No. People aren't sick of superheroes. They're sick of movies about characters they've never heard of. Phase 4 and 5 mostly centered on the types of characters that wouldn't even appear in 90's video games. Man-Thing, Moon Knight, Ms.Marvel, G'aia, America Chavez, Wong, Shang Chi and Antman are not fan favorite characters of the main stream audiences. The characters we learned to love and follow were aged up, killed, replaced or retired. Oh but what about Loki? What ABOUT Loki? You can't mean him interacting with Hunter B-15, Mobius, and OB? These aren't really characters that had layers or depth beyond their place in that show. They're Loki's co-workers. And the characters we wanted to see interact with him, like Sylvie, barely did. There is no *Marvel Fatigue*, just disjointed projects and characters that don't hold a candle to Hulk, Cap, Ironman, Thor, Hawkeye or Black Widow.
"all of those things you said were incorrect because I don't have media literacy and can't be bothered to understand anything that isn't the sound of my last two braincells clanking together, if it's not the same video of baby shark that I've watched every day for the last five years, I don't wanna see it, only familiar things forever! What is that well written characters that feel things and grow? Get that stuff outta here! Imma big manly man and my emotional constipation is proof of that! I don't feel sissy things like 'sadness' or 'joy' or 'the inexplicable feeling of contentment when a loved one wants your presence in their life' .... I'm so lonely someone please love me...." There! I fixed your comment for you!❤
People are sick of seeing people make super hero videos on UA-cam. Especially when there is a small rumor. Every rumor doesn't need a 20 minute video with the same scenes. Every week a Loki video dropped you guys showed the same scenes from previous episodes. Watch. When Loki comes back in a future Marvel movie, they're going to show scenes from the Loki show to fill space. That is what makes people sick and tired.
@@Aeis_ArcadeScreenCrush hears a rumor about Jonathan Majors. Then they make a video showing the same scenes of him as Victor Timely and as He who remains in the Loki series.
I still love superheroes. I love Invincible and rewatching old MCU movies. You know why? Because the writing and characters (for the most part) are actually good.
@@Last-Scar-5675 Not really, hence the question of "Super Hero Fatigue"...if the Writing was still good enough to get people in the seats, these questions wouldn't have been raised in the 1st place, but here we are...
I used to work for a major animation studio for the director and producer and I can tell you without hesitation that it’s not only studio notes that cause problems but they reach out to people like Spielberg and many other directors with great resumes to watch their cuts and give their notes. Then they review all the notes and go back to tweak the film over and over and over. Protecting these projects is like a mother trying to shield her baby in an apocalypse where bombs are going off all around. And EVERYONE even remotely associated with the production is trying to get their voices heard. So until they can get the filmmakers the autonomy they need, this will not change.
It's not JUST autonomy, though. It's producers AND directors who both care about the quality of the STORY/universe. I love Lord & Miller, but when I heard how they were managing Solo, even I thought Kennedy was right to say no.
I'm not fatigued, I'm just frustrated that over the past several years, the stories aren't self contained. They are part of an arc that won't get resolved until the next film or series.
But comic book movies, at least with the MCU, have always been serialized storytelling, just like actual comic books. Look at the storyline with Thanos; his arc didn't get resolved for YEARS, and no one complained. Why? Because the movies were good. If Marvel started making good movies again, I'm sure people would be happy to resume the ride.
I can't think of any MCU movie that didn't tell a complete story for its main character. Maybe some lose threads to string into future titles, but nothing that breaks a story. Unlike SpiderVerse ending with "to be continued"
I think it's both for a lot of people. Bad writing, tired storyline, and character dev/portrayal (or lack of) is maybe slightly more than half the current problem, IMO. There is so much superhero content in movies and tv shows. And a lot of it just okay or passable to watch. If you made it all great tv/movies, it would still be too much of it. And I don't think the sports analogy works well. I get it, part of the sports analogy is made to stick up for people that love these movies/shows/comics/fandom. But people do think of fanatical fandom of a sports team as childish in some ways, it's just not a strong or prevalent of a concept. Lastly, if sports were creating new teams and leagues every other year, there would be fatigue or oversaturation of the market rel. to demand. And we have seen this with XFL, XFL part deux, Arena football, bikini football, NFL Europe, USFL, consolidation of minor league baseball, pro basketball outside of the NBA is non-existent for decades.
"Sports fans routinely dress as their heroes and gather together to watch grown men play a child's game with balls" The wildest quote I've heard all week LMAO I'M DYING
This is Screencrush’s best video. I felt very seen in this and I’m going to share it with anyone that tries to tell my that superhero fatigue is a thing. Thank you for making this ❤️
Werewolf by Night is a perfect example of subverting the superhero genre by introducing monsters, horror, style, creative directing, practicality, and no studio interference more of that would be nice
Ryan “There has never been a live action Fantastic Four film” Me “you sit on a throne of lies!” Great video mate, you and the team did fantastic job of explaining something that I personally agree with it isn’t just superhero fatigue, It is just general mediocre movie fatigue
We are tired of the bad and generic ones, I'd love another Logan, Gaurdians vol 3 or the batman. One thing I want is for studio's to give directors more creative freedom, like you said we may get some fantastic movies out of it.
So, you just want more of what already worked…. That’s how we got here in the first place- formulas. I just want a creative writer to hand a script in to an out-of-the-box-thinking producer who champions this creative story to a boardroom of execs who are smart enough to get out of the way and let the creatives create. That’s all. I don’t want any other movie copied because it was good. That’s how end up with Coldplay; a band that made two really interesting albums but had one major hit that they just copied over and over and over and over again.
The bad generic ones come from a formula that you probably once enjoyed. They've been remaking Iron Man for more than a decade now, Falcon and Winter Soldier was basically russo brothers light. Rest assured you'll get another Logan, Guardians and the batman. The sequel for the batman is due out pretty soon. You may not see direct sequels to Logan or Guardians but you will see the something in that same vein. Obviously they'll beat to death that which was originally fresh and until it's tired. What wasn't pointed out in this video is that Disney did this same thing back in the mid 2000's. There was a guy through the mid 90's to mid 2000's that had a string of critical and box office hits. Pixar. Everything for ten years that John Lasseter touched turned to gold. Unlike Marvel, Pixar did not have a single dud for 10 years. Then when Disney bought pixar they put him in charge of everything animation and it all got diluted. Feige was fine when he was only overseeing 2 or 3 projects at a time, but now he's overseeing 3 films and umpteen streaming series all at the same time and it's too much. It's hard to believe they didn't learn anything from past mistakes.
At 15:00, I really actually liked this scene in Doctor Strange after doing a rewatch this year. At first, it just seemed like his cape was messing with him for comedic effect, but then I realized that the cape was actually wiping his tears away after his heavy conversation with Christine, telling him to be strong and showcasing that the cape cares for Stephen. To me, it was a brief moment of levity, and not as cringy as I had originally perceived it. The cape chose Strange, and its proven to be very protective of him over their time together
Oh yeah absolutely. I don't think there is a single instance of that kind of humor messing with the tone of that movie. But then there's Thor Love and Thunder...oof.
Great video. I think the fix is simpler than it seems: 1. Hire writers & directors who actually care 2. Don’t be afraid to adapt some of the comics more closely 3. Develop your talent 4. Let directors put their own ideas into projects 5. Stop leaving so many loose threads
Actually, this is a great take on the matter, i’m really tired of the bad wiritting, the bad characters, the boring strong female lead, and the bad use of old characters
Agree w/ the smaller budget projects - I think this is where the special presentations can shine as an opportunity for more risky, personal stories that can just feel like a great experience first instead of feeling like a sequel to a sequel. Ryan & Screencrush team, I have some ideas on a future video you could do: "Possible pitches for a future MCU Special Presentation/One Shot Short Film": -Silver surfer origin story, Cosmic disaster vibes/Faustian deal with Galactus -Animated mystical short about the Iron Fist trial of fighting Shao-Lao The Undying -(Live Action What If) Luke Cage Noir 1930s style detective noir, in black and white. Harlem Nights meets Chinatown w/ Jack Nicholson. It won't be MCU Canon since it's a multiverse story I'm sure you'll come up with better ideas for a future video
So here's my take...I thought secret invasion and Ms. Marvel were really boring. BUT, watching Ms. Marvel all at once was a lot better than watching one episode every week. A lot of these shows really ARE cut up movies. Either take the time to properly write and build these stories or just release it all at once and hope for the best. In the words of Patrice O'Neal: If you offer me a stale donut, I'll take it. But I want it RIGHT NOW.
I for one enjoy the weekly watch, speculation, easter egg and theory videos, which for me gives a lot more enjoyable content. I can even go read some of the comics during the week to see what they referenced etc. If the whole season drops it’s gone in a day or two, instead of giving me something to wait for for a few months.
You beat me to my comment :p People are tired of bad writing. We didn't like Tony Stark because he was Iron Man, He liked Tony Stark because each of his movie appearances had an Arc, He started off flawed in his own was and over came them over the course of 12 or more movies. It was even to the point we didn't know he would snap to save the universe. because he wanted no part of putting his family in danger, he was finally a family man. He was happy. It's a very "human" story. Steve Rogers was the 180 from Tony. He was selfless, in the end he finally took something for himself. (as much as it didn't make sense, continuity wise)
I don’t need to say anything about superhero fatigue, the numbers speak for themself. There will always be a small core audience for the genre but the wider fad is over.
Because people are tired of the same shit. Now, if they started phrasing these things as frontier movies (Fantastic Four) or monster movies (Swamp Thing). Maybe a Noir Detective film (The Batman), things would probably be better.
Very conflicted about this. I tend to enjoy a superhero film/show when I dip into it, but the thought of starting on one is REALLY tiring. The fatigue is real since despite a Disney+ connection, I really could not be bothered to keep up after Wandavision and She Hulk (which I dipped into at random and thought was a lot more fun than it got credit for). I thought Wandavision genuinely expanded the scope of storytelling in the genre but the inescapable problem is despite the emotional heft of the story, it will ALWAYS end with godlike creatures beating each other up. There was a time when the conflicts and action sequences were the high point of a film for me, but unless there's an entirely new visual vocabulary to the fights - like in the Spiderverse films - I'm now actively bored by visuals that would have made my jaw hit the floor back in the late 90s or through the 2000s. The closest analogy I can think of is eating four cheese pizzas - you may love them deeply, but as you get older, to keep that love going, the intervals between each time you have one needs to get longer and longer. But at least over the last couple of years, it feels like at least one big streaming platform has been replacing all the other food with four cheese pizzas, and the only alternative is the eight or 12 cheese pizzas of franchises I'm fundamentally uninterested in like Star Wars or ones that seem to have gone off the rails completely like The Simpsons. It gets harder and harder to find something that isn't these things without going back to really old shows. Over the last couple of years, some of the most fun I had was watching Dexter (which, despite its vastly variable quality between seasons, had an exhilarating unpredictably to it) and The Sopranos. Also sometimes its just a relief to watch something that is not being discussed threadbare at the time you are watching it. Fantastic video though, and a great companion piece to the one on Disney.
That Stephano joke was so on point. I used to watch that show at work. Came back a few years later and had no idea what was happening. So there you go.
I think people are fatigued by leaks and being constantly barraged for 2-3 years about a movie, that then can’t provide them with a novel experience, because they have already seen and heard every detail of it a thousand times
I'm loving these dives into the "industry" it really helps me to understand the how and why these movies and shows I love just don't have the same impact. However, you also remind me just how lucky we are to be in an era where The Punisher and Daredevil are on TV Rated R! Or how Moon Knight with it's Egyptian God's fighting even got made. It surely is The Revenge Of The Nerds!
Or maybe the reason the box office numbers are down is because we know we can wait a few months to watch marvel on Disney or DC on HBO max. It’s not that complicated; they give us an alternative option to watch (which has more content) then complain we don’t go to the theater to watch 1 movie for the same fee as the whole month
For real. I agree with them to some degree, but I'm so tired of this topic. They're doing a video like this at least once a week. Is the negativity really helping the channel?
It's not just one thing, but many reasons. Lack of stand alone stories, quality issues etc. Also, people going out the cinema in general has gone down. Myself, and others I know have had too many experiences of trying to go see a film, and kids with tablets at full volume during the movie, or just running around loudly, has become more and more common, especially after the pandemic. If you have a great TV and sound system at home, just wait a few months.
Superheroes are iconic and beloved by everyone so superhero fatigue won’t be a thing. It’s a thing when movies and tv shows took a dump on all of the heroes and villains even the characters to promote their product for their greed and pride.
I love that you mentioned the Epic of Gilgamesh, which is the oldest piece of literature that we've ever found... and it's a superhero story. Superheroes are literally the grandfather of narrative
This video essay was *mwah* chef's kiss. You said exactly what my best friend and I were just talking about with Marvel movies. I love Marvel movies, I've been to multiple comic-cons(and dress up lol), and have a good amount of merchandise. I'm not tired of Marvel but I'm tired of mid Marvel. I know they can do better and I want something to be excited about again. Also, your call out of Bill Maher and Scorsese were great! 😂
I don't know if you've talked about it yet... but another problem that I'm noticing is the younger folks are less interested in movies and tv and more interested in short attention span streaming on their hand held devices.
Hard disagree. I’m a millennial surrounded by gen z at work and home life. They, almost exclusively, like watching movies and TV. Yes, they also like tik tok and some have short attention spans to things that don’t interest them, but I find it that older people don’t have time to watch anything but the news while drinking coffee in the morning. Movie theaters are full of young people when you go to the movies. Very rarely do I see anyone above 40 at the movies.
@@melmorenoi I wonder if it's a regional thing... or even just a component of Urban, Suburban and Rural communities. When I was in my 20s and we went to movies every seat was full and most everyone was my age +/- 10yrs. Now at 58 I go to local theaters and there's more seats empty than full and 2/3s are the exact same age group as from my 20's.... the younger folks tend to be the adult children of the old news watching coffee drinking fogies like me. Now.. in defense of the partially empty room, there's a dozen screens or more and in my youth 6-8 would have been the max (locally) so of course more screens allows the masses to be spread out, but shouldn't the increased population suggest that adding more screens has only managed to keep up with that growing population? I'm certainly no expert... but I do see my children's groups of friends far less interested in going to movies... unless I organize it for the four of us to go see a movie together... they're 35, 25 & 18 by the way. Oh and I live in a small city within 40 miles of Boston and 15 miles of Portsmouth NH... so there's plenty of things for young folks to do other than go to movies.
@@crittyluslowshout out to Salem?😄 I live in a small city in RI. Movies are one of only a few things that kids have to do here. Hallelujah for the new mini golf! And sadly, that affects the experience of others who go. I have seen a group of teenagers sitting in the back, chatting and talking as if they were in their living room at home. Running in and out for more snacks every five-ten minutes, and not just exiting....doing the "run, run, jump!" on the wide theater stairs as if they were 5 and not 15. They didn't grow up in theaters as we did, so they've no etiquette. Honestly, they would have saved their parents money if they had just gone out to a restaurant and had a meal together. Because they surely each spent more on those snacks than a restaurant meal would have cost them. And the phones come out, too. I've been in the classroom for 30 yrs, and I can tell you for certain that reduced attention span is partly to blame. So as an adult when I am faced with a friend, who wants to go to the 7 o'clock show of a new film so that she can get to bed in time (because she's older) or going to the 9 o'clock by myself so that I don't have to deal with loud teenagers ruining my experience, I'm caught. When a film is in its first week, if it is PG-13 or an easier rating, or it looks like it would be remotely of interest to teenagers, I wait until it has been out for a few days or a week.... Which means that I wind up missing a lot of films because I don't want to deal with that element.
Really loving the fact other than super hero movie, the regular movies are getting a shine and yes now the box office is low for regular movies but in the future the regular movies will make more money than super hero movies. Things will go back to normal
100% agree with everything you've said in this video. Superhero films need a "Neo-Western" genre, because they're great. Also, why hasn't Kevin Smith been tapped to do any projects for Marvel? He literally got the ball rolling on the Stan Lee cameo trope.
For me, it was the introduction of time travel and the multiverse. Not only do I find them confusing at times, they rewrite the rules on consequences. It's hard to care about life and death decisions when I know they can just press an undo button. The other thing is the brief cameo introductions of too many characters that we know almost nothing about, like you mentioned. They're not enough to excite us as characters and only serve to dilute the main story. Ironheart is a perfect example. Give us more short "Werewolf By Night" shows as backstories so we can be at least somewhat invested when they hit the screen. They don't always have to be either 10 minutes of screen time or 6-8 hour miniseries.
Yes I felt that Thor: Love and Thunder failed majorly due to the quick timelapses of him going from "DAD BOD to GOD BOD" and then the quick timelapse of his love life. The montages from Luis in Ant-Man movies were great! But in Love and Thunder, they took away fromt the story. Thor being "Bro-Thor" in Endgame was a big deal for many fans and we wanted to see him come back and turn God again. Also not to mention, the behind-the-scenes "KILLING SPREE" of Gorr. They didn't even show him killing gods after that one time at the start. The humour was miserable too!
I sort of agree but I think it was just THOSE ones. SpiderMan No Way Home was pretty good even though it involved the multiverse. Doctor Strange was just a huge turd. So many possibilities and thats what they came up with? I think Time Travel was just in that one movie wasn't it? Sure, invent a time machine in a weekend. Tony Stark shows up and basically says "you forgot to carry the one right, he turned into a baby". Yes, time travel is THAT easy. For me it wrecked the whole movie, although the battle scene at the end was pretty good.
@user-jp5nc8zf7m time travel in Endgame allowed the filmmakers to provide so much fabulous fan service by revisiting moments from favorite films. I don't believe time travel and Endgame, which I thought was fantastic btw) are the problems, the multiverse is a different animal than time travel.
Brilliant 👏🏾 An excellent deconstruction, and detailed narrative that examined and explored every genre of cinema that focuses on cultural archetypes. Kudos!
It's not fatigue, it's just the first MCU felt very new and fresh, with a long time between two projects. Now there are loads of movies and series every year, and you must see everything to get the whole story. And also us fans watch videos to know which movies and series will come out in the next years so it really kills the surprise effect :)
@@berniemadoff9688 hi, i don’t think this is fatigue, i still enjoy a lot of super hero stories, and i enjoy most of what marvel is releasing (except secret invasion which was really bad). I think the issue the mcu has is the lack of surprise effect when a project comes out, but it seems they are going to release less projects this year some hopefully it will help.
This is the best commentary video you've published since the one you did about The Last of Us. Thank you for what you do, how you feel, and how you express it all in such an engaging and relatable way. Oh, and thank Doug. Forever. He's the best good boy.
I think the “super hero fatigue” comments started at the same time that the stakes were time traveled away. Then they doubled down with infinite universes, realms, and timelines. There are no more stakes and the stories are suffering.
My disinterest is down to the whole multiverse tie-in thing. The individual films should stand alone, with a good character based story & just be their own thing. Forcing them all to be teaser chapters in a bigger story like Rise of Kang/multiverse saga got old quick. The original Iron Man is still probably my favorite Marvel movie. I went reluctantly with my husband (he is still into comicbooks & manga) not knowing anything about Iron Man. I assumed I would be bored. I was so wrong, I really enjoyed that movie & even went back to see it again-twice- in the theatre & have watched it streaming multiple times.
Personally, with watching everything on streaming, or premium UA-cam, I'm never aware of new movies coming out, without someone like this channel mentioning/doing the trailer. Wish, Blue Beetle, etc....I had no idea these movies were even coming out until they were already in theatres. On top of those, having things like Black Widow available to purchase during COVID on D+ while it was in theatres, and the later super short (usually around 60-80 days) amount of time we have to wait for things to go from the theatre to streaming, it just doesn't seem worth it to go to the theatre anymore. Especially having not many nerdy friends/sig. other to go to the movies with, it just makes more sense for me to personally wait for movies to be available on streaming. I don't necessarily think superhero movies are DYING, but I DO think there's alot of people like me, who aren't fatigued, but also aren't going to the theatres. But it doesn't mean that (probably first week of release) that we're not watching those same movies once they're on streaming. I think if the streaming numbers later on were taken into consideration, numbers may seem higher. Also, I know it was controversial, but I really do think things like D+ should bring back the ability to rent a movie that's in theatres, on streaming, for a price. Those numbers + the theatres numbers might not be as much as pre-COVID, but I do think they would see a boost in revenue doing this
I haven't been to a theater since 2012. The first Avengers movie is the last one I watched at the theater. For me it's to expensive to take my family to see a movie. I can sit home fix a nice meal and enjoy a movie on streaming while sitting on my couch and relaxed.
I realized, watching Indiana Jones and Star Wars end, that those sagas have been with me my entire life. And I have found very few franchises where I could get as excited as when one of those 2 produced a new film. The Mummy with Brendan Fraser came close.
Your best point is this; the hero has been a staple character of almost all stories in all civilizations for all of recorded history. It is our human nature to dream of heroes, magic, and epic plots and stakes. It will not go away., though it may change in volume or tone.
My teenager children who loved watching the early 2000's Avengers animated TV show and Xmen animated, no longer care much for the movies. So yes, superhero fatigue. I grew up reading comic books in my teens and 20s, so I still love it, provided the stories are good and original and the cast and characters are popular with fans.
The suits have always been a problem. In a documentary about HBO, one of the series creatives said how once in another network a executive showed him the term "entertainment spaces"(or something like that). When the creative asked what was that, the executive replied "What goes between commercials" So, for the executive, their business was put commercials on TVs.
You're the best Ryan! Thanks for this. Would love to see the behind the scenes from the creation of this video. I can't stand the idea that "superhero movies" were just "theme parks". I dont enjoy theme parks. They are pure emotion without substance for me. The infinity saga is full of substance... You can see the story of two friends with different upbringings and personalities learn from each other and then split apart because now they have opposing ideas. And those ideas came from each other, and from the experiences they had together. I will never forget Rogers telling Tony he was not the man to make the sacrifice play. And Tony telling him back that everything special about him came out of a bottle just to both be proven wrong in the end. i absolutely LOVE the phrase from Dr. Strange that was slowly set up from the beggining of the movie, you can see the threads uniting just to become one in the quote. "I love you in every universe". That was beautiful. The guardians is about loss, friendship and found family, unity made with broken people. The realisation that Drax was born to be a father was heartwarming. I used to not like the new spiderman he was too much of a child to me. But i saw him grow up, pay respect to those before him, and end up facing the consequences of his actions. I remember Strange telling him he couldn't help him, and when Peter starts to leave you can see the face of Stephen change just a llittle bit to show compassion for him. So when the end of the movie comes and you hear him say "But everyone who knows and loves you, we'd... We'd all forget who you are." I can still hear and feel the scene from the first Dr Strange movie. "It's not about you". And I know it's not wholesome, it's harsh, but I like that moment between him and Dr. Palmer when she says "There are other things that can give your life meaning" and he responds with "Like what? You?" Great character moment. Great scene. Great script So i really wonder. Those who say these movies are just theme parks, those who say that superheroes are just adult teenagers. Those who say all these movies have no substance. I really really wonder what movies are they watching. If they are going to the cinema with a blindfold or are just looking at their cellphone the whole 2hours. Because if you pay attention you can see the message from the artist behind all the marketing and the money and the explosions that i know its there, but i personally dont care about that. So thank you Ryan for speaking about this. Hope good movies and good art analysis comes back. PD: I want my Shang Chi sequel. I need to see more of that fight choreography and music.
No people are sick of movies that don’t connect and don’t deliver, we’re still waiting on BLADE and that was announced 2019, were still waiting on ShangChi
she-hulk was not the greatest; but horrible take thinking that was the worst...Secret Invasion had the most potential and was by far and beyond the most disappointing with the writing, ending, and overall "what's going to happen next" factor...get over yourself
@DUBSandChubb They absolutely ruined her character, She-Hulk was actually *likable* in the comics, not to mention actually clever with her jokes and fourth wall breaks. That pisses me off.
I think people know if they wait 3 months they can see the movies of thier choice on the platform they' like and at a convenient price , from the comfort of home where you can eat and drink or even wear what you want . Going outside takes work, so it's Laziness not fatigue, people are lazy and want convenience at thier own leisure. Also it's not just superhero movies , apparently it's all movies , so my theory has some weight to it ,
I keep saying the problem is that they're focusing on Quantity over Quality. I love watching good superhero media, often times I'll go back and rewatch episodes of Daredevil or Jessica Jones, because they were well written shows.
It's not fatigue, and it's not "wokeness" as I'm sure some guys will claim. The movies are awesome! It's just that it costs an arm and a leg to go to the theater and have some snacks, anymore. On a lesser note, I like to think that people are also fed up that theater owners (smaller ones in particular) don't get as much of a cut of ticket sales anymore.
People love super heros Hollywood needs to learn less is more. Just cus something is doing good does not mean you flood the market with it. Less is more.
I love marvel, since I watched Iron Man on 2008 I´ve never missed a movie or show on release weekend. But you were spot on when you said that lately we get all these teases that never give a payoff, right now the MCU feels disconnected and that needs to be fixed. I actually think the marvels was a step on that direction
I would agree that it’s more of the mainstream population getting off the bandwagon. It’s unfortunate that a drop in quality came in at the same time to kind of reinforce the notion of‘superhero fatigue’
Thx for giving a shout out/recommendation for Blue Beetle!😀 My new favorite superhero movie…I just hope it gets a sequel 🤞 Keep up the awesome work on your videos!
I wonder if anyone considers the amount of coverage these movies get as part of the fatigue. Big fan of ScreenCrush + Heavy Spoilers but would directly attach them to my fatigue. The amount of coverage and the content has completely changed over 5 years and in essence you can experience a majority of a movie without watching it just from these two channels alone. The amount of content being produced per individual movie is an endurance test for a person's interest on a topic.
The comment about Marvel needing less money reminds me of this Coppola quote about filming Apocalypse Now. "There were too many of us. We had access to to to much money. Too much equipment. And little by little we went insane." Also, theres an incredible video by Patrick H Willems called "Who Killed Cinema," and it's absolutely worth a watch.
The same story that destroys every industry and business: executives with too much power think they know better, make too many of the decisions and squeeze both the work force and the consumer base. Marvel built itself by making quality movies with interesting characters and fun stories but lately if feels like Marvel is living off of brand loyalty rather than quality.
Incredible video, Ryan, thank you! I feel like a lot of Marvel's past few years have been movies taking bigger swings with interesting ideas, trying to change up some of the usual formulas, but with mixed results. Dr Strange 2 was a horror movie, Wandavision was a slow-burn mystery/horror, Thor 4 was a romcom, The Celestials was a space epic. None of these were things they tried in the first saga of the MCU. Did they all work all the time? No, not really. Nothing was perfect, a lot of things kinda ended up back in "super hero movie" territory. But personally, I enjoyed the attempts. I can forgive a misstep when it's from trying something wild and different. I've had a ton of fun with most of the recent marvel productions, even when they're a little goofy. It almost seems to me that this is what Marvel maybe shouldn't have done? I wonder why it is that I'm still enjoying most of these things, but a lot of people are falling off. Am I just easy to please? Or am I just too much of a sucker for Sam Raimi? Should Marvel have just kept making movies like Iron Man 1 and never stopped?
I adore cinema, I watch films in every genre and I think the problem is suits messing with creative visions and awful writing. Btw, what a well written video.
Fun fact: Dirty Harry - "Do you feel lucky punk...?" - the punk is the actor who plays Garak in Deep Space 9. He appears briefly in this video. Which is excellent by the way, thanks Ryan and the team :) Oh and by the way... I'll bet you a pound to a penny that Aquaman is going to be HUGE! 2024 is the new year of the superhero!
Apologies. Your quote is slightly off from the actual lines. Those spoken at that point of the movie are spoken to a black actor. The main villain of the movie is called Scorpio. He was portrayed by Andrew Robinson who was Garak. Just plain, simple Garak. A tailor. And nothing more. Robinson was also in at least the first Hellraiser movie.
It's NOT superhero fatigue. It's BAD BAD BAD Disney feminist and diversity political agenda they're trying to push into ALL their movies. I honestly do not care for diversity even though I have an asian background, I JUST WANT STAY TRUE TO the STORIES AND CHARACTERS and GOOD STORY TELLING!!!!!!!!!!!
There has never been a live action Fantastic 4 film. But what about the... THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A LIVE ACTION FANTASTIC 4 FILM! There has been an animated one though. Its called The Incredibles.
Use SCVIDEO to get 55% off your first month at Scentbird sbird.co/3SUzWIO
No. People aren't sick of superheroes. They're sick of movies about characters they've never heard of. Phase 4 and 5 mostly centered on the types of characters that wouldn't even appear in 90's video games. Man-Thing, Moon Knight, Ms.Marvel, G'aia, America Chavez, Wong, Shang Chi and Antman are not fan favorite characters of the main stream audiences. The characters we learned to love and follow were aged up, killed, replaced or retired.
Oh but what about Loki? What ABOUT Loki? You can't mean him interacting with Hunter B-15, Mobius, and OB? These aren't really characters that had layers or depth beyond their place in that show. They're Loki's co-workers. And the characters we wanted to see interact with him, like Sylvie, barely did. There is no *Marvel Fatigue*, just disjointed projects and characters that don't hold a candle to Hulk, Cap, Ironman, Thor, Hawkeye or Black Widow.
"all of those things you said were incorrect because I don't have media literacy and can't be bothered to understand anything that isn't the sound of my last two braincells clanking together, if it's not the same video of baby shark that I've watched every day for the last five years, I don't wanna see it, only familiar things forever! What is that well written characters that feel things and grow? Get that stuff outta here! Imma big manly man and my emotional constipation is proof of that! I don't feel sissy things like 'sadness' or 'joy' or 'the inexplicable feeling of contentment when a loved one wants your presence in their life' .... I'm so lonely someone please love me...." There! I fixed your comment for you!❤
People are sick of seeing people make super hero videos on UA-cam. Especially when there is a small rumor. Every rumor doesn't need a 20 minute video with the same scenes. Every week a Loki video dropped you guys showed the same scenes from previous episodes. Watch. When Loki comes back in a future Marvel movie, they're going to show scenes from the Loki show to fill space. That is what makes people sick and tired.
@@Aeis_ArcadeScreenCrush hears a rumor about Jonathan Majors. Then they make a video showing the same scenes of him as Victor Timely and as He who remains in the Loki series.
It feels like you guys already made this video like 5 times in the past 1 year
I still love superheroes. I love Invincible and rewatching old MCU movies.
You know why?
Because the writing and characters (for the most part) are actually good.
The writing is actually gud in the current phase of the MCU
@@Last-Scar-5675I don't know what "gud" means, but if you follow this channel, you will be well versed in what makes the current marvel phase poor.
@@Last-Scar-5675 Not really, hence the question of "Super Hero Fatigue"...if the Writing was still good enough to get people in the seats, these questions wouldn't have been raised in the 1st place, but here we are...
Agreed
@@Last-Scar-5675Stop it
Doug being so aggressive towards the Doug plushie is starting to be my new fav thing. Absolutely hilarious 😂😂
@user-ho2mj5wo7j facts. On one of the other vids Doug was yelling at the plushie and calling it stupid took me out lmao I was dyin
@@redskybyam586I just started watching this guy a few days ago. Is that a new thing? Lol I agree it’s hilarious
Everything Doug is great. I enjoyed the clips explaining movies to Doug.
I'm not into most comix or superheroes; Doug is why I'm here 😅
I used to work for a major animation studio for the director and producer and I can tell you without hesitation that it’s not only studio notes that cause problems but they reach out to people like Spielberg and many other directors with great resumes to watch their cuts and give their notes. Then they review all the notes and go back to tweak the film over and over and over. Protecting these projects is like a mother trying to shield her baby in an apocalypse where bombs are going off all around. And EVERYONE even remotely associated with the production is trying to get their voices heard. So until they can get the filmmakers the autonomy they need, this will not change.
I’m also a studio vet and you make a great point. Studio meddling is a MAJOR issue.
It's not JUST autonomy, though. It's producers AND directors who both care about the quality of the STORY/universe. I love Lord & Miller, but when I heard how they were managing Solo, even I thought Kennedy was right to say no.
I'm not fatigued, I'm just frustrated that over the past several years, the stories aren't self contained. They are part of an arc that won't get resolved until the next film or series.
or won't get resolved at all, which is even worse.
Too right !
But comic book movies, at least with the MCU, have always been serialized storytelling, just like actual comic books. Look at the storyline with Thanos; his arc didn't get resolved for YEARS, and no one complained. Why? Because the movies were good. If Marvel started making good movies again, I'm sure people would be happy to resume the ride.
I can't think of any MCU movie that didn't tell a complete story for its main character.
Maybe some lose threads to string into future titles, but nothing that breaks a story.
Unlike SpiderVerse ending with "to be continued"
I'm fine with an arc taking two or three or even four movies, but he hit it on the head when he talked about all the teases and setups that never come
Agreed, the issue isnt fatigue with Marvel, the problem is fatigue with bad writing/movies.
I think it's both for a lot of people. Bad writing, tired storyline, and character dev/portrayal (or lack of) is maybe slightly more than half the current problem, IMO.
There is so much superhero content in movies and tv shows. And a lot of it just okay or passable to watch. If you made it all great tv/movies, it would still be too much of it.
And I don't think the sports analogy works well. I get it, part of the sports analogy is made to stick up for people that love these movies/shows/comics/fandom. But people do think of fanatical fandom of a sports team as childish in some ways, it's just not a strong or prevalent of a concept.
Lastly, if sports were creating new teams and leagues every other year, there would be fatigue or oversaturation of the market rel. to demand. And we have seen this with XFL, XFL part deux, Arena football, bikini football, NFL Europe, USFL, consolidation of minor league baseball, pro basketball outside of the NBA is non-existent for decades.
ditto!
"Sports fans routinely dress as their heroes and gather together to watch grown men play a child's game with balls"
The wildest quote I've heard all week LMAO I'M DYING
This is Screencrush’s best video. I felt very seen in this and I’m going to share it with anyone that tries to tell my that superhero fatigue is a thing. Thank you for making this ❤️
Werewolf by Night is a perfect example of subverting the superhero genre by introducing monsters, horror, style, creative directing, practicality, and no studio interference more of that would be nice
As long as there are only real life supervillains controlling everything, there will always be a need for escapism.
💯
Ryan “There has never been a live action Fantastic Four film”
Me “you sit on a throne of lies!”
Great video mate, you and the team did fantastic job of explaining something that I personally agree with it isn’t just superhero fatigue, It is just general mediocre movie fatigue
We are tired of the bad and generic ones, I'd love another Logan, Gaurdians vol 3 or the batman. One thing I want is for studio's to give directors more creative freedom, like you said we may get some fantastic movies out of it.
I know I miss those kind of creative titles guardians of the Galaxy 3 was pretty amazing
@@Planag7 yeah for sure. it help that they had a complete script before filming.
So, you just want more of what already worked…. That’s how we got here in the first place- formulas. I just want a creative writer to hand a script in to an out-of-the-box-thinking producer who champions this creative story to a boardroom of execs who are smart enough to get out of the way and let the creatives create. That’s all. I don’t want any other movie copied because it was good. That’s how end up with Coldplay; a band that made two really interesting albums but had one major hit that they just copied over and over and over and over again.
Not too much freedom though, unless you want to find out Palpatine has somehow returned
The bad generic ones come from a formula that you probably once enjoyed. They've been remaking Iron Man for more than a decade now, Falcon and Winter Soldier was basically russo brothers light.
Rest assured you'll get another Logan, Guardians and the batman. The sequel for the batman is due out pretty soon. You may not see direct sequels to Logan or Guardians but you will see the something in that same vein. Obviously they'll beat to death that which was originally fresh and until it's tired.
What wasn't pointed out in this video is that Disney did this same thing back in the mid 2000's. There was a guy through the mid 90's to mid 2000's that had a string of critical and box office hits. Pixar. Everything for ten years that John Lasseter touched turned to gold. Unlike Marvel, Pixar did not have a single dud for 10 years. Then when Disney bought pixar they put him in charge of everything animation and it all got diluted.
Feige was fine when he was only overseeing 2 or 3 projects at a time, but now he's overseeing 3 films and umpteen streaming series all at the same time and it's too much. It's hard to believe they didn't learn anything from past mistakes.
At 15:00, I really actually liked this scene in Doctor Strange after doing a rewatch this year. At first, it just seemed like his cape was messing with him for comedic effect, but then I realized that the cape was actually wiping his tears away after his heavy conversation with Christine, telling him to be strong and showcasing that the cape cares for Stephen. To me, it was a brief moment of levity, and not as cringy as I had originally perceived it. The cape chose Strange, and its proven to be very protective of him over their time together
Oh yeah absolutely. I don't think there is a single instance of that kind of humor messing with the tone of that movie. But then there's Thor Love and Thunder...oof.
Great video. I think the fix is simpler than it seems: 1. Hire writers & directors who actually care 2. Don’t be afraid to adapt some of the comics more closely 3. Develop your talent 4. Let directors put their own ideas into projects 5. Stop leaving so many loose threads
Actually, this is a great take on the matter, i’m really tired of the bad wiritting, the bad characters, the boring strong female lead, and the bad use of old characters
Agree w/ the smaller budget projects - I think this is where the special presentations can shine as an opportunity for more risky, personal stories that can just feel like a great experience first instead of feeling like a sequel to a sequel.
Ryan & Screencrush team, I have some ideas on a future video you could do:
"Possible pitches for a future MCU Special Presentation/One Shot Short Film":
-Silver surfer origin story, Cosmic disaster vibes/Faustian deal with Galactus
-Animated mystical short about the Iron Fist trial of fighting Shao-Lao The Undying
-(Live Action What If) Luke Cage Noir 1930s style detective noir, in black and white. Harlem Nights meets Chinatown w/ Jack Nicholson. It won't be MCU Canon since it's a multiverse story
I'm sure you'll come up with better ideas for a future video
So here's my take...I thought secret invasion and Ms. Marvel were really boring. BUT, watching Ms. Marvel all at once was a lot better than watching one episode every week. A lot of these shows really ARE cut up movies. Either take the time to properly write and build these stories or just release it all at once and hope for the best.
In the words of Patrice O'Neal: If you offer me a stale donut, I'll take it. But I want it RIGHT NOW.
I for one enjoy the weekly watch, speculation, easter egg and theory videos, which for me gives a lot more enjoyable content. I can even go read some of the comics during the week to see what they referenced etc. If the whole season drops it’s gone in a day or two, instead of giving me something to wait for for a few months.
No. People are just sick of movies that aren’t good. Marvel’s content has just been substandard
Saw a supercut of the CGI slipping. Definitely cutting corners to rush sh't out. Also the bane of gaming studios too.
You beat me to my comment :p
People are tired of bad writing. We didn't like Tony Stark because he was Iron Man,
He liked Tony Stark because each of his movie appearances had an Arc, He started off flawed in his own was
and over came them over the course of 12 or more movies. It was even to the point we didn't know he would snap to save the universe.
because he wanted no part of putting his family in danger, he was finally a family man.
He was happy. It's a very "human" story. Steve Rogers was the 180 from Tony.
He was selfless, in the end he finally took something for himself. (as much as it didn't make sense, continuity wise)
Exactly 👍🏻
Faxts tho
This is why I'm making my own version of avengers the kang dynasty so we have a good story with good characters and good writing
I’m not in a superhero fatigue, but I think Marvel’s problem is that they are pushing way too many projects not allowing them focus on the characters.
I don’t need to say anything about superhero fatigue, the numbers speak for themself. There will always be a small core audience for the genre but the wider fad is over.
Because people are tired of the same shit. Now, if they started phrasing these things as frontier movies (Fantastic Four) or monster movies (Swamp Thing). Maybe a Noir Detective film (The Batman), things would probably be better.
Very conflicted about this. I tend to enjoy a superhero film/show when I dip into it, but the thought of starting on one is REALLY tiring.
The fatigue is real since despite a Disney+ connection, I really could not be bothered to keep up after Wandavision and She Hulk (which I dipped into at random and thought was a lot more fun than it got credit for). I thought Wandavision genuinely expanded the scope of storytelling in the genre but the inescapable problem is despite the emotional heft of the story, it will ALWAYS end with godlike creatures beating each other up.
There was a time when the conflicts and action sequences were the high point of a film for me, but unless there's an entirely new visual vocabulary to the fights - like in the Spiderverse films - I'm now actively bored by visuals that would have made my jaw hit the floor back in the late 90s or through the 2000s.
The closest analogy I can think of is eating four cheese pizzas - you may love them deeply, but as you get older, to keep that love going, the intervals between each time you have one needs to get longer and longer.
But at least over the last couple of years, it feels like at least one big streaming platform has been replacing all the other food with four cheese pizzas, and the only alternative is the eight or 12 cheese pizzas of franchises I'm fundamentally uninterested in like Star Wars or ones that seem to have gone off the rails completely like The Simpsons.
It gets harder and harder to find something that isn't these things without going back to really old shows. Over the last couple of years, some of the most fun I had was watching Dexter (which, despite its vastly variable quality between seasons, had an exhilarating unpredictably to it) and The Sopranos. Also sometimes its just a relief to watch something that is not being discussed threadbare at the time you are watching it.
Fantastic video though, and a great companion piece to the one on Disney.
Best comic video I gave watched in a long time. Well reasoned and researched
That Stephano joke was so on point. I used to watch that show at work. Came back a few years later and had no idea what was happening. So there you go.
Love that yall consistently put respect on Blue Beetle that movie was so underrated
It was horrible
I think people are fatigued by leaks and being constantly barraged for 2-3 years about a movie, that then can’t provide them with a novel experience, because they have already seen and heard every detail of it a thousand times
oh, trust me; they're not sick of superhero films; they're just sick of bad films
There's no rush to go out an watch a superhero film when you know you can stream it in a month.
I'm loving these dives into the "industry" it really helps me to understand the how and why these movies and shows I love just don't have the same impact. However, you also remind me just how lucky we are to be in an era where The Punisher and Daredevil are on TV Rated R! Or how Moon Knight with it's Egyptian God's fighting even got made. It surely is The Revenge Of The Nerds!
😂 I perked up when you said Stefano became good guy. Because I quit when he died last time and visiting my mother found out he was alive again 😅
Totally agree. I don’t have fatigue. Just tired of the suits ruining what could be really good movies.
Or maybe the reason the box office numbers are down is because we know we can wait a few months to watch marvel on Disney or DC on HBO max.
It’s not that complicated; they give us an alternative option to watch (which has more content) then complain we don’t go to the theater to watch 1 movie for the same fee as the whole month
Is it possible to get fatigued from people explaining why I am supposed to be fatigued?
For real. I agree with them to some degree, but I'm so tired of this topic. They're doing a video like this at least once a week. Is the negativity really helping the channel?
There are channels out there that survive doing nothing but negative Disney videos, so yeah I guess so unfortunately.@@fizzle7421
It's not just one thing, but many reasons. Lack of stand alone stories, quality issues etc. Also, people going out the cinema in general has gone down. Myself, and others I know have had too many experiences of trying to go see a film, and kids with tablets at full volume during the movie, or just running around loudly, has become more and more common, especially after the pandemic. If you have a great TV and sound system at home, just wait a few months.
Superheroes are iconic and beloved by everyone so superhero fatigue won’t be a thing. It’s a thing when movies and tv shows took a dump on all of the heroes and villains even the characters to promote their product for their greed and pride.
No. Most people dont give a shit about superheros, and oversaturation is just annoying.
There is fatigue and there also are people who are just tired of 50 characters being introduced and nothing coming of it.
I love that you mentioned the Epic of Gilgamesh, which is the oldest piece of literature that we've ever found... and it's a superhero story. Superheroes are literally the grandfather of narrative
This video essay was *mwah* chef's kiss. You said exactly what my best friend and I were just talking about with Marvel movies. I love Marvel movies, I've been to multiple comic-cons(and dress up lol), and have a good amount of merchandise. I'm not tired of Marvel but I'm tired of mid Marvel. I know they can do better and I want something to be excited about again. Also, your call out of Bill Maher and Scorsese were great! 😂
Moon Knight was fantastic. The characters were fleshed out and Oscar Isaac's performance (and Ethan Hawk's) was great.
Moon Knight was terrible.
Agreed. I think that was the last decent thing from Marvel or DC for me.
I don't have superhero fatigue. I have multiverse fatigue.
Thank you ryan so much for stating this point i miss basic superhero plots ,and for giving more people this perspective👏🏽👏🏽.
Useless Executive fatigue.
Pointless Middle Management fatigue.
But most of All, GREED FATIGUE.
I don't know if you've talked about it yet... but another problem that I'm noticing is the younger folks are less interested in movies and tv and more interested in short attention span streaming on their hand held devices.
Hard disagree. I’m a millennial surrounded by gen z at work and home life. They, almost exclusively, like watching movies and TV. Yes, they also like tik tok and some have short attention spans to things that don’t interest them, but I find it that older people don’t have time to watch anything but the news while drinking coffee in the morning. Movie theaters are full of young people when you go to the movies. Very rarely do I see anyone above 40 at the movies.
@@melmorenoi I wonder if it's a regional thing... or even just a component of Urban, Suburban and Rural communities. When I was in my 20s and we went to movies every seat was full and most everyone was my age +/- 10yrs. Now at 58 I go to local theaters and there's more seats empty than full and 2/3s are the exact same age group as from my 20's.... the younger folks tend to be the adult children of the old news watching coffee drinking fogies like me. Now.. in defense of the partially empty room, there's a dozen screens or more and in my youth 6-8 would have been the max (locally) so of course more screens allows the masses to be spread out, but shouldn't the increased population suggest that adding more screens has only managed to keep up with that growing population? I'm certainly no expert... but I do see my children's groups of friends far less interested in going to movies... unless I organize it for the four of us to go see a movie together... they're 35, 25 & 18 by the way. Oh and I live in a small city within 40 miles of Boston and 15 miles of Portsmouth NH... so there's plenty of things for young folks to do other than go to movies.
@@crittyluslowshout out to Salem?😄
I live in a small city in RI. Movies are one of only a few things that kids have to do here. Hallelujah for the new mini golf! And sadly, that affects the experience of others who go. I have seen a group of teenagers sitting in the back, chatting and talking as if they were in their living room at home. Running in and out for more snacks every five-ten minutes, and not just exiting....doing the "run, run, jump!" on the wide theater stairs as if they were 5 and not 15. They didn't grow up in theaters as we did, so they've no etiquette. Honestly, they would have saved their parents money if they had just gone out to a restaurant and had a meal together. Because they surely each spent more on those snacks than a restaurant meal would have cost them.
And the phones come out, too. I've been in the classroom for 30 yrs, and I can tell you for certain that reduced attention span is partly to blame. So as an adult when I am faced with a friend, who wants to go to the 7 o'clock show of a new film so that she can get to bed in time (because she's older) or going to the 9 o'clock by myself so that I don't have to deal with loud teenagers ruining my experience, I'm caught.
When a film is in its first week, if it is PG-13 or an easier rating, or it looks like it would be remotely of interest to teenagers, I wait until it has been out for a few days or a week.... Which means that I wind up missing a lot of films because I don't want to deal with that element.
Really loving the fact other than super hero movie, the regular movies are getting a shine and yes now the box office is low for regular movies but in the future the regular movies will make more money than super hero movies. Things will go back to normal
Nah, people are just sick of slapdash gimmicky schlock being passed off as high mythology
Imagine if everything Marvel had the same quality as Loki. We wouldn’t be having this conversation. It’s a quality issue.
100% agree with everything you've said in this video. Superhero films need a "Neo-Western" genre, because they're great. Also, why hasn't Kevin Smith been tapped to do any projects for Marvel? He literally got the ball rolling on the Stan Lee cameo trope.
Yeah good call about K.S.
This might be one of your best videos ever. Well done!!
For me, it was the introduction of time travel and the multiverse. Not only do I find them confusing at times, they rewrite the rules on consequences. It's hard to care about life and death decisions when I know they can just press an undo button. The other thing is the brief cameo introductions of too many characters that we know almost nothing about, like you mentioned. They're not enough to excite us as characters and only serve to dilute the main story. Ironheart is a perfect example. Give us more short "Werewolf By Night" shows as backstories so we can be at least somewhat invested when they hit the screen. They don't always have to be either 10 minutes of screen time or 6-8 hour miniseries.
Yes I felt that Thor: Love and Thunder failed majorly due to the quick timelapses of him going from "DAD BOD to GOD BOD" and then the quick timelapse of his love life. The montages from Luis in Ant-Man movies were great! But in Love and Thunder, they took away fromt the story. Thor being "Bro-Thor" in Endgame was a big deal for many fans and we wanted to see him come back and turn God again. Also not to mention, the behind-the-scenes "KILLING SPREE" of Gorr. They didn't even show him killing gods after that one time at the start. The humour was miserable too!
I sort of agree but I think it was just THOSE ones. SpiderMan No Way Home was pretty good even though it involved the multiverse. Doctor Strange was just a huge turd. So many possibilities and thats what they came up with?
I think Time Travel was just in that one movie wasn't it? Sure, invent a time machine in a weekend. Tony Stark shows up and basically says "you forgot to carry the one right, he turned into a baby". Yes, time travel is THAT easy.
For me it wrecked the whole movie, although the battle scene at the end was pretty good.
Agreed, Once you introduce time travel, you basically jump the shark imo
Only a good writer can handle an element like that
Also, the director is one of those people either love or hate due to his style of humour @@AVR0709
@user-jp5nc8zf7m time travel in Endgame allowed the filmmakers to provide so much fabulous fan service by revisiting moments from favorite films. I don't believe time travel and Endgame, which I thought was fantastic btw) are the problems, the multiverse is a different animal than time travel.
When your waiting for the person in-front of you to show the teacher you’re essay
Brilliant 👏🏾 An excellent deconstruction, and detailed narrative that examined and explored every genre of cinema that focuses on cultural archetypes. Kudos!
This is an amazing exploration of an overarching conversation that there is no easy answer for great job Ryan !!! Go Browns!!!
All excellent points, and I'm glad I'm not the only one who is enjoying what we have now because we know what it was like before.
I feel like I don't need to watch 100s of hours of other super hero shows in order to know what's going on in the movies.
We are not tired of marvel we are not tired of Star wars we are tired of bad movies
You are very correct when you say there is "mid-fatigue", not super-hero fatigue. Audiences will never tire from excellent, compelling stories.
Perfectly said and explained. Excellent work.
it can't be possible to loose this channel because of superhero fatigue. No way I could live without. You make such a great job guys
It's not fatigue, it's just the first MCU felt very new and fresh, with a long time between two projects. Now there are loads of movies and series every year, and you must see everything to get the whole story. And also us fans watch videos to know which movies and series will come out in the next years so it really kills the surprise effect :)
Not trying to be a jerk here. But isn't your description the definition of fatigue? Perhaps I'm missing something?
@@berniemadoff9688 hi, i don’t think this is fatigue, i still enjoy a lot of super hero stories, and i enjoy most of what marvel is releasing (except secret invasion which was really bad). I think the issue the mcu has is the lack of surprise effect when a project comes out, but it seems they are going to release less projects this year some hopefully it will help.
If superhero fatigue was real, The Boys and Invincible wouldn’t be so amazing.
The quality of Andor is the direction I want comic and sci-fi content to go.
We just have higher standards. After Endgame, She-Hulk doesn’t feel so great.
This is the best commentary video you've published since the one you did about The Last of Us. Thank you for what you do, how you feel, and how you express it all in such an engaging and relatable way.
Oh, and thank Doug. Forever. He's the best good boy.
I think the “super hero fatigue” comments started at the same time that the stakes were time traveled away. Then they doubled down with infinite universes, realms, and timelines. There are no more stakes and the stories are suffering.
My disinterest is down to the whole multiverse tie-in thing. The individual films should stand alone, with a good character based story & just be their own thing. Forcing them all to be teaser chapters in a bigger story like Rise of Kang/multiverse saga got old quick. The original Iron Man is still probably my favorite Marvel movie. I went reluctantly with my husband (he is still into comicbooks & manga) not knowing anything about Iron Man. I assumed I would be bored. I was so wrong, I really enjoyed that movie & even went back to see it again-twice- in the theatre & have watched it streaming multiple times.
Personally, with watching everything on streaming, or premium UA-cam, I'm never aware of new movies coming out, without someone like this channel mentioning/doing the trailer. Wish, Blue Beetle, etc....I had no idea these movies were even coming out until they were already in theatres.
On top of those, having things like Black Widow available to purchase during COVID on D+ while it was in theatres, and the later super short (usually around 60-80 days) amount of time we have to wait for things to go from the theatre to streaming, it just doesn't seem worth it to go to the theatre anymore. Especially having not many nerdy friends/sig. other to go to the movies with, it just makes more sense for me to personally wait for movies to be available on streaming. I don't necessarily think superhero movies are DYING, but I DO think there's alot of people like me, who aren't fatigued, but also aren't going to the theatres. But it doesn't mean that (probably first week of release) that we're not watching those same movies once they're on streaming.
I think if the streaming numbers later on were taken into consideration, numbers may seem higher. Also, I know it was controversial, but I really do think things like D+ should bring back the ability to rent a movie that's in theatres, on streaming, for a price. Those numbers + the theatres numbers might not be as much as pre-COVID, but I do think they would see a boost in revenue doing this
Renting does exist it’s on Amazon prime and Apple Store.
I haven't been to a theater since 2012. The first Avengers movie is the last one I watched at the theater. For me it's to expensive to take my family to see a movie. I can sit home fix a nice meal and enjoy a movie on streaming while sitting on my couch and relaxed.
Even when there is a lull in marvel/Star Wars content from Disney, you guys consistently put out quality content on the franchises. Great vid!
I’m not sick of superhero movies and shows. I can’t wait for the next one and I’m bummed that I have to wait. Same goes with Star Wars.
I realized, watching Indiana Jones and Star Wars end, that those sagas have been with me my entire life. And I have found very few franchises where I could get as excited as when one of those 2 produced a new film. The Mummy with Brendan Fraser came close.
Okay but can anyone explain to me why joker is my favorite movie of all time since it’s not really a superhero movie?
Your best point is this; the hero has been a staple character of almost all stories in all civilizations for all of recorded history. It is our human nature to dream of heroes, magic, and epic plots and stakes. It will not go away., though it may change in volume or tone.
I believe WWE Monday Night Raw actually broke that longest running TV show record, not The Simpsons.
There’s only mid fatigue we need better writers and people who actually care about the products they produce!
My teenager children who loved watching the early 2000's Avengers animated TV show and Xmen animated, no longer care much for the movies. So yes, superhero fatigue. I grew up reading comic books in my teens and 20s, so I still love it, provided the stories are good and original and the cast and characters are popular with fans.
The suits have always been a problem.
In a documentary about HBO, one of the series creatives said how once in another network a executive showed him the term "entertainment spaces"(or something like that).
When the creative asked what was that, the executive replied
"What goes between commercials"
So, for the executive, their business was put commercials on TVs.
I don't have superhero fatigue, I have bad movie fatigue
You're the best Ryan! Thanks for this. Would love to see the behind the scenes from the creation of this video.
I can't stand the idea that "superhero movies" were just "theme parks". I dont enjoy theme parks. They are pure emotion without substance for me. The infinity saga is full of substance... You can see the story of two friends with different upbringings and personalities learn from each other and then split apart because now they have opposing ideas. And those ideas came from each other, and from the experiences they had together.
I will never forget Rogers telling Tony he was not the man to make the sacrifice play. And Tony telling him back that everything special about him came out of a bottle just to both be proven wrong in the end.
i absolutely LOVE the phrase from Dr. Strange that was slowly set up from the beggining of the movie, you can see the threads uniting just to become one in the quote. "I love you in every universe". That was beautiful.
The guardians is about loss, friendship and found family, unity made with broken people. The realisation that Drax was born to be a father was heartwarming.
I used to not like the new spiderman he was too much of a child to me. But i saw him grow up, pay respect to those before him, and end up facing the consequences of his actions. I remember Strange telling him he couldn't help him, and when Peter starts to leave you can see the face of Stephen change just a llittle bit to show compassion for him. So when the end of the movie comes and you hear him say "But everyone who knows and loves you, we'd... We'd all forget who you are."
I can still hear and feel the scene from the first Dr Strange movie. "It's not about you". And I know it's not wholesome, it's harsh, but I like that moment between him and Dr. Palmer when she says "There are other things that can give your life meaning" and he responds with "Like what? You?" Great character moment. Great scene. Great script
So i really wonder. Those who say these movies are just theme parks, those who say that superheroes are just adult teenagers. Those who say all these movies have no substance. I really really wonder what movies are they watching. If they are going to the cinema with a blindfold or are just looking at their cellphone the whole 2hours. Because if you pay attention you can see the message from the artist behind all the marketing and the money and the explosions that i know its there, but i personally dont care about that.
So thank you Ryan for speaking about this.
Hope good movies and good art analysis comes back.
PD: I want my Shang Chi sequel. I need to see more of that fight choreography and music.
No people are sick of movies that don’t connect and don’t deliver, we’re still waiting on BLADE and that was announced 2019, were still waiting on ShangChi
We're not tired of superhero films, We're tired of terrible writing.
We shouldn't see something like She-Hulk ever again.
THIS 100%
Well, you just jinxed yourself, because it's looking to come back for Season 2, which I am ALL for.
she-hulk was not the greatest; but horrible take thinking that was the worst...Secret Invasion had the most potential and was by far and beyond the most disappointing with the writing, ending, and overall "what's going to happen next" factor...get over yourself
Agreed... She-Hulk was pure trash so was Ant-Man 3 and most of phase 4-5.
@DUBSandChubb They absolutely ruined her character, She-Hulk was actually *likable* in the comics, not to mention actually clever with her jokes and fourth wall breaks.
That pisses me off.
It is fatigue, just look at the Box Office in 2023
After Endgame the majority of the audience moved on with their lifes
I think people know if they wait 3 months they can see the movies of thier choice on the platform they' like and at a convenient price , from the comfort of home where you can eat and drink or even wear what you want . Going outside takes work, so it's
Laziness not fatigue, people are lazy and want convenience at thier own leisure.
Also it's not just superhero movies , apparently it's all movies , so my theory has some weight to it ,
I keep saying the problem is that they're focusing on Quantity over Quality.
I love watching good superhero media, often times I'll go back and rewatch episodes of Daredevil or Jessica Jones, because they were well written shows.
It's not fatigue, and it's not "wokeness" as I'm sure some guys will claim. The movies are awesome! It's just that it costs an arm and a leg to go to the theater and have some snacks, anymore. On a lesser note, I like to think that people are also fed up that theater owners (smaller ones in particular) don't get as much of a cut of ticket sales anymore.
Good god Iger admitted it was about social BS
That's why my family and I haven't been to a theater since 2012. It just cost to much.
No it‘s definitly the wokeness
People love super heros Hollywood needs to learn less is more. Just cus something is doing good does not mean you flood the market with it. Less is more.
Those in-house ads are hilarious. I usually fast forward but these bits with Doug n the puppet are awesome 😂
I love marvel, since I watched Iron Man on 2008 I´ve never missed a movie or show on release weekend. But you were spot on when you said that lately we get all these teases that never give a payoff, right now the MCU feels disconnected and that needs to be fixed. I actually think the marvels was a step on that direction
I would agree that it’s more of the mainstream population getting off the bandwagon. It’s unfortunate that a drop in quality came in at the same time to kind of reinforce the notion of‘superhero fatigue’
Marvel should stick to 3 shows and 2 movies a year because most of the time the shows are better than the movies!
Thx for giving a shout out/recommendation for Blue Beetle!😀
My new favorite superhero movie…I just hope it gets a sequel 🤞
Keep up the awesome work on your videos!
It’s all about the story and staying true to what makes a story epic. A lot of money doesn’t know epic; it just knows epic purchases
I wonder if anyone considers the amount of coverage these movies get as part of the fatigue.
Big fan of ScreenCrush + Heavy Spoilers but would directly attach them to my fatigue. The amount of coverage and the content has completely changed over 5 years and in essence you can experience a majority of a movie without watching it just from these two channels alone.
The amount of content being produced per individual movie is an endurance test for a person's interest on a topic.
The comment about Marvel needing less money reminds me of this Coppola quote about filming Apocalypse Now. "There were too many of us. We had access to to to much money. Too much equipment. And little by little we went insane."
Also, theres an incredible video by Patrick H Willems called "Who Killed Cinema," and it's absolutely worth a watch.
The same story that destroys every industry and business: executives with too much power think they know better, make too many of the decisions and squeeze both the work force and the consumer base.
Marvel built itself by making quality movies with interesting characters and fun stories but lately if feels like Marvel is living off of brand loyalty rather than quality.
Incredible video, Ryan, thank you!
I feel like a lot of Marvel's past few years have been movies taking bigger swings with interesting ideas, trying to change up some of the usual formulas, but with mixed results. Dr Strange 2 was a horror movie, Wandavision was a slow-burn mystery/horror, Thor 4 was a romcom, The Celestials was a space epic. None of these were things they tried in the first saga of the MCU. Did they all work all the time? No, not really. Nothing was perfect, a lot of things kinda ended up back in "super hero movie" territory. But personally, I enjoyed the attempts. I can forgive a misstep when it's from trying something wild and different. I've had a ton of fun with most of the recent marvel productions, even when they're a little goofy.
It almost seems to me that this is what Marvel maybe shouldn't have done? I wonder why it is that I'm still enjoying most of these things, but a lot of people are falling off. Am I just easy to please? Or am I just too much of a sucker for Sam Raimi? Should Marvel have just kept making movies like Iron Man 1 and never stopped?
You crushed this video. Nailed it.
What a great season finale , thanks you both Colton and Ryan for covering this new what if season 2, it was great
You got super hero fatigue? Go watch Invincible season 1 and part of 2. You will love super heroes again.
I adore cinema, I watch films in every genre and I think the problem is suits messing with creative visions and awful writing.
Btw, what a well written video.
Fun fact: Dirty Harry - "Do you feel lucky punk...?" - the punk is the actor who plays Garak in Deep Space 9. He appears briefly in this video. Which is excellent by the way, thanks Ryan and the team :) Oh and by the way... I'll bet you a pound to a penny that Aquaman is going to be HUGE! 2024 is the new year of the superhero!
Apologies. Your quote is slightly off from the actual lines. Those spoken at that point of the movie are spoken to a black actor.
The main villain of the movie is called Scorpio. He was portrayed by Andrew Robinson who was Garak. Just plain, simple Garak. A tailor. And nothing more.
Robinson was also in at least the first Hellraiser movie.
It's NOT superhero fatigue. It's BAD BAD BAD Disney feminist and diversity political agenda they're trying to push into ALL their movies. I honestly do not care for diversity even though I have an asian background, I JUST WANT STAY TRUE TO the STORIES AND CHARACTERS and GOOD STORY TELLING!!!!!!!!!!!
This is a great video. I'm not tired of superhero films. It's just the writing needs to be good and have the greedy CEOs stay out of the way.
There has never been a live action Fantastic 4 film.
But what about the...
THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A LIVE ACTION FANTASTIC 4 FILM!
There has been an animated one though. Its called The Incredibles.