't think the record industry killed the roses , i think john killed the roses
@@valley_robot To be honest, there were a legion of reasons why a band with the biggest potential of that era, ended up not recording and making so many more great albums. But I maintain, they were THE worst managed band EVER aswell though.
@@dannygray4898 Elvis Presley’s manager, Col. Tom Parker (actually not a colonel and not named Tom Parker) took over half of his earnings and never let him tour outside the U.S., though he was arguably the world’s biggest star. It later turned out that “Parker” had illegally immigrated, and risked having this exposed if he tried getting paperwork to leave the U.S. So I would nominate him for worst manager ever.
@@ibelieveicansoar Yeh, but Elvis didn't write his own songs.... the Roses did, and there's a famous story that Manny had to sell his Lambretta in 99, to afford to go and watch United in the champions league final that year. Elvis was giving cars away (or shooting them) LOL, and didn't even write his own songs.
how musicians effed themselves
when napster came out, many musicians jumped on the bandwagon to support labels suing downloaders, not realizing that the platform provided them the opportunity to break from the companies who had been screwing them for years
so instead of joining together to create their own platform, they allowed apple, spotify, youtube and others to become the new platforms and continue screwing the artist
Would love to hear your thoughts on the Frank Ocean situation. He completely finessed his label and was able to release his most critically acclaimed album under his own terms, in his own way, resulting in millions of dollars going directly to him. A legendary story that often gets swept under the rug. Cheers!
Quickly becoming my favorite UA-cam channel. Much love, Justin Hawkins. Keep riding.
It's awesome, so glad he's doing this, especially videos like this one.
I love how honest you are , Justin! I would love to see you have a chat with Daniel Johns, ex Silverchair frontman, most recently a scoundrel who is doing his own thing on social media and refusing to tour. He is a genius, he is a musical prodigy, but he’s rejecting all of the shit that goes along with it, including playing live. His music stands on its own, and I think it would be good for both of you to have chat.
That would be quite interesting. Silverchair were about 15-17yo back then when they stirred up the scene..
Genius, really? I mean have you listened to frog stomp recently? The ONLY reason they got any attention was the same reason Perth band Amonia did too.... 3 piece band with blond singer in the early 90s. Gee who does that remind you of? A&R were head-hunting for nirvana clones at the time.
Some of Daniel's work with over rated electronic nobody Paul Mac is good though I must RELUCTANTLY admit.
@@rjanolsen3935 pfffft stirred up the scene. Come on. The were irrelevant to what was happening in the underground. Incessant triple J play isn't indicative of a good band. I can't even think of ONE decent song by silverchair. Johns really only came into his own after his brush with anorexia.
Being a musician you're expected to "hustle" nowadays. That usually means self-promotion through social media but I think that in many ways this is the antithesis to the rock n' roll attitude which is about rebellion and not fitting in with the status quo, which social media tilts towards. For example, a lot of bands may feel pressured to conform to one genre to get on Spotify playlists. I personally miss the days when bands like Queen and Thin Lizzy would traipse through multiple genres on their albums. Doing that now is heretical (although I myself am proud of being one). Bands like Motorhead and Led Zeppelin came from a "purer" time insofar as the artists focused on the art and the management handled the business side of things.
As regards labels, I think if you do succeed in the hustle you don't really need one as a musician nowadays. You can build up a YT following for example and then you have a captive audience for your music, although I would say major labels still have clout as first moves. Pity the gatekeepers have a distinct lack of imagination though. And further to that, it's truly a sad reflection on the state of this world, when corporate drones bereft of imagination or talent pilfer the profits duly owed to the artists who create the "miracle of music".
Well said. 🤘
hard to be a see artists as cool and cutting edge when they are begging for your views, your votes and to come to every single one of their shows no matter how far away you are. Spam equals lame. So many want to oversaturate like they aren't aware that their efforts to reach a new person will be a tidal wave that washes away their core audience.... seems everyone is modeling their approach after new kids on the block reguardless of what they do or play.
This is so much like what I recently watched Mathew Baynton saying in a conversation about the entertainment, acting industry. He had said that when he was coming up, he’d see people who were so focused on their idea of success, and would only be seeing their work as steps towards something bigger. Get a gig, not be happy because you’re not the lead. Get a leading role, not be happy because now you need an award. Get some sort of award, decide it’s not prestigious enough. Then you need a BAFTA to feel like anything you do is valid.
All when instead you could be doing what you do because you love it. And in creative jobs like acting and writing and music, where you need both creativity and talent, the opportunity to love the work you do is so great, how can you not? If you do what you love, and put your best self into it, it’s something to be proud of.
This is a different measurement of success than when we’re getting into details about getting screwed by royalty rates and such. But “success” is so difficult to measure and means something different to every person, and that’s where I see how what Mat was saying is similar to what Justin’s talking about here with what making music could and should be, were it not for the industry BS. As a working artist, be it a musician, or a writer like myself, you HAVE to play ball with “the Man” to be able have a professional career doing what you love and what you’re good at.
Unfortunately I’ve regretted and even resented so many of my choices, being a damn ghostwriter for many, many years. That’s a whole different thing . . . I don’t even get my name on much of my best work. But it’s how I’m able to do it. So it was a tough choice. And I’ve finally said no more. Seeing someone talk about my work as if they’d done it. GUTTING.
I’m getting off topic. I just think it’s interesting to stumble across a similar discussion about life working as a professional in an artistic, creative field. It’s really a very very tricky thing to keep a balance and preserve authenticity.
I think there WAS a small period of time where the Internet allowed bands and artists who may not have otherwise found an audience, to gain some exposure.
It was when MySpace was the biggest social media. Every local band had a page and we could put whatever music we wanted on our personal pages and it would automatically play. I personally know a good few metal bands from the Lowestoft/Norwich area that got signed to decent labels, toured the US, got slots at Download and other festivals, all from MySpace. One of which was born from the remnants of my old metal band whose biggest gigs had previously been Camden Underworld and Norwich waterfront supporting or even only opening for bands like The Black Dahlia Murder, Mendeed, Minicipal Waste, and Dry Kill Logic. Not to mention Ed Sheeran was initially discovered there I believe.
MySpace was this amazing wild west for us small hopeful bands of the early noughties.
True! Ghost got their start from MySpace
@@Emilmoolin Arctic Monkeys also had their name spread via MySpace
Bandcamp has filled a similar role for me. No way would I have found some bands without it
Arctic Monkeys and Lily Allen too. I agree - my band had a song that Carl Barat of the Libertines put on his page and had we had any wherewithal we'd have taken advantage of it, self promotion was so much easier then too. That said, Tiktok has been through this phase too - I feel like the larger corporations are fully aware of this now and are playing the system like old fashioned payola. But I know of a few acts who have massive success through it but it seems to only really be one or two songs that at a time that get a massive boost, rather than the band's whole career
@@NSPike yeah, lily allen...so underground
Thank you for uploading lots of material. Absolutely your analysis of music.
Hey, Justin, thanks for giving us another good hang! Great video, as always.
These videos are great. Thanks for the knowledgeable info. Keep em coming they're great!
This...is the best video you have ever pumped out yet. Loved it. Genuine and truth.
This is one of my favorite channels. Absolutely top-notch. Thank you, Justin!
That shirt is fabulous! Great perspective, as well. I really like your well reasoned analysis on the topics that you cover.
What an incredible insight. Just brilliant. Justin, you’re funny as hell and devastatingly articulate at the same time.
I remember when you guys began to appear, we were so happy. you made a lot of people smile. intelligence.
Great video Justin! Really enjoying your channel, don’t stop riding agaaaiiiiiinnnnn
Pretty much loving this channel , such a lovely insight into so many aspects of being a successful musician. I am jealous but in a loving way. Please keep em coming and answer my question about oasis's bsides !
The best channel on UA-cam! I'm going though every-single episode. Justin is CRAZY insightful, interesting, entertaining and we get to watch a MASTER musician, break things down for those of us who will never reach that level. I can't get enough of this channel.
Would love if u made more videos talking about this kinda stuff 👍🏻
My new favourite channel ! Really interesting and informative. Also
very funny .
Tell the truth ✌ Justin you are my fave new UA-cam channel. So honest and down to earth. Thanks for the great conversation👍
Thank you Justin, another wonderful UA-cam blog. Especially the Frank Zappa interview.
Justin, your channel and videos like this really inspires me. I was a Darkness 1st album fan, but now I sincerely respect you and your band as a true artist for this generation. Rock on man! 🤘
Really interesting insights. I'm loving your videos more and more.
Firstly, my new favourite channel. Absolutley epic.
Honest, informative and funny. The trifectre of champions!
And i love to hear people speaking out about the copycat culture in modern pop.
As a lifelong musician, i tend to micro analyse songs, and instrumentation, harmonies, and fx are the worst offenders that arent just blatantly ripping off other songs. That digital bassy glockenspiel is an example of being over used as a "stick that in somewhere and the kids will love it"
This channel is amazing, I love it so much and Justin is a class act all round as always. I thinks its easy to perceive a career in the music industry as the perfect job, but I sense some serious angst in all these interviews thats being held back in the name of professionalism. Imagine Prince and Justin drunk at a BBQ ranting off about the industry and their experiences.
Congrats on the best bum ever card 😁 And thanks, for an interesting video on the music biz's shadyside. My dad was a musician he played mostly covers in bars and restaurants often as a one man band but actually played all the instruments himself (it was the late 70's you couldn't just plug a laptop into the system with a backing track to play over) which amazed me and to be honest the memories still do. He also was in a band that played their own music. Very few bands made enough to support a family. A big reason was because there was very little local music on the radio in our country at the time. Also alot was censored by the apartheid government. He moved to Australia because they had a law that if I remember correctly said that 50 or more percent of music that the radio stations played had to be local. Keep on riding Justin
Recently discovered this UA-cam Channel and really enjoying it. Great content. Justin, you're a very articulate guy.
Great heart felt erudite talk on the music business, by someone who knows and someone who supports and loves creators and artists. Justin rules!
This was really magnificent!!! Thank you so much for making this. Brilliant words and fascinating clips!
This is the perfect example of what I've been struggling to figure out about the industry. Thank you for explaining. Music was my savour, then one day I couldn't tell the difference between the artists being played main stream, everyone sounded the same. If someone sounded different from the #1 on the radio the switched to sound exactly like the #1 until they all sound the same. I didn't know where to start to find true art through music anymore, it took about two years and I realized I had to change the algorithm in my streaming. It's much harder to do than you think, so I had to go back to the roots of music and finally it fixed the algorithm and new fresh music started to be easily accessible finally. It kind of made me sick to realize how generic the industry is turning artists work and almost silencing their creativity in the process.
Absolutely amazing , love your insight and views . Always been a huge fan .
Great show this one, interesting.
I did watch the billy interview and you have taken the information higher, thanks.👋👋
Enjoyed this, especially as someone who has lost out on around half a million quid,thanks to contracts written by weasels.
Think you may have taken a different interpretation to the ‘damages’ section, Serj is referring to archaic clauses where the labels would take a % off the top to cover damages caused by physical copies falling off trucks/boats etc.. whereas that cannot apply to digital downloads.. but the labels still try and take it anyway 💀 your point still applies mind.
Thanks for the videos man 🙏🏻
Today's outfit is BRILLIANT! Having worked in the music business, I know all too well how many ways an artist can be screwed. I realized very early on that when a record made money that the label found everyone possible to pay that money to (including themselves) and, if there was any little scrap of money left, they'd give that to the artist. Also, the artist would be charged for EVERYTHING. Did the label send you a gold record? Well, guess who paid for it. Did the president fly out to your gig and bring an expensive bottle of champagne back stage? Yep, the band paid for that, too.
Loving your honesty and realism and of course Prince
Brilliant video. Should be required viewing for anyone thinking of entering the music business. Hats off to Justin for sharing his knowledge and experience. Look, listen and weep.
I've always loved Prince, and I always have heard a bit of his influence on the Darkness. A prince cover would be rad!
Certainly never could figure out wtf the music companies actually do anymore, other than cause problems.
That is why he is no longer alive!
@@silke9479 So you are inferring that Prince's record company caused his death in some way? Seriously? Prince had bad hips from dancing around stage and jumping off piano's and speakers in high heel boots for 30 years. He was self administering illegally obtained Fentanyl to deal with the hip pain. All Prince's decisions. All his responsibility. Don't be one of these "they killed him" people that don't know the facts.
@@brianinglis3805 well said!
@@brianinglis3805 wow I didn’t read that comment like that at all. Sounded to me like they are aware of the fact that administrators and executives go around causing problems so that they can pretend their jobs matter.
@@brianinglis3805 there is a death clause in these contracts. And sometimes, death becomes more profitable than life.
Love this. Music law is fascinating. I wrote a paper on sampling and copyright law in college when rap first came out.
are you against rap music and/or sampling? just curious.
I don’t know which video to drop this praise, but longtime fan of yours, new to this channel. Thank you for all of what you do. Endless insight, lots of great humor, and tons of talent. Please don’t ever stop. 👍
Justin, this is wonderful. I could listen to music industry talk like this for hours. I find it fascinating. Thank you. Billy Squier comes to mind as an artist who was left hanging by his record company, which basically refused to market his later albums. I love Billy Squier and he’s one of the most under-appreciated American rockers. He ended up leaving the music business altogether because the experience was so bad.
Pretty enlightening stuff. It's amazing how much the record companies have shaped our music and kept a stranglehold on creativity for the almighty dollar. I appreciate bands like The Darkness that work hard to make great rock music with integrity and heart. You guys should have the great success you so deserve to go with it. Looking forward to seeing you guys for the first time live in April. Cheers!
People only get the abuse they allow.
your shoutout to Prince is much appreciated! When will do an album review?
Gosh that was interesting, pretty eye opening about the music industry really!
Also, come play in Leicester again sometime! 😎
Really fascinating topic,thank you for all the enlightening , and by the way,love the shirt!
Been trying my whole life to break in to the business . You have to know somebody or have an opportunity to get heard . Very hard .love your analysis Justin .thanks buddy 👍
I reckon there's a triangle of a) effort, b) talent, c) luck. For real success you need all three of those. a+c = mediocre journeyman, b+c = wasted talent, a+b = unrecognised brilliance.
Something that we've had to deal with as a small band making weird Alt rock stuff has been sharky mix engineers. For our first EP we got swindled hard and lost thousands. Old mate (who shall not be named) managed to convince us to work with him after showing us previous songs that he's worked with. They sounded good, really good. But as we came to the end of it all, we got the WORST MIX EVER. There was clearly not the same amount of effort put into the job as others and what it left us with was no money and a really dodgy sounding ep... We ended up doing it ourselves (which could have been better but it wasn't anywhere near as bad). The biggest advice we can give, from one small live band to another, is to work with people who have continuesly, over years, produced great music! We've done it right this time around and can't wait to show the people the difference! 🤙🤙 There's many traps to fall into, just be careful! ❤️
“Old mate”, are you from NSW Australia by any chance? 😂👍🇦🇺🍻🍻🍻
@@dasmuss6174 Country town Australia in a place called Mount Gambier brother! 😜🤙🤙 Same sort of people though man haha
@@higgsfield2325 haha I knew it, I’m from Newcastle, I moved up from vic 10 years ago and heard everyone saying “old mate” 😂🇦🇺🍻🍻
Great video Justin, every new artist should see this before they write a note. My old friend and bandmate Shea worked with you guys on your last Irish tour and spoke very highly of you.
Another great video and insight in “The Biz”. Frank was a visionary musical genius.
It's bloody shocking when you think about it: as you said, Justin, music is something almost magical! It's treated by record companies and publishers as a commodity; and, you can clearly argue music is consumed and is therefore a commodity to be produced and sold. It is, as we know, more than this: Prince is the perfect example of an artist who channeled something that mixed with his desire and immense creativity to produce something that is more than a commodity.
I'm of to pick up my acoustic and strum and wail a song or two - good for the soul.
x
Called the music business for a reason...
Its not consumed, though, is it.
Great Vid, as always! Hey... Speaking of Prince, I'd love to see you break him and his music down as you've done with other musicians! Pllleeeaaase!!!
I’ve been wanting him to talk Prince for ages! Justin breaking down his guitar work, especially the opening to When Doves Cry.
Just discovered this channel, really enjoying it!
What a great breakdown of the different facets of being in the music industry and how the decisions that are made and the effects they have on the artists. Needs to be more help for independent artists who don’t wanna be owned and controlled by people who have never written a song, played an instrument or sung in any way shape or form.
If you look a certain way, have a large social media presence and you're willing to be moulded into what music executives want then it doesn't matter if you have any talent, write a lyric or even play the recorder you'll get that music deal. Literally for the past 15 to 20 years depending upon who you ask there is one person who has written more hit pop songs than Michael Jackson, Adele and Madonna combined and his name is max Martin. If there's a new living figurine to throw out into the pop world then there's a huge chance this bloke wrote songs for him or her. Thats why a lot of the music you hear on the radio seems to sound the same. So when he said creativity is dead he was kind of right. If you look beyond the radio friendly music there's a huge wave of creativity out there and it's up to us to find it and embrace it, only then we may see some change.
Loving todays shirt. 💓
....and pants, may i add!😘
@@gearViewmirror oh yeah 😎
Love this channel. Could listen all day dude
It's truly incredible to get real experience based insights from someone at this level.
Music is a business and it unfortunately likes to exploit the artists,especially the newer,younger artists.
Great video.
Keep it up.
Hey Justin subs are going up rapid good work
Cheers! :)
Wow, this is one of the best videos you've done yet.
You’re a legend. How insightful, thanks for this vid. I had no idea all this was going on.
Hi Justin! I'm a new subscriber and loving the videos. Many moons ago (circa 2006) I worked at Vodafone in Hampstead and sold you a new sim card. Anyway, keep up the good work!
Hope you didn't double-scan it! 😉
This Content is absolutely fascinating. I'm very impressed. Great channel! 👍
Actually I've said some things about the darkness myself and your voice Justin but after watching this video I e found new respect for you as an individual and a musician.
Love this and Love your channel Justin. Been singing “juuuuuustin Hawkins rides aaaaagain….againnnnn” all day! Question. What do you do to keep your singing voice healthy and consistent on tour / have you noticed that your voice has been effected at all from constant touring and if so in what way?
I keep singing it too! 😂
Likewise😅
Me too,lol
Answer him, Justin! 😎
Bro, my cat has heard this innumerable times in the last few weeks. I prefer to believe she loves it.
Dam man, i'm digging the outfit 💖
Loving the insight you give and the channel, which us becoming my go to on YT . Would you consider doing a series of 'this week I have mostly been ' listening to..please?
At my old age of 56, I rarely branch out into new genres now, and they do say variety is the spice of life. Apparently, it helps keep the senility at bay too..one fears one maybe too late in my case but I am ever the optimist .
Big love
Ruddy ruddy good video! I think this musical creativity lives on in the independent music world a lot more now, so you have to dig a bit more to find it, but there is amazing stuff there.
Getting the promotion is very hard as we have to do it ourselves, but at least there is a way to put music out .. just a shame that the mainstream side is so overly controlled compared to the days of them giving bands 5 or 6 album record deals back in’t day :)
With you all the way on this Justin... I never quite 'made it', had 5 contracts from indie to major and I think I was bugger all more than a tax loss.
I see Prince. I click. I watch! Great vid.
super interesting takes! Loved you commenting on this!
I really enjoyed listening to your experience and take on this. Obviously The Darkness have been through this process many times throughout their tenure.
Great video. Nailed it with Prince. He broke chains and in doing so charted the path for others to follow. Also, love to hear what your thoughts are on the Taylor Swift situation. Her music isn’t my taste but her savy and moxie definitely are. Maybe you’ve already done a video on it???
Sometimes I'm glad I never fulfilled my dream of becoming a rock musician because there's no way an artist can win this game.
It amazes me how artists gave up their music almost for free to these leeches.
Prince was right: you make the music, you own it. A record company should only function as a manufacturer and a promoter/deliverer and receive a cut from it. These companies can be definitely be audited, they just sold the myth that they can't be hel accountable for their theft.
Sadly artists dwell in fantasies of megastardom and they resign to the rights of their art in hope that the muse will keep flowing and that the record companies will help them fulfill their dreams.
Grave mistake.
How many great bands were ignored by the record companies and the marketing department after their debut?, even when they were successful starts?
Big Country, The Outfield, etc. So many to count.
They will leach an artist the most they can and will stop taking a risk on the next albums even if those albums are even better. Counterwise they will support a subpar artist as long as they can be manipulated, like they do today with today's "talents".
The internet still have the potential to level the game, it's just that artists are not organized, and not sort of unionised too.
Also the constant feud and legal battles against an unstoppable force like piracy and file sharing is not conducting to a successful outcome.
Copyright claims against fans and owners of the artist's material, the real patrons of musicians have the ability to promote the artist with the power of social media but record companies get in the way, and artists too.
you're absolutely right. it's the same with the dance world but kind of worse bc you cannot obtain rights to your choreo. but having to sellout is a big reason I'm happy I walked away from the dance industry. I'm too stubborn & particular to sacrifice my art for an artist, song, or choreo that I hate and don't feel in my soul.
I have great respect for you Justin, really enjoyed that insight thanks
I've watched two of your uploads...a master class on ego management! Cheers Mate!
I’m a tour manager. I’ve been lucky enough to work with very established artists and emerging artists a like. It’s genuinely heartbreaking to see new artists be tempted by the major label blank cheques that are written and the bigger acts that are fighting for their masters back or a fair split.
It’s a fantastic industry but my god does it have its drawbacks for the creators of the medium.
Love you to bits Justin.
It's a severely flawed "Industry".
Are you sure you are not the ex football player?
Masters back? Like the ones which burned in the Universal fire in 2008.
It would be interesting to hear your take on the industry pressures on smaller labels and indie artists, and also on artists who end up creating their own label (either from the outset or after they get established). I believe, for example, Les Claypool and Primus own their music, or there are smaller (and amazing) groups like Kikagaku Moyo who founded their label to release their own music (and other asian psych rock groups). It seems like there isn't just one "music industry", there is 'The Industry' you're speaking about, and then there's the smaller, for lack of a better term 'mom and pop' style labels that are more of a passion project. And yet despite their passion the smaller labels still tend to fuck over artists financially. I haven't done the proper research, but my guess is that those people really are trying their best to treat artists well, but there's too many competitive pressures from the mainstream industry to be able to maintain a fair and ethical relationship with artists.
Hanson was one such group. They got shuffled off to Island Of Def Jam in a label merger. Great label, but clearly a bad fit for Hanson. They’d written well over a hundred songs, but I of DJ kept saying they had no single. Finally fed up they involved their lawyers, got out of their contact and started their own label. The subsequent record, at least at the time, was the highest selling indie album release of all time. Also the single they’d wanted to use from the beginning was Penny And Me, which went on to be one of their biggest hits. I’m a big Hanson fan and am reluctant to talk about them here thinking I’d be soundly mocked. 😂 But they’ve been making great music for a very long time at a rate of an album every year or 2.
@@lisamarie1560 Who?
@@DMSProduktions get a grip....
@@Newmusicreview On WHAT? WTF are you on about?
@@DMSProduktions was the Who thing a joke …or you actually don’t know Hanson 🤷🏻
This was very interesting Mr Hawkins, many a wise word passed on. thanks for sharing .:)
It's nice of you to give us your time keep being smart and patient
I really wish that people like you would use your platform to help music fans find new music that is not being peddled by the industry. Bandcamp is awash with great, brilliant music (including your own), so why not once in a while take a great unknown artist and expose them to your audience? If more established artists helped the little guys climb the ladder we wouldn't need the establishment. I think it's a real shame that you don't alert everyone to the alternatives.
I agree. More people need to be the change they want to see and so many big artists could help smaller artists and provide an alternative way to promote music.
Can you do a video talking about your feud with disturbed lol I remember you calling them the taco bell of metal
Enjoying your channel tons! Best video so far, very informative and interesting this one.
Really enjoying watching your stuff Justin. My band White Wizzard has lived this roller coaster and all of this is spot on. When I signed my first record deal with a certain label in Nottingham that shall go unmentioned, one little trick they threw into the verbiage of the contract was the words “in perpetuity”
I had a lawyer here in the USA red line the contract and I guess he just didn’t catch it. Basically with no rights reversion on my songs, the label owns every song I wrote FOREVER. So if you end up in a dispute and they are spiteful, or the owner of the label is a loon in this case, they can literally pull your videos from you tube which happened to us. I think for any artist, if you are going to be the top priority of a record label and you want to play long ball trusting the building process to cash in after your 4th or 5th album (see Metallica) and use the label for all that push….and you can survive that long, then it can work to your advantage in the end. However if you become a back burner band, they give up on you or if they decide to shelve you -you are screwed. A lot of bands get caught up in the notion that a record deal is nirvana but that’s a slippery slope. We then signed to a next label that just dropped the ball on marketing our record and did not have strong European distribution so that hurt us in a different way. We will probably self release our next album and hire our own PR. To do so will take a min 10-20k out of pocket but that’s the trade off. We’ll own it all and hope to build off it. Anyway labels just pay bulk rates for radio and PR and get free interns to do all the work ha ha ….usually teenagers wide eyed and fresh out of high school. In the end if the guys in the band can pony up 20k, record themselves and hire the people to push it, it’s always better. Problem is labels know MOST musicians can’t afford that, and prey on the naïveté of making it and being broke. Again love your stuff. Hope we all cross paths or play on the same bill sometime. Cheers.
I’d love to rummage your wardrobe…..not a euphemism.
When someone writes performs and puts out a song/album then the writer/performer should have all rights full stop. It’s a shame there are snakes surrounding talent. It’s heartbreaking.
I only watch these videos for the first 5 seconds - love the way you sing your intros. So much harder than it looks!
That was really interesting. More industry talk please
Music is the same as writing books, the internet was supposed to take away the need for gatekeepers (agents + publishing houses) and authors were going to make more. Instead even those with good deals, and I have a decent deal, don't get much whilst distributors, agents, and publishers take the lions' share.
Coming from someone who has never even gotten close to finishing a song; it's good to know that if i ever do that I've got someone like Justin Hawkins spitting no nonsense facts to keep me from being royally fucked by piggish businessmen
Brilliant! This is true of pretty much every industry these days.
One of your best show. Thanks for doing all that research