Why the Katy Perry/Flame lawsuit makes no sense
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- Опубліковано 1 сер 2019
- Katy Perry just lost a $2.8 million dollar court case against Christian rapper Flame. The case hinged on the testimony of the plaintiff’s expert musicologist Todd Decker.
Legal opinions on the case, and a link to the initial brief
blogs.law.gwu.edu/mcir/case/m...
Things that sound like Dark Horse/Joyful Noise (but aren’t)
• ART OF NOISE: MOMENTS...
• 05 Incoming Boss - Sup...
The Switched on Pop Tweet/thread that a lot of these examples came from
/ 1156248427132383233
Musicologist testifies against Katy Perry
www.digitalmusicnews.com/2019...
• What does war sound li...
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Peace,
Adam
He didn't throw shade. He threw the whole palm tree at Todd Decker
yes he did
He deserve it
No, he actually thrown the entire Amazon rainforest
@Ann Coulter Is Right how? can you elaborate? preferably with an elaborate and eloquent video like this one :)
@Ann Coulter Is Right lol it's because the jury doesn't have a single clue as to what all of the case meant. Do you even understand what this video is pointing at?
I once sued a coworker because his farts sounded similar to mine
Richard Paulus do you have recorded proof of the fart sound so that you can sue successfully? /s
@@kingkv3 of course. I record all of my farts on audio. I also put them all in jars just in case my team of lawyers need to take them to a lab for testing.
Richard Paulus relatable
if it was in the USA, totally possible lawsuit.
JayFeather why are you getting so offended wtf
The jury's verdict has been finally reversed in May 2020.
this should be higher in the comment thread
Thank God. This shit is insane
Yeeeeessssssss!!!!!
For now, the case is not over
did she still pay of sumn
New Rule: All music copyright infringement cases must have a jury consisting of musicians, engineers, composers, etc. as those would truly be the peers of both the plaintiff and defendant!
I 100% support this. Getting brain washed by a biased "musicologist" makes no sense to me.
Yeah, I've thought this for many years, it's a good point. This always comes into play with cases that involve so called "expert knowledge", which just means the knowledge that any "practitioner", even an amateur, should possess. It's certainly not limited to just music, but arises often in all the creative media.
With criminal cases, a jury of "peers" from the general population is integral to concepts of fairness and social justice, so the Finders of Fact (jury) must be taken from the population at large. But in expert cases, shouldn't the Finders of Fact BE experts? I've thought ever since I realized that in most cases they are not, probably when I was 8 years old or something.
But people like this Musicologist are paid superbly to form a set of "facts" that their Employers can use to make their case. "Truth" is fairly inconsequential to the Process itself. That doesn't really seem cool.
How can you possibly make a decision in this case, unless you are knowledgeable about the Lore, the Body-of-Work that represents the State of the Art in creative music? That is to say, KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT THE HISTORY OF WRITTEN MUSIC OF THIS TYPE AND OTHERS. If one person turns to a novice jury and says "Oh, yes, it does use the same 4/4 time signature as Piece A... but so do most of the songs ever written." That's when the classic squinty-eyed old juror says "Ooooooooh, I didn't know thaaaaat.......well, I guess that changes things doesn't it? Theeey didn't tell us thaaaaaat, young man." And so on.
@@bladebaron9351 I absolutely agree with you but I'm somewhat alarmed that the defence didn't seem to have one or more expert witnesses of their own saying exactly what this video says, complete with previous similar examples. I would have thought that most non-musicians just seeing this short video would be inclined to throw out the case.
Having said that, an entire industry shouldn't be hurled into turmoil because one defence in one case was seriously lacking.
that is not how the fake law system works
No one is assured a jury of their peers unless it's a George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin situation
Everybody knows Lil John invented the phrase “yeah” in 2003
Actually, ‘yeah’ would most likely be intellectual property of a mr Layne Staley. Lil John stole it and now mr Staley’s estate will be suing mr John for royalties on every single ‘yeah’ he ever uttered.
Fuff Mcduffin as a juror representing on this case who doesn’t understand any of the jargon you just typed, I rule in favor of the one you are presiding
Oh also OVERRULED! Hehe I just wanted to say that!
@@McDuffin Pursuant to the suit filed by Mr. Staley's estate, the current owner of the Beatles catelouge will be filing their own motion. When they receive their settlement they will love you, yeah, yeah, yeah!!
*james hetfield
“That’s actually Bach” You destroyed the whole case right there.
Leoben I laughed so hard! 🤣🤣🤣
I'm a bit slow, sorry didn't get this 🤔
I have to disagree, in fact I think Adam did something very deceptive. He played it with a similar rhythmic feel, tempo, and timbre to the two songs in discussion, but that is not actually how that Bach music sounds. He reduces the entire comparison to just melody, and then just states later that all the other tonal features aren't similar enough either. But it's not every feature individually, it's the combination together that makes it too close to the original song. In addition, none of the other examples he found are ostinatos, nor do they repeat nearly as many times as in these two songs. Honestly, I think Adam dressed up his fairly simplistic analysis in elevated language to make it appear more convincing than it was.
Jack Barbey aaaaa, so where do I direct my internet anger at now?? 😝
@@jackbarbey
"Adam dressed up his fairly simplistic analysis in elevated language to make it appear more convincing than it was."
So did Todd, and that was his point.
How bad must Katy Perry's lawyers have been that they couldn't come up with the same examples used in this video and make the plaintiff look foolish?
They just fished around in the couch cushions and came up with the 2.8 mil just to make the dude go away.
I was wondering just that. Who the hell did they hire?
Lionel Hutz, attorney at law! No. Money down!
Celebrity Lawyers arent human
"Kinda dangerous." Adam Neely giving a lesson on the art of understatement. I've never heard of Todd Decker before and what I think about him after watching this video cannot be repeated in public.
Dare you to say Todd Decker 3 times in front of a mirror..
You have to wonder if TD has seen this video...
He sure is a forgetful little man
@@effsixteenblock50he has lol and he hates it, the whole washu music department got lots of hate mail from this video
A law suit over a two bar, straight quarter note pattern with only three notes. What a time to be alive.
When those couple notes kinda make the whole song tho...
Kinda like the Under pressure bassline. If it's catchy enough to be associated with one song, then years later done by another song...welp.
@@guitargeekette exactly
@jmarks881 But the bassline is not really what forms the memorable part. It's all about that synth running through the song. Many many songs share the same notes and progressions, but some guitar lines/synth lines/piano lines etc are so easily recognizable and play such a big part in the recognition of the song overall, that if anyone else does that after, it can be easily identified as a copy.
Christians are sure they go to heaven cuz Jesus right?! so they do whatever the shit they want to, including doing this laughable case. Sorry all true Christians, your peers make you look damn bad
@@guitargeekette I don't agree at all. Have you actually listened to the two songs? It's not even the exact same synth pattern. And it's not such an outlandish pattern that two producers couldn't come up with it seperately. I mean, what's next? Trap rappers suing each other over using the triplet flow and 32nd note hihat patterns? Somebody copyrighting the I-vi-IV-V and its variations and suing every pop musician on the planet? This is laughable.
Even if you were to say that Dark Horse copied Joyful Noise, whether consciously or unconsciously, there is A LOT more going on in the Katy Perry song than that ostinato. It actually starts out with a totally different synth pattern, there's a different chord progression and bassline, and there are actual melodies in the verse and chorus. As Rick Beato said, you could award Flame with maybe 10 or 15% of the royalties, but 100% is just absolutely laughable. It's just an unknown mediocre rapper cashing in on somebody else's success. Similar to what the Marvin Gaye estate has been doing the last couple of years.
Same as with the Zeppelin/Spirit case.
Could you imagine if country music people started suing each other over this?
or Reggae or Soca, or tecno, or heavy metal -- that's why it is called a genre
country musicians are at each other’s throats for using the same key change
The universe would implode!
Or blues lmao. Blues music is probably the most “sue-able” of them all if this case is any indication.
Oh... they all know, and laugh all the way to the bank...
ua-cam.com/video/FY8SwIvxj8o/v-deo.html
In the appeal, judge recently ruled said that a copyright over this would amount “to allowing an improper monopoly over two-note pitch sequences or even the minor scale itself, especially in light of the limited number of expressive choices available when it comes to an eight-note repeated musical figure”. Great to hear a judge understanding the magnitude of the copyright.
Judges are (generally) rather intelligent people. Of course they'd understand the issues a copyright like this would cause.
Arguments like Todd's would be devastating for the whole blues culture.
Jazz as well, it kills the entire idea of building off of a standard without being immediately exposed to a lawsuit.
" Imagine if someone could own a word"
*gets react bros flashbacks*
Why? They weren't claiming the word.
Black people own a word.
Can buy a vowel? I don't want to own a word. I want the letter "e". Muwahaha! This lawsuit reminds me of a diaper I saw once. Even better, can I copyright the color blue?
@@LVRN-qj7kr So true.
Also Kim Kardashian’s “Kimono” Clothing line.
What is wrong Katy Perry's lawyers that they can't construct an argument like this one?
They should have played this video in court😂
@Rata 4U that is the most bullshit thing I have ever heard.
This week
Stupid people keep saying stupid shit
Rata 4U were you on the jury - because that is the kind of stupid that would award the case to Flame - 🤦♂️
Rata 4U first off we’re talking about copyright law, not patent law. That 70 years thing is more or less accurate for copyright law, though I think it’s life of the author plus 77 years. I may be off, it’s been awhile since I took communication law in college. This video is arguing that what the plaintiff did was not unique enough to be copyrightable and I think he makes a great argument there. What the plaintiff claimed to have owned has been in the public domain for centuries, and is too insignificant to really count. On that first part, if I made a Snow White movie, Disney could not sue me for copyright infringement. Snow White was always in the public domain, and them making a Snow White movie does not give them ownership of the story, like you are arguing. And on the later point about significance, I think the video makes a better argument than I could in a comment.
@@jacencade4019 if it's that stupid then please don't try to hurt him. Maybe he hurts a lot already. Please just say why it's wrong
Thank you for posting this. As a songwriter/artist seriously planning on marketing my music, it makes me nervous to see these lawsuits coming out where people are losing because the "vibe" is too close. It honestly makes me afraid to think that I'll spend thousands of dollars to record and market a song, only to have some unknown artist sue me. If more of these silly lawsuits come out I hope that you'll keep making these videos and standing up for creatives
Broken justice system brings ridiculous results.
This reminds me of the time I sent an essay of mine through plagiarism checking software and it came back that I strung together the same 7 words as someone else when they published their paper on a different topic… in the 80s 😂
*This just in: Bach comes back from the grave to sue Flame for sampling his violin sonata in f minor*
Breaking news: Pythagoras also comes back from the dead to sue Bach for using fifths. He is also to sue every mathematician for using the Pythagorean theorem.
@@craigsimpson1230 Not sure the jury is in on that. His music is in the public domain because he is believed to be dead for more than [insert number depending in legal framework of copyright in your country] years. In a scenario where the dead come alive again, this believe is wrong and he is currently not dead for that number of years. In the post apocalyptic zombie hellscape of returning dead people, that would be a court case to watch closely... But I think the plaintive, Zombie Bach, should be paid.
Why do I see you everywhere
Craig Simpson it was a joke
This just in: The big bang is suing everything for making sound.
Imagine copyrighting your own DNA so you can sue all of your offspring for living if you wanted to 🤔
Sergio lazaro mejía 99% of our DNA is common to all of us, so if you did that you could copyright everyone for living!!! 🤔
BEWARE THE REPO MAN.
Technically, you are the one that's copying yourself, so that won't work.
If someone else started using your DNA without permission however... that would be a cool sci-fi flick.
I copyrighted your comment.
*I'll see you in court.*
Careful, don't give them ideas.
When I first watched this I knew very little about music, but watching it again now I realise how laughably absurd Decker's claim is. Imagine trying to claim that a certain painter was the first to use red and green together, and now they legally own that colour combination
One of the first songs I ever wrote when I started playing guitar was a simple 4 chord, 6/8 time signature, song in the key of C. I played it for my mom, who is a music education major, but would have been a performance major if it weren’t for an injury to her left arm half way through her sophomore year. She liked it and said as much at first but remarked later that she had heard the chord progression before (in that time signature). While she meant this not with the intention of discouragement, it illustrated to me the reality of how finite the number of chord progressions there are and the pertinence of individual playing styles and melodic composition in distinguishing ones individual artistic expression from another’s. Granted my fundamental understanding of music composition and terminology is very limited still I hope this makes some level of sense. Just figured I’d share a thought 🤷♂️
The year 2030: Musician sued for using a snare drum. Jury awards damages.
2023: Sued for singing horribly in a song, just like this other song
"I have never heard this snare drum being played on beat 2 and 4 in two songs before"
Sued for blowing a flute
2035: musician sued for rhyming words
And the musician was sentenced to death.
Katy Perry must hire Adam Neely and sue rapper flame and Todd Decker.
Well, maybe ... if you can fill the jury with academic musicologists.
@@banjopink4409 i'm not an academic musicologist and I was able to follow the video perfectly well
@@scottrainey2375 OK. So we stuff the jury with clones of you ... just so long as there's no normies capable of being misled by snake-oil hustlers
Neely and Beato would be the dream team...
@@banjopink4409 Perfectly clear to me and I have zero knowlege of music theory. All that's needed are eyes and ears, the comparisons to earlier music was enough to blow the case out of court, and I'm certain your average 12 year old could follow that with ease.
If you struggled with that I suspect you are the one in the minority.
The verdict was overturned on appeal on the March 16, 2020.
US District Court judge Christina A Snyder said "It is undisputed in this case" that the ostinato was "not a particularly unique or rare combination."
Adam, what a great video! Thanks for putting this together. I'll share it with my classes.
I feel like you're gonna become the anti-industry lawsuit guy, and I'm so for this.
@Pompous Psycho That's the point though. Keyword, "Unwillingly". It's not about whether anyone's a fan or not. It's about what makes sense.
We should be so lucky...
It is, in fact, the point. In the legal system, hearsay testimony is generally not accepted. One of a small list of exceptions is called 'testimony against interest'.
I don't know if that fits this legally or not, but it gets the idea across.
That's what real hackers do,, expose the falsity of the establishment. If were paying attention watching the film "The Matrix" hackers reveal the truth to the world so that people can choose to think for themselves and not be told what to believe, I think and say.
Never too late for social media to rescue us from insanity, Red Pill that shit...
@@lukasalihein, Sorry - you can't say that any more. Kylie will sue.
Just In: Katy Perry sued by the zoo for copyright infringement by using animals sounds in Roar!
Bruh 😂
The opening sounds very similar to _Brave_ by Sara Bareilles...she just laughed it off and moved on, no lawsuit or whatever against Perry or anyone else involved in making _Roar._
@@an_impasse That's because Brave was hugely successful while Joyful Noise was not.
It could happen, even I got a copyright claim on one of my videos for a seagull noise playing in the background in a video game. Copyrighted by freaking ambient nature sounds in a game. The person trying to claim one of my unlisted videos had done an album of nature noises, so it sounded like it belonged to them.
And now it's been overturned! That's a win for music, if you ask me.
Update: the win for Flame has been overturned. Only the Supreme Court at this point can keep the case alive (so a win for Perry).
So by this logic... they better sue Santa and Moses too lmao
Or sue the guy who is suing Katy Perry for copying Moses and Santa
I love how this implies Santa & Moses wrote those songs, it’s just so funny to imagine Santa going “hmmm that song Moses made sounds great...”
And Godzilla...
And Bach
@mike sixx
Get the fuck out of here you shit faced troll getting paid by Russians.
What’s kind of amazing in this case is also how much Katy Perry’s team dropped the ball with the defense. I threw together this video in less than a week. They had 4 years.
they probably didnt think they lived in a universe stupid enough they could lose.
Heads up to musicians, hire Neely and Beato for your case.
good point. almost unbelievable
Why wouldn't you play the two licks back to back?
Someone needs to introduce Katy to you...
As soon as I heard it, I immediately went to "Moments in Love". Maybe Art of Noise has a case against Flame?
I am so glad you exist Adam, thank you for everything you do.
Music copyright trolling is ridiculous. This is like copyrighting the use of the color blue in a visual artwork.
Some artist actually did copyright some colors (ie: the blackest black)
And Cadbury purple
Yep. Over the years some 'rights' to old songs, ditties and even what would amount to nursery rhymes come into 'ownership' of faceless corporations. Do a web search on 'Men at Work', 'Downunder' and 'kookaburra sits in the old Gum tree's, one flute section in that song saw the band taken to the cleaners by 'rights owners' decades after either song was released. This video ably demonstrates the absurdities, seems Katy Perry's legal team was lacking. Is there an appeal process for such a decision?
Well copyright trollers do exist.
copiright law is a joke.
a joke made by these corporations, fuck them all.
When he finally said this is Katy Perry's dark horse, I almost didn't believe him
🤣🤣🤣
Mee tooo😂😂😂
Hahaha
fr, that got really annoying after the second one
@@lachlanstory9929 You must be easily annoyed.
Well, "Men at Work" were sued over the flute riff in "Down Under" by the owners of the copyright to "Kookaburra sits in the old gum tree"
Nice video!! Interesting that this totally spurious lawsuit should have been overturned, Katy got lucky, or a competent judge 2nd time around.
Maybe Colin Hay (of Men at Work) should seek another trial. I'm referring to one of the most embarrassing episodes in Australia's legal history.
In June 2009, 28 years after the release of the recording of Men at Works song Down Under, Larrikin Music sued Men
at Work for copyright infringement, alleging that part of the flute riff of "Down Under" was copied from "Kookaburra"
(a children's nursery rhyme known to all and widely thought to be in the public domain).
The flute riff included a musical 4-bar quote which had no doubt been initially played off the cuff at a live gig sometime
but had come to be incorporated into the song as an essential element of "Australian-ness", and recorded with it in as is.
The art of musical quoting other pieces of music dates back centuries and is widely practiced in jazz (and sometimes even rock)
so I'm really not sure how it even came to be in court - imagine if a publisher of a pop song from the 40s tried to sue
Dexter Gordon for doing one of his innumerable quotes. It would have been - quite rightly - laughed out of court.
However the Men at Work defense team, instead of stating;
"Yes it's a musical quote, and correct, not much point if no-one recognises it is there?!" they for whatever reason tried to
argue that is wasn't intentional, or it wasn't that song, or was already in the public domain (a fairly valid argument as
well as it happens). Anyway they lost something that should never have even got to court, Larrikin music is now much
despised and has since changed their name, Greg Ham (the flute player) died not long after, and the legal system in Australia
is now widely recognised as the farce it is, not least because the High Court of Australia declined to hear the appeal (and missed
a golden opportunity to be seen as doing something constructive).
For stupid music court cases it takes some beating - despite thousands of instances of musical "quoting" by instrumentalists I
cannot think of another that has ended up in court.
Oh and the amount awarded; 5% of royalties from 2002. Millions. Take-away? Greed pays - sue.
“Imagine if someone could own a word”
Kim Kardashian: hold my Kimono
What about The react brothers?
Didn't Paris Hilton attempt to copyright "that's hot"? Pretty sure she was denied that the same reason this should've thrown out of court.
Well, there are several examples: Some sports announcers have a phrase that no one else can use and blacks have the "N" word. There are others, so you don't have to imagine.
LOL
Bitch
If I ever become a musician and get sued, I'm using you as my expert witness.
My civil procedure professor is an expert witness and makes SO MUCH FUCKING MONEY, if he gets into this realm he could make a lot of money especially if he is testifying for defendants with huge pockets.
Why didn't Katy Perry get Adam Neely as an expert witness?
You'd had to be innocent though
What if that's the one time that he decides it was plagiarized 🤔🤔🤔
@@ignacioandresv3170 Evidently not as this law suit has just shown us.
My favorite channel at the moment! You're so good, thank you!
at 5:21 Art of Noise, Moments in Love....was sounding in my head from start of this vid, glad it is included (sampled )
If this is the case, every 90's rapper should be sued by every 70's soul artists.
true, but only if the song makes money. there is no need to sue if the song is a dud and it made no revenue. the ploy for sampling is to sample, knowing it is wrong, to try to get your song noticed and make enough revenue to get something out of your recording after the lawsuit. who wants to pay for permission of the usage of another's work and then make no money off of it. life is full of taking chances to make money.
Axle Grind Wrong, wrong, and wrong. Sampling isnt for greedy opportunists, its a tool for expression and reflection. They are used to add detail, contribute to the album's storyline, comedic value, etc. Take any hip-hop or rap album that employs skits to tell a story or be comedic. Sampling is beneficial for music, not for corrupt financial-based schemes. There is a huge difference between stealing a song and sampling a conversation, subway train, TV shows, etc. You needa educate yourself.
@@bluewuppo Also, they get permission. But, you're not wrong at all mate.
@@bluewuppo he obviously wasn't referring to sampling a conversation on the subway... Moot point at it's finest. Sampling a tracks melody effectively makes your track a remix which you need clearance for, yeah sometimes you'll get away with it but if the tracks blow up expect to lose most of your royalties for being dishonest as fuck...
@@bencastor9207 Dishonest? Are you kidding me? Literally any musician worth their salt knows what you're saying is brain dead.
I'm a little disappointed that the whole video was not just him going "wait, that wasn't kary perry, this is katy perry.." over and over again
over and over again? You can't use that it's been copyrighted to Nelly & Tim Mcgraw.
@@UKRAku damn!! My comment just got demonetized
I don't know what the FUCK you just said, Little Kid, but you're special man, you reached out, and you touch a brother's heart.
That was rather annoying to me lol
Pronte sorry but the word demon**ised is copyrighted by you know who
i've been looking for that art of noise sample for ages.... thank you
You are so awesome. If I ever get sued for copyright infringement, I'm hiring you as my musicology expert. Love your channel.❤❤❤
It’s interesting that Katy Perry’s attorney couldn’t find someone anyone as knowledgeable as Adam Neeley.
What the hell were they thinking?
Get her back in the news?
They knew exactly what they were doing.
Someone didn't read the court documents 🤷♂️
Rick Beato broke this down in a different way but same conclusion.
My thoughts exactly.
2018: "You can't own chords"
2019: "You can't own the minor scale"
2020: You can't own the chromatic scale
2021: You can't own the western music notation
2022: "you can't own a note"
2020: "You can't own rhythms"
2021: "You can't own pitches"
2022: "You can't own quarter notes"
2023: "You can't own bar lines"
2024: "You can't own the idea of computers"
2025: "You can't own the idea of music"
@@weee50 2026: "You can't own sound"
@@marchesi07 2022: "Jazz pianist fined for failure to sufficiently pay Warner's per-interval royalty for music tuned equal temperament."
Adam thanks for making this video. Seems like Katy defense attorney should have hired you to counter the case. Great work. Love your channel and bass playing.
When you mentioned Art of Noise it finally clicked for me why it felt like your synth was so familiar.
It's one of the most famous Fairlight presets, ARR1.
"Wait a sec you can't do that."
"Why not?"
I _own_ Piano.
Jokes on you
You cant tell me not to play piano because you own it...
*If I own vocal communications*
Batman's Pet Goldfish well i own the Yamaha DX7!
He claimed that 45% of dark horse was copyrighted and that he should get 45% of the money earned by PRISM
The entire album
Dark Horse is one song.
He's money hungry and it shows
Peyton James Christian my ass, dude just trying to squeeze as much as he can out of this.
Yeah. Exactly.
He’s just a piece of shit.
I wonder how much the "expert" Todd Decker gets from that.
To be honest that song was probably the main reason for album sales though.
xPorsum roar was even more popular than dark horse
You are an encyclopedia, Adam. I learn something every time I watch your videos. And I'd like to think I know a thing or 2! Thank you for sharing your knowledge, information and insight. You are a force!
I learned a lot about music with just two of your video!! My respect in your knowledge and way of explaining what music really is!! Thanks 🙏
I am a musicologist. These musicologists give a bad name to the profession. This lawsuit is ridiculous.
You ain't shit except an overweight old hag
@@user-ei9ns9hq6b You are a very stupid human being. Probably one of the juries in this stupid lawsuit. Hell, you might be related to the idiot musicologist who was called as an expert.
@@user-ei9ns9hq6b what the fuck is wrong with you? Are you ten?
@@user-ei9ns9hq6b I'm sorry for whatever pain you've suffered that motivates you to waste all our time typing something like that. I hope you find something positive that helps you find joy in doing good.
@@user-ei9ns9hq6b eat a couple more pieces of vegan goodness and sort yourself out
Katy should sue Todd Decker for not doing his research and she should bring up these songs
agreed
You cannot sue a witness.
I'm not a fan of her and don't even listen to her music but such unfair outrageous lawsuits need to be clamped down on
@@neurofiedyamato8763 Agreed
Her legal team completely fucking failed her. Like, what was she even paying them for?!
The "pingy, artificial sound" is originally from Laurie Anderson, 1984.
THANK YOU! I was trying to remember the name of the song and artist and I knew you would find Moments in Love by Art of Noise. Been searching for this for years
I'm gonna copyright A 440hz and sue everyone.
That's ok, I'm usually out of tune.
Sorry, we only play A 432 Hz with pythagorean tuning nowadays.
Then the 432hz people would finally have an actual purpose for using the right frequencies.
4/4 dibs!
I call dibs on the perfect fifth, you can't use it or anything approximating it or I sue
"Imagine a big corporate entity being able to own a word"
Fine Bros: copyrights the word "react"
Wasn't it a trademark though? Pretty sure you can't copyright single words.
You can copyright phrases. Firms do it all the time.
They call em 'slogans'
apparently you can own two words in the czech republic: www.google.com/search?q=upec+treba+zed
@@ryanfoltz1276 But those words & slogans are only copyright within specific and very limited fields. A slogan for a brand of kitchen cleaner, for example, could be used to advertise a car, without fear of infringement.
"You're fired."
What a pleasure to hear someone say things like they really are! Thank you, Mr. Neely!
Adam - you totally nailed this! Thanks for posting!!
i bet, when the jury was selected, anyone with a musical background was rejected by plaintiff's council
Which is ironic, because if one is entitled to a trial by a jury OF THEIR PEERS, be it a criminal or civil trial, then the jury should have been ENTIRELY COMPOSED OF PEOPLE WHO HAD AN UNDERSTANDING OF MUSICAL COMPOSITION.
Robert Kennedy sound logic but in practice I think by peers they meant average civillians.
I’m pretty sure they rejected anyone with a brain
Spot on with that comment!
Jurors that are informed on the subject are often weeded out. If a learned juror gets through selection, they could introduce defacto expert testimony neither side gets to examine as well as introduce facts not entered into evidence.
I'm so glad people like you and Rick Beato are shedding some light on how outrageous these lawsuits are
Nothing is going to change sadly
I agree
It is good for this stupidity to be brought to light. However, I would be happier if the videos on these were not monetised, as they are also making income off the backs of other peoples music. How ironic!
@@brin57 i think they are making money on behalf of the insight he's offering, not on the music itself
Singers and songwriters can make some "joyful noise" now that a federal appeals court has now confirmed that Perry didn't infringe on Flame's copyright. All three judges unanimously agreed that "The portion of the ‘Joyful Noise’ ostinato that overlaps with the ‘Dark Horse’ ostinato consists of a manifestly conventional arrangement of musical building blocks ... Allowing a copyright over this material would essentially amount to allowing an improper monopoly over two-note pitch sequences or even the minor scale itself."
This sensible ruling protects the right of all artists to freely make use of basic musical building blocks that are rightfully in the public domain, just like individual words or common idioms in the English language. Good job explaining this case!
Your work is astonishing. You’re so pro, I truly admire your mind/knowledge 😧
You need to contact Katie Perry for her appeal and request a large commission lol
He would, if he could spell her name properly. JK.
@@stephendevore Her name is actually spelled Katy,,,
Katy not Katie! 🙄😬😑
I agree except for the Commission part- she has a good appeal with this evidence. Not that it wasn't obvious at the time that the suit was solely a result of religious bigotry on the part of the plaintiff and had little to do with the riff..
"bruh you can't just own a sound" *copyrights the lick*
oh god
I'm gonna copyright C4. Take that.
@@hansfranz8795 I'm going to copyright the tambre of the human voice. You better not speak, or you're going to hear from my lawyers!
@@hansfranz8795 I'm gonna copyright the concept of music
I just copyrighted Eb11 so nobody can abuse it ever again.
ahahahaha literally laughed at that soon forgotten lyrics, you're a champ adam!
The biggest problem has always been, that lawmakers do not understand the nuances of the art industry. And though the assumption is that they will argue their case in a way that explains the nuances, we clearly end up with cases that set precedent in a really unfortunate way. A jury of your peers, we’re no one on the jury is expected to understand music theory.
This guy should have been Katy Perry’s lawyer
Asher Barnsdale he actually ended up being hired by media to represent those rights, and then got sued by the Katy Perry representatives
@@nicholasrevill6610 lmao what, for real?
@@keralis12 yup, he did another video 2 months later explaining everything
@@nicholasrevill6610 What? Can you provide a link to that video/source please? Are you sure you aren't talking about the false copyright claim from Warner/Chappell? Because a copyright strike on UA-cam and a lawsuit are completely different things
@@GoldenMaverick3 ua-cam.com/video/KM6X2MEl7R8/v-deo.html
The part where you "mistook" other songs for Katy Perry's was clever.
I think he was also pointing out that a ton of songs use the same thing.
@@kleeklee4572 thats the point
Yeah, the second he did the first "Oh nope just kidding" I was like "Oh there are totally going to be several and this is going to be such a satisfying making of the point"
@@kleeklee4572 no shit Sherlock
@Shyru#Celestial-Master that's not being a smartass, it's just proving his point that Katy Perry shouldn't have lost the lawsuit
I was just listening to 20 Thousand Hertz' episode on music copyright and kept thinking "Man, Adam Neely would be such a good guest for this episode". It was a really nice surprise when you did show up, though it made sense when Dallas said the entire episode was inspired by this video :)
I agree that copyright lawsuits can deviate from the copyright goal when money interests kicks in and that any authority trying to own any musical thing is a threat to the art of Music.
Actually, the problem is far worse:
if in centuries copying and plagiarism are coming to a point that people notice more and more similarities between artists and bands overtime...
We the bands, artists, music specialists, sound enginers, etc. have a need to discuss all together (be in many groups of people scattered around the world or in every realist way possible) about what musical concepts can help prevent it to escalate to a seemingly unsolvable point.
In an era of existencial crisis with high technological means and a lot of available info / knowledge, we have to give us the tools to keep between FREEWILL that prevents obscurantism to happen and INSTRUCTIONS that we can follow to encourage us to take harder musical paths.
Creativity is not an issue nowadays; it's our lack of understanding about creativity and our lazyness.
I want that to make sense for you, as every art needs thinking about its transformations and evolutions.
I won't blame the artists who are inspired, nor those whose team is inspired and make the music sounds like someone else more or less.
I just blame that it can't last for too long...
Not when the solution comes with thought, something that some people are still very able to do.
Come on, nobody's willing to be stupid. Life can be rough and complicated, that's all.
I love how I’m watching this pretending like I know and understand everything he’s saying
I mean he explains it...it's not really hard to understand
Lol what's difficult to understand? Are you 12?
faroshscale it’s more that there’s a lot of words new to those of us with no knowledge of music theory (? i assume what this is?) and while i personally understand what he’s saying - he’s very good at explaining! - i can’t for the life of me explain this to someone else coherently
faroshscale I’m talking about the terminology, not the concept....
Damn these people got salty at you really quick, from a non musical background a lot of the words, terminology this guy used can come across as being a bit confusing, yall need to c h i l l
Can wait until UMG takes down your video where you defend them
lmao
they actually didn't for some reason
This comment is fucking gold
Everybody gangsta til this happens
This fucking happened!!
Music copyright lawsuits should be mandated to have juries of Music Theory experts
All your videos rock for a variety of reasons; this one for its courage and integrity.
“Think about what you did here-you convinced a jury that the idea of quarter notes descending in a minor scale from the 3rd degree originated in 2008 with Christian rapper _Flame_ ” … absolutely dead 😂😂😂😂😂
Ro F Right? Horrendous!🤦♀️
To be fair I don’t know much about music
Yeah especially when he showed all those old songs at the start that sound similar it makes me wonder how flame won now
Fame wishes he invented it, lol.
Isn't there a way to disprove that the testimony was truthful and that the witness should therefore not be considered in the verdict? Shouldn't this make it fall apart?
isn't it odd how in 2019 you'd use witchcraft and paganism as accusations in a law suit?
Reodora Purple
it's america, what did you expect?
Welcome to the modern world of Resident* Trump
*He's the place holder between out most recent President and the next one.
That's the whole 'what buzzwords can I throw in to upset the jurors?' strategy.
especially against a woman... i bet if katy were male none of that would have been brought up. sounds very witch trials if you ask me
I'm alright with christianity and with Christian music like gospel but what can you expect from "christian rap" - they're too crazy for christianity and rap
This MUST have had an effect on Katy winning the appeal! I hope you got the recognition for that!
This was an amazing video! AMAZING!
Igor Stravinsky: "Lesser artists borrow, great artists steal " these cases are potentially corporate destruction of musical creativity
Imagine Newton : I discovered gravity so don't use it OR pay me every time you use it
tbh i d prefer if he didnt invent it
Guess I'll fly ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Jabir Fatah no you dont
Jabir Fatah xD why do I feel like I’m the only one who new what you said was a joke?.
@@evillolipop2704 Dont worry I've already posted this crap to r/wooosh
"I hope that you were paid well, because you kind of sold us all out" - Genius, 2019
@Adam Neely Great video! Analyzing cases like this takes a thorough understanding of music, it's theory, composition, history, etc. and that is knowledge that most people (including many musicians) simply do not have . So when an "expert" gives testimony on a subject this complex, people tend to defer to it. You would make an excellent expert witness in cases like this Adam. Sounds like Katy Perry could've used you! 🙂
Guilty verdict now overturned and upheld 👍🏼
“It seems he has forgotten that phrase even when he wrote the book on the song” OH THE SHADE THE SHAAAAADDEEE
we are going to reach a point where even single notes are gonna be copyrighted
Great idea bro - Cx is mine!
Hell, while we're at it, let's give them Ab, Eb and Bb as well.
Then I lay claim to the highest C. If your glissando were to ever land on that key,
PAY UP BITCH.
Revolution!
We will ? On youtube you can copyright nothing XD !
This entire video reminded me of the similarity between the beginning part of 3Racha song Runners high and the NCT song Sit Down. I was just happy to hear that the similar tone could begin an entirely different song. Or the time Ateez used the exact same music to begin both Treasure and Precious. I referred to that example because to me, as just a lover of music, isn’t the beauty of music how just a few notes can sound similar but gives two completely different songs? I wish we would have more of a love for music and not money. I hope it’s not an issue that i used Kpop songs as examples, im just more familiar to it and hope people could relate. Again, I am not commenting kpop in a totally unrelated video, but with pure reference to a particular riff like in this video.
I was waiting to hear Art of Noise with that synth sound you were using
Katy failed the moment she didn't hire you in her defense team.... Don't be like Katy y'all.
Always hire Neely.
We need Adam as the expert witness for the defense, led by chief legal council - D James Stone, AKA LegalEagle here on UA-cam
Add Rick Beato too
@@meme3796 hmmm, nah he ain't cool enough
She would have had a chance ----- UNLESS everyone in the jury, the judge and opposing counsel were Christians heavily influenced by the swarmy Christian evangelists and other fascist thought. Just saying.
I've copyrighted the note of B flat, so any song that has that note can and will be sued
Shit, rip every middle school band
Aww crap cant play my B flat clarinet anymore, guess I'll fail band
No! My Bb concert scale warmup! (I don't know why I am attached to this but I am.) Also, no! My Bb clarinet! That means I can't play it! I shall fail and I cannot have that. Literally almost every song we play has Bb in it.
You’ll never take my trombone alive!
I love your profile 😂
Such great points. Art and especially music is so misunderstood. Hopefully we find more people taking a scientific approach to what creativity in music is. It's probably not one aspect such as a note or chord sequence but the different configurations of sound. Imagine if someone tried to copyright a chord sequence. Pop would be dead or owned by a mega Corp....
I didn't recognize any of those until you played Godzilla and immediatley started laughing, half out of how funny it was that even Godzilla weighs in on this one, and out of delight for getting one right within the first three notes.
The music industry is being destroyed by a musicologist.
Katy Perry is destroying music by copying other artists. Don't get it twisted.
Love is the answer I love your answer : )
I'm guessing you guys didn't finish watching this video
LoveIsTheAnswer but she’s not. This would be the equivalent of a painter trying to sue another painter because they both paint trees, Or they both used red or something. It’s ridiculous. You can’t own the building blocks of music. You don’t want to live in a world like that.
@@passionfly1 Do you not understand or watch the fucking video?
"imagine if somebody owned a word"
Example: "react"
The shade @ the finebros
There is a joint ownership of the word "superhero" by DC and Marvel.
Ok i have one for you. Apple.
deepweeb dive that’s much different than the word “react.” Droid is just a shortened version of the word “android,” and it is often associated with the Star Wars films.
Kylie Jenner trying to the word Kylie
One photography teacher told me, even if you think it was your idea, for sure unconsciously you heard or saw or had a contact with that (what ever is that) during your life, but you don't know when or even remember, inspiration comes from everywhere.
yes exactly, and that's good and important because you can't just come up with totally new ideas, you just alterate and reiterate on the stuff that came before. and just by coincidence, some things will turn out very similar, that doesn't mean you stole something just because the inspiration might be obvious in some places.
And this is WHY the idea that everything has to be decided by a jury of non-expert laypersons is a TERRIBLE idea. If a jury is to decide this matter, the jury should consist of musicians, lyricists, sound engineers, producers and composers. It is INSANE that we are letting people with no musical knowledge decide on these delicate matters.
*Todd Decker is musicologist*
Adam Neely: I'm gonna end this man's career.
Good.
Fingers crossed
*bout to end this man's whole career.*
Oh! Good! I approve!
More like
Todd Decker: is a musicologist
Todd Decker: I'm gonna end this man's whole career
Brb, off to copyright 12 bar blues.
Fine, but the II V I is all $MINE$
*Robert Johnson wants to know your location*
Hate to break it to y’all but I officially own the key of A.
Oof, is this a bad time to mention that the octave belongs to me?
Sorry man, I did that last week, should've been faster
UPDATE THIS KING
As a person who spent a lot of time in clubs when I was young , every night at this one local club they played Art of Noise song Moments in Love and couples slow danced. The song is very memorable because of the beat. The first time I heard Dark Horse I turned to my sister and said that sounds like Moments in Love. I never knew that over 100 other people had used Moments in Love as well. If you have never heard moments in love you should. It is a very cool piece of music. It is so obvious that I immediately recognized it as Moments in Love. Obvious like Vanilla Ice and Queen with Under pressure.